Hey Cyan, why did the scum kill the only other person who thought I was town?
Hey dC, what's that 6 point ability of yours?
Hey, how believable is a 6 point ability anyways? A 4 point one revived a player as confirmed town and was attached to an item that fed the owner points.
Even though I think UI is scum, I'm at least a little curious about dC answering about the 6 pt ability.
What's the value in UI voting me right now? I mean it's obvious that would seal his fate...
I'm going to get blown up as soon as we hit scum with a lynching vote.
Votes done after a lynching vote usually aren't counted. You can't change your vote during twilight, nor can you add new ones. I think it was fairly apparent that UI was the favourite to be lynched, and he didn't take his auto-kill on you. That leaves the following scenarios:
1) He's townie.
2) He is scum and doesn't care if you're alive or dead. UI/the scum figure that your added analysis isn't worth wasting a chance to have UI talk his way out of a lynch.
3) He is scum and is trying to metagame his way out of this, figuring that someone would raise this exact point. (Or he is having a scumbuddy raise the point for him OMG.)
Votes done after a lynching vote usually aren't counted. You can't change your vote during twilight, nor can you add new ones. I think it was fairly apparent that UI was the favourite to be lynched, and he didn't take his auto-kill on you. That leaves the following scenarios:
1) He's townie.
2) He is scum and doesn't care if you're alive or dead. UI/the scum figure that your added analysis isn't worth wasting a chance to have UI talk his way out of a lynch.
3) He is scum and is trying to metagame his way out of this, figuring that someone would raise this exact point. (Or he is having a scumbuddy raise the point for him OMG.)
So rather than clarify whether a vote for me in twilight would kill me you just make that the cornerstone of an assumption to exonerate someone based on them not killing me.
So rather than clarify whether a vote for me in twilight would kill me you just make that the cornerstone of an assumption to exonerate someone based on them not killing me.
PM sent, but I also noticed that the kill on you is specifically mentioned as a daykill - also not something that would normally be done during twilight.
Note that you claimed to have been caught up at twilight last night, and this topic came up at 5191.
My assumption at that time is the same as it was before you questioned me just now: any vote to kill you would need to be done before the lynching vote, as once that vote is placed we're in twilight. Thus there was no reason for either zind or kpaca to vote you after 5176.
Yesterday's lynch was a different animal due to kpaca ninjaing zindabad. I suppose it could have been argued at the time that (knowing the position he was in) scum kpaca would have voted you before jumping onto zind with all three feet, but I hadn't considered that at the time.
RR's point is a valid point, but to make that play is bad scum play. It gives up absolutely any hope that UI has of getting out of being lynched, and there is no real gain involved. It's safe to assume that, if he IS scum, he has at least one buddy, and they can deal with Rider at their leisure.
My assumption at that time is the same as it was before you questioned me just now: any vote to kill you would need to be done before the lynching vote, as once that vote is placed we're in twilight. Thus there was no reason for either zind or kpaca to vote you after 5176.
Yesterday's lynch was a different animal due to kpaca ninjaing zindabad. I suppose it could have been argued at the time that (knowing the position he was in) scum kpaca would have voted you before jumping onto zind with all three feet, but I hadn't considered that at the time.
SK, can your ability target corpses? I see no reason we can't take a damaged or destroyed item.
Not sure, I'll ask if I can target dead people. I guess I was thinking of destroyed as in vaporized, although I logically, I suppose picking up parts is the same as stealing a whole item.
Votes done after a lynching vote usually aren't counted. You can't change your vote during twilight, nor can you add new ones. I think it was fairly apparent that UI was the favourite to be lynched, and he didn't take his auto-kill on you. That leaves the following scenarios:
1) He's townie.
2) He is scum and doesn't care if you're alive or dead. UI/the scum figure that your added analysis isn't worth wasting a chance to have UI talk his way out of a lynch.
3) He is scum and is trying to metagame his way out of this, figuring that someone would raise this exact point. (Or he is having a scumbuddy raise the point for him OMG.)
If I'm scum, there's really no reason for me to hammer rider here. The advantage of his analysis isn't worth the chance of me squeaking out of this, especially as rider's existence doesn't change the number of mislynches we have.
RR, is there a way to un-ghost Ash? If town is lynched today, we might need to gamble on nobody with access being scum and getting to buy an extra day by giving him the vote back.
That analysis is correct; the scum would probably not blow up rider until it gave them a majority to lynch with, unless they fear rider's analysis.
The owner of the Ghost Pendant as far as I know can bring Ash back. I kind of suspect it's six of one, half a dozen of the other though. If UI is not scum and there's 3 scum left, I can't see DV not being one of them.
I too would like to hear what's so good that it's a 6 point ability and yet dC has AFAIK made no attempt to get to activate said ability.
The owner of the Ghost Pendant as far as I know can bring Ash back. I kind of suspect it's six of one, half a dozen of the other though. If UI is not scum and there's 3 scum left, I can't see DV not being one of them.
It's really unlikely, sure. But it's possible and if there are 2 scum and DV is one of them, an immediate self-vote by kpaca stops the scum from running anybody up. It gives us a chance instead of just losing straight up.
It cost 5 for DYH to use it, it cost 6 for Descoures to use it.
Like I said, there's no reason to believe that dC has to spend more for an ability than DYH. Nothing else in this game's like that and if DYH inherited the ability from dC somehow, it wouldn't make sense for the price to drop.
Are there any other examples of costs of abilities changing between different people who can use them?
Yeah you got me. It was a carefully elaborated ploy between myself and DC to pretend that he has an ability that he actually doesn't(which benefits absolutely no one). Yet somehow, in the apparent copious amount of effort that would be required in such a plan, I failed to notice something like DYH's ability costing 5 points while Descoures claiming that his ability cost 6.
...
Or, conversely, you are desperate scum that knows he is 5 minutes from being lynched, and are trying to squeeze one more mislynch out of the town.
And of course, DV was all too eager to have any reason to not be voting you.
Feel free to find an example of me 'screwing up' in this fashion. Ever. In the entire history of my playing mafia. Good luck.
Or better yet, explain why any of these events would remotely make sense.
To start with, the only way any of it works is if DC and I are both scum. So you figure I started out the day by making up DC having an ability that he actually didn't have(keep in mind that the scum have daytalk in this game, so everything would be carefully orchestrated), him just randomly choosing 6 points for the activation cost(despite that there would be no reason to not choose 5 if we were lying). Only to immediately backdown at the first explanation. What would be the POSSIBLE benefit to something like this? The only logical conclusion would be that I was going to bus him, but this very clearly didn't happen.
You're being ridiculous. DC's ability cost a different amount of points than DYH's, and that's it. It's also worth mentioning that DYH's ability says '1 activation', but DC's says nothing of the sort.
Between Cyan's revote and DV's unvote, I have to believe there was ample opportunity for a town UI to be cliffpushed immediately by the scum (with some plausible deniability, even, in the event that the game does not immediately end in the morning). Unless the remaining scum are Abbey, DV and Cyan... and I just can't see that trio quite together.
Same kind of reasoning as iLord being scum, ultimately.
Hopefully this is right, and at least I'll get "I told you so" out of this whole deal, since I wanted to lynch UI day 1!
Feel free to find an example of me 'screwing up' in this fashion. Ever. In the entire history of my playing mafia. Good luck.
I'm almost certain that good people made those mistakes in Pokemafia. And rider (it was you, right?) in Byzantine miscapitalized his role and almost got lynched for it, except he used the defense of "Yeah right, like I'd go to all this work of making a fakeclaim and then screw up the basics"
Quote from Cyan »
Or better yet, explain why any of these events would remotely make sense.
There are all sorts of defenses. Maybe you thought that him having a less vanilla role would keep him out of the noose. Maybe your rolecop isn't as it appears. I could keep guessing hypotheticals but there's really no point.
I mean the idea of a 6 cost ability when someone has no natural way of getting points is still bogus as all get out. Why, when you get an ability that he kept hidden, is known to be a scum's future ability and he has no way to ever use, would you ask about it and accept his explanation at face value?
Quote from Cyan »
You're being ridiculous. DC's ability cost a different amount of points than DYH's, and that's it. It's also worth mentioning that DYH's ability says '1 activation', but DC's says nothing of the sort.
Not really. I mean, now DYH's copier is supposed to be totally different than his other uninherited abilities at your say-so when it's probably LoL.
Cyan, I was serious when I asked why I went from townie to scum in your eyes.
Between Cyan's revote and DV's unvote, I have to believe there was ample opportunity for a town UI to be cliffpushed immediately by the scum (with some plausible deniability, even, in the event that the game does not immediately end in the morning). Unless the remaining scum are Abbey, DV and Cyan... and I just can't see that trio quite together.
Same kind of reasoning as iLord being scum, ultimately.
How was that the reasoning that made iLord scum? Pretty sure we killed him because of the dilemma between him and RR.
And there's no need that all of Abbey, DV and Cyan be scum for me to not have been speed lynched. If two of them are, or if there are two scum, the mafia wouldn't be willing to throw the game on killing me when it's plain that the town is going to anyways.
Quote from Raf »
Hopefully this is right, and at least I'll get "I told you so" out of this whole deal, since I wanted to lynch UI day 1!
How was that the reasoning that made iLord scum? Pretty sure we killed him because of the dilemma between him and RR.
It was my reasoning on the previous day, which is why I backed iLord's lynch over DYH's. iLord was left hanging at -1 at the original deadline.
And there's no need that all of Abbey, DV and Cyan be scum for me to not have been speed lynched. If two of them are, or if there are two scum, the mafia wouldn't be willing to throw the game on killing me when it's plain that the town is going to anyways.
Even two of them is pushing, at least in that combination. And if there's 3 mafia left, the only scenario in which this conversation matters, then it would have been the game-over move, not really throwing the game....
It was my reasoning on the previous day, which is why I backed iLord's lynch over DYH's. iLord was left hanging at -1 at the original deadline.
Ah. I think that logic's not all that great though; especially when lynching town doesn't lose the game.
Quote from Raf »
Even two of them is pushing, at least in that combination. And if there's 3 mafia left, the only scenario in which this conversation matters, then it would have been the game-over move, not really throwing the game....
Well, unless DV is scum we can blow up the ghost pendant tonight if we lynch town, so it's not impossible for three scum to not have us at LoL.
But if you think that there are three scum, that two of them aren't in {Cyan, Abbey or DV} but that DV is scum and that the scum would ninja any townie and have been around to, then I guess your logic makes me scum.
SK do you want to coordinate the item hunt tonite given that we know how our abilities resolve?
So I assume you're just treating today as done?
---------------------
RANDOM WEIRD STUFF CYAN AND DC HAVE DONE:
This isn't complete and is because I haven't reread and won't be able to until Thursday or more likely Friday at the earliest.
dC:
*Claimed an ability that was entirely usurped by the game rules
*Didn't use it in the one place it could have mattered
*Didn't claim an ability during massclaim
*Claims to have an ability that costs 6 with no way of getting points [Note: I'm pretty sure that nobody else has claimed to have an ability they didn't have the points to use at least once or a built-in way of gaining points.]
*His 6 cost ability is the same as a 5 cost ability the scum have.
*Consistently misinterpreted statements about my role and every time used it as some proof of me lying and string claiming (everything I've claimed about my role was either directly stated or a simple extrapolation of my claim post)
Cyan:
*Tried to take his vote off of DYH with ~3 hours left in the day.
*reversed his stance on me when I became a more likely lynch.
*Three bullet points looks way better than two.
RANDOM WEIRD STUFF CYAN AND DC HAVE DONE:
This isn't complete and is because I haven't reread and won't be able to until Thursday or more likely Friday at the earliest.
dC:
*Claimed an ability that was entirely usurped by the game rules
*Didn't use it in the one place it could have mattered
*Didn't claim an ability during massclaim
*Claims to have an ability that costs 6 with no way of getting points [Note: I'm pretty sure that nobody else has claimed to have an ability they didn't have the points to use at least once or a built-in way of gaining points.]
*His 6 cost ability is the same as a 5 cost ability the scum have.
Yeah, those parts above do all make sense (albeit that Cyan has confirmed the ability part, so Cyan would have to be scum with him to be lying about that, and it seems like a pretty pointless lie). The strongest parts being his failure to report on rider's role and that he appears to have done nothing at all about the 6 point ability.
Hey dC, did you inherit that ability or did you start with it?
unvote now because I might as well get my questioning done first. There's a couple of follow-up questions, I want dC's answer to that one first.
Quote from UI »
Cyan:
*Tried to take his vote off of DYH with ~3 hours left in the day.
I guess that still bugs me. zindabad coming up town, though, tends to make me more confident that DYH used his block as advertised, which makes Cyan much more likely to be town.
SK do you want to coordinate the item hunt tonite given that we know how our abilities resolve?
Nope. I still like the idea of us choosing our own targets in private as it makes the scum guess which of us might be on to them. I'll risk us choosing the same person to mess with their plans.
Nope. I still like the idea of us choosing our own targets in private as it makes the scum guess which of us might be on to them. I'll risk us choosing the same person to mess with their plans.
RR, is there a way to un-ghost Ash? If town is lynched today, we might need to gamble on nobody with access being scum and getting to buy an extra day by giving him the vote back.
As noted by Raf, the current owner of the Pendant (Abbey) can bring him back. I actually don't have that much of a problem with this being done - I more wanted to get the one use of the Pendant out of the way than get Ash RFG'd. It might turn out to be a good thing to bring him back in - one more way to roll the dice if he's townie-only, or the ability to disable his double-vote if scum have access and get their hands on the Pendant.
@Kraj: I don't think that anyone alive has any points. If they do, they're not admitting to it. I don't have any.
@UI: Actually, I started to express suspicion of you toward the end of D3, then again at the start of Day 4. Long before anyone else did(except possibly AG, but he can hardly be considered as actually trying to get you lynched) I backed off of it for awhile, then decided that I was right in the first place. Nice misrep, though.
@UI: Actually, I started to express suspicion of you toward the end of D3, then again at the start of Day 4. Long before anyone else did(except possibly AG, but he can hardly be considered as actually trying to get you lynched) I backed off of it for awhile, then decided that I was right in the first place. Nice misrep, though.
I don't remember it exactly and don't have time to check this (I will do it later this week or over the weekend though), but late day 3 a lot of people were going "Hey, maybe ewie is lurking scum" and you were in among those, and then for most of day 4 you were calling me town until near the end when I became scum in your eyes again.
Did I miss where we decided we won't/can't use RobRoy's ability today?
Yeah, we asked around and no-one is claiming to have any points. Seppel would have got the high-poster point at the end of yesterday but he's dead. Cyan will get it at the end of today. There seems to be a bit of a lack of opportunity in this game to generate points for the town.
Bad example. Tilde's paranoia ran him afoul with DYH, but he was right about the rest of the living scum. If my instincts have the same results here as Tilde's did in Persona, I'll be a happy man.
Kraj
P.S. I'd love to hear why you think you and Cyan are such an unlikely scum group.
...don't be obtuse. You know I'm talking about his ridiculous attempt to characterize DYH and Pale Mage as scumbuddies, when they were, in fact, the least likely combination of possible mafia in the entire game.
For that matter, the only one of the 'rest of the living scum' he was right about was you. Wuffles was so obvscum it hurt, he never said anything about significant about andelijah or MMoD, and he even went along with Guardman's lynch while saying he thought it was the wrong thing to do. Nice 'instincts'. Your 'facts' about Persona are just as wrong as your 'facts' in this game.
As for me and Cyan... really? Linking himself to me so ridiculously thoroughly? Exposing my additional ability for no reason? Arguing with me constantly over zindabad?
We'd have to be the worst scum players in existence to both be scum. Especially since, between me with iLord and him with DYH, we must have been bussing half our scum team almost literally to death.
As I've claimed from the beginning, my ability lets me pick a number and get back the active aspect of the person connected to that number. Since I have no information that links numbers to people, it's essentially random. However, because I can safely assume that a number corresponds to a person, if I pick the same number, I get the same person. Whatashock!
This is consistent with your original claim, now that I look at it. But at some point didn't you say something about 'targeting zindabad' and 'targeting Cyan'? You seemed to know who you were targeting at those points, not just a number.
You aren't thinking, and you aren't trying to find scum. You're trying to misunderstand me and play every instance of you not getting it as me being lying scum. vote: desCoures
I expect two, but three left is a fairly reasonable guess, and pessimism can't hurt right now.
Way to try and deflect attention with a Kraj barn. Or is it because I seem like a relatively easy target? Just like Seppel, and zindabad after RafK and I did all the work?
As for the other question, I asked because I can't really see any combination of three that would be likely scum together behaviourally. It's a possibility, I suppose, but then they're doing a damned good job hiding the links...
Hey Cyan, why did the scum kill the only other person who thought I was town?
Hey dC, what's that 6 point ability of yours?
Hey, how believable is a 6 point ability anyways? A 4 point one revived a player as confirmed town and was attached to an item that fed the owner points.
You mean Seppel? The person you were after most of yesterday? The person who, frankly, flipped his opinion so often he seemed like a pancake chef?
I swear you're typing flustered in the above...
And now here's your list of 'weird stuff', half of which is blatant mod-gaming...
RANDOM WEIRD STUFF CYAN AND DC HAVE DONE:
This isn't complete and is because I haven't reread and won't be able to until Thursday or more likely Friday at the earliest.
dC:
*Claimed an ability that was entirely usurped by the game rules
Pure mod-gaming, and only usurped by player action. Fail.
*Claims to have an ability that costs 6 with no way of getting points [Note: I'm pretty sure that nobody else has claimed to have an ability they didn't have the points to use at least once or a built-in way of gaining points.]
RobRoy. Fail.
EDIT: Ah, nice attempt to give yourself an out with the 'didn't have the points to use at least once'. So you're blatantly ignoring the fact that I have a (useless) ability that I can use as many times as I want, because it doesn't cost points?
*Consistently misinterpreted statements about my role and every time used it as some proof of me lying and string claiming (everything I've claimed about my role was either directly stated or a simple extrapolation of my claim post)
Nice attempt at defence-disguised-as-offence. I'll admit to forgetting your original claim post, but I'm pretty certain you've made statements since then that confused the issue.
Yeah, those parts above do all make sense (albeit that Cyan has confirmed the ability part, so Cyan would have to be scum with him to be lying about that, and it seems like a pretty pointless lie). The strongest parts being his failure to report on rider's role and that he appears to have done nothing at all about the 6 point ability.
Hey dC, did you inherit that ability or did you start with it?
? Inherited. Middle of day 2, after Axelrod died. I started vanilla, as a matter of fact. -_-
As for rider's role, as I mentioned previously, I simply forgot about him. As for the other point... given where I was in the post count, what did you expect me to do about the 6 point ability? Especially when it has the same restrictions that DYH's version had (no kill-related, vote-related, RB-related, etc.), making it essentially a really gimped backup?
I was fairly certain all the rest of you had far better uses for points than I did, and still am.
Private Mod Note
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Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Esper Simperer; Even the court homonculi need someone to look down on.
Jund Fangirl; Few things can describe the bliss of the fangirl's cries fading to silence (broken by occasional munching sounds).
Grixis Emo; 'Why should I go out there? They're all uncaring zombies! *sniff* No one understands me...' Bant Wageslave; Behind every successful knight is a corporate drudge doing his taxwork.
Naya Overenthusiast; Because there is such a thing as too much enthusiasm.
This is consistent with your original claim, now that I look at it. But at some point didn't you say something about 'targeting zindabad' and 'targeting Cyan'? You seemed to know who you were targeting at those points, not just a number.
Once I knew the number that corresponded to zindabad, I could talk about targeting him. I also talked about targeting people the multiple times I proved that I can get roles without targeting people and today when I talked about how I could have made up fake results.
Quote from dC »
Way to try and deflect attention with a Kraj barn. Or is it because I seem like a relatively easy target? Just like Seppel, and zindabad after RafK and I did all the work?
What? Where the hell did barning Ash come from? This is just ludicrous.
Quote from dC »
As for the other question, I asked because I can't really see any combination of three that would be likely scum together behaviourally. It's a possibility, I suppose, but then they're doing a damned good job hiding the links...
What do we gain by acting like only two scum are left? What we lose is potentially the game, so I'd like for there to be a decently-sized upside.
Quote from dC »
You mean Seppel? The person you were after most of yesterday? The person who, frankly, flipped his opinion so often he seemed like a pancake chef?
I swear you're typing flustered in the above...
Yeah, that Seppel. I thought he was scum, but I highly doubt that the mafia took "ewie thinks Seppel is scum" into their consideration, unless they really wanted to make me look like a fool today. (Hint: they didn't)
And if you're trying to push for one more mislynch why wouldn't you kill the guy with a lot of sway in the town who very well might save the person you want to be going after?
Quote from dC »
And now here's your list of 'weird stuff', half of which is blatant mod-gaming...
No, it's analysis of claims. But no matter what you want to call it doesn't change its validity.
Quote from dC »
Pure mod-gaming, and only usurped by player action. Fail.
It is a reasonable argument to make. Your ability having zero use as long as the town performs what was probably the only obvious action this game is unique among all the people in this game.
Quote from dC »
What are you on about here? If you're talking about rider, I quite literally forgot about him.
That's not impossible, but it gives the town as a whole no way to confirm your ability. Also in the months since rider's death I'm surprised that you never tried to look up the roles people had and get stonewalled by rider.
Quote from dC »
I don't recall that we ever came to a consensus on a massclaim. Some people wanted one, some people claimed. Fail.
Where some people who claimed are the ones who hadn't and people were telling you to claim. I mean, not fully claiming after the town yelled at you multiple times to actually claim what your abilities are isn't less suspicious or anything, but I can replace this contention with that.
Quote from dC »
RobRoy. Fail.
EDIT: Ah, nice attempt to give yourself an out with the 'didn't have the points to use at least once'. So you're blatantly ignoring the fact that I have a (useless) ability that I can use as many times as I want, because it doesn't cost points?
Yup. Because Arim had an ability that didn't cost points but got a couple points to use the one that did. And Raf too, if I'm remembering correctly. I mean, Arim, RR, Ash, Cubus and I think raf all had abilities that cost points and just enough points to use them instead of a point generator.
Hey, how does the flavor between "I look at dead people" and "I can gain any role from any game that Az has modded" sync up?
Quote from dC »
Mod-gaming, and wrong anyway. (See above)
Your ability costs 6. DYH's ability costs 5. This is a suspicious thing.
Quote from dC »
Nice attempt at defence-disguised-as-offence. I'll admit to forgetting your original claim post, but I'm pretty certain you've made statements since then that confused the issue.
Well, you're the only one who kept on getting confused and you're the only one who, when he didn't understand how my ability works, jumped into the thread with an "AHA! I CAUGHT YOU NOW!"
What? Where the hell did barning Ash come from? This is just ludicrous.
No, that's precisely what you did. I've been poking at DC for multiple game days; I agree with him that's it hard to see your attack on him as anything other than trying to use my townie cred to save yourself. I don't see much of a reason not to lynch you today.
As for me and Cyan... really? Linking himself to me so ridiculously thoroughly? Exposing my additional ability for no reason? Arguing with me constantly over zindabad?
See, just when I'm feeling good about lynching UI you have to go and do that. This is the exact defense I'd expect from you as a scum pair. These are all things I actually find suspicious. It's also rather interesting that all these reasons are behaviors Cyan has had towards you; you, notably, have had practically nothing to say about Cyan all game.
* Ash LV-426 curses kpaca.
It would have been really nice to lock Raf into another vig tonight.
Kraj
Private Mod Note
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Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
We were in Inheritance Mafia. People thought we were CropCircles. We can die happy now.
No! We are upset that people are so unfamiliar with Crop Circles awesomeness that they thought we were him. We die angry
Oh get a room.
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This means I'm horny.
ITS A ZOMBIE! ......oh wait, it's just Tyler Hansbrough.
Elvis! Elvis! Let me be! Keep that pelvis faaaaar from me!
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Even though I think UI is scum, I'm at least a little curious about dC answering about the 6 pt ability.
What's the value in UI voting me right now? I mean it's obvious that would seal his fate...
I'm going to get blown up as soon as we hit scum with a lynching vote.
Votes done after a lynching vote usually aren't counted. You can't change your vote during twilight, nor can you add new ones. I think it was fairly apparent that UI was the favourite to be lynched, and he didn't take his auto-kill on you. That leaves the following scenarios:
1) He's townie.
2) He is scum and doesn't care if you're alive or dead. UI/the scum figure that your added analysis isn't worth wasting a chance to have UI talk his way out of a lynch.
3) He is scum and is trying to metagame his way out of this, figuring that someone would raise this exact point. (Or he is having a scumbuddy raise the point for him OMG.)
So rather than clarify whether a vote for me in twilight would kill me you just make that the cornerstone of an assumption to exonerate someone based on them not killing me.
Seems pretty bad to me.
Valid point. PMing the mod now.
PM sent, but I also noticed that the kill on you is specifically mentioned as a daykill - also not something that would normally be done during twilight.
My assumption at that time is the same as it was before you questioned me just now: any vote to kill you would need to be done before the lynching vote, as once that vote is placed we're in twilight. Thus there was no reason for either zind or kpaca to vote you after 5176.
Yesterday's lynch was a different animal due to kpaca ninjaing zindabad. I suppose it could have been argued at the time that (knowing the position he was in) scum kpaca would have voted you before jumping onto zind with all three feet, but I hadn't considered that at the time.
Seems an awfully obvious thing not to consider.
Not sure, I'll ask if I can target dead people. I guess I was thinking of destroyed as in vaporized, although I logically, I suppose picking up parts is the same as stealing a whole item.
If I'm scum, there's really no reason for me to hammer rider here. The advantage of his analysis isn't worth the chance of me squeaking out of this, especially as rider's existence doesn't change the number of mislynches we have.
RR, is there a way to un-ghost Ash? If town is lynched today, we might need to gamble on nobody with access being scum and getting to buy an extra day by giving him the vote back.
The owner of the Ghost Pendant as far as I know can bring Ash back. I kind of suspect it's six of one, half a dozen of the other though. If UI is not scum and there's 3 scum left, I can't see DV not being one of them.
I too would like to hear what's so good that it's a 6 point ability and yet dC has AFAIK made no attempt to get to activate said ability.
It's really unlikely, sure. But it's possible and if there are 2 scum and DV is one of them, an immediate self-vote by kpaca stops the scum from running anybody up. It gives us a chance instead of just losing straight up.
Copier costs 5, not 6. BAM MR MAN
And no, abilities having different costs for different people is unbelievable.
Cyan explain this right now.
It cost 5 for DYH to use it, it cost 6 for Descoures to use it.
Like I said, there's no reason to believe that dC has to spend more for an ability than DYH. Nothing else in this game's like that and if DYH inherited the ability from dC somehow, it wouldn't make sense for the price to drop.
Are there any other examples of costs of abilities changing between different people who can use them?
...
Or, conversely, you are desperate scum that knows he is 5 minutes from being lynched, and are trying to squeeze one more mislynch out of the town.
And of course, DV was all too eager to have any reason to not be voting you.
Or better yet, explain why any of these events would remotely make sense.
To start with, the only way any of it works is if DC and I are both scum. So you figure I started out the day by making up DC having an ability that he actually didn't have(keep in mind that the scum have daytalk in this game, so everything would be carefully orchestrated), him just randomly choosing 6 points for the activation cost(despite that there would be no reason to not choose 5 if we were lying). Only to immediately backdown at the first explanation. What would be the POSSIBLE benefit to something like this? The only logical conclusion would be that I was going to bus him, but this very clearly didn't happen.
You're being ridiculous. DC's ability cost a different amount of points than DYH's, and that's it. It's also worth mentioning that DYH's ability says '1 activation', but DC's says nothing of the sort.
Same kind of reasoning as iLord being scum, ultimately.
Hopefully this is right, and at least I'll get "I told you so" out of this whole deal, since I wanted to lynch UI day 1!
vote UI
Now to just wait for DV to revote.
There are all sorts of defenses. Maybe you thought that him having a less vanilla role would keep him out of the noose. Maybe your rolecop isn't as it appears. I could keep guessing hypotheticals but there's really no point.
I mean the idea of a 6 cost ability when someone has no natural way of getting points is still bogus as all get out. Why, when you get an ability that he kept hidden, is known to be a scum's future ability and he has no way to ever use, would you ask about it and accept his explanation at face value?
Not really. I mean, now DYH's copier is supposed to be totally different than his other uninherited abilities at your say-so when it's probably LoL.
Cyan, I was serious when I asked why I went from townie to scum in your eyes.
And there's no need that all of Abbey, DV and Cyan be scum for me to not have been speed lynched. If two of them are, or if there are two scum, the mafia wouldn't be willing to throw the game on killing me when it's plain that the town is going to anyways.
Ah, but what if it is I who has told YOU so?!
There I revoted where my suspicions lie. I don't like the way that you are now posting.
It was my reasoning on the previous day, which is why I backed iLord's lynch over DYH's. iLord was left hanging at -1 at the original deadline.
Even two of them is pushing, at least in that combination. And if there's 3 mafia left, the only scenario in which this conversation matters, then it would have been the game-over move, not really throwing the game....
Well, unless DV is scum we can blow up the ghost pendant tonight if we lynch town, so it's not impossible for three scum to not have us at LoL.
But if you think that there are three scum, that two of them aren't in {Cyan, Abbey or DV} but that DV is scum and that the scum would ninja any townie and have been around to, then I guess your logic makes me scum.
So I assume you're just treating today as done?
---------------------
RANDOM WEIRD STUFF CYAN AND DC HAVE DONE:
This isn't complete and is because I haven't reread and won't be able to until Thursday or more likely Friday at the earliest.
dC:
*Claimed an ability that was entirely usurped by the game rules
*Didn't use it in the one place it could have mattered
*Didn't claim an ability during massclaim
*Claims to have an ability that costs 6 with no way of getting points [Note: I'm pretty sure that nobody else has claimed to have an ability they didn't have the points to use at least once or a built-in way of gaining points.]
*His 6 cost ability is the same as a 5 cost ability the scum have.
*Consistently misinterpreted statements about my role and every time used it as some proof of me lying and string claiming (everything I've claimed about my role was either directly stated or a simple extrapolation of my claim post)
Cyan:
*Tried to take his vote off of DYH with ~3 hours left in the day.
*reversed his stance on me when I became a more likely lynch.
*Three bullet points looks way better than two.
Yeah, those parts above do all make sense (albeit that Cyan has confirmed the ability part, so Cyan would have to be scum with him to be lying about that, and it seems like a pretty pointless lie). The strongest parts being his failure to report on rider's role and that he appears to have done nothing at all about the 6 point ability.
Hey dC, did you inherit that ability or did you start with it?
unvote now because I might as well get my questioning done first. There's a couple of follow-up questions, I want dC's answer to that one first.
I guess that still bugs me. zindabad coming up town, though, tends to make me more confident that DYH used his block as advertised, which makes Cyan much more likely to be town.
Nope. I still like the idea of us choosing our own targets in private as it makes the scum guess which of us might be on to them. I'll risk us choosing the same person to mess with their plans.
Is every living player claiming to have zero points? Did everyone just forget about turning point sharing on so we could get a second lynch today?
Kraj
No! We are upset that people are so unfamiliar with Crop Circles awesomeness that they thought we were him. We die angry
Oh get a room.
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ITS A ZOMBIE! ......oh wait, it's just Tyler Hansbrough.
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Just visiting.
Understood. Fair enough on that one.
THUNDERCATS ARE ON THE LOOSE!
THUNDER, THUNDER, THUNDERCATS!
As noted by Raf, the current owner of the Pendant (Abbey) can bring him back. I actually don't have that much of a problem with this being done - I more wanted to get the one use of the Pendant out of the way than get Ash RFG'd. It might turn out to be a good thing to bring him back in - one more way to roll the dice if he's townie-only, or the ability to disable his double-vote if scum have access and get their hands on the Pendant.
You can see the full text of the Pendant on Axelrod's death scene, btw.
Not necessarily true, depending on how you count me.
@UI: Actually, I started to express suspicion of you toward the end of D3, then again at the start of Day 4. Long before anyone else did(except possibly AG, but he can hardly be considered as actually trying to get you lynched) I backed off of it for awhile, then decided that I was right in the first place. Nice misrep, though.
I don't remember it exactly and don't have time to check this (I will do it later this week or over the weekend though), but late day 3 a lot of people were going "Hey, maybe ewie is lurking scum" and you were in among those, and then for most of day 4 you were calling me town until near the end when I became scum in your eyes again.
*adhoms the **** outta u*
Yeah, we asked around and no-one is claiming to have any points. Seppel would have got the high-poster point at the end of yesterday but he's dead. Cyan will get it at the end of today. There seems to be a bit of a lack of opportunity in this game to generate points for the town.
What, no. That's a terrible idea. Don't do that. Kill dC instead.
Not quite right, Cyan. Read the PM again. My version of Copier is permanent and irreversible.
@Ash-Kraj
...don't be obtuse. You know I'm talking about his ridiculous attempt to characterize DYH and Pale Mage as scumbuddies, when they were, in fact, the least likely combination of possible mafia in the entire game.
For that matter, the only one of the 'rest of the living scum' he was right about was you. Wuffles was so obvscum it hurt, he never said anything about significant about andelijah or MMoD, and he even went along with Guardman's lynch while saying he thought it was the wrong thing to do. Nice 'instincts'. Your 'facts' about Persona are just as wrong as your 'facts' in this game.
As for me and Cyan... really? Linking himself to me so ridiculously thoroughly? Exposing my additional ability for no reason? Arguing with me constantly over zindabad?
We'd have to be the worst scum players in existence to both be scum. Especially since, between me with iLord and him with DYH, we must have been bussing half our scum team almost literally to death.
@Uncle Istvun
This is consistent with your original claim, now that I look at it. But at some point didn't you say something about 'targeting zindabad' and 'targeting Cyan'? You seemed to know who you were targeting at those points, not just a number.
Way to try and deflect attention with a Kraj barn. Or is it because I seem like a relatively easy target? Just like Seppel, and zindabad after RafK and I did all the work?
As for the other question, I asked because I can't really see any combination of three that would be likely scum together behaviourally. It's a possibility, I suppose, but then they're doing a damned good job hiding the links...
You mean Seppel? The person you were after most of yesterday? The person who, frankly, flipped his opinion so often he seemed like a pancake chef?
I swear you're typing flustered in the above...
And now here's your list of 'weird stuff', half of which is blatant mod-gaming...
Pure mod-gaming, and only usurped by player action. Fail.
What are you on about here? If you're talking about rider, I quite literally forgot about him.
I don't recall that we ever came to a consensus on a massclaim. Some people wanted one, some people claimed. Fail.
RobRoy. Fail.
EDIT: Ah, nice attempt to give yourself an out with the 'didn't have the points to use at least once'. So you're blatantly ignoring the fact that I have a (useless) ability that I can use as many times as I want, because it doesn't cost points?
Mod-gaming, and wrong anyway. (See above)
Nice attempt at defence-disguised-as-offence. I'll admit to forgetting your original claim post, but I'm pretty certain you've made statements since then that confused the issue.
@RafaelK
? Inherited. Middle of day 2, after Axelrod died. I started vanilla, as a matter of fact. -_-
As for rider's role, as I mentioned previously, I simply forgot about him. As for the other point... given where I was in the post count, what did you expect me to do about the 6 point ability? Especially when it has the same restrictions that DYH's version had (no kill-related, vote-related, RB-related, etc.), making it essentially a really gimped backup?
I was fairly certain all the rest of you had far better uses for points than I did, and still am.
Jund Fangirl; Few things can describe the bliss of the fangirl's cries fading to silence (broken by occasional munching sounds).
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Bant Wageslave; Behind every successful knight is a corporate drudge doing his taxwork.
Naya Overenthusiast; Because there is such a thing as too much enthusiasm.
We should have killed him yesterday.
What? Where the hell did barning Ash come from? This is just ludicrous.
What do we gain by acting like only two scum are left? What we lose is potentially the game, so I'd like for there to be a decently-sized upside.
Yeah, that Seppel. I thought he was scum, but I highly doubt that the mafia took "ewie thinks Seppel is scum" into their consideration, unless they really wanted to make me look like a fool today. (Hint: they didn't)
And if you're trying to push for one more mislynch why wouldn't you kill the guy with a lot of sway in the town who very well might save the person you want to be going after?
No, it's analysis of claims. But no matter what you want to call it doesn't change its validity.
It is a reasonable argument to make. Your ability having zero use as long as the town performs what was probably the only obvious action this game is unique among all the people in this game.
That's not impossible, but it gives the town as a whole no way to confirm your ability. Also in the months since rider's death I'm surprised that you never tried to look up the roles people had and get stonewalled by rider.
Where some people who claimed are the ones who hadn't and people were telling you to claim. I mean, not fully claiming after the town yelled at you multiple times to actually claim what your abilities are isn't less suspicious or anything, but I can replace this contention with that.
Yup. Because Arim had an ability that didn't cost points but got a couple points to use the one that did. And Raf too, if I'm remembering correctly. I mean, Arim, RR, Ash, Cubus and I think raf all had abilities that cost points and just enough points to use them instead of a point generator.
Hey, how does the flavor between "I look at dead people" and "I can gain any role from any game that Az has modded" sync up?
Your ability costs 6. DYH's ability costs 5. This is a suspicious thing.
Well, you're the only one who kept on getting confused and you're the only one who, when he didn't understand how my ability works, jumped into the thread with an "AHA! I CAUGHT YOU NOW!"
Mmmm, why do you think I said that yesterday? Maybe because I thought of this yesterday?
UI was on my very first suspicious list. I found some of his defenses persuasive yesterday, but his play has just been lousy.
No, that's precisely what you did. I've been poking at DC for multiple game days; I agree with him that's it hard to see your attack on him as anything other than trying to use my townie cred to save yourself. I don't see much of a reason not to lynch you today.
See, just when I'm feeling good about lynching UI you have to go and do that. This is the exact defense I'd expect from you as a scum pair. These are all things I actually find suspicious. It's also rather interesting that all these reasons are behaviors Cyan has had towards you; you, notably, have had practically nothing to say about Cyan all game.
* Ash LV-426 curses kpaca.
It would have been really nice to lock Raf into another vig tonight.
Kraj
No! We are upset that people are so unfamiliar with Crop Circles awesomeness that they thought we were him. We die angry
Oh get a room.
о дерьмо | i can has cheezburger?
This means I'm horny.
ITS A ZOMBIE! ......oh wait, it's just Tyler Hansbrough.
Elvis! Elvis! Let me be! Keep that pelvis faaaaar from me!
Just visiting.