2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Anyway, can we talk about how badly Bur is scum right now?
And by talk, I mean vote him into oblivion?
That's funny I was thinking the same thing, I also agreed with Cyan on Anak as well.
@Tom I always read GJ as Town until he does something to sway me of that opinion. He really hasn't been scummy to me. Specifically not over players like Bur and Anak.
I don't see any scum ability being based around passives its too weird to me, there would have to be a lot of passives in the game.
I'll watch Seppels actions and worry about it later. You too for that matter you are seeming more town. Unvote
What do you think about the rest of the game?
This reads to me as a very nice and subtle to way to unvote, kind of tacked so as to avoid any attention. I don't like it.
Happy Thanksgiving, laying down some slank cover for the next 48 hours or so as I help my father do a bunch of random ***** around the house.
Quote from Anak »
@GJ I mean, an RVS post is an RVS post, though I'm beginning to think you will always suspect me. So it goes, there will always be our Cops wolf chat.
@silver Yeah I mean, that's fair. In my defense it was a lot of fun.
Tom looks to be very Tom at this point, what does scum!Tom do differently than town!Tom here DV?
Hmm,
I didn't suspect you in AA, at least not after day 0. I was scum in Drunk Trackers, wrong in Shia Lebouf, and correct in Cops. I don't tink I am always suspecting you. I think you do seem to get legitmately uncomfortable dealing with me, and I don't like your reaction to Cyan. Vote Anak.
Chris, Chris, Chris, I have been waiting a while to (hopefully) work together with you for a while, ever since the AA bonding. Here is where I am at.
I'll be honest, I am going against my read on Axel. My initial dislike of his Manders read was primarily coming from the fact that two of his points had nothing to do with her posts. Especially the part about Az not likely giving her a scum role. It just rubbed me the wrong way, like he was looking for an excuse to town read (or pocket Manders). The more I have thought about it though, I think you are correct about arbitrarily giving town reads (even if I disagree that wolves do this all the time). I think what made me agree that it isn't a point against him is that the read is so early. Saying Mander's tone is town, and that changing that tune 100+ posts in wouldn't really be suspicious. His read though wouldn't in theory change as the day goes on, because it wouldn't be all based on her posts. It could still be a pocket play, but it was a blatantly obvious one. All of that said, he kind of disappeared so I don't know what to make of that.
As far as Manders goes, the way she came across towards Axel struck me as a feeling that she was being pocketed. Her back and forth with TIM also feels like she doesn't understand why she is being read that way in a genuine way, and it does feel like TIM is stretching a bit, even if Manders could explain things more.
My only reaction to seppel's post was something along the lines of "Another ******* neutral...." >:(
DV also feels town, so we are just in opposite land right now. Tom I am not sure of. I never understood the point of calling something a "pressure vote".
She's played enough mafia to understand as far as I'm aware. I don't buy that.
Bur lynch seems boring
Lke a thing we should compromise on in the last week
Give me something spicier
It's a bit strange, but I agree with tom's sentiment here. Bur has made two mildly scummy posts and has said nothing of any great substance. I feel like he's an easy "default" vote at this point.
While your logic seems fine at a base level, I think that it only applies to inexperienced/bad players. Manders has been playing Mafia longer than I have and full well knows the importance of putting one's opinion out there. She gets very emotionally involved in the game (if her indignant response is any indicator of that; and, in fact, another thing that I think makes her town), which can discolor her judgment on certain things, but she's not a bad player by any means. Given my history with Manders, I'd say it's a fair supposition that I know how she thinks - at least to a good extent - and that she wanted to make the fact that she had an opinion on the matter known. I don't think it's at all weird for her to not say what it is - at least, given her playstyle - and that she's shaking the rust off after an extended absence from Mafia.
I read her response to me as patronizing rather than indignant. I think what you're saying is otherwise reasonably logical but it hinges upon a meta-read that I'm not sure I can follow and/or understand. For me it doesn't make a lot of sense for a townie to be so concerned with how their actions will appear down the line.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Anyway, can we talk about how badly Bur is scum right now?
And by talk, I mean vote him into oblivion?
That's funny I was thinking the same thing, I also agreed with Cyan on Anak as well.
@Tom I always read GJ as Town until he does something to sway me of that opinion. He really hasn't been scummy to me. Specifically not over players like Bur and Anak.
I don't see any scum ability being based around passives its too weird to me, there would have to be a lot of passives in the game.
I'll watch Seppels actions and worry about it later. You too for that matter you are seeming more town. Unvote
What do you think about the rest of the game?
I'd like to hear your reasons why are you buying Seppel's claim? Why do you even believe Seppel has the abilities he claimed?
Private Mod Note
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Quote from Prophylaxis »
Also modgaming Bur setups is kind of treading down a dark path
0-TEST A TARGET PLAYER FOR HAVING PASSIVE ABILITIES AND TEMPORARILY (time unspecified and I asked Azrael about it) BLOCK THE TARGET FROM HAVING THEM IF THEY DO. I DONT LEARN WHAT THE PASSIVE IS, JUST WHETHER OR NOT I BLOCKED A PASSIVE.
2-MOVE ALL OF TARGET PLAYER'S PASSIVE ABILITIES TO ANOTHER TARGET PLAYER.
I WIN AND LEAVE THE GAME WHEN NOBODY HAS THEIR ORIGINAL PASSIVE ABILITIES
So. Start taking advantage of this while I'm still here.
I'm not sure what to make of this claim, but w/e.
Seppel, does using your 0-ability make people count towards your wincon?
I'm guessing no. Also clarification on wincon, nobody *living*.
Also I just realized that I have no innate way of gaining empowerment. So uh. Oops on that.
Ghosting got me all excited and then I was let down.
How about we go for something symbiotic?
@Anyone: You empower me, I empower you back. First to empower me gets my empowerment loyalty.
how does it not?
It sounds like a neutral claim from trigger happy
Seems gambitty.
Which is NAI for seppel of course
But him being neutral is no more likely than before and I wouldn't tell him about any passive abilities
No need. I was given a list of all 16 passive abilities that could appear in the game.
Godfather is one of them.
There's also one called "Shell-shocked from Doom Cannon," which leads me to believe two things:
(1) There's a Doom Cannon. (Might be as unlikely to appear as the Armageddon Weapon from Inheritance Mafia.)
(2) Players can gain passive abilities.
My block also works on temporary passive abilities, like "doc protected," but those aren't necessary for hitting my wincon.
I'm not revealing the full list, because some of these are not good for the mafia to know about.
0-TEST A TARGET PLAYER FOR HAVING PASSIVE ABILITIES AND TEMPORARILY (time unspecified and I asked Azrael about it) BLOCK THE TARGET FROM HAVING THEM IF THEY DO. I DONT LEARN WHAT THE PASSIVE IS, JUST WHETHER OR NOT I BLOCKED A PASSIVE.
2-MOVE ALL OF TARGET PLAYER'S PASSIVE ABILITIES TO ANOTHER TARGET PLAYER.
I WIN AND LEAVE THE GAME WHEN NOBODY HAS THEIR ORIGINAL PASSIVE ABILITIES
So. Start taking advantage of this while I'm still here.
I'm not sure what to make of this claim, but w/e.
Seppel, does using your 0-ability make people count towards your wincon?
I'm guessing no. Also clarification on wincon, nobody *living*.
Also I just realized that I have no innate way of gaining empowerment. So uh. Oops on that.
Ghosting got me all excited and then I was let down.
How about we go for something symbiotic?
@Anyone: You empower me, I empower you back. First to empower me gets my empowerment loyalty.
how does it not?
It sounds like a neutral claim from trigger happy
Seems gambitty.
Which is NAI for seppel of course
But him being neutral is no more likely than before and I wouldn't tell him about any passive abilities
No need. I was given a list of all 16 passive abilities that could appear in the game.
Godfather is one of them.
There's also one called "Shell-shocked from Doom Cannon," which leads me to believe two things:
(1) There's a Doom Cannon. (Might be as unlikely to appear as the Armageddon Weapon from Inheritance Mafia.)
(2) Players can gain passive abilities.
My block also works on temporary passive abilities, like "doc protected," but those aren't necessary for hitting my wincon.
I'm not revealing the full list, because some of these are not good for the mafia to know about.
Or, maybe I've learned not to believe anything you claim on Day 1.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I've caught up to this last post with multi-quote. I just have to set up my response and post it. Luckily it's pretty slow today, so it shouldn't take too long. Thanks for y'all's patience.
One urgent thing, @ Seppel, I don't have any passive abilities. Will I gain anything by empowering you? Other than getting empowered myself (which is not a bad idea if anyone else believes I'm Town, btw). I need to review your ability again because it seems like something Azrael would come up with and I see no reason not to believe it. You played it exactly as you should have imo, and I didn't see any Scum motivation for doing it.
@TIM: Do you agree that it's a townie's responsibility to be read as a member of the town?
Kind of. I view it as a secondary responsibility. A townie's primary responsibility is to catch scum, and in the process of doing so they'll try to be read as town (so that others will have more confidence in their reads and/or prevent being mislynched down the line). For scum, being read as a member of the town is the primary goal. I don't believe townies spend a lot of time trying to look town while not furthering any of their other goals.
As for Seppel's claim, the knowledge of passives doesn't change much although it would obviously be suicidal to fake. I'm not at all surprised that there are godfathers/millers/etc. in the game given Az's stated intent of encouraging behavioral analysis above all else. Even if Sepppel is a neutral I'm sure that there's a much better use of our empowerment votes than transferring passives.
Does it really do any good to make that info public (rather than noting it privately)? You could just come back and note the post later if your read solidified enough to make an accusation that you actually wanted to talk about. The way you're talking, you care far too much about how others perceive your (potential future) case (i.e. "Manders has had Axelrod down as scum from the start").
And? Is that something ONLY a Scum player would do?
When I play Mafia, I'm always thinking about every possible outcome I can see and their effects, both immediately and in the long run. This is a result of that.
So. I say to you again. How does this make me Scum?
It's not something only a scum player would do, nothing is quite that black and white. Undue concern for how your opinions will be perceived by others in the future is, however, indicative of a scum mindset.
Being concerned with how well I can convince others IF I decide I need to convince others that AXELROD is Scum is not me being scum…it is me being me. IF Axelrod is scum and I need to prove it later, I will need all the help I can get.
Also, who wants to be Neighbors with me? That seems like the most useful way to utilize the one-way comms thing, rather than just making everything one-way and lame.
Well, hell, if no one else is going to volunteer, I totally will. I love being neighbors (Masons?) with people.
Oh yay, this post:
Post # 37 makes Axelrod town on the basis that scum do not tend to go out of their way to make arbitrary reasons to town clear people. It's not in their thinking process to do so, a town member trying to solve the game will think of weird things like this. I think a singular post can be faked though, so this is ultimately a poor thought process from Axelrod, but those tend to be town as well so double the confirmation, double the town fun.
How much experience do you have playing with Axelrod?
Oh man, follow up post by Manders (38 for those who can't keep track of numbers) is really scummy. I really don't like it when people make a post to say “I don't know what to make of this” when it is about themselves. Like, I am confused about a lot of things over the course of a game but direct interaction when my name is called is usually not one of them. So yeah, not really feeling Manders as town based on that reaction to Axelrod. Also because conclusions that are away from my own observations tend to arise my suspicions a bit, unless they are like Iso or Cyan who I have learned to accept are sometimes just silly geese.
You voted for Trump, didn’t you?
@ Manders 40 - Manders I have no idea who you are or how good you are but given this player list I doubt you're going to have any problems living. Also I am not in the mood, having been gone for months due to work related busyness, to care to lay low like I do sometimes so the scum team is probably not going to be overtly fond of me either. Let's be pals.
It is painfully obvious that you don’t have any idea about me, my playstyle, or my play history. I’m down to be pals, though.
Emotion tells don't tend to be very valuable unless you've got the heart beat of someone extremely well.
Unfortunately for you, this is the best way to determine my alignment. Always has been, always will be.
Because I didn't WANT to say anything more. Why do I have to share EVERYTHING that goes through my head? (HINT: I don't.)
I made a note on it so that, if I decided my initial thoughts were right and he IS scum, I could make reference to that post to show that he had been pinging since the beginning. (And because I like to see if my initial thoughts were correct once the game is over. You wouldn't believe how many times I've caught scum off one post because of my gut instincts.)
This is an interesting post because it could come from two perspectives, a poor play town perspective and a smart play scum perspective and I don't know enough of Manders to know which is more objectively likely. She talks about an essential burden here that I feel like bad players and scum share: the burden to commit. For an aggressive town player like myself I will pass along most anything that slips from my mind into the topic because I am trying to overpower the game with my will and with my influence, it's kind of my 'thing' as a player and I like to saturate the game. However Manders here expresses the fact that she doesn't HAVE TO. She's not OBLIGATED to do so. Scum like to, usually secretly without admitting it, do only whatever it takes to avoid detection. Sometimes this is about successfully fighting off this urge and blending into a town very well, but often times they just can't help themselves to not want to overshare.
BTW this is where you REALLY show that you know nothing about me.
Now where this dips into a mostly scum post (as in, if this post was posted 10,000 times it would come from scum 8,000 times) is the method of her madness: the ability to go back and prove her suspicion. Scum like to be able to have a great case. The bulletproof case. “See guys? I suspected him way back when, you can't shoot holes in me!” but its very existence tends to be a bullet hole. It's self serving. It's not hunting scum, it's protecting your vital organs so when you get shot you can bounce back. It doesn't tend to be a town mindset.
Scumhunting Town like to be able to have a great case, too.
That being said, out of all of that surely there is more for you to think on then a throw away line about yourself, or does scum Cyan just ctrl + f these days ;x.
I mean. I don't think Manders is scum currently, she's just a type of player that is going to rub you, in particular, the wrong way. Literally forever. She is unconventional.
And yes, I know. I was also being cheeky.
I’m an unconventional person. Kudos for finally getting me.
HI SEPPEL. I’m going to ask some clarifying questions. Feel free not to answer if you think it’s best.
HERE ARE MY ABILITIES:
0-TEST A TARGET PLAYER FOR HAVING PASSIVE ABILITIES AND TEMPORARILY (time unspecified and I asked Azrael about it) BLOCK THE TARGET FROM HAVING THEM IF THEY DO. I DONT LEARN WHAT THE PASSIVE IS, JUST WHETHER OR NOT I BLOCKED A PASSIVE.
So you will learn if they have one at all and if you blocked it? (Meaning if they don’t have one, you’ll know that as well?)
2-MOVE ALL OF TARGET PLAYER'S PASSIVE ABILITIES TO ANOTHER TARGET PLAYER.
That is sexy.
I WIN AND LEAVE THE GAME WHEN NOBODY HAS THEIR ORIGINAL PASSIVE ABILITIES
I assume the abilities will stay where they are when you win and leave the game?
So. Start taking advantage of this while I'm still here.
Can you go into more detail about the Manders read please? Also more specifically parse through my logic and tell me where my fallacy is in my thinking, I am curious to hear a discussion surrounding that.
While your logic seems fine at a base level, I think that it only applies to inexperienced/bad players. Manders has been playing Mafia longer than I have and full well knows the importance of putting one's opinion out there. She gets very emotionally involved in the game (if her indignant response is any indicator of that; and, in fact, another thing that I think makes her town), which can discolor her judgment on certain things, but she's not a bad player by any means. Given my history with Manders, I'd say it's a fair supposition that I know how she thinks - at least to a good extent - and that she wanted to make the fact that she had an opinion on the matter known. I don't think it's at all weird for her to not say what it is - at least, given her playstyle - and that she's shaking the rust off after an extended absence from Mafia.
Also I just realized that I have no innate way of gaining empowerment. So uh. Oops on that.
You mean other than other people giving it to you? From my discussion with Az on the subject, I assumed no one did…but that’s probably a silly assumption now that I think about it.
No need. I was given a list of all 16 passive abilities that could appear in the game.
Godfather is one of them.
There's also one called "Shell-shocked from Doom Cannon," which leads me to believe two things:
(1) There's a Doom Cannon. (Might be as unlikely to appear as the Armageddon Weapon from Inheritance Mafia.) (2) Players can gain passive abilities.
@ The bolded…duh! Your ability can give passives from one person to another, and there’s probably a good chance several players have no passive abilities.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Being concerned with how well I can convince others IF I decide I need to convince others that AXELROD is Scum is not me being scum…it is me being me. IF Axelrod is scum and I need to prove it later, I will need all the help I can get.
If you think Axelrod is scum, I'll believe you based on the strength of your evidence rather than some nebulous "gut pinging" that's been going on since the start of the game. I still think it's far more likely that you're scum who wanted to register early suspicion in order to solidify a potential future case/vote.
Oh!! I just remembered Feyd Ruin fixed my access to MandersHex. He's not able to merge these two accounts right now because technical issues, but Az said I could go ahead and switch to start using it, so this will be my last post as MandersW.
I'll use the same avatar so it won't be TOO confusing.
It's a bit strange, but I agree with tom's sentiment here. Bur has made two mildly scummy posts and has said nothing of any great substance. I feel like he's an easy "default" vote at this point.
Oh!! I just remembered Feyd Ruin fixed my access to MandersHex. He's not able to merge these two accounts right now because technical issues, but Az said I could go ahead and switch to start using it, so this will be my last post as MandersW.
feyd GOAT
anyway.
i feel good about my vote RN
i dont like this mask so far, gj
developing some town reads
notably on chris, manders, tim, DV, anak, maaayybbee iso
Being concerned with how well I can convince others IF I decide I need to convince others that AXELROD is Scum is not me being scum…it is me being me. IF Axelrod is scum and I need to prove it later, I will need all the help I can get.
If you think Axelrod is scum, I'll believe you based on the strength of your evidence rather than some nebulous "gut pinging" that's been going on since the start of the game. I still think it's far more likely that you're scum who wanted to register early suspicion in order to solidify a potential future case/vote.
Doesn't this logic only apply is Axelrod is also scum?
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Being concerned with how well I can convince others IF I decide I need to convince others that AXELROD is Scum is not me being scum…it is me being me. IF Axelrod is scum and I need to prove it later, I will need all the help I can get.
If you think Axelrod is scum, I'll believe you based on the strength of your evidence rather than some nebulous "gut pinging" that's been going on since the start of the game. I still think it's far more likely that you're scum who wanted to register early suspicion in order to solidify a potential future case/vote.
Doesn't this logic only apply is Axelrod is also scum?
I'm not sure I totally follow. My logic or Manders'? Scum have plenty of incentive to want to make their cases look well thought through rather than spurious and/or opportunistic, regardless of whether their target is town or scum.
As for Bur, I think I understand (and agree with) what tom is trying to say but I'm not about to put words in his mouth.
Why do I have to agree with a person's reads to think they're town?
Who said you did? I never did.
Then why are you giving me grief for empowering Chris?
Because you're currently giving him the power to target me with something and you have no idea what it is. (To be clear, you don't have to agree with someone's read to think they're Town, but giving them the ability to affect someone else you think is Town in a negative way is weird.)
I like how Manders felt the need 3 separate times to point out that I don't know anything about her when the first thing I said about her was, more or less "What is a Manders." Also I don't like the narrative that Manders is creating surrounding her here. She is seeking to disarm me (again, 3 times going 'you don't know me' is not to me a town reaction, but a scum trying to discredit, even if the point is valid repeating it 3 times feels like trying to throw me over a bridge on the subject) and also the pat on the head of Iso for 'improving' feels like a pocket to me and stroking Iso's ego is a pretty safe play.
So yeah still very unconvinced about Manders. Like sure I get that everyone is different and hey meta is meta, I do love my meta reads myself I can't deny them, but she is being pretty slimy right now and I don't have the disadvantage of expectation here. If Manders is clever she knows how to play against people who have seen her, any scum can fake that, good scum get in trouble when people just drop the pretense and look at stuff.
What I see from Manders is a very self serving style.
Experience with Axelrod... honestly I can't remember playing with him off the top of my head, but I may have at some point. When I am in the thick of things I like to rely on meta reads quite a bit because mine tend to be scary good at determining town, but because I am not in that mindset I am just working off my basic book of mafia play which tends to have a good 90% clear rate. Mafia won't tend to act in an intentional way that corners them, and so I work off of that.
Hey Seppel I am down for Empowerment buddying.
Empower Seppel
Love ya pal.
Also I have a passive.
Vote2: Manders
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2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang) 2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer 2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator) 2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia 2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational 2015 - Best Town Player 2015 - Best Mafia Player 2015 - Best Overall Player
I like how Manders felt the need 3 separate times to point out that I don't know anything about her when the first thing I said about her was, more or less "What is a Manders." Also I don't like the narrative that Manders is creating surrounding her here. She is seeking to disarm me (again, 3 times going 'you don't know me' is not to me a town reaction, but a scum trying to discredit, even if the point is valid repeating it 3 times feels like trying to throw me over a bridge on the subject) and also the pat on the head of Iso for 'improving' feels like a pocket to me and stroking Iso's ego is a pretty safe play.
So yeah still very unconvinced about Manders. Like sure I get that everyone is different and hey meta is meta, I do love my meta reads myself I can't deny them, but she is being pretty slimy right now and I don't have the disadvantage of expectation here. If Manders is clever she knows how to play against people who have seen her, any scum can fake that, good scum get in trouble when people just drop the pretense and look at stuff.
What I see from Manders is a very self serving style.
Experience with Axelrod... honestly I can't remember playing with him off the top of my head, but I may have at some point. When I am in the thick of things I like to rely on meta reads quite a bit because mine tend to be scary good at determining town, but because I am not in that mindset I am just working off my basic book of mafia play which tends to have a good 90% clear rate. Mafia won't tend to act in an intentional way that corners them, and so I work off of that.
I like how Manders felt the need 3 separate times to point out that I don't know anything about her when the first thing I said about her was, more or less "What is a Manders." Also I don't like the narrative that Manders is creating surrounding her here. She is seeking to disarm me (again, 3 times going 'you don't know me' is not to me a town reaction, but a scum trying to discredit, even if the point is valid repeating it 3 times feels like trying to throw me over a bridge on the subject) and also the pat on the head of Iso for 'improving' feels like a pocket to me and stroking Iso's ego is a pretty safe play.
I have no idea what "pocket" means in regards to the bolded.
That being said, everything that I have been accused of is something that could be done by either Town or Scum. The fact that you do not know me IS relevant because you cannot possibly decipher my intent unless you know me (as many here can attest) because, as Cyan said, I'm unconventional.
Do take note, though, that I never said you were scummy or leaning Scum to me. I believe you are Town, but are wrong.
So yeah still very unconvinced about Manders. Like sure I get that everyone is different and hey meta is meta, I do love my meta reads myself I can't deny them, but she is being pretty slimy right now and I don't have the disadvantage of expectation here. If Manders is clever she knows how to play against people who have seen her, any scum can fake that, good scum get in trouble when people just drop the pretense and look at stuff.
I'm actually pretty terrible as Scum. I had ONE shining moment in a Basic once, but I was a gimmick and had WAY more experience than anyone else in the game.
Experience with Axelrod... honestly I can't remember playing with him off the top of my head, but I may have at some point. When I am in the thick of things I like to rely on meta reads quite a bit because mine tend to be scary good at determining town, but because I am not in that mindset I am just working off my basic book of mafia play which tends to have a good 90% clear rate. Mafia won't tend to act in an intentional way that corners them, and so I work off of that.
OK then let me share with you WHY Axelrod's post gave me hesitance. (I actually think I already said this in a post to TIM, but I can't remember, so I'll say it here for you.)
I, myself, have only played with Axelrod a few times. Even players who have played with me a LOT (see Cyan, Seppel, Iso for examples from this game) have a tendency to have trouble reading me and can't determine my alignment all that well. So for Axelrod to come in and proclaim me Town based off one post (because the reasons he gave were just reasons, they didn't actually make any difference in his decision on whether I was Town or not, I guarantee you that because, like Gentleman Johnny said, those two factors have no bearing on me myself) is a bit ridiculous and makes me very skeptical.
What I THINK might be happening? Axel's just saying I'm Town to ease my mind and throw me off in an attempt to earn my trust. Yet, even if this is 100% what he's doing, THAT doesn't even guarantee he's Scum. I could see Axelrod doing that so I will relax and be me (because he's seen me be nervous as Town, make a stupid mistake, get strung up for it, and flip the **** out because I ****ed up and I was so mad at myself I raged and rampaged and ended up getting myself modkilled for posting before I thought and I accidentally quoted the mod so Seppel had to modkill me) so he can decide if I'm Town or not (because when I'm Town, eventually, I am OBV TOWN and then get night killed.)
I will get to the other stuff in a bit, but Manders, why am I town?
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Okay, why is anyone voting to Empower Seppel based on that claim? I completely fail to understand the logic here. Like even if he's telling the truth (big "if"), he appears to me to be of no value to the Town, and might be straight-up anti-value (removing Doc protects?) We've got a limited # of people we can empower, and we're going to throw that away on this? To help him win and then leave the game (which is also like a free kill for the scum then?)
I'm not sure I believe it anyway, as his ability to win seems to rely completely on us doing something stupid and unproductive (i.e. voting to empower him). It's literally impossible for him to win with his role as described without that. And otherwise it's like he's not even part of the game, just this guy over here doing his own thing which might randomly mess with us (or, to be fair, the scum too, but it's not like he actually cares about that if the claim is true). It's just so weird. I won't say it can't be true because weird is certainly in Az's wheelhouse, but I don't like it as a role, and I want to think Az would be more cognizant of that. But helping Seppel over someone you actually think is Town is pure negative value.
Other news, not a huge fan of what Sir Chris is doing re: Manders. And I don't agree with his logic. And he's voting to give Seppel power which is not something a smart person should be doing, and he claims to be smart.
I do not think that the typical scum reaction to my post (i.e. giving an opinion Manders is Town for a less-than-objectively-great reason) is to jump down the throat of the person who is saying they think you are town. I think her paranoia seems more townie than scummy. I think scum are more likely to play that one of two ways - either get jokey with me, taking my post as a joke post, or staying nice with me, and hoping this read I have doesn't go away.
None of this is definitive, but it makes more sense to me from Town than scum so far.
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
It's true, but I am a skilled enough scum player to fake this sentiment as scum quite easily. You should ask Cyan sometime about that. I am quite the weird player as well, and not easily put in a box.
One of the things I am finding weird is your lack of scum ability paired with an inability for people to read you paired with you praising everyone being able to read you this game. Bad scum players are very easy to read as town. It is the nature of the dynamic which makes it easy for people to sacrifice their scum game for their town game (something players will often do so they can be 'obvious) but when that happens... you don't get a lot of mix ups. Also I am very good at reading unconventional players because I myself am one. I caused quite a stir when I debuted here because I am a different animal than most had seen before in terms of how I use logic and how I employ strategy.
It has worked out for me though, thankfully.
Okay so the bold pocket means basically what you said you thought Axel was doing to you.
I find it interesting that Cyan thinks you will rub me the wrong way forever, I don't tend to be vexed for too long in the game of mafia.
Speaking of Cyan, Manders and Cyan are unlikely to be scum buddies based off Manders using Cyan as a prop. Don't think a scum manders leans on the testimony of a scum cyan to bolster herself there. I fundamentally disagree with needing to have played with you to read you though. It aids, but at most I could look up an old game. I inherently dislike this attempt to cast me in the role of someone who CAN'T do something. It makes me want to read every single one of your games just to eliminate the thread, as it is a very nasty thread. Mafia has very few unique circumstances, frankly. I love meta more than most even, but the lack of meta has never critically hindered me, and you won't be the first to make that happen for me.
Something is bugging me here. Something is off about you or around you. Is it you? Is it something someone said related to you? This conversation is an interesting one for me because many people have gone out of their way to make you special, and with not a lot of heat. You express suspicion of Axelrod but don't seem concerned about the softer defenses of you that come from a far more clever mindset. Cyan trying to get me to cut bait, for instance, would make me paranoid if he did that on my behalf far more than Axel's hamfisted read.
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Okay, why is anyone voting to Empower Seppel based on that claim? I completely fail to understand the logic here. Like even if he's telling the truth (big "if"), he appears to me to be of no value to the Town, and might be straight-up anti-value (removing Doc protects?) We've got a limited # of people we can empower, and we're going to throw that away on this? To help him win and then leave the game (which is also like a free kill for the scum then?)
I'm not sure I believe it anyway, as his ability to win seems to rely completely on us doing something stupid and unproductive (i.e. voting to empower him). It's literally impossible for him to win with his role as described without that. And otherwise it's like he's not even part of the game, just this guy over here doing his own thing which might randomly mess with us (or, to be fair, the scum too, but it's not like he actually cares about that if the claim is true). It's just so weird. I won't say it can't be true because weird is certainly in Az's wheelhouse, but I don't like it as a role, and I want to think Az would be more cognizant of that. But helping Seppel over someone you actually think is Town is pure negative value.
Other news, not a huge fan of what Sir Chris is doing re: Manders. And I don't agree with his logic. And he's voting to give Seppel power which is not something a smart person should be doing, and he claims to be smart.
I do not think that the typical scum reaction to my post (i.e. giving an opinion Manders is Town for a less-than-objectively-great reason) is to jump down the throat of the person who is saying they think you are town. I think her paranoia seems more townie than scummy. I think scum are more likely to play that one of two ways - either get jokey with me, taking my post as a joke post, or staying nice with me, and hoping this read I have doesn't go away.
None of this is definitive, but it makes more sense to me from Town than scum so far.
Being concerned with how well I can convince others IF I decide I need to convince others that AXELROD is Scum is not me being scum…it is me being me. IF Axelrod is scum and I need to prove it later, I will need all the help I can get.
If you think Axelrod is scum, I'll believe you based on the strength of your evidence rather than some nebulous "gut pinging" that's been going on since the start of the game. I still think it's far more likely that you're scum who wanted to register early suspicion in order to solidify a potential future case/vote.
Doesn't this logic only apply is Axelrod is also scum?
I'm not sure I totally follow. My logic or Manders'? Scum have plenty of incentive to want to make their cases look well thought through rather than spurious and/or opportunistic, regardless of whether their target is town or scum.
Your logic. Unless you think Manders is just the worst scum player ever, how do you reconcile the thought that Manders would leave herself open for such a derpy attack on Axelrod later on if she weren't scum with him? By any stretch of the imagination, that would look terrible in any scenario that was NOT scumManders on scumAxel.
Why do I have to agree with a person's reads to think they're town?
Who said you did? I never did.
Then why are you giving me grief for empowering Chris?
Because you're currently giving him the power to target me with something and you have no idea what it is. (To be clear, you don't have to agree with someone's read to think they're Town, but giving them the ability to affect someone else you think is Town in a negative way is weird.)
In general, there are more abilities I can think of that townies in general have that have a positive effect on the state of the person they target if they're town (such as Doctor or Cop) as opposed to the more detrimental ones (such as Jailer, which still has an upside, or Vigilante). I mean, what are the odds that in a game this large, I had Empowered the Vigilante to shoot you? Additionally, do you not think you'll be able to shake Chris's scum read of you before the time he reaches the point where he could detrimentally affect you? Come on, bring back the old Manders who didn't care about the way people were reading her.
Okay, why is anyone voting to Empower Seppel based on that claim? I completely fail to understand the logic here. Like even if he's telling the truth (big "if"), he appears to me to be of no value to the Town, and might be straight-up anti-value (removing Doc protects?) We've got a limited # of people we can empower, and we're going to throw that away on this? To help him win and then leave the game (which is also like a free kill for the scum then?)
I'm not sure I believe it anyway, as his ability to win seems to rely completely on us doing something stupid and unproductive (i.e. voting to empower him). It's literally impossible for him to win with his role as described without that. And otherwise it's like he's not even part of the game, just this guy over here doing his own thing which might randomly mess with us (or, to be fair, the scum too, but it's not like he actually cares about that if the claim is true). It's just so weird. I won't say it can't be true because weird is certainly in Az's wheelhouse, but I don't like it as a role, and I want to think Az would be more cognizant of that. But helping Seppel over someone you actually think is Town is pure negative value.
Other news, not a huge fan of what Sir Chris is doing re: Manders. And I don't agree with his logic. And he's voting to give Seppel power which is not something a smart person should be doing, and he claims to be smart.
I do not think that the typical scum reaction to my post (i.e. giving an opinion Manders is Town for a less-than-objectively-great reason) is to jump down the throat of the person who is saying they think you are town. I think her paranoia seems more townie than scummy. I think scum are more likely to play that one of two ways - either get jokey with me, taking my post as a joke post, or staying nice with me, and hoping this read I have doesn't go away.
None of this is definitive, but it makes more sense to me from Town than scum so far.
/barn basically everything Axel said RE: Seppel. I have no intention of Empowering Seppel until he trueclaims.
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See this is fun. Because I just got done being told manders is very unconventional and now Axelrod is citing typical scum reactions as a way to clear Manders.
This just doesn't add up when people are using different standards and it all leads to "oh that Manders, totes town" it's kind of bull***** really, to be blunt. I mean maybe Manders is in fact town but if everyone has a different measuring stick it means that most of them are flawed because only one can be true in terms of what type of player manders is.
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Oh but be at ease, I only vig people I think I can't get lynched
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{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
The Family
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I'd like to hear your reasons why are you buying Seppel's claim? Why do you even believe Seppel has the abilities he claimed?
I'm guessing no. Also clarification on wincon, nobody *living*.
Also I just realized that I have no innate way of gaining empowerment. So uh. Oops on that.
Ghosting got me all excited and then I was let down.
How about we go for something symbiotic?
@Anyone: You empower me, I empower you back. First to empower me gets my empowerment loyalty.
Relatedly, I don't believe Iso has any passive abilities.
And if he's scum, I'm looking forward to seeing how it goes.
No need. I was given a list of all 16 passive abilities that could appear in the game.
Godfather is one of them.
There's also one called "Shell-shocked from Doom Cannon," which leads me to believe two things:
(1) There's a Doom Cannon. (Might be as unlikely to appear as the Armageddon Weapon from Inheritance Mafia.)
(2) Players can gain passive abilities.
My block also works on temporary passive abilities, like "doc protected," but those aren't necessary for hitting my wincon.
I'm not revealing the full list, because some of these are not good for the mafia to know about.
I hope everyone had a good Thanksgiving!
I'll do my best about catching up asap, but I AM at work, so no promises.
Or, maybe I've learned not to believe anything you claim on Day 1.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
One urgent thing, @ Seppel, I don't have any passive abilities. Will I gain anything by empowering you? Other than getting empowered myself (which is not a bad idea if anyone else believes I'm Town, btw). I need to review your ability again because it seems like something Azrael would come up with and I see no reason not to believe it. You played it exactly as you should have imo, and I didn't see any Scum motivation for doing it.
1. Yes
2. No
3. Yes
This way once I leave the game or whenever it becomes relevant, you can out the list, or at the very least be an independent verifier.
If you want the list, you'll empower me. <3
Bur- Iso, Cyan
Manders - Seppel, TheIceMan, Sir Chris
Tom - Anak , Axelrod
Anak - Shadow, GJ
GJ - Cythare, Tom
9 to lynch
Official Empowerment Count:
Sir Chris - Iso
Being concerned with how well I can convince others IF I decide I need to convince others that AXELROD is Scum is not me being scum…it is me being me. IF Axelrod is scum and I need to prove it later, I will need all the help I can get.
Well, hell, if no one else is going to volunteer, I totally will. I love being neighbors (Masons?) with people.
Oh yay, this post:
How much experience do you have playing with Axelrod?
You voted for Trump, didn’t you?
It is painfully obvious that you don’t have any idea about me, my playstyle, or my play history. I’m down to be pals, though.
Unfortunately for you, this is the best way to determine my alignment. Always has been, always will be.
BTW this is where you REALLY show that you know nothing about me.
Scumhunting Town like to be able to have a great case, too.
I’m an unconventional person. Kudos for finally getting me.
HI SEPPEL. I’m going to ask some clarifying questions. Feel free not to answer if you think it’s best.
So you will learn if they have one at all and if you blocked it? (Meaning if they don’t have one, you’ll know that as well?)
That is sexy.
I assume the abilities will stay where they are when you win and leave the game?
Oh bby.
I don’t know why, and I know him pretty well.
You don’t agree with his number one choice for scum, yet you empower him? What logic did you use to decide to do that?
Anything in particular you’re looking for? I ask because I feel as if I’ve explained myself pretty clearly.
Glad to see we’re on the same page.
Wow. You’ve improved.
You mean other than other people giving it to you? From my discussion with Az on the subject, I assumed no one did…but that’s probably a silly assumption now that I think about it.
@ The bolded…duh! Your ability can give passives from one person to another, and there’s probably a good chance several players have no passive abilities.
You're gross.
TO THE PERSON WHO INITIATED A ONE-WAY CHAT WITH ME: I'm not ready for that level of commitment just yet.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I'll use the same avatar so it won't be TOO confusing.
is that what im doing?
its a slightly less boring lynch if it hits scum, but its still a boring lynch
now i definitely hope youre lying
anyway.
i feel good about my vote RN
i dont like this mask so far, gj
developing some town reads
notably on chris, manders, tim, DV, anak, maaayybbee iso
not sure who else is scum
could be bur. meh.
Then why are you giving me grief for empowering Chris?
Doesn't this logic only apply is Axelrod is also scum?
Sooo you would prefer an exciting town lynch over a boring scum lynch? Do correct me if I'm misunderstanding.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Fixed.
Empower Seppel
id just rather hear spicier reads than scum bur right now
did you message him on MU?
i doubt he checks this website
What's his username on MU? No idea who he is.
No one with the same i.d. over there.
As for Bur, I think I understand (and agree with) what tom is trying to say but I'm not about to put words in his mouth.
maybe im wrong
Because you're currently giving him the power to target me with something and you have no idea what it is. (To be clear, you don't have to agree with someone's read to think they're Town, but giving them the ability to affect someone else you think is Town in a negative way is weird.)
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So yeah still very unconvinced about Manders. Like sure I get that everyone is different and hey meta is meta, I do love my meta reads myself I can't deny them, but she is being pretty slimy right now and I don't have the disadvantage of expectation here. If Manders is clever she knows how to play against people who have seen her, any scum can fake that, good scum get in trouble when people just drop the pretense and look at stuff.
What I see from Manders is a very self serving style.
Experience with Axelrod... honestly I can't remember playing with him off the top of my head, but I may have at some point. When I am in the thick of things I like to rely on meta reads quite a bit because mine tend to be scary good at determining town, but because I am not in that mindset I am just working off my basic book of mafia play which tends to have a good 90% clear rate. Mafia won't tend to act in an intentional way that corners them, and so I work off of that.
Hey Seppel I am down for Empowerment buddying.
Empower Seppel
Love ya pal.
Also I have a passive.
Vote2: Manders
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I already got dibs.
I have no idea what "pocket" means in regards to the bolded.
That being said, everything that I have been accused of is something that could be done by either Town or Scum. The fact that you do not know me IS relevant because you cannot possibly decipher my intent unless you know me (as many here can attest) because, as Cyan said, I'm unconventional.
Do take note, though, that I never said you were scummy or leaning Scum to me. I believe you are Town, but are wrong.
I'm actually pretty terrible as Scum. I had ONE shining moment in a Basic once, but I was a gimmick and had WAY more experience than anyone else in the game.
OK then let me share with you WHY Axelrod's post gave me hesitance. (I actually think I already said this in a post to TIM, but I can't remember, so I'll say it here for you.)
I, myself, have only played with Axelrod a few times. Even players who have played with me a LOT (see Cyan, Seppel, Iso for examples from this game) have a tendency to have trouble reading me and can't determine my alignment all that well. So for Axelrod to come in and proclaim me Town based off one post (because the reasons he gave were just reasons, they didn't actually make any difference in his decision on whether I was Town or not, I guarantee you that because, like Gentleman Johnny said, those two factors have no bearing on me myself) is a bit ridiculous and makes me very skeptical.
What I THINK might be happening? Axel's just saying I'm Town to ease my mind and throw me off in an attempt to earn my trust. Yet, even if this is 100% what he's doing, THAT doesn't even guarantee he's Scum. I could see Axelrod doing that so I will relax and be me (because he's seen me be nervous as Town, make a stupid mistake, get strung up for it, and flip the **** out because I ****ed up and I was so mad at myself I raged and rampaged and ended up getting myself modkilled for posting before I thought and I accidentally quoted the mod so Seppel had to modkill me) so he can decide if I'm Town or not (because when I'm Town, eventually, I am OBV TOWN and then get night killed.)
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I'm not sure I believe it anyway, as his ability to win seems to rely completely on us doing something stupid and unproductive (i.e. voting to empower him). It's literally impossible for him to win with his role as described without that. And otherwise it's like he's not even part of the game, just this guy over here doing his own thing which might randomly mess with us (or, to be fair, the scum too, but it's not like he actually cares about that if the claim is true). It's just so weird. I won't say it can't be true because weird is certainly in Az's wheelhouse, but I don't like it as a role, and I want to think Az would be more cognizant of that. But helping Seppel over someone you actually think is Town is pure negative value.
Other news, not a huge fan of what Sir Chris is doing re: Manders. And I don't agree with his logic. And he's voting to give Seppel power which is not something a smart person should be doing, and he claims to be smart.
I do not think that the typical scum reaction to my post (i.e. giving an opinion Manders is Town for a less-than-objectively-great reason) is to jump down the throat of the person who is saying they think you are town. I think her paranoia seems more townie than scummy. I think scum are more likely to play that one of two ways - either get jokey with me, taking my post as a joke post, or staying nice with me, and hoping this read I have doesn't go away.
None of this is definitive, but it makes more sense to me from Town than scum so far.
One of the things I am finding weird is your lack of scum ability paired with an inability for people to read you paired with you praising everyone being able to read you this game. Bad scum players are very easy to read as town. It is the nature of the dynamic which makes it easy for people to sacrifice their scum game for their town game (something players will often do so they can be 'obvious) but when that happens... you don't get a lot of mix ups. Also I am very good at reading unconventional players because I myself am one. I caused quite a stir when I debuted here because I am a different animal than most had seen before in terms of how I use logic and how I employ strategy.
It has worked out for me though, thankfully.
Okay so the bold pocket means basically what you said you thought Axel was doing to you.
I find it interesting that Cyan thinks you will rub me the wrong way forever, I don't tend to be vexed for too long in the game of mafia.
Speaking of Cyan, Manders and Cyan are unlikely to be scum buddies based off Manders using Cyan as a prop. Don't think a scum manders leans on the testimony of a scum cyan to bolster herself there. I fundamentally disagree with needing to have played with you to read you though. It aids, but at most I could look up an old game. I inherently dislike this attempt to cast me in the role of someone who CAN'T do something. It makes me want to read every single one of your games just to eliminate the thread, as it is a very nasty thread. Mafia has very few unique circumstances, frankly. I love meta more than most even, but the lack of meta has never critically hindered me, and you won't be the first to make that happen for me.
Something is bugging me here. Something is off about you or around you. Is it you? Is it something someone said related to you? This conversation is an interesting one for me because many people have gone out of their way to make you special, and with not a lot of heat. You express suspicion of Axelrod but don't seem concerned about the softer defenses of you that come from a far more clever mindset. Cyan trying to get me to cut bait, for instance, would make me paranoid if he did that on my behalf far more than Axel's hamfisted read.
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang)
2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer
2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator)
2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia
2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational
2015 - Best Town Player
2015 - Best Mafia Player
2015 - Best Overall Player
Axel, what do you think about D_V?
Tired of corporate corruption ruining your favorite MtG site?
Come join ours!!
We even have Mafia!!
Then why aren't you making waves?
Your logic. Unless you think Manders is just the worst scum player ever, how do you reconcile the thought that Manders would leave herself open for such a derpy attack on Axelrod later on if she weren't scum with him? By any stretch of the imagination, that would look terrible in any scenario that was NOT scumManders on scumAxel.
In general, there are more abilities I can think of that townies in general have that have a positive effect on the state of the person they target if they're town (such as Doctor or Cop) as opposed to the more detrimental ones (such as Jailer, which still has an upside, or Vigilante). I mean, what are the odds that in a game this large, I had Empowered the Vigilante to shoot you? Additionally, do you not think you'll be able to shake Chris's scum read of you before the time he reaches the point where he could detrimentally affect you? Come on, bring back the old Manders who didn't care about the way people were reading her.
/barn basically everything Axel said RE: Seppel. I have no intention of Empowering Seppel until he trueclaims.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
This just doesn't add up when people are using different standards and it all leads to "oh that Manders, totes town" it's kind of bull***** really, to be blunt. I mean maybe Manders is in fact town but if everyone has a different measuring stick it means that most of them are flawed because only one can be true in terms of what type of player manders is.
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang)
2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer
2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator)
2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia
2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational
2015 - Best Town Player
2015 - Best Mafia Player
2015 - Best Overall Player
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang)
2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer
2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator)
2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia
2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational
2015 - Best Town Player
2015 - Best Mafia Player
2015 - Best Overall Player