I've noticed a trend with the most recent sets. Scars was Mirrodin 2.0. Innistrad was Kamigawa 2.0 (more on this later). Right after, we're getting Ravnica 2.0. So, I speculate we'll have some form of TSP afterwards. (Possibly llorwen though, since the TSP was the end of a story)
Right now, the burden is on me to prove how ISD is like Kami. Both were telling a story. Both had factions at war. Both had a happy ending. Both were extremely flavorful, and more of a flavor built set than anything (with the key difference being kamigawa failed to be popular). I feel that ISD was kamigawa done RIGHT, and with that we have a 1-2-3 pattern of blocks.
The trend I notice is new-returning-new-returning, so seems to me we'll have a new plane next block. A return to Dominaria is basically inevitable, but I don't see it happening until Fall 2014 at the earliest.
I didn't see scars as a happy ending very sad when the plane got taken over. I wanted the mirrans to win.
Scars wasn't that flavorful, it was telling a story, but not "flavor" so much the way cards like doomed traveler is flavorful, or the werewolves, or the 101 other things. They had a story going on of the all out war, but that's subtly different from what I'm trying to say.
after tamyio, don't we all expect a block tha actually happens in kamigawa? if so, innistrad is not new kamigawa. i understand your point, and i think innistrad is one of the collest sets i've seen, having cool and clean cards with nice flavor, but i think the goal is always to have a good flavor in the set
Scars was a happy ending.
I got to see the plane that brought standard the 'joys' of Raffinity crushed under the heels of Magics greatest and most iconic enemy.
Great times.
Kind of hoping we eventually go back to Kamigawa although it'll probably be a while. That was a block with some great limited action. Until the third set which was just really bad.
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Brian Tinsman, Set Designer :?mana::snow::snow:
Legendary Creature – Human Designer (MR)
Brian Tinsman, Set Designer can only be cast during the third set of a block.
When Brian Tinsman, Set Designer enters the battlefield, ignore all flavor and mechanics of the first two sets in the block. "Ok so what do we have here... gothic horror? Scrap it. Expand the Devine Vs. Demonic duel deck to 244 cards and print it!"
2/2
Right now, the burden is on me to prove how ISD is like Kami. Both were telling a story. Both had factions at war. Both had a happy ending. Both were extremely flavorful, and more of a flavor built set than anything (with the key difference being kamigawa failed to be popular). I feel that ISD was kamigawa done RIGHT, and with that we have a 1-2-3 pattern of blocks.
Isn't every block supposed to tell a story?
Also, Kamigawa's storyline is pretty different from Innistrad's.
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Commander:GB Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord (list) - U Talrand, Sky Summoner - GRU Maelstrom Wanderer
maan goyf is so cool! it is a card that was not overpowered in standard and did not even make in the best deck, but is one of the cards that started to shift legacy into a format that actually have creature decks. i think they probably won't reprint because everyone that has goyfs would be mad, but i think this is the only reason not to reprint the card.
EDIT: though now, with snapcaster, leak, probe, and ponder (and evolving wilds), it could rule standard, but the reprint would not be in ravnica, so it doesn't matter.
I'd love to see Time Spiral 2.0 minus any Tarmo level mistakes. Was such a fun block - I loved mechanics overload.
We all would. Except maybe mixing up mechanics and themes from sets in different planes instead of from sets from different times. Like Devour and Morbid on the same card, for example.
And I don't think Goyf was a mistake at the time it was printed.
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Commander:GB Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord (list) - U Talrand, Sky Summoner - GRU Maelstrom Wanderer
maan goyf is so cool! it is a card that was not overpowered in standard and did not even make in the best deck, but is one of the cards that started to shift legacy into a format that actually have creature decks. i think they probably won't reprint because everyone that has goyfs would be mad, but i think this is the only reason not to reprint the card.
EDIT: though now, with snapcaster, leak, probe, and ponder (and evolving wilds), it could rule standard, but the reprint would not be in ravnica, so it doesn't matter.
They already stated they will reprint modern staples. You can assume this means they will reprint goyf at some point (even if only in a product such as duel decks)
If you are suggeting a return to Dominaria, then yes, someday it will happen. But if you are suggesting it will return according to the pattern you have shown (which is not a pattern - 2 out of 3 is not a pattern), then no.
Time spiral will never be done again.
1. Maro hates it.
2. It was the most complex standard in magic history. No metagame, over 59 keywords in block play.
3. Magic is just getting new players to drink the kool-aid, drowning them in it won't help.
And I'm pretty sure by "reprint modern staples" Maro meant the expensive uncommons, not goyf. Goyf will probably not be reprinted do to the "Chronicles-effect", even if it isn't on reserve. I do think we will see the return of Spell Snare in RTR block and Kitchen Finks at some point. $10+ for non-legacy intended uncommons is a little much.
however don't expect remand to return, ever in an expert level expansion.
The patter I see is New (Zendikar) Return (Scars of Mirrodin) New (Innistrad) Return (Ravnica)
To me, Innistrad replaces kamigawa, so I would expect some new set to replace time spiral for a return to lorwyn after that.
Does this really seem likely? No, not really, it's probably wrong, which just goes to show that just because you can see a pattern doesn't mean it's actually there.
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"In the beginning, MTG Salvation switched to a new forum format.
This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move."
It was at that moment that I realized: I'm kinda just making these things up. We can just write the rules the way we want them to work. People will have fun, and people will get it.
Right now, the burden is on me to prove how ISD is like Kami. Both were telling a story. Both had factions at war. Both had a happy ending. Both were extremely flavorful, and more of a flavor built set than anything (with the key difference being kamigawa failed to be popular). I feel that ISD was kamigawa done RIGHT, and with that we have a 1-2-3 pattern of blocks.
Both were also top down sets. Kamigawa was trying to adapt japanese myths, legends, and culture to magic. It, like innistrad, was designed around flavor and tropes.
It's possible that this pattern of new-old-new-old, with replacements where necessary, could be a way of satisfying current players, while attracting new ones.
The bigger question is which planes can support a return. Lorwyn, as much as I love the set, doesn't have enough to justify a return, as far as I know. At least, only because Shadowmoor did what a return probably would have done (turn it dark), which was done with Mirrodin just recently. Note that for Mirrodin, a seed was planted for a return there way back when (ichor).
I'd guess something like Kamigawa - Innistrad would happen again; sets with similar philosophies, but different else wise, instead of a direct return.
As for a return to Dominaria, it's possible, but I think they'd have to invent a new conflict to justify it, which would feel really forced. I think the only reason they'd want to return to Dominaria, is if they want to use the same creature type pool, locations, and mechanics. Otherwise, it'd just be easier to create a new plane, yielding more creative control.
I kind of hope we can get a block around Planer Chaos... the "never-was" block... Alara didn't reform, Phyrexia lost the war, the Eldrazi weren't released... I personally love having the tons of different keywords and no fixed meta-game...
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I do hope that Wizards actually does the alternating new return new return pattern, because I don't want the game to have an increase in the number of planes way too fast.
There are 8 planes of existence, not counting the settings that are based off any set released before 2003. If they kept on introducing new planes every year, and assuming none are destroyed, then there are 16 planes of existence by the time it is 2020, compared to 12 planes of existence when they do the alternating pattern.
By the time it is 2030, if they kept on adding new planes per year, there would be 26 planes, but if they did the alternating pattern, there would be 17 planes.
I do hope that Wizards actually does the alternating new return new return pattern, because I don't want the game to have an increase in the number of planes way too fast.
There are 8 planes of existence, not counting the settings that are based off any set released before 2003. If they kept on introducing new planes every year, and assuming none are destroyed, then there are 16 planes of existence by the time it is 2020, compared to 12 planes of existence when they do the alternating pattern.
By the time it is 2030, if they kept on adding new planes per year, there would be 26 planes, but if they did the alternating pattern, there would be 17 planes.
Dominaria
Alara
Zendikar
Mercadia
Mirrodin/New Phyrexia
innistrad
Ravnica
Ulgrotha
Kamigawa
Shandalar
Muraganda
Wildfire
Rabiah
Moag
Lorwyn/Shadowmoor
Valla
Arkhos
Bolas’s Meditation Realm
Kaldheim
Iquatana
Equilor
Segovia
Ir
23 visited planes, not counting the dead ones (Rath, Phyrexia, Serra's Realm), nor the ones introduced in PC2.
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It's about time for the reserved list to die, for the sake of Vintage and Legacy (And Commander).
They already stated they will reprint modern staples. You can assume this means they will reprint goyf at some point (even if only in a product such as duel decks)
Where did they say this, exactly? What were the words they used? I keep hearing aboot it but I never actually see physical hard proof that they actually said it.
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You've got a rat in your walls, and cheese won't solve anything.
Maro's said that 1.) While Innistrad does bear notable similarities to Kamigawa, those similarities were unintentional, as was the "Mirrodin-otherblock-Ravinca" pattern; and 2.) That while he personally loves Time Spiral, they don't have plans to do anything like it again. Just too alienating for new players.
I've noticed a trend with the most recent sets. Scars was Mirrodin 2.0. Innistrad was Kamigawa 2.0 (more on this later). Right after, we're getting Ravnica 2.0. So, I speculate we'll have some form of TSP afterwards. (Possibly llorwen though, since the TSP was the end of a story)
Right now, the burden is on me to prove how ISD is like Kami. Both were telling a story. Both had factions at war. Both had a happy ending. Both were extremely flavorful, and more of a flavor built set than anything (with the key difference being kamigawa failed to be popular). I feel that ISD was kamigawa done RIGHT, and with that we have a 1-2-3 pattern of blocks.
Has anyone else noticed this?
And don't forget that the third set was each a gigantic ball drop. And had the same lead designer in charge.
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Brian Tinsman, Set Designer :?mana::snow::snow:
Legendary Creature – Human Designer (MR)
Brian Tinsman, Set Designer can only be cast during the third set of a block.
When Brian Tinsman, Set Designer enters the battlefield, ignore all flavor and mechanics of the first two sets in the block. "Ok so what do we have here... gothic horror? Scrap it. Expand the Devine Vs. Demonic duel deck to 244 cards and print it!"
2/2
The trend of Mirrodin-Kamigawa-Ravnica-Time Spiral actually isn't the original cycle. Those sets were iterations of Urza block-Mercadian Masques-Invasion-Odyssey. Lorwyn/Shadowmoor imitates Onslaught block, as both are tribal-centric. The cycle skips over the first two with Shards block, however, and skips Onslaught at the end to begin with Urza block again. Except for the first two cycles there's little rhyme or reason to it all.
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RRRDo Not Pursue Lu Bu!!!RRR UBUWydwyn, the Biting Gale 1v1UBU WRWBrion Cho Aniki!! I Wanna Be Strong Like Big Brother!WRW BRBLyzie Borden and the Thrill Kill CultBRB GWUDerevi, Birdman TacticianGWU
"Gotta have opposites dark and light, light and dark in painting. It's like in life. Gotta have a little sadness once in a while so you know when the good times come." -Bob Ross
That while he personally loves Time Spiral, they don't have plans to do anything like it again. Just too alienating for new players.
What was alienatingabout Time Spiral? Was it the amount of Mechanics? Because if that were the case than the Ravnica block had the potential to be just as bad. (Disclaimer: I loved both blocks)
I started during Betrayers of Kamigawa, so the Ravnica Block was my first full block. And it didn't make me feel alienated, neither did the Time Spiral Block.
I've noticed a trend with the most recent sets. Scars was Mirrodin 2.0. Innistrad was Kamigawa 2.0 (more on this later). Right after, we're getting Ravnica 2.0. So, I speculate we'll have some form of TSP afterwards. (Possibly llorwen though, since the TSP was the end of a story)
Right now, the burden is on me to prove how ISD is like Kami. Both were telling a story. Both had factions at war. Both had a happy ending. Both were extremely flavorful, and more of a flavor built set than anything (with the key difference being kamigawa failed to be popular). I feel that ISD was kamigawa done RIGHT, and with that we have a 1-2-3 pattern of blocks.
Has anyone else noticed this?
The issue I see with your reasoning is that I don't think they would bring three blocks from the past in four years. They like to focus on new things.
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Scars wasn't that flavorful, it was telling a story, but not "flavor" so much the way cards like doomed traveler is flavorful, or the werewolves, or the 101 other things. They had a story going on of the all out war, but that's subtly different from what I'm trying to say.
I got to see the plane that brought standard the 'joys' of Raffinity crushed under the heels of Magics greatest and most iconic enemy.
Great times.
Kind of hoping we eventually go back to Kamigawa although it'll probably be a while. That was a block with some great limited action. Until the third set which was just really bad.
Legendary Creature – Human Designer (MR)
Brian Tinsman, Set Designer can only be cast during the third set of a block.
When Brian Tinsman, Set Designer enters the battlefield, ignore all flavor and mechanics of the first two sets in the block.
"Ok so what do we have here... gothic horror? Scrap it. Expand the Devine Vs. Demonic duel deck to 244 cards and print it!"
2/2
Isn't every block supposed to tell a story?
Also, Kamigawa's storyline is pretty different from Innistrad's.
Pauper: UR some horrible homebrew izzet deck
Re: People misusing the term Vanilla to describe a flying, unleash (sometimes trample) critter.
EDIT: though now, with snapcaster, leak, probe, and ponder (and evolving wilds), it could rule standard, but the reprint would not be in ravnica, so it doesn't matter.
We all would. Except maybe mixing up mechanics and themes from sets in different planes instead of from sets from different times. Like Devour and Morbid on the same card, for example.
And I don't think Goyf was a mistake at the time it was printed.
Pauper: UR some horrible homebrew izzet deck
They already stated they will reprint modern staples. You can assume this means they will reprint goyf at some point (even if only in a product such as duel decks)
1. Maro hates it.
2. It was the most complex standard in magic history. No metagame, over 59 keywords in block play.
3. Magic is just getting new players to drink the kool-aid, drowning them in it won't help.
And I'm pretty sure by "reprint modern staples" Maro meant the expensive uncommons, not goyf. Goyf will probably not be reprinted do to the "Chronicles-effect", even if it isn't on reserve. I do think we will see the return of Spell Snare in RTR block and Kitchen Finks at some point. $10+ for non-legacy intended uncommons is a little much.
however don't expect remand to return, ever in an expert level expansion.
On Modern Masters 2:
Will be kept until 12/31/2013 to prove if Right or Wrong.Proven right 1/27/2013To me, Innistrad replaces kamigawa, so I would expect some new set to replace time spiral for a return to lorwyn after that.
Does this really seem likely? No, not really, it's probably wrong, which just goes to show that just because you can see a pattern doesn't mean it's actually there.
This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move."
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Both were also top down sets. Kamigawa was trying to adapt japanese myths, legends, and culture to magic. It, like innistrad, was designed around flavor and tropes.
The bigger question is which planes can support a return. Lorwyn, as much as I love the set, doesn't have enough to justify a return, as far as I know. At least, only because Shadowmoor did what a return probably would have done (turn it dark), which was done with Mirrodin just recently. Note that for Mirrodin, a seed was planted for a return there way back when (ichor).
I'd guess something like Kamigawa - Innistrad would happen again; sets with similar philosophies, but different else wise, instead of a direct return.
As for a return to Dominaria, it's possible, but I think they'd have to invent a new conflict to justify it, which would feel really forced. I think the only reason they'd want to return to Dominaria, is if they want to use the same creature type pool, locations, and mechanics. Otherwise, it'd just be easier to create a new plane, yielding more creative control.
There are 8 planes of existence, not counting the settings that are based off any set released before 2003. If they kept on introducing new planes every year, and assuming none are destroyed, then there are 16 planes of existence by the time it is 2020, compared to 12 planes of existence when they do the alternating pattern.
By the time it is 2030, if they kept on adding new planes per year, there would be 26 planes, but if they did the alternating pattern, there would be 17 planes.
Dominaria
Alara
Zendikar
Mercadia
Mirrodin/New Phyrexia
innistrad
Ravnica
Ulgrotha
Kamigawa
Shandalar
Muraganda
Wildfire
Rabiah
Moag
Lorwyn/Shadowmoor
Valla
Arkhos
Bolas’s Meditation Realm
Kaldheim
Iquatana
Equilor
Segovia
Ir
23 visited planes, not counting the dead ones (Rath, Phyrexia, Serra's Realm), nor the ones introduced in PC2.
---
Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.
Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.
Where did they say this, exactly? What were the words they used? I keep hearing aboot it but I never actually see physical hard proof that they actually said it.
And don't forget that the third set was each a gigantic ball drop. And had the same lead designer in charge.
Legendary Creature – Human Designer (MR)
Brian Tinsman, Set Designer can only be cast during the third set of a block.
When Brian Tinsman, Set Designer enters the battlefield, ignore all flavor and mechanics of the first two sets in the block.
"Ok so what do we have here... gothic horror? Scrap it. Expand the Devine Vs. Demonic duel deck to 244 cards and print it!"
2/2
What.
UBUWydwyn, the Biting Gale 1v1UBU
WRWBrion Cho Aniki!! I Wanna Be Strong Like Big Brother!WRW
BRBLyzie Borden and the Thrill Kill CultBRB
GWUDerevi, Birdman TacticianGWU
"Gotta have opposites dark and light, light and dark in painting. It's like in life. Gotta have a little sadness once in a while so you know when the good times come." -Bob Ross
I highly doubt we'll ever have a set take place here. lol
Though... It would be kinda cool...
What was alienatingabout Time Spiral? Was it the amount of Mechanics? Because if that were the case than the Ravnica block had the potential to be just as bad. (Disclaimer: I loved both blocks)
I started during Betrayers of Kamigawa, so the Ravnica Block was my first full block. And it didn't make me feel alienated, neither did the Time Spiral Block.
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