^^^I thought you didn't care about this movie. Maybe you should leave this thread alone?
Probably.
One thing that bothered me when I was driving home today.
So, the big reveal is that Bane is not the child born in the hell-on-earth prison, but instead Talia al-Ghul was.
This seems like a contradiction though. Well, before I go into why, props to anyone who caught the fact that the child was revealed not to be Bane early on because Bane is said to have received his injuries in prison and the child who escaped had no such injury.
That being said, there seems to be a problem here. Remember that Alfred says that it was Bane was born in the prison. (Which immediately raises the question of where Alfred got his information so quickly concerning the activities of the League of Shadows, a secret organization that Bruce Wayne supposedly destroyed.)
But then in the sewer fight, when Bruce cuts the lights and Bane taunts him saying he's far more comfortable in the shadows that Bruce was, Bane also claims that he was born in the prison. Please, anyone who intends to see this movie again, correct me if I'm wrong/back me up, but I believe he specifically uses the phrase "born," as in he was born in darkness.
Seems like the facts are mixed up here.
I'm curious, when the cops are across the street staring down the armed groups and the tanks, did anyone else think of Syria?
The political bias in this movie is extremely right-wing. Wait, I'm confused; isn't this the movie that Rush Limbaugh said it would be liberal, or anti-Romney? lol.
Politics aside, it was still good action. The pacing at the beginning of the movie is a bit bad, but the last half-hour is just pure awesome. It was a really good climatic ending.
One thing that bothered me when I was driving home today.
So, the big reveal is that Bane is not the child born in the hell-on-earth prison, but instead Talia al-Ghul was.
This seems like a contradiction though. Well, before I go into why, props to anyone who caught the fact that the child was revealed not to be Bane early on because Bane is said to have received his injuries in prison and the child who escaped had no such injury.
That being said, there seems to be a problem here. Remember that Alfred says that it was Bane was born in the prison. (Which immediately raises the question of where Alfred got his information so quickly concerning the activities of the League of Shadows, a secret organization that Bruce Wayne supposedly destroyed.)
But then in the sewer fight, when Bruce cuts the lights and Bane taunts him saying he's far more comfortable in the shadows that Bruce was, Bane also claims that he was born in the prison. Please, anyone who intends to see this movie again, correct me if I'm wrong/back me up, but I believe he specifically uses the phrase "born," as in he was born in darkness.
Seems like the facts are mixed up here.
No, Bane definitely never said he was born in the prison. You're just incorrect on that one. He said he was raised in hell, at home in the shadows. It never gives Bane's origin story, but it is very likely that he spent a LONG time in that prison as well. It is implied he is the one born in the prison to lead the audience on, definitely never said though.
Asking people to remove quotes in their signatures is tyranny! If I can't say something just because someone's feelings are hurt then no one would ever be able to say anything! Political correctness is stupid.
One thing that bothered me when I was driving home today.
So, the big reveal is that Bane is not the child born in the hell-on-earth prison, but instead Talia al-Ghul was.
This seems like a contradiction though. Well, before I go into why, props to anyone who caught the fact that the child was revealed not to be Bane early on because Bane is said to have received his injuries in prison and the child who escaped had no such injury.
That being said, there seems to be a problem here. Remember that Alfred says that it was Bane was born in the prison. (Which immediately raises the question of where Alfred got his information so quickly concerning the activities of the League of Shadows, a secret organization that Bruce Wayne supposedly destroyed.)
But then in the sewer fight, when Bruce cuts the lights and Bane taunts him saying he's far more comfortable in the shadows that Bruce was, Bane also claims that he was born in the prison. Please, anyone who intends to see this movie again, correct me if I'm wrong/back me up, but I believe he specifically uses the phrase "born," as in he was born in darkness.
Seems like the facts are mixed up here.
I'm curious, when the cops are across the street staring down the armed groups and the tanks, did anyone else think of Syria?
I agree, I thought them trying to hide the fact that Talia was the little girl was a bit muddled and probably should have been dealt with a bit more delecatly.
I have other complaints with the movie too.
Wayne's back heals way too quick. I understand they wanted to have the classic scene of Bane breaking Batman's back but this was a little much.
Did Bruce walk from the prison to Gotham?
With all the complaints that Bale got with the bat growl, they deliberetly chose to do it again here. I am very interested in hearing an explanation behind that choice.
I felt like him getting toghet with Catwoman really wasn't developed and the only reason it happened is because Batman needed a love interest. It would have been nice if Nolan had a bit more forethought in earlier instalments and established her.
Bane's voice, really?
In quite a few scenes the dialogue was drowned out by the music. Nolan really needs to get a better person in charge of his audio.
Even though the scene was awesome, how the hell did Wayne get all the fuel on the bridge to form the Bat symbol?
Why was his name Robin? Either make it Dick Greyson or Terry McGinnis.
I thought his limp in the beginning wasn't handled well and didn't go anywhere important. Was the condition of his body suppose to be an explanation on why he lost to Bane the first time? And if it was, was it a necessary explanation?
I don't think Talia was developed enough to be a villain. She was probably an unnecessary character.
I feel like this movie would have been stronger if it was a two parter. It ends with Bruce being thrown in the prison. Broken. Gotham is under Bane's martial law, and everything is in question. Cut to the second movie 4 months later. Would have also allowed them to do another anamatrix style of short animated films inbetween the movies explaining specifics of what went down.
I probably would have more complaints when I put it up for repeat views. But I did find the movie very enjoyable on the first watch.
Everyone who sees this movie should give thanks that we are alive and condolences for those who cannot say the same.
I actually said at one point, out loud, "Hey, remember how this movie is about Batman?"
Characterization?
Bane is a one-note villain with no clear goal or motivation whose plans make absolutely no sense. He's the big, tough, bad guy who does bad things because he's big and tough.
I've thought about it, and I think it is energy.
Every scene which Ledger is in sizzles with his character, in TDK. Bane just sort of...occupies space. He exists, but nothing much more. Part of it is that it must be hard for Hardy to emote throught that mask.
Every scene which Ledger is in sizzles with his character, in TDK. Bane just sort of...occupies space. He exists, but nothing much more. Part of it is that it must be hard for Hardy to emote throught that mask.
I don't think we can blame it on the mask. Darth Vader somehow managed.
I think it's more the fact that Bane doesn't really emote anything except, "I'm confident and brutish," with the exception of his last scenes.
I don't think we can blame it on the mask. Darth Vader somehow managed.
I think it's more the fact that Bane doesn't really emote anything except, "I'm confident and brutish," with the exception of his last scenes.
Are you kidding me? Bane is the living embodiment of Despair. Everything about Bane just seeeeeeps despair. Which was Nolan's intention.
You're just flat out wrong about this.
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Asking people to remove quotes in their signatures is tyranny! If I can't say something just because someone's feelings are hurt then no one would ever be able to say anything! Political correctness is stupid.
saw it today, I liked it, but somehow felt a little disapointed and I just am not sure why...
it sorta reminded me of transformers 3 when the decepticons take over the one city and it appears so hopeless and then some people fix it and the movies over, but i agree batman wasn't used much which I am sure was the plan, bane was played well, I dont think he was the star, but at the end when talia is talking and re-attaching the items on his mask you can see it in his face his pain, it was well done. and then catwoman was also well done, blake was i think the almost obvious star, he was played well and the ending made me a bit happy in away that they may continue the franchise with maybe him as the new batman or nightwing or whatever, but it got me thinking about how good that could be
overall i guess its a good movie don't get me wrong, i think it went on a little to long and dragged a bit, they seemed to want people to see batman/bruce suffer, and i personally have always had a hatred of super hero movies in which they remove a heroes mask, and watching him watch them break into the vault of bat goodies and have bane hit him so hard that his mask broke off was i dunno just odd for me to watch, sort of just all around hard to see batman broke, really deep stuff for a super hero movie
also no superman trailer for me, was disapointed by that
I don't think Talia was developed enough to be a villain. She was probably an unnecessary character.
Oh complete agreement there.
My problem with that is that it totally cheapens Bane's character. Bane is poorly developed and is a stock character as is, but what the movie really tried to do was make him a foil for Batman by giving him this mystique of being the child forged in darkness and hell, while Batman was a man of privilege (never mind the fact that Batman still managed to kick the entire League of Shadows' asses the first movie). But then they reveal that it's Talia who was forged in darkness and hellfire. Talia being a person of privilege who owns a company that deals in philanthropy and is a multi-billionaire and couldn't fight Bruce Wayne in a million years.
The whole thing of giving Bane a love interest does at least give his character a motivation for wanting anything to do with the League of Shadows, but I have huge problems with Bane, who starts out as this awe-inspiring monster of a man who is a revolutionary dictator and a fanatic terrorist all rolled into one, turning out to be some love-sick puppy who is the muscle of the operation as opposed to the brains.
By the way, if this sounds familiar, it's because James Bond did that already.
It's called The World is Not Enough. And Renard wasn't even one of the GOOD Bond villains.
Since we're sharing, I might as well type out a few of my problems.
Total agreement on the leg injury thing. Did Bruce Wayne really injure his legs? If not, then why does the doctor say he has injuries and why is he wearing a leg brace? If so, then why does he have no trouble walking or doing his stunts to get into Gordon's hospital? Also how did he injure them? Further, how does he have 8 years and not get over his leg crippling, but have no problems dealing with his back?
So the CIA guy has three mercenaries of Bane, one of whom is Bane, that they captured and have bags over their heads. As far as I could tell, none of the CIA guy's men were insiders working for Bane. If that's the case, who captured Bane and put the bag over his head initially? Because if it was someone looking for a masked man, guess what...
I had absolutely no idea what was going on with the whole Congressman taken hostage, deal gone south, etc. First of all, why does the guy in charge of the rival company want Bruce Wayne's fingerprints again? Second, Catwoman goes into the bar to make a deal, and the Congressman just goes along with it? Then the Congressman gets shot, and he says, "Call me?" So is he in on the plan? Did he know he was going to get shot? And he just went along with it? Because there's NO way he could have missed that something was going down.
Anyway, the cops surround the bar and proceed to block off all exits. Then something really dumb happens. One of Bane's lieutenants, a sniper, starts shooting at the police, prompting them to chase after him, which leads the police and Gordon right into the sewer where Bane's men are working covertly. Why would he draw attention on himself and Bane's entire operation by firing on police officers when they weren't looking for him and Bane clearly wouldn't want them there? And furthermore, why didn't corrupt corporation man get caught for being present at a hostage situation with the Congressman?
Gordon then jumps into the sewer, oh Gordon you so awesome, and Bane tells them to find Gordon. The guy says that Gordon could have washed up anywhere, so Bane gives him a cellphone and then shoots him so he'll wash up where Gordon does and they can track the signal. Yet, despite the fact that Gordon could wash up anywhere and there's no way to know where without a tracking device, Blake manages to find Gordon before Bane does.
So Bane's plan is to waltz into Wall Street, shoot some guns, and then destroy the stock market. Predictably, the entire scene is surrounded by cops within moments, and they cut everything that the crooks need to succeed in their plan. Bane decides they're going to get on motorcycles and start a police car chase to ensure their plan is a success. The police pursue. Now, based on what we see here, it seems as though if Batman hadn't shown up, thereby causing the police to reprioritize, they probably would have caught Bane. So Bane's plan almost failed due to the police doing exactly what anyone could have foreseen they would do.
Further, if Bane wanted to create mass anarchy, why did he need the bomb? Why not simply use the stock exchange to remove all the money in the city or the world, and then have the people of Gotham riot? This is not dissimilar from the movie Fight Club. Indeed, that would have created pandemonium globally. Not to mention the entire bomb plan revolved around Bruce Wayne handing the reactor over to someone else instead of flushing it, when Bruce has been debating over flushing it, and has been established in both The Dark Knight and The Dark Knight Rises to destroy evidence and keep things close to the chest to keep outsiders away from Batman evidence and high tech stuff. He doesn't let his Applied Sciences stuff into anyone's hands, yet gives Miranda a fusion reactor?
So Batman's the star pupil of Ra's al-Ghul AND the world's greatest detective, and he never thinks to hit Bane in the mask, even after he learns what the mask does, until the very last part of the last fight scene? You wouldn't think to maybe aim for that first?
The final fight sequence makes no sense. First of all, the cops are fully armed, but instead of shooting at the criminal army, who are armed with tanks and automatic weapons, they decide to run at them and start punching them. Although, this ends up being a really intelligent decision, as they're able to charge into automatic fire with only a few of them getting mowed down and the tanks proving pretty much useless.
Speaking of tanks, what exactly happens in that initial sequence? Bane orders the tank to open fire and kill them all. The tank fires, then The Bat shows up. Now, I missed what happened here: did The Bat destroy the tank, or did it simply take the shot that was supposed to be fired at the crowd? Because you notice that every time the tanks fire at The Bat, they do nothing. I assume that Batman simply took the shot because his weapons seem to be anti-personnel weapons that do nothing against a tank. Seems short-sighted of Fox considering that the Batpod has massive firepower, but whatever. The point is: Why didn't Batman just stay there and provide air support for the police? He didn't even have to open fire on the crowd, he could have just been disruptive. None of the tanks could shoot him out of the air!
I enjoyed the film as a movie going experience. I was disappointed with some of the directions they took, and with some of the plot holes left out of apparent laziness. Most have been mentioned from what I saw in the past few pages, but one that really bothered me is:
How is it that Bruce spends the whole film, nearly, repairing the damage of him neglecting his self appointed duty to Gotham and Wayne Enterprises, to then fake his own death after being vindicated in the eyes of the public and police alike? That makes no sense. I don't care when they deviate from canon a bit. I do care when it seems like they don't understand the character. It was a bad enough start that he had hung up the cowl for as long as he had, but then when shown clear evidence that his lack of activity within his company and his city has brought disaster to both, he just retires? That doesn't feel like Bruce Wayne at all. Also, since when does Batman, a trained ninja, have trouble scaling a wall with a rope?
My problem with that is that it totally cheapens Bane's character. Bane is poorly developed and is a stock character as is, but what the movie really tried to do was make him a foil for Batman by giving him this mystique of being the child forged in darkness and hell, while Batman was a man of privilege (never mind the fact that Batman still managed to kick the entire League of Shadows' asses the first movie). But then they reveal that it's Talia who was forged in darkness and hellfire. Talia being a person of privilege who owns a company that deals in philanthropy and is a multi-billionaire and couldn't fight Bruce Wayne in a million years.
The whole thing of giving Bane a love interest does at least give his character a motivation for wanting anything to do with the League of Shadows, but I have huge problems with Bane, who starts out as this awe-inspiring monster of a man who is a revolutionary dictator and a fanatic terrorist all rolled into one, turning out to be some love-sick puppy who is the muscle of the operation as opposed to the brains.
By the way, if this sounds familiar, it's because James Bond did that already.
It's called The World is Not Enough. And Renard wasn't even one of the GOOD Bond villains.
Since we're sharing, I might as well type out a few of my problems.
Ok, so did Bruce Wayne really injure his legs? If no, then why does the doctor say he has injuries and why is he wearing a leg brace? If yes, then why does he have no trouble walking or doing his stunts to get into Gordon's hospital? Also how did he injure them? Further, how does he have 8 years and not get over his leg crippling, but have no problems dealing with his back?
So the CIA guy has three mercenaries of Bane, one of whom is Bane, that they captured and have bags over their heads. As far as I could tell, none of the CIA guy's men were insiders working for Bane. If that's the case, who captured Bane and put the bag over his head initially? Because if it was someone looking for a masked man, guess what...
I had absolutely no idea what was going on with the whole Congressman taken hostage, deal gone south, etc. First of all, why does the guy in charge of the rival company want Bruce Wayne's fingerprints again? Second, Catwoman goes into the bar to make a deal, and the Congressman just goes along with it? Then the Congressman gets shot, and he says, "Call me?" So is he in on the plan? Did he know he was going to get shot? And he just went along with it? Because there's NO way he could have missed that something was going down.
Anyway, the cops surround the bar and proceed to block off all exits. Then something really dumb happens. One of Bane's lieutenants, a sniper, starts shooting at the police, prompting them to chase after him, which leads the police and Gordon right into the sewer where Bane's men are working covertly. Why did he do that again? And furthermore, why didn't corrupt corporation man get caught?
Gordon then jumps into the sewer, oh Gordon you so awesome, and Bane tells them to find Gordon. The guy says that Gordon could have washed up anywhere, so Bane gives him a cellphone and then shoots him so he'll wash up where Gordon does and they can track the signal. Yet, despite the fact that Gordon could wash up anywhere and there's no way to know where without a tracking device, Blake manages to find Gordon before Bane does.
So Bane's plan is to waltz into Wall Street, shoot some guns, and then destroy the stock market. Predictably, the entire scene is surrounded by cops within moments, and they cut everything that the crooks need to succeed in their plan. Bane decides they're going to get on motorcycles and start a police car chase to ensure their plan is a success. The police pursue. Now, based on what we see here, it seems as though if Batman hadn't shown up, thereby causing the police to reprioritize, they probably would have caught Bane. So Bane's plan almost failed due to the police doing exactly what anyone could have foreseen they would do.
Further, if Bane wanted to create mass anarchy, why did he need the bomb? Why not simply use the stock exchange to remove all the money in the city or the world, and then have the people of Gotham riot? This is not dissimilar from the movie Fight Club. Indeed, that would have created pandemonium globally.
So Batman's the star pupil of Ra's al-Ghul AND the world's greatest detective, and he never thinks to hit Bane in the mask, even after he learns what the mask does, until the very last part of the last fight scene? You wouldn't think to maybe aim for that first?
The final fight sequence makes no sense. First of all, the cops are fully armed, but instead of shooting at the criminal army, who are armed with tanks and automatic weapons, they decide to run at them and start punching them. Although, this ends up being a really intelligent decision, as they're able to charge into automatic fire with only a few of them getting mowed down and the tanks proving pretty much useless.
Speaking of tanks, what exactly happens in that initial sequence? Bane orders the tank to open fire and kill them all. The tank fires, then The Bat shows up. Now, I missed what happened here: did The Bat destroy the tank, or did it simply take the shot that was supposed to be fired at the crowd? Because you notice that every time the tanks fire at The Bat, they do nothing. I assume that Batman simply took the shot because his weapons seem to be anti-personnel weapons that do nothing against a tank. Seems short-sighted of Fox considering that the Batpod has massive firepower, but whatever. The point is: Why didn't Batman just stay there and provide air support for the police? He didn't even have to open fire on the crowd, he could have just been disruptive. None of the tanks could shoot him out of the air!
Wait, are you trying to say that Bane himself feels despair, or that Bane is despair?
Neither came across to me.
just to answer a few of your questions from what i can recall
yah the leg thing was odd, its really, bad, but then it's not, then he has the device on that allows him to kick through brick, so why not just kick bane hard in that leg, and then hes in the prison, they removed the batsuit, i doubt they left the thing on his leg, so that had to heal along side his back
as for the start, it was banes lieutenant who's always by his side through out the movie that dropped them off to the cia dude, so I am guessing he either pretended to just be a merc or something to the cia guy and then says heres some guys who work for bane, and the cia guy trusts him
dagget or daggert or whatever his name was, he wanted the prints i guess so that bane could goto the stock market, use them to gain access to and drain waynes funds, thus making him broke and allowing dagget or say look waynes broke, i should be in charge now, and then merge both his and waynes company, it was basically just a business thing i guess
and the congressman, when selina gets into the car with him after stealing the necklace from bruce, she asks him for a ride and his reply was "you read my mind" implying that he just went along with this stuff because he was horny and probably let the little congressman do the thinking from that point on
yah gordan in the sewers was random, just as easily could have ended up somewhere else and drowned or whatever
and the congressman, when selina gets into the car with him after stealing the necklace from bruce, she asks him for a ride and his reply was "you read my mind" implying that he just went along with this stuff because he was horny and probably let the little congressman do the thinking from that point on
Ah yes. "The Dark Knight Rises" indeed...
But still, he had to have known that something was going on, especially when guns started being pointed.
And even still, he was obviously being used AND got shot. And his reaction is, "Call me?" Is there magical mind control in this movie?
Ok, so it was one of Bane's guys with them. Got it.
But still, he had to have known that something was going on, especially when guns started being pointed.
And even still, he was obviously being used AND got shot. And his reaction is, "Call me?" Is there magical mind control in this movie?
Ok, so it was one of Bane's guys with them. Got it.
i think he was already a bit drunk, and he sorta when he went in plopped himself down at the bar, so she probably got him good and drunk to make him more agreeable
People are split on it. Appose to some other movies where they have obvious problems with them, and the only matter is if it bothered the person enough to not enjoy the movie.
Dark Knight Rises does not have that. People are split on almost every issue. Some people loved Bane and found him a threatening villain other people found him ridiculous and one dimensional. Some people found Anne Hatheyway amazing, other people find her bland. Some people find the political commentary over the top and others find it subtle and inofenssive. The only real consensus I've seen in that Gary Oleman, Michael Kane, and JGL are amazing in there roles.
This is the kind of movie that people takes sides on. I found the movie to be flawed but enjoyable none-the-less. You kind of need to see it for your self to decide.
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That's the remarkable thing about life. It's never so bad that it can't get worse
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I think a lot of the feedback you're hearing right now (on these forums and elsewhere) is gut reactions. It was already going to be pretty polarizing; some people love what Nolan had done with Batman, others haven't, and there was little hope that this movie would change anyone's mind one way or another. Most of what your hearing is either praise from the Nolan Fan Club, while many of it's detractors are the comic book readers who don't care for the grim and gritty retelling, or people who didn't care for the series to begin with. Over time, I think we'll start to see these two sides reach a lot more mutual ground on aspects of the film.
I think the true test for me is two things - A) How much I remember aspects of the film over time (though I can already say, the fast pace means certain things weren't at impactful or memorable as they should have been), and B) How many times I go back to see it. Dark Knight brought me to the threatre three times. I anticipate going to see DKR again to see it in IMAX, but we'll see if there's a third for this one as well, or if the second one even happens.
Since we're sharing, I might as well type out a few of my problems.
Total agreement on the leg injury thing. Did Bruce Wayne really injure his legs? If not, then why does the doctor say he has injuries and why is he wearing a leg brace? If so, then why does he have no trouble walking or doing his stunts to get into Gordon's hospital? Also how did he injure them? Further, how does he have 8 years and not get over his leg crippling, but have no problems dealing with his back?
Yeah...
I was quite surprised about how flagrantly inconsistent the movie was about this. Presumably the leg injury is from the end of TDK when he takes that fall since he's been a hermit until now, but 8 goddam years and he's still hobbled? And, within a few months he's spry again?
The scene with his back was beyond stupid as well. "Okay, stand very still while I donkey punch you in the lower back to fix it. Don't worry, I'm a trained professional inmate of a secret prison." What the hell? And then, on top of that, he's expected to stand up in short order? The injuries he had and the recovery time required would be quite long in top notch facilities, but he's in a prison for heaven sakes. I know superhero movies require a leap of faith, but for a series that attempted to be more grounded in reality, this was a brainless departure.
I had absolutely no idea what was going on with the whole Congressman taken hostage, deal gone south, etc. First of all, why does the guy in charge of the rival company want Bruce Wayne's fingerprints again? Second, Catwoman goes into the bar to make a deal, and the Congressman just goes along with it? Then the Congressman gets shot, and he says, "Call me?" So is he in on the plan? Did he know he was going to get shot? And he just went along with it? Because there's NO way he could have missed that something was going down.
Ugh...
The fingerprints... Right, because the stock market requires easily forged bioinformatic systems to do trades...
So Batman's the star pupil of Ra's al-Ghul AND the world's greatest detective, and he never thinks to hit Bane in the mask, even after he learns what the mask does, until the very last part of the last fight scene? You wouldn't think to maybe aim for that first?
That seemed to be a theme of the entire movie...
That Bruce Wayne suffered mostly brain injuries and is now incompetent. Seriously, he's a pretty sharp guy as a character, and usually invests time to learn how to defeat his enemies. A guy is wearing a mask like that and you don't think it could be a vulnerability?
Speaking of tanks, what exactly happens in that initial sequence? Bane orders the tank to open fire and kill them all. The tank fires, then The Bat shows up. Now, I missed what happened here: did The Bat destroy the tank, or did it simply take the shot that was supposed to be fired at the crowd? Because you notice that every time the tanks fire at The Bat, they do nothing. I assume that Batman simply took the shot because his weapons seem to be anti-personnel weapons that do nothing against a tank. Seems short-sighted of Fox considering that the Batpod has massive firepower, but whatever. The point is: Why didn't Batman just stay there and provide air support for the police? He didn't even have to open fire on the crowd, he could have just been disruptive. None of the tanks could shoot him out of the air!
I'm glad I'm not the only one who noticed that...
Yeah, it seems like The Bat has an interesting ability to turn artillery rounds from Tumblers into smoke.
Bruce Wayne hallucinated a Ra's Al Ghul who told him secrets that were real facts??
Bane was a little underwhelming to me. Based on the Knightfall comic arc, Bane ought to be one of the most impressive villains in the Rogues Gallery: Batman's equal (or superior) in intelligence and power. There was some feeling of those characteristics - he did break Batman's back and his spirit - but for some reason I didn't feel it quite enough.
What really annoyed me though...
There was no hint at Miranda Tate being Talia Al Ghul, unless you already knew she existed (scar and injuries or lack thereof notwithstanding), which was really ****; in fact, I didn't even know who that character was until I saw this thread. It came out of nowhere, and there was absolutely no motivation for it, and any momentum stemming from Bane was immediately dissipated.
What could have been really cool was playing closer to Knightfall, and having a replacement Batman who Bruce Wayne would eventually have to fight. I loved that part of Knightfall because Wayne recognized that it was his spirit that needed to be rebuilt, and so he concentrated on building himself, the man inside the suit, sharply contrasting with Jean-Paul Valley's heavy weapon/gadget style, which is what allowed him to win.
Gordon then jumps into the sewer, oh Gordon you so awesome, and Bane tells them to find Gordon. The guy says that Gordon could have washed up anywhere, so Bane gives him a cellphone and then shoots him so he'll wash up where Gordon does and they can track the signal. Yet, despite the fact that Gordon could wash up anywhere and there's no way to know where without a tracking device, Blake manages to find Gordon before Bane does.
I believe it was the same location where that orphan kid from the organization Blake knew washed up when he died.
The Ur-Dragon's Tyranny
Karador, Ghost of the Golgari
Niv-Mizzet, Izzet Mastermind
Thromok's Barbecue, Come Get Some!
Sedris's Hand of the Dead
Wort, the Queen of Boggarts
Rafiq, King of Jerkish Nature
Standard Decks
Jund Midrange
Narset 5 Color
Mono-Green Devotion
Naya Beasts
WR Burn
Modern Decks
Izzet Fiend
Affinity for Green
Probably.
One thing that bothered me when I was driving home today.
This seems like a contradiction though. Well, before I go into why, props to anyone who caught the fact that the child was revealed not to be Bane early on because Bane is said to have received his injuries in prison and the child who escaped had no such injury.
That being said, there seems to be a problem here. Remember that Alfred says that it was Bane was born in the prison. (Which immediately raises the question of where Alfred got his information so quickly concerning the activities of the League of Shadows, a secret organization that Bruce Wayne supposedly destroyed.)
But then in the sewer fight, when Bruce cuts the lights and Bane taunts him saying he's far more comfortable in the shadows that Bruce was, Bane also claims that he was born in the prison. Please, anyone who intends to see this movie again, correct me if I'm wrong/back me up, but I believe he specifically uses the phrase "born," as in he was born in darkness.
Seems like the facts are mixed up here.
I'm curious, when the cops are across the street staring down the armed groups and the tanks, did anyone else think of Syria?
#OccupyGotham.
No, Bane definitely never said he was born in the prison. You're just incorrect on that one. He said he was raised in hell, at home in the shadows. It never gives Bane's origin story, but it is very likely that he spent a LONG time in that prison as well. It is implied he is the one born in the prison to lead the audience on, definitely never said though.
I have other complaints with the movie too.
Wayne's back heals way too quick. I understand they wanted to have the classic scene of Bane breaking Batman's back but this was a little much.
Did Bruce walk from the prison to Gotham?
With all the complaints that Bale got with the bat growl, they deliberetly chose to do it again here. I am very interested in hearing an explanation behind that choice.
I felt like him getting toghet with Catwoman really wasn't developed and the only reason it happened is because Batman needed a love interest. It would have been nice if Nolan had a bit more forethought in earlier instalments and established her.
Bane's voice, really?
In quite a few scenes the dialogue was drowned out by the music. Nolan really needs to get a better person in charge of his audio.
Even though the scene was awesome, how the hell did Wayne get all the fuel on the bridge to form the Bat symbol?
Why was his name Robin? Either make it Dick Greyson or Terry McGinnis.
I thought his limp in the beginning wasn't handled well and didn't go anywhere important. Was the condition of his body suppose to be an explanation on why he lost to Bane the first time? And if it was, was it a necessary explanation?
I don't think Talia was developed enough to be a villain. She was probably an unnecessary character.
I feel like this movie would have been stronger if it was a two parter. It ends with Bruce being thrown in the prison. Broken. Gotham is under Bane's martial law, and everything is in question. Cut to the second movie 4 months later. Would have also allowed them to do another anamatrix style of short animated films inbetween the movies explaining specifics of what went down.
I probably would have more complaints when I put it up for repeat views. But I did find the movie very enjoyable on the first watch.
Calvin and Hobbes
Cube Tutor
I've thought about it, and I think it is energy.
Every scene which Ledger is in sizzles with his character, in TDK. Bane just sort of...occupies space. He exists, but nothing much more. Part of it is that it must be hard for Hardy to emote throught that mask.
I don't think we can blame it on the mask. Darth Vader somehow managed.
I think it's more the fact that Bane doesn't really emote anything except, "I'm confident and brutish," with the exception of his last scenes.
Are you kidding me? Bane is the living embodiment of Despair. Everything about Bane just seeeeeeps despair. Which was Nolan's intention.
You're just flat out wrong about this.
it sorta reminded me of transformers 3 when the decepticons take over the one city and it appears so hopeless and then some people fix it and the movies over, but i agree batman wasn't used much which I am sure was the plan, bane was played well, I dont think he was the star, but at the end when talia is talking and re-attaching the items on his mask you can see it in his face his pain, it was well done. and then catwoman was also well done, blake was i think the almost obvious star, he was played well and the ending made me a bit happy in away that they may continue the franchise with maybe him as the new batman or nightwing or whatever, but it got me thinking about how good that could be
overall i guess its a good movie don't get me wrong, i think it went on a little to long and dragged a bit, they seemed to want people to see batman/bruce suffer, and i personally have always had a hatred of super hero movies in which they remove a heroes mask, and watching him watch them break into the vault of bat goodies and have bane hit him so hard that his mask broke off was i dunno just odd for me to watch, sort of just all around hard to see batman broke, really deep stuff for a super hero movie
also no superman trailer for me, was disapointed by that
Oh complete agreement there.
The whole thing of giving Bane a love interest does at least give his character a motivation for wanting anything to do with the League of Shadows, but I have huge problems with Bane, who starts out as this awe-inspiring monster of a man who is a revolutionary dictator and a fanatic terrorist all rolled into one, turning out to be some love-sick puppy who is the muscle of the operation as opposed to the brains.
By the way, if this sounds familiar, it's because James Bond did that already.
Since we're sharing, I might as well type out a few of my problems.
So the CIA guy has three mercenaries of Bane, one of whom is Bane, that they captured and have bags over their heads. As far as I could tell, none of the CIA guy's men were insiders working for Bane. If that's the case, who captured Bane and put the bag over his head initially? Because if it was someone looking for a masked man, guess what...
I had absolutely no idea what was going on with the whole Congressman taken hostage, deal gone south, etc. First of all, why does the guy in charge of the rival company want Bruce Wayne's fingerprints again? Second, Catwoman goes into the bar to make a deal, and the Congressman just goes along with it? Then the Congressman gets shot, and he says, "Call me?" So is he in on the plan? Did he know he was going to get shot? And he just went along with it? Because there's NO way he could have missed that something was going down.
Anyway, the cops surround the bar and proceed to block off all exits. Then something really dumb happens. One of Bane's lieutenants, a sniper, starts shooting at the police, prompting them to chase after him, which leads the police and Gordon right into the sewer where Bane's men are working covertly. Why would he draw attention on himself and Bane's entire operation by firing on police officers when they weren't looking for him and Bane clearly wouldn't want them there? And furthermore, why didn't corrupt corporation man get caught for being present at a hostage situation with the Congressman?
Gordon then jumps into the sewer, oh Gordon you so awesome, and Bane tells them to find Gordon. The guy says that Gordon could have washed up anywhere, so Bane gives him a cellphone and then shoots him so he'll wash up where Gordon does and they can track the signal. Yet, despite the fact that Gordon could wash up anywhere and there's no way to know where without a tracking device, Blake manages to find Gordon before Bane does.
So Bane's plan is to waltz into Wall Street, shoot some guns, and then destroy the stock market. Predictably, the entire scene is surrounded by cops within moments, and they cut everything that the crooks need to succeed in their plan. Bane decides they're going to get on motorcycles and start a police car chase to ensure their plan is a success. The police pursue. Now, based on what we see here, it seems as though if Batman hadn't shown up, thereby causing the police to reprioritize, they probably would have caught Bane. So Bane's plan almost failed due to the police doing exactly what anyone could have foreseen they would do.
Further, if Bane wanted to create mass anarchy, why did he need the bomb? Why not simply use the stock exchange to remove all the money in the city or the world, and then have the people of Gotham riot? This is not dissimilar from the movie Fight Club. Indeed, that would have created pandemonium globally. Not to mention the entire bomb plan revolved around Bruce Wayne handing the reactor over to someone else instead of flushing it, when Bruce has been debating over flushing it, and has been established in both The Dark Knight and The Dark Knight Rises to destroy evidence and keep things close to the chest to keep outsiders away from Batman evidence and high tech stuff. He doesn't let his Applied Sciences stuff into anyone's hands, yet gives Miranda a fusion reactor?
So Batman's the star pupil of Ra's al-Ghul AND the world's greatest detective, and he never thinks to hit Bane in the mask, even after he learns what the mask does, until the very last part of the last fight scene? You wouldn't think to maybe aim for that first?
The final fight sequence makes no sense. First of all, the cops are fully armed, but instead of shooting at the criminal army, who are armed with tanks and automatic weapons, they decide to run at them and start punching them. Although, this ends up being a really intelligent decision, as they're able to charge into automatic fire with only a few of them getting mowed down and the tanks proving pretty much useless.
Speaking of tanks, what exactly happens in that initial sequence? Bane orders the tank to open fire and kill them all. The tank fires, then The Bat shows up. Now, I missed what happened here: did The Bat destroy the tank, or did it simply take the shot that was supposed to be fired at the crowd? Because you notice that every time the tanks fire at The Bat, they do nothing. I assume that Batman simply took the shot because his weapons seem to be anti-personnel weapons that do nothing against a tank. Seems short-sighted of Fox considering that the Batpod has massive firepower, but whatever. The point is: Why didn't Batman just stay there and provide air support for the police? He didn't even have to open fire on the crowd, he could have just been disruptive. None of the tanks could shoot him out of the air!
Wait, are you trying to say that Bane himself feels despair, or that Bane is despair?
Neither came across to me.
How is it that Bruce spends the whole film, nearly, repairing the damage of him neglecting his self appointed duty to Gotham and Wayne Enterprises, to then fake his own death after being vindicated in the eyes of the public and police alike? That makes no sense. I don't care when they deviate from canon a bit. I do care when it seems like they don't understand the character. It was a bad enough start that he had hung up the cowl for as long as he had, but then when shown clear evidence that his lack of activity within his company and his city has brought disaster to both, he just retires? That doesn't feel like Bruce Wayne at all. Also, since when does Batman, a trained ninja, have trouble scaling a wall with a rope?
just to answer a few of your questions from what i can recall
yah the leg thing was odd, its really, bad, but then it's not, then he has the device on that allows him to kick through brick, so why not just kick bane hard in that leg, and then hes in the prison, they removed the batsuit, i doubt they left the thing on his leg, so that had to heal along side his back
as for the start, it was banes lieutenant who's always by his side through out the movie that dropped them off to the cia dude, so I am guessing he either pretended to just be a merc or something to the cia guy and then says heres some guys who work for bane, and the cia guy trusts him
dagget or daggert or whatever his name was, he wanted the prints i guess so that bane could goto the stock market, use them to gain access to and drain waynes funds, thus making him broke and allowing dagget or say look waynes broke, i should be in charge now, and then merge both his and waynes company, it was basically just a business thing i guess
and the congressman, when selina gets into the car with him after stealing the necklace from bruce, she asks him for a ride and his reply was "you read my mind" implying that he just went along with this stuff because he was horny and probably let the little congressman do the thinking from that point on
yah gordan in the sewers was random, just as easily could have ended up somewhere else and drowned or whatever
Ah yes. "The Dark Knight Rises" indeed...
And even still, he was obviously being used AND got shot. And his reaction is, "Call me?" Is there magical mind control in this movie?
Ok, so it was one of Bane's guys with them. Got it.
i think he was already a bit drunk, and he sorta when he went in plopped himself down at the bar, so she probably got him good and drunk to make him more agreeable
thanks to DNC of Heroes of the Plane Studios for the coolest sig
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People are split on it. Appose to some other movies where they have obvious problems with them, and the only matter is if it bothered the person enough to not enjoy the movie.
Dark Knight Rises does not have that. People are split on almost every issue. Some people loved Bane and found him a threatening villain other people found him ridiculous and one dimensional. Some people found Anne Hatheyway amazing, other people find her bland. Some people find the political commentary over the top and others find it subtle and inofenssive. The only real consensus I've seen in that Gary Oleman, Michael Kane, and JGL are amazing in there roles.
This is the kind of movie that people takes sides on. I found the movie to be flawed but enjoyable none-the-less. You kind of need to see it for your self to decide.
Calvin and Hobbes
Cube Tutor
Everyone can probably agree it is one of the best three Batman movies to exist.
It will probably be in most peoples top three movies of this year.
There are aspects people don't like, but I think most people enjoyed the movie.
It feels kind of long at some points, and rushed at others though.
So Pro I have an alpha Volcanic Island
I think a lot of the feedback you're hearing right now (on these forums and elsewhere) is gut reactions. It was already going to be pretty polarizing; some people love what Nolan had done with Batman, others haven't, and there was little hope that this movie would change anyone's mind one way or another. Most of what your hearing is either praise from the Nolan Fan Club, while many of it's detractors are the comic book readers who don't care for the grim and gritty retelling, or people who didn't care for the series to begin with. Over time, I think we'll start to see these two sides reach a lot more mutual ground on aspects of the film.
I think the true test for me is two things - A) How much I remember aspects of the film over time (though I can already say, the fast pace means certain things weren't at impactful or memorable as they should have been), and B) How many times I go back to see it. Dark Knight brought me to the threatre three times. I anticipate going to see DKR again to see it in IMAX, but we'll see if there's a third for this one as well, or if the second one even happens.
Yeah...
I was quite surprised about how flagrantly inconsistent the movie was about this. Presumably the leg injury is from the end of TDK when he takes that fall since he's been a hermit until now, but 8 goddam years and he's still hobbled? And, within a few months he's spry again?
The scene with his back was beyond stupid as well. "Okay, stand very still while I donkey punch you in the lower back to fix it. Don't worry, I'm a trained professional inmate of a secret prison." What the hell? And then, on top of that, he's expected to stand up in short order? The injuries he had and the recovery time required would be quite long in top notch facilities, but he's in a prison for heaven sakes. I know superhero movies require a leap of faith, but for a series that attempted to be more grounded in reality, this was a brainless departure.
Ugh...
That seemed to be a theme of the entire movie...
That Bruce Wayne suffered mostly brain injuries and is now incompetent. Seriously, he's a pretty sharp guy as a character, and usually invests time to learn how to defeat his enemies. A guy is wearing a mask like that and you don't think it could be a vulnerability?
I'm glad I'm not the only one who noticed that...
Yeah, it seems like The Bat has an interesting ability to turn artillery rounds from Tumblers into smoke.
And lastly
I present to you, the inspiration for the end of the movie:
http://www.gifsoup.com/view/22625/batman-bomb.html
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G4v1hAnfy1I
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Bane was a little underwhelming to me. Based on the Knightfall comic arc, Bane ought to be one of the most impressive villains in the Rogues Gallery: Batman's equal (or superior) in intelligence and power. There was some feeling of those characteristics - he did break Batman's back and his spirit - but for some reason I didn't feel it quite enough.
What really annoyed me though...
There was no hint at Miranda Tate being Talia Al Ghul, unless you already knew she existed (scar and injuries or lack thereof notwithstanding), which was really ****; in fact, I didn't even know who that character was until I saw this thread. It came out of nowhere, and there was absolutely no motivation for it, and any momentum stemming from Bane was immediately dissipated.
What could have been really cool was playing closer to Knightfall, and having a replacement Batman who Bruce Wayne would eventually have to fight. I loved that part of Knightfall because Wayne recognized that it was his spirit that needed to be rebuilt, and so he concentrated on building himself, the man inside the suit, sharply contrasting with Jean-Paul Valley's heavy weapon/gadget style, which is what allowed him to win.