The rules of the game are simple. The first poster will post two cards, asserting that one is strictly better than the other. The person who replies has to come up with a scenario in which the "strictly worse" card is actually better than the "strictly better" card, disproving the first person's assertion. Then the second poster makes his own assertion, for the next person to disprove, etc.
tl;dr:
Bob: Card X is strictly better than card Y.
Joe: No, if A and B are out and you're at C life, Y can make you survive the game, while having X out means you lose.
Joe: Card V is strictly better than card U.
Bill: No, if F and G happen...
Tips and recommendations
1. When you're posting creatures to be compared, try to make sure that creature types match. Otherwise you're leaving yourself open to Door of destinies, Coat of Arms, and other easy stuff. Make it hard on them!
2. While the point of the game is to come up with hilariously archaic or bizarre board positions where certain cards are better, please don't make a Rube Goldberg machine if another answer seems simple.
3. Certain scenarios are too far-reaching and have therefore been banned. Examples include:
-Mindslaver: It's too easy. I think we all know that a spell meant to crush your opponent will usually be "worse" if they Slaver you. And don't be cute and put Sorin Markov's ultimate instead.
-Mental Misstep, Spell Snare, etc.: If two cards do something very similar, and one costs less, don't be lazy and say it happens to get smacked by a particular counterspell that preys upon efficiency and call it a day. While this is true, I want you to work for your proof, damn it.
-Declaration of Naught, Meddling Mage, and other cards that mention specific cards by name : 'Nuff said.
-No functional reprints: I'm looking at you two, Divination and Counsel of the Soratami.
-More to be added if needed as I see the thread progress. Hopefully we won't need any, though I'm sure we will.
4. If you can make your scenario tie in with actual tournament decks in any formats, +2 internets to you.
5. Only a 15 card sideboard for "outside the game", please, unless you're doing something hilariously awesome that requires access to a "collection".
6. Similarly, no Silver-bordered cards unless your scenario is jaw-droppingly awesome and requires one. If so, please no more than two.
I think that's all for now, I'll put more up there if I need to.
Let's start it off! I think I'll do an easy one to begin.
Mental Misstep Hysteria sweeps the nation! Legacy format to never be the same! Wizards releases new card made of space-age polymers and Tang, infused with the DNA of Ramses II, Alexander the Great, and Joe Montana! Every Legacy deck to begin “4 Mental Misstep and 56 other, less exciting cards” forever more!
Wow, that was a really tough one, especially without mana burn! (Otherwise Lotus Vale would've made it no problem.)
This scenario is kind of a stretch. Hopefully someone will eventually be able to give a better one, but here it goes.
You have Metalcraft, and all mana sources are tapped out except for two Islands. Your opponent has a Lullmage Mentor out and 5 other Merfolk (mostly tokens). He casts Divination with three cards in his hand. Seeing an opportunity to deny his two-for-one, you cast Stoic Rebuttal.
But surprise! He removes two janky blue cards from his hand to Commandeer your Stoic Rebuttal. He can't chooses to have his own Divination countered still but now he controls it, so Lullmage Mentor produces that 7th merfolk to give him an astounding amount of permission.
Had that Stoic Rebuttal been Cancel, the Divination would have resolved, but you might have been able to use the rest of your hand after untapping to stop the Commandeer from occurring.
Like I said, that was a huge stretch, but dear GOD that one was tough.
Mental Misstep Hysteria sweeps the nation! Legacy format to never be the same! Wizards releases new card made of space-age polymers and Tang, infused with the DNA of Ramses II, Alexander the Great, and Joe Montana! Every Legacy deck to begin “4 Mental Misstep and 56 other, less exciting cards” forever more!
Kicking an Into the Roil to bounce a token may seem like a nice, safe play until your opponent casts Scout's Warning to flash in Consecrated Sphinx and draw 2 cards himself. A Disperse wouldn't have made such an opportunity possible.
For your easy one... if I've tapped out to play something while I have lots of Pegasus tokens out thanks to Sacred Mesa but my opponent is a meanieface and casts Æther Snap to sweep my tokens, I'm gonna be pretty happy I have an Armored Pegasus to sacrifice so I can keep my Mesa alive. Courier Hawk doesn't do much there.
Mental Misstep Hysteria sweeps the nation! Legacy format to never be the same! Wizards releases new card made of space-age polymers and Tang, infused with the DNA of Ramses II, Alexander the Great, and Joe Montana! Every Legacy deck to begin “4 Mental Misstep and 56 other, less exciting cards” forever more!
Well it cant be strictly better, can it? Elven Cache is illustrated by Rebecca Guay. Oh, you meant functionally. Regrowth gets hit by Inquisition of Kosilek, something the beautifully illustrated Elven Cache know nothing about.
Edit: Ow, double nathed. Let me just answer the above guy now. Its not strictly better when your opponents only 3 untapped permanents happen to be 3 fallowsages.
Ancestral Visions would take 4 turns to do that, while Ancestral Recall would end the game right there. So Ancestral Recall is still strictly better in your example.
As for yours, Surgical Extraction is better when you have more than 3 life and less than one black mana. So roughly 90% of the game.
You are tapped out. Ignite Memories with storm equal to your lifetotal is pointed at your head. In your hand there is only either Recall or Memories. No other game deciding factors. Vision > Recall.
I think I got this one. You opponent runs a blue black deck with Grim Reminder in it. He also runs Divination. In that case, running Counsel of the Soratami as opposed to Divination would be strictly better. Also, that was HARD.
Next one: (this is probably going to be too easy because they are different types, but ill give it a try anyway)
As the fish example is too far out there for my tastes:
You have metalcraft with three artifacts and are at 4 life. Your op.'s at 6. Greedy you, who's slightly behing with only 6 lands, lets Morphling swing for 5 in the air, leaving only UU open. Eoyt your op. Naturalizes metalcraft to the bin and you can't counter his Thornling.
If your opponent casts Word of Command on you and you have a Black Lotus in your hand, he or she can force you to cast that, only to trip a Baloth Cage Trap that's in his or her hand. The same can't happen with Lotus Bloom.
This game is too hard. I'll bet that the game where they put you on some random island is easier.
An ability exists on the stack independently of its source. Removal of the source after that time won't affect the ability. Some abilities cause a source to do something rather than the ability. Any activated or triggered ability that references information about the source checks that information when the ability is put onto the stack. Otherwise, it will check that information when it resolves. If the source is no longer in the zone it's expected to be in, its last known information is used.
An ability exists on the stack independently of its source. Removal of the source after that time won't affect the ability. Some abilities cause a source to do something rather than the ability. Any activated or triggered ability that references information about the source checks that information when the ability is put onto the stack. Otherwise, it will check that information when it resolves. If the source is no longer in the zone it's expected to be in, its last known information is used.
Mental Misstep Hysteria sweeps the nation! Legacy format to never be the same! Wizards releases new card made of space-age polymers and Tang, infused with the DNA of Ramses II, Alexander the Great, and Joe Montana! Every Legacy deck to begin “4 Mental Misstep and 56 other, less exciting cards” forever more!
They control a Platinum Angel, and you're unsuspending a Phthisis. I believe The Cheese Stands Alone would cause the game to draw out before your suspended answer can win you the game?
(it's NOT a functional reprint!)
And Mana Prism vs. Celestial Prism: Your opponent just cast Drain Power.
Edit: And MY challenge?
Lightning Bolt is Strictly Better than Volcanic Hammer
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tl;dr:
Bob: Card X is strictly better than card Y.
Joe: No, if A and B are out and you're at C life, Y can make you survive the game, while having X out means you lose.
Joe: Card V is strictly better than card U.
Bill: No, if F and G happen...
Tips and recommendations
1. When you're posting creatures to be compared, try to make sure that creature types match. Otherwise you're leaving yourself open to Door of destinies, Coat of Arms, and other easy stuff. Make it hard on them!
2. While the point of the game is to come up with hilariously archaic or bizarre board positions where certain cards are better, please don't make a Rube Goldberg machine if another answer seems simple.
3. Certain scenarios are too far-reaching and have therefore been banned. Examples include:
-Mindslaver: It's too easy. I think we all know that a spell meant to crush your opponent will usually be "worse" if they Slaver you. And don't be cute and put Sorin Markov's ultimate instead.
-Mental Misstep, Spell Snare, etc.: If two cards do something very similar, and one costs less, don't be lazy and say it happens to get smacked by a particular counterspell that preys upon efficiency and call it a day. While this is true, I want you to work for your proof, damn it.
-Declaration of Naught, Meddling Mage, and other cards that mention specific cards by name : 'Nuff said.
-No functional reprints: I'm looking at you two, Divination and Counsel of the Soratami.
-More to be added if needed as I see the thread progress. Hopefully we won't need any, though I'm sure we will.
4. If you can make your scenario tie in with actual tournament decks in any formats, +2 internets to you.
5. Only a 15 card sideboard for "outside the game", please, unless you're doing something hilariously awesome that requires access to a "collection".
6. Similarly, no Silver-bordered cards unless your scenario is jaw-droppingly awesome and requires one. If so, please no more than two.
I think that's all for now, I'll put more up there if I need to.
Let's start it off! I think I'll do an easy one to begin.
I assert that Glory Seeker is strictly better than Squire.
^^Thanks dantcg!
How about:
Stoic Rebuttle is strictly better than Cancel?
This scenario is kind of a stretch. Hopefully someone will eventually be able to give a better one, but here it goes.
You have Metalcraft, and all mana sources are tapped out except for two Islands. Your opponent has a Lullmage Mentor out and 5 other Merfolk (mostly tokens). He casts Divination with three cards in his hand. Seeing an opportunity to deny his two-for-one, you cast Stoic Rebuttal.
But surprise! He removes two janky blue cards from his hand to Commandeer your Stoic Rebuttal. He can't chooses to have his own Divination countered still but now he controls it, so Lullmage Mentor produces that 7th merfolk to give him an astounding amount of permission.
Had that Stoic Rebuttal been Cancel, the Divination would have resolved, but you might have been able to use the rest of your hand after untapping to stop the Commandeer from occurring.
Like I said, that was a huge stretch, but dear GOD that one was tough.
Next one:
Looming Shade is strictly better than Frozen Shade.
^^Thanks dantcg!
How about:
Lightning Bolt is strictly better than Shock.
P.S: Glad you had trouble with the last one. Trying to make them a little on the though side. =)
Next:
Choose one:
(easy) Courier Hawk > Armored Pegasus
or
(hard) Into the Roil > Disperse
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For your easy one... if I've tapped out to play something while I have lots of Pegasus tokens out thanks to Sacred Mesa but my opponent is a meanieface and casts Æther Snap to sweep my tokens, I'm gonna be pretty happy I have an Armored Pegasus to sacrifice so I can keep my Mesa alive. Courier Hawk doesn't do much there.
Next one:
Regrowth is strictly better than Elven Cache.
^^Thanks dantcg!
How about:
Tempest Owl > Storm Crow
(Same creature type this time...)
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Edit: Ow, double nathed. Let me just answer the above guy now. Its not strictly better when your opponents only 3 untapped permanents happen to be 3 fallowsages.
Next:
Wasteland is strictly better than Tectonic Edge.
Preordain > Serum Visions
Next:
Ancestral Recall is better than Ancestral Vision
You draw into that while at one life, and finish them.
Stay tuned for:
Extirpate is strictly better than Surgical Extraction
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As for yours, Surgical Extraction is better when you have more than 3 life and less than one black mana. So roughly 90% of the game.
Divination > Counsel of the Soratami (that allowed? :evillol:)
Uh.
Not sure what else to do...
(Next person try to find an example, if it's even possible...)
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Next one: (this is probably going to be too easy because they are different types, but ill give it a try anyway)
Time Vault > Magosi, the Waterveil
You have metalcraft with three artifacts and are at 4 life. Your op.'s at 6. Greedy you, who's slightly behing with only 6 lands, lets Morphling swing for 5 in the air, leaving only UU open. Eoyt your op. Naturalizes metalcraft to the bin and you can't counter his Thornling.
Black Lotus > Lotus Bloom
card with effects based on names should be excluded. Grim Reminder et alii work for any card.
This game is too hard. I'll bet that the game where they put you on some random island is easier.
Anyways...
Choose one:
(easier) Darksteel Ingot > Drake-Skull Cameo
or
(harder) Kill-Suit Cultist > Crazed Goblin
EDIT: swapped.
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- Burden of Greed is cast on you at 1 life, the respective artifact is tapped and your only way out is to Disenchant it.
Healing Salve > Shieldmate's Blessing
You're at 3 life, False Cure was played this turn, and your opponent has Sen Triplets.
Jungle Shrine > Shivan Oasis
Celestial Colonnade > Coastal Tower?
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Mogg Fanatic > Goblin Firestarter
Volunteer Militia > Eager Cadet
The Cheese Stands Alone > Barren Glory
Here's a classic:
Mana Prism is strictly better than Celestial Prism.
^^Thanks dantcg!
They control a Platinum Angel, and you're unsuspending a Phthisis. I believe The Cheese Stands Alone would cause the game to draw out before your suspended answer can win you the game?
(it's NOT a functional reprint!)
And Mana Prism vs. Celestial Prism: Your opponent just cast Drain Power.
Edit: And MY challenge?
Lightning Bolt is Strictly Better than Volcanic Hammer