Agreed. Also hybrid is popular and so far only had one "block" compared to gold having 3 full blocks + Legends so it has some catching up to do. With Lights block being assumed artifact heavy it's a good time for Hybrid to have some extra cards.
There has been at least one card with hybrid in its cost or text box printed each year since Ravnica - Time Spiral had Graven Cairns; then we had Shadowmoor block and Alara Reborn, each of which had hybrid.
They might as well make it evergreen, but unless they do, it's unlikely we'll see it every year...
My only thought about the hybrid is this... if you have a W/1 style casting cost, why bother having the white at all because the mono U or B deck could run very off-color things then.
If they were to do colorless/color hybrids, it would look like Flame Javelin/Spectral Procession and cost more colorless than colored.
Also, even if the set is ALL Colorless and Hybrid cards, there can still be a definite color pie. Ghostfire is a "colorless" card, but it still is clearly in the color pie. We will probably see more cards like it. Colorless does not mean they can't have color requirements in their casting cost,
I could go with hybrid, but a set full of colorless cards with "[card] is colorless" would be really stupid. I seriously doubt that for the same reason wall and legend were changed, because of having to write "except legend or wall" on every type changing card in Onslaught block. Mono colored hybrid is an elegant way to make cards that are effectively colorless in most cases.
They might as well make it evergreen, but unless they do, it's unlikely we'll see it every year...
Hybrid mana is evergreen.
Multicolor cards, legendary permanents, cantrips, numerous creature keywords, equipment, race/class, hybrid mana, planeswalkers—these are all things available to a designer for any set he or she designs, none of which existed in Alpha.
If this is true, I would like to say Hybrid seems to be turning into a bit of a crutch. Seeing it every couple of sets completely nerfs its specialness, imo. Whatever.
I wouldn't like to see an all-colorless set either. Enough with the set gimmicks already.
The set being Colorless/Hybrid also precludes printing any planeswalkers in RoE right?
Uh, why?
I believe it's quite a given that we'll have colorless and hybrid planeswalkers someday. No reason why it couldn't be right now.
Anyway, I hope that this speculation is wrong. I'm fine with some colorlessness and some hybrid, but not a whole set of it. I don't like this type of gimmick.
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Quote from parinoid »
I rolled 5 D6's and got 3 fours. They must have changed the odds of getting a 4!
Affinity for "ARTIFACTS" was broken in such a set... but what about colorless spells with affinity for a basic land type? Or affinity for those lesser Eldrazi creature types?
Mmh?
Uh, his quote has nothing to do with the Affinity mechanic...
MaRo was pointing out the fact that in Mirrodin Block you didn't need to care about colors, basically. You could play all the best cards without any manabase problem.
Actually, I don't really see any reasons why RoTE can't support color/colorless hybrid; design-wise it makes perfect sense in a colorless-themed set, it helps artificially increase the number and mechanical range of colorless spells without introducing large numbers of out-of-pie cards, and it plays well with what is perhaps the most defining characteristic of a heavily colorless set: an extremely biased limited format.
Srsly, does these truly seem out-of-theme in a colorless-themed set?
Mana Syphon
Instant - 1U/
Counter target spell unless its controller pays U/.
Crystal Shard
Artifact - 3 U/: Return target creature to its owner's hand unless its controller pays 1.
Wrath of the Eldrazi
Sorcery - 3W/W/
Destroy all creatures. If no colored mana was used to cast Wrath of the Eldrazi, put three 2/2 colorless Eldrazi Brood tokens into the battlefield.
Eldrazi Ritual
Sorcery - 1R/R/
Add 5 to your mana pool. If no colored mana was used to cast Eldrazi Ritual, it deals 5 damage to target creature or player.
They will just make more Ghostfire type colorless cards. We will probably just see colorless versions of Divination or something, maybe as "Tribal- Eldrazi," but I doubt that.
I don't see why having everything be "colorless" means they are throwing the color pie out the window. They can just have "~ is colorless" on it, and give them the "full art" frames we saw:
I bet only the Eldrazi themselves don't have colored mana in their casting cost. (and any artifacts that might be in)
Also, I could see a hybrid version of Nissa or Sarkhan or something. Hybrid Jace, not so much, but Sarkhan is already multicolored, and Nissa always seemed a bit "black" to me.
They could make some keyword for "this card is colorless" and the colorless border helps too.
Also, any colorless mana acceleration derived from "lights" could be easily controlled if the mana can be spent only on artifacts.
I see this whole 50/50 separation as possible and quite fun, time will tell.
Also, colorless planeswalker, hybrid planeswalker or hybrid/colorless planeswalker FTW. An artifact planeswalker for "lights" could be cool too.
Sure, you could print Colorsap (This card is colorless), but that takes up even more space and is at least as much of a gimmick as tribal. It's completely useless other than parasitic cards to interact with it. It would be much more sensible to just do them as monocolor hybrid cards and change the comprehensive rules to say that such a card is colorless in addition to the color in its mana cost if it has no fully colored mana symbols.
Sure, you could print Colorsap (This card is colorless), but that takes up even more space and is at least as much of a gimmick as tribal. It's completely useless other than parasitic cards to interact with it. It would be much more sensible to just do them as monocolor hybrid cards and change the comprehensive rules to say that such a card is colorless in addition to the color in its mana cost if it has no fully colored mana symbols.
I agree. Making a bunch of cards like Ghostfire would just mean a bunch of gray card borders. Oh, and RDW can now hose Kor Firewalker.
Sure, you could print Colorsap (This card is colorless), but that takes up even more space and is at least as much of a gimmick as tribal. It's completely useless other than parasitic cards to interact with it. It would be much more sensible to just do them as monocolor hybrid cards and change the comprehensive rules to say that such a card is colorless in addition to the color in its mana cost if it has no fully colored mana symbols.
But that defeats the purpose of being "colorless". How exactly would something be colored and colorless at the same time?
Ghostfire, which is obviously a future-shifted card from ROE, was a forecast of the colorless nature of the set. I'm pretty sure we will see more cards like it, most likely keyworded.
My only thought about the hybrid is this... if you have a W/1 style casting cost, why bother having the white at all because the mono U or B deck could run very off-color things then.
Ravnica comes to answer your question! You would have cards like Induce Paranoia but without the blue. Example:
ET's Healing Finger 1/
Instant
You gain 1 life.
If you spent W to cast this, target creature gains vigilance until end of turn.
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She wants a ride on the pony, dude.
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In this message, the reference to hybrid is purely speculative. I don't see any source or whatsoever that indicates it's true. Just the writer of the piece who seems 99% sure.
I agree. There's nothing that indicates the set will be "all colorless or hybrid." There's nothing that indicates the set will have any hybrid cards! Just this guy thinks so, and if he's right you'll all hate the set because by its nature it'll have to be underpowered to accommodate the fact that at least 2 colors can run every card in the set.
I agree. There's nothing that indicates the set will be "all colorless or hybrid." There's nothing that indicates the set will have any hybrid cards! Just this guy thinks so, and if he's right you'll all hate the set because by its nature it'll have to be underpowered to accommodate the fact that at least 2 colors can run every card in the set.
Wizards tend to push the power level of set theme. Hybrid cards in Shadowmoor weren't weaker as they should be in theory.
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Quote from parinoid »
I rolled 5 D6's and got 3 fours. They must have changed the odds of getting a 4!
I agree. There's nothing that indicates the set will be "all colorless or hybrid." There's nothing that indicates the set will have any hybrid cards! Just this guy thinks so, and if he's right you'll all hate the set because by its nature it'll have to be underpowered to accommodate the fact that at least 2 colors can run every card in the set.
From a flavor perspective, I don't see WotC making a completely colorless set that is based entireley around the Eldrazi.
I expect that there will be resistance forces arrayed against them in the set, and that these cards will have colored mana symbols. I expect to see some angels, vampires, merfolk, etc... in RoE.
Wizards tend to push the power level of set theme. Hybrid cards in Shadowmoor weren't weaker as they should be in theory.
I think they're still experimenting with what the right power level should be. This set will be the third (or fourth) good testing for Hybrid. I look for the power level of this set to be used as the gold standard for Hybrid going forward.
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WoTC, thank you for finally announcing the Modern format, an eternal format where everyone can participate.
The idea of colourless mana being able to pay any cost, albeit at a steeper cost, would finally make sense with their "unstable mana" bit they touted about Zendikar as a plane. Because frankly, I haven't seen anything that's interesting thematically with the way they pushed the block.
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Standard: BRG Jund Midrange GRB //// B Vampire Aggro B //// WRU Patriot Control URW
Extended: RGW Zoo WGR
Legacy: RUG Canadian Thresh GUR
Ravnica comes to answer your question! You would have cards like Induce Paranoia but without the blue. Example:
ET's Healing Finger 1/
Instant
You gain 1 life.
If you spent W to cast this, target creature gains vigilance until end of turn.
You do realize this card works the same costed as 1 without the hybrid, right? I think we'll see more Beseech the Queen-type cost benefits if hybrid is coming back.
You do realize this card works the same costed as 1 without the hybrid, right? I think we'll see more Beseech the Queen-type cost benefits if hybrid is coming back.
If you're not playing White, it only nets you a life. But it's hybrid and would fit the theme of the set it it does go the hybrid route.
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GP Charlotte 2013 Top 16 GTC Limited
PT RTR Day 2
GP Worcester 3-4th place 2012 M13 Limited
GPT Minneapolis 1st Place
SCG Worcester 10th place 2012
TCG Platinum top 8 June 24th 2012
GPT Worcester 2012 2nd and 5-8th place same event 2 decks (2 running soul run ramp m13 standard)
If you're not playing White, it only nets you a life. But it's hybrid and would fit the theme of the set it it does go the hybrid route.
But it could still just cost 1 and have a condition if W was paid to pay it.
The common rule is that one colored symbol is equal to 2 colorless mana. I think it's good design space to explore and definitely helpful in limited imagine:
Grey Giant :3mana::sym2r:
Creature
3/3
Hill giant you can cast when missing the color, that's tasty in a limited deck.
Nessa, for the Greater Good2:symgb::symgw:
Planeswalker - Nessa
+2: You gain 2 life.
-1: Put a 1/1 green Elf creature token with lifelink and deathtouch onto the battlefield.
-9: Each player sacrifices each creature they control. Put a 3/3 green Beast creature token onto the battlefield for each creature sacrificed in this way.
3
Sarkhan, Corrupted2:symrb::symgb:
Planeswalker - Sarkhan
+1: Creatures you control get +2/+0 until end of turn.
-2: Target player sacrifices a creature.
-6: Put five 3/3 green Beast creature tokens with haste onto the battlefield. Sacrifice them at the beginning of the next end step.
4
Though, I doubt very much we will see Nissa again.
We might also see more cards along the lines of Spectral Procession or Reaper King, where you can pay colored mana, or just colorless, or some combination of the two. Also expecting a common CotbT land which produces 2 mana or something.
This could be a very interesting set, or another experimental flop, but at least they're trying something new and hopefully inventive.
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Decks
Commander
Ezuri, Renegade Leader (Aggro/Combo - Favorite) Skullbriar, the Walking Grave (Sac and Grave hijinks) Azusa, Lost but Seeking (Landfall hijinks) Kaalia of the Vast (Heavily modded)
There has been at least one card with hybrid in its cost or text box printed each year since Ravnica - Time Spiral had Graven Cairns; then we had Shadowmoor block and Alara Reborn, each of which had hybrid.
They might as well make it evergreen, but unless they do, it's unlikely we'll see it every year...
If they were to do colorless/color hybrids, it would look like Flame Javelin/Spectral Procession and cost more colorless than colored.
Also, even if the set is ALL Colorless and Hybrid cards, there can still be a definite color pie. Ghostfire is a "colorless" card, but it still is clearly in the color pie. We will probably see more cards like it. Colorless does not mean they can't have color requirements in their casting cost,
It just means they are colorless.
Hybrid mana is evergreen.
http://www.wizards.com/MagiC/Magazine/Article.aspx?x=mtg/daily/mm/44
I wouldn't like to see an all-colorless set either. Enough with the set gimmicks already.
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I believe it's quite a given that we'll have colorless and hybrid planeswalkers someday. No reason why it couldn't be right now.
Anyway, I hope that this speculation is wrong. I'm fine with some colorlessness and some hybrid, but not a whole set of it. I don't like this type of gimmick.
MaRo was pointing out the fact that in Mirrodin Block you didn't need to care about colors, basically. You could play all the best cards without any manabase problem.
Srsly, does these truly seem out-of-theme in a colorless-themed set?
I don't see why having everything be "colorless" means they are throwing the color pie out the window. They can just have "~ is colorless" on it, and give them the "full art" frames we saw:
Also, I could see a hybrid version of Nissa or Sarkhan or something. Hybrid Jace, not so much, but Sarkhan is already multicolored, and Nissa always seemed a bit "black" to me.
Sure, you could print Colorsap (This card is colorless), but that takes up even more space and is at least as much of a gimmick as tribal. It's completely useless other than parasitic cards to interact with it. It would be much more sensible to just do them as monocolor hybrid cards and change the comprehensive rules to say that such a card is colorless in addition to the color in its mana cost if it has no fully colored mana symbols.
I agree. Making a bunch of cards like Ghostfire would just mean a bunch of gray card borders. Oh, and RDW can now hose Kor Firewalker.
[Clan Flamingo]
But that defeats the purpose of being "colorless". How exactly would something be colored and colorless at the same time?
Ghostfire, which is obviously a future-shifted card from ROE, was a forecast of the colorless nature of the set. I'm pretty sure we will see more cards like it, most likely keyworded.
or theres more of an emphasis on single colors coming up.
regardless most of the time she's not so easy to get into play.
Ravnica comes to answer your question! You would have cards like Induce Paranoia but without the blue. Example:
ET's Healing Finger 1/
Instant
You gain 1 life.
If you spent W to cast this, target creature gains vigilance until end of turn.
Mafia Stats
Kill shot: BB
Issue with my shooting? Please visit my helpdesk and help me learn to aim!
I agree. There's nothing that indicates the set will be "all colorless or hybrid." There's nothing that indicates the set will have any hybrid cards! Just this guy thinks so, and if he's right you'll all hate the set because by its nature it'll have to be underpowered to accommodate the fact that at least 2 colors can run every card in the set.
From a flavor perspective, I don't see WotC making a completely colorless set that is based entireley around the Eldrazi.
I expect that there will be resistance forces arrayed against them in the set, and that these cards will have colored mana symbols. I expect to see some angels, vampires, merfolk, etc... in RoE.
I think they're still experimenting with what the right power level should be. This set will be the third (or fourth) good testing for Hybrid. I look for the power level of this set to be used as the gold standard for Hybrid going forward.
BRG Jund Midrange GRB //// B Vampire Aggro B //// WRU Patriot Control URW
Extended:
RGW Zoo WGR
Legacy:
RUG Canadian Thresh GUR
EDH:
U Arcum Dagsson U //// WB Teysa, Orzhov Scion BW //// UR Jhoira of the Ghitu RU
Special thanks to spiderboy4 of High~Light Studios for the banner
You do realize this card works the same costed as 1 without the hybrid, right? I think we'll see more Beseech the Queen-type cost benefits if hybrid is coming back.
If you're not playing White, it only nets you a life. But it's hybrid and would fit the theme of the set it it does go the hybrid route.
PT RTR Day 2
GP Worcester 3-4th place 2012 M13 Limited
GPT Minneapolis 1st Place
SCG Worcester 10th place 2012
TCG Platinum top 8 June 24th 2012
GPT Worcester 2012 2nd and 5-8th place same event 2 decks (2 running soul run ramp m13 standard)
WR Boros Legion WR
But it could still just cost 1 and have a condition if W was paid to pay it.
The common rule is that one colored symbol is equal to 2 colorless mana. I think it's good design space to explore and definitely helpful in limited imagine:
Grey Giant :3mana::sym2r:
Creature
3/3
Hill giant you can cast when missing the color, that's tasty in a limited deck.
My Altered Art Gallery
Nessa, for the Greater Good 2:symgb::symgw:
Planeswalker - Nessa
+2: You gain 2 life.
-1: Put a 1/1 green Elf creature token with lifelink and deathtouch onto the battlefield.
-9: Each player sacrifices each creature they control. Put a 3/3 green Beast creature token onto the battlefield for each creature sacrificed in this way.
3
Sarkhan, Corrupted 2:symrb::symgb:
Planeswalker - Sarkhan
+1: Creatures you control get +2/+0 until end of turn.
-2: Target player sacrifices a creature.
-6: Put five 3/3 green Beast creature tokens with haste onto the battlefield. Sacrifice them at the beginning of the next end step.
4
Though, I doubt very much we will see Nissa again.
This could be a very interesting set, or another experimental flop, but at least they're trying something new and hopefully inventive.
Commander
Ezuri, Renegade Leader (Aggro/Combo - Favorite)
Skullbriar, the Walking Grave (Sac and Grave hijinks)
Azusa, Lost but Seeking (Landfall hijinks)
Kaalia of the Vast (Heavily modded)
Standard
Waiting for Innistrad...
Extended
Hah!
Modern
Living End Cascade (RGB)
Legacy
Burn
Vintage
None
Casual
WB Aggro-Control
Green Stompy
Pink Floyd (UWr Wall Control)
Lunch Box (Fatty ramp)
D-Bag (White Control)
Level 13 Task Mage