My friends are having serious problems on the SideBord, I literally never know what to take .. sometimes I put so much letter and I lose focus of the deck and I lose, as in the case against uwr, I shoot the prisons and spheres, and I am dead in damages of snapcaster and geist.
Would you have a default list?
this is the list.
1 Boseiju, Who Shelters A ..
4 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
14 Plains
1 Ghost Quarter
4 Temple of Enlightenment
24 land
4 Runed Halo
2 Greater Auramancy
4 Suppression Field
3 Sphere of Safety
3 Nodes
4 Leyline of Sanctity
4 Phyrexian Unlife
4 Ghostly Prison
4 Entreat the Angels
4 Solemnity
1 Zenith Red
the deck has 61 cards.
my SIDE
4 Rest in peace
4 Stony silence
3 nevermore
3 Oketra's Last Mercy
1 great auramancer
against agros I am satisfied, safe any aggro, post side I shot the 4 lines of force and put
+ 3x Oketra's over there for them.
+1 Auramancer
I returned the Entreat the Angels on account of having any chance against tron. which still tends to zero.
Now controls.
UWR
-4 phantasmagoric prison
+ 4 rest in peace
+3 Oketra
+1 auramancer
-4 Solemnty
my plan, I may be wrong, I need help here, is to make him lose all their instants, always descending 2 incantations at a time, if we launch 1 by 1 they cancel.
able to make a RIP before. and 3 nodes for clean snaps, geists etc.
I would like to know the strategies against control ... please. control that I say are
UWRs Nahiri and Geist
You can't beat control easily in Mono W. Landking S Field might buy you time, but by and large you need to hose their mana with Blood Moon,or Boil throw down a silly card like Obliterate, or splash B for discard, or U for disruption.
RIP is good against control, yes.
Some Enduring Ideal decks use Boseiju and some even run Silence.
Defense Grid is good vs counters.
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Just wanted to post here to point out that right now Rest in Peace is very maindeckable for us, I am seeing it every event almost. The decks it really does not hose tend to be our best matches anyway. It does conflict with Starfield but that card is best in Opalescence mode anyway.
At worst it adds one to devotion and Sphere of safety count, but it is nuts against Reanimator, dredge, Living End, of course, but also very solid VS. mardu, good Vs storm, Snapcaster/Search, persist combos in toolbox decks and modula in Affinity plus delve in DS decks. It also hits Goyf and matter reshaper death triggers. Minimal effects vs hate bears, merfolk, burn etc. don't really matter as they are very easy matches anyway.
There are decks that hurt us and it does little against, but those are decks where we gave bad game 1s anyway.
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Hey guys,
Wanted to take a minute to say how much this thread has helped out with my version of the deck. I've been messing around with W/X enchantments for a long time myself and have settled on this W/G Starfield build currently.
Some of my selections I know will surprise some people but they are, in my opinion, just as solid as many of the more mainstream options for Starfield of Nyx builds. Let me explain...
Why the green splash?
It's no secret our deck is mana hungry and Utopia Sprawl is a hell of a card. Utopia sprawl and Birds of Paradise (I'll get to why BoP over Arbor Elf in a bit) allows us to power down Ghostly Prison on turn 2, which as we all know can cripple many fair aggro decks like Affinity, Humans, and Merfolk. Green also gives us a powerful draw engine in Eidolon of Blossoms, which in conjunction with Starfield of Nyx is a potent 4/4 threat that you want to send to the bin, so swinging in and blocking become significantly easier.
But where green really shines is Vessel of Nascency. Vessel is an all-star with Starfield. Vessel allows us to dig like crazy, dumping cards into the bin while giving us gas in our hand, we can recur it with starfield to dig further, but where it shines the most is in a defensive position, allowing us to turn off our enchantment army at will. Vessel is stronger over in conjunction with Starfield many other deck manipulation options. Yes, it requires 3 mana, but the ramp from Utopia and BoP assist greatly with this.
Speaking of BoP and Utopia--I'm not a fan of Tron decks, I imagine that for many of us not in W/R this is a common feeling. So I wanted a way to punish them, Crumble to Dust works pretty soundly at doing that. This is not wholly necessary, but it's been effective for me.
Let's talk about Pariah. Pariah is a solid stall card. Slap it on an opponent's Tarmogoyf and you've effectively neutered it. Slap it on a Death's Shadow, and you've turned it into a removal spell (this is also a strong lock piece against fair aggro decks when paired with Starfield). But where the card does the most work is with Heliod, God of the Sun. Enchanting Heliod with Pariah means that you've effectively locked your opponent out of winning through damage. The same thing Solemnity and Phyrexian Unlife decks attempt to do, except you can put Heliod to work popping out tokens, beating for 5 (or 4 if you have Starfield--the world's an imperfect place). Yes, Heliod can still get pathed, but outside of that, the lock is pretty strong.
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No one spoke. There was no need. The threat of the Eldrazi presented a simple choice: lay down your arms and die for nothing, or hold them fast and die for something.
Not sure there are that many surprises there, one or two.
Utopia sprawl seems very, very valid.
Pariah is excellent in Heliod builds, I know, although I find Heliod is exiled often in my RW, the Pariah card offers flexibility. I don't run it in red splash, but mainly because I run a lot of win cons and space is tight. I already Combo around Nodes Heliod.
Vessel offers a lot to green. I agree it is able to do donkey work for the deck.
Bop and wrath are surprising to me. I personally would rather run an unlife and sphere no 4 than Wraths main. You can't run Suppression Field with fetches and unless I have misread don't run Halo, which is unusual, as is the absence of Temples. I guess you have to keep the forest count high for Sprawl.
Rule of law/Eidolon of R effects have always been brilliant for me v Tron from the board, in many ways better than Blood Moon. It slows them to a crawl.
I can see why you need Defense Grid, expensive win cons are hard to slip past control.
Hey, thanks for commenting. I agree, things aren't exactly novel as far as G/W builds go. BoP is really just a personal choice as it provides the red mana I need for crumble to dust, which may not be necessary, but I think it's effective. Pariah has served me particularly well as I don't have too many white players in my meta, now that I think about it.
I'd love to consider a build that runs Suppression Field more prominently, possibly alongside Kruphix's Insight rather than vessel. This would make running temples much easier, but with Starfield of Nyx as my primary wincon, I think it just makes too much sense to run vessels, which are just an impossibility with suppression field.
I'd argue pretty vehemently in favor of Defense Grid in blue control heavy metas. Sure, by the time you get to turn 5-7 it's value is much diminished, but with utopia and BoP ramping me into quick mana I'm usually able to get out ahead of that.
On an unrelated note, do we have any dream reprints we'd like to see in Return to Dominaria? My heart is desperately hoping for a reprint of Enchantress's Presence I'm sure it won't happen, but a man can dream!
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No one spoke. There was no need. The threat of the Eldrazi presented a simple choice: lay down your arms and die for nothing, or hold them fast and die for something.
DG is excellent at getting things down. The reason I don't run it is numbers on my win cons- I have a lot and the L. ascension in particular is cheap enough to slip under- and that karoo land/nykthos acceleration into the uncounterable obliterate.
I would say that Mulitani's presence and sterling grove would be great options for your 75 if they ever got reprinted.
I want a 1 mana enchantment pithing needle. I think that is key - more 1 mana enchantments with relevant abilities.
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I know technically this isn't a pillowfort deck but it seems to play like one. I might be going the wrong direction but I have had a decent win rate with this deck. I have been able to beat burn, affinity, Lantern, storm pretty easily at times. I have struggled with Tron a bit and decks like merfolk because of lack of interactions. I could probably use some help with land if someone like to help but this leyline deck is a blast to play and I hope to take it to a FNM in the next few weeks.
I know technically this isn't a pillowfort deck but it seems to play like one. I might be going the wrong direction but I have had a decent win rate with this deck. I have been able to beat burn, affinity, Lantern, storm pretty easily at times. I have struggled with Tron a bit and decks like merfolk because of lack of interactions. I could probably use some help with land if someone like to help but this leyline deck is a blast to play and I hope to take it to a FNM in the next few weeks.
just wanted to see what y'all think, maybe a more control variant is better but I just wanted yall two cents
I don't see the big upside of the green Leyline. You also can't really get any benefit from PIPs, etc. I don't see the benefit/synergy of having the Leylines in play other the token subtheme. I actually like the idea, but I think you could drop Green. It will fix your mana and allow you to play better utility land. I think Nythos, Shrine to Nyx is important in a deck like yours where you are getting Leylines down early. You aren't dependent on them, but they can help to have turns where you put out two cards. Windbrisk Heights is a very nice form of card advantage and selection in a deck like this that can use it.
If you are a token theme, I'd advise between 1-3 Intangible Virtue. The vigilance is worth the card, it swings fair games and games against aggressive decks. The added power and toughness works well too.
Token Makers you aren't running: Secure the Wastes is really good. Its almost a Raise the Alarm by itself and can be a huge swing late game when you have a lot of mana to put into it. Legion's Landing is a nice source of continuous tokens and the life gain is relevant. I like Rise of the Hobgoblins for similar reasons, its not instant speed, but surprisingly the First Strike can be relevant in matchups where you are defensive or you draw the Vault of the Archangels and can give your creatures deathtouch. Promise of Bunrei makes a lot of tokens and plays really well in matchups where the opponent has removal and sweepers. I like the Sorin for the buff to creatures with life gain, but it also makes tokens, easy enough to side it out when you bring in Suppression Field. The enchantments and planeswalkers also provide PIPS (color symbols) for the Board so they can allow for big Springjack Shepherd or Nythos. Start/Finish might also be a good change from Raise the Alarm since it can be used as removal as well.
I think some number of non-token creatures out of the sideboard make sense. Your opponent will remove its targeted removal after game one, so a Weathered Wayfarer can stick around and draw you extra cards and utility lands, I like a single Orzhov Basilica to help keep those land drops coming. Auriok Champion can dodge removal and gain life, good in Death Shadow and Burn matchups, so they can be well worth sideboard spots.
I may not have the deck tuned because I added some cards but here are some suggestions to look at.
I had the green leyline to offset the bitterblossom life drain then the additionally life gain from the tokens. It is pretty sweet with linger souls
Its your only green card. Its a terrible topdeck. The effect on the game isn't that big and you can find lots of good life gain in White. I like Auriok Champion for that purpose. Its a better card, it effects the metagame with so much Death's Shadow and very similar life gain. Occasionally, the body will make some difference, and if you add a PIP matters subtheme...
I had the green leyline to offset the bitterblossom life drain then the additionally life gain from the tokens. It is pretty sweet with linger souls
Its your only green card. Its a terrible topdeck. The effect on the game isn't that big and you can find lots of good life gain in White. I like Auriok Champion for that purpose. Its a better card, it effects the metagame with so much Death's Shadow and very similar life gain. Occasionally, the body will make some difference, and if you add a PIP matters subtheme...
That's just my thinking.
Sorry I haven't responded since I have been traveling for work but I understand what you are saying. I will try it without it and see how it plays out.
I had the green leyline to offset the bitterblossom life drain then the additionally life gain from the tokens. It is pretty sweet with linger souls
Its your only green card. Its a terrible topdeck. The effect on the game isn't that big and you can find lots of good life gain in White. I like Auriok Champion for that purpose. Its a better card, it effects the metagame with so much Death's Shadow and very similar life gain. Occasionally, the body will make some difference, and if you add a PIP matters subtheme...
That's just my thinking.
Sorry I haven't responded since I have been traveling for work but I understand what you are saying. I will try it without it and see how it plays out.
I hope I didn't come off as judgey. I like people trying new things. It maybe that you want to add more green cards and the third color would make more sense. I do see value in free cards, but I am very high on Auriok Champion and feel it would fill a very similar role in your deck. I hope this helps. Let us know what you find. It maybe that you still like the Green and we try some new things. But I'm hopeful that being just BW will sure up your mana base and open up the possibitly of more utility land. White has the best sideboard cards in Modern and Black can be very disruptive. Good luck!
For my money the fetches just don't play well enough with the board S field.
S field is a maindeckable card, I would seek to eliminate the Leyline of vitality and fetches play sphere of safety, Sup fields etc. You will end up with a token/hybrid build, but that is fine.
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Thoughts on Lightmine Field in these decks ?
I haven't seen it mentioned before but it seems like a pretty powerful option to stop creatures and is slightly easier to cast than Sphere of Safety at 4-mana.
I have always enjoyed decks that make it impossible for the other player to enjoy themselves; I've been admiring pillow fort for well over 6 years at this point but only recently have I pieced everything together to be able to play it. However, my major "innovation" is that I don't want to play an actual win condition; therefore the thesis of the deck I have been tuning over the past month is simply "Do Not Lose".
Because I do technically need a way to ensure that I would win eventually; the "win condition" I have chosen is the combination of Rest in Peace and Wheel of Sun and Moon; once a lock is established, the primary one being Phyrexian Unlife and Solemnity, my win condition ensures that I will never mill myself out as I will eventually be discarding to hand size, but the replacement effect of Wheel will ensure that I will never mill myself out, but my opponent will eventually end up with everything in exile. TLDR;the win condition is naturally mill the other player out.
While I have been playing slightly different lists over the past month, the differences are primarily one is W/U and focuses on quickly establishing a fast lock, while the W/R version plays fast mana and more locks. I have not tested the W/R list as extensively and am planning on taking it on Monday after I tweak it a bit.
Playing a W/U list
Round 1: Elves 0-2 [The deck had just been put together and had yet to be shuffled properly]
Round 2: Storm 2-0
Round 3: Jund 0-2
Round 4: Death & Taxes: 1-2
Playing a W/U list
Round 1: Grixis Control 1-2 [Engineered Explosives for 3 did me dirty]
Round 2: Land Distruction 0-2
Round 3: A pile of Standard Cards 2-0
Round 4: Storm: 2-1
Playing a W/U list
Round 1: B/W Tokens 1-0-1
Round 2: Deathtouch Tribal 2-0
Round 3: Scapeshift 0-2 [He hard cast an Emrakul]
Round 4: Elves: 0-2
Playing a W/U list
Round 1: Affinity 2-1
Round 2: Jeski Control 1-2
Round 3: Mono Red Tron 0-2
Round 4: Abazan: 2-0 [He conceded the match after game one]
Playing a W/R list
Round 1: Eldritch Ponza 2-1
Round 2: Boogles 1-2 [Couldn't find my halos and when I did, he had Seal of Primordium
Round 3: Elves 0-2
Round 4: Lantern Control: 0-2
Part of my issue with the W/R list was my mana base; I threw it together quickly and was punished as a result. I'm glad i was punished though, as when paired against the ponza deck,I found Blood Moon to be extremely self punishing and may have pushed me towards Blood Sun in the next iteration of the deck.
Possibility however proved its worth to me as being a secondary lock to ensure that the primary lock is undisturbed.
I plan on taking a W/R list on Monday with a more traditional mana base (similar to what drmarkb's mana base looks like). I would love feedback regarding what you think works with my approach to the deck and what could use some work.
Well I can say it is odd on u list that you are trying to deck them and are using wheel of S M to not die, but are also using serum visions etc. If the sun and moon does not resolve you may lose yourself to out drawing them.
I think in blue there is something to be said for running a repeated mill card-the 3 mana enchantment whose name escapes springs to mind, thus milling them.
Don't forget that if you are one nil down you can't win in the time as us. A good way to win quickly from the board, besides Starfield alpha strikes or Luminarch Ascension, is to board bribery against Tron or Reanimator lists.
Another lock you may fancy looking at is Zur's weirding and a bit of lifegain. You may need a Squadron Hawk/ Mistveil Plains and or Martyr Proc type shell, but coupled with attack taxes it is the ultimate in sadism, more so than Top Control.
Remember mana is vital, and little tricks like using a karoo land to bounce a temple can come with experience.
Like everybody, I'm wondering in which deck the new Dominaria spoiled cards could fit, and I could see Damping Matrix, although an artifact, in our W or WR Pillow Fort decks. It slows down opponents' shenanigans without us being impacted too much since we only play one spell per turn. We lose Nykhtos though. Argh, why ?!
I've been playing mono W Solemnity Prison in an FNM recently and I LOVED it (except when I played against UW Control and Jeskai that reckted me). The deck has a hard time against counterspells and even worse. I wish there was a consistent way to beat blue control decks, but I haven't found any. The WR shell is maybe more resilient with the Bloodmoons to hurt their manabase.
So lately I've been going mad trying to brew the Solemnity/Unlife combo into something that can hold up in a competitive environment. I've tried over 30 different deck ideas (yes, I have a sickness and the only cure is more Solemnity), but the only ones that felt even remotely competitive was the Solemnity Combo paired with Geralf's Messenger and Kitchen Finks in either a Orzhov Aristocrat shell or a BWg shell using Birds of Paradise for getting the combo down faster and Commune with the Gods as tutor support. The combo was relatively fast (BWg version allowing for turn 3 wins), but annoyingly fragile. The solemnity combo isn't really on anyone's radar in terms of the larger competitive atmosphere, but even so it catches the residual graveyard hate people are packing against other threats such as dredge, storm, hollow one etc. So I finally had enough. I decided that instead of brewing under the premise of "How can I win with this combo?" I would instead approach it with the notion of "How do I not lose?". And here we are.
This has been my take on the idea of using the Solemnity combo in a prison shell:
As you can see this is pretty unconventional compared to most pillowfort strategies, but when I was looking through the top 30 most played decks in modern right now I started to realize that there are only a handful of threats out there that can win through the Solemnity/Unlife combo. So, instead of cramming the deck full of aggro defense which is largely useless once the Solemnity combo goes online (unless Starfield of Nyx is your primary win-con), I instead decided to proactively attack those threats in the aims to completely neuter an opponents deck. The early hand disruption coupled with surgical extraction lets you not only strip an early threat, but also gives you information about your opponents deck, allowing you to make relevant choices with your Nevermores or Runed Halos. Cast Out and Gideon's Intervention are there as backup in case something slips through the cracks. Win-cons are the Karma + Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth combo and a single Palace Siege for backup, both tutorable when appropriate. Sideboard is rough and ever changing.
I don't have a tremendous amount of game data, but so far on Xmage it's been not only fun and challenging to play but also feels pretty powerful when played correctly. Most of my losses have been due to missteps on my part or from fast aggro decks sometimes slipping under unlife (especially if I have to tutor for it). I'm curious to see if anyone else has thought of taking this deck into this direction and what kinda of success they've had with it.
Like everybody, I'm wondering in which deck the new Dominaria spoiled cards could fit, and I could see Damping Matrix, although an artifact, in our W or WR Pillow Fort decks. It slows down opponents' shenanigans without us being impacted too much since we only play one spell per turn. We lose Nykhtos though. Argh, why ?!
I've been playing mono W Solemnity Prison in an FNM recently and I LOVED it (except when I played against UW Control and Jeskai that reckted me). The deck has a hard time against counterspells and even worse. I wish there was a consistent way to beat blue control decks, but I haven't found any. The WR shell is maybe more resilient with the Bloodmoons to hurt their manabase.
I run Obliterate. With S Field it hurts them big time. I counters learn, kills everything bar our enchantments. The ramp is via Nykthos or 2 Garrison, which also bounce scry lands. They do add a bit to the skill level required as you have to play them at the right time and plan your next drops more carefully, weighing up the extra mana long term vs bring short a mana on a turn, assuming you have a regular land drop too there are more choices.
Mono w has no chance vs uw, but maybe the new 'geddon Saga could help though it is better in enduring ideal decks. The old fashioned way for mono w was to play Crucible and recur Ghost Quarter or to use critters and Emeria, neither of which work in a Pillow Fort deck that well.
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Like everybody, I'm wondering in which deck the new Dominaria spoiled cards could fit, and I could see Damping Matrix, although an artifact, in our W or WR Pillow Fort decks. It slows down opponents' shenanigans without us being impacted too much since we only play one spell per turn. We lose Nykhtos though. Argh, why ?!
I've been playing mono W Solemnity Prison in an FNM recently and I LOVED it (except when I played against UW Control and Jeskai that reckted me). The deck has a hard time against counterspells and even worse. I wish there was a consistent way to beat blue control decks, but I haven't found any. The WR shell is maybe more resilient with the Bloodmoons to hurt their manabase.
Are you running the Weathered Wayfarer version? Boseiju could be an option to be able to tutor for it with a one drop, so you can get in before they have counter magic up. The life loss from Boeseju is less impactful in a control matchup.
I don't really trust Wayfarer to survive the opponent's spells, nor do I trust Boseiju because blue control decks tend to run Field of Ruins anyway. But that was a good suggestion !
On the other hand the Obliterate plan sounds great. Frankly I think I might splash red just for Blood Moons and this (even if it's a nombo) ^^
I'd need to solve the manabase though.
I'll bring the deck again to my LGS this Wednesday ! The meta has definitely shifted there since the Jace / BBE unbanning and I actually haven't met any UW or UWR control since then. There are a lot of Junds, and I think this deck can be ok against it
Also a few Lantern decks, 8 Whack, Affinity, Human... it's worth a try.
I like Wayfarer as a sideboard option too. Game two they take out their removal and since its your only creature it tends to survive. I leave my land base the same so the Boseju is in there. I agree that most control decks have some land removal, but they often want to throw that at your Nyx too.
In game two, having the Wayfarer greatly increases the chances to get the specialty lands, so it can greatly increase your speed and power. Its up to you whether you want the Wayfarer game one or not, because if it sticks you are faster. But if they keep in removal for just your Wayfarer's game two and three that is also a big advantage.
I like the new Fall of Thran card from Dominaria. It's a bit expensive, but the payoff is pretty nice. I'm thinking W/B for Leyline of the Void and discard. Void can win games on it's own, and the discard can help you with counter wars.
I don't like it. Lands are coming back so there's not much point,or is there ?
As for black leyline, Rest in Peace does in my opinion a more consistent job and doesn't need any splash
I'd like to try 2 Idyllic tutors in the deck list I posted above. I think I'll remove 1 Solemnity and 1 Gideon's Intervention for it. Seems fine.
I'd also like to add a second Greater Auramancy MD, but I can't decide what to take out. Probably 1 Sigil ? I'm reluctant to take out one win con. Maybe 1 Porphyry Node ?
My friends are having serious problems on the SideBord, I literally never know what to take .. sometimes I put so much letter and I lose focus of the deck and I lose, as in the case against uwr, I shoot the prisons and spheres, and I am dead in damages of snapcaster and geist.
Would you have a default list?
this is the list.
1 Boseiju, Who Shelters A ..
4 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
14 Plains
1 Ghost Quarter
4 Temple of Enlightenment
24 land
4 Runed Halo
2 Greater Auramancy
4 Suppression Field
3 Sphere of Safety
3 Nodes
4 Leyline of Sanctity
4 Phyrexian Unlife
4 Ghostly Prison
4 Entreat the Angels
4 Solemnity
1 Zenith Red
the deck has 61 cards.
my SIDE
4 Rest in peace
4 Stony silence
3 nevermore
3 Oketra's Last Mercy
1 great auramancer
against agros I am satisfied, safe any aggro, post side I shot the 4 lines of force and put
+ 3x Oketra's over there for them.
+1 Auramancer
I returned the Entreat the Angels on account of having any chance against tron. which still tends to zero.
Now controls.
UWR
-4 phantasmagoric prison
+ 4 rest in peace
+3 Oketra
+1 auramancer
-4 Solemnty
my plan, I may be wrong, I need help here, is to make him lose all their instants, always descending 2 incantations at a time, if we launch 1 by 1 they cancel.
able to make a RIP before. and 3 nodes for clean snaps, geists etc.
I would like to know the strategies against control ... please. control that I say are
UWRs Nahiri and Geist
RIP is good against control, yes.
Some Enduring Ideal decks use Boseiju and some even run Silence.
Defense Grid is good vs counters.
At worst it adds one to devotion and Sphere of safety count, but it is nuts against Reanimator, dredge, Living End, of course, but also very solid VS. mardu, good Vs storm, Snapcaster/Search, persist combos in toolbox decks and modula in Affinity plus delve in DS decks. It also hits Goyf and matter reshaper death triggers. Minimal effects vs hate bears, merfolk, burn etc. don't really matter as they are very easy matches anyway.
There are decks that hurt us and it does little against, but those are decks where we gave bad game 1s anyway.
Wanted to take a minute to say how much this thread has helped out with my version of the deck. I've been messing around with W/X enchantments for a long time myself and have settled on this W/G Starfield build currently.
// 8 Creature
2 Heliod, God of the Sun
3 Eidolon of Blossoms
3 Birds of Paradise
// 28 Enchantment
4 Ghostly Prison
3 Sphere of Safety
4 Utopia Sprawl
3 Vessel of Nascency
1 Sigil of the Empty Throne
3 Starfield of Nyx
4 Leyline of Sanctity
1 Greater Auramancy
2 Pariah
1 Story Circle
2 Cast Out
4 Temple Garden
4 Forest
4 Plains
4 Windswept Heath
2 Horizon Canopy
2 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Stomping Ground
// 2 Sorcery
2 Wrath of God
// 6 Artifact
1 Pithing Needle
3 Defense Grid
2 Grafdigger's Cage
// 2 Creature
2 Aven Mindcensor
2 Stony Silence
2 Nevermore
// 3 Sorcery
3 Crumble to Dust
Some of my selections I know will surprise some people but they are, in my opinion, just as solid as many of the more mainstream options for Starfield of Nyx builds. Let me explain...
Why the green splash?
It's no secret our deck is mana hungry and Utopia Sprawl is a hell of a card. Utopia sprawl and Birds of Paradise (I'll get to why BoP over Arbor Elf in a bit) allows us to power down Ghostly Prison on turn 2, which as we all know can cripple many fair aggro decks like Affinity, Humans, and Merfolk. Green also gives us a powerful draw engine in Eidolon of Blossoms, which in conjunction with Starfield of Nyx is a potent 4/4 threat that you want to send to the bin, so swinging in and blocking become significantly easier.
But where green really shines is Vessel of Nascency. Vessel is an all-star with Starfield. Vessel allows us to dig like crazy, dumping cards into the bin while giving us gas in our hand, we can recur it with starfield to dig further, but where it shines the most is in a defensive position, allowing us to turn off our enchantment army at will. Vessel is stronger over in conjunction with Starfield many other deck manipulation options. Yes, it requires 3 mana, but the ramp from Utopia and BoP assist greatly with this.
Speaking of BoP and Utopia--I'm not a fan of Tron decks, I imagine that for many of us not in W/R this is a common feeling. So I wanted a way to punish them, Crumble to Dust works pretty soundly at doing that. This is not wholly necessary, but it's been effective for me.
Let's talk about Pariah. Pariah is a solid stall card. Slap it on an opponent's Tarmogoyf and you've effectively neutered it. Slap it on a Death's Shadow, and you've turned it into a removal spell (this is also a strong lock piece against fair aggro decks when paired with Starfield). But where the card does the most work is with Heliod, God of the Sun. Enchanting Heliod with Pariah means that you've effectively locked your opponent out of winning through damage. The same thing Solemnity and Phyrexian Unlife decks attempt to do, except you can put Heliod to work popping out tokens, beating for 5 (or 4 if you have Starfield--the world's an imperfect place). Yes, Heliod can still get pathed, but outside of that, the lock is pretty strong.
Utopia sprawl seems very, very valid.
Pariah is excellent in Heliod builds, I know, although I find Heliod is exiled often in my RW, the Pariah card offers flexibility. I don't run it in red splash, but mainly because I run a lot of win cons and space is tight. I already Combo around Nodes Heliod.
Vessel offers a lot to green. I agree it is able to do donkey work for the deck.
Bop and wrath are surprising to me. I personally would rather run an unlife and sphere no 4 than Wraths main. You can't run Suppression Field with fetches and unless I have misread don't run Halo, which is unusual, as is the absence of Temples. I guess you have to keep the forest count high for Sprawl.
Rule of law/Eidolon of R effects have always been brilliant for me v Tron from the board, in many ways better than Blood Moon. It slows them to a crawl.
I can see why you need Defense Grid, expensive win cons are hard to slip past control.
Thanks for sharing...
I'd love to consider a build that runs Suppression Field more prominently, possibly alongside Kruphix's Insight rather than vessel. This would make running temples much easier, but with Starfield of Nyx as my primary wincon, I think it just makes too much sense to run vessels, which are just an impossibility with suppression field.
I'd argue pretty vehemently in favor of Defense Grid in blue control heavy metas. Sure, by the time you get to turn 5-7 it's value is much diminished, but with utopia and BoP ramping me into quick mana I'm usually able to get out ahead of that.
On an unrelated note, do we have any dream reprints we'd like to see in Return to Dominaria? My heart is desperately hoping for a reprint of Enchantress's Presence I'm sure it won't happen, but a man can dream!
I would say that Mulitani's presence and sterling grove would be great options for your 75 if they ever got reprinted.
I want a 1 mana enchantment pithing needle. I think that is key - more 1 mana enchantments with relevant abilities.
4 Bitterblossom
3 Ghostly Prison
4 Leyline of Sanctity
4 Leyline of the Meek
2 Leyline of the Void
4 Leyline of Vitality
Instant (7)
3 Path to Exile
4 Raise the Alarm
Sorcery
2 Inquisition of Kozilek
4 Lingering Souls
2 Thoughtseize
2 Wrath of God
2 Forest
1 Godless Shrine
2 Horizon Canopy
4 Marsh Flats
4 Plains
2 Swamp
1 Temple Garden
4 Windswept Heath
2 Overgrown Tomb
2 Day of Judgment
1 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Leyline of the Void
2 Nevermore
2 Runed Halo
3 Stony Silence
3 Suppression Field
just wanted to see what yall think, maybe a more control variant is better but I just wanted yall two cents
I don't see the big upside of the green Leyline. You also can't really get any benefit from PIPs, etc. I don't see the benefit/synergy of having the Leylines in play other the token subtheme. I actually like the idea, but I think you could drop Green. It will fix your mana and allow you to play better utility land. I think Nythos, Shrine to Nyx is important in a deck like yours where you are getting Leylines down early. You aren't dependent on them, but they can help to have turns where you put out two cards. Windbrisk Heights is a very nice form of card advantage and selection in a deck like this that can use it.
If you are a token theme, I'd advise between 1-3 Intangible Virtue. The vigilance is worth the card, it swings fair games and games against aggressive decks. The added power and toughness works well too.
Token Makers you aren't running: Secure the Wastes is really good. Its almost a Raise the Alarm by itself and can be a huge swing late game when you have a lot of mana to put into it. Legion's Landing is a nice source of continuous tokens and the life gain is relevant. I like Rise of the Hobgoblins for similar reasons, its not instant speed, but surprisingly the First Strike can be relevant in matchups where you are defensive or you draw the Vault of the Archangels and can give your creatures deathtouch. Promise of Bunrei makes a lot of tokens and plays really well in matchups where the opponent has removal and sweepers. I like the Sorin for the buff to creatures with life gain, but it also makes tokens, easy enough to side it out when you bring in Suppression Field. The enchantments and planeswalkers also provide PIPS (color symbols) for the Board so they can allow for big Springjack Shepherd or Nythos. Start/Finish might also be a good change from Raise the Alarm since it can be used as removal as well.
I think some number of non-token creatures out of the sideboard make sense. Your opponent will remove its targeted removal after game one, so a Weathered Wayfarer can stick around and draw you extra cards and utility lands, I like a single Orzhov Basilica to help keep those land drops coming. Auriok Champion can dodge removal and gain life, good in Death Shadow and Burn matchups, so they can be well worth sideboard spots.
I may not have the deck tuned because I added some cards but here are some suggestions to look at.
1 Springjack Shepherd
Planeswalker
1 Sorin, Solemn Visitor
Enchantment
4 Bitterblossom
3 Ghostly Prison
4 Leyline of Sanctity
4 Leyline of the Meek
1 Leyline of the Void
3 Intangible Virtue
1 Rise of the Hobgoblins
1 Legion's Landing
1 Promise of Bunrei
Instant (7)
3 Path to Exile
2 Raise the Alarm
2 Secure the Wastes
2 Start
2 Inquisition of Kozilek
4 Lingering Souls
2 Thoughtseize
2 Wrath of God
3 Godless Shrine
2 Horizon Canopy
4 Marsh Flats
4 Plains
2 Swamp
4 Windswept Heath
1 Vault of the Archangel
2 Windbrisk Heights
2 Nythos, Shrine to Nyx
1 Orzhov Basilica
1 Day of Judgment
1 Hour of Reckoning
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Leyline of the Void
1 Weathered Wayfarer
1 Auriok Champion
1 Tidehollow Sculler
1 Nevermore
1 Runed Halo
3 Stony Silence
3 Suppression Field
Its your only green card. Its a terrible topdeck. The effect on the game isn't that big and you can find lots of good life gain in White. I like Auriok Champion for that purpose. Its a better card, it effects the metagame with so much Death's Shadow and very similar life gain. Occasionally, the body will make some difference, and if you add a PIP matters subtheme...
That's just my thinking.
Sorry I haven't responded since I have been traveling for work but I understand what you are saying. I will try it without it and see how it plays out.
I hope I didn't come off as judgey. I like people trying new things. It maybe that you want to add more green cards and the third color would make more sense. I do see value in free cards, but I am very high on Auriok Champion and feel it would fill a very similar role in your deck. I hope this helps. Let us know what you find. It maybe that you still like the Green and we try some new things. But I'm hopeful that being just BW will sure up your mana base and open up the possibitly of more utility land. White has the best sideboard cards in Modern and Black can be very disruptive. Good luck!
S field is a maindeckable card, I would seek to eliminate the Leyline of vitality and fetches play sphere of safety, Sup fields etc. You will end up with a token/hybrid build, but that is fine.
I haven't seen it mentioned before but it seems like a pretty powerful option to stop creatures and is slightly easier to cast than Sphere of Safety at 4-mana.
This into Gideon Jura can wrath the board.
I have always enjoyed decks that make it impossible for the other player to enjoy themselves; I've been admiring pillow fort for well over 6 years at this point but only recently have I pieced everything together to be able to play it. However, my major "innovation" is that I don't want to play an actual win condition; therefore the thesis of the deck I have been tuning over the past month is simply "Do Not Lose".
Because I do technically need a way to ensure that I would win eventually; the "win condition" I have chosen is the combination of Rest in Peace and Wheel of Sun and Moon; once a lock is established, the primary one being Phyrexian Unlife and Solemnity, my win condition ensures that I will never mill myself out as I will eventually be discarding to hand size, but the replacement effect of Wheel will ensure that I will never mill myself out, but my opponent will eventually end up with everything in exile. TLDR;the win condition is naturally mill the other player out.
While I have been playing slightly different lists over the past month, the differences are primarily one is W/U and focuses on quickly establishing a fast lock, while the W/R version plays fast mana and more locks. I have not tested the W/R list as extensively and am planning on taking it on Monday after I tweak it a bit.
4 Serum Visions
2 Monastery Siege
1 Search for Azcanta
2 Idyllic Tutor
Lock Pieces
4 Runed Halo
2 Greater Auramancy
3 Rest in Peace
2 Wheel of Sun and Moon
4 Suppression Field
1 Nevermore
4 Phyrexian Unlife
4 Solemnity
4 Leyline of Sanctity
1 Sphere of Safety
2 Azorious Chancery
1 Gemstone Mine
4 Ghost Quarter
2 Hallowed Fountain
1 Island
2 Mistveil Plains
3 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
2 Temple of Enlightenment
1 Vivid Meadow
5 Plains
2 Eidolon of Rhetoric
4 Porphyry Nodes
1 Stony Silence
2 Ghostly Prison
3 Nevermore
3 Oblivion Ring
4 Runed Halo
1 Curse of Exhaustion
1 Possibility Storm
3 Blood Moon
2 Greater Auramancy
2 Rest in Peace
2 Wheel of Sun and Moon
4 Suppression Field
1 Nevermore
4 Phyrexian Unlife
4 Solemnity
4 Leyline of Sanctity
1 Sphere of Safety
3 Idyllic Tutor
1 Oblivion Ring
4 Simian Spirit Guide
1 Gemstone Mine
2 Ghost Quarter
4 Sacred Foundry
1 Mountain
2 Mistveil Plains
2 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
7 Plains
1 Sphere of Safety
3 Porphyry Nodes
1 Stony Silence
1 Curse of Exhaustion
3 Nevermore
3 Oblivion Ring
1 Idyllic Tutor
1 Blood Moon
1 Rest in Peace
Playing a W/U list
Round 1: Elves 0-2 [The deck had just been put together and had yet to be shuffled properly]
Round 2: Storm 2-0
Round 3: Jund 0-2
Round 4: Death & Taxes: 1-2
Playing a W/U list
Round 1: Grixis Control 1-2 [Engineered Explosives for 3 did me dirty]
Round 2: Land Distruction 0-2
Round 3: A pile of Standard Cards 2-0
Round 4: Storm: 2-1
Playing a W/U list
Round 1: B/W Tokens 1-0-1
Round 2: Deathtouch Tribal 2-0
Round 3: Scapeshift 0-2 [He hard cast an Emrakul]
Round 4: Elves: 0-2
Playing a W/U list
Round 1: Affinity 2-1
Round 2: Jeski Control 1-2
Round 3: Mono Red Tron 0-2
Round 4: Abazan: 2-0 [He conceded the match after game one]
Playing a W/R list
Round 1: Eldritch Ponza 2-1
Round 2: Boogles 1-2 [Couldn't find my halos and when I did, he had Seal of Primordium
Round 3: Elves 0-2
Round 4: Lantern Control: 0-2
Part of my issue with the W/R list was my mana base; I threw it together quickly and was punished as a result. I'm glad i was punished though, as when paired against the ponza deck,I found Blood Moon to be extremely self punishing and may have pushed me towards Blood Sun in the next iteration of the deck.
Possibility however proved its worth to me as being a secondary lock to ensure that the primary lock is undisturbed.
I plan on taking a W/R list on Monday with a more traditional mana base (similar to what drmarkb's mana base looks like). I would love feedback regarding what you think works with my approach to the deck and what could use some work.
I think in blue there is something to be said for running a repeated mill card-the 3 mana enchantment whose name escapes springs to mind, thus milling them.
Don't forget that if you are one nil down you can't win in the time as us. A good way to win quickly from the board, besides Starfield alpha strikes or Luminarch Ascension, is to board bribery against Tron or Reanimator lists.
Another lock you may fancy looking at is Zur's weirding and a bit of lifegain. You may need a Squadron Hawk/ Mistveil Plains and or Martyr Proc type shell, but coupled with attack taxes it is the ultimate in sadism, more so than Top Control.
Remember mana is vital, and little tricks like using a karoo land to bounce a temple can come with experience.
I've been playing mono W Solemnity Prison in an FNM recently and I LOVED it (except when I played against UW Control and Jeskai that reckted me). The deck has a hard time against counterspells and even worse. I wish there was a consistent way to beat blue control decks, but I haven't found any. The WR shell is maybe more resilient with the Bloodmoons to hurt their manabase.
Modern : Solemnity Prison Martyr Proc Devotion to Green 8 Whacks Eldrazi Processor Bogles Landfall Aggro
Legacy : Goblins
This has been my take on the idea of using the Solemnity combo in a prison shell:
4 Thoughtseize
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
4 Surgical Extraction
4 Idyllic Tutor
Enchantments
3 Phyrexian Unlife
2 Solemnity
2 Greater Auramancy
3 Leyline of Sanctity
4 Nevermore
2 Runed Halo
2 Cast Out
1 Gideon's Intervention
2 Karma
1 Palace Siege
4 Caves of Koilos
3 Godless Shrine
4 Marsh Flats
1 Mistveil Plains
2 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
4 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
3 Plains
2 Swamp
1 Cranial Extraction
2 Wrath of God
2 Stony Silence
1 Rule of Law
1 Cast Out
1 Gideon's Intervention
3 Leyline of the Void
1 Starfield of Nyx
1 Form of the Dragon
As you can see this is pretty unconventional compared to most pillowfort strategies, but when I was looking through the top 30 most played decks in modern right now I started to realize that there are only a handful of threats out there that can win through the Solemnity/Unlife combo. So, instead of cramming the deck full of aggro defense which is largely useless once the Solemnity combo goes online (unless Starfield of Nyx is your primary win-con), I instead decided to proactively attack those threats in the aims to completely neuter an opponents deck. The early hand disruption coupled with surgical extraction lets you not only strip an early threat, but also gives you information about your opponents deck, allowing you to make relevant choices with your Nevermores or Runed Halos. Cast Out and Gideon's Intervention are there as backup in case something slips through the cracks. Win-cons are the Karma + Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth combo and a single Palace Siege for backup, both tutorable when appropriate. Sideboard is rough and ever changing.
I don't have a tremendous amount of game data, but so far on Xmage it's been not only fun and challenging to play but also feels pretty powerful when played correctly. Most of my losses have been due to missteps on my part or from fast aggro decks sometimes slipping under unlife (especially if I have to tutor for it). I'm curious to see if anyone else has thought of taking this deck into this direction and what kinda of success they've had with it.
I run Obliterate. With S Field it hurts them big time. I counters learn, kills everything bar our enchantments. The ramp is via Nykthos or 2 Garrison, which also bounce scry lands. They do add a bit to the skill level required as you have to play them at the right time and plan your next drops more carefully, weighing up the extra mana long term vs bring short a mana on a turn, assuming you have a regular land drop too there are more choices.
Mono w has no chance vs uw, but maybe the new 'geddon Saga could help though it is better in enduring ideal decks. The old fashioned way for mono w was to play Crucible and recur Ghost Quarter or to use critters and Emeria, neither of which work in a Pillow Fort deck that well.
Are you running the Weathered Wayfarer version? Boseiju could be an option to be able to tutor for it with a one drop, so you can get in before they have counter magic up. The life loss from Boeseju is less impactful in a control matchup.
4x Ghostly Prison
2x Gideon's Intervention
1x Greater Auramancy
4x Leyline of Sanctity
2x Oblivion Ring
4x Phyrexian Unlife
1x Porphyry Nodes
4x Runed Halo
3x Sigil of the Empty Throne
4x Solemnity
4x Suppression Field
2x Ghost Quarter
4x Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
1x Mistveil Plains
17x Plains
Sorcery (4)
4x Entreat the Angels
2x Grand Abolisher / Defense Grid
2x Greater Auramancy
1x Journey to Nowhere
2x Nevermore
1x Oblivion Ring
1x Path to Exile
1x Porphyry Nodes
3x Rest in Peace
2x Stony Silence
I don't really trust Wayfarer to survive the opponent's spells, nor do I trust Boseiju because blue control decks tend to run Field of Ruins anyway. But that was a good suggestion !
On the other hand the Obliterate plan sounds great. Frankly I think I might splash red just for Blood Moons and this (even if it's a nombo) ^^
I'd need to solve the manabase though.
I'll bring the deck again to my LGS this Wednesday ! The meta has definitely shifted there since the Jace / BBE unbanning and I actually haven't met any UW or UWR control since then. There are a lot of Junds, and I think this deck can be ok against it
Also a few Lantern decks, 8 Whack, Affinity, Human... it's worth a try.
Modern : Solemnity Prison Martyr Proc Devotion to Green 8 Whacks Eldrazi Processor Bogles Landfall Aggro
Legacy : Goblins
In game two, having the Wayfarer greatly increases the chances to get the specialty lands, so it can greatly increase your speed and power. Its up to you whether you want the Wayfarer game one or not, because if it sticks you are faster. But if they keep in removal for just your Wayfarer's game two and three that is also a big advantage.
Any thoughts?
As for black leyline, Rest in Peace does in my opinion a more consistent job and doesn't need any splash
I'd like to try 2 Idyllic tutors in the deck list I posted above. I think I'll remove 1 Solemnity and 1 Gideon's Intervention for it. Seems fine.
I'd also like to add a second Greater Auramancy MD, but I can't decide what to take out. Probably 1 Sigil ? I'm reluctant to take out one win con. Maybe 1 Porphyry Node ?
Modern : Solemnity Prison Martyr Proc Devotion to Green 8 Whacks Eldrazi Processor Bogles Landfall Aggro
Legacy : Goblins