Picked up the Dr Who precons and I really liked Vrestin, Menoptra Leader, so I have decided to helm a separate deck with them. A go-wide insect tribal in Selesnya colours is appealing to me.
On the green side I think I know what I have/need; plenty of insect creatures, ramp, doubling mechanics, mass trample etc...
The main problem I am facing is I'm not sure what I can add on the white side for this commander or indeed if there are any multicolour cards. I am aware of the few moths, but I'm more interested in what I can add that might synergise with Vrestin with white. A lot of the usual choices for a go-wide token deck focus on other creature types like soldiers, elves, or humans which isn't really that useful for Vrestin.
Happy to get ideas on things to cut and add in general, this is a fully WIP creation at the moment as you may see with filler like Kei Takahashi in the deck list at the moment
And for the types of games Sheldon's referring to, most of the infinites are out of nowhere. The infinities have no synergy with the rest of the deck. They are simply "oopsies" I have the loop. And they're incredibly unsatisfying because the game and board-state never built up for the game to end that way.
This sums up the issue.
If I create a tribal sea monster deck I could include Isochron Scepter & Dramatic Reversal. I won't because it doesn't fit the theme or spirit I am going for, but some players will because they saw on cEDH subreddit a player use them and win on turn 4.
I maintain if combos are ruining your playgroups fun, talk and then switch out one of the combo pieces for an = cmc card and then carry on playing. (E.g from the example above Isochron Scepter gets swapped for Null Rod or Dramatic Reversal is switched for Refocus)
This boils down to Kitchen Table vs Competitive viewpoints, which is an immovable object vs the unstoppable force scenario.
The answer is communication usually.
If this is tricky (flgs game with strangers) I suggest the french vanilla replacement strategy. Say you or your opponent is ending games with out of nowhere infinite combos or playing some longwinded wincon then next game replace the demoralising card in the deck with a french vanilla creature that matches it's colour and casting cost (If an X spell default to 1 cmc)
I say french vanilla but I mean anything in the draft chaff box you usually find in the store (or bring your own replacement if you know it can be a troublesome card). Your deck only has one wincon and it's an infinite combo? (swap out the tutor, or other card that makes it go off efficiently.)
Maybe take out Zombie Master he's kind of lacking in today's environment for maybe Josu Vess, Lich Knight or some other better zombie tribal card. Unless he is there for nostalgia old school style. (I totally understand that.)
Decree of Pain - In my experience this is either not powerful enough early on or too expensive to cast in the late game. Maybe switch for something like Death cloud or a wipe with a body like Reiver Demon
Some possibilities to consider: Vengeful Dead - Seems like an obvious include Necrotic ooze -Not a zombie but makes use of all those things in your graveyard Extract from Darkness - Thematic and fun.
So are we looking at a targeted Bend or Break kind of commander for Boros? Something not too backbreaking but still useful.
Oleb, Territory Smasher
When Oleb, Territory Smasher leaves the battlefield target player separates all nontoken lands they control into two piles. You exile one pile. Draw a card for each land in the remaining pile.
Ulgrotha is an unfortunate case, despite being the home of the Baron Sengir. That portal is all I know that could link it to the modern story, but I think the potential of things coming through the portal FROM Ulgrotha is much more interesting than going back TO Ulgrotha. Maro says that portal connects to an "unnamed plane" when it's more accurate to say that it connects to an "unknown plane," which could be a new plane or a plane we're already familiar with, it was left open-ended.
Since the mending all planar portals and ways to travel different planes (outside of being a planeswalker) stopped working, which is why the Planar Bridge is such a big deal.
Yes but it is entirely possible Sengir and his army went through the Ulgrotha Portal before the Mending.
On the green side I think I know what I have/need; plenty of insect creatures, ramp, doubling mechanics, mass trample etc...
The main problem I am facing is I'm not sure what I can add on the white side for this commander or indeed if there are any multicolour cards. I am aware of the few moths, but I'm more interested in what I can add that might synergise with Vrestin with white. A lot of the usual choices for a go-wide token deck focus on other creature types like soldiers, elves, or humans which isn't really that useful for Vrestin.
Happy to get ideas on things to cut and add in general, this is a fully WIP creation at the moment as you may see with filler like Kei Takahashi in the deck list at the moment
Current WIP Vrestin Decklist -https://www.moxfield.com/decks/Aa1hwC7_Kkyk74CD4YMy4g
Thanks for any and all help.
This sums up the issue.
If I create a tribal sea monster deck I could include Isochron Scepter & Dramatic Reversal. I won't because it doesn't fit the theme or spirit I am going for, but some players will because they saw on cEDH subreddit a player use them and win on turn 4.
I maintain if combos are ruining your playgroups fun, talk and then switch out one of the combo pieces for an = cmc card and then carry on playing. (E.g from the example above Isochron Scepter gets swapped for Null Rod or Dramatic Reversal is switched for Refocus)
The answer is communication usually.
If this is tricky (flgs game with strangers) I suggest the french vanilla replacement strategy. Say you or your opponent is ending games with out of nowhere infinite combos or playing some longwinded wincon then next game replace the demoralising card in the deck with a french vanilla creature that matches it's colour and casting cost (If an X spell default to 1 cmc)
So Laboratory Maniac could become Phantom Warrior or Paradox Engine becomes Mantis Engine.
I say french vanilla but I mean anything in the draft chaff box you usually find in the store (or bring your own replacement if you know it can be a troublesome card). Your deck only has one wincon and it's an infinite combo? (swap out the tutor, or other card that makes it go off efficiently.)
Selesnya is easy mode for an edh deck with vanilla creatures.
Rakdos is the true challenge. I think I'm going to have a brew and then brew a deck idea for a Vanilla Lady Orca Black/Red Deck
e.g
https://deckstats.net/decks/72437/940070-unstable-dice-rolls-urza-/en
Decree of Pain - In my experience this is either not powerful enough early on or too expensive to cast in the late game. Maybe switch for something like Death cloud or a wipe with a body like Reiver Demon
Some possibilities to consider:
Vengeful Dead - Seems like an obvious include
Necrotic ooze -Not a zombie but makes use of all those things in your graveyard
Extract from Darkness - Thematic and fun.
Hope this helps.
Oleb, Territory Smasher
When Oleb, Territory Smasher leaves the battlefield target player separates all nontoken lands they control into two piles. You exile one pile. Draw a card for each land in the remaining pile.
It could work, certainly would be a political.
[[Squirrel Farm]] - Show your true MtG knowledge or die by Squirrel
[[The Cheese Stands Alone]] - Legitimate card reprinted in normal magic as [[Barren Glory]], in cube not terribly useful.
Yes but it is entirely possible Sengir and his army went through the Ulgrotha Portal before the Mending.
Book Devourer: It's weird and amusing
Barrier of Bones: Got to keep the Skeleton tribal going
Lazav, the Multifarious: Seems the most interesting for EDH purposes
Ochran Assassin: Finally lure paired with a basilisk
Doom Whisperer: Great card for my cube.
I did try and make a very casual EDH deck with him you can see it here, but he is terrible.
On the plus side he is a human cleric these days so Cleric Tribal might have a use for him if you want to dip into green.