Xyre "started this mess" by role-fishing, and while that's generally not good for the town, and the person doing the role fishing in particular, it occasionally turns up better suspects.
In the kung-fu genre, if someone is blind, then they are likely extremely good martial artists to compensate. This was the first indication to me that Niv has a high-power role of some sort.
When I called Niv on his revealing that his role was blind, the general response was that he had made a newbie mistake and, had that been all... I would have left it at that. (even Niv says as much in post #93)
But then RafK starts the attack on me out of nowhere, which raises my suspicion level, and VERY quickly there's a decent bandwagon on me, hence my response from earlier today where I went to a full vote.
Niv responds to this by slapping a vote on me, which I expected, but then requests (again) that I tell him what made me suspicious of HIM in the first place. I think I explained why I was suspicious of you earlier, because you offered up information about your role when there was no obvious reason for you to. That makes me think that you either:
a) made a newbie mistake or
b) had some surreptitious reason for doing it...
The bandwagon on me in response confirms reason b) in my mind, so I'll go ahead and reveal my theory now.
Niv - You are the Mafia Godfather, and you have the safe claim of "Blind Master". You pushed out that tidbit of info earlier about you being blind so that nobody would think twice about it if/when you were forced to claim.
As for the wagon on me... I'd say probably 2 of them are your scum buddies. (most likely RafK and DYH)
So yeah, Vote Stands...and barring some independent proof of your innnocence I don;'t see it moving any time soon
Wow. it's amazing how you deduced this entire senario from one word. also, the RafK resoning is total crap, he hadent posted since the origanal fos happened. neither had Alx or DYH. Gnome had posted, that is why i said that i will be watching him. there are way to many liks in this logic for it to ever work. and all of those likns are rusty. also you said in this that you had explaned your vote, i am so glad my vote is currently on you. this is just path E Tech.
Kenji: Occasionally long shots pay off big, I'd say if I'm right, then it's very good for the town.
AlphaI: It's possible that Niv's a town power role. I had considered that before the wagon on me started... but I feel very convinced otherwise.. (Besides, isn't it a common twist in Kung-Fu that the hero's sensei turns out to be the main villain?)
Kenji: Occasionally long shots pay off big, I'd say if I'm right, then it's very good for the town.
AlphaI: It's possible that Niv's a town power role. I had considered that before the wagon on me started... but I feel very convinced otherwise.. (Besides, isn't it a common twist in Kung-Fu that the hero's sensei turns out to be the main villain?)
~: metagaming the mod is one of the worst things you can do in a game of mafia imo. and again, as far as i know this is not based on any movie of any sorts, so common twists should take no creadence
<grumble> I hate how the posts come in while I'm trying to respond.
Quote from Kenji »
As it's been pointed out, saying I don't have a role name is giving out information
Yes.. saying you don't have a role name is information.. but if this were a movie, you could be listed in the credits as anything from "Emperor's Bodyguard" to "Random Peasant". It's not information that's really relevant.
i may have burned once in there about the Xyre comment. but imo that is all i barned. also, how can someone go to bed for the night, i wake up, read it over and post what i think. then get called Barning by you. there is a difference imo between barning and having the same opinion as someone else.
Quote from Niv »
Well imo this is disgusting. the way you vote me for disscussing role info, i find it overall strange. also IGMEOYing this bandwagon is also bad imo. they found something that they see as genuanly scummy and attacked you for it, and what do yuo respond to their votes with, why a vote on me. you cant start a wagon without saying why you are starting it, that to me seams like more fishing.
Quote from WOLG »
~ is also fishing here, trying to find out if for sure that's his rolename, or trying to get someone to pop forward and claim that they are the blind master...
Quote from DYH »
What is, however, was the blatant role-fishing that followed, particularly given the conversations earlier about names.
It just seems that you take every reason that has been stated so far to vote for Tilde, instead of taking the one you feel condemns him the most and expounding on it. Fortunately, Tilde's play is becoming scummier by the post.
Xyre "started this mess" by role-fishing, and while that's generally not good for the town, and the person doing the role fishing in particular, it occasionally turns up better suspects.
So its not good, but it can be good, therefore it doesn't deserve a vote?
In the kung-fu genre, if someone is blind, then they are likely extremely good martial artists to compensate. This was the first indication to me that Niv has a high-power role of some sort.
But it doesn't make any sense that he could be a townie power role?
When I called Niv on his revealing that his role was blind, the general response was that he had made a newbie mistake and, had that been all... I would have left it at that. (even Niv says as much in post #93)
But then RafK starts the attack on me out of nowhere, which raises my suspicion level, and VERY quickly there's a decent bandwagon on me, hence my response from earlier today where I went to a full vote.
Niv responds to this by slapping a vote on me, which I expected, but then requests (again) that I tell him what made me suspicious of HIM in the first place. I think I explained why I was suspicious of you earlier, because you offered up information about your role when there was no obvious reason for you to. That makes me think that you either:
a) made a newbie mistake or
b) had some surreptitious reason for doing it...
The bandwagon on me in response confirms reason b) in my mind, so I'll go ahead and reveal my theory now.
I don't follow. Again, someone starts a bandwagon on you for using bad logic, and you assume that your logic all of a sudden makes sense?
Niv - You are the Mafia Godfather, and you have the safe claim of "Blind Master". You pushed out that tidbit of info earlier about you being blind so that nobody would think twice about it if/when you were forced to claim.
As for the wagon on me... I'd say probably 2 of them are your scum buddies. (most likely RafK and DYH)
So yeah, Vote Stands...and barring some independent proof of your innnocence I don;'t see it moving any time soon
Or he could actually be a "Blind Master" (or he could be a blind beggar with some vanilla role, you're assuming things without Niv confirming or denying them), and not false claiming at all. You are assuming an unlikely worse case scenario when there is a much more obvious explanation right in front of you.
Or he could actually be a "Blind Master" (or he could be a blind beggar with some vanilla role, you're assuming things without Niv confirming or denying them), and not false claiming at all. You are assuming an unlikely worse case scenario when there is a much more obvious explanation right in front of you.
And i dont plan on confirming or denying anything. i have learned my lesson about revaling trivial flavor about my role.
We have no evidence to prove that Niv is the Mafia Godfather like ~ is suggesting. But we also don't have any evidence to prove that Niv isn't the Mafia Godfather like ~ is suggesting. It's day 1 and I'm tempted by the long shot if I'm honest.
Why is it more likely that Niv isn't the Mafia Godfather though? We know nothing of the set-up, how do we know what is likely?
Kenji: for the exact same reason you are suggesting taking this long shot on me put forth by the scummiest player in the game. why should we not lynch the scummiest player in the game. it's a long shot, but it just might work. also, kenji, you are sugesting that we lynch me on NO EVIDENCE.
Tilde's logic is completely outlandish and ridiculous. I'm not sure how he got from Niv stating his role name to Niv being the godfather in cahoots with the people on his (Tilde's) wagon. He's trying far too hard.
Tilde's logic is completely outlandish and ridiculous. I'm not sure how he got from Niv stating his role name to Niv being the godfather in cahoots with the people on his (Tilde's) wagon. He's trying far too hard.
QFT.
Seriously- Niv mentions he's blind and it turns into his being the Mafia Godfather?
@Kenji: This line of questioning is a bit silly, don't you think? I hate to break into CP statistics, but given there is usually only one godfather per game (or none), the odds aren't good that Niv-Mizzet is him. Particularly based on the "evidence" being produced by ~.
"Scumminess" has nothing to do with this, Kenji, it's a matter of illogical argument. Tilde is founding his attack on Niv on a flawed premise that because he claimed to be blind he's claiming a strong role, which must in turn be the mafia godfather with "blind master" as a safe claim.
The game? Outing a townie power role for no reason?
We have no evidence to prove that Niv is the Mafia Godfather like ~ is suggesting. But we also don't have any evidence to prove that Niv isn't the Mafia Godfather like ~ is suggesting. It's day 1 and I'm tempted by the long shot if I'm honest.
Why is it more likely that Niv isn't the Mafia Godfather though? We know nothing of the set-up, how do we know what is likely?
Lets see. Niv mentioned "blind" and therefore he's the godfather? There are two cases in which I can see Niv being the godfather:
1) Random Guess: in which case we might as well lynch anyone for the same reason. In fact, we might as well lynch Tilde for acting by far scummier than Niv has.
2) Tilde and Niv are both mafia, and Tilde is making this case off of inside information. In this case, lynching Tilde lynches scum anyways, and we can worry about Niv later.
We have one tidbit of information from Niv's pm, and you're going to take the incredibly long shot of assuming that means he's a godfather.
Cases have been based on less, a player was once lynched due to an 11-year old wrote his pm and had missed a comma [might have been some different punctuation].
In the clan contest mafia game, we lynched someone due to him misspelling his mtg salvation mod's name incorrectly under the impression that if he really was urzassedatives, he could have copy and pasted the name from his role pm.
as to all the posts made overnight, tilde's case on niv seems flimsy. Tilde's case that niv is the godfather is primarily based on flavor.
Cases have been based on less, a player was once lynched due to an 11-year old wrote his pm and had missed a comma [might have been some different punctuation].
and that makes this case good? also, i will be away tonight, going to a concert. will only be one night, but it will varry form my posting methods so far. so just wanted to infor everyone. back late tomorow PST. however i wount be leaving for another hour and a half or so
and that makes this case good? also, i will be away tonight, going to a concert. will only be one night, but it will varry form my posting methods so far. so just wanted to infor everyone. back late tomorow PST. however i wount be leaving for another hour and a half or so
side note: Not trying to deflect attention away from tilde, but myrf only has 1 post in the thread, and its his random vote. The first random vote of the game. He was on yesterday but he didn't post in the thread. I'm finding this a little strange.
Cases have been based on less, a player was once lynched due to an 11-year old wrote his pm and had missed a comma [might have been some different punctuation].
I've gotta read that game. I've been hearing about this for years. What game was it?
At my count, Tilde's at 7 votes. 1-2 more and he should probably claim.
<grumble> I hate how the posts come in while I'm trying to respond.
Yes.. saying you don't have a role name is information.. but if this were a movie, you could be listed in the credits as anything from "Emperor's Bodyguard" to "Random Peasant". It's not information that's really relevant.
"its not information that's really relevant", yet its relevant enought to say that niv is the godfather because he's blind? Either i am misunderstanding what you are saying tilde, or this is a glaring contradiction.
why did that take over a page and a half before all of you voted? Personally I read it as a newb mistake, not a newb scum mistake... Most of you hadnt posted... but wolg was posting then and diddnt comment at all. Seems opertunistic. FoS: WolG
"was posting then" is a misrepresentation: My only post between his and my vote was this:
"I'm still confused as to why people started spewing information for no reason...Arn't we supposed to be disciplined?" Which was refering to the game as a whole, I hadn't even read Tilde's post.
Being opportunistic is going "Oh yeah, ME TOO!", NOT agreeing with someones point, and then giving additional reasons for a vote, like I did.
Cyan, otoh, was being excessively opportunistic with his vote, and Niv was also doing the whole "Me too guys! Me too!" thing.
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You can't just dismiss a vote against you by claiming it was opportunistic. CPE brought up what I thought was a valid enough point against you that it was worth voting..which is exactly what I said already.
Falling back on 'lash out at my attackers' and using excuses like 'I only read some of the posts and responded, I didn't read the post which is being used against me' is pretty silly.
You can't just dismiss a vote against you by claiming it was opportunistic. CPE brought up what I thought was a valid enough point against you that it was worth voting..which is exactly what I said already.
Falling back on 'lash out at my attackers' and using excuses like 'I only read some of the posts and responded, I didn't read the post which is being used against me' is pretty silly.
1.) I didn't dismiss it, I stated that it was ironic. Actually, me mentioning it at all is the opposite of dismissing it.
2.) I'm glad that you are agree that you basically said "Yeah, me too!"
3.) Stating that you thought something was a vaild point against me, without having a paper trail to back it up, and attempting to use it against me is pretty silly.
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I voted you, there is no other paper trail in mafia other than voting. I publicly asserted my agreement, and emphasized this with a vote. There is nothing more I could do really, and your follow-up statements here are only making me happier with my vote.
side note: Not trying to deflect attention away from tilde, but myrf only has 1 post in the thread, and its his random vote. The first random vote of the game. He was on yesterday but he didn't post in the thread. I'm finding this a little strange.
I'm... quiet?
Seriously, though, one of the things i was taught about mafia was "if you don't have anything useful to say, keep your mouth shut." That, plus me being away for most of yesterday and quite a bit of today means that I haven't posted much. So let's catch up, shall we?
First off, Unvote. No need to keep voting Wuffles.
Second, I pretty much agree with the case against ~, for reasons that othrs have put much more eloquently than I can. I just think a lot of his logic has been pretty flimsy, and his attack against Niv is pretty random. I would, however, like a votecount before I make my vote. I should also do a re-read of the last 5-6 pages at a time when my brain isn't fried.
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Kudos to Mr. Stuff for the adorable drummer avvy.
Kudos to Sephiroth Owa for the random banner. Tell me, ARE there similarities?
You see, part of what makes playing Magic so special is figuring out the good R&D decisions from the bad ones. If they were all good, it would take away an important element of the game: complaining about Magic on the Internet. - Mark Rosewater
EBWODP: My god, I am a moron. Votecount staring me RIGHT in the face. Anyway, I want to do a re-read, probably tomorrow, at a time when I am slightly less tired.
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Kudos to Mr. Stuff for the adorable drummer avvy.
Kudos to Sephiroth Owa for the random banner. Tell me, ARE there similarities?
You see, part of what makes playing Magic so special is figuring out the good R&D decisions from the bad ones. If they were all good, it would take away an important element of the game: complaining about Magic on the Internet. - Mark Rosewater
Seriously, though, one of the things i was taught about mafia was "if you don't have anything useful to say, keep your mouth shut."
Who taught you that? The most town thing you can do is to keep talking, even when you don't have anything to add.
I, for example, don't have anything to add about this ~ wagon, because I haven't been paying close enough atention yet. But I'll get there.
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
I said that you were being opportunistic in voting me. (I.e. Going: "Yeah, me too!")
Quote from Cyan »
You can't just dismiss a vote against you by claiming it was opportunistic. CPE brought up what I thought was a valid enough point against you that it was worth voting..which is exactly what I said already.
1.) I didn't dismiss it, I stated that it was ironic. Actually, me mentioning it at all is the opposite of dismissing it.
2.) I'm glad that you are agree that you basically said "Yeah, me too!"
3.) Stating that you thought something was a vaild point against me, without having a paper trail to back it up, and attempting to use it against me is pretty silly.
I voted you, there is no other paper trail in mafia other than voting. I publicly asserted my agreement, and emphasized this with a vote. There is nothing more I could do really, and your follow-up statements here are only making me happier with my vote.
Ironically, you're saying the same thing I am in regards to my vote on Tilde, hypocrite much?
You are only happy with your vote because I'm arguing with you, and now you're gonna go all bull-dog "OMGOMGI KNOW YOU'RE SCUM, bicker/bicker/bicker/diescumdie!" Because you either know that: As scum you can get an easy lynch on me or as town you think anyone disagreeing/arguing with you is scum.
PPE: I'll go ahead and state that I was wrong with #3. I read what you said more as "CPE had brought up what I thought was a valid enough point against you that it was worth voting.."[ital/underlined word added by me] in which I was stating that there was no proof that you previously thought that at all. My mistake.
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Trying to charge someone with opportunism when they're the first vote against you(even if I didn't make the original point), or even the second vote, is a fallacy.
In a mostly unrelated thought, you seem to be greatly overreacting to what can only be considered almost no pressure on you. You're acting like someone that messed up and got caught and is bitter about it.
Why take one course of action over another when we have no evidence in either course's favour? How is that logical?
That's precisely what you're advocating yourself...in just lynching Niv on a long-shot that really means nothing at this point. There's no need to settle for that at this point, and gives us a significantly higher chance of not only hitting town D1, but IMO hitting a town power role..
Cases have been based on less, a player was once lynched due to an 11-year old wrote his pm and had missed a comma [might have been some different punctuation].
And why does that mean that we should continue making weak cases, and acting them out? That's an absurd argument for your point of view.
I've gotta read that game. I've been hearing about this for years. What game was it?
At my count, Tilde's at 7 votes. 1-2 more and he should probably claim.
I was beaten to it, but it was World Dom 2...what a hilarious game, up to the end, where puzzle had us claim countries, to fulfill his SK win condition. Almost worked too
More to the point, I'm very wary of Kenji at the moment...his justifications are pretty much fluff and WIFOM.
-Alpha
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Quote from TheFooFish »
Lies! -I'm Buffy Summers, town tracker. I used my ability on you and saw that you didn't use any abilities before the game started. My flavor is I was sucked through a mysterious space-time portal and I'm here to kill all the vampires, and my tracking ability is a combination of my Slayer and Native American skills.
In a mostly unrelated thought, you seem to be greatly overreacting to what can only be considered almost no pressure on you. You're acting like someone that messed up and got caught and is bitter about it.
Looks to me more like he's defending himself against an attack where if he didn't, he'd be accused of being scummy for dismissing it. He doesn't look like he's getting too worked up over it.
I think ~'s theory right now is amusing and I think going after Niv based solely on that is idiotic. This especially amused me:
Quote from Kenji »
We have no evidence to prove that Niv is the Mafia Godfather like ~ is suggesting. But we also don't have any evidence to prove that Niv isn't the Mafia Godfather like ~ is suggesting.
Nice job with the crap-logic there. By your standard, ANYONE can be scum because we have no evidence to suggest they aren't. I expect better from you. FOS Kenji.
Yes, continuing on my previous post, since he doesn't have any votes on him, I see no reason not to Vote: Kenji
-Alpha
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Quote from TheFooFish »
Lies! -I'm Buffy Summers, town tracker. I used my ability on you and saw that you didn't use any abilities before the game started. My flavor is I was sucked through a mysterious space-time portal and I'm here to kill all the vampires, and my tracking ability is a combination of my Slayer and Native American skills.
Seriously, though, one of the things i was taught about mafia was "if you don't have anything useful to say, keep your mouth shut." That, plus me being away for most of yesterday and quite a bit of today means that I haven't posted much. So let's catch up, shall we?
thank you for responding. That seems to be a useful piece of advice, but if you keep on saying nothing, you might just draw attention to yourself:p
Trying to charge someone with opportunism when they're the first vote against you(even if I didn't make the original point), or even the second vote, is a fallacy.
In a mostly unrelated thought, you seem to be greatly overreacting to what can only be considered almost no pressure on you. You're acting like someone that messed up and got caught and is bitter about it.
So you're admitting to commiting a fallacy? You do realize that you called me opportunistic for voting Tilde...and I was the second vote on him? "Hey pot, this is kettle...you're black!"
Where did I "mess-up" exactly? This is a laugh riot! You're the only bitter one here, Cyan, and you're doing all the things you're accusing me of.
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If you were indeed the second vote, then that's fair enough, I remove my statement that you were being opportunistic. I thought you were the 4th vote on him.
I still find your response to CPE's initial query completely lacking, however.
The concept of trying to lynch someone for being the Godfather's "false-claim" "BLIND MASTER" without any evidence whatsoever is incredibly dense of you, my friend.
Especially when Xyre hasn't (I don't think) actually claimed anything except being blind.
The punctuation mark is an idiot. No denying that, but I'm not sure that he's an idiot scum yet. I'd like to watch him for a bit longer.
Kenji on the other hand should know better.
Vote Kenji
Also don't like that WoLG conviently overlooked the relevant post.
Not fond of Niv or Tilde's play, but thus far I'm just reading them as really really newb.
The concept of trying to lynch someone for being the Godfather's "false-claim" "BLIND MASTER" without any evidence whatsoever is incredibly dense of you, my friend.
Especially when Xyre hasn't (I don't think) actually claimed anything except being blind.
I'm kind of undecided between voting Kenji and Tilde. As Treigit said, Kenji should know better as a more experience player, and he tried to get away with spewing illogical arguments by saying he was playing Devil's Advocate, whereas Tilde may be simply newbish. However, I think Tilde's attempt to lynch Niv is way too far-fetched for a towny, and I want to hear Tilde's claim before simply packing up and moving onto a new bandwagon.
So, Vote: Tilde (puts him at -2), which will be removed with a satisfactory claim. FoS: Kenji for now.
~: why not vote/fos me? I gave up information freely as well, why is Niv scummier than I for doing the same thing?
Saying what you and Xyre said (which was something along the lines of "We don't have a role name, just a title") is not giving up any information at all.
Information is like a seed blown in the wind. It is only a seed until it is planted in the right place.
~Tilde~ , may I ask, where you train in the art of Mafia? Have you trained for a long time?
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First off on WolG: Why did I wait? because at first, I diddnt know if it was worth a vote. Then I rethought it and I realised that yes it really was. Did Cyans vote matter? No. Also conviently skipping the post untill it was brought up is fishy. Vote is staying.
Next : ~: You are playing horribly, throwing out accusations, and having crap logic. However your claim might help. Please claim
Niv: You also arent that great, but if he is scum I would see you as clean because I doubt you guys are this great at distancing.
Kenji : You know better FOS: KENJI
Hawkeye was completely right on.
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Quote from hotshizzle »
<hotshizle> WINE IN FRONT OF MEAL
<hotshizle> i think
First off on WolG: Why did I wait? because at first, I diddnt know if it was worth a vote. Then I rethought it and I realised that yes it really was. Did Cyans vote matter? No. Also conviently skipping the post untill it was brought up is fishy. Vote is staying.
1.) I doubt anyone would buy that. Heck, I know even YOU wouldn't if you wern't the one saying it.
2.) I hope you're not trying to claim that you've NEVER EVER missed reading a post before. I really hope not.
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-[thread=14456]The [Untitled] Avatar and Sig shop![/thread] Avatar from:[thread=25376] [Epic Graphics][/thread]
Wow. it's amazing how you deduced this entire senario from one word. also, the RafK resoning is total crap, he hadent posted since the origanal fos happened. neither had Alx or DYH. Gnome had posted, that is why i said that i will be watching him. there are way to many liks in this logic for it to ever work. and all of those likns are rusty. also you said in this that you had explaned your vote, i am so glad my vote is currently on you. this is just path E Tech.
Millionaires, I hear it's good Music (Disclaimer: lyrics not PG-13) Thanks, CC
Kenji: Occasionally long shots pay off big, I'd say if I'm right, then it's very good for the town.
AlphaI: It's possible that Niv's a town power role. I had considered that before the wagon on me started... but I feel very convinced otherwise.. (Besides, isn't it a common twist in Kung-Fu that the hero's sensei turns out to be the main villain?)
Note to self: Your mafia theories are usually wrong, so don't act on them.
~: metagaming the mod is one of the worst things you can do in a game of mafia imo. and again, as far as i know this is not based on any movie of any sorts, so common twists should take no creadence
Millionaires, I hear it's good Music (Disclaimer: lyrics not PG-13) Thanks, CC
Yes.. saying you don't have a role name is information.. but if this were a movie, you could be listed in the credits as anything from "Emperor's Bodyguard" to "Random Peasant". It's not information that's really relevant.
Note to self: Your mafia theories are usually wrong, so don't act on them.
It just seems that you take every reason that has been stated so far to vote for Tilde, instead of taking the one you feel condemns him the most and expounding on it. Fortunately, Tilde's play is becoming scummier by the post.
So its not good, but it can be good, therefore it doesn't deserve a vote?
But it doesn't make any sense that he could be a townie power role?
I don't follow. Again, someone starts a bandwagon on you for using bad logic, and you assume that your logic all of a sudden makes sense?
Or he could actually be a "Blind Master" (or he could be a blind beggar with some vanilla role, you're assuming things without Niv confirming or denying them), and not false claiming at all. You are assuming an unlikely worse case scenario when there is a much more obvious explanation right in front of you.
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And i dont plan on confirming or denying anything. i have learned my lesson about revaling trivial flavor about my role.
Kenji: for the exact same reason you are suggesting taking this long shot on me put forth by the scummiest player in the game. why should we not lynch the scummiest player in the game. it's a long shot, but it just might work. also, kenji, you are sugesting that we lynch me on NO EVIDENCE.
Millionaires, I hear it's good Music (Disclaimer: lyrics not PG-13) Thanks, CC
Vote Tilde.
to the first point yes...
aslo you are you are doing a good job as devils advocate
Millionaires, I hear it's good Music (Disclaimer: lyrics not PG-13) Thanks, CC
Can we have ONE game on this forum that doesn't involve Keanu Reeves? Please!?
QFT.
Seriously- Niv mentions he's blind and it turns into his being the Mafia Godfather?
@Kenji: This line of questioning is a bit silly, don't you think? I hate to break into CP statistics, but given there is usually only one godfather per game (or none), the odds aren't good that Niv-Mizzet is him. Particularly based on the "evidence" being produced by ~.
V/LA: 3/21-3/24 & 3/27-3/29
Actually i think he is saying that ~ is more scummey than i am right now. Obv. he is
Millionaires, I hear it's good Music (Disclaimer: lyrics not PG-13) Thanks, CC
V/LA: 3/21-3/24 & 3/27-3/29
No. I'm using Tilde's scumness as evidence of Tilde's scumness.
Imagine that. so am i. also, mod, could we get a votecount?
Millionaires, I hear it's good Music (Disclaimer: lyrics not PG-13) Thanks, CC
The game? Outing a townie power role for no reason?
Lets see. Niv mentioned "blind" and therefore he's the godfather? There are two cases in which I can see Niv being the godfather:
1) Random Guess: in which case we might as well lynch anyone for the same reason. In fact, we might as well lynch Tilde for acting by far scummier than Niv has.
2) Tilde and Niv are both mafia, and Tilde is making this case off of inside information. In this case, lynching Tilde lynches scum anyways, and we can worry about Niv later.
We have one tidbit of information from Niv's pm, and you're going to take the incredibly long shot of assuming that means he's a godfather.
In case it wasn't clear, I don't want you to either. I'm pointing out that Tilde is making the flimsiest case ever based on inferred information.
Innocent until proven guilty? Lynching Niv at this point in time basically equals a random lynch.
Devil's advocate requires logic and evidence for the other side, its not just being contrary for kicks.
I'm going to hold off a vote until at least after the vote count.
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last updated 03/23/11
Well i allreddy pointed out that this case is based on one word. if that isnt a blind stap in the dark i don't know what is.
Millionaires, I hear it's good Music (Disclaimer: lyrics not PG-13) Thanks, CC
In the clan contest mafia game, we lynched someone due to him misspelling his mtg salvation mod's name incorrectly under the impression that if he really was urzassedatives, he could have copy and pasted the name from his role pm.
as to all the posts made overnight, tilde's case on niv seems flimsy. Tilde's case that niv is the godfather is primarily based on flavor.
and that makes this case good? also, i will be away tonight, going to a concert. will only be one night, but it will varry form my posting methods so far. so just wanted to infor everyone. back late tomorow PST. however i wount be leaving for another hour and a half or so
Millionaires, I hear it's good Music (Disclaimer: lyrics not PG-13) Thanks, CC
I'm going to one tomorrow. Who are you going to see tonight?
side note: Not trying to deflect attention away from tilde, but myrf only has 1 post in the thread, and its his random vote. The first random vote of the game. He was on yesterday but he didn't post in the thread. I'm finding this a little strange.
I've gotta read that game. I've been hearing about this for years. What game was it?
At my count, Tilde's at 7 votes. 1-2 more and he should probably claim.
"its not information that's really relevant", yet its relevant enought to say that niv is the godfather because he's blind? Either i am misunderstanding what you are saying tilde, or this is a glaring contradiction.
Greatest lynch ever.
V/LA: 3/21-3/24 & 3/27-3/29
Also, CPE: Why wait to vote me until after Cyan did? Were you just hoping that some of the dirt you were flinging would stick?
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"was posting then" is a misrepresentation: My only post between his and my vote was this:
"I'm still confused as to why people started spewing information for no reason...Arn't we supposed to be disciplined?" Which was refering to the game as a whole, I hadn't even read Tilde's post.
Being opportunistic is going "Oh yeah, ME TOO!", NOT agreeing with someones point, and then giving additional reasons for a vote, like I did.
Cyan, otoh, was being excessively opportunistic with his vote, and Niv was also doing the whole "Me too guys! Me too!" thing.
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Awards:
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Falling back on 'lash out at my attackers' and using excuses like 'I only read some of the posts and responded, I didn't read the post which is being used against me' is pretty silly.
1.) I didn't dismiss it, I stated that it was ironic. Actually, me mentioning it at all is the opposite of dismissing it.
2.) I'm glad that you are agree that you basically said "Yeah, me too!"
3.) Stating that you thought something was a vaild point against me, without having a paper trail to back it up, and attempting to use it against me is pretty silly.
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Awards:
Elegant Mafia: The Joker, Mafia MVP
Tilde - 7 (RafaelK, WellOfLostGnomes, Disrupt_Your_Hymn, Alx2, Niv-Mizzet the Firemind, Ged, Kenji)
RafaelK - 2 (MD, Wrath_of_DoG)
WellOfLostGnomes - 2 (Cyan, creampuffeater)
AlphaInsidious - 1 (Wuffles_II)
Myrf - 1 (ferro_man)
Niv-Mizzet the Firemind - 1 (Tilde)
Wuffles_II - 1 (Myrf)
I'm... quiet?
Seriously, though, one of the things i was taught about mafia was "if you don't have anything useful to say, keep your mouth shut." That, plus me being away for most of yesterday and quite a bit of today means that I haven't posted much. So let's catch up, shall we?
First off, Unvote. No need to keep voting Wuffles.
Second, I pretty much agree with the case against ~, for reasons that othrs have put much more eloquently than I can. I just think a lot of his logic has been pretty flimsy, and his attack against Niv is pretty random. I would, however, like a votecount before I make my vote. I should also do a re-read of the last 5-6 pages at a time when my brain isn't fried.
Who taught you that? The most town thing you can do is to keep talking, even when you don't have anything to add.
I, for example, don't have anything to add about this ~ wagon, because I haven't been paying close enough atention yet. But I'll get there.
I said that you were being opportunistic in voting me. (I.e. Going: "Yeah, me too!")
My response:
Ironically, you're saying the same thing I am in regards to my vote on Tilde, hypocrite much?
You are only happy with your vote because I'm arguing with you, and now you're gonna go all bull-dog "OMGOMGI KNOW YOU'RE SCUM, bicker/bicker/bicker/diescumdie!" Because you either know that: As scum you can get an easy lynch on me or as town you think anyone disagreeing/arguing with you is scum.
PPE: I'll go ahead and state that I was wrong with #3. I read what you said more as "CPE had brought up what I thought was a valid enough point against you that it was worth voting.."[ital/underlined word added by me] in which I was stating that there was no proof that you previously thought that at all. My mistake.
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Awards:
Elegant Mafia: The Joker, Mafia MVP
In a mostly unrelated thought, you seem to be greatly overreacting to what can only be considered almost no pressure on you. You're acting like someone that messed up and got caught and is bitter about it.
That's precisely what you're advocating yourself...in just lynching Niv on a long-shot that really means nothing at this point. There's no need to settle for that at this point, and gives us a significantly higher chance of not only hitting town D1, but IMO hitting a town power role..
Brilliant.
And why does that mean that we should continue making weak cases, and acting them out? That's an absurd argument for your point of view.
I was beaten to it, but it was World Dom 2...what a hilarious game, up to the end, where puzzle had us claim countries, to fulfill his SK win condition. Almost worked too
More to the point, I'm very wary of Kenji at the moment...his justifications are pretty much fluff and WIFOM.
-Alpha
Looks to me more like he's defending himself against an attack where if he didn't, he'd be accused of being scummy for dismissing it. He doesn't look like he's getting too worked up over it.
Nice job with the crap-logic there. By your standard, ANYONE can be scum because we have no evidence to suggest they aren't. I expect better from you. FOS Kenji.
Experiments Series: #5 (Courtly Intrigue Mafia) | #4 (Drunken Tracker) | #3 (Big Red Button) - coming soon | #2 (Pope Mafia) | #1 (Iso's Inflammable Mafia)
Mini Games: MTGS Mafia Redux II (Invitational, Evil Mirror Universe) | Unreal City
Old Games (bad): The Greenwood Affair | Blood Moon Mafia
-Alpha
thank you for responding. That seems to be a useful piece of advice, but if you keep on saying nothing, you might just draw attention to yourself:p
So you're admitting to commiting a fallacy? You do realize that you called me opportunistic for voting Tilde...and I was the second vote on him? "Hey pot, this is kettle...you're black!"
Where did I "mess-up" exactly? This is a laugh riot! You're the only bitter one here, Cyan, and you're doing all the things you're accusing me of.
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Awards:
Elegant Mafia: The Joker, Mafia MVP
I still find your response to CPE's initial query completely lacking, however.
The concept of trying to lynch someone for being the Godfather's "false-claim" "BLIND MASTER" without any evidence whatsoever is incredibly dense of you, my friend.
Especially when Xyre hasn't (I don't think) actually claimed anything except being blind.
Kenji on the other hand should know better.
Vote Kenji
Also don't like that WoLG conviently overlooked the relevant post.
Not fond of Niv or Tilde's play, but thus far I'm just reading them as really really newb.
No, that was Niv. I said I have no name.
Experiments Series: #5 (Courtly Intrigue Mafia) | #4 (Drunken Tracker) | #3 (Big Red Button) - coming soon | #2 (Pope Mafia) | #1 (Iso's Inflammable Mafia)
Mini Games: MTGS Mafia Redux II (Invitational, Evil Mirror Universe) | Unreal City
Old Games (bad): The Greenwood Affair | Blood Moon Mafia
So, Vote: Tilde (puts him at -2), which will be removed with a satisfactory claim.
FoS: Kenji for now.
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last updated 03/23/11
~Tilde~ , may I ask, where you train in the art of Mafia? Have you trained for a long time?
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First off on WolG: Why did I wait? because at first, I diddnt know if it was worth a vote. Then I rethought it and I realised that yes it really was. Did Cyans vote matter? No. Also conviently skipping the post untill it was brought up is fishy. Vote is staying.
Next : ~: You are playing horribly, throwing out accusations, and having crap logic. However your claim might help. Please claim
Niv: You also arent that great, but if he is scum I would see you as clean because I doubt you guys are this great at distancing.
Kenji : You know better FOS: KENJI
Hawkeye was completely right on.
1.) I doubt anyone would buy that. Heck, I know even YOU wouldn't if you wern't the one saying it.
2.) I hope you're not trying to claim that you've NEVER EVER missed reading a post before. I really hope not.
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Unvote RafK, btw.
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