I'm here to listen to people who are halfway between normal humans and godless internet trolls. The PC Nazism of this board makes it interesting in contrast to places where darker kinds of speech are tolerated. But the contrast is critical - if I had to stick to either the politically correct group or the other one, I would feel brainwashed by their fascism, because the moral people tend to shame any hint of alternative values, and the other group tends to tell morally indoctrinated people to gtfo.
Even if Salvation doesn't draw in users for the early spoilers like it used to, more people than ever before have been browsing the site for spoilers. Check the 'most users online ever' history, it was a few days ago. That record has been broken several times in the last week.
I disagree with Mikey, I show interest in the CI forum as it is related to the runnings of the site I generally use to view and discuss cards.
You would be an exception. Clearly some people who are here for the cards will also care about the community (as we see in this thread, some people are some ratio between the two and not clearly here for one more than the other), but as Galspanic so helpfully pointed out - there are thousands of people here for the cards who probably don't care much about the community.
I don't really get the argument about MTGS not being a good spoiler resource. It may not get exclusives but it does collect all the available ones into one resource, which is much more convenient than having to scour dozens of websites (some of them not available in English). I'm also not a big social media person, so I've never used that for spoilers.
On topic, I began coming to MTGS for the Ravnica spoilers, then I started reading the Standard forums, then the Extended forums after rotation, and then last year I finally bit the bullet and joined. I still browse the Modern forum and contribute occasionally, but I play strictly casually now and I'm not the least bit interested in Cube or EDH, so there's not much on the game side of things that piques my interest. I s'pose that's why I mod WCT
When I looked a little while ago, there were 3500+ people viewing MTGS.
About 150 were not in "cards" related forums.
Even though for some the lure is community, the numbers suggest a very different picture.
For me, my community is one of the card subforums. Being a productive member of that community is more important to me than getting the imput on cards. Around spoiler season though, the cards are the main reason I come here.
I don't really get the argument about MTGS not being a good spoiler resource. It may not get exclusives but it does collect all the available ones into one resource, which is much more convenient than having to scour dozens of websites (some of them not available in English). I'm also not a big social media person, so I've never used that for spoilers.
I agree here -- I don't see why there's some resentment towards MTGS's value as a new cards/spoiler resource. It's not like any other site has taken over the 'week's ahead of time' full spoiler that MTGS (and previously, MTGNews) was egularly capable of.
The social media thing confuses me too. I can't think of a commonly used social media tool that generates genuine and focused discussion. Outlets like Twitter and Facebook are certainly good at showing new things or providing links to things but not really interactively discuss it with others. Forums like MTGS still and always will provide that.
Galspanic's post confirms that MTGS even today is continuing to be the site people go to read and discuss anything that is MTG. Numbers don't lie.
Obviously both the community and the cards are a significant draw, hence the near split in votes.
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Waiting patiently for MTGO Leagues to become a priority again. It's been 4 years :sick:.
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MTGS doesn't get spoilers, period. People just haven't realized that yet, because the Rumor Mill is an iconic source for spoilers and there is still a big forum generation of users who like to see them in a layout like this with thread discussion. I'm one of them. But you can't deny that this site, in its wide size and scope, should be getting a spoiler from Wizards to show. It would draw new users here. But we won't get that because of the Great Spoiler War that once was waged. Even after that fiasco, Wizards still knew how important it was to get the new cards out, so they would send us the spoilers by means of planted story-tellers and dumby accounts. Now they don't even do that, because the Magic online community is booming elsewhere. And yes, social media is a part of that. We're left behind, but luckily the spoiler-lovers haven't realized it yet.
I like the old and the new. But it saddens me to not hear all the buzz online ever include, "Have you heard about the new spoiler? Check @MTGSalvation out, they are releasing it tonight!"
Galspanic's post confirms that MTGS even today is continuing to be the site people go to read and discuss anything that is MTG. Numbers don't lie.
I'd like to add that despite the obsolescence of the site's function, the site is actually still growing. It's not a matter of "When users realize MTGS isn't the cutting edge source for spoilers" at all. New users are coming despite this fact.
Whenever I look at the "currently active users" number, it is always still a lot higher than when I first joined 6 years ago when we did get insane spoilers. Also, the site is hitting new user records all the time. For example, "Most users ever online was 13,237, 04-12-2012 at 09:27 PM". That was just 5 days ago!
While social media is more instantaneous, I think many users either a) are embarrassed to be associated with MTG or b) don't want their Facebook or Twitter feeds spammed up about cards. For this reason, MTGs still serves a purpose for more casual users who do not demand instant, INSTANT spoilers. MTGS also collects all the spoiled cards neatly into one page for those who miss the news.
All-in-all, there's not a huge overarching purpose to this site that it once has; but, it's still a popular place to get spoilers and casually talk about cards. Make no mistake. "Pro" players have found something else. Social media provides immediate news and the strategic discussion here has never been lauded; however, pro players have always been the ultra minority.
MTGS doesn't get spoilers, period. People just haven't realized that yet, because the Rumor Mill is an iconic source for spoilers and there is still a big forum generation of users who like to see them in a layout like this with thread discussion. I'm one of them. But you can't deny that this site, in its wide size and scope, should be getting a spoiler from Wizards to show. It would draw new users here. But we won't get that because of the Great Spoiler War that once was waged. Even after that fiasco, Wizards still knew how important it was to get the new cards out, so they would send us the spoilers by means of planted story-tellers and dumby accounts. Now they don't even do that, because the Magic online community is booming elsewhere. And yes, social media is a part of that. We're left behind, but luckily the spoiler-lovers haven't realized it yet.
Since you're generally well spoken and seem to be in the "MTGS sucks for spoilers camp", could you clarify the points that I'm puzzled about?
I don't really get the argument about MTGS not being a good spoiler resource. It may not get exclusives but it does collect all the available ones into one resource, which is much more convenient than having to scour dozens of websites (some of them not available in English). I'm also not a big social media person, so I've never used that for spoilers.
If you wanted to distill my question down even further, I suppose it would be: what IS the place for spoilers? Starting from scratch, if I wanted to learn about every new card as quickly as possible, what should I do?
There is no one place for spoilers. The MTG internet community is supposed to be just that -- a community. Everyone gets a piece of the pie. Except for this website.
I'm not saying MTGS is going to die off or anything. It's just said to see outdated software, owner abandonment and being considered a pariah by the company whose product the forum is based around.
What did happen back during the Spoilers Fiasco, anyway? I have difficulty digging up anything even remotely objective (and the rest has been whitewashed away, it seems).
There is no one place for spoilers. The MTG internet community is supposed to be just that -- a community. Everyone gets a piece of the pie. Except for this website.
I actually talked about that with another mod yesterday, and I'm considering approaching WotC about it. This is the largest MtG community; in theory, we should get one (or more) cards to spoil. The hatchet was buried a good while ago, and we'd like to keep it that way.
Edit: Misclick, there were some R&D playtest cards that got spoiled like a million years before the set came out; I think that was the incident that triggered the lawsuit.
There is no one place for spoilers. The MTG internet community is supposed to be just that -- a community. Everyone gets a piece of the pie. Except for this website.
I'm not saying MTGS is going to die off or anything. It's just said to see outdated software, owner abandonment and being considered a pariah by the company whose product the forum is based around.
Thanks. So do you not see any added value in a website that collects all available spoilers into one place?
Edit: Misclick, I there were some R&D playtest cards that got spoiled like a million years before the set came out; I think that was the incident that triggered the lawsuit.
And not just any playtest cards, specifically those that proved Time Spiral would feature timeshifted reprints. And this was before the Ravnica block was even on the go.
And not just any playtest cards, specifically those that proved Time Spiral would feature timeshifted reprints. And this was before the Ravnica block was even on the go.
Right. And it isn't like that was the only incident either (though it was the most serious one), one of our former rumormongers and moderators (Hydrokinesis) got banned for life from sanctioned Magic events for his efforts around here. Needless to say, they didn't like the old rumor mill much (and as a result, the site), as it frequently got a hold of the entire set weeks before the prerelease.
This was what I was getting at with my first question. I don't visit any other Magic websites, so I didn't know this. But now I'm going to check it out. Here's what I find at the sites I hear about a lot:
The Mothership: has 49 cards in a spoiler that's only viewable as images. Incomplete compared to here.
Channel Fireball: I mostly see ads, but eventually I found a link to a Facebook photo gallery where I can click through spoilers one at a time. The spoiler contained 39 cards compared to 41 here (excluding basic lands).
Star City Games: Again mostly ads, but I did find a link to buy singles, and there were 55 available. Incomplete compared to here.
Black Border: I found their preview card, but I couldn't find a full spoiler.
So it appears to me that every Magic website does not do this.
Just went into those forums to see(most of them I have not heard before), their membership is measly compared to MTGS. Their community is too small to speak of.
If the store owner says that I can't trade in the premises, I'll just go outside. If he says that I can't trade within 10m of his premises, I'll go to 11 meters. If he says that he doesn't want to see me trading, I will put a basket over his head and continue trading.
Yes, he's a local legend. He's only known to take his clothes off before he goes into the Ladies' Lockerroom. Nobody knows what he does in there because he's invisible, but it's almost certainly tons of masturbating.
I'm not trying to be a jerk here, but some of you will invariably get upset about this.
Not really. Color me shocked that a person with 5 posts would even look in the community issues area. When a random stranger comes up to me and says I don't care at all about you, it doesn't really hurt my feelings at all - I don't care at all about them either.
I'd be more surprised to hear that sentiment coming from someone with a few thousand posts, but then, if they had that much time invested in the site, then they wouldn't hold that sentiment in the first place.
Wit's End is the PERFECT answer to your opponent's Monomania however.
Just hold on to your Wit's End when they Monomania, so you can Wit's End them on your next turn!!!
I think this is fairly reminiscent of the "Jace Battles" we have seen in past standards.. My guess is we will soon witness the great Monomania-Wit's End battles.
The most important part of the forums for me is the Magic Rulings forum, since I spend some time answering questions there. I also like talking about other aspects of the game itself and the stuff that surrounds it. I voted that "It's about the cards".
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About 150 were not in "cards" related forums.
Even though for some the lure is community, the numbers suggest a very different picture.
WUBRGPauper Battle BoxWUBRG ... and why I am not a fan of Wayne Reynolds' Illustrations.
You would be an exception. Clearly some people who are here for the cards will also care about the community (as we see in this thread, some people are some ratio between the two and not clearly here for one more than the other), but as Galspanic so helpfully pointed out - there are thousands of people here for the cards who probably don't care much about the community.
Archatmos
Excellion
Fracture: Israfiel (WBR), Wujal (URG), Valedon (GUB), Amduat (BGW), Paladris (RWU)
Collision (Set Two of the Fracture Block)
Quest for the Forsaken (Set Two of the Excellion Block)
Katingal: Plane of Chains
On topic, I began coming to MTGS for the Ravnica spoilers, then I started reading the Standard forums, then the Extended forums after rotation, and then last year I finally bit the bullet and joined. I still browse the Modern forum and contribute occasionally, but I play strictly casually now and I'm not the least bit interested in Cube or EDH, so there's not much on the game side of things that piques my interest. I s'pose that's why I mod WCT
For me, my community is one of the card subforums. Being a productive member of that community is more important to me than getting the imput on cards. Around spoiler season though, the cards are the main reason I come here.
@mm: you always make me laugh
Draft it on Cubetutor!
I agree here -- I don't see why there's some resentment towards MTGS's value as a new cards/spoiler resource. It's not like any other site has taken over the 'week's ahead of time' full spoiler that MTGS (and previously, MTGNews) was egularly capable of.
The social media thing confuses me too. I can't think of a commonly used social media tool that generates genuine and focused discussion. Outlets like Twitter and Facebook are certainly good at showing new things or providing links to things but not really interactively discuss it with others. Forums like MTGS still and always will provide that.
Galspanic's post confirms that MTGS even today is continuing to be the site people go to read and discuss anything that is MTG. Numbers don't lie.
Obviously both the community and the cards are a significant draw, hence the near split in votes.
Drop by my Helpdesk if you have any questions/concerns on the Limited forum.
Excited for M13 Limited? What do you think the format will look like? Head over to the limited forum and let us know what you think.
Whenever I look at the "currently active users" number, it is always still a lot higher than when I first joined 6 years ago when we did get insane spoilers. Also, the site is hitting new user records all the time. For example, "Most users ever online was 13,237, 04-12-2012 at 09:27 PM". That was just 5 days ago!
While social media is more instantaneous, I think many users either a) are embarrassed to be associated with MTG or b) don't want their Facebook or Twitter feeds spammed up about cards. For this reason, MTGs still serves a purpose for more casual users who do not demand instant, INSTANT spoilers. MTGS also collects all the spoiled cards neatly into one page for those who miss the news.
All-in-all, there's not a huge overarching purpose to this site that it once has; but, it's still a popular place to get spoilers and casually talk about cards. Make no mistake. "Pro" players have found something else. Social media provides immediate news and the strategic discussion here has never been lauded; however, pro players have always been the ultra minority.
If you wanted to distill my question down even further, I suppose it would be: what IS the place for spoilers? Starting from scratch, if I wanted to learn about every new card as quickly as possible, what should I do?
I'm not saying MTGS is going to die off or anything. It's just said to see outdated software, owner abandonment and being considered a pariah by the company whose product the forum is based around.
I actually talked about that with another mod yesterday, and I'm considering approaching WotC about it. This is the largest MtG community; in theory, we should get one (or more) cards to spoil. The hatchet was buried a good while ago, and we'd like to keep it that way.
Edit: Misclick, there were some R&D playtest cards that got spoiled like a million years before the set came out; I think that was the incident that triggered the lawsuit.
Thanks. So do you not see any added value in a website that collects all available spoilers into one place?
And not just any playtest cards, specifically those that proved Time Spiral would feature timeshifted reprints. And this was before the Ravnica block was even on the go.
Archatmos
Excellion
Fracture: Israfiel (WBR), Wujal (URG), Valedon (GUB), Amduat (BGW), Paladris (RWU)
Collision (Set Two of the Fracture Block)
Quest for the Forsaken (Set Two of the Excellion Block)
Katingal: Plane of Chains
Every Magic website does that.
Right. And it isn't like that was the only incident either (though it was the most serious one), one of our former rumormongers and moderators (Hydrokinesis) got banned for life from sanctioned Magic events for his efforts around here. Needless to say, they didn't like the old rumor mill much (and as a result, the site), as it frequently got a hold of the entire set weeks before the prerelease.
This was what I was getting at with my first question. I don't visit any other Magic websites, so I didn't know this. But now I'm going to check it out. Here's what I find at the sites I hear about a lot:
The Mothership: has 49 cards in a spoiler that's only viewable as images. Incomplete compared to here.
Channel Fireball: I mostly see ads, but eventually I found a link to a Facebook photo gallery where I can click through spoilers one at a time. The spoiler contained 39 cards compared to 41 here (excluding basic lands).
Star City Games: Again mostly ads, but I did find a link to buy singles, and there were 55 available. Incomplete compared to here.
Black Border: I found their preview card, but I couldn't find a full spoiler.
So it appears to me that every Magic website does not do this.
Draft My Cube!
Not really. Color me shocked that a person with 5 posts would even look in the community issues area. When a random stranger comes up to me and says I don't care at all about you, it doesn't really hurt my feelings at all - I don't care at all about them either.
I'd be more surprised to hear that sentiment coming from someone with a few thousand posts, but then, if they had that much time invested in the site, then they wouldn't hold that sentiment in the first place.
Stayed for cards for 90% of the time. I usually quit a forum after the subject stops interesting me.
Stayed of the speakeasy. I don't know why I feel drawn to check it always.