Yes, I actually do feel better. Time fixes all wounds.
It's unfortunate that we (humanity) are unable to make logical decisions that are without prejudice. It saddens me. Only then are we able to move forward as a species.
A lot of things are rules. That doesn't mean that they make sense.
Yes, I actually do feel better. Time fixes all wounds.
It's unfortunate that we (humanity) are unable to make logical decisions that are without prejudice. It saddens me. Only then are we able to move forward as a species.
I'm... having some difficulty wrapping my head around the idea that the two sentences were consecutively stated in the same post, by the same person. You vented, you feel better, but it's only when we discard our emotions that we can move forward? Are you implying that you didn't start this thread in anger, or that you haven't moved forward?
A lot of things are rules. That doesn't mean that they make sense.
And this is very true. Most rules, when you get right down to it, are responses to the amazingly illogical way in which humans do the things they do. We wouldn't need laws if everyone got along, thought the same way. But we don't: every single person has different thoughts in their head, does different things for different reasons, it's all a big cluster**** and we just kind of have to take it as it comes or be overwhelmed. So is it really so surprising that we have these "harsh" rules to protect the innocent in the Market Street? Sure, it might be a joke to you or I that someone would be so silly as to abuse the "24-hour bump" rule, but there are people who would, with malice of forethought, and we both know it. Can you really blame the staff for being a little worried, a little overly cautious, about people who would abuse the rules of a website devoted to a card game? 'Cuz I think those people are scary, and if I have to trade off a little freedom for protection from these people, I would be okay with it.
Mods, feel free to close these. Or leave it open. I don't care. This is my last post in this topic. I've said my piece. Now I'm done. There is no reason for me to continue.
I really don't understand why people are agreeing with him though. Are you so desperate to bump your thread at the exact time you cannot wait for it to be 1 minute over to be safe?
Why do you have to be like that? A lot of the talk was about how different people's computers are a few minutes off.
If the infraction means that much to that particular member, then they should fix the clock on their computer or find a secondary source (wristwatch, cell phone, my cable box and even my oven tell the time.)
So every person posting in Market Street should be expected to figure out what the server's time zone is, how their time zone compares, and then make sure they're respecting the "midnight to midnight rule"? I don't see how that's easier, or any less arbitrary, than "once every 24 hours."
The reason why a 'midnight to midnight' rule is a sensible possibility, and what I suspect is Sykes' reason for suggesting it, is because that's the illegal bump rule MOTL uses. It works for them because they have a custom plugin for their forum software that throws an error message and refuses to let members post an illegal bump. vBulletin would also require a plugin to do this, which we don't have.
We use the current rolling 24 hour period rule because a midnight-to-midnight rule would require moderators to calculate what midnight is in their local timezone (vBulletin displays post times in postbits using the user's chosen local timezone) and do the math to determine if a bump is illegal. Rather than force a timezone dependency and make the Market Street staff's work even more time-consuming, we use a standard that any mod in any timezone can correctly and quickly apply without having to determine anything other than "is this time less than 24 hours after the last one?"
This works, and I wouldn't even consider a proposal to go to a midnight-to-midnight standard without the means to enforce it automatically.
If the infraction means that much to that particular member, then they should fix the clock on their computer or find a secondary source (wristwatch, cell phone, my cable box and even my oven tell the time.)
No, I agree with this. I just thought that guy was out of line calling people desperate especially when some discussion was had about the time differences between computers. I already voiced here.
vBulletin would also require a plugin to do this, which we don't have.
What would it take to implement this? I'm sure nobody really wants to bump early, it's either an accident or they didn't read the MS specific rules. Seems like not even being allowed to post early would be a great feature, like taking a breathalyzer before entering Debate or whatever
Well I think that the OP is very desperate needing to bump 6 minutes early.
I never stated everyone in the market street is like that, and I don't believe that. I'm just saying the ones that were sticking up for the "Oh but 6 minutes should be fine!" are.
I think it would make more sense if the minimum were 23 hours instead of 24. That way you could regularly do it at the same time each day, instead of (if you want to be safe) slightly later each day.
I think it would make more sense if the minimum were 23 hours instead of 24. That way you could regularly do it at the same time each day, instead of (if you want to be safe) slightly later each day.
23 hours doesn't sound quite as nice as 24 hours. I think it should be 48. Then again, I don't use Market Street, so you can ignore me.
I think it would make more sense if the minimum were 23 hours instead of 24. That way you could regularly do it at the same time each day, instead of (if you want to be safe) slightly later each day.
Reading through this thread, this is exactly what I was thinking. Sure 23 doesn't sound as nice, but allowing people to post at the same time everyday instead of worrying about skipping a day to sleep (potentially a big concern to the more compulsive of us) might make things easier on people.
You know what would be really awesome, if the trade thread had some kind of a automatically enforced warning system telling you before you bump if it has been at least 24 hours so you don't get that 2 minute early infraction cause you didn't check the exact time before running off for work.
Or if you could set an auto bump script...but that could get kind of spammy...
Personally, I don't see a problem with a bump if it is within a few minutes. Sure, if someone happens to catch it leave some nice MOD text as a friendly reminder. If it is more than 10 minutes you are obviously violating the spirit of the rule...but does it really have to be followed to the letter?
I suppose that would lead to more MOD action, but a clear history of violating the spirit of the rule would definitely be an infraction.
Or even better, a premature bump gets your thread locked for 24 hours and only unlocked when you contact the MOD.
I think most of the users who have posted in the market place have gotten a warning for bumping their thread early. I know I certainly did the first time.
I probably don't bump my trade thread enough because I'm scared of being infracted or being given other warning.
It really does make sense that you simply should not be able to bump the thread until the system allows you too, OR that they drop the hard rule of 24 hours and just make it once a day. I don't buy the argument on how much time it would take a moderator to calculate time zone difference. If you see a guy bump his thread and the last time he did it was the day before, let it go and everyone is merry and happy.
I think most of the users who have posted in the market place have gotten a warning for bumping their thread early. I know I certainly did the first time.
I probably don't bump my trade thread enough because I'm scared of being infracted or being given other warning.
It really does make sense that you simply should not be able to bump the thread until the system allows you too, OR that they drop the hard rule of 24 hours and just make it once a day. I don't buy the argument on how much time it would take a moderator to calculate time zone difference. If you see a guy bump his thread and the last time he did it was the day before, let it go and everyone is merry and happy.
The difference between 24 hours and once a day is when you bump at 11:59 pm and then again at 12:01 am. It is now a new day. Sure a 2 minute wait time between bumps is pointless...but you get the idea.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I am looking for Date Stamped promos from Khans of Tarkir block so I can finish my set. Check my wants if you have any.
Currently offering 2 non-foil Kolighan's Command for a Date Stamped foil!
The difference between 24 hours and once a day is when you bump at 11:59 pm and then again at 12:01 am. It is now a new day. Sure a 2 minute wait time between bumps is pointless...but you get the idea.
Why's that a problem? You'll still have to wait an entire day to bump again after that.
EDH/Commander is a social format, right? So why don't people use their social skills to discuss what they like and don't like, instead of adopting a list with 60+ banned cards?
It really does make sense that you simply should not be able to bump the thread until the system allows you too, OR that they drop the hard rule of 24 hours and just make it once a day. I don't buy the argument on how much time it would take a moderator to calculate time zone difference. If you see a guy bump his thread and the last time he did it was the day before, let it go and everyone is merry and happy.
Having the BBS system enforce it is not an option. Making it the rule 'soft' like just 'once a day' is messy as it becomes awkward to enforce and there are several issues with anything involving time zones.
fnord's 23-hour rule seems like the greatest solution by far.
It's unfortunate that we (humanity) are unable to make logical decisions that are without prejudice. It saddens me. Only then are we able to move forward as a species.
A lot of things are rules. That doesn't mean that they make sense.
My have/wants trade list.
Seeing this thread, I figure there's a lot more people who will opt not to trade with him now.
Whoops.
Sign up for League of Legends!
I'm... having some difficulty wrapping my head around the idea that the two sentences were consecutively stated in the same post, by the same person. You vented, you feel better, but it's only when we discard our emotions that we can move forward? Are you implying that you didn't start this thread in anger, or that you haven't moved forward?
And this is very true. Most rules, when you get right down to it, are responses to the amazingly illogical way in which humans do the things they do. We wouldn't need laws if everyone got along, thought the same way. But we don't: every single person has different thoughts in their head, does different things for different reasons, it's all a big cluster**** and we just kind of have to take it as it comes or be overwhelmed. So is it really so surprising that we have these "harsh" rules to protect the innocent in the Market Street? Sure, it might be a joke to you or I that someone would be so silly as to abuse the "24-hour bump" rule, but there are people who would, with malice of forethought, and we both know it. Can you really blame the staff for being a little worried, a little overly cautious, about people who would abuse the rules of a website devoted to a card game? 'Cuz I think those people are scary, and if I have to trade off a little freedom for protection from these people, I would be okay with it.
Dude, I don't think one person here thinks getting an infraction makes you a bad guy. Stop trying to say that, it makes no sense and helps nothing.
Archatmos
Excellion
Fracture: Israfiel (WBR), Wujal (URG), Valedon (GUB), Amduat (BGW), Paladris (RWU)
Collision (Set Two of the Fracture Block)
Quest for the Forsaken (Set Two of the Excellion Block)
Katingal: Plane of Chains
Over the last 3 years, I have accumulated 2 warnings and 1 infraction.
Do you now think I'm a horrible person?
Sign up for League of Legends!
It's just troll city now.
My have/wants trade list.
Thanks for keeping the tone fairly non-confrontational here, everyone.
I really don't understand why people are agreeing with him though. Are you so desperate to bump your thread at the exact time you cannot wait for it to be 1 minute over to be safe?
LOL
Why do you have to be like that? A lot of the talk was about how different people's computers are a few minutes off.
If the infraction means that much to that particular member, then they should fix the clock on their computer or find a secondary source (wristwatch, cell phone, my cable box and even my oven tell the time.)
My Mafia Stats - My Helpdesk
G Omnath, Locus of Mana U Arcum Dagsson BUG The Mimeoplasm GW Gaddock Teeg X Karn, Silver Golem
The reason why a 'midnight to midnight' rule is a sensible possibility, and what I suspect is Sykes' reason for suggesting it, is because that's the illegal bump rule MOTL uses. It works for them because they have a custom plugin for their forum software that throws an error message and refuses to let members post an illegal bump. vBulletin would also require a plugin to do this, which we don't have.
We use the current rolling 24 hour period rule because a midnight-to-midnight rule would require moderators to calculate what midnight is in their local timezone (vBulletin displays post times in postbits using the user's chosen local timezone) and do the math to determine if a bump is illegal. Rather than force a timezone dependency and make the Market Street staff's work even more time-consuming, we use a standard that any mod in any timezone can correctly and quickly apply without having to determine anything other than "is this time less than 24 hours after the last one?"
This works, and I wouldn't even consider a proposal to go to a midnight-to-midnight standard without the means to enforce it automatically.
https://twitch.tv/annorax10 (classic retro speedruns & occasional MTGO/MTGA screwaround streams)
https://twitch.tv/SwiftorCasino (yes, my team and I run live dealer games for the baldman using his channel points as chips)
No, I agree with this. I just thought that guy was out of line calling people desperate especially when some discussion was had about the time differences between computers. I already voiced here.
What would it take to implement this? I'm sure nobody really wants to bump early, it's either an accident or they didn't read the MS specific rules. Seems like not even being allowed to post early would be a great feature, like taking a breathalyzer before entering Debate or whatever
Hypothetical situation:
"I posted at 4PM yesterday and my computer clock says its 3:59PM now... better just wait till 4:03 on my computer clock to be safe"
My question is why are people so impatient they cannot wait till then?
LOL
I never stated everyone in the market street is like that, and I don't believe that. I'm just saying the ones that were sticking up for the "Oh but 6 minutes should be fine!" are.
LOL
Practice for Khans of Tarkir Limited:
Draft: (#1) (#2) (#3) (#4) (#5)
23 hours doesn't sound quite as nice as 24 hours. I think it should be 48. Then again, I don't use Market Street, so you can ignore me.
Reading through this thread, this is exactly what I was thinking. Sure 23 doesn't sound as nice, but allowing people to post at the same time everyday instead of worrying about skipping a day to sleep (potentially a big concern to the more compulsive of us) might make things easier on people.
Keep it to 1 bump every 24 hrs.
Follow the rules.
???
PROFIT!!!
Executive Infiltrator of [House Dimir].
My Trade Thread
Current EDH Decks
Braids
Wrexial
Bruna
Marath
Vorel
Tariel WIP
Or if you could set an auto bump script...but that could get kind of spammy...
Personally, I don't see a problem with a bump if it is within a few minutes. Sure, if someone happens to catch it leave some nice MOD text as a friendly reminder. If it is more than 10 minutes you are obviously violating the spirit of the rule...but does it really have to be followed to the letter?
I suppose that would lead to more MOD action, but a clear history of violating the spirit of the rule would definitely be an infraction.
Or even better, a premature bump gets your thread locked for 24 hours and only unlocked when you contact the MOD.
Currently offering 2 non-foil Kolighan's Command for a Date Stamped foil!
convert bulk into good cards? PucaTrade - https://pucatrade.com/invite/gift/21195
Ebay - decks/Promos/DVDs
Trade thread (constantly updated)
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/trading-post/details/337-pokerbob1s-casual-trading-emporium
I probably don't bump my trade thread enough because I'm scared of being infracted or being given other warning.
It really does make sense that you simply should not be able to bump the thread until the system allows you too, OR that they drop the hard rule of 24 hours and just make it once a day. I don't buy the argument on how much time it would take a moderator to calculate time zone difference. If you see a guy bump his thread and the last time he did it was the day before, let it go and everyone is merry and happy.
The difference between 24 hours and once a day is when you bump at 11:59 pm and then again at 12:01 am. It is now a new day. Sure a 2 minute wait time between bumps is pointless...but you get the idea.
Currently offering 2 non-foil Kolighan's Command for a Date Stamped foil!
convert bulk into good cards? PucaTrade - https://pucatrade.com/invite/gift/21195
Ebay - decks/Promos/DVDs
Trade thread (constantly updated)
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/trading-post/details/337-pokerbob1s-casual-trading-emporium
Why's that a problem? You'll still have to wait an entire day to bump again after that.
Having the BBS system enforce it is not an option. Making it the rule 'soft' like just 'once a day' is messy as it becomes awkward to enforce and there are several issues with anything involving time zones.
fnord's 23-hour rule seems like the greatest solution by far.