If you ban any cards from your Cube for power level or annoyance factor, which ones are they and why?
Lots of people run unpowered Cubes, but will still include non-P9 cards that are generally regarded as overpowered for Cube (such as Sol Ring and Mind Twist). Sol Ring is generally regarded as the worst offender, but Library and Mind Twist are frequently mentioned and so is Mana Drain. Looking to put together a list of what people think is just too good.
Flavor Reasons
Even if WotC finds it fun to give green + white countermagic, blue direct damage, black artifact destruction and green some card draw, there has to be a good reason before I start playing these cards
While I understand Mana Tithe and Nether Void, I really don't understand the land destruction part. It have been a black ability from Alpha to now. Most recently in Innistrad with Maw of the Mire.
I know that these effects have been printed in other colors before, but I simply disagree that wotc should have taken away these effects from a color that already has a low profile.
Oh and please lets not talk about modern land destruction spells, that always makes me sad.
But Land Destruction have never been removed from anything. It have always been a Jund ability, that pops up in red, green and black frequently throughout magics history.
But you are ofcourse in your right to exclude whatever cards you want from your cube. I just don't think it's justified to put Sinkhole and Mana Tithe in the same booth.
Edit: And I totally agree with the modern LD statement. I don't even understand why wizards prints these spells. Either print some decent LD or just don't print it at all. Make up your mind...
I don't think that is very convincing. Not playing Time Vault or Illusionary Mask for that reason I would totally understand. (Or Flash if that were more widely Cubed)
To me, the errata for Necromancy is intuitive; however, cards like Sower of Temptation and manlands both frequently have rules questions and interactions brought up. Unless we're talking Sands of Time complex, rules interactions or foginess would never prevent me from playing a card.
I don't necessarily have banned cards. I don't run a powered cube, but that's not to say they're all banned. I would say the only cards that are banned would be Ante cards.
I wouldn't have mentioned these issues, if they didn't come up in our drafts.
Remember I am often playing at our local store, where you can't count on the best knowledge of the rules from each participant, especially when the cards are in a foreign language and you simply mentally shortcut the functionality of the card to the picture without knowing in detail what it does.
Ah ok that makes sense. I thought you were just being doctrinaire on the point. I would do the same if there was foreign language involved
For me, anything that's banned in Vintage would be banned in my cube. Other than that, I haven't made anything official, but I think it might be hard for anyone to convince me to add any Infect cards to my cube - I can't tell you how much I dislike playing with that mechanic.
For me, anything that's banned in Vintage would be banned in my cube. Other than that, I haven't made anything official, but I think it might be hard for anyone to convince me to add any Infect cards to my cube - I can't tell you how much I dislike playing with that mechanic.
-rexx
I can. It sucked. Whenever I drafted it I lost horribly or my opponent got sword of feast and famine and whenever my opponent drafted it they got god hands and won in like turn 3.
It was definitely the worst part of Scars. At least NPH made it slightly more interesting. Also there's not nearly enough infect cards to matter unless you're not playing a singleton cube.
I'm really more concerned with power level alone, rather than other considerations. wtwlf123 and Konfusius, thanks for the links.
The list seems to be
Sol Ring
Mana Crypt
Black Lotus
Moxes
Ancestral Recall
Time Walk
Library of Alexandria
Timetwister
Mana Drain
Mind Twist
Balance
Mana Vault
in rough order of offensiveness. Several newer cards (Jitte, Time Spiral etc) are not applicable for me since my cube is only Alpha-Exodus.
I think I'll be keeping Mana Drain, Mind Twist, Balance and Mana Vault, and not running the rest. Mind Twist doesn't seem to be that bad if you're not running a lot of acceleration and there's not much in my cube. Mana Drain can be played around sufficiently. If I owned a Timetwister I'd probably keep that too.
To me, the errata for Necromancy is intuitive; however, cards like Sower of Temptation and manlands both frequently have rules questions and interactions brought up. Unless we're talking Sands of Time complex, rules interactions or foginess would never prevent me from playing a card.
I don't necessarily have banned cards. I don't run a powered cube, but that's not to say they're all banned. I would say the only cards that are banned would be Ante cards.
This card is fricking pain in my cube. I love it so much.
The boost it gives vs control for aggro/midrange is just insane (with mana burn)
Just got to say, you've definitely earned distinction as an MTGS hero
Quote from Stardust »
Because he's the hero MTGS deserves, and the one it needs right now. So we'll global him. Because he can take it. Because he's not just our hero. He's a silent guardian, a watchful protector. An expired rascal.
Quote from LuckNorris »
ExpiredRascals you sir are a god-like hero.
Quote from Lanxal »
ER is a masterful god who cannot be beaten in any endeavour.
Just got to say, you've definitely earned distinction as an MTGS hero
Quote from Stardust »
Because he's the hero MTGS deserves, and the one it needs right now. So we'll global him. Because he can take it. Because he's not just our hero. He's a silent guardian, a watchful protector. An expired rascal.
Quote from LuckNorris »
ExpiredRascals you sir are a god-like hero.
Quote from Lanxal »
ER is a masterful god who cannot be beaten in any endeavour.
The only cards I ban are cards that weren't intended to be tournament legal when they were designed/printed. So that's the Un- sets, the holiday cards and the Portal/Starter sets.
Banned Cards for Power Level: Moxen, Lotus, Ancestral Recall, Time Walk, Sol Ring, Library of Alexandria, Mana Drain, Mana Crypt, Mana Vault, Grim Monolith, Booster Tutor
Banned Cards for "fun" factor: Armageddon, Ravages of War, Mind Twist, Hymn to Tourach, Moat, Cataclysm, Catastrophe, Stupor
Banned because white having a counterspell is too weird for me: Mana Tithe
I didn't see anyone mention Land Tax, that card just doesn't feel like a magic card to me. I guess it's technically banned for power level but since I run a powered cube it's just because I don't like the card.
For me, anything that's banned in Vintage would be banned in my cube. Other than that, I haven't made anything official, but I think it might be hard for anyone to convince me to add any Infect cards to my cube - I can't tell you how much I dislike playing with that mechanic.
-rexx
This is almost exactly the way I feel about banning cards in Cube, with a few small exceptions (namely Booster Tutor, Blast from the Past and Who/What/When/Where/Why)
No Ante or manual dexterity cards. I also won't run a card I can't either acquire or proxy in English because only about two of the players I routinely play with have the same knowledge of older cards that I do.
Lots of people run unpowered Cubes, but will still include non-P9 cards that are generally regarded as overpowered for Cube (such as Sol Ring and Mind Twist). Sol Ring is generally regarded as the worst offender, but Library and Mind Twist are frequently mentioned and so is Mana Drain. Looking to put together a list of what people think is just too good.
My 630 Card Powered Cube
My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 50th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from OTJ!
This was followed up with three posts in the Official Cube Discussion thread:
Lord Tiram
gafgar
Magic-Jiffen
Also, many of us who actually have ban-lists have posted them in our cube thread. Here is mine:
Proxies: Yes, Original Dual Lands
Powered: No
Portal: No
Snow: No
"Un" Cards: No
Banned Cards: Yes, Calciderm, Mana Tithe, Psionic Blast, Damnation, Blood Knight and Harmonize are banned for flavor reasons; power (Ancestral Recall, Time Walk, Timetwister, Black Lotus, Mox Pearl, Mox Sapphire, Mox Jet, Mox Ruby, Mox Emerald, Mana Drain and Library of Alexandria) and fast mana (Sol Ring, Mana Crypt, Mana Vault and Grim Monolith) are banned because of the disproportionate impact they have on games. Double faced cards are banned because I don't like them (Cloistered Youth, Ludevic's Test Subject, Instigator Gang, Reckless Waif, Garruk Relentless).
Errata: No, all cards are played according to their oracle wording
"What am I looking at? Ashes, dead man."
While I understand Mana Tithe and Nether Void, I really don't understand the land destruction part. It have been a black ability from Alpha to now. Most recently in Innistrad with Maw of the Mire.
See a list here http://magiccards.info/query?q=o%3Adestroy+o%3Atarget+o%3Aland+c!b&v=card&s=cname
My Tribal cube
My 93/94 old school cube
My Artifact cube
My Hearthstone Quiz App for iOS
But Land Destruction have never been removed from anything. It have always been a Jund ability, that pops up in red, green and black frequently throughout magics history.
But you are ofcourse in your right to exclude whatever cards you want from your cube. I just don't think it's justified to put Sinkhole and Mana Tithe in the same booth.
Edit: And I totally agree with the modern LD statement. I don't even understand why wizards prints these spells. Either print some decent LD or just don't print it at all. Make up your mind...
My Tribal cube
My 93/94 old school cube
My Artifact cube
My Hearthstone Quiz App for iOS
I don't necessarily have banned cards. I don't run a powered cube, but that's not to say they're all banned. I would say the only cards that are banned would be Ante cards.
Joy of Cubing Podcast
My 600 Card Unpowered Cube
My Combo Cube
Ah ok that makes sense. I thought you were just being doctrinaire on the point. I would do the same if there was foreign language involved
-rexx
Draft my 540 card powered cube here: http://www.cubetutor.com/draft/36935
I can. It sucked. Whenever I drafted it I lost horribly or my opponent got sword of feast and famine and whenever my opponent drafted it they got god hands and won in like turn 3.
It was definitely the worst part of Scars. At least NPH made it slightly more interesting. Also there's not nearly enough infect cards to matter unless you're not playing a singleton cube.
I feel compelled to repeat everything I hear
My cube
My cube on Cube tutor
I'm OP_Forever. I'll be putting this in my signature for a while so everyone know I change my nickname.
The list seems to be
Sol Ring
Mana Crypt
Black Lotus
Moxes
Ancestral Recall
Time Walk
Library of Alexandria
Timetwister
Mana Drain
Mind Twist
Balance
Mana Vault
in rough order of offensiveness. Several newer cards (Jitte, Time Spiral etc) are not applicable for me since my cube is only Alpha-Exodus.
I think I'll be keeping Mana Drain, Mind Twist, Balance and Mana Vault, and not running the rest. Mind Twist doesn't seem to be that bad if you're not running a lot of acceleration and there's not much in my cube. Mana Drain can be played around sufficiently. If I owned a Timetwister I'd probably keep that too.
This card is fricking pain in my cube. I love it so much.
The boost it gives vs control for aggro/midrange is just insane (with mana burn)
What about the card makes it over-complex to you?
Body Count: GRRRUUUUUUUUUUU
إن سرقت إسرق جمل
Level 1 Judge
My Cube for use with 6th ed. Rules
Calvin and Hobbes
Cube Tutor
For what it's worth, I ban 0 cards for flavor, complexity, or aesthetics.
Joy of Cubing Podcast
My 600 Card Unpowered Cube
My Combo Cube
It's very good with phasing and mana burn. Without mana burn it loses a lot of its value.
So, very good for me. Probably not great for non-6th ed rules cubes.
Body Count: GRRRUUUUUUUUUUU
إن سرقت إسرق جمل
Level 1 Judge
My Cube for use with 6th ed. Rules
My 630 Card Powered Cube
My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 50th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from OTJ!
Banned Cards for Power Level: Moxen, Lotus, Ancestral Recall, Time Walk, Sol Ring, Library of Alexandria, Mana Drain, Mana Crypt, Mana Vault, Grim Monolith, Booster Tutor
Banned Cards for "fun" factor: Armageddon, Ravages of War, Mind Twist, Hymn to Tourach, Moat, Cataclysm, Catastrophe, Stupor
Banned because white having a counterspell is too weird for me: Mana Tithe
My 630 Card Powered Cube
My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 50th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from OTJ!
This is almost exactly the way I feel about banning cards in Cube, with a few small exceptions (namely Booster Tutor, Blast from the Past and Who/What/When/Where/Why)
No Ante or manual dexterity cards. I also won't run a card I can't either acquire or proxy in English because only about two of the players I routinely play with have the same knowledge of older cards that I do.
MY CUBE!
EDH Decks
Tomorrow, The Pitcher's Name