Might seem like an overstretch but what are the chances we could run a build with a paradox engine and temple bells? Don't know what to cut in order to make room but hear me out..
When we lock the game with ensnaring bridge and are able to control their draw step with mill rocks it becomes a matter of turns and wasted time. What if we could cast paradox engine, manipulate both ours and their top card of the library and then pretty much: draw card off of temple bell that is either 0 or 1 mana, mill cards with the remaining mill rocks - cast the spell in your hand - untap off of paradox engine all of your artifacts including mox opal and whatnot...
It just seems like such an awesome way to speed up matches and essentially just win that turn given the amount of low costing spells we play
Just an idea I've been having to spice the deck up a little since it sounds fun!
EDIT: To add to this, I feel like you would obviously only run one of paradox engine given it's high mana cost but as I was saying, as the game progresses and they are unable to respond to your board, getting to the 6 mana wouldn't be too difficult. Plus the deck is so good at tutoring for artifacts through ancient stirrings/inventor's fair/etc...
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Might seem like an overstretch but what are the chances we could run a build with a paradox engine and temple bells? Don't know what to cut in order to make room but hear me out..
When we lock the game with ensnaring bridge and are able to control their draw step with mill rocks it becomes a matter of turns and wasted time. What if we could cast paradox engine, manipulate both ours and their top card of the library and then pretty much: draw card off of temple bell that is either 0 or 1 mana, mill cards with the remaining mill rocks - cast the spell in your hand - untap off of paradox engine all of your artifacts including mox opal and whatnot...
It just seems like such an awesome way to speed up matches and essentially just win that turn given the amount of low costing spells we play
Just an idea I've been having to spice the deck up a little since it sounds fun!
EDIT: To add to this, I feel like you would obviously only run one of paradox engine given it's high mana cost but as I was saying, as the game progresses and they are unable to respond to your board, getting to the 6 mana wouldn't be too difficult. Plus the deck is so good at tutoring for artifacts through ancient stirrings/inventor's fair/etc...
Honestly I think just one Ghirapur Aether Grid would serve this role a lot better.
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what are thoughts on sorcerous spyglass as a one of in place of one pithing needle
I am testing two Needle main and one Spyglass side. I do not have enough testing to have an opinion.
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sun droplet is for any deck that is trying to win with incrmemental damage. i usually bring them in against burn, bgx, stuff like that. against burn it can be a hoser and against bgx it usually eats some artifact removal.
spellskites are also for burn and bgx, they also can handle affinity pretty well too.
bontu is for all creature decks. acts like a 5th bridge bettter than most cards ive seen. i was trying flaying tendrils since you can grab it with stirrings, but it doesnt kill enough
mainly these cards are designed to mitigate the loss of white. sun droplets and spellskite try to mimic leyline of sanctity, bontu is in for magus of the mote, lost legacy acts like gaddock teeg, and crucible is a bomb against control decks.
no white means you can easily run 4 ghost quarters which is very useful against some of our worst match ups
Well, was going to copy a post from the Facebook page and reddit so that I can share the info here, but the forum keeps giving me a "Non Latin Unicode characters are temporarily not allowed" error. So, feel free to check it out here.
Maybe it should be one Spyglass and one Neexle main, and one Needle side?
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That may be true. However, I have already come across a situation where having it made all the difference: Chalice on 1. I played it against an E-Tron opponent when the only board presence I had was Padeem and Bridge. I was able to see they were just about ready to drop Karn, so I nabbed their Karn. I then enchanted it with Mechanized Production, so every turn I got a fresh look at their hand and simply nabbed the most important card with the copy. I won G2 and the match vs E-Tron like this.
It has also come in handy against the mirror due to being a hedge against both Leyline of Sanctity and Surgical Extraction. Its peek effect says "look at an opponent's hand", so you can get around LoS amd still see what they have going on, nab their most important card, and work around the rest. That really contributed to my win against the mirror earlier yesterday.
This is all anecdotal evidence, but it is more than enough for me to continue testing it. The 2cmc has been more than worth it (and in the case of Chalice, simply better than 1cmc).
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hey yall! finally picked up this deck. Im a control player who also enjoys dysfunctional decks (See: eldrazi stompy, and tron) ... U tron is my fav. and is also a hard to pilot and highly rewarding deck. so i figured I may find a good home with lantern...
anyways, im glad to see the chatter on spyglass, and it makes sense to me. I was going to use spyglass in eldrazi stompy cause SSG allows it to be played t1, and they ultimately have a chalice on 1 many games, so it fits in well there, but it seems a bit unnecessary in this deck for previously mentioned reasons. slowing the deck down is not good.
random idea partially in line with spyglass talk, has anyone ever trie SSG for speeding the deck up even more?
I have a question about witchbane orb ... as a 4th leyline, that is tutor-able with inventors fair? ... is there a reason people don't do this? for titanshift/burn/ad nauseum maybe? ... or is it just unnecessary?
Hey guys! Quick question, how many of you are running Ghirapur as a win condition? I have been playing it as a one of in the mainboard for a few months now and I have to say that it is consistently underperforming for me.. I mean there have been several matches where things worked out and it was quicker to kill them with that then by mill, but I don't like that it can't be tutored for and that in your opening hand it is almost a dead card..
I also don't know what would be a considerable replacement.. I was thinking of just adding a third collective company in it's place since it has so much utility in it's modes and it's discard outlet to get Ensnaring Bridge to 0. Ultimately, what I'm asking is: Is everyone here going entirely mill or how do you like to win with the deck? Is Pyrite Spellbomb still a thing? lol
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Hey guys! Quick question, how many of you are running Ghirapur as a win condition? I have been playing it as a one of in the mainboard for a few months now and I have to say that it is consistently underperforming for me.. I mean there have been several matches where things worked out and it was quicker to kill them with that then by mill, but I don't like that it can't be tutored for and that in your opening hand it is almost a dead card..
I also don't know what would be a considerable replacement.. I was thinking of just adding a third collective company in it's place since it has so much utility in it's modes and it's discard outlet to get Ensnaring Bridge to 0. Ultimately, what I'm asking is: Is everyone here going entirely mill or how do you like to win with the deck? Is Pyrite Spellbomb still a thing? lol
maybe try moving grid to the sideboard? I usually win G1 with mill or concession. I bring grid in for any match that has hierarch, signal pest, stony silence, or kataki. I also consider bringing it in when theres less than ~12 minutes to finish a match and i dont think the opponent will concede to the lock.
Hey guys! Quick question, how many of you are running Ghirapur as a win condition? I have been playing it as a one of in the mainboard for a few months now and I have to say that it is consistently underperforming for me.. I mean there have been several matches where things worked out and it was quicker to kill them with that then by mill, but I don't like that it can't be tutored for and that in your opening hand it is almost a dead card..
I also don't know what would be a considerable replacement.. I was thinking of just adding a third collective company in it's place since it has so much utility in it's modes and it's discard outlet to get Ensnaring Bridge to 0. Ultimately, what I'm asking is: Is everyone here going entirely mill or how do you like to win with the deck? Is Pyrite Spellbomb still a thing? lol
Collective brutality + Codex shredder + Academy ruins already provide you with an alternative way to win. It's a bit mana ontensive, but you can drain them to death. The only upside of Grid is that it can ping creatures, but brutality can also deal with small creatures and big ones are handled by the bridge. I don't see any reason to play grid in lantern right now.
Hey guys! Quick question, how many of you are running Ghirapur as a win condition? I have been playing it as a one of in the mainboard for a few months now and I have to say that it is consistently underperforming for me.. I mean there have been several matches where things worked out and it was quicker to kill them with that then by mill, but I don't like that it can't be tutored for and that in your opening hand it is almost a dead card..
I also don't know what would be a considerable replacement.. I was thinking of just adding a third collective company in it's place since it has so much utility in it's modes and it's discard outlet to get Ensnaring Bridge to 0. Ultimately, what I'm asking is: Is everyone here going entirely mill or how do you like to win with the deck? Is Pyrite Spellbomb still a thing? lol
Collective brutality + Codex shredder + Academy ruins already provide you with an alternative way to win. It's a bit mana ontensive, but you can drain them to death. The only upside of Grid is that it can ping creatures, but brutality can also deal with small creatures and big ones are handled by the bridge. I don't see any reason to play grid in lantern right now.
Speed is a huge factor here. It is very hard to get to 11 mana with Lantern, and that will take tons of time to dig to your lands (or recur them with Shredder if you have milled too many!). Then you have to explain what you are doing to your opponent, and against a savvy opponent will probably have to take all the actions because they will not allow you to shortcut. Then for all your work, you can only take chunks out of opponents' life two at a time.
The goal of an alt-wincon is to close out games that you need to close out quickly. For example, if you are starting G3 with 10-15 minutes left, or you've lost G1 against a grindy deck and need to win two games in the alloted time now. Brutality loop is way too slow to accomplish this goal, even for Lantern, which is saying a lot.
Grid is a lot faster; all it needs is for you to find it (easier with Tutor) and have some artifacts to fuel it. Late game, it regularly deals 4-7 damage a turn, which is certainly enough to close a game in a few turns once it is found and cast.
Grid can also deal with a large number of corner case scenarios that may come up in post-SB games, like a wild Kataki or a resolved Gideon Jura with the Gideon of the Trials emblem. It deals with threats like Hierarch more efficiently than Brutality, too.
Grid's functionality may mostly be covered by existing cards in Lantern's mainboard, but nothing comes close to Grid's sheer speed and efficiency. I don't think it is a particularly strong mainboard card, but if you need to deal with a horde of weenies and/or close games quickly to avoid timing out, Grid does an awesome job.
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Speed is a huge factor here. It is very hard to get to 11 mana with Lantern, and that will take tons of time to dig to your lands (or recur them with Shredder if you have milled too many!). Then you have to explain what you are doing to your opponent, and against a savvy opponent will probably have to take all the actions because they will not allow you to shortcut.
For what it's worth, you can just declare a loop (or maybe it's not technically a loop idk) but your opponent is bound to accept that you are doing the same action every turn - I usually just shortcut to updating the life totals on my lifepad and saying go
Just like mindslaver lock isn't technically a loop because even though your opponent will be screwed, they technically have a chance to act (in the case of mindslaver, they can act on your turn) so it's not a "loop".
Speed is a huge factor here. It is very hard to get to 11 mana with Lantern, and that will take tons of time to dig to your lands (or recur them with Shredder if you have milled too many!). Then you have to explain what you are doing to your opponent, and against a savvy opponent will probably have to take all the actions because they will not allow you to shortcut.
For what it's worth, you can just declare a loop (or maybe it's not technically a loop idk) but your opponent is bound to accept that you are doing the same action every turn - I usually just shortcut to updating the life totals on my lifepad and saying go
Your opponent must agree to your declaration of a loop. They have the option of saying "No, play it out please, I want to see you take the actions".
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When we lock the game with ensnaring bridge and are able to control their draw step with mill rocks it becomes a matter of turns and wasted time. What if we could cast paradox engine, manipulate both ours and their top card of the library and then pretty much: draw card off of temple bell that is either 0 or 1 mana, mill cards with the remaining mill rocks - cast the spell in your hand - untap off of paradox engine all of your artifacts including mox opal and whatnot...
It just seems like such an awesome way to speed up matches and essentially just win that turn given the amount of low costing spells we play
Just an idea I've been having to spice the deck up a little since it sounds fun!
EDIT: To add to this, I feel like you would obviously only run one of paradox engine given it's high mana cost but as I was saying, as the game progresses and they are unable to respond to your board, getting to the 6 mana wouldn't be too difficult. Plus the deck is so good at tutoring for artifacts through ancient stirrings/inventor's fair/etc...
http://magic-league.com/tournament/info.php?id=95259&view=decks
i like this build cuz i can run 4 ghost quarters, which often act like sudo lanterns. for shuffling
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spellskites are also for burn and bgx, they also can handle affinity pretty well too.
bontu is for all creature decks. acts like a 5th bridge bettter than most cards ive seen. i was trying flaying tendrils since you can grab it with stirrings, but it doesnt kill enough
mainly these cards are designed to mitigate the loss of white. sun droplets and spellskite try to mimic leyline of sanctity, bontu is in for magus of the mote, lost legacy acts like gaddock teeg, and crucible is a bomb against control decks.
no white means you can easily run 4 ghost quarters which is very useful against some of our worst match ups
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It has also come in handy against the mirror due to being a hedge against both Leyline of Sanctity and Surgical Extraction. Its peek effect says "look at an opponent's hand", so you can get around LoS amd still see what they have going on, nab their most important card, and work around the rest. That really contributed to my win against the mirror earlier yesterday.
This is all anecdotal evidence, but it is more than enough for me to continue testing it. The 2cmc has been more than worth it (and in the case of Chalice, simply better than 1cmc).
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anyways, im glad to see the chatter on spyglass, and it makes sense to me. I was going to use spyglass in eldrazi stompy cause SSG allows it to be played t1, and they ultimately have a chalice on 1 many games, so it fits in well there, but it seems a bit unnecessary in this deck for previously mentioned reasons. slowing the deck down is not good.
random idea partially in line with spyglass talk, has anyone ever trie SSG for speeding the deck up even more?
I have a question about witchbane orb ... as a 4th leyline, that is tutor-able with inventors fair? ... is there a reason people don't do this? for titanshift/burn/ad nauseum maybe? ... or is it just unnecessary?
I also don't know what would be a considerable replacement.. I was thinking of just adding a third collective company in it's place since it has so much utility in it's modes and it's discard outlet to get Ensnaring Bridge to 0. Ultimately, what I'm asking is: Is everyone here going entirely mill or how do you like to win with the deck? Is Pyrite Spellbomb still a thing? lol
Coolness, the price of foils will drop some.
maybe try moving grid to the sideboard? I usually win G1 with mill or concession. I bring grid in for any match that has hierarch, signal pest, stony silence, or kataki. I also consider bringing it in when theres less than ~12 minutes to finish a match and i dont think the opponent will concede to the lock.
Collective brutality + Codex shredder + Academy ruins already provide you with an alternative way to win. It's a bit mana ontensive, but you can drain them to death. The only upside of Grid is that it can ping creatures, but brutality can also deal with small creatures and big ones are handled by the bridge. I don't see any reason to play grid in lantern right now.
The goal of an alt-wincon is to close out games that you need to close out quickly. For example, if you are starting G3 with 10-15 minutes left, or you've lost G1 against a grindy deck and need to win two games in the alloted time now. Brutality loop is way too slow to accomplish this goal, even for Lantern, which is saying a lot.
Grid is a lot faster; all it needs is for you to find it (easier with Tutor) and have some artifacts to fuel it. Late game, it regularly deals 4-7 damage a turn, which is certainly enough to close a game in a few turns once it is found and cast.
Grid can also deal with a large number of corner case scenarios that may come up in post-SB games, like a wild Kataki or a resolved Gideon Jura with the Gideon of the Trials emblem. It deals with threats like Hierarch more efficiently than Brutality, too.
Grid's functionality may mostly be covered by existing cards in Lantern's mainboard, but nothing comes close to Grid's sheer speed and efficiency. I don't think it is a particularly strong mainboard card, but if you need to deal with a horde of weenies and/or close games quickly to avoid timing out, Grid does an awesome job.
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Just like mindslaver lock isn't technically a loop because even though your opponent will be screwed, they technically have a chance to act (in the case of mindslaver, they can act on your turn) so it's not a "loop".
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