Time to get back into this game. Sorry again for the absence.
I'm going to reread from the beginning.
28 (KK): I don't agree with KK's reasoning on hansanator.
32 (kaburi): I had actually sort of skimmed over kaburi last time so I'm paying closer attention to him this time around. His post here follows the same sort of things I was seeing.
36 (KK): I don't understand; if they aren't reliable, why were you still voting him when it was disproved on top of it?
48 (Hansanator): Oh yeah but then hansanator started into this. I wonder, has KK played with Hansanator before?
69 (Jay13x): Jay is town.
92 (KK): In retrospect I wonder if KK was just letting the vote sit in order to wait for something he could push on han. Nah, that sounds too tinfoil-y to me. But I don't understand why KK kept the vote on in between, either way.
109 (ria): I like Ria for town.
120 (Jay): I don't think a noob would put this much work into the game unless he was genuinely trying to determine alignments. This seals my read on Jay.
Oh yeah, CCM7 is done now, yeah? I was told what I was told about Teia's meta I believe in the Crafters chat for CCM7, or maybe in the actual thread, and Teia flipped scum while following her scum meta. That's why I thought Teia was scum, and why I said I saw it proven to me.
148 (GM): Why is GM not commenting on almost anything?
157 (KK): KK makes a good point about Teia.
!!! 176 (KK): KK jumps back on hansanator when the wagon seems to be moving again.
262 (Teia): This makes me feel uncomfortable but I can't point to exactly why.
293 (Teia): And this one makes me feel uncomfortable and I know EXACTLY why. It looks like it's adding something useful but it's not.
That brings us to Day 2.
388 (BV): I was asked for my reads on GM and KK; I think KK is scum and GM I feel weird about so I have no real read yet.
It seems GM is being run up, but I don't know the meta. If enough people tell me this is his scum meta I'm willing to go for it though.
GM suddenly posting a lot after he comes under pressure from more than one player.
I don't have time to fully analyze this last page, I'm going to come back to everything after post 400 in my next post.
I don't know about KK right now. I thought he was town earlier. He's picked up on Void's wagon against Teia and pushed it pretty damned hard. He wants to come across as legitimately thinking Teia's scum, but it seems disingenuous to me.
Why do you think its disingenuous?
@Wheat: Let me know whether your opinion of me changes after you finish reading everything. But I hope, if you still think I'm scum, that you held back part of your reasoning from that post. Otherwise I'll be disappointed in you.
@rian: you've been keeping your opinions to your self since our exchange. Have you fully read my and Teia's exchange + what do you think of it now?
The fact that everyone is apparently ignoring my Teia case is :-/. Laziness gives scum wins people. The posts aren't even long by mafia standards.
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I'll bet you wish you had a non-unglued/unhinged card that shared your first name.
It's all very wordy and I haven't gotten the mental focus to slog through them yet, at least not enough to understand them completely. (Except for rian's. I didn't understand his point at all in his latest post, but tried rereading a couple of times because it was short. It didn't help.)
Anyway, Town Void has never been known for strong cases or perfect logic. See the latest clan contest mafia that just ended for an example. My first reading of the counter-arguments told me void's accused of pulling a relationship out of no where and anally sticking to it like fact and participating in confirmation bias. Both of these are firmly within Void's town meta.
And while he's going after the people I find scummy, I find little reason to delve into text walls. Especially when his detractors are arguing he's bad at arguing rather than actually finding scum motivation behind his arguments.
You were so quick to agree with Void and hop on the Teia wagon, yet you "haven't gotten the mental focus to slog through [the counterarguments to Void's case on Teia]?" Then go on to summarize the counterarguments as "arguing that he's bad a arguing rather than actually finding scum motivation"? The same counterarguments you just said you hadn't read? That's pretty much the definition of disingenuous:
dis·in·gen·u·ous
/ˌdisinˈjenyo͞oəs/
Adjective
Not candid or sincere, typically by pretending that one knows less about something than one really does
Bold emphasis mine.
You gave yourself an out by saying you hadn't read the counterarguments to Void's case (despite having just dismissed them outright, which implies you've at least looked at them), so that if the Teia wagon starts to backfire you can hop off later. That doesn't exactly give off town vibes.
posting from a Wii U is terrible
basically I'll post something reasonable tomorrow but I haven't seen anything that shakes my scum reads on Void and KK
My first reading of the counter-arguments told me...
You were so quick to agree with Void and hop on the Teia wagon, yet you "haven't gotten the mental focus to slog through [the counterarguments to Void's case on Teia]?" Then go on to summarize the counterarguments as "arguing that he's bad a arguing rather than actually finding scum motivation"? The same counterarguments you just said you hadn't read? That's pretty much the definition of disingenuous:
You gave yourself an out by saying you hadn't read the counterarguments to Void's case (despite having just dismissed them outright, which implies you've at least looked at them), so that if the Teia wagon starts to backfire you can hop off later. That doesn't exactly give off town vibes.
I did read the Void cases. I said I read the Void cases. I just got bored and skimmed in places, thus came my comment that I hadn't fully slogged through them.
By now, I've gone back and done the slogging and can safely say my first impression of the cases is exactly right.
The fact that everyone on Void's wagon is refusing to believe this fits in his town meta and won't even investigate it for themselves, such as by reading CCMVII as I suggested, is telling me that this is a mislynch driven by scum (Teia and GM), upset that they don't have as strong a case as they thought they did.
Also: please tell me how, after making the massively aggressive posts I have on Teia, you think I could ever hop off safely?
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I'll bet you wish you had a non-unglued/unhinged card that shared your first name.
Void's scum meta, the parts I use to identify him as scum/town at least, are in his posting style. He often lurks more as scum and when he posts he's cautious about throwing suspicion on people, usually trying to muddy another player's image rather than becoming accusatory. By contrast, he's very aggressive as town, sometimes to the point of losing his head on his cases and indulging in logical fallacies and confirmation bias. I actually took advantage of this in basic 68 as scum to pick apart his argument against me and survive, despite the fact that he was an un-CCed bodyguard.
EBWODP: Upon rereading your post I have to ask, what is a 'full barn' then?
A full barn. I wasn't specific about what I liked in my original post, but I did say "for providing evidence" and I later said what I was talking about by evidence.
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I'll bet you wish you had a non-unglued/unhinged card that shared your first name.
I should have worded it slightly better (I never wished to imply that your whole case on her is based on her meta), but read the opening line of the post I linked to - you explicitly say that one of the reasons that you think Teia is scum is because she's playing to her scum meta.
Right, and there are legitimate town reasons for knowing my case isn't based on meta, yet calling my case a meta case and listing it as a reason I'm scummy.
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I'll bet you wish you had a non-unglued/unhinged card that shared your first name.
It's entirely possible that he's scum and hasn't been counterclaimed due to a lack of town vig (see CCMVII for such a game). I know that's reaching, but I want to throw it out there because this post really makes me uncomfortable.
EBWODP: Upon rereading your post I have to ask, what is a 'full barn' then?
A full barn. I wasn't specific about what I liked in my original post, but I did say "for providing evidence" and I later said what I was talking about by evidence.
This is some serious weaseling here, KK. Since you've not brought it up, I'm left to conclude you don't agree with the part about Teia's shift on Iso (which was the main thing I referenced when I voted Void, that you subsequently handwaved as Void being terrible town).
If hans flips scum, scrutinize Jay/Void/Wheat/rianalnn. I doubt he'd be foolish enough to list both his buddies in there, but I'd be surprised if that list was all town, and picking from a small pool is more likely to find scum than picking from a larger pool.
Now this is the gem that had me questioning Teia as we went into Night. Teia was all over Wheaties yesterDay. But, prior going into Night, Teia gives herself an out for Wheaties without much of an explanation. Granted the information I am using is implied here, but since Teia posted that if hansanator flips scum, then those 4 should be scrutinized. Then if hansanator flips Town, then those should not be scrutinized is what I get.
Bold emphasis is mine. He's totally misconstruing what Teia said and even calls it an implication, suggesting that it's not at all concrete and most importantly acknowledging such.
When BV breaks down why the Teia's-shift-on-Wheat part of Void's post is garbage, you ignore it. Why?
So while Void picks at Teia "waffling" & you giving that the thumbs up, BV posts this;
I also noticed a post from Wheat_Grinder which made me :eyebrow:. He's an uncounterclaimed vig with actual claimed results to support himself, and that's enough for him to be in my town list at the moment; however, this REALLY reads as a scum slip to me.
I'm going to try and make a post in this game toNight since I've sort of been ignoring it in favor of my other games.
bolding mine; you're not using that convention correctly – this would be a reference to the Game's Night 2. toDay = this game Day. toNight = next Game Night.
I've lost momentum x_x
Re-reading Day 1.
whoops. I'm so used to saying toDay and toNight in the context of mafia.
I had meant to post last night but got sidetracked. Today I'm (supposed to be) studying for a final so it'll have to be tomorrow for content.
It's entirely possible that he's scum and hasn't been counterclaimed due to a lack of town vig (see CCMVII for such a game). I know that's reaching, but I want to throw it out there because this post really makes me uncomfortable.
Anyway, I'm ready to vote Void, but I want to see him claim first.
Which is what I say fence-sitting actually looks like – "he's in my town list at the moment but this REALLY reads like a scum slip" – if ever there was a post leaving a door open, this is it. Yet you don't even comment.
I need to re-read to be sure but in CCMVI, I remember Void's townie play being lurky & distracting – basically what you just described as his scum meta.
You're forgetting/ignoring the fact that Wheat claimed...
Yes, that & Teia's two posts referring to Wheat's claim where she doesn't appear to be considering the full claim.
In that case, I think Teia would ignore part of wheat's claim because she was trying to put doubt in the town's minds about Wheat and get a mislynch wagon started. And even if a wagon didn't start, she called him town, so she doesn't get in caught in the attempt, right?
This is some serious weaseling here, KK. Since you've not brought it up, I'm left to conclude you don't agree with the part about Teia's shift on Iso (which was the main thing I referenced when I voted Void, that you subsequently handwaved as Void being terrible town).
Just the truth. And is it really news that I didn't agree with Void's logic on Teia+Iso at this point?
So while Void picks at Teia "waffling" & you giving that the thumbs up, BV posts this;
Which is what I say fence-sitting actually looks like – "he's in my town list at the moment but this REALLY reads like a scum slip" – if ever there was a post leaving a door open, this is it. Yet you don't even comment.
I missed it because I was focusing on what he said about me.
You're right though, which makes me even more optimistic that I've got the scumteam pegged.
I need to re-read to be sure but in CCMVI, I remember Void's townie play being lurky & distracting – basically what you just described as his scum meta.
I read that game at the time, but I don't recall much of it. I think I stopped reading religiously when our clanmate got lynched.
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I'll bet you wish you had a non-unglued/unhinged card that shared your first name.
I'm not going to continue that previous back-and-forth with KK. It's run its course of anything that could possibly be useful, and to continue it would be detrimental. Me "playing to [my] scum meta" is a reason (along with lengthy examples) he thinks I'm scum, but his case apparently isn't built on my meta. Okay, sure.
I also noticed a post from Wheat_Grinder which made me :eyebrow:. He's an uncounterclaimed vig with actual claimed results to support himself, and that's enough for him to be in my town list at the moment; however, this REALLY reads as a scum slip to me.
...
It's entirely possible that he's scum and hasn't been counterclaimed due to a lack of town vig (see CCMVII for such a game). I know that's reaching, but I want to throw it out there because this post really makes me uncomfortable.
Given the context, I'm not sure what could plausibly support that he meant the game night rather than the real-life night. It seems like an excuse to waffle on his read.
It's not the first time we've seen him waffle around, either. On day 1, he went after Iso pretty hard (saying he's distancing, accusing him of flailing around trying to start wagons, and handwaving), only to have his case "fall apart" at the last second, then laud Iso for catching scum and joining the Wheat wagon.
In that case, I think Teia would ignore part of wheat's claim because she was trying to put doubt in the town's minds about Wheat and get a mislynch wagon started. And even if a wagon didn't start, she called him town, so she doesn't get in caught in the attempt, right?
I'm not going to continue that previous back-and-forth with KK. It's run its course of anything that could possibly be useful, and to continue it would be detrimental. Me "playing to [my] scum meta" is a reason (along with lengthy examples) he thinks I'm scum, but his case apparently isn't built on my meta. Okay, sure.
Seriously? You people can't see Teia is scum after this endless handwaving and strawmanning of my case?
Teia: You think it's town behavior to handwave cases? If you think my case is all meta, why don't you talk about it and prove it as I've asked you to do multiple times? If my case were actually as bad as you claim, you should have no problem proving me wrong.
But you don't. You toss mud and handwave and hide behind the town's laziness.
Wake up and read the thread Town. Teia is obvscum and you're all ignoring it.
Given the context, I'm not sure what could plausibly support that he meant the game night rather than the real-life night. It seems like an excuse to waffle on his read.
It's not the first time we've seen him waffle around, either. On day 1, he went after Iso pretty hard (saying he's distancing, accusing him of flailing around trying to start wagons, and handwaving), only to have his case "fall apart" at the last second, then laud Iso for catching scum and joining the Wheat wagon.
So for the second time this game, you go after someone I started the case on while still calling me scum.
In that case, I think Teia would ignore part of wheat's claim because she was trying to put doubt in the town's minds about Wheat and get a mislynch wagon started. And even if a wagon didn't start, she called him town, so she doesn't get in caught in the attempt, right?
WIFOM.
Of course its WIFOM. Rian asked me why you would have done the ignored half of forgot/ignored. He didn't ask me about the half that could mean you were town. I in no way said nor implied this was "THE WAY IT HAPPENED 100%!"
This is the 5th or so time you've deliberately misinterpreted something to cast me in a scummy light.
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I'll bet you wish you had a non-unglued/unhinged card that shared your first name.
Did Teia say that Wheat joined the Wheat wagon? I did not understand that bit (middle of 490).
Are you guys aware that we only have one more day to deadline? It looks like the rules say there is no lynch unless we reach 5 votes. Not sure if you're all aware that No Lynch Day 2 is bad for town
Are you guys aware that we only have one more day to deadline? It looks like the rules say there is no lynch unless we reach 5 votes. Not sure if you're all aware that No Lynch Day 2 is bad for town
In both cases, he hints at trying to start a wagon on BV, who some (including me) listed as a scummy candidate on Day 1.
Where did I accuse you of trying to "avoid scrutiny?"
Being facetious does not count as a counter-argument. What was the point of bringing up that other people found BV scummy if not to claim that I was trying to get aboard a safe wagon?
So for the second time this game, you go after someone I started the case on while still calling me scum.
Get lynched.
Are you seriously suggesting that because player A calls player C scum, player B can't express suspicion of both player A & player C?
Oh, forgot this.
They can, except when its. "Player A is positive Player B is scum, but Player C, who Player B started the wagon on, is scummy at the same time."
Scum almost never begin bus wagons on their own, and this is the second time this game Teia's jumped on a wagon I started (not that she fully jumped on this time) without even addressing the fact that its unlikely we're both scum.
As with everything else she's been doing this game, she ignores everything that could possibly cast her in a negative light in hopes that it will just fade away.
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I'll bet you wish you had a non-unglued/unhinged card that shared your first name.
oh good, I guess that was the Day 1 deadline, nevermind
Ok, KK, I guess "avoiding scrutiny" is another interpretation of that behavior, it's just not something I was specifically thinking. The fact remains that you seem to be pushing for a BV lynch but unwilling to commit to the first vote, that's what I found particularly scummy about your actions there.
So here's the question for you then - what makes the Teia case stronger than your case on BV?
Are you guys aware that we only have one more day to deadline? It looks like the rules say there is no lynch unless we reach 5 votes. Not sure if you're all aware that No Lynch Day 2 is bad for town
Ok, KK, I guess "avoiding scrutiny" is another interpretation of that behavior, it's just not something I was specifically thinking. The fact remains that you seem to be pushing for a BV lynch but unwilling to commit to the first vote, that's what I found particularly scummy about your actions there.
You're dodging the question. What was your reasoning behind bringing up that other people found BV scummy as well if not to say I was attempting to get on a safe wagon?
So here's the question for you then - what makes the Teia case stronger than your case on BV?
Well, firstly that I've taken the time to put together the Teia case and seen how strong it is, while BV I haven't put everything together on for side-by-side comparison.
Also, BV is someone I always read as scummy even when he's town. So I really need to put together a strong case rather than just believe I have one before I vote him.
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I'll bet you wish you had a non-unglued/unhinged card that shared your first name.
71 - KK agrees with Iso that Void is scum, because KK learned to read Void from Dietryp. Can you elaborate here?
160 - Talk about inconsistent reads. Void questions KK's early vote on hans and says he is suspicious of KK, but also that KK's response is good and that Teia is twisting KK's legit argument against hans. Then later we have "Teia is scum and KK undecided," and they are on different teams.
176 - KK explicitly says he is getting back on the hans wagon because Void and Iso agreed
181 - Void feels that KK is town after KK says obvious stuff about RVS and explains that he didn't think about hans having non-MTGS Mafia experience
196 - Here's kaburi saying BV could be scum, Iso has also called out BV for voting Iso by this point
205 - BV's tries to defend himself against Iso and then decides to join him in voting Wheat. BV's scummiest post so far
221 - KK "wouldn't be surprised" if both Iso and Wheat are town - one of which is confirmed, the other of which is near-confirmed. It's hard when you know everyone's alignment, isn't it?
222 - This is where KK first states he is suspicious of BV, but we're in hans wagon mode by now, so there's not a vote or a super-developed case
Explain how your feelings on BV have gone on Day 2 then, KK. I can see that you wanted to push him, but I'm very confused as to why you were distracted from that push to agree with Void's case on Teia. As I said, nobody was pegging BV as town by the end of Day 1. It seems like you wanted to push him but decided you couldn't because of what Void was doing for some reason. Town make their own decisions and push who they want.
You're dodging the question. What was your reasoning behind bringing up that other people found BV scummy as well if not to say I was attempting to get on a safe wagon?
I'll answer your questions when you answer mine. Plus I've got to go mow the lawn right now.
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I'll bet you wish you had a non-unglued/unhinged card that shared your first name.
BV
Please explain how calling yourself Town is scummy. Use examples of players stating so or proving that is scummy.
Everyone
To whomever said I was pushing a bad scum tell (or evidence or whatever was said about it) on GM for the “I’m Town" thing. I even stated I wasn’t sure how accurate it is. It’s the first time I AM testing too see if it may or may not be a good scum tell. I am not using this as supportive evidence or any kind of evidence against GM.
Also, please take a look at my case again. I have outlined why Teia is scum from a Behavior stand point. There was no reason for Teia to start changing her read on Wheaties during Day 1. AFAWK Wheaties could be scum in this game with a smart claim.
There may be a few things from my case that I believe it getting over looked here. But the one below is a strong point against Teia.
Something I am noticing about this post that I did not notice earlier is that Teia dropped her read on Iso because of Wheaties, but then uses reasoning that does not make sense with he read on Iso. “Apparently I was mistaken” does not mean that Teia was reading Iso incorrectly. The fact that Iso flipped Town may support inside information, because the reason used, by Teia, does not make Iso Town. As far as Teia knew both Iso and Wheaties could have been scum at that juncture.
The reason I said I was mistaken was because Iso provided compelling and reasonable arguments for a scum read on Wheat, as opposed to Wheat's scummy-looking arguments. Sure, as far as I knew, both of them could've been scum, but I deemed this outcome unlikely based upon their interactions.
If Iso provided compelling and reasonable arguments, then why did you consider Iso to be scum in the first place?
This response from Teia shows that Teia knew Iso was giving valid reads and reason since Teia, herself, acknowledged that Iso is giving "compelling and reasonable arguments". But yet she was scum reading Iso for having "compelling and reasonable arguments". That is not how a Townie acts. If a Townie believes someone is giving "compelling and reasonable arguments", then why would Townie say that person is Scum? Hint: They wouldn’t
Yes KK, I think you were trying to get a wagon started on an easy target. That is not the main source of my suspicion of you though, it's the fact that you pushed at him without voting and deferred to Void's case on Teia instead of actually following through on BV.
As town, like our last Flamingo game, I feel you stick to your convictions and are quick to notice bad wagons. You did that against TK in MM7 as well. Ignoring all the logical errors and misdirection in Void's arguments is not something I think town KK would do.
As for Void himself, did you use an ability last night? Why or why not? Also, nice to know that you were just slinging mud randomly instead of having an actual reason to point out that I never said "I'm town." Teia can field the stuff directed at her, but I see no reason why people can't change their reads as an argument progresses - Iso started out making some random stabs like the one at me, but his case on Wheat did make sense at the time, which even Wheat acknowledged by claiming. However, it looks like you still want to cast suspicion on Wheat. If he didn't misvig Iso, what do you think happened?
Is there anything outstanding I need to respond to so far that I've missed? It's my mother-in-law's birthday today, and I've got my HazMat class again tomorrow, so I don't have a lot of free (read: in depth) reading and posting time.
I'm honestly confused by what's going on right now. It's pretty clear that with the right spin anyone's posting can be misconstrued. I'm still suspicious of Teia and GM because of their actions, and when I get the chance I'll go back and take a look at their pairings since Day One and see what I come up with.
Scum almost never begin bus wagons on their own, and this is the second time this game Teia's jumped on a wagon I started (not that she fully jumped on this time) without even addressing the fact that its unlikely we're both scum.
You're stretching the definition of "wagon" to the breaking point here. I didn't vote him, nor did I say conclusively whether he's likely scum or not. I simply pointed out that he's waffling a fair bit.
Did you use any of those abilities? If so, what were your results?
Also, please take a look at my case again. I have outlined why Teia is scum from a Behavior stand point. There was no reason for Teia to start changing her read on Wheaties during Day 1. AFAWK Wheaties could be scum in this game with a smart claim.
First, reads can change as new information becomes available. As Wheat and Iso posted more and more content, it appeared that my suspicion of Iso was misplaced, and Wheat appeared increasingly scummy. I changed my reads accordingly. Sure, he could be scum, but given his claim and the night results, there's no reason to assume that's the case as there's no supportive evidence I can see.
This response from Teia shows that Teia knew Iso was giving valid reads and reason since Teia, herself, acknowledged that Iso is giving "compelling and reasonable arguments". But yet she was scum reading Iso for having "compelling and reasonable arguments". That is not how a Townie acts. If a Townie believes someone is giving "compelling and reasonable arguments", then why would Townie say that person is Scum? Hint: They wouldn’t
You're conflating things that shouldn't be conflated here, along with misrepresenting my play. Yes, I was suspicious of Iso for a time. But his arguments, which I described with the above adjectives, eventually swayed me to a town read of him and a scum read of Wheat.
5) Teia comes out the gate Day 2 calling Wheaties Town despite everything about her play from yesterDay.
Wheat claimed vig. There were two kills overnight. Then Wheat claimed he shot Iso. There were no counterclaims. Are you suggesting that I should somehow cling to a scum read?
What "actions" did Teia or I take that appear scummy to you?
Also, the scum want you to be confused. Read through the cases again when you have time and tell us more specifically what you don't understand. Although if the answer is "stuff that Void and KK posted," the answer is "because scum."
I'm not sure what Wheat is getting at with his question to Void, but apparently he needs to define "recently" so we can advance with the claim discussion. How about last 10 games Void played in?
Also, please take a look at my case again. I have outlined why Teia is scum from a Behavior stand point. There was no reason for Teia to start changing her read on Wheaties during Day 1. AFAWK Wheaties could be scum in this game with a smart claim.
First, reads can change as new information becomes available. As Wheat and Iso posted more and more content, it appeared that my suspicion of Iso was misplaced, and Wheat appeared increasingly scummy. I changed my reads accordingly. Sure, he could be scum, but given his claim and the night results, there's no reason to assume that's the case as there's no supportive evidence I can see.
But you were suspicious of Iso for giving "compelling and reasonable arguments". That is what you posted about Iso. If you truly believe that Iso was posting "compelling and reasonable arguments", then there is no reason for you to believe Iso to be Scum. If anything, that would make you believe that Iso is Town. But, as we know, that is not the case here.
This response from Teia shows that Teia knew Iso was giving valid reads and reason since Teia, herself, acknowledged that Iso is giving "compelling and reasonable arguments". But yet she was scum reading Iso for having "compelling and reasonable arguments". That is not how a Townie acts. If a Townie believes someone is giving "compelling and reasonable arguments", then why would Townie say that person is Scum? Hint: They wouldn’t
You're conflating things that shouldn't be conflated here, along with misrepresenting my play. Yes, I was suspicious of Iso for a time. But his arguments, which I described with the above adjectives, eventually swayed me to a town read of him and a scum read of Wheat.
Except for the fact that you KNEW Iso was giving "compelling and reasonable arguments". Then because Wheaties got scummier, to you, your read in Iso changed to Town.
How one player can think that "compelling and reasonable arguments" is a reason to Scum read someone is very laughable. Then to change that Scum read to Town because the person they were interacting with is now Scummier makes no sense. Seriously, everyone, think about this for a moment. If Teia was Scum reading Iso and then thought Wheaties was Scum, then why would Teia’s read on Iso change? As far as we knew at the time, both Iso and Wheaties could have been Scumbuddies. But, we know that is not the case.
5) Teia comes out the gate Day 2 calling Wheaties Town despite everything about her play from yesterDay.
Wheat claimed vig. There were two kills overnight. Then Wheat claimed he shot Iso. There were no counterclaims. Are you suggesting that I should somehow cling to a scum read?
The only thing I am saying is that your behavior leading up to Wheaties claim doesn’t make any sense. If anything, it should have been the start of Day 2 when you began to read Wheaties as Town since we all would have the information in front of us. But, on Day 1, all Wheaties did was claim and you began to believe him to be Town.
I am willing to lynch either GM or Teia at this point.
EWP: GM, I appreciate you answering, but you are not Wheaties. I would rather have an exact number than to come back in here and have Wheaties tell me I didn't check back enough.
Are you guys aware that we only have one more day to deadline? It looks like the rules say there is no lynch unless we reach 5 votes. Not sure if you're all aware that No Lynch Day 2 is bad for town
BV
Please explain how calling yourself Town is scummy. Use examples of players stating so or proving that is scummy.
Everyone
To whomever said I was pushing a bad scum tell (or evidence or whatever was said about it) on GM for the “I’m Town" thing. I even stated I wasn’t sure how accurate it is. It’s the first time I AM testing too see if it may or may not be a good scum tell. I am not using this as supportive evidence or any kind of evidence against GM.
I hope this illustrates why that behaviour is scummy (& if anyone has more examples gimme gimme I collect them all).
Current mindset: Jay is town (but with this tiny nagging feeling that I might have been wrong about that which cleared him), kaburi is town (no nagging there), ria is town. KoolKoal is scum, and I'm paying very close attention to GM and Teia. BlackVise is an unknown to me, as is Void. BlackVise is my own fault though; I find myself skimming all of his posts.
401 (Void): While I'm feeling weird about Teia, this case makes me feel even weirder about Void. He calls Teia out on waffling on me, and then illustrates how Teia had a pretty natural progression into finding me scummy. He finds it odd that Teia questioned Iso despite "being mistaken" about Iso, but I don't find that necessarily scummy.
402 (KK): I strongly dislike the way KK jumps on the case before the rebuttal. If KK is scum like I suspect then Teia for sure is town and possibly BV as well. Void I'm less certain is scum this way.
403 (Teia): Teia's rebuttal makes me feel better about Teia.
411 (kaburi): This makes me feel even better about kaburi being town; he pointed out exactly what I was thinking with Teia v. Void.
416 (GM): Coaching of kaburi, but why, if kaburi is town?
417 (Void): lol that OMGUS. Void is scum.
418 (KK): And KK immediately jumps to defend Void. Hole in one.
424 (Jay): Jay is not scum with Void and KK.
426 (Void): But how is Teia scum for that? Only #3 counts as a strike against Teia, and only if you twist it pretty hard. #5 is explained by #4, and #1 and #2 don't contradict the rest like you seem to think.
428 (Void): So if someone doesn't agree with your characterization, they're scum?
430 (Jay): I was waiting for someone to point that out with Ria. I still feel Ria is town, but that was the one thing nagging me about him.
That seals it, nagging feeling gone, Jay is all the way town.
433 (Void): oh lord Void do you really believe this?
Also your tone says you don't believe GM is scum.
437 (Ria): The last nail in Void's coffin. Not that we needed another; the casket is more metal than wood at this point.
439 (KK): "As for liking Void's case on Teia, I more liked it that he found some evidence because all I had before that was meta."
hoo hoo hooboy
we got us a live one.
446 (KK): So if you didn't have the mental focus to slog, why did you slog for a case on Teia? (That was rhetorical unless you have a *really* good answer)
448 (KK): "Ignore large swaths of my case, hm?"
hoo hoo hooboy
we got us a live one.
Let's see, skipping some of the casefights as useless...
473 (KK): No, my opinion of you didn't change. Unless you count going from being pretty sure to completely sure you're scum.
Also, if it makes you feel better, I read your case. Well, up until you started it with LOLOLOLOLOL instead of logic.
474 (kaburi): Oh I love you so, I was worried no one caught that.
---
The end!
Void and KK are scum together.
Kaburi and Jay are definitely town.
Ria...I feel he's town but I've got a nagging feeling in my stomach. My eye will be upon him.
Teia and Gerrard's Mom are the same alignment as each other, which probably means they are town.
BlackVise is probably the third scum by POE but I won't worry about the third scum until Void and KK are dead. Unfortunately, I still find myself skipping over his posts.
I'm pretty sure KK has few enough votes to be voted for safely; Void is too close to a lynch right now for me to feel comfortable voting him until there's been discussion on his claim.
BV
Please explain how calling yourself Town is scummy. Use examples of players stating so or proving that is scummy.
Everyone
To whomever said I was pushing a bad scum tell (or evidence or whatever was said about it) on GM for the “I’m Town" thing. I even stated I wasn’t sure how accurate it is. It’s the first time I AM testing too see if it may or may not be a good scum tell. I am not using this as supportive evidence or any kind of evidence against GM.
I hope this illustrates why that behaviour is scummy (& if anyone has more examples gimme gimme I collect them all).
Why are you answering for GM? Do you believe GM is not capable of answering the question? Also, you didn't even asnwer the question in the way I asked. Using cartoon stuff (where you can SEE THE OTHER PERSON?THING) is NOT a good comparison to use.
So for the second time this game, you go after someone I started the case on while still calling me scum.
Get lynched.
Are you seriously suggesting that because player A calls player C scum, player B can't express suspicion of both player A & player C?
Oh, forgot this.
They can, except when its. "Player A is positive Player B is scum, but Player C, who Player B started the wagon on, is scummy at the same time."
Scum almost never begin bus wagons on their own, and this is the second time this game Teia's jumped on a wagon I started (not that she fully jumped on this time) without even addressing the fact that its unlikely we're both scum.
As with everything else she's been doing this game, she ignores everything that could possibly cast her in a negative light in hopes that it will just fade away.
BV
Please explain how calling yourself Town is scummy. Use examples of players stating so or proving that is scummy.
Everyone
To whomever said I was pushing a bad scum tell (or evidence or whatever was said about it) on GM for the “I’m Town" thing. I even stated I wasn’t sure how accurate it is. It’s the first time I AM testing too see if it may or may not be a good scum tell. I am not using this as supportive evidence or any kind of evidence against GM.
I hope this illustrates why that behaviour is scummy (& if anyone has more examples gimme gimme I collect them all).
Why are you answering for GM? Do you believe GM is not capable of answering the question? Also, you didn't even asnwer the question in the way I asked. Using cartoon stuff (where you can SEE THE OTHER PERSON?THING) is NOT a good comparison to use.
Whatever guy. It's been discussed umpteen times here & on GGery & Misetings. It is a known mafia meme in the circles I travel, if only because I post one of these images when it comes up.
I will dig up prior times it has come up when naptime rolls around.
"As with everything else she's been doing this game, she ignores everything that could possibly cast her in a negative light in hopes that it will just fade away."
I mean, I already answered that as far as I'm concerned, Void. Although I appreciate the humorous backup from ria, I'm suspicious of his lightning wagon switch to follow Wheat. I think he has dropped some reasonable analysis, but his votes on Void and KK today look like he is trying to vote as soon as possible after a wagon is declared "safe."
So Wheat, are you willing to lynch Void after we discuss his claim more? I'd rather lynch the person who initiated the bad case than the person who barned it, but I'm willing to lynch KK today as well. I need to see at least one of them flip before I make a call on third scum.
Void, you weren't very active at the end of Day 1, so I couldn't find any specific information on this. What were your reads on Wheat and Iso at the end of the Day?
I mean, I already answered that as far as I'm concerned, Void. Although I appreciate the humorous backup from ria, I'm suspicious of his lightning wagon switch to follow Wheat. I think he has dropped some reasonable analysis, but his votes on Void and KK today look like he is trying to vote as soon as possible after a wagon is declared "safe."
I sort of doubt that he made that decision within 4 minutes of my post because of my post.
So Wheat, are you willing to lynch Void after we discuss his claim more? I'd rather lynch the person who initiated the bad case than the person who barned it, but I'm willing to lynch KK today as well. I need to see at least one of them flip before I make a call on third scum.
I'm more than willing to lynch Void toDay, and I'm just as willing to lynch KK instead. They are almost certainly both scum together; their actions don't make sense if they aren't.
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I'm going to reread from the beginning.
28 (KK): I don't agree with KK's reasoning on hansanator.
32 (kaburi): I had actually sort of skimmed over kaburi last time so I'm paying closer attention to him this time around. His post here follows the same sort of things I was seeing.
36 (KK): I don't understand; if they aren't reliable, why were you still voting him when it was disproved on top of it?
48 (Hansanator): Oh yeah but then hansanator started into this. I wonder, has KK played with Hansanator before?
69 (Jay13x): Jay is town.
92 (KK): In retrospect I wonder if KK was just letting the vote sit in order to wait for something he could push on han. Nah, that sounds too tinfoil-y to me. But I don't understand why KK kept the vote on in between, either way.
109 (ria): I like Ria for town.
120 (Jay): I don't think a noob would put this much work into the game unless he was genuinely trying to determine alignments. This seals my read on Jay.
Oh yeah, CCM7 is done now, yeah? I was told what I was told about Teia's meta I believe in the Crafters chat for CCM7, or maybe in the actual thread, and Teia flipped scum while following her scum meta. That's why I thought Teia was scum, and why I said I saw it proven to me.
148 (GM): Why is GM not commenting on almost anything?
157 (KK): KK makes a good point about Teia.
!!! 176 (KK): KK jumps back on hansanator when the wagon seems to be moving again.
262 (Teia): This makes me feel uncomfortable but I can't point to exactly why.
293 (Teia): And this one makes me feel uncomfortable and I know EXACTLY why. It looks like it's adding something useful but it's not.
That brings us to Day 2.
388 (BV): I was asked for my reads on GM and KK; I think KK is scum and GM I feel weird about so I have no real read yet.
It seems GM is being run up, but I don't know the meta. If enough people tell me this is his scum meta I'm willing to go for it though.
GM suddenly posting a lot after he comes under pressure from more than one player.
I don't have time to fully analyze this last page, I'm going to come back to everything after post 400 in my next post.
@Wheat: Let me know whether your opinion of me changes after you finish reading everything. But I hope, if you still think I'm scum, that you held back part of your reasoning from that post. Otherwise I'll be disappointed in you.
@rian: you've been keeping your opinions to your self since our exchange. Have you fully read my and Teia's exchange + what do you think of it now?
The fact that everyone is apparently ignoring my Teia case is :-/. Laziness gives scum wins people. The posts aren't even long by mafia standards.
442:
You were so quick to agree with Void and hop on the Teia wagon, yet you "haven't gotten the mental focus to slog through [the counterarguments to Void's case on Teia]?" Then go on to summarize the counterarguments as "arguing that he's bad a arguing rather than actually finding scum motivation"? The same counterarguments you just said you hadn't read? That's pretty much the definition of disingenuous:
Bold emphasis mine.
You gave yourself an out by saying you hadn't read the counterarguments to Void's case (despite having just dismissed them outright, which implies you've at least looked at them), so that if the Teia wagon starts to backfire you can hop off later. That doesn't exactly give off town vibes.
@_kaburi_ on Twitter
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basically I'll post something reasonable tomorrow but I haven't seen anything that shakes my scum reads on Void and KK
By now, I've gone back and done the slogging and can safely say my first impression of the cases is exactly right.
The fact that everyone on Void's wagon is refusing to believe this fits in his town meta and won't even investigate it for themselves, such as by reading CCMVII as I suggested, is telling me that this is a mislynch driven by scum (Teia and GM), upset that they don't have as strong a case as they thought they did.
Also: please tell me how, after making the massively aggressive posts I have on Teia, you think I could ever hop off safely?
I have two questions for you:
What is Void's scum meta?
Why would Teia ignore/pretend to forget evidence that supports her conclusion?
Please also maek post.
Do you mean this?
1) That's not even a full barn. 2) Why do you think that is scummy? My case on Teia clearly isn't based on meta and I've already said the same thing multiple times: BV confirmed not reading.
What about that post makes you uncomfortable?
This is some serious weaseling here, KK. Since you've not brought it up, I'm left to conclude you don't agree with the part about Teia's shift on Iso (which was the main thing I referenced when I voted Void, that you subsequently handwaved as Void being terrible town).
When BV breaks down why the Teia's-shift-on-Wheat part of Void's post is garbage, you ignore it. Why?
So while Void picks at Teia "waffling" & you giving that the thumbs up, BV posts this;
Which is what I say fence-sitting actually looks like – "he's in my town list at the moment but this REALLY reads like a scum slip" – if ever there was a post leaving a door open, this is it. Yet you don't even comment.
I need to re-read to be sure but in CCMVI, I remember Void's townie play being lurky & distracting – basically what you just described as his scum meta.
Just the truth. And is it really news that I didn't agree with Void's logic on Teia+Iso at this point?
Because he's just copying what other people have said, and I've already said all I need about the point to the people he copied it from.
I missed it because I was focusing on what he said about me.
You're right though, which makes me even more optimistic that I've got the scumteam pegged.
I read that game at the time, but I don't recall much of it. I think I stopped reading religiously when our clanmate got lynched.
Given the context, I'm not sure what could plausibly support that he meant the game night rather than the real-life night. It seems like an excuse to waffle on his read.
It's not the first time we've seen him waffle around, either. On day 1, he went after Iso pretty hard (saying he's distancing, accusing him of flailing around trying to start wagons, and handwaving), only to have his case "fall apart" at the last second, then laud Iso for catching scum and joining the Wheat wagon.
Also:
WIFOM.
Teia: You think it's town behavior to handwave cases? If you think my case is all meta, why don't you talk about it and prove it as I've asked you to do multiple times? If my case were actually as bad as you claim, you should have no problem proving me wrong.
But you don't. You toss mud and handwave and hide behind the town's laziness.
Wake up and read the thread Town. Teia is obvscum and you're all ignoring it.
So for the second time this game, you go after someone I started the case on while still calling me scum.
Get lynched.
Of course its WIFOM. Rian asked me why you would have done the ignored half of forgot/ignored. He didn't ask me about the half that could mean you were town. I in no way said nor implied this was "THE WAY IT HAPPENED 100%!"
This is the 5th or so time you've deliberately misinterpreted something to cast me in a scummy light.
There is more I would like to respond to but I am not actually here right now
Are you guys aware that we only have one more day to deadline? It looks like the rules say there is no lynch unless we reach 5 votes. Not sure if you're all aware that No Lynch Day 2 is bad for town
Sorry, that was a bit ambiguous. I meant that BV joined the Wheat wagon.
Also GM, you haven't answered this yet, and I'd appreciate it if you did more than active lurk.
Really? He hasn't posted in almost 72 hours at this point. I just looked for a v/la announcement for a second time and didn't find one.
They can, except when its. "Player A is positive Player B is scum, but Player C, who Player B started the wagon on, is scummy at the same time."
Scum almost never begin bus wagons on their own, and this is the second time this game Teia's jumped on a wagon I started (not that she fully jumped on this time) without even addressing the fact that its unlikely we're both scum.
As with everything else she's been doing this game, she ignores everything that could possibly cast her in a negative light in hopes that it will just fade away.
Void will be prodded if he doesn't post within the next hour or so.
Ok, KK, I guess "avoiding scrutiny" is another interpretation of that behavior, it's just not something I was specifically thinking. The fact remains that you seem to be pushing for a BV lynch but unwilling to commit to the first vote, that's what I found particularly scummy about your actions there.
So here's the question for you then - what makes the Teia case stronger than your case on BV?
@_kaburi_ on Twitter
Special thanks to Serrot_29 for Catbug'mrakul!
Well, firstly that I've taken the time to put together the Teia case and seen how strong it is, while BV I haven't put everything together on for side-by-side comparison.
Also, BV is someone I always read as scummy even when he's town. So I really need to put together a strong case rather than just believe I have one before I vote him.
160 - Talk about inconsistent reads. Void questions KK's early vote on hans and says he is suspicious of KK, but also that KK's response is good and that Teia is twisting KK's legit argument against hans. Then later we have "Teia is scum and KK undecided," and they are on different teams.
176 - KK explicitly says he is getting back on the hans wagon because Void and Iso agreed
181 - Void feels that KK is town after KK says obvious stuff about RVS and explains that he didn't think about hans having non-MTGS Mafia experience
196 - Here's kaburi saying BV could be scum, Iso has also called out BV for voting Iso by this point
205 - BV's tries to defend himself against Iso and then decides to join him in voting Wheat. BV's scummiest post so far
221 - KK "wouldn't be surprised" if both Iso and Wheat are town - one of which is confirmed, the other of which is near-confirmed. It's hard when you know everyone's alignment, isn't it?
222 - This is where KK first states he is suspicious of BV, but we're in hans wagon mode by now, so there's not a vote or a super-developed case
I'll answer your questions when you answer mine. Plus I've got to go mow the lawn right now.
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Protect (Doctor)
BV
Please explain how calling yourself Town is scummy. Use examples of players stating so or proving that is scummy.
Everyone
To whomever said I was pushing a bad scum tell (or evidence or whatever was said about it) on GM for the “I’m Town" thing. I even stated I wasn’t sure how accurate it is. It’s the first time I AM testing too see if it may or may not be a good scum tell. I am not using this as supportive evidence or any kind of evidence against GM.
Also, please take a look at my case again. I have outlined why Teia is scum from a Behavior stand point. There was no reason for Teia to start changing her read on Wheaties during Day 1. AFAWK Wheaties could be scum in this game with a smart claim.
There may be a few things from my case that I believe it getting over looked here. But the one below is a strong point against Teia.
This response from Teia shows that Teia knew Iso was giving valid reads and reason since Teia, herself, acknowledged that Iso is giving "compelling and reasonable arguments". But yet she was scum reading Iso for having "compelling and reasonable arguments". That is not how a Townie acts. If a Townie believes someone is giving "compelling and reasonable arguments", then why would Townie say that person is Scum? Hint: They wouldn’t
As town, like our last Flamingo game, I feel you stick to your convictions and are quick to notice bad wagons. You did that against TK in MM7 as well. Ignoring all the logical errors and misdirection in Void's arguments is not something I think town KK would do.
As for Void himself, did you use an ability last night? Why or why not? Also, nice to know that you were just slinging mud randomly instead of having an actual reason to point out that I never said "I'm town." Teia can field the stuff directed at her, but I see no reason why people can't change their reads as an argument progresses - Iso started out making some random stabs like the one at me, but his case on Wheat did make sense at the time, which even Wheat acknowledged by claiming. However, it looks like you still want to cast suspicion on Wheat. If he didn't misvig Iso, what do you think happened?
I'm honestly confused by what's going on right now. It's pretty clear that with the right spin anyone's posting can be misconstrued. I'm still suspicious of Teia and GM because of their actions, and when I get the chance I'll go back and take a look at their pairings since Day One and see what I come up with.
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What do you consider recent? Once you respond I will begin to check.
I will also respond to everyone else in my response to Wheaties.
You're stretching the definition of "wagon" to the breaking point here. I didn't vote him, nor did I say conclusively whether he's likely scum or not. I simply pointed out that he's waffling a fair bit.
Did you use any of those abilities? If so, what were your results?
First, reads can change as new information becomes available. As Wheat and Iso posted more and more content, it appeared that my suspicion of Iso was misplaced, and Wheat appeared increasingly scummy. I changed my reads accordingly. Sure, he could be scum, but given his claim and the night results, there's no reason to assume that's the case as there's no supportive evidence I can see.
You're conflating things that shouldn't be conflated here, along with misrepresenting my play. Yes, I was suspicious of Iso for a time. But his arguments, which I described with the above adjectives, eventually swayed me to a town read of him and a scum read of Wheat.
Which reminds me, you never did answer this:
What "actions" did Teia or I take that appear scummy to you?
Also, the scum want you to be confused. Read through the cases again when you have time and tell us more specifically what you don't understand. Although if the answer is "stuff that Void and KK posted," the answer is "because scum."
I'm not sure what Wheat is getting at with his question to Void, but apparently he needs to define "recently" so we can advance with the claim discussion. How about last 10 games Void played in?
I did not use any abilities last Night.
But you were suspicious of Iso for giving "compelling and reasonable arguments". That is what you posted about Iso. If you truly believe that Iso was posting "compelling and reasonable arguments", then there is no reason for you to believe Iso to be Scum. If anything, that would make you believe that Iso is Town. But, as we know, that is not the case here.
Except for the fact that you KNEW Iso was giving "compelling and reasonable arguments". Then because Wheaties got scummier, to you, your read in Iso changed to Town.
How one player can think that "compelling and reasonable arguments" is a reason to Scum read someone is very laughable. Then to change that Scum read to Town because the person they were interacting with is now Scummier makes no sense. Seriously, everyone, think about this for a moment. If Teia was Scum reading Iso and then thought Wheaties was Scum, then why would Teia’s read on Iso change? As far as we knew at the time, both Iso and Wheaties could have been Scumbuddies. But, we know that is not the case.
The only thing I am saying is that your behavior leading up to Wheaties claim doesn’t make any sense. If anything, it should have been the start of Day 2 when you began to read Wheaties as Town since we all would have the information in front of us. But, on Day 1, all Wheaties did was claim and you began to believe him to be Town.
I am willing to lynch either GM or Teia at this point.
EWP: GM, I appreciate you answering, but you are not Wheaties. I would rather have an exact number than to come back in here and have Wheaties tell me I didn't check back enough.
I mean in specifically your recent memory. So any games you remember in say...the past year? Past few months is even better.
I am immediately turning over to working on the remainder of the catchup, sorry about the incessant delays.
I hope this illustrates why that behaviour is scummy (& if anyone has more examples gimme gimme I collect them all).
Current mindset: Jay is town (but with this tiny nagging feeling that I might have been wrong about that which cleared him), kaburi is town (no nagging there), ria is town. KoolKoal is scum, and I'm paying very close attention to GM and Teia. BlackVise is an unknown to me, as is Void. BlackVise is my own fault though; I find myself skimming all of his posts.
401 (Void): While I'm feeling weird about Teia, this case makes me feel even weirder about Void. He calls Teia out on waffling on me, and then illustrates how Teia had a pretty natural progression into finding me scummy. He finds it odd that Teia questioned Iso despite "being mistaken" about Iso, but I don't find that necessarily scummy.
402 (KK): I strongly dislike the way KK jumps on the case before the rebuttal. If KK is scum like I suspect then Teia for sure is town and possibly BV as well. Void I'm less certain is scum this way.
403 (Teia): Teia's rebuttal makes me feel better about Teia.
411 (kaburi): This makes me feel even better about kaburi being town; he pointed out exactly what I was thinking with Teia v. Void.
416 (GM): Coaching of kaburi, but why, if kaburi is town?
417 (Void): lol that OMGUS. Void is scum.
418 (KK): And KK immediately jumps to defend Void. Hole in one.
424 (Jay): Jay is not scum with Void and KK.
426 (Void): But how is Teia scum for that? Only #3 counts as a strike against Teia, and only if you twist it pretty hard. #5 is explained by #4, and #1 and #2 don't contradict the rest like you seem to think.
428 (Void): So if someone doesn't agree with your characterization, they're scum?
430 (Jay): I was waiting for someone to point that out with Ria. I still feel Ria is town, but that was the one thing nagging me about him.
That seals it, nagging feeling gone, Jay is all the way town.
433 (Void): oh lord Void do you really believe this?
Also your tone says you don't believe GM is scum.
437 (Ria): The last nail in Void's coffin. Not that we needed another; the casket is more metal than wood at this point.
439 (KK): "As for liking Void's case on Teia, I more liked it that he found some evidence because all I had before that was meta."
hoo hoo hooboy
we got us a live one.
446 (KK): So if you didn't have the mental focus to slog, why did you slog for a case on Teia? (That was rhetorical unless you have a *really* good answer)
448 (KK): "Ignore large swaths of my case, hm?"
hoo hoo hooboy
we got us a live one.
Let's see, skipping some of the casefights as useless...
473 (KK): No, my opinion of you didn't change. Unless you count going from being pretty sure to completely sure you're scum.
Also, if it makes you feel better, I read your case. Well, up until you started it with LOLOLOLOLOL instead of logic.
474 (kaburi): Oh I love you so, I was worried no one caught that.
---
The end!
Void and KK are scum together.
Kaburi and Jay are definitely town.
Ria...I feel he's town but I've got a nagging feeling in my stomach. My eye will be upon him.
Teia and Gerrard's Mom are the same alignment as each other, which probably means they are town.
BlackVise is probably the third scum by POE but I won't worry about the third scum until Void and KK are dead. Unfortunately, I still find myself skipping over his posts.
I'm pretty sure KK has few enough votes to be voted for safely; Void is too close to a lynch right now for me to feel comfortable voting him until there's been discussion on his claim.
Unvote, Vote: KoolKoal
Why are you answering for GM? Do you believe GM is not capable of answering the question? Also, you didn't even asnwer the question in the way I asked. Using cartoon stuff (where you can SEE THE OTHER PERSON?THING) is NOT a good comparison to use.
Unvote
Vote: KoolKoal
Whatever guy. It's been discussed umpteen times here & on GGery & Misetings. It is a known mafia meme in the circles I travel, if only because I post one of these images when it comes up.
I will dig up prior times it has come up when naptime rolls around.
"As with everything else she's been doing this game, she ignores everything that could possibly cast her in a negative light in hopes that it will just fade away."
hoo hoo boy
we got us a live one
So Wheat, are you willing to lynch Void after we discuss his claim more? I'd rather lynch the person who initiated the bad case than the person who barned it, but I'm willing to lynch KK today as well. I need to see at least one of them flip before I make a call on third scum.
Void, you weren't very active at the end of Day 1, so I couldn't find any specific information on this. What were your reads on Wheat and Iso at the end of the Day?
I sort of doubt that he made that decision within 4 minutes of my post because of my post.
I'm more than willing to lynch Void toDay, and I'm just as willing to lynch KK instead. They are almost certainly both scum together; their actions don't make sense if they aren't.