I especially want input from people who know him and how he plays.
---
I...don't really see the questions-as-accusations thing. I think they're fair questions -- ones I've certainly thought myself. kpaca's weird townread, Shinichi not asking what I liked about Grapefruit's post, etc.
Re, could you tell me where you are with kpaca, QH, and Shinichi? Anything that sticks out to you?
It all a matter of the eye of the beholder, though i already explained my response on this discussion in post 148 , not sure how to grab the url for specific posts yet.
I still don't think Shinichi is town (wish other people would weigh in here, kinda feels like it's being brushed aside) so kpaca and his Good Posts TM will have to wait.
Mind providing details for those reading the post and myself lol.
That's something i took note off to, ive seen it happen in plenty of my games. If anything it gives me a slight scum read of shadow a very small one at that tho, because asking questions to push the thread is not something scum would necessarily would do, but the would do it to try to create fasle accusations.
Yes, it's something that weirds me out. Will be watching for more of those...
No unless he uses myanimelist then yes its possible.
I see, alright. vote: kpaca
Nobody townreads Shinichi that early. Nobody townreads Shinichi unless they've played with him before. Even if they've played with him before, they don't townread him. It doesn't matter much to me atm if Shinichi is town or scum, only that that's a read I can't buy. To top it off, I don't think I've read any justification behind the read. Yes, I'm sheeping a bit.
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[quote from="kpaca »" url="http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/community-forums/mafia/777879-silence-of-the-lambs-d1-lambs-in-the-mist?comment=59"]My only read right now is soft town on shinchi but I mean it's really to early to tell.
Getting slight town reads from the guy who i called aggresive, should i be worried.
you've got to be kidding me
can he really be scum with lines like that
Is this sarcasm? Because unless you have absolute proof hes town for me hes guilty just like everyone else.
Also I think you read this post wrong, or maybe my grammar just sucks. I was saying should i be worried that the person who i said was aggresive announced that he had a slight town read on me. I wasn't implying i town read him but like I said my grammar ****ed that sentence up pretty badly.
I did misread it like that.
That's okay, because you're probably still town anyway.
Hey Grapefruit, since everyone else is, can I pocket you as well?
I feel like asking this is something a player that is afraid of being caught would ask but maybe im looking way to into this statement
@grapefruit This something i notice alot, but its possible mindreaver read that small line about quickhoodies that you posted before posting his own message just a possibility tho.
@Mindreaver compared to hoodies post i quite like your entrance you started off with a vote and explained in detail even tho small of why you voted him. Do you think his overreaction was scum motivated or town motivated tho? I feel as tho it was more town motivated than anything.
@Wheat I completely disagree with your read on Vaimes, but I like someone being skeptical especially with your other reads feeling town.
The tidbit on Terry makes total sense to me and I like you backing down on that misunderstanding.
@Shinichi I forgot to ask what do you make of RE so far this game?
Olny thing that really strikes me as odd is the fact that he's vote kpaca for a reference he doesnt even know about so it cant even be applied to him. I speficially don't like her most recent post except the middle quote that was fine but the rest are just fluff and playful games it seems.
Hey Grapefruit, since everyone else is, can I pocket you as well?
I feel like asking this is something a player that is afraid of being caught would ask but maybe im looking way to into this statement
@grapefruit This something i notice alot, but its possible mindreaver read that small line about quickhoodies that you posted before posting his own message just a possibility tho.
@Mindreaver compared to hoodies post i quite like your entrance you started off with a vote and explained in detail even tho small of why you voted him. Do you think his overreaction was scum motivated or town motivated tho? I feel as tho it was more town motivated than anything.
Trying to figure out where i mentioned anything about QH being town motivated i was implying i that vai overreaction to my post was town motivated unless we are talking about something totally difference cause if so im confused.
Getting slight town reads from the guy who i called aggresive, should i be worried.
you've got to be kidding me
can he really be scum with lines like that
Is this sarcasm? Because unless you have absolute proof hes town for me hes guilty just like everyone else.
Also I think you read this post wrong, or maybe my grammar just sucks. I was saying should i be worried that the person who i said was aggresive announced that he had a slight town read on me. I wasn't implying i town read him but like I said my grammar ****ed that sentence up pretty badly.
I did misread it like that.
That's okay, because you're probably still town anyway.
</blockquote>
I kinda figured as much lol, tho i still question that town read on me.
Olny thing that really strikes me as odd is the fact that he's vote kpaca for a reference he doesnt even know about so it cant even be applied to him. I speficially don't like her most recent post except the middle quote that was fine but the rest are just fluff and playful games it seems.
What reference?
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@Wheat I completely disagree with your read on Vaimes, but I like someone being skeptical especially with your other reads feeling town.
The tidbit on Terry makes total sense to me and I like you backing down on that misunderstanding.
@Shinichi I forgot to ask what do you make of RE so far this game?
Olny thing that really strikes me as odd is the fact that he's vote kpaca for a reference he doesnt even know about so it cant even be applied to him. I speficially don't like her most recent post except the middle quote that was fine but the rest are just fluff and playful games it seems.
Hey Grapefruit, since everyone else is, can I pocket you as well?
I feel like asking this is something a player that is afraid of being caught would ask but maybe im looking way to into this statement
@grapefruit This something i notice alot, but its possible mindreaver read that small line about quickhoodies that you posted before posting his own message just a possibility tho.
@Mindreaver compared to hoodies post i quite like your entrance you started off with a vote and explained in detail even tho small of why you voted him. Do you think his overreaction was scum motivated or town motivated tho? I feel as tho it was more town motivated than anything.
Trying to figure out where i mentioned anything about QH being town motivated i was implying i that vai overreaction to my post was town motivated unless we are talking about something totally difference cause if so im confused.
@Wheat I completely disagree with your read on Vaimes, but I like someone being skeptical especially with your other reads feeling town.
The tidbit on Terry makes total sense to me and I like you backing down on that misunderstanding.
@Shinichi I forgot to ask what do you make of RE so far this game?
Olny thing that really strikes me as odd is the fact that he's vote kpaca for a reference he doesnt even know about so it cant even be applied to him. I speficially don't like her most recent post except the middle quote that was fine but the rest are just fluff and playful games it seems.
Hey Grapefruit, since everyone else is, can I pocket you as well?
I feel like asking this is something a player that is afraid of being caught would ask but maybe im looking way to into this statement
@grapefruit This something i notice alot, but its possible mindreaver read that small line about quickhoodies that you posted before posting his own message just a possibility tho.
@Mindreaver compared to hoodies post i quite like your entrance you started off with a vote and explained in detail even tho small of why you voted him. Do you think his overreaction was scum motivated or town motivated tho? I feel as tho it was more town motivated than anything.
Trying to figure out where i mentioned anything about QH being town motivated i was implying i that vai overreaction to my post was town motivated unless we are talking about something totally difference cause if so im confused.
Bolded the part in question.
But that bold i was talking about vaimes not QH lmao
Olny thing that really strikes me as odd is the fact that he's vote kpaca for a reference he doesnt even know about so it cant even be applied to him. I speficially don't like her most recent post except the middle quote that was fine but the rest are just fluff and playful games it seems.
What reference?
You voted him due to the fact that he town read me when no ones suppose to do that, like he suppose to get that reference lol. How can you scum read him for not being accustomed to a different websites meta.
It seems that, regardless of their alignments, poking at kpaca and WG isn't going to be very productive. I can already see myself getting annoyed at them, so I'll let other people handle that unless either of those two have specific questions for me.
Town: Vaimes
Townlean: Grapefruit, WG, QH, RE1031
Null: Roger Sherman, Joe Terry, AG, Mindreaver, shadowlancerx
Scumlean: kpaca, Shinichi
Scum:
---
@shadow
Can you tell me why you like Grapefruit, why you unvoted kpaca, and what you expect kpaca to do as a result? Please be specific.
Olny thing that really strikes me as odd is the fact that he's vote kpaca for a reference he doesnt even know about so it cant even be applied to him. I speficially don't like her most recent post except the middle quote that was fine but the rest are just fluff and playful games it seems.
What reference?
You voted him due to the fact that he town read me when no ones suppose to do that, like he suppose to get that reference lol. How can you scum read him for not being accustomed to a different websites meta.
Yeah, sorry, I should clarify. I mean to say that you're typically not town read by many people. At least from my experience. So in addition to there being no reasoning behind that read, it's a read that I would not expect anyone to give in the beginning of the game. kpaca's read on you when you were getting some heat feels almost like an attempt to pocket you, or at least gain some kind of credit should you flip town. This theory does assume you are town, but it stems from something more concrete, like a read out of nowhere.
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I think Grapefruit is town, specifically for 107. Glad WG agrees with me!
I'm okay with the way WG is handling me, though I'm loathe to actually interact with him.
RE1031 just kind of feels agenda-less.
QH is more of a shrugread. I think it'd be weird for scum to be accused of making large empty posts, by responding to that accusation with an even bigger wallpost going over his own past posts to make a point. Reads more as towny defiance/snark.
It seems that, regardless of their alignments, poking at kpaca and WG isn't going to be very productive. I can already see myself getting annoyed at them, so I'll let other people handle that unless either of those two have specific questions for me.
Town: Vaimes
Townlean: Grapefruit, WG, QH, RE1031
Null: Roger Sherman, Joe Terry, AG, Mindreaver, shadowlancerx
Scumlean: kpaca, Shinichi
Scum:
---
@shadow
Can you tell me why you like Grapefruit, why you unvoted kpaca, and what you expect kpaca to do as a result? Please be specific.
What makes u think me and kpaca are scum together?
Scumreadig two people != thinking they are scum together. It takes time and content to fine-tune scumreads.
As it stands, there is nothing ruling out you two being on the mafia team together. There's a small link re: kpaca townreading you for reasons that are nonexistent or flimsy.
Rereading has told me my vote on Shadow is awful. In context I like the quotes RE pulled out, but I see nothing that really makes me feel one way or the other...
Unvote
Will try to form a productive wagon after modern tonight.
It seems that, regardless of their alignments, poking at kpaca and WG isn't going to be very productive. I can already see myself getting annoyed at them, so I'll let other people handle that unless either of those two have specific questions for me.
Town: Vaimes
Townlean: Grapefruit, WG, QH, RE1031
Null: Roger Sherman, Joe Terry, AG, Mindreaver, shadowlancerx
Scumlean: kpaca, Shinichi
Scum:
---
@shadow
Can you tell me why you like Grapefruit, why you unvoted kpaca, and what you expect kpaca to do as a result? Please be specific.
I think Grapefruit is town, specifically for 107. Glad WG agrees with me!
I'm okay with the way WG is handling me, though I'm loathe to actually interact with him.
RE1031 just kind of feels agenda-less.
QH is more of a shrugread. I think it'd be weird for scum to be accused of making large empty posts, by responding to that accusation with an even bigger wallpost going over his own past posts to make a point. Reads more as towny defiance/snark.
@Wheat Sure so there are a couple things commiting reads to the record is a good sign. It's harder to back out of them later if you get them out early so I like the existence of those two posts.
Second I really like his QH read.
Third and weaker I like his tale on RE. It looks super sketchy, but it rings true to me. If either of them were to flip scum it would make me look at the other but RE is raising valid points without really driving anything which doesn't scream scummy. In short I like his town reads.
Its a pretty pointless post true but its also easy to answer this early game, though if anything I would consider these post meaningless unless you think people who try to paint themselves as town through trick questions as scum?
i think it's possible.
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That's something i took note off to, ive seen it happen in plenty of my games. If anything it gives me a slight scum read of shadow a very small one at that tho, because asking questions to push the thread is not something scum would necessarily would do, but the would do it to try to create fasle accusations.
Yes, it's something that weirds me out. Will be watching for more of those...
No unless he uses myanimelist then yes its possible.
I see, alright. vote: kpaca
Nobody townreads Shinichi that early. Nobody townreads Shinichi unless they've played with him before. Even if they've played with him before, they don't townread him. It doesn't matter much to me atm if Shinichi is town or scum, only that that's a read I can't buy. To top it off, I don't think I've read any justification behind the read. Yes, I'm sheeping a bit.
I don't like this vote. Seems like an early bandwagon disguised as thought. I town read Sinichi early, well pretty close to that, I didn't see anything outwardly scummy. I'm just not feeling the sincerity.
I don't like this vote. Seems like an early bandwagon disguised as thought. I town read Sinichi early, well pretty close to that, I didn't see anything outwardly scummy. I'm just not feeling the sincerity.
UNVTOTE, VOTE: RE1031
Grapefruit admitted that he always scum reads Shinichi. I'm saying that Shinichi is not often town read. Shinichi can probably confirm that I in the past have scum read him and lynched him as town while at it. I've seen plenty of people struggle to read Shinichi. So I am suspicious of what led kpaca to say that Shinichi was a town read, even if it was soft.
What you're saying right now about how you feel about Shinichi is he's neutral. Someone who does nothing outwardly scummy nor outwardly townie (I'm assuming here) is neutral.
And I honestly haven't been keeping track of votes, I thought at least one person removed their votes from kpaca.
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Rereading has told me my vote on Shadow is awful. In context I like the quotes RE pulled out, but I see nothing that really makes me feel one way or the other...
Unvote
Will try to form a productive wagon after modern tonight.
Yeah, that's actually how I felt about it too, but I wanted to do something slightly productive. So I thought it was a little weird that you voted right after me. So this may be an early town tell from you, taking back your vote. Maybe...
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I don't like this vote. Seems like an early bandwagon disguised as thought. I town read Sinichi early, well pretty close to that, I didn't see anything outwardly scummy.
Can you go over this a little bit more? Why are you equating "not scummy" with "I townread him early"?
Can you tell me why you like Grapefruit, why you unvoted kpaca, and what you expect kpaca to do as a result? Please be specific.
Grapefruit so far has been a driving force; he's asking relevant questions, critically thinking about other people, and so far seems to be playing without agenda. His haphazard vote on me was a blip on that, not because of the vote, but how...off it felt. However, his retraction feels genuine, and wasn't prompted by anyone else calling him out.
This speaks to me:
Quote from Vaimes »
It seems that, regardless of [his] alignment, poking at kpaca isn't going to be very productive. I can already see myself getting annoyed at [him]
Like his early posts did not feel like I have started expecting from him, but as soon as I called him out, he turned into a troll again.
What I'm hoping is that I'll be able to read him without the back and forth fight that would come from continuing to push him, because I have a feeling that he'll self resolve.
~~~
Why are you reading Wheat as town? Does he always push you?
@Wheat: Walk me through your thoughts on Vaimes, I have no idea what you're seeing.
Yeah, that's actually how I felt about it too, but I wanted to do something slightly productive. So I thought it was a little weird that you voted right after me. So this may be an early town tell from you, taking back your vote. Maybe...
I can only recall one game I played in with WG, some micro with a cult mechanic. He scumread me most of D1 for some reason, can't remember and don't feel like looking it up, then he reversed his read on me when I self-voted. Basically I feel like he's handling me in a similar fashion.
Though the way he's handling me also means that trying to interact with him will suck the fun out of the game for me. It gives off a very "you're scum so I don't care about anything you have to say," vibe, which I don't feel like subjecting myself to. So I'll interact with other people and he'll see I'm town sooner or later.
I can only recall one game I played in with WG, some micro with a cult mechanic. He scumread me most of D1 for some reason, can't remember and don't feel like looking it up, then he reversed his read on me when I self-voted. Basically I feel like he's handling me in a similar fashion.
Though the way he's handling me also means that trying to interact with him will suck the fun out of the game for me. It gives off a very "you're scum so I don't care about anything you have to say," vibe, which I don't feel like subjecting myself to. So I'll interact with other people and he'll see I'm town sooner or later.
that was Titanic ultimatum, which I remember because it's the game that actually got me interested in Mafia. I didn't realize that was your only other game with Wheat.
@Wheat I completely disagree with your read on Vaimes, but I like someone being skeptical especially with your other reads feeling town.
The tidbit on Terry makes total sense to me and I like you backing down on that misunderstanding.
@Shinichi I forgot to ask what do you make of RE so far this game?
Olny thing that really strikes me as odd is the fact that he's vote kpaca for a reference he doesnt even know about so it cant even be applied to him. I speficially don't like her most recent post except the middle quote that was fine but the rest are just fluff and playful games it seems.
Hey Grapefruit, since everyone else is, can I pocket you as well?
I feel like asking this is something a player that is afraid of being caught would ask but maybe im looking way to into this statement
@grapefruit This something i notice alot, but its possible mindreaver read that small line about quickhoodies that you posted before posting his own message just a possibility tho.
@Mindreaver compared to hoodies post i quite like your entrance you started off with a vote and explained in detail even tho small of why you voted him. Do you think his overreaction was scum motivated or town motivated tho? I feel as tho it was more town motivated than anything.
Trying to figure out where i mentioned anything about QH being town motivated i was implying i that vai overreaction to my post was town motivated unless we are talking about something totally difference cause if so im confused.
Bolded the part in question.
Sorry, I guess I missed a question directed at me. As far as Vaimes' motivation here goes, it'd be pretty bold to come out of the gate swinging for a mislynch of anyone. Let alone somebody he has no background at all with. I've seen him pick fights early as town and scum, so that's not really indicative either way. I'll lay out my complete thought process now, since I'm not sure how much more I'm going to get out of it. I was hoping for more Vaimes votes, but I don't think anyone is biting.
We had roughly 7 people actively posting in the beginning. My hypothesis is, that there is some number of scum in:
Grapefruit21
kpaca
Quickhoodies
Shinichi
Vaimes
Wheat_Grinder
So with that in mind, I had two or three scenarios:
1) Grape and Vaimes are a team, and are powerwolfing like crazy. They still could be, but based on Grape's reaction, or lack of one, when I went after Vaimes. I'm at least comfortable they aren't aligned.
2) Kpaca and WG were both behaving in a similar way. One-liners, and not much input, while keeping post count up. The difference there, was that I didn't see kpaca's agenda. Like, he's abrasive, and it's generally unhelpful. But that doesn't advance any scum worldview, he's not probing for mislynches, or discrediting anyone, even his "townread" was loose. WG was more troublesome, since he did comment on specific people, and kinda piled on to the Vaimes wagon. I disagree with Vaime that Kpaca was the scum on his wagon, and I think it might be WG. Assuming we see Vaimes flip town at some point.
3) Shinichi and QH seemed like they could be aligned, just the way they are interacting. But that also just seems like it could be that they know one another, and were more comfortable interacting with each other. If Shinichi is indeed scum here, that would seem to vindicate Vaimes.
I think I'm most convinced with a town grape world. Which would lead me down a path where Vaimes is probably town, and suspicion falls to WG/Kpaca, Sinichi/QH worlds.
I hated AGs entrance, and when contrasted with Terry's, I can't help feel Terry is town and AG just looked forced into making reads the second he came in. Shadow is null, RE I need to reread a bit.
I think I'd like to Vote AG. I'd like to see something other than consensus reads out of you.
There miiight be one more game I've had with WG that I'm just not remembering. Shrug.
It's a limited meta read. WG is sort of short/curt with his responses, doesn't elaborate on things without prodding, makes definitive but empty statements. Things I'm at least somewhat used to coming from him as town. Plus the scumread of me is something I can understand, even though it's wrong.
There's room for this read to improve. No interest in lynching right now, at any rate.
Yeah, that's actually how I felt about it too, but I wanted to do something slightly productive. So I thought it was a little weird that you voted right after me. So this may be an early town tell from you, taking back your vote. Maybe...
What do you mean by the bolded?
My only vote prior was an RVS vote. I was not confident in my vote on you (I stated in the same post that I basically got nothing from rereading), but I wanted to start somewhere.
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I think I'm most convinced with a town grape world. Which would lead me down a path where Vaimes is probably town, and suspicion falls to WG/Kpaca, Sinichi/QH worlds.
Why are you voting for AG instead of exploring these worlds?
Yeah, that's actually how I felt about it too, but I wanted to do something slightly productive. So I thought it was a little weird that you voted right after me. So this may be an early town tell from you, taking back your vote. Maybe...
What do you mean by the bolded?
My only vote prior was an RVS vote. I was not confident in my vote on you (I stated in the same post that I basically got nothing from rereading), but I wanted to start somewhere.
Oooh, that makes a lot more sense, I misunderstood your first line and I'm tracking now.
Scumreadig two people != thinking they are scum together. It takes time and content to fine-tune scumreads.
As it stands, there is nothing ruling out you two being on the mafia team together. There's a small link re: kpaca townreading you for reasons that are nonexistent or flimsy.
Well I mean if me and him are your only scum reads it makes sense to assume you think we're mafia together lol.
"I think Shinichi is town but it's soft read so I dunno lol."
Idk if its flimsy at all, it doesn't have any backup that's all
Actually alot of people have been town reading me and only a few actually provided reason. If you think i'm scum why are you only question His read on me and not the others that have seen me as town?
I don't like this vote. Seems like an early bandwagon disguised as thought. I town read Sinichi early, well pretty close to that, I didn't see anything outwardly scummy.
Can you go over this a little bit more? Why are you equating "not scummy" with "I townread him early"?
I don't think they're close concepts at all.
The point was, that when I told you I didn't find anything scummy about Shinichi, it could easily have been taken as "I think Shin is town". The reason I made that point, which I guess wasn't too clear now that I go back and read it was that REI, voted Kpaca on a pretty flimsy reason that he shouldn't have town-read shinichi that early. There were votes at the time on Kpaca and it reads to me as REI choosing to push Kpaca over, someone like me. I got some pretty early town-cred (for very little reasoning IMO), so a push on me wouldn't have been received too well at the time so REI chose to push Kpaca, which could be a easier lynch.
When someone says "I don't think xyz is scummy," that does not register as a townread to me. It registers as null.
I don't think it's flimsy. It's based on what RE knows about Shinichi as a player -- that people in general (but more specifically, people who know him) tend not to townread him early. So RE thinks it's weird that kpaca gave a townread on Shinichi.
The point was, that when I told you I didn't find anything scummy about Shinichi, it could easily have been taken as "I think Shin is town". The reason I made that point, which I guess wasn't too clear now that I go back and read it was that REI, voted Kpaca on a pretty flimsy reason that he shouldn't have town-read shinichi that early. There were votes at the time on Kpaca and it reads to me as REI choosing to push Kpaca over, someone like me. I got some pretty early town-cred (for very little reasoning IMO), so a push on me wouldn't have been received too well at the time so REI chose to push Kpaca, which could be a easier lynch.
Well, I don't think you posted enough to be read at all, scum or town. A push on you as scum wouldn't have made sense even if you weren't being town read. (At the time.)
And it wasn't just that he town read Shinichi early, he didn't offer reasoning behind it. Like I said, it felt like an attempt to pocket Shinichi, especially since Shinichi was getting heat at the time. I'm not pushing anything at this point, or at least anything that I see lasting until the end of the 2 weeks. I could claim that there's nothing to go on, and post nothing until I find something that's not just "flimsy," or I could go and put content in the thread.
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The point was, that when I told you I didn't find anything scummy about Shinichi, it could easily have been taken as "I think Shin is town". The reason I made that point, which I guess wasn't too clear now that I go back and read it was that REI, voted Kpaca on a pretty flimsy reason that he shouldn't have town-read shinichi that early. There were votes at the time on Kpaca and it reads to me as REI choosing to push Kpaca over, someone like me. I got some pretty early town-cred (for very little reasoning IMO), so a push on me wouldn't have been received too well at the time so REI chose to push Kpaca, which could be a easier lynch.
Well, I don't think you posted enough to be read at all, scum or town. A push on you as scum wouldn't have made sense even if you weren't being town read. (At the time.)
And it wasn't just that he town read Shinichi early, he didn't offer reasoning behind it. Like I said, it felt like an attempt to pocket Shinichi, especially since Shinichi was getting heat at the time. I'm not pushing anything at this point, or at least anything that I see lasting until the end of the 2 weeks. I could claim that there's nothing to go on, and post nothing until I find something that's not just "flimsy," or I could go and put content in the thread.
Really, none of us have posted much. This response is good though.
UNVOTE
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It all a matter of the eye of the beholder, though i already explained my response on this discussion in post 148
, not sure how to grab the url for specific posts yet.
Mind providing details for those reading the post and myself lol.
Arg, I should have done the same... Although the Nozomi avatar may have been a dead giveaway.
Yes, it's something that weirds me out. Will be watching for more of those...
I see, alright.
vote: kpaca
Nobody townreads Shinichi that early. Nobody townreads Shinichi unless they've played with him before. Even if they've played with him before, they don't townread him. It doesn't matter much to me atm if Shinichi is town or scum, only that that's a read I can't buy. To top it off, I don't think I've read any justification behind the read. Yes, I'm sheeping a bit.
Yeah actually when the content is all focused on saving your own butt.
Town.
It doesn't. That's not why he's scum. He's scum because he "decided" to have a townread.
Terry is town because he had nothing to say. I'd have expected a scum to try to make something up. I also like the mindset of wanting to start fires.
I did misread it like that.
That's okay, because you're probably still town anyway.
I knew i shoulda hit preview
Was referring to this
The tidbit on Terry makes total sense to me and I like you backing down on that misunderstanding.
@Shinichi I forgot to ask what do you make of RE so far this game?
Olny thing that really strikes me as odd is the fact that he's vote kpaca for a reference he doesnt even know about so it cant even be applied to him. I speficially don't like her most recent post except the middle quote that was fine but the rest are just fluff and playful games it seems.
Trying to figure out where i mentioned anything about QH being town motivated i was implying i that vai overreaction to my post was town motivated unless we are talking about something totally difference cause if so im confused.
I kinda figured as much lol, tho i still question that town read on me.
What reference?
Bolded the part in question.
But that bold i was talking about vaimes not QH lmao
You voted him due to the fact that he town read me when no ones suppose to do that, like he suppose to get that reference lol. How can you scum read him for not being accustomed to a different websites meta.
Town: Vaimes
Townlean: Grapefruit, WG, QH, RE1031
Null: Roger Sherman, Joe Terry, AG, Mindreaver, shadowlancerx
Scumlean: kpaca, Shinichi
Scum:
---
@shadow
Can you tell me why you like Grapefruit, why you unvoted kpaca, and what you expect kpaca to do as a result? Please be specific.
Yeah, sorry, I should clarify. I mean to say that you're typically not town read by many people. At least from my experience. So in addition to there being no reasoning behind that read, it's a read that I would not expect anyone to give in the beginning of the game. kpaca's read on you when you were getting some heat feels almost like an attempt to pocket you, or at least gain some kind of credit should you flip town. This theory does assume you are town, but it stems from something more concrete, like a read out of nowhere.
I'm okay with the way WG is handling me, though I'm loathe to actually interact with him.
RE1031 just kind of feels agenda-less.
QH is more of a shrugread. I think it'd be weird for scum to be accused of making large empty posts, by responding to that accusation with an even bigger wallpost going over his own past posts to make a point. Reads more as towny defiance/snark.
I see that now Shinichi...
Time to reread and make sure all these town leans I have are legitimate.
What makes u think me and kpaca are scum together?
As it stands, there is nothing ruling out you two being on the mafia team together. There's a small link re: kpaca townreading you for reasons that are nonexistent or flimsy.
Unvote
Will try to form a productive wagon after modern tonight.
Even after these last two posts? Please explain why you believe the following two posts come from town:
Second I really like his QH read.
Third and weaker I like his tale on RE. It looks super sketchy, but it rings true to me. If either of them were to flip scum it would make me look at the other but RE is raising valid points without really driving anything which doesn't scream scummy. In short I like his town reads.
What's your problem with those posts?
"I think Shinichi is town but it's soft read so I dunno lol."
UNVTOTE, VOTE: RE1031
Grapefruit admitted that he always scum reads Shinichi. I'm saying that Shinichi is not often town read. Shinichi can probably confirm that I in the past have scum read him and lynched him as town while at it. I've seen plenty of people struggle to read Shinichi. So I am suspicious of what led kpaca to say that Shinichi was a town read, even if it was soft.
What you're saying right now about how you feel about Shinichi is he's neutral. Someone who does nothing outwardly scummy nor outwardly townie (I'm assuming here) is neutral.
And I honestly haven't been keeping track of votes, I thought at least one person removed their votes from kpaca.
Yeah, that's actually how I felt about it too, but I wanted to do something slightly productive. So I thought it was a little weird that you voted right after me. So this may be an early town tell from you, taking back your vote. Maybe...
I don't think they're close concepts at all.
This speaks to me:
Like his early posts did not feel like I have started expecting from him, but as soon as I called him out, he turned into a troll again.
What I'm hoping is that I'll be able to read him without the back and forth fight that would come from continuing to push him, because I have a feeling that he'll self resolve.
~~~
Why are you reading Wheat as town? Does he always push you?
@Wheat: Walk me through your thoughts on Vaimes, I have no idea what you're seeing. What do you mean by the bolded?
Though the way he's handling me also means that trying to interact with him will suck the fun out of the game for me. It gives off a very "you're scum so I don't care about anything you have to say," vibe, which I don't feel like subjecting myself to. So I'll interact with other people and he'll see I'm town sooner or later.
So why are you town reading him?
We had roughly 7 people actively posting in the beginning. My hypothesis is, that there is some number of scum in:
Grapefruit21
kpaca
Quickhoodies
Shinichi
Vaimes
Wheat_Grinder
So with that in mind, I had two or three scenarios:
1) Grape and Vaimes are a team, and are powerwolfing like crazy. They still could be, but based on Grape's reaction, or lack of one, when I went after Vaimes. I'm at least comfortable they aren't aligned.
2) Kpaca and WG were both behaving in a similar way. One-liners, and not much input, while keeping post count up. The difference there, was that I didn't see kpaca's agenda. Like, he's abrasive, and it's generally unhelpful. But that doesn't advance any scum worldview, he's not probing for mislynches, or discrediting anyone, even his "townread" was loose. WG was more troublesome, since he did comment on specific people, and kinda piled on to the Vaimes wagon. I disagree with Vaime that Kpaca was the scum on his wagon, and I think it might be WG. Assuming we see Vaimes flip town at some point.
3) Shinichi and QH seemed like they could be aligned, just the way they are interacting. But that also just seems like it could be that they know one another, and were more comfortable interacting with each other. If Shinichi is indeed scum here, that would seem to vindicate Vaimes.
I think I'm most convinced with a town grape world. Which would lead me down a path where Vaimes is probably town, and suspicion falls to WG/Kpaca, Sinichi/QH worlds.
I hated AGs entrance, and when contrasted with Terry's, I can't help feel Terry is town and AG just looked forced into making reads the second he came in. Shadow is null, RE I need to reread a bit.
I think I'd like to Vote AG. I'd like to see something other than consensus reads out of you.
It's a limited meta read. WG is sort of short/curt with his responses, doesn't elaborate on things without prodding, makes definitive but empty statements. Things I'm at least somewhat used to coming from him as town. Plus the scumread of me is something I can understand, even though it's wrong.
There's room for this read to improve. No interest in lynching right now, at any rate.
My only vote prior was an RVS vote. I was not confident in my vote on you (I stated in the same post that I basically got nothing from rereading), but I wanted to start somewhere.
Sell me on what you're seeing re: JoeTerry?
I think I'm most convinced with a town grape world. Which would lead me down a path where Vaimes is probably town, and suspicion falls to WG/Kpaca, Sinichi/QH worlds.
Why are you voting for AG instead of exploring these worlds?
Well I mean if me and him are your only scum reads it makes sense to assume you think we're mafia together lol.
Idk if its flimsy at all, it doesn't have any backup that's all
Actually alot of people have been town reading me and only a few actually provided reason. If you think i'm scum why are you only question His read on me and not the others that have seen me as town?
At the time of his vote yes i do believe they're all soft, no way to accuratly catch scum that early unless your psychic.
2. He asked me to explain why it was flimsy.
3. Those posts were directed at kpaca.
If you think someone else is scum, please move your vote over to them and explain why you think they're mafia.
If you don't want to move your vote, please explain why.
The point was, that when I told you I didn't find anything scummy about Shinichi, it could easily have been taken as "I think Shin is town". The reason I made that point, which I guess wasn't too clear now that I go back and read it was that REI, voted Kpaca on a pretty flimsy reason that he shouldn't have town-read shinichi that early. There were votes at the time on Kpaca and it reads to me as REI choosing to push Kpaca over, someone like me. I got some pretty early town-cred (for very little reasoning IMO), so a push on me wouldn't have been received too well at the time so REI chose to push Kpaca, which could be a easier lynch.
I don't think it's flimsy. It's based on what RE knows about Shinichi as a player -- that people in general (but more specifically, people who know him) tend not to townread him early. So RE thinks it's weird that kpaca gave a townread on Shinichi.
I'm confused as to why you're making this a "pushing you vs. pushing kpaca" thing.
Well, I don't think you posted enough to be read at all, scum or town. A push on you as scum wouldn't have made sense even if you weren't being town read. (At the time.)
And it wasn't just that he town read Shinichi early, he didn't offer reasoning behind it. Like I said, it felt like an attempt to pocket Shinichi, especially since Shinichi was getting heat at the time. I'm not pushing anything at this point, or at least anything that I see lasting until the end of the 2 weeks. I could claim that there's nothing to go on, and post nothing until I find something that's not just "flimsy," or I could go and put content in the thread.
UNVOTE