The guys complaining about the powerlevel of the block......
Would you rather have a standard with infinite combos and turn 4 ulamogs?
No, but a couple of low-powered sets doesn't fix that. Instead you just get a few sets that contribute little-to-nothing to standard for their entire time in rotation, since the pendulum will eventually swing back to higher-power.
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My decks
Standard - RIP Cat
Modern - Death & Taxes
Commander - Mazirek, Trostani, Angry Omnath
As soon as I saw that your post was content-free and confuses difference of opinions with passive-aggressiveness, I took no real offense.
My list is a mixed of standard-playables, modern-playables and intriguing cards for casual. I'm mentioning this for others who might have an actual conversation to hold.
PS: did Wizards clarify if imminent doom damage is the # of doom counters or the CMC of the spell?
Blah blah blah. The format is going to switch to BG Energy and UR Control for the next few months due to the power level of Kaladesh block. Go look at almost every thread and I comment on spoiled cards. The obvious powerful cards are great but Overwhelming Splendor? I'm making Sen Triplets because of that card, but that isn't fun. This overall low-powered set doesn't help the power creep presented in just the previous block. Does that help you?
Despite the overall criticism, I see some interesting cards I was not expecting to be in the set.
Perhaps the biggest thing I want to bring up is how many different cards between both sets in the block feature Archfiend of Ifnir getting messed up. I feel bad for the poor guy!
I think the arts just show normal demons from Ifnir rather than archfiends
Wall of Forgotten Pharaohs is neat because it acknowledges there were actual, traditional human pharaohs on Amonkhet before Bolas took over. Man I wish we had seen THAT Egypt before this.
Set is cool and all but I only want Nimble Obstructionist, Solemnity and Mirage Mirror.
As usual, only a few goodies in the last day. Riddleform is no Delver, but might be strong enough to see some serious play nevertheless. Unsummon makes a welcome return to wreck tokens and counters; surprising to see it at common since it's going to really ruin some Eternals days in limited. Although if you are in Esper I think the added Flexibility of Consign is better (talking about some sort of Uxy tempo Flash deck in standard, and Esper seems most likely since it gets to use Fatal Push, Archangel Avacyn, Spell Queller, and Nimble Obstructionist). Counterveiling Winds is no Circular Logic but since Logic isn't legal in Modern or Standard, it could also seem some play. Firebrand Archer is a more aggressive Thermo-alchemist and that card has seen some play in standard (it's also some redundancy with Guttersnipe and Young Pyromancer in Modern but probably too bad). My pick for real sleeper would probably be Obelisk Spider as it seems to stop a lot of things on the ground while having good interaction with lots of near-playable Standard cards.
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Sufferer of EDHD
Commander - Currently Playing: RCRDaretti: Superfriends Forever RCR WGBDoran: Ent-mootWBG GGGMultani: Group Bear HugGGG GB(B/G)The Gitrog Monster: Dredgefall DurdleGB(B/G) RGWGahiji, the Honored Group Hug MonsterRGW UB(U/B)Yuriko, Ninja Trinket AggroUB(U/B) WUBRGAtogatog: Assembling a OHKOWUBRG
Despite the overall criticism, I see some interesting cards I was not expecting to be in the set.
Perhaps the biggest thing I want to bring up is how many different cards between both sets in the block feature Archfiend of Ifnir getting messed up. I feel bad for the poor guy!
I think the arts just show normal demons from Ifnir rather than archfiends
Haha okay well then even so, demons are actually quite targeted it seems on this plane.
Would you rather have a standard with infinite combos and turn 4 ulamogs?
I'm all for the prevention of power creep, but even if you decide to do a lower-powered set, it still has to add something new and interesting somehow.
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Perhaps the biggest thing I want to bring up is how many different cards between both sets in the block feature Archfiend of Ifnir getting messed up. I feel bad for the poor guy!
I always find it neat when a visual motiv is repeated like that. There seem to be multiple Archfiend-like demons though, so it's most likely not the same guy getting killed over and over again.
BUT THE FLAVOR TEXT ON HALF OF THESE CARDS ARE AWFUL.
"Liliana always knew that Jace's illusions would come in handy." I honest to god threw up in my mouth.
"Bolas remade this plane in his image. He has the advantage here. We must approach carefully." Thanks captain obvious.
"I was promised an afterlife, not this. Samut was right. The God-Pharaoh lied." Did you need the second half? Honestly, the first sentence would have had a nice ambiance to it. It would have been short and sweet. But no... this set has some real trash flavor text. Why Wizards? Why?! This has been trending since at LEAST Dragons of Tarkir.
Yeah, I kind of agree with you here. Do think it's the pseudo name-dropping that gets to you? That seems like at least half of it.
Once again, it's not about us wanting a powerful set. Like others stated before, we just want a set with some interesting interactions in it with like maybe a dozen playable cards in standard that open up new archetypes. They half-assed this set under Bolas's name and undermined this entire block. There is and was so much unexplored design space using the desert lands (Urborg land making all lands deserts opens up its own deck right there), eternalize (Adorned Pouncer is the best costed creature with eternalize) and more peculiar zombies (Who is playing Zombies in September? Not I because there's not adequate support). There's even people and lords missing (where is Hapatra? where is our Jackal lord?).
We scream for diversity but at the end of the day, this is not how we're going to get it.
Original Innistrad block was my idea of a good Standard. I also enjoyed Theros block before Khans. Mostly because monochrome decks are fun and I loved Devotion. But really, Innistrad was amazing, and say what you will about AVR but that was the best sealed environment I have ever played in (BFZ was the worst).
BUT THE FLAVOR TEXT ON HALF OF THESE CARDS ARE AWFUL.
"Liliana always knew that Jace's illusions would come in handy." I honest to god threw up in my mouth.
"Bolas remade this plane in his image. He has the advantage here. We must approach carefully." Thanks captain obvious.
"I was promised an afterlife, not this. Samut was right. The God-Pharaoh lied." Did you need the second half? Honestly, the first sentence would have had a nice ambiance to it. It would have been short and sweet. But no... this set has some real trash flavor text. Why Wizards? Why?! This has been trending since at LEAST Dragons of Tarkir.
Yeah, I kind of agree with you here. Do think it's the pseudo name-dropping that gets to you? That seems like at least half of it.
I believe the awkward flavor text is a consequence of the decision (made after Theros, so the Khans block actually would be where it started) to explicitly explain the story-line through the cards so that even people who don't read the stories on the website can follow every aspect of the plot. Thus, flavor text now frequently over-explains things.
As for the set itself, I believe it's better than most first impressions. Although the power level is lower than previous sets(not necessarily a bad thing), the removal is actually decent. (Can you believe Unsummon hasn't been printed in a standard set since M13?) Right now, I'm taking it as a hopeful sign that future sets will also have a better suite of removal.
Kinda hate how the Scorpion God is RB when almost all of the awesome -1/-1 counter card support is in GB. Want to build an EDH deck around it but when you have cards like the newly spoiled Obelisk Spider and old goodies like Quillspike in G, it just doesn't feel worth it. Would have been awesome if he were RGB.
I also wish The Scorpion God could fit in BG, as I already have a Hapatra deck. I'll still find a way to play him though. If you haven't tried Hapatra yet, I highly recommend her.
Kinda hate how the Scorpion God is RB when almost all of the awesome -1/-1 counter card support is in GB. Want to build an EDH deck around it but when you have cards like the newly spoiled Obelisk Spider and old goodies like Quillspike in G, it just doesn't feel worth it. Would have been awesome if he were RGB.
I also wish The Scorpion God could fit in BG, as I already have a Hapatra deck. I'll still find a way to play him though. If you haven't tried Hapatra yet, I highly recommend her.
That land could see play in pox, and there are a few other interesting cards. However on the whole the set just feels very meh, I'm not really excited for this set at all.
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Standard
none
Modern UBG B/U/G control BBB MBC WUR Control WWW Prison RRR Goblins
Legacy BBB Pox UBG B/U/G Control UWU StoneBlade UW Miracle Control
BUT THE FLAVOR TEXT ON HALF OF THESE CARDS ARE AWFUL.
"Liliana always knew that Jace's illusions would come in handy." I honest to god threw up in my mouth.
"Bolas remade this plane in his image. He has the advantage here. We must approach carefully." Thanks captain obvious.
"I was promised an afterlife, not this. Samut was right. The God-Pharaoh lied." Did you need the second half? Honestly, the first sentence would have had a nice ambiance to it. It would have been short and sweet. But no... this set has some real trash flavor text. Why Wizards? Why?! This has been trending since at LEAST Dragons of Tarkir.
What's sad is that most of the awful flavor text could be good, or at least decent, with just a little alteration. As you mentioned, Djeru’s Renunciation really needs to drop the third sentence, possibly the second as well. Hour of Eternity and Imaginary Threats could work if they were reworded to be quotes from characters, instead of the bland statements of exposition that they are. It's like the creative department accidentally submitted their first drafts for these flavor texts, instead of the final versions.
Once again, it's not about us wanting a powerful set. Like others stated before, we just want a set with some interesting interactions in it with like maybe a dozen playable cards in standard that open up new archetypes. They half-assed this set under Bolas's name and undermined this entire block. There is and was so much unexplored design space using the desert lands (Urborg land making all lands deserts opens up its own deck right there), eternalize (Adorned Pouncer is the best costed creature with eternalize) and more peculiar zombies (Who is playing Zombies in September? Not I because there's not adequate support). There's even people and lords missing (where is Hapatra? where is our Jackal lord?).
We scream for diversity but at the end of the day, this is not how we're going to get it.
Uuuummm...Hapatra, Vizier of Poisons was in Amonkhet? She was a total beating in limited and is a fun, popular new Commander?
I am sure given the prominence of "Voodoo Zombies" and "Cursed Pirates" in Pirate lore that we will get plenty more zombie support next block.
I agree the set is underwhelming, especially Eternalize (feels like they played it WAY too safe with that and Embalm, and only one card that is playable outside of limited with each), just offering some corrections.
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Sufferer of EDHD
Commander - Currently Playing: RCRDaretti: Superfriends Forever RCR WGBDoran: Ent-mootWBG GGGMultani: Group Bear HugGGG GB(B/G)The Gitrog Monster: Dredgefall DurdleGB(B/G) RGWGahiji, the Honored Group Hug MonsterRGW UB(U/B)Yuriko, Ninja Trinket AggroUB(U/B) WUBRGAtogatog: Assembling a OHKOWUBRG
The guys complaining about the powerlevel of the block......
Would you rather have a standard with infinite combos and turn 4 ulamogs?
In a word? Yes.
I dunno why the only options are the far ends of the proverbial spectrum tho. Just because people aren't excited to play with underwhelming cards, that doesn't mean that they want want a format where turn 4 is the 'late game.' Likewise, I'm not sure that folks wanting to move away from a power-crested format cherish the thought of playing 1 spell a turn till turn 7 or so.
I'm not going to bash the set. It simply is what it is. I do, however, think its a bit disingenuous to defend one viewpoint by offering a far extreme as the only other possible alternative.
MTGS Wikia Article about "New World Order"
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
PSA to everyone who keeps forgetting about the Reserved List:
You're on a website dedicated to talking about MtG. You're only a few keystrokes away from finding out what cards are on the Reserved List. You're also only a few keystrokes away from finding out why some cards on the Reserved List got foil printings in FtV, as Judge promos, or whatnot, as well as why that won't happen again. Stop doing this.
This plane is full of sadness. Well, also deserts, but largely sadness. Is this what it felt like when people got Born of the Gods or is this actually worse than even Born of the Gods?
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1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Fast Red aggro is getting some more juice, which I like. It's getting a possible new top-end threat in Magmaroth, a couple of combat tricks, and some first strike creatures. Fast Red aggro was already pretty decent, and I think this set makes it better.
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Standard - RIP Cat
Modern - Death & Taxes
Commander - Mazirek, Trostani, Angry Omnath
Blah blah blah. The format is going to switch to BG Energy and UR Control for the next few months due to the power level of Kaladesh block. Go look at almost every thread and I comment on spoiled cards. The obvious powerful cards are great but Overwhelming Splendor? I'm making Sen Triplets because of that card, but that isn't fun. This overall low-powered set doesn't help the power creep presented in just the previous block. Does that help you?
All this set did was cement two already good strategies into being the forerunners of the next set. I'm trying BG -1/-1 counters for FNM: http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/standard-type-2/deck-creation-standard/779163-gb-negative-counters-hou#c1.
Just adding more discussion. Anyone else think this set counterbalances anything?
I think the arts just show normal demons from Ifnir rather than archfiends
Set is cool and all but I only want Nimble Obstructionist, Solemnity and Mirage Mirror.
|| UW Jace, Vyn's Prodigy UW || UG Kenessos, Priest of Thassa (feat. Arixmethes) UG ||
Cards I still want to see created:
|| Olantin, Lost City || Pavios and Thanasis || Choryu ||
RCRDaretti: Superfriends Forever RCR
WGBDoran: Ent-mootWBG
GGGMultani: Group Bear HugGGG
GB(B/G)The Gitrog Monster: Dredgefall DurdleGB(B/G)
RGWGahiji, the Honored Group Hug MonsterRGW
UB(U/B)Yuriko, Ninja Trinket AggroUB(U/B)
WUBRGAtogatog: Assembling a OHKOWUBRG
Haha okay well then even so, demons are actually quite targeted it seems on this plane.
Dunes of Zairo
SHANDALAR
Innistrad - The Darkest Night
~THE RAVNICAN CONSORTIUM~
A Community Set
Commander: Allies & Adversaries
I always find it neat when a visual motiv is repeated like that. There seem to be multiple Archfiend-like demons though, so it's most likely not the same guy getting killed over and over again.
Yeah, I kind of agree with you here. Do think it's the pseudo name-dropping that gets to you? That seems like at least half of it.
Yes?
Spirits
We scream for diversity but at the end of the day, this is not how we're going to get it.
|| UW Jace, Vyn's Prodigy UW || UG Kenessos, Priest of Thassa (feat. Arixmethes) UG ||
Cards I still want to see created:
|| Olantin, Lost City || Pavios and Thanasis || Choryu ||
this has been the best set in std since kaladesh( and those sets that preceded kaladesh didnt help matters much)
guess haters gotta hate
I believe the awkward flavor text is a consequence of the decision (made after Theros, so the Khans block actually would be where it started) to explicitly explain the story-line through the cards so that even people who don't read the stories on the website can follow every aspect of the plot. Thus, flavor text now frequently over-explains things.
As for the set itself, I believe it's better than most first impressions. Although the power level is lower than previous sets(not necessarily a bad thing), the removal is actually decent. (Can you believe Unsummon hasn't been printed in a standard set since M13?) Right now, I'm taking it as a hopeful sign that future sets will also have a better suite of removal.
2023 Average Peasant Cube|and Discussion
Because I have more decks than fit in a signature
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This is an EDH set.
none
Modern
UBG B/U/G control
BBB MBC
WUR Control
WWW Prison
RRR Goblins
Legacy
BBB Pox
UBG B/U/G Control
UWU StoneBlade
UW Miracle Control
What's sad is that most of the awful flavor text could be good, or at least decent, with just a little alteration. As you mentioned, Djeru’s Renunciation really needs to drop the third sentence, possibly the second as well. Hour of Eternity and Imaginary Threats could work if they were reworded to be quotes from characters, instead of the bland statements of exposition that they are. It's like the creative department accidentally submitted their first drafts for these flavor texts, instead of the final versions.
Uuuummm...Hapatra, Vizier of Poisons was in Amonkhet? She was a total beating in limited and is a fun, popular new Commander?
I am sure given the prominence of "Voodoo Zombies" and "Cursed Pirates" in Pirate lore that we will get plenty more zombie support next block.
I agree the set is underwhelming, especially Eternalize (feels like they played it WAY too safe with that and Embalm, and only one card that is playable outside of limited with each), just offering some corrections.
RCRDaretti: Superfriends Forever RCR
WGBDoran: Ent-mootWBG
GGGMultani: Group Bear HugGGG
GB(B/G)The Gitrog Monster: Dredgefall DurdleGB(B/G)
RGWGahiji, the Honored Group Hug MonsterRGW
UB(U/B)Yuriko, Ninja Trinket AggroUB(U/B)
WUBRGAtogatog: Assembling a OHKOWUBRG
In a word? Yes.
I dunno why the only options are the far ends of the proverbial spectrum tho. Just because people aren't excited to play with underwhelming cards, that doesn't mean that they want want a format where turn 4 is the 'late game.' Likewise, I'm not sure that folks wanting to move away from a power-crested format cherish the thought of playing 1 spell a turn till turn 7 or so.
I'm not going to bash the set. It simply is what it is. I do, however, think its a bit disingenuous to defend one viewpoint by offering a far extreme as the only other possible alternative.
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
"I was promised an afterlife, not this."
-Djeru, former Tah-crop initiate
"Samut was right."
-Djeru, former Tah-crop initiate
"The God-Pharaoh lied."
-Djeru, former Tah-crop initiate
"I was promised an afterlife, not this. Samut was right."
-Djeru, former Tah-crop initiate
"I was promised an afterlife, not this. The God-Pharaoh lied."
-Djeru, former Tah-crop initiate
"Samut was right. The God-Pharaoh lied."
-Djeru, former Tah-crop initiate
Versus the actual flavor text:
"I was promised an afterlife, not this. Samut was right. The God-Pharaoh lied."
-Djeru, former Tah-crop initiate
See? Dropping a sentence, any sentence, vastly improves the whole thing. It's maddening how close it is to being good.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!