1. The community will be the same as LoL, 99% of them are trolls.
2. Its for Valve, no new mechanics, no new interesting champion designs.
3. The gameplay is gonna be still the same, I have been played original Dota for years with my friend, now we all transferred to LoL, I don't want to do it again.
4. This game wont be that much hardcore anymore, the new system will make the game easier and drags more player and become "noob friendly"
I didn't mean every hero, but it seems like most heroes either are boring or have some strange complexity that makes them a ***** to play as.
You went from "all heroes boring" to "all heroes seem boring." Huge difference. I think your fanboyism is clouding your judgment.
They don't. They really don't.
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"If you're Havengul problems I feel bad for you son, I got 99 problems and a Lich ain't one." - FSM
"In a world where money talks, silence is horrifying."
You went from "all heroes boring" to "all heroes seem boring." Huge difference. I think your fanboyism is clouding your judgment.
They don't. They really don't.
Well every hero I played as except Skeleton King was either boring or frustrating to play as. Therefore I never found another hero that I said, oh I enjoy playing as such and such. It's not fanboyism as much as I didn't enjoy playing as them, and while I didn't try everyone of them I did try a good number of them. Enough that I can say that I couldn't find another hero I truly enjoyed.
Well every hero I played as except Skeleton King was either boring or frustrating to play as. Therefore I never found another hero that I said, oh I enjoy playing as such and such. It's not fanboyism as much as I didn't enjoy playing as them, and while I didn't try everyone of them I did try a good number of them. Enough that I can say that I couldn't find another hero I truly enjoyed.
Or maybe you just didn't know what you were doing because DotA is an extremely punishing game in ways that Riot intentionally left behind. You're setting your standards for DotA in terms of Lol instead of analyzing it according to its own goals (A.K.A. fanboyism). There's a difference between how much you enjoy a game and how well it was made, even if the two often overlap.
I just played a couple games earlier... 95% of the terrain is grey, green, and alternate colors with gray and green blended in... maybe before you complain about the graphics of a game you should take into account your personal handicaps.
"If you're Havengul problems I feel bad for you son, I got 99 problems and a Lich ain't one." - FSM
"In a world where money talks, silence is horrifying."
Or maybe you just didn't know what you were doing because DotA is an extremely punishing game in ways that Riot intentionally left behind. You're setting your standards for DotA in terms of Lol instead of analyzing it according to its own goals (A.K.A. fanboyism). There's a difference between how much you enjoy a game and how well it was made, even if the two often overlap.
A well made game that isn't enjoyed isn't well made.
As for Dota there are a ton of interface and usability problems that I've gone over in this thread that seriously reduce the ability to enjoy the game. Also a game should be interpreted via my goals, not the games goals. The first rule of design is you don't design the game for yourself, but for the people who will play it.
Basically if I have to twist my decisions and how I think things should work for a game, that usually means that unless there is a specific reason for doing so, the game has some design problems. Everytime I used the shop or even tried matchmaking or use smartcasting (well tried) I had to jump through hoops, half the time which did nothing. Now I can accept some of this is Beta, but a lot of the problems, such as shop usability, seem like things they are unwilling to fix as they just for the most part transferred it from Dota 1 from what people have been telling me. This speaks to me that instead of trying to find out if this was the best way to make the shop that they would rather just import something poorly designed and lacking usability.
I just played a couple games earlier... 95% of the terrain is grey, green, and alternate colors with gray and green blended in... maybe before you complain about the graphics of a game you should take into account your personal handicaps.
I admit I have that handycap, but this isn't a complaint I've heard just myself. I've had other friends who have tried the trial or seen videos of people playing it and they all agree it can be difficult to tell what is what while playing.
A well made game that isn't enjoyed isn't well made.
If a task, program, system, etc. accomplishes its goals, then it's well made. If you don't enjoy it, that's another thing. The two generally overlap for games but that doesn't make them synonymous.
Also a game should be interpreted via my goals, not the games goals. The first rule of design is you don't design the game for yourself, but for the people who will play it.
Absolutely, but perhaps Valve and Icefrog aren't trying to appeal to you, but to another niche of gamers. The enjoyability you get out of a game should be according to your tastes; to say it's a poorly made game is an objective statement that has nothing to do with taste but with the standards set by the developers and the audience they're trying to target. I think SC: Brood War was a well made game, but you'll never find me playing it.
Basically if I have to twist my decisions and how I think things should work for a game, that usually means that unless there is a specific reason for doing so, the game has some design problems. Everytime I used the shop or even tried matchmaking or use smartcasting (well tried) I had to jump through hoops, half the time which did nothing. Now I can accept some of this is Beta, but a lot of the problems, such as shop usability, seem like things they are unwilling to fix as they just for the most part transferred it from Dota 1 from what people have been telling me. This speaks to me that instead of trying to find out if this was the best way to make the shop that they would rather just import something poorly designed and lacking usability.
The game design doesn't have problems if you don't like it, it has problems if it conflicts with the game itself. So saying that the shop is poorly set up is a fine complaint, but you have to explain why in order for it to be an objective argument against the game's flaws. Is it too complicated, are there too many pages, is the sorting system unclear, etc.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to invalidate your opinions, but stating that a game is poorly made because it doesn't do exactly what you want it to is silly.
I admit I have that handycap, but this isn't a complaint I've heard just myself. I've had other friends who have tried the trial or seen videos of people playing it and they all agree it can be difficult to tell what is what while playing.
You're the first person I've heard complain about this.
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"If you're Havengul problems I feel bad for you son, I got 99 problems and a Lich ain't one." - FSM
"In a world where money talks, silence is horrifying."
So I just had some douchebag Ezalor act useless the entire game, trash talk, and then buy a blink dagger and teleport me to an inaccessible location and then blink out, and then on top of that set up a votekick against me when I was trying to votekick him.
I change my mind. **** DOTA. If you want to play a game of DotA, next time you're at work tape a giant picture of a middle finger and attach it to your computer screen and stare at it during the duration of your lunch break. That's what a game of DotA's like, except the difference is you won't have wasted as much of your life as if you played it.
I'm pissed off...
Guardman: I don't see the problems you're seeing in terms of design. I think Icefrog especially has done a fantastic job with things. The community SUCKS BALLS, but that's not a fault of the game itself.
So I just had some douchebag Ezalor act useless the entire game, trash talk, and then buy a blink dagger and teleport me to an inaccessible location and then blink out, and then on top of that set up a votekick against me when I was trying to votekick him.
I change my mind. **** DOTA. If you want to play a game of DotA, next time you're at work tape a giant picture of a middle finger and attach it to your computer screen and stare at it during the duration of your lunch break. That's what a game of DotA's like, except the difference is you won't have wasted as much of your life as if you played it.
I'm pissed off...
Guardman: I don't see the problems you're seeing in terms of design. I think Icefrog especially has done a fantastic job with things. The community SUCKS BALLS, but that's not a fault of the game itself.
ha, DOTA community has always been hostile. That's never going to change considering the mechanics of the game.
ha, DOTA community has always been hostile. That's never going to change considering the mechanics of the game.
Yeah, I've often compared DotA to Counterstrike as the worst and best games, respectively, when taking into account the nature of the online community.
So I just had some douchebag Ezalor act useless the entire game, trash talk, and then buy a blink dagger and teleport me to an inaccessible location and then blink out, and then on top of that set up a votekick against me when I was trying to votekick him.
I change my mind. **** DOTA. If you want to play a game of DotA, next time you're at work tape a giant picture of a middle finger and attach it to your computer screen and stare at it during the duration of your lunch break. That's what a game of DotA's like, except the difference is you won't have wasted as much of your life as if you played it.
I'm pissed off...
Guardman: I don't see the problems you're seeing in terms of design. I think Icefrog especially has done a fantastic job with things. The community SUCKS BALLS, but that's not a fault of the game itself.
If you don't have friends who want to play and you aren't a masochist, don't bother.
"If you're Havengul problems I feel bad for you son, I got 99 problems and a Lich ain't one." - FSM
"In a world where money talks, silence is horrifying."
I have played Dota, Dota 2, LoL and HoN. Out of all 4 my preference lies towards HoN, the game is much faster paced and the graphics are streamlined. Unfortunately, the community isn't exactly the kindest, definitely not a noob friendly game.
I just had a 'rousing discussion' about dota2 with someone, and I must say that I doubt I'll desire to play it anytime soon.
Because he was bragging that you could do **** like what Highroller was complaining about and used it as an example of why dota2 is better than LoL.
Yeah, I think I'll pass.
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Even if the author is silenced, the performance is stopped, the story will not end.
Whether it's a comedy or a tragedy, if there is cheering, the story will continue on.
Just like the many lives.
For the us who are still in it and still in the journey, send warm blessings.
- We will continue to walk down this path until eternity.
I wont lie, even over here LoL has a bad community, HoN has a toxic community but neither of those compare to the degree of vileness that i have seen from the DotA community in my place, i like to use my community as a minimal bar for both the good and the bad and i tell you when even at its lowest the bad outweighs the good thats not good, in both HoN and LoL it at least breaks even.
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Quote from »
Call me old fashioned, but an evil ascension to power just isn't the same without someone chanting faux Latin in the background.
Oreo, Glazing people better than Dunkin' Donuts since 2009
That is not dead which can eternal lie. And with strange eons even death may die.
Every game's community is awful, as has been stated. My estimation is that DotA will be the future of the genre, with HoN's producers (S2) only out to obtain as much $ as possible before DotA 2 finishes Beta, and LoL being the haven for the more casual players that prefer a medium-paced game between HoN (faster, gank-oriented with tanky-style heroes being the current meta) and DotA (slower, farm-oriented, with team fights and the bigger carry often winning the day).
Been playing Dota/variants since 5.84c, and Dota 2 is going to be great when it's finished.
Every game's community is awful, as has been stated. My estimation is that DotA will be the future of the genre, with HoN's producers (S2) only out to obtain as much $ as possible before DotA 2 finishes Beta, and LoL being the haven for the more casual players that prefer a medium-paced game between HoN and DotA
You do know that League of Legends is the most played video game in the world, right? League of Legends is present in almost every major cybergames tournament, with a cumulative prize pool of over $5 million dollars. It's hard to say that it's a haven for casual players when the competitive scene is that large. And if you're saying it's a casual game because it doesn't have denying (as I see used as an argument all the time)... well
Invariably, however, gamers will run into comparisons between League of Legends and Dota2. I'm going to avoid starting a 'console war' style argument with fanboyisms and whatnot, I just felt that it would be prudent to correct you on your casual gamers statement.
Private Mod Note
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Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Even if the author is silenced, the performance is stopped, the story will not end.
Whether it's a comedy or a tragedy, if there is cheering, the story will continue on.
Just like the many lives.
For the us who are still in it and still in the journey, send warm blessings.
- We will continue to walk down this path until eternity.
You do know that League of Legends is the most played video game in the world, right? League of Legends is present in almost every major cybergames tournament, with a cumulative prize pool of over $5 million dollars. It's hard to say that it's a haven for casual players when the competitive scene is that large. And if you're saying it's a casual game because it doesn't have denying (as I see used as an argument all the time)... well
Invariably, however, gamers will run into comparisons between League of Legends and Dota2. I'm going to avoid starting a 'console war' style argument with fanboyisms and whatnot, I just felt that it would be prudent to correct you on your casual gamers statement.
LoL is a FtP game that can be accessed and used by anyone, and sports non-ranked casual play as well as ranked play (most mobas do this, but because LoL is free it's immediately accessible to a gigantic target audience). But comparing the size of the community is almost a waste of time; the DotA AS community was so big that people were logging onto WCIII Battle.Net to play DotA instead of WCIII. It took less than a minute to get into a DotA game any time of the day, whereas the actual game took generally twice that time just for a 1v1. 3v3 wait time was ludicrous if you weren't on at the right time.
DotA 2 is in closed beta; it has no way of matching League's player base.
"If you're Havengul problems I feel bad for you son, I got 99 problems and a Lich ain't one." - FSM
"In a world where money talks, silence is horrifying."
So I just had some douchebag Ezalor act useless the entire game, trash talk, and then buy a blink dagger and teleport me to an inaccessible location and then blink out, and then on top of that set up a votekick against me when I was trying to votekick him.
Since Ezalor is not in DOTA 2 yet, I assume you are reffering to the original. Typically the douchesness of dota from dota 1 - 2 is not even close to as bad. I admit the community still has several issues, but in Warcraft, you can hundreds of different usernames, and were practically untouchable, as long as you could change your IP.
Since DOTA 2 is on steam, you will find its much harder to get away with trolling. Problem players can be reported with a nifty little system, and while I suppose they could come back, it would require the creation of a different steam name, meaning they would have to re-buy the game again (which right now, it is a closed beta).
Since I have been playing, the amount of douchness in games has dropped off dramatically from Warcraft III dota.
I change my mind. **** DOTA. If you want to play a game of DotA, next time you're at work tape a giant picture of a middle finger and attach it to your computer screen and stare at it during the duration of your lunch break. That's what a game of DotA's like, except the difference is you won't have wasted as much of your life as if you played it.
I'm pissed off...
Guardman: I don't see the problems you're seeing in terms of design. I think Icefrog especially has done a fantastic job with things. The community SUCKS BALLS, but that's not a fault of the game itself.[/quote]
LoL is a FtP game that can be accessed and used by anyone, and sports non-ranked casual play as well as ranked play (most mobas do this, but because LoL is free it's immediately accessible to a gigantic target audience).
DotA could be used and accessed by anyone who was willing to make an initial investment, this doesnt even begin to talk about the closed games that could be played through piracy.
DotA AS also sports casual and ranked play.
As for it being free last i checked HoN is also free yet it does not have nearly as big a following or support as LoL or DotA AS.
But comparing the size of the community is almost a waste of time;
Agreed, i dont think GLJ was trying to compare the community size in itself but rather the support it has outside of casual.
the DotA AS community was so big that people were logging onto WCIII Battle.Net to play DotA instead of WCIII. It took less than a minute to get into a DotA game any time of the day, whereas the actual game took generally twice that time just for a 1v1. 3v3 wait time was ludicrous if you weren't on at the right time.
Not entirely sure of your argument here, same thing happens in lol, and saying that people where logging in to B.Net just for DotA seems counter to your point that comparing community size is a waste.
DotA 2 is in closed beta; it has no way of matching League's player base.
I think the argument wasn't in regards to size but rather in the quality.
Like i said before im not saying LoL has a pristine quality but as far a cesspools go it is not as vile as others moba's
One word: Flash.
You are gonna have to go into a bigger depth that that as to why DotA 2 is suddenly all much better despite the dickery simply because LoL has a strategy element mechanic which serves both as escape mechanism or as an initiation mechanism.
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Quote from »
Call me old fashioned, but an evil ascension to power just isn't the same without someone chanting faux Latin in the background.
Oreo, Glazing people better than Dunkin' Donuts since 2009
That is not dead which can eternal lie. And with strange eons even death may die.
What I will know from this game is:
1. The community will be the same as LoL, 99% of them are trolls.
2. Its for Valve, no new mechanics, no new interesting champion designs.
3. The gameplay is gonna be still the same, I have been played original Dota for years with my friend, now we all transferred to LoL, I don't want to do it again.
4. This game wont be that much hardcore anymore, the new system will make the game easier and drags more player and become "noob friendly"
EDH: Xenagos, God of Revels.
You went from "all heroes boring" to "all heroes seem boring." Huge difference. I think your fanboyism is clouding your judgment.
They don't. They really don't.
"In a world where money talks, silence is horrifying."
Ashcoat Bear of Limited
Well every hero I played as except Skeleton King was either boring or frustrating to play as. Therefore I never found another hero that I said, oh I enjoy playing as such and such. It's not fanboyism as much as I didn't enjoy playing as them, and while I didn't try everyone of them I did try a good number of them. Enough that I can say that I couldn't find another hero I truly enjoyed.
Or maybe you just didn't know what you were doing because DotA is an extremely punishing game in ways that Riot intentionally left behind. You're setting your standards for DotA in terms of Lol instead of analyzing it according to its own goals (A.K.A. fanboyism). There's a difference between how much you enjoy a game and how well it was made, even if the two often overlap.
I just played a couple games earlier... 95% of the terrain is grey, green, and alternate colors with gray and green blended in... maybe before you complain about the graphics of a game you should take into account your personal handicaps.
"In a world where money talks, silence is horrifying."
Ashcoat Bear of Limited
A well made game that isn't enjoyed isn't well made.
As for Dota there are a ton of interface and usability problems that I've gone over in this thread that seriously reduce the ability to enjoy the game. Also a game should be interpreted via my goals, not the games goals. The first rule of design is you don't design the game for yourself, but for the people who will play it.
Basically if I have to twist my decisions and how I think things should work for a game, that usually means that unless there is a specific reason for doing so, the game has some design problems. Everytime I used the shop or even tried matchmaking or use smartcasting (well tried) I had to jump through hoops, half the time which did nothing. Now I can accept some of this is Beta, but a lot of the problems, such as shop usability, seem like things they are unwilling to fix as they just for the most part transferred it from Dota 1 from what people have been telling me. This speaks to me that instead of trying to find out if this was the best way to make the shop that they would rather just import something poorly designed and lacking usability.
I admit I have that handycap, but this isn't a complaint I've heard just myself. I've had other friends who have tried the trial or seen videos of people playing it and they all agree it can be difficult to tell what is what while playing.
If a task, program, system, etc. accomplishes its goals, then it's well made. If you don't enjoy it, that's another thing. The two generally overlap for games but that doesn't make them synonymous.
Absolutely, but perhaps Valve and Icefrog aren't trying to appeal to you, but to another niche of gamers. The enjoyability you get out of a game should be according to your tastes; to say it's a poorly made game is an objective statement that has nothing to do with taste but with the standards set by the developers and the audience they're trying to target. I think SC: Brood War was a well made game, but you'll never find me playing it.
The game design doesn't have problems if you don't like it, it has problems if it conflicts with the game itself. So saying that the shop is poorly set up is a fine complaint, but you have to explain why in order for it to be an objective argument against the game's flaws. Is it too complicated, are there too many pages, is the sorting system unclear, etc.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to invalidate your opinions, but stating that a game is poorly made because it doesn't do exactly what you want it to is silly.
You're the first person I've heard complain about this.
"In a world where money talks, silence is horrifying."
Ashcoat Bear of Limited
I change my mind. **** DOTA. If you want to play a game of DotA, next time you're at work tape a giant picture of a middle finger and attach it to your computer screen and stare at it during the duration of your lunch break. That's what a game of DotA's like, except the difference is you won't have wasted as much of your life as if you played it.
I'm pissed off...
Guardman: I don't see the problems you're seeing in terms of design. I think Icefrog especially has done a fantastic job with things. The community SUCKS BALLS, but that's not a fault of the game itself.
ha, DOTA community has always been hostile. That's never going to change considering the mechanics of the game.
Yeah, I've often compared DotA to Counterstrike as the worst and best games, respectively, when taking into account the nature of the online community.
If you don't have friends who want to play and you aren't a masochist, don't bother.
"In a world where money talks, silence is horrifying."
Ashcoat Bear of Limited
EDH
U Azami, Lady of Scrolls
GBGlissa, the Traitor
Modern
X Affinity
EDH
BUGTasigur, the Golden Fang (French 1v1)
Modern
RWG Burn
Because he was bragging that you could do **** like what Highroller was complaining about and used it as an example of why dota2 is better than LoL.
Yeah, I think I'll pass.
Whether it's a comedy or a tragedy, if there is cheering, the story will continue on.
Just like the many lives.
For the us who are still in it and still in the journey, send warm blessings.
- We will continue to walk down this path until eternity.
The funny thing is, am I still going to play Dota? Probably.
It's only now I remember that "-disablehelp" command. Yeah, that would have helped in this situation.
Been playing Dota/variants since 5.84c, and Dota 2 is going to be great when it's finished.
You do know that League of Legends is the most played video game in the world, right? League of Legends is present in almost every major cybergames tournament, with a cumulative prize pool of over $5 million dollars. It's hard to say that it's a haven for casual players when the competitive scene is that large. And if you're saying it's a casual game because it doesn't have denying (as I see used as an argument all the time)... well
Invariably, however, gamers will run into comparisons between League of Legends and Dota2. I'm going to avoid starting a 'console war' style argument with fanboyisms and whatnot, I just felt that it would be prudent to correct you on your casual gamers statement.
Whether it's a comedy or a tragedy, if there is cheering, the story will continue on.
Just like the many lives.
For the us who are still in it and still in the journey, send warm blessings.
- We will continue to walk down this path until eternity.
LoL is a FtP game that can be accessed and used by anyone, and sports non-ranked casual play as well as ranked play (most mobas do this, but because LoL is free it's immediately accessible to a gigantic target audience). But comparing the size of the community is almost a waste of time; the DotA AS community was so big that people were logging onto WCIII Battle.Net to play DotA instead of WCIII. It took less than a minute to get into a DotA game any time of the day, whereas the actual game took generally twice that time just for a 1v1. 3v3 wait time was ludicrous if you weren't on at the right time.
DotA 2 is in closed beta; it has no way of matching League's player base.
One word: Flash.
"In a world where money talks, silence is horrifying."
Ashcoat Bear of Limited
Since Ezalor is not in DOTA 2 yet, I assume you are reffering to the original. Typically the douchesness of dota from dota 1 - 2 is not even close to as bad. I admit the community still has several issues, but in Warcraft, you can hundreds of different usernames, and were practically untouchable, as long as you could change your IP.
Since DOTA 2 is on steam, you will find its much harder to get away with trolling. Problem players can be reported with a nifty little system, and while I suppose they could come back, it would require the creation of a different steam name, meaning they would have to re-buy the game again (which right now, it is a closed beta).
Since I have been playing, the amount of douchness in games has dropped off dramatically from Warcraft III dota.
I change my mind. **** DOTA. If you want to play a game of DotA, next time you're at work tape a giant picture of a middle finger and attach it to your computer screen and stare at it during the duration of your lunch break. That's what a game of DotA's like, except the difference is you won't have wasted as much of your life as if you played it.
I'm pissed off...
Guardman: I don't see the problems you're seeing in terms of design. I think Icefrog especially has done a fantastic job with things. The community SUCKS BALLS, but that's not a fault of the game itself.[/quote]
The GJ way path to no lynching:
DotA AS also sports casual and ranked play.
As for it being free last i checked HoN is also free yet it does not have nearly as big a following or support as LoL or DotA AS.
Agreed, i dont think GLJ was trying to compare the community size in itself but rather the support it has outside of casual.
Not entirely sure of your argument here, same thing happens in lol, and saying that people where logging in to B.Net just for DotA seems counter to your point that comparing community size is a waste.
I think the argument wasn't in regards to size but rather in the quality.
Like i said before im not saying LoL has a pristine quality but as far a cesspools go it is not as vile as others moba's
You are gonna have to go into a bigger depth that that as to why DotA 2 is suddenly all much better despite the dickery simply because LoL has a strategy element mechanic which serves both as escape mechanism or as an initiation mechanism.