Wizards of the Coast Extends Nationals Invitations to Yu-Gi-Oh! Players
March 2, 2009 - Renton, WA - Wizards of the Coast today announced that invitations to the Magic: The Gathering® Nationals tournament will be extended to qualified Yu-Gi-Oh! trading card game players in response to the recent announcement that their National Championships are cancelled.
“We respect the accomplishments of all high-level tournament players,” said Chris Galvin, VP of Organized Play for Wizards of the Coast. “We’d like to do what we can to honor their achievements and keep them gaming.”
Yu-Gi-Oh! trading card game players who hold an invitation to the Yu-Gi-Oh! US or Canadian Nationals that were scheduled to take place this year will be welcomed to come play Magic at the equivalent Magic: The Gathering Nationals in summer 2009. Interested players can simply contact the Wizards Game Support team by visiting customer support or by calling 1-800-324-6496.
any thoughts? it seems like it's a bit of a strange idea, seeing as YGO isn't even made by wizards. any person who qualifies for YGO nats gets an invitation to the Magic Nationals for that same country.
It's the equivalent of a Pizza Hut accepting all competitors' coupons. If some of the 'good' yu-gi-oh players ('good' not meant as an insult here, I just don't know if they have any stars like magic does) switch to Magic, maybe others will too?
Sure, stuff like Snapping Drake and Goblin Piker are for limited. But Null isn't even playable against a 5 year old whose hand consists of a 6 of Clubs, Blue-Eyes White Dragon, Chimney Imp, and a very large cumquat.
I don't want to criticize them for this move, or any money move they make that doesn't significantly affect the game in a negative fashion (because the more money they make, the, hopefully, more prize support and such they can offer). I think it's good that they're extending the invite, but as someone said, I don't think YGO has any name pros (I think from a Shonen Jump tournament you get a laptop or something as first prize).
I don't want to criticize them for this move, or any money move they make that doesn't significantly affect the game in a negative fashion (because the more money they make, the, hopefully, more prize support and such they can offer).
I agree, these sort of business decisions are a great way to increase revenue without "hurting" the game (like some people think Mythics do), and decisions like this can only have positive consequences. What's the worst that could happen? No YGO players show up? Oh well.
Sure, stuff like Snapping Drake and Goblin Piker are for limited. But Null isn't even playable against a 5 year old whose hand consists of a 6 of Clubs, Blue-Eyes White Dragon, Chimney Imp, and a very large cumquat.
This is the perfect time to make this move. Upper Deck and Konami are in a legal battle over the righst to distribute YGO in North America and Europe will likely be next. Alot of YGO players move on to Magic on their own though. One in my area has an established YGO reputation and is now starting all over again with Magic(its Vincent Tundo and that will only mean something to you if you've played YGO for as long as I have). GG Wizards!
This makes me angry. They're inviting Yu-Gi-Oh players over more qualified Magic players? I can see it as a business move, but saturating Nats with people who just learned how to play seems annoying and unfair to other Magic players.
Back on topic:
How are invitations for nationals normally handed out? Is there only a set number each year? And do we know if these YGO invitations cut into that number? Because if someone who grinds it out for an invite gets bumped for a YGO player, I could see it being a problem.
Sure, stuff like Snapping Drake and Goblin Piker are for limited. But Null isn't even playable against a 5 year old whose hand consists of a 6 of Clubs, Blue-Eyes White Dragon, Chimney Imp, and a very large cumquat.
This makes me angry. They're inviting Yu-Gi-Oh players over more qualified Magic players? I can see it as a business move, but saturating Nats with people who just learned how to play seems annoying and unfair to other Magic players.
No qualified Magic players are losing spots. Also, alot of YGO players also play Magic. Try talking to some local YGO players instead of scorning and slamming them.
Ah, my mistake, I didn't mean "qualified" like that. Rather I meant that WotC could be giving those spots out to random magic players, specifically me.
Ah, my mistake, I didn't mean "qualified" like that. Rather I meant that WotC could be giving those spots out to random magic players, specifically me.
But the YGO players topped regionals. No matter what the TCG, random scrubs don't top regionals.
Try talking to some local YGO players instead of scorning and slamming them.
I've tried, several times, in several cities in several countries, but they're all always rude and socially awkward when I'm trying to be nice and they dismiss MTG as a stupid game, so you can guess the type of luck I've had in real life with those kinds of people.
I've tried, several times, in several cities in several countries, but they're all always rude and socially awkward when I'm trying to be nice and they dismiss MTG as a stupid game, so you can guess the type of luck I've had in real life with those kinds of people.
All? I doubt that. The problem is that many Magic players talk about Magic as if its a superior game without actually knowing anything about YGO. I played YGO before I played Magic and when people told me about Magic many would just say that its better than YGO and thats why I should play. No reasoning behind it at all. Presenting Magic from a position of perceived superiority comes off as very pompous and elitist. Try learning about the game, the metagame, and why people play it. Insight is a definite +1 when trying to draw someone into another TCG.
DISCLAIMER: This is entirely based on my experience as an employee at a specific comic/game store.
I typically play in or work during all 3 Magic events at our store and occasionally fill in for someone during our YuGiOh event. Somehow I end up TOing YuGiOh whenever I'm there (pretty much because since I'm not usually around they think they can pawn it off on me) so I'm get up close with the YuGiOh kids.
Now, I want to point out that the Yugioh crowd is typically younger than the Magic crowd.
Both groups have a mix of well-behaved kids and misbehaving kids, mature people and immature people. There isn't a huge difference between the players. You'll always have a variety of people in a group and you shouldn't always base your opinions on a small group (although, I just did).
I'd wager in this case that these winners are Spikes anyway and a Spike is a Spike is a Spike as far as I'm concerned. Serious game players will be serious about any game they play.
I don't like YuGiOh as a game personally and I'd be glad to see less people play it and have more players playing Magic
It's a good idea, but I feel if WotC wants to capture a slice of the YGO pie, they need to target the general population. Imagine complete novices (assuming they have not played MTG before) going to an advanced level tournament - their experiences would likely not be pleasant, trying to learn the rules in such a strict environment. Wizards is better off targetting the much more numerous everyday players of the game rather than the YGO pros.
You guys have to realize that, at the moment, yugioh HAS NO COMPETITIVE PLAY NETWORK.
Wizards is basically offering qualified yugioh players the chance to have something they currently don't have - Competitive play. If they get a few converts out of it, good for them.
That sort of attitude is what makes YGO players dislike Magic players. >.<
LOL, of course I don't even imply that. I've tried to keep an open mind about YGO but it's never worked. I actually think the game is better because YGO didn't get to me in the beginning. I thought YGO was simpler, so I started trying to learn it, but I ended up thinking MTG was better after a personal failed attempt at understanding (in conclusion, my way of thinking is quite recent).
All? I doubt that. The problem is that many Magic players talk about Magic as if its a superior game without actually knowing anything about YGO. I played YGO before I played Magic and when people told me about Magic many would just say that its better than YGO and thats why I should play. No reasoning behind it at all. Presenting Magic from a position of perceived superiority comes off as very pompous and elitist. Try learning about the game, the metagame, and why people play it. Insight is a definite +1 when trying to draw someone into another TCG.
Well, seeing that you're from NY, where there's lots of everything, you may have been exposed to very diverse environments... I think it's a matter of chance, I HAVE had a bad experience with 100% of YGO-only players... after I while I just gave up and decided I liked MTG better (but I try to respect those who play that... other game:rolleyes:, and I consider you an exception: the only cool Yu-Gi-Oh player ever). A friend tried teaching me how to play Yu-Gi long before I knew how to play Magic well... it was like a native Hawaiian talking to me about nuclear physics in Chinese... sadly.
You guys have to realize that, at the moment, yugioh HAS NO COMPETITIVE PLAY NETWORK.
Wizards is basically offering qualified yugioh players the chance to have something they currently don't have - Competitive play. If they get a few converts out of it, good for them.
And this is basically why I think it's a great idea.
It's a good idea, but I feel if WotC wants to capture a slice of the YGO pie, they need to target the general population. Imagine complete novices (assuming they have not played MTG before) going to an advanced level tournament - their experiences would likely not be pleasant, trying to learn the rules in such a strict environment. Wizards is better off targetting the much more numerous everyday players of the game rather than the YGO pros.
Wizards need to get the pros to get everyone else. The YGO metagame is extremely competitive and many casual players follow the high level tournaments. No one cares if Joe Schmoe starts playing Magic but if Adam Corn or Cezar "The Princess" Gonzales(he's openly gay and that's his real nickname!) does more average players are going to get interested. Also, I expect that only a few hardcore tournament players to actually do this. I bet there will be alot of people in their corner because this is sort of a challenge. What if they qualify for Worlds of both games? YGO players love challenges and it seems Wizards has unknowingly thrown down the gauntlet.
You guys have to realize that, at the moment, yugioh HAS NO COMPETITIVE PLAY NETWORK.
Wizards is basically offering qualified yugioh players the chance to have something they currently don't have - Competitive play. If they get a few converts out of it, good for them.
Wait what? YGO has competitive play. There just isn't a Pro Tour type circuit. In Japan mangaka are given alot of creative control and YGO's creator decreed that YGO should never have a pro circuit with cash prizes. Takahashi feels that players would become too serious about what should be a hobby. Every month there's a Shonen Jump Championship, where players compete for electronics and an exclusive prize card(each is valued at 2k or so while its the prize card). OP has been frozen because of the dispute between UDE and Konami but it did exist and local OP is still going on.
LOL, of course I don't even imply that. I've tried to keep an open mind about YGO but it's never worked. I actually think the game is better because YGO didn't get to me in the beginning. I thought YGO was simpler, so I started trying to learn it, but I ended up thinking MTG was better after a personal failed attempt at understanding (in conclusion, my way of thinking is quite recent).
Its only a children's card game on paper. YGO is fairly easy for me but then I've been playing nearly 7 years. Its hard to learn YGO sometimes because many players don't want to teach you to play and delight in humiliating new players. Also, the rules are often contridictory at the best of times. I'm a judge and I'm often baffled by some rulings.
Well, seeing that you're from NY, where there's lots of everything, you may have been exposed to very diverse environments... I think it's a matter of chance, I HAVE had a bad experience with 100% of YGO-only players... after I while I just gave up and decided I liked MTG better (but I try to respect those who play that... other game:rolleyes:, and I consider you an exception: the only cool Yu-Gi-Oh player ever). A friend tried teaching me how to play Yu-Gi long before I knew how to play Magic well... it was like a native Hawaiian talking to me about nuclear physics in Chinese... sadly.
I live in Buffalo. Its very far away from NYC. I've been to Georgia and have seen the small, sometimes isolated pockets of TCG players. But then again I went to Warner Robins(I won a tourny there with mono black Rogues!) and its tiny and its very hard to do anything there w/o a car. If you want to learn YGO, talk to someone who's at least 17. Older players are nicer and more patient. Maybe I can meet up with you this summer or in the fall. I'm going to DragonCon and I might spend the summer in Georgia with my dad or cousin. So I'll be at events all over!
This seems like a brilliant move to me. UDE (The ones who have distributed Yugioh in North America since the beginning), just lost the right to Konami, the original creators of the game, apparently because UDE authorized the distribution of "counterfeit" cards (Cards NOT manufactured with Konami's authorization). Now that Konami has taken over, many of the players, especially the pros, are worried. They fear that Konami will screw up the game because Yugioh in Japan is not as competetive (As in, not as many large tournaments, not as much prize support. The players are still really good) as it is over here. They fear the game will die and all of the money (it's a LOT) that they have invested in their decks will go down the drain. With cancellations of events and push-backs of product release dates, it does seem like an opportune time to sell off some of your Yugioh stuff and start finding a new hobby incase Yugioh does tank. WOTC is simply taking advantage of this situation like Upper Deck did with their Upper Deck Day (Their last hurrah before Konami could take complete control, where they gave away a lot of good Yugioh prizes to lure in the players and let everyone try out -their- new TCG for free, in hopes of converting the Yugioh players to their new game).
honestly, as a former YGO player (who never really got into the game)... I think the idea to try to attract the big names in YGO to Magic, is a brilliant move. However in all honesty, I am not all that sure it is going to work very well. For one thing, alot of these big names probably are very dedicated to YGO and may not be overly well versed with magic (then again they may be, who knows except them?). However either way, even if they are card sharks in YGO, I highly doubt these guys are anywhere near the level of card sharkyness that is required to play with the big boys of Magic the Gathering, and will probably end up highly discouraged when they encounter the bigger names and lose to the bigger names in the Nationals Tournament.
That's just my 2c's
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So people who did not qualify for Nationals get an invitation to Nationals? I like that it may give Magic more players, but really?
Yugioh is just such a different game than magic. The decision making process in Magic is so much more involved. Yugioh, from what I remember, doesn't have a "stack" system, and instead uses some "spell speed" system, which is non intuitive and doesn't allow for as much interaction. Design is all over the place, spells are not all templated the same way, and rulings are made that simply don't fit the card. Take one card I remember, Wave Motion Cannon. During your main phase, you could sacrifice this card to deal damage equal to 1000 times the number of the standby phases (think upkeep) you have had since the card was in play. Another called called Solomon's Lawbook says target player skips his or her next standby phase. According to the ruling, when you sacrifice the cannon, it counts the phase you skipped. That would be like a ruling that says you can remove time counters from suspended cards as normal even though there is an Eon Hub in play. Granted, this may not be the current ruling, but it matches the absurdity of the others I encountered.
There is also no R&D to make sure broken things stay relatively out of the game. The fact that their version of Standard is "whatever isn't currently banned" should tell you something.
So people who did not qualify for Nationals get an invitation to Nationals? I like that it may give Magic more players, but really?
Yugioh is just such a different game than magic. The decision making process in Magic is so much more involved. Yugioh, from what I remember, doesn't have a "stack" system, and instead uses some "spell speed" system, which is non intuitive and doesn't allow for as much interaction. Design is all over the place, spells are not all templated the same way, and rulings are made that simply don't fit the card. Take one card I remember, Wave Motion Cannon. During your main phase, you could sacrifice this card to deal damage equal to 1000 times the number of the standby phases (think upkeep) you have had since the card was in play. Another called called Solomon's Lawbook says target player skips his or her next standby phase. According to the ruling, when you sacrifice the cannon, it counts the phase you skipped. That would be like a ruling that says you can remove time counters from suspended cards as normal even though there is an Eon Hub in play. Granted, this may not be the current ruling, but it matches the absurdity of the others I encountered.
There is also no R&D to make sure broken things stay relatively out of the game. The fact that their version of Standard is "whatever isn't currently banned" should tell you something.
Well, Yugioh has "chains" which work the same way as the stack in Magic. First in, last out. The last card in the "chain" resolves, and it works backwards from there. Yugioh also has priority like Magic does. Yugioh was bad and chaotic in the beginning, but in recent year, Konami and UDE really have done a great job with fixing things. Most ruling conflicts come from slight translation errors (Since the cards originate in Japan and must be translated into English. It doesn't happen often though).The only other major problem that Yugioh tournaments tend to have is that often times, when the ban/restricted list is updated (This is Yugioh's version of 'rotation'), the TCG often gets Japan's ban list, and since our metagames are much different thanks to the card pools, it often doesn't hurt the problem decks enough that are being used outside of Japan.
I've played Yugioh since the beginning. I do admit that Magic is far more complex, offers great tournament play, and is generally more fun, but Yugioh isn't without fun or strategy of it's own.
any thoughts? it seems like it's a bit of a strange idea, seeing as YGO isn't even made by wizards. any person who qualifies for YGO nats gets an invitation to the Magic Nationals for that same country.
I agree, these sort of business decisions are a great way to increase revenue without "hurting" the game (like some people think Mythics do), and decisions like this can only have positive consequences. What's the worst that could happen? No YGO players show up? Oh well.
EDIT: apparently konami made the decision to cut out the middle man (Upper Deck Entertainment), and UDE decided to sue them. This was back in december, and this was all I could find on the topic:
http://www.yugioh-card.com/en/news/press_release_ygo.pdf
http://dockets.justia.com/docket/court-nvdce/case_no-2:2008cv01737/case_id-63327/
Back on topic:
How are invitations for nationals normally handed out? Is there only a set number each year? And do we know if these YGO invitations cut into that number? Because if someone who grinds it out for an invite gets bumped for a YGO player, I could see it being a problem.
No qualified Magic players are losing spots. Also, alot of YGO players also play Magic. Try talking to some local YGO players instead of scorning and slamming them.
But the YGO players topped regionals. No matter what the TCG, random scrubs don't top regionals.
I've tried, several times, in several cities in several countries, but they're all always rude and socially awkward when I'm trying to be nice and they dismiss MTG as a stupid game, so you can guess the type of luck I've had in real life with those kinds of people.
I like 4/4s for 7.
Beat that yugi oh!
That sort of attitude is what makes YGO players dislike Magic players. >.<
All? I doubt that. The problem is that many Magic players talk about Magic as if its a superior game without actually knowing anything about YGO. I played YGO before I played Magic and when people told me about Magic many would just say that its better than YGO and thats why I should play. No reasoning behind it at all. Presenting Magic from a position of perceived superiority comes off as very pompous and elitist. Try learning about the game, the metagame, and why people play it. Insight is a definite +1 when trying to draw someone into another TCG.
I typically play in or work during all 3 Magic events at our store and occasionally fill in for someone during our YuGiOh event. Somehow I end up TOing YuGiOh whenever I'm there (pretty much because since I'm not usually around they think they can pawn it off on me) so I'm get up close with the YuGiOh kids.
Now, I want to point out that the Yugioh crowd is typically younger than the Magic crowd.
Both groups have a mix of well-behaved kids and misbehaving kids, mature people and immature people. There isn't a huge difference between the players. You'll always have a variety of people in a group and you shouldn't always base your opinions on a small group (although, I just did).
I'd wager in this case that these winners are Spikes anyway and a Spike is a Spike is a Spike as far as I'm concerned. Serious game players will be serious about any game they play.
I don't like YuGiOh as a game personally and I'd be glad to see less people play it and have more players playing Magic
Wizards is basically offering qualified yugioh players the chance to have something they currently don't have - Competitive play. If they get a few converts out of it, good for them.
Currently 62/265 cards.
LOL, of course I don't even imply that. I've tried to keep an open mind about YGO but it's never worked. I actually think the game is better because YGO didn't get to me in the beginning. I thought YGO was simpler, so I started trying to learn it, but I ended up thinking MTG was better after a personal failed attempt at understanding (in conclusion, my way of thinking is quite recent).
Well, seeing that you're from NY, where there's lots of everything, you may have been exposed to very diverse environments... I think it's a matter of chance, I HAVE had a bad experience with 100% of YGO-only players... after I while I just gave up and decided I liked MTG better (but I try to respect those who play that... other game:rolleyes:, and I consider you an exception: the only cool Yu-Gi-Oh player ever). A friend tried teaching me how to play Yu-Gi long before I knew how to play Magic well... it was like a native Hawaiian talking to me about nuclear physics in Chinese... sadly.
And this is basically why I think it's a great idea.
I like 4/4s for 7.
Wizards need to get the pros to get everyone else. The YGO metagame is extremely competitive and many casual players follow the high level tournaments. No one cares if Joe Schmoe starts playing Magic but if Adam Corn or Cezar "The Princess" Gonzales(he's openly gay and that's his real nickname!) does more average players are going to get interested. Also, I expect that only a few hardcore tournament players to actually do this. I bet there will be alot of people in their corner because this is sort of a challenge. What if they qualify for Worlds of both games? YGO players love challenges and it seems Wizards has unknowingly thrown down the gauntlet.
Wait what? YGO has competitive play. There just isn't a Pro Tour type circuit. In Japan mangaka are given alot of creative control and YGO's creator decreed that YGO should never have a pro circuit with cash prizes. Takahashi feels that players would become too serious about what should be a hobby. Every month there's a Shonen Jump Championship, where players compete for electronics and an exclusive prize card(each is valued at 2k or so while its the prize card). OP has been frozen because of the dispute between UDE and Konami but it did exist and local OP is still going on.
Its only a children's card game on paper. YGO is fairly easy for me but then I've been playing nearly 7 years. Its hard to learn YGO sometimes because many players don't want to teach you to play and delight in humiliating new players. Also, the rules are often contridictory at the best of times. I'm a judge and I'm often baffled by some rulings.
I live in Buffalo. Its very far away from NYC. I've been to Georgia and have seen the small, sometimes isolated pockets of TCG players. But then again I went to Warner Robins(I won a tourny there with mono black Rogues!) and its tiny and its very hard to do anything there w/o a car. If you want to learn YGO, talk to someone who's at least 17. Older players are nicer and more patient. Maybe I can meet up with you this summer or in the fall. I'm going to DragonCon and I might spend the summer in Georgia with my dad or cousin. So I'll be at events all over!
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That's just my 2c's
Yugioh is just such a different game than magic. The decision making process in Magic is so much more involved. Yugioh, from what I remember, doesn't have a "stack" system, and instead uses some "spell speed" system, which is non intuitive and doesn't allow for as much interaction. Design is all over the place, spells are not all templated the same way, and rulings are made that simply don't fit the card. Take one card I remember, Wave Motion Cannon. During your main phase, you could sacrifice this card to deal damage equal to 1000 times the number of the standby phases (think upkeep) you have had since the card was in play. Another called called Solomon's Lawbook says target player skips his or her next standby phase. According to the ruling, when you sacrifice the cannon, it counts the phase you skipped. That would be like a ruling that says you can remove time counters from suspended cards as normal even though there is an Eon Hub in play. Granted, this may not be the current ruling, but it matches the absurdity of the others I encountered.
There is also no R&D to make sure broken things stay relatively out of the game. The fact that their version of Standard is "whatever isn't currently banned" should tell you something.
Well, Yugioh has "chains" which work the same way as the stack in Magic. First in, last out. The last card in the "chain" resolves, and it works backwards from there. Yugioh also has priority like Magic does. Yugioh was bad and chaotic in the beginning, but in recent year, Konami and UDE really have done a great job with fixing things. Most ruling conflicts come from slight translation errors (Since the cards originate in Japan and must be translated into English. It doesn't happen often though).The only other major problem that Yugioh tournaments tend to have is that often times, when the ban/restricted list is updated (This is Yugioh's version of 'rotation'), the TCG often gets Japan's ban list, and since our metagames are much different thanks to the card pools, it often doesn't hurt the problem decks enough that are being used outside of Japan.
I've played Yugioh since the beginning. I do admit that Magic is far more complex, offers great tournament play, and is generally more fun, but Yugioh isn't without fun or strategy of it's own.
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(Signature courtesy of Argetlam of Hakai Studios