I dont think the problem will be solved with reprints, but with new cards that make cards like tarmogoyf either risky, or second choise due to synergies with other cards in certain decks.
a Card like "smother the rich aunt"; Destroy target creature with casting cost 3 or less. If it is a green creature, draw cards equal to its power" could do something about tarmogoyfs popularity if its at two mana or less.
Well you would be wrong on both fronts. Reprints DO affect a card's price and ways to kill a card dont.
How would you go about making goyf "risky" or "second choice"? Hes a 2 drop, would you just print cards that made playing any 2 CMC creature risky? I mean you can already spell snare the little bugger. Not to mention, its pretty hard to make an extremely efficient creature second choice, you would be solving goyf's price problem by having a card take goyf's place so all you have done essentially is created a new $150 card.
If you want to make a card that sees play less expensive the solution is reprints, the question is where will those reprints come from. Duel Decks/Planechase/Commander product is extremely unlikely, this would just inflate the price of the sealed product to that of goyf and make it difficult to find as well. If he was printed in a standard legal set he would see a fairly sharp decrease in price and post rotation a slow climb.
They should really just start making modern tournament decks, have a couple with really expensive staples that the store gets to charge ridiculous amounts of money for, and have some that won't sell out right away but have a little value in them.
They should really just start making modern tournament decks, have a couple with really expensive staples that the store gets to charge ridiculous amounts of money for, and have some that won't sell out right away but have a little value in them.
Except LGS would take the price of each card in the deck and charge what the total is of all the cards, or we would get Modern starter decks with staples like Spell Snare/Kitchen Finks/Eternal Witness with rares and Mythics like the Kama Dragons. I doubt they would fill the decks with cards such as Bob/Goyf/V.Clique.
Except LGS would take the price of each card in the deck and charge what the total is of all the cards, or we would get Modern starter decks with staples like Spell Snare/Kitchen Finks/Eternal Witness with rares and Mythics like the Kama Dragons. I doubt they would fill the decks with cards such as Bob/Goyf/V.Clique.
Exactly, and i just said that sealed product with things like goyf is going to make the sealed product the price of goyf, it WILL NOT drop the price of goyf. Not to mention, look at how little value is in the Standard "starter" decks (intro/event decks), why would WotC put ANYTHING of value in a Modern "starter" deck if they put only 1 shock land in a Standard event deck?
I think it would drop the price somewhat, Jace dipped from a very limited sealed release in comparison to an event deck. Think of it this way, Goyf is available to buy at it's current price, if people want to pay that price for it they can. If they're not willing to pay that price for it, they're not going to be willing to pay that price for it in a precon. Stores would cut the price to move the product, unless they want to buy the product from wizards to just sit on it, which doesn't make a lot of sense.
They should really just start making modern tournament decks, have a couple with really expensive staples that the store gets to charge ridiculous amounts of money for, and have some that won't sell out right away but have a little value in them.
Incidentally, does anyone know the financial path of the infamous Rat's Nest precon (the "Jitte + 59 cards" deck)?
Hello. I've been away from the MTG scene for a while now. I was wondering if someone could give me a really brief summary of how Modern Masters changed Modern prices.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Common sense is the most fairly distributed thing in the world, for each one thinks he is so well-endowed with it that even those who are hardest to satisfy in all other matters are not in the habit of desiring more of it than they already have. - René Descartes
Hello. I've been away from the MTG scene for a while now. I was wondering if someone could give me a really brief summary of how Modern Masters changed Modern prices.
Fringe cards that were reprinted lowered significantly.
Hello. I've been away from the MTG scene for a while now. I was wondering if someone could give me a really brief summary of how Modern Masters changed Modern prices.
Prices of uncommons and commons that got reprinted drop in price (e.g., Path to Exile). Those that didn't get reprinted rose (e.g., Remand). Rares and Mythics that got reprinted didn't move much in price.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Modern:
Bant | U Tron | GW Hatebears | Death and Taxes | Scapeshift | UW Tron | UW Midrange
Incidentally, does anyone know the financial path of the infamous Rat's Nest precon (the "Jitte + 59 cards" deck)?
I am not sure what you mean by "financial path". I bought 5 of them at the time (3 for me 2 for my son) at Target over a period of a few weeks, and never even noticed that they were gold-mines. Precons were never something I went to shops to buy anyway, and I must have missed the growing Jitte price, because I was buying them pretty casually to build by toolbox. By the time I realized that they were being bumped at shops I started looking out for them, but at that point they were pretty much bought up. I saw one that clearly some person had hid behind some sports cards until they could get back with the funds, and I bought it and gave it to a friend as a gift. Never saw any more (unopened) at a big box store.
I think it would drop the price somewhat, Jace dipped from a very limited sealed release in comparison to an event deck. Think of it this way, Goyf is available to buy at it's current price, if people want to pay that price for it they can. If they're not willing to pay that price for it, they're not going to be willing to pay that price for it in a precon. Stores would cut the price to move the product, unless they want to buy the product from wizards to just sit on it, which doesn't make a lot of sense.
People are willing to buy goyfs now, people would be even more willing to buy them if the price dropped even slightly. Further, in a precon, stores arent just going to cut prices to move product if the product is going to move anyway, why buy only goyfs when you can buy a precon with goyf in it for the same price? The inclusion of goyf in a precon is going to make the precon the price of goyf and make it hard to find.
People are willing to buy goyfs now, people would be even more willing to buy them if the price dropped even slightly. Further, in a precon, stores arent just going to cut prices to move product if the product is going to move anyway, why buy only goyfs when you can buy a precon with goyf in it for the same price? The inclusion of goyf in a precon is going to make the precon the price of goyf and make it hard to find.
That depends on the rarity of the precon. If it is something that walmart gets its hands on, then the opposite would happen. Goyf's price ceiling would drop to the precon's MSRP. Some people would try scalping the precons at first, but ultimately the supply would be too great.
That depends on the rarity of the precon. If it is something that walmart gets its hands on, then the opposite would happen. Goyf's price ceiling would drop to the precon's MSRP. Some people would try scalping the precons at first, but ultimately the supply would be too great.
And chances are that if that were to happen walmart would find a good portion of their product missing, people already steal product from walmart, this would just give them a bigger reward for doing so. Not to mention i doubt that WotC would put such a product on walmart shelves.
And chances are that if that were to happen walmart would find a good portion of their product missing, people already steal product from walmart, this would just give them a bigger reward for doing so. Not to mention i doubt that WotC would put such a product on walmart shelves.
I highly doubt that. They'll try. Smaller towns would probably be bought out by the resident THAT GUY, but that's about it. Even if all the precons are bought out by speculators (They won't be. There would be far too many of them if walmart is involved), then the price of goyf would still plummet simply because the market would be flooded with them.
This is all kind of a moot point though. WotC would never print goyf in a precon for exactly that reason. Fetchlands are might be fair game though.
People are willing to buy goyfs now, people would be even more willing to buy them if the price dropped even slightly. Further, in a precon, stores arent just going to cut prices to move product if the product is going to move anyway, why buy only goyfs when you can buy a precon with goyf in it for the same price? The inclusion of goyf in a precon is going to make the precon the price of goyf and make it hard to find.
Yes but basically what is being stated is the precons would be sold by stores for the price of the contents, goyf's price plus whatever else is in there, this is wrong. These types of products always sell for a fair amount less than the value of the contents at any store I've ever bought them from, the stores are still making a lot of money off of charging less than the value of the cards. If there's a precon that had a card worth 120 plus some other cards together worth 20, I'm not going to pay 140 to get the 120 card that I already opted out of buying at at 120. Now if it's 120 for the precon and I get 20 worth of traders after getting the card I want, that's a slightly better deal, I can sell those cards making my cost of the $120 card $100.
BbearZ & Heretix, thank you for answering. I still have a long, long way to guy (card acquiring-wise).
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Common sense is the most fairly distributed thing in the world, for each one thinks he is so well-endowed with it that even those who are hardest to satisfy in all other matters are not in the habit of desiring more of it than they already have. - René Descartes
Yes but basically what is being stated is the precons would be sold by stores for the price of the contents, goyf's price plus whatever else is in there, this is wrong. These types of products always sell for a fair amount less than the value of the contents at any store I've ever bought them from, the stores are still making a lot of money off of charging less than the value of the cards. If there's a precon that had a card worth 120 plus some other cards together worth 20, I'm not going to pay 140 to get the 120 card that I already opted out of buying at at 120. Now if it's 120 for the precon and I get 20 worth of traders after getting the card I want, that's a slightly better deal, I can sell those cards making my cost of the $120 card $100.
No, if you would go back and read what i said you would see i said that a precon with goyf in it would make the precon the price of goyf.
No, if you would go back and read what i said you would see i said that a precon with goyf in it would make the precon the price of goyf.
Again, it all depends on the rarity of the precon.
If it is something limited like a from-the-vault set, then goyf's price will hardly budge and the precon's price will skyrocket.
If it is something distributed in bulk through retailers like Walmart, then the reverse would happen. Goyf's price would plumment practically overnight to the precon's MSRP. The increase in the supply of goyfs would be far too great for it to maintain its current price.
Again, it all depends on the rarity of the precon.
If it is something limited like a from-the-vault set, then goyf's price will hardly budge and the precon's price will skyrocket.
If it is something distributed in bulk through retailers like Walmart, then the reverse would happen. Goyf's price would plumment practically overnight to the precon's MSRP. The increase in the supply of goyfs would be far too great for it to maintain its current price.
As I said before, you would have gamer pandemonium as people camped outside big box stores waiting for the second that precon was stocked on the shelf, then one or two people would buy them all. If theft was a problem then you they might not even be stocked. Wallmart, Target, and other Big Box Stores do not stock those sections, they rent the space out to a retail distributor that stocks it with the latest items. I am not sure what the financial arrangement is, but I am sure that the distributor eats the cost of loss, so they are not going to keep stocking theft bait.
As I said before, you would have gamer pandemonium as people camped outside big box stores waiting for the second that precon was stocked on the shelf, then one or two people would buy them all. If theft was a problem then you they might not even be stocked. Wallmart, Target, and other Big Box Stores do not stock those sections, they rent the space out to a retail distributor that stocks it with the latest items. I am not sure what the financial arrangement is, but I am sure that the distributor eats the cost of loss, so they are not going to keep stocking theft bait.
But in the end it's unlikely that goyf would see a mass reprint in a Precon, it's possible that goyf comes out as a judge or FTV foil but a duel deck or commander deck is less likely.
No, if you would go back and read what i said you would see i said that a precon with goyf in it would make the precon the price of goyf.
You were also agreeing with the statement that an LGS would just charge what the contents were worth in that comment. Which is never the case in my experience. The last FTV I bought I got for a little over half of what the value of the contents were. If it was a higher print run than FTV series' it would have a much better effect on the prices. And really, the worst thing that would happen is what happens when a FTV series or anything like that is printed.
You were also agreeing with the statement that an LGS would just charge what the contents were worth in that comment. Which is never the case in my experience. The last FTV I bought I got for a little over half of what the value of the contents were. If it was a higher print run than FTV series' it would have a much better effect on the prices. And really, the worst thing that would happen is what happens when a FTV series or anything like that is printed.
They're going to charge for the contents: the contents being the goyf, nobody would care about the rest, including the shop.
And the post you were referring to wasn't talking about goyf specifically, it was taking about the entire idea of modern precon decks, which would sell for the sum of their contents. If there's goyf + bob I'm a precon the price for the product is going to be at least goyf + bob, if goyf is the only money card in it and the next highest value card is a woodland cemetery, the price would start at that of goyf.
I have a noob pricing question: it does seem that Jund midrange is the dominant deck in Modern, and this is what drives the price of Bob, Goyf, Lilliana of the Veil.
1. Do you think Wizards will be inclined at some point to ban Goyf and/or reprint in Standard any one of these three cards?
2. And if not, are we stuck with the price of Bob, Goyf, Lilliana of the Veil being so high for the indefinite future?
Well you would be wrong on both fronts. Reprints DO affect a card's price and ways to kill a card dont.
How would you go about making goyf "risky" or "second choice"? Hes a 2 drop, would you just print cards that made playing any 2 CMC creature risky? I mean you can already spell snare the little bugger. Not to mention, its pretty hard to make an extremely efficient creature second choice, you would be solving goyf's price problem by having a card take goyf's place so all you have done essentially is created a new $150 card.
If you want to make a card that sees play less expensive the solution is reprints, the question is where will those reprints come from. Duel Decks/Planechase/Commander product is extremely unlikely, this would just inflate the price of the sealed product to that of goyf and make it difficult to find as well. If he was printed in a standard legal set he would see a fairly sharp decrease in price and post rotation a slow climb.
Except LGS would take the price of each card in the deck and charge what the total is of all the cards, or we would get Modern starter decks with staples like Spell Snare/Kitchen Finks/Eternal Witness with rares and Mythics like the Kama Dragons. I doubt they would fill the decks with cards such as Bob/Goyf/V.Clique.
Exactly, and i just said that sealed product with things like goyf is going to make the sealed product the price of goyf, it WILL NOT drop the price of goyf. Not to mention, look at how little value is in the Standard "starter" decks (intro/event decks), why would WotC put ANYTHING of value in a Modern "starter" deck if they put only 1 shock land in a Standard event deck?
Incidentally, does anyone know the financial path of the infamous Rat's Nest precon (the "Jitte + 59 cards" deck)?
Fringe cards that were reprinted lowered significantly.
Staple cards stayed around the same or went up.
Sexy Sig by mchief111 @ Rising Studios
EDH
G Isao
Prices of uncommons and commons that got reprinted drop in price (e.g., Path to Exile). Those that didn't get reprinted rose (e.g., Remand). Rares and Mythics that got reprinted didn't move much in price.
Bant | U Tron | GW Hatebears | Death and Taxes | Scapeshift | UW Tron | UW Midrange
Reprint Opt for Modern!!
FREE DIG THOROUGH TIME!
PLAY MORE ROUGE DECKS!
People are willing to buy goyfs now, people would be even more willing to buy them if the price dropped even slightly. Further, in a precon, stores arent just going to cut prices to move product if the product is going to move anyway, why buy only goyfs when you can buy a precon with goyf in it for the same price? The inclusion of goyf in a precon is going to make the precon the price of goyf and make it hard to find.
That depends on the rarity of the precon. If it is something that walmart gets its hands on, then the opposite would happen. Goyf's price ceiling would drop to the precon's MSRP. Some people would try scalping the precons at first, but ultimately the supply would be too great.
And chances are that if that were to happen walmart would find a good portion of their product missing, people already steal product from walmart, this would just give them a bigger reward for doing so. Not to mention i doubt that WotC would put such a product on walmart shelves.
I highly doubt that. They'll try. Smaller towns would probably be bought out by the resident THAT GUY, but that's about it. Even if all the precons are bought out by speculators (They won't be. There would be far too many of them if walmart is involved), then the price of goyf would still plummet simply because the market would be flooded with them.
This is all kind of a moot point though. WotC would never print goyf in a precon for exactly that reason. Fetchlands are might be fair game though.
Yes but basically what is being stated is the precons would be sold by stores for the price of the contents, goyf's price plus whatever else is in there, this is wrong. These types of products always sell for a fair amount less than the value of the contents at any store I've ever bought them from, the stores are still making a lot of money off of charging less than the value of the cards. If there's a precon that had a card worth 120 plus some other cards together worth 20, I'm not going to pay 140 to get the 120 card that I already opted out of buying at at 120. Now if it's 120 for the precon and I get 20 worth of traders after getting the card I want, that's a slightly better deal, I can sell those cards making my cost of the $120 card $100.
No, if you would go back and read what i said you would see i said that a precon with goyf in it would make the precon the price of goyf.
Again, it all depends on the rarity of the precon.
If it is something limited like a from-the-vault set, then goyf's price will hardly budge and the precon's price will skyrocket.
If it is something distributed in bulk through retailers like Walmart, then the reverse would happen. Goyf's price would plumment practically overnight to the precon's MSRP. The increase in the supply of goyfs would be far too great for it to maintain its current price.
As I said before, you would have gamer pandemonium as people camped outside big box stores waiting for the second that precon was stocked on the shelf, then one or two people would buy them all. If theft was a problem then you they might not even be stocked. Wallmart, Target, and other Big Box Stores do not stock those sections, they rent the space out to a retail distributor that stocks it with the latest items. I am not sure what the financial arrangement is, but I am sure that the distributor eats the cost of loss, so they are not going to keep stocking theft bait.
Reprint Opt for Modern!!
FREE DIG THOROUGH TIME!
PLAY MORE ROUGE DECKS!
But in the end it's unlikely that goyf would see a mass reprint in a Precon, it's possible that goyf comes out as a judge or FTV foil but a duel deck or commander deck is less likely.
Reprint Opt for Modern!!
FREE DIG THOROUGH TIME!
PLAY MORE ROUGE DECKS!
You were also agreeing with the statement that an LGS would just charge what the contents were worth in that comment. Which is never the case in my experience. The last FTV I bought I got for a little over half of what the value of the contents were. If it was a higher print run than FTV series' it would have a much better effect on the prices. And really, the worst thing that would happen is what happens when a FTV series or anything like that is printed.
They're going to charge for the contents: the contents being the goyf, nobody would care about the rest, including the shop.
And the post you were referring to wasn't talking about goyf specifically, it was taking about the entire idea of modern precon decks, which would sell for the sum of their contents. If there's goyf + bob I'm a precon the price for the product is going to be at least goyf + bob, if goyf is the only money card in it and the next highest value card is a woodland cemetery, the price would start at that of goyf.
1. Do you think Wizards will be inclined at some point to ban Goyf and/or reprint in Standard any one of these three cards?
2. And if not, are we stuck with the price of Bob, Goyf, Lilliana of the Veil being so high for the indefinite future?
http://mtgadventures.blogspot.com/
Please check out my youtube channel at:
http://www.youtube.com/user/rubiera22/videos?flow=grid&view=0