Osi shot ISO, ISO shot Megidoo, so according to my scum shoot early at scum theory, all three were suspect
How does the fact that two of them have now flipped town affect your read on Iso?
That's a good question. Obviously my theory was wrong, but I still think the shot was reckless and ended up at town. I still like my theory and it could apply to any fresh start of the day, but I've been wrong once before. I would really like to see us play this more like a mafia game and not a shoot fest. We can figure people out by their actions and posts. Will someone shoot DV? I'd like to but I promised not to shoot unless shot at.
Just to clarify, I'm asking if people are willing to shoot DV, but would like to discuss it a bit first and come to a consensus. What do you think DoT? DV should be shot or not?
Only the mod has more posts than you (but this is tom we're talking about ;-) ), but there's not a lot of content in them. Even though you're the one who's been saying we should treat this as a regular game of Mafia you don't seem to be doing a lot to solve the game. Then there's the following(granted I could be and probably am horribly off about this):
Osi shot ISO, ISO shot Megidoo, so according to my scum shoot early at scum theory, all three were suspect
How does the fact that two of them have now flipped town affect your read on Iso?
That's a good question. Obviously my theory was wrong, but I still think the shot was reckless and ended up at town. I still like my theory and it could apply to any fresh start of the day, but I've been wrong once before. I would really like to see us play this more like a mafia game and not a shoot fest. We can figure people out by their actions and posts. Will someone shoot DV? I'd like to but I promised not to shoot unless shot at.
The bolded seems unnecessary, like you're trying to subtly buddy me. Also, if you believe D_V should be shot then you wouldn't be worried about some random "promise" that was made that could affect the game state. If you're town who honestly believes D_V should be the next kill them do something about it. Pull the trigger yourself and work to convince the rest of us to do the same.
Just to clarify, I'm asking if people are willing to shoot DV, but would like to discuss it a bit first and come to a consensus. What do you think DoT? DV should be shot or not?
A loaded question. If I say yes I'm obligated to fire at him. If I say no I have to defend my reasoning and you turn your town read of me into a scum read for "defending obvscum!D_V.
So did I, and let's be honest my reasons as explained when Bur asked were shaky, yet you never even blinked an eye on my direction for it.
--------------------
I see this playing out in one of three ways:
Scenario 1: Shot hits scum Terry. Bur is then next on my list for their early interaction and his current push at D_V. If it's not Bur then D_V. I can't see Iso being scum in this scenario.
Scenario 2: Shot hits town Terry. Iso/D_V is the most likely pairing then. Their willingness to both shoot at Meg stands out here, and I almost talked myself out of shooting Terry because of it. Where Bur is a slower, more analytical player, Meg often tends to be a wild card. He would be the most likely to just randomly fire into one of those two and is probably most likely to pick up on them being scum. Both of them firing at Meg the way they did stands out as a massive warning sign but I've blinded myself before into tunneling because of random theories.
Scenario 3: Shot misses. In this case Terry, if you're town you consider my read listed here on the Iso/D_V pairing and we take them on. If you're scum you'll probably do the same, or try and twist your read of me around so you can "retaliate" as you said you would. I'd be interested in seeing your reasoning in that situation since anyone firing at their top townread because "I said I would shoot back" is not interested in solving and winning this game.
Gosh Darnit DoT. I really don't want to shoot you. Why did you do this to me? You put me in a spot of breaking my promise or shooting a town read. Wish you would have talked to me first about your issues with me. I have more content in my post then most of the people in this thread combined, what are you smoking?
It was a good question and made me consider my theory in light of the recent flips. How is that scummy?
I was trying to generate discussion instead of just shooting at people. Sorry for trying to be reasonable in a game format that clearly is not tailored for that. Along those lines, I was actually wondering what's going to happen when there are just a couple of people left. It seems like it will just degenerate into a Wild West shoot off and the final result will be based purely on luck and not skill.
It's funny you think I'm buddying you for admitting you had a good question and not for announcing that I thought it was obvious you are town.
My response to DV was specific to him saying I was tunneling on him again. Which was his response to me for questioning his motives on the Megidoo shot.
Like none of your reasons for calling me scum make sense. I'm super confused. If I decide to break my promise I would have rather just shot DV, I thought that was clear. I was actually hoping he'd take a shot at me, but now you screwed that all up.
I'm going to wait and see if I'm dead before I decide on which path to take.
Iso tried (Megiddo), I got it right (Osieorb). Pointed it out above.
If you're around for a bit, I'd like your thoughts on Terry/Iso, Terry/Bur and why you're tinfoiling me as possible scum?
So I'm tin foiling you because of his interactions with you. He expressed suspicion me because I killed a towny but ignored you. You shooting him as the first shot of the day should miss and its a pretty good way to distance.
Iso did something similar with targeting Megs as well before he even posted. I find it strange that once again he ignored this.
Finally Bur / him have zero interaction. I actually think its Bur now but will wait for Bur to post. Terry just hardcore ignored two other people he could have thrown shade on which makes me think they are both town and he knew it, and didn't want three townies annoyed with him. So that really leaves Bur left as the something else.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
If it's not DV, it's DoT. I feel pretty confident hedging this game on But being town and even if he isn't I can easily pull the trigger faster than he can.
DV, DoT, do me a favor and shoot each other. If either of you aim at bur, I will assume you are scum and annihilate you with extreme prejudice.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
If it's not DV, it's DoT. I feel pretty confident hedging this game on But being town and even if he isn't I can easily pull the trigger faster than he can.
DV, DoT, do me a favor and shoot each other. If either of you aim at bur, I will assume you are scum and annihilate you with extreme prejudice.
1) Why would scum!DoTA try to shoot at his other mate especially when there's no one really pushing SJT?
2) What makes you confident about me being town?
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Also modgaming Bur setups is kind of treading down a dark path
Well SJT was going down as soon as I hit the thread so it's probable that he wanted the town credit for the shot before SJT further implicated the team.
I feel like your early questions are townBur trying to solve the game rather than scumBur awkwardly trying to tread water. And I feel more confident that DV or DoT are scum than you anyway.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I need to know where you guys stand on each other and on me. Shooting now and hitting town removes any chance of this being solved normally and turns it into who gets lucky first. My thoughts as follows:
Bur: Terry engaged with most people, especially those who engaged with him, except for you. There was one post where he made fun of your uncertainty on his theory and one mention of you when he asked D_V if you're scum?D_V's buddy. Considering how hard he worked on creating links with almost everyone else, including Iso. His first post listed three people as suspicious (Osieorb/Iso/Meg) and I know it isn't uncommon for scum to lump a buddy into a suspect list for town cred). I noticed this after I shot Terry and started doubting my town read of Iso, but that's now been resolved at least. You're top of my list mainly because of that.
D_V: I'm still uncertain as to what Terry was trying to accomplish with his push on you, was he trying to get a buddy shot for town cred or distancing himself from being the one who pulls the trigger on town? Iso obviously had some reason to think you were the last remaining Mafia and I wish he'd given a bit more info than "because D_V". Your shot at Meg still pings me as well for being odd.
I'll check back in about 2-3 hours if anyone has any questions for me.
So, here's where I am currently.
I haven't reread the game (yet), but I should since I can't really recall Terry's interactions.
I've been thinking about this game for a while and actually wanted to ask D_V at the beginning of the day (after #90) what are his current read / what does he think about DoTA. Had he answered something like "I'm townreading DoTA / scumreading Bur", I would've been hounding for his blood, but since his #96 implies otherwise, I need to re-evaluate.
(In before "why": Since his #90 wouldn't have made sense had he had a strong read on either of us. He was confident about DoTA/me, he would've shot me and not be "I probably don't shoot anyone anymore". But, since his #96 "I flipped a coin" is in line with this, I'm dropping the issue.)
I need to re-read this game (luckily it's only 2 pages).
Anyways, few things:
@DV: Why are you not townreading DoTA for shooting Terry? Do you think it might've been a turbobus?
@DoTA: Why are do you care what we think of you? I would've expected more "look, I shot a scum! Now I'm confirmed town" -attitude from you than this current one...
I'll be around for maybe an hour or so before I head back to bed...
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Also modgaming Bur setups is kind of treading down a dark path
The reason I asked for your (and D_V's) thoughts on each other AND myself is to figure out where everyone stands at this moment. Is there a reason I might be considered to be the last scum? Is it something I can engage with you about or is it scum trying to push a bad case on me. And if so, maybe the other townie sees it as well. There's still a safety net in that, if town eats a bullet we still get one more try to win this but it becomes about luck, who gets their shot through first. If both town members are correctly firing at the last remaining scum we have a much better chance of winning this.
As I mentioned previously, I have my reasons for suspecting both of you and I need more to work with so we can figure this out.
And why would I claim that shooting Terry confirms me as town? I shot scum therefore I can't be scum is a terrible play that gets people thinking the exact opposite...
Idk, it just felt weird to me. Like, when in Revolution Mafia town!KJ shot scum!Huntzilla, his attitude was more of an "I told you so, you should listen to me more". Your attitude felt weird compared to that (and many other similar cases).
Anyways, the biggest factor in my town read on you is how you handled Terry's wagon: I don't recall there was really any pressure on Terry at that point when you came with your case on him and then just shot him on the spot. I mean, when you just a single townie death away from reaching a tie with town members, why suddenly turbobus your buddy?
(I know I need to reread and re-evaluate, which might happen later today, depending on how much time writing my essay takes today.)
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Also modgaming Bur setups is kind of treading down a dark path
Felt super fence sitting.
More recent posts have been more direct.
Nice nice.
Iso
Bur/D_V
StinkyJoeTerry
Shoot: TheRealStinkyJoeTerry
Only the mod has more posts than you (but this is tom we're talking about ;-) ), but there's not a lot of content in them. Even though you're the one who's been saying we should treat this as a regular game of Mafia you don't seem to be doing a lot to solve the game. Then there's the following(granted I could be and probably am horribly off about this):
The bolded seems unnecessary, like you're trying to subtly buddy me. Also, if you believe D_V should be shot then you wouldn't be worried about some random "promise" that was made that could affect the game state. If you're town who honestly believes D_V should be the next kill them do something about it. Pull the trigger yourself and work to convince the rest of us to do the same.
A loaded question. If I say yes I'm obligated to fire at him. If I say no I have to defend my reasoning and you turn your town read of me into a scum read for "defending obvscum!D_V.
So did I, and let's be honest my reasons as explained when Bur asked were shaky, yet you never even blinked an eye on my direction for it.
--------------------
I see this playing out in one of three ways:
Scenario 1: Shot hits scum Terry. Bur is then next on my list for their early interaction and his current push at D_V. If it's not Bur then D_V. I can't see Iso being scum in this scenario.
Scenario 2: Shot hits town Terry. Iso/D_V is the most likely pairing then. Their willingness to both shoot at Meg stands out here, and I almost talked myself out of shooting Terry because of it. Where Bur is a slower, more analytical player, Meg often tends to be a wild card. He would be the most likely to just randomly fire into one of those two and is probably most likely to pick up on them being scum. Both of them firing at Meg the way they did stands out as a massive warning sign but I've blinded myself before into tunneling because of random theories.
Scenario 3: Shot misses. In this case Terry, if you're town you consider my read listed here on the Iso/D_V pairing and we take them on. If you're scum you'll probably do the same, or try and twist your read of me around so you can "retaliate" as you said you would. I'd be interested in seeing your reasoning in that situation since anyone firing at their top townread because "I said I would shoot back" is not interested in solving and winning this game.
I'll take a proper look at this game tomorrow, when it's not 0.30 AM and I don't have lessons to attend to at 8 AM.
It was a good question and made me consider my theory in light of the recent flips. How is that scummy?
I was trying to generate discussion instead of just shooting at people. Sorry for trying to be reasonable in a game format that clearly is not tailored for that. Along those lines, I was actually wondering what's going to happen when there are just a couple of people left. It seems like it will just degenerate into a Wild West shoot off and the final result will be based purely on luck and not skill.
It's funny you think I'm buddying you for admitting you had a good question and not for announcing that I thought it was obvious you are town.
My response to DV was specific to him saying I was tunneling on him again. Which was his response to me for questioning his motives on the Megidoo shot.
Like none of your reasons for calling me scum make sense. I'm super confused. If I decide to break my promise I would have rather just shot DV, I thought that was clear. I was actually hoping he'd take a shot at me, but now you screwed that all up.
I'm going to wait and see if I'm dead before I decide on which path to take.
(I joined spectator chat, comodding shots.)
That wasn't an override, it was him posting at the exact same time. Also, the first two shots were co-modded as well. Anyways...
It is now Day 4. You may post/shoot
So did Iso?
But its probabally Bur or Iso.
Well played Terry, had me second guessing myself all the way till the flip.
If you're around for a bit, I'd like your thoughts on Terry/Iso, Terry/Bur and why you're tinfoiling me as possible scum?
So I'm tin foiling you because of his interactions with you. He expressed suspicion me because I killed a towny but ignored you. You shooting him as the first shot of the day should miss and its a pretty good way to distance.
Iso did something similar with targeting Megs as well before he even posted. I find it strange that once again he ignored this.
Finally Bur / him have zero interaction. I actually think its Bur now but will wait for Bur to post. Terry just hardcore ignored two other people he could have thrown shade on which makes me think they are both town and he knew it, and didn't want three townies annoyed with him. So that really leaves Bur left as the something else.
Shoot: DV
You're welcome.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
OP updated.
Carry on
thank you
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Oh wtf is this?
If it's not DV, it's DoT. I feel pretty confident hedging this game on But being town and even if he isn't I can easily pull the trigger faster than he can.
DV, DoT, do me a favor and shoot each other. If either of you aim at bur, I will assume you are scum and annihilate you with extreme prejudice.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
1) Why would scum!DoTA try to shoot at his other mate especially when there's no one really pushing SJT?
2) What makes you confident about me being town?
I feel like your early questions are townBur trying to solve the game rather than scumBur awkwardly trying to tread water. And I feel more confident that DV or DoT are scum than you anyway.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
He even took my tinfoil to try and get me to shoot Dota over him.
Dear lord.
Shoot: Iso
It is now Day 5. You may post/shoot.
I need to know where you guys stand on each other and on me. Shooting now and hitting town removes any chance of this being solved normally and turns it into who gets lucky first. My thoughts as follows:
Bur: Terry engaged with most people, especially those who engaged with him, except for you. There was one post where he made fun of your uncertainty on his theory and one mention of you when he asked D_V if you're scum?D_V's buddy. Considering how hard he worked on creating links with almost everyone else, including Iso. His first post listed three people as suspicious (Osieorb/Iso/Meg) and I know it isn't uncommon for scum to lump a buddy into a suspect list for town cred). I noticed this after I shot Terry and started doubting my town read of Iso, but that's now been resolved at least. You're top of my list mainly because of that.
D_V: I'm still uncertain as to what Terry was trying to accomplish with his push on you, was he trying to get a buddy shot for town cred or distancing himself from being the one who pulls the trigger on town? Iso obviously had some reason to think you were the last remaining Mafia and I wish he'd given a bit more info than "because D_V". Your shot at Meg still pings me as well for being odd.
I'll check back in about 2-3 hours if anyone has any questions for me.
If you have questions DoTA, ask them and I'll answer them tomorrow.
I'm 0/2
OOG: Good luck with the fever, I got pretty sick a few weeks back and was also out of commission for a day or two. Far from fun.
What are your thoughts on Bur and myself right now? What do you think about my points regarding Bur and yourself?
I think your points are reasoned.
I've got a thought but I'm waiting on Bur to post before I comment more right now.
I think Terry had to eventually start shooting someone.
I'm almost at a point where I just flip a coin. Do I go with my gut or blindly trust Iso...
Also its the play I want to make.
Shoot Bur
I haven't reread the game (yet), but I should since I can't really recall Terry's interactions.
I've been thinking about this game for a while and actually wanted to ask D_V at the beginning of the day (after #90) what are his current read / what does he think about DoTA. Had he answered something like "I'm townreading DoTA / scumreading Bur", I would've been hounding for his blood, but since his #96 implies otherwise, I need to re-evaluate.
(In before "why": Since his #90 wouldn't have made sense had he had a strong read on either of us. He was confident about DoTA/me, he would've shot me and not be "I probably don't shoot anyone anymore". But, since his #96 "I flipped a coin" is in line with this, I'm dropping the issue.)
I need to re-read this game (luckily it's only 2 pages).
Anyways, few things:
@DV: Why are you not townreading DoTA for shooting Terry? Do you think it might've been a turbobus?
@DoTA: Why are do you care what we think of you? I would've expected more "look, I shot a scum! Now I'm confirmed town" -attitude from you than this current one...
I'll be around for maybe an hour or so before I head back to bed...
As I mentioned previously, I have my reasons for suspecting both of you and I need more to work with so we can figure this out.
And why would I claim that shooting Terry confirms me as town? I shot scum therefore I can't be scum is a terrible play that gets people thinking the exact opposite...
Anyways, the biggest factor in my town read on you is how you handled Terry's wagon: I don't recall there was really any pressure on Terry at that point when you came with your case on him and then just shot him on the spot. I mean, when you just a single townie death away from reaching a tie with town members, why suddenly turbobus your buddy?
(I know I need to reread and re-evaluate, which might happen later today, depending on how much time writing my essay takes today.)