MTG Salvation

I really, really wish Just Desserts dealt damage to players so it could **** up all "strictly better" discussions regarding Lightning Strike variants from now until forever.

Alas.

Five-Finger Discount
Looks interesting. More expensive than Control Magic, can't be disenchanted, you have to pay the mana, but you get any ETB-ability it might have, can also target any nonland permanent.

EDIT: Can also just be a super-expensive Unsummon for your own ETB-trigger, if that could ever be relevant.

Seems a bit expensive

It costs probably a full 10 mana at minimum. No thank you

Get that Elite Vanguard for full efficiency

Knight of the Kitchen Sink

WW 2/2 First Strike, Protection from Black Borders

Hello, uncommon True Name Nemesis.

You can't do anything with your wanna-be nemesis either, so it's just an unblockable unkillable 2/2 with first strike it doesn't need. Boring as hell to play with and against and not even that good.

Quote from guitarspider »

You can't do anything with your wanna-be nemesis either, so it's just an unblockable unkillable 2/2 with first strike it doesn't need. Boring as hell to play with and against and not even that good.

An unblockable, almost-unkillable two drop in an aggressively-leaning color is pretty strong. Boring with wonky un-rulings that don't appeal to some/many, that is definitely a real thing, but the power level is undoubtedly there.

The full list of cards Im looking at testing is:

Squirrel Dealer
Knight of the Kitchen Sink
Shellephant
Old Guard
Slaying Mantis
Goblin Haberdasher
More or Less
Crow Storm
Amateur Auteur
Novellamental
Extremely Slow Zombie


While probably only 1-2 cards will make the cut I am excited to test these guys as they should make for fun testings

I am probably adding four cards for now: GO TO JAIL, More or Less, Super-Duper Death Ray, and Proper Laboratory Attire.

I like GO TO JAIL for being a unique effect that, while random, is able to be played around. You cannot get blown out at instant speed by the opponent rolling doubles, and you always get at least one turn where the creature cannot block or attack (unless it has haste). I am kind of thinking about it like Journey to Nowhere with fading 3, since that is a fairly likely case scenario.

Proper Laboratory Attire is probably a better piece of equipment than Vulshok Morningstar, and has extra upside as long as GO TO JAIL is in the cube.

In regards to Super-Duper Death Ray, a this-or-that for the crowd:

PICK THREE- Super-Duper Death Ray, Searing Blood, Flames of the Firebrand, or Volt Charge.
I want to cut Flames for being a sorcery that is also a stronger anti-aggro card than the others and I like my burn being slightly better in aggro decks than midrange or control decks.

I haven't done a gatherer search, but is Super-Duper Death Ray the first 3 mana instant deal 4 at peasant? At least without a drawback? Even if it didn't have trample I think that is still fairly significant.

I'd drop Searing Blood from that list, but only because I'm such a fun of synergy; Volt Charge is the only card that I cube two copies of because I love the proliferate opportunities it presents at instant speed, even if Searing Blood might be the better card in a vacuum. Pumping up your unleash creatures while clearing a blocker is solid for aggro.

Going to test:
Old Guard - Solid card
Crow Storm - Might be too hard to find a deck for, but it looks solid if you're pretty low curve with draw
More or Less - Almost can't imagine it being bad and it has interesting options
Super-Duper Death Ray - Diversifying red removal
Ordinary Pony - Seems equal to Glimmerpoint Stag

If I add contraptions:
Crafty Octopus - A contraption is probably better than a Sleight of Hand
Steady-Handed Mook - Well stated
Wrench-Rigger - Looks insane
Work a Double -

Arms Depot -
Dispatch Dispensary -
Genetic Recombinator -
Gnomeball Machine -
Jamming Device - Discounted Festering March
Widget Contraption -
Optical Optimizer - May be a bit weak
Neural Network - Probably reasonable?

Quote from Squirrely »

I'm still not sure how many silver bordered cards I want in my cube. Cards like Amateur Auteur or Old Guard are only slightly better (if they even are) than what's available in black border Magic. So they improve the cube a bit, but it's also like playing with cards that are less like Magic cards.

A card like Ameteur Auteur doesn't have a silver-bordered effect so I don't really mind including it in my list as if it wasn't. I'm not sure I'll go with some of the watermark or flavor text or longest name stuff. I had Frazzled Editor in my cube at one point and it was just a confusing pain.

I think I want to try
More or Less
Hammer Helper (I don't think it beats out Besmirch or Enthralling Victor in the two slots I'm allocating to threatens)
Extremely Slow Zombie
Old-Fashioned Vampire

Isn't knight of the kitchen sink just broken? There's not a lot of counterplay other than killing your opponents first.

I've been thinking for a while of having mini-expansions for the cube. You could add small circular stickers to each of the expansion cards so they would be easy to separate, and then you can do stuff like multiplayer or un-set themed 15-30 card expansions to mix it up once in a while.

I like the following cards and may try them out:

Blurry Beeble
More or Less
Extremely Slow Zombie
Hammer Helper
Super-Duper Death Ray
Lobe Lobber

Quote from Salmo »

Quote from guitarspider »

You can't do anything with your wanna-be nemesis either, so it's just an unblockable unkillable 2/2 with first strike it doesn't need. Boring as hell to play with and against and not even that good.

An unblockable, almost-unkillable two drop in an aggressively-leaning color is pretty strong. Boring with wonky un-rulings that don't appeal to some/many, that is definitely a real thing, but the power level is undoubtedly there.

It's not bad, but the "shroud" effect makes it signigicantly weaker than Nemesis. We don't have any swords to equip either, unlike powered cube. Even then, compare Invisible Stalker for reasons why this is not a card most people will want in their cube.

Quote from bacchus2 »

I haven't done a gatherer search, but is Super-Duper Death Ray the first 3 mana instant deal 4 at peasant? At least without a drawback? Even if it didn't have trample I think that is still fairly significant.

I'd drop Searing Blood from that list, but only because I'm such a fun of synergy; Volt Charge is the only card that I cube two copies of because I love the proliferate opportunities it presents at instant speed, even if Searing Blood might be the better card in a vacuum. Pumping up your unleash creatures while clearing a blocker is solid for aggro.

It is very similar to Hungry Flames but may be strictly better. The only other card I can think of is Arrows of Justice, however it is restricted to combat.

While it may be worse than True-Name(I would say mostly because it's 1 power less, not the swords), it's still being compared to bloody True-Name Nemesis.

Invisible Stalker is a good example in that it can't be interacted with, which is bad game play. Invisible Stalker is a bad example in that it requires pants, which Knight doesn't need because it's already an Invisible Stalker with a +1/+100 aura on it.

While I don't think it's a card that has a super high 1st pick rate, I think it's hard to argue that it's not the best 2 drop.

Quote from majikian »

The worst thing about it is that it gives you an incentive to cube with white-bordered cards.

Did you see this?

https://twitter.com/CalebDMTG/status/870495954415177730

: )

Coming soon to a knight near you

Does Foil 8th Pyroclasm count?

I think aesthetics mattering is completely justified man. Each cube is created in its owner's image, and the way it is presented and played out is all part of the big picture and the overall cube design.

I haven't even paid attention to the majority of this conversation because I would despise adding these cards due to exactly that... aesthetics.

I have nothing against other people doing it (unless they add Unstable rares hehe), but it is certainly not my cup of tea.

The tokens on the other hand.. SIGN ME UP!

Thought about Extremely Slow Zombie last night and realized I just don't have space for a worse than vanilla 3/3.
I'd forgotten to mention Old-Fashioned Vampire, though a 5/5 flyer is kind of bland.

Does More or Less need to be house-ruled to affect cards that say "draw a card" to be cubable?

Pretty sure that the answer is no.