as much as I want to stick it to the man, I think there's a better way to start a game. Xyre isn't something we should be concerning ourselves with at the moment, although both CP and Bat's reactions are interesting.
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What?! Look at the initial post; he is dead. Deceased. Kaputt. Indefinitely horizontal. In mafia games, you see, people are occasionally "killed off," and when that sad event occurs, he or she is no longer allowed to post, on account of rigor mortis and what-have-you.
'Welcome to Mafia Salvation', it said, 'Population: 3,660.' And someone, they never figured out who, had painted on the sign in red letters: '1,831 to lynch.'
What?! Look at the initial post; he is dead. Deceased. Kaputt. Indefinitely horizontal. In mafia games, you see, people are occasionally "killed off," and when that sad event occurs, he or she is no longer allowed to post, on account of rigor mortis and what-have-you.
'Welcome to Mafia Salvation', it said, 'Population: 3,660.' And someone, they never figured out who, had painted on the sign in red letters: '1,831 to lynch.'
What?! Look at the initial post; he is dead. Deceased. Kaputt. Indefinitely horizontal. In mafia games, you see, people are occasionally "killed off," and when that sad event occurs, he or she is no longer allowed to post, on account of rigor mortis and what-have-you.
'Welcome to Mafia Salvation', it said, 'Population: 3,660.' And someone, they never figured out who, had painted on the sign in red letters: '1,831 to lynch.'
This is ****ing insane. Why are we lynching the mod? THE MOD? Nevermind, this isn't worth discussing. It should be obvious now that this isn't the course of action we should take today.
Just because you CAN do something doesn't always mean you should. You don't open a car door when you're going 60 miles an hour just because you can. All we have is the word of one player. One.
You won't be getting my vote on the mod unless there is more to this. If there is, it needs to be said now, or this whole thing needs to be put off until we have more information.
While I would word it differently, I do understand Zionite's frustration. The fact that this wagon seems to be gaining momentum is disturbing. We're talking about lynching someone who cannot post to defend themselves based on the fact that an unconfirmed player says that another unconfirmed player told him that the mod was scum. The more I think about it, the more absurd it becomes. I've seen a few people now who've said they approve of the wagon, but why? What is it about this wagon that is appealing to anyone besides CP?
CP is a scum who is told that Xyre embodies a super-powered town that can only be killed by a lynch.
Isn't this a type of role information that is OP for scum? I know that this is not the only situation we could have. Hell, CP could be a lyncher on the mod (if this is true, I am going to come to Xyre's house and castrate him).
Personally, I am willing to take role information on Day 1 and lynch Xyre, enabling us to get a two night start (one with kills and one without).
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Hell, CP could be a lyncher on the mod (if this is true, I am going to come to Xyre's house and castrate him).
Why?
Why can't we just play around that possibility?
You recognize the threat, and completely ignore it, blaming the mod for the role if it backfires.
Let's look at the circumstances:
CP claims to be 100% certain of something in a game where 100% certainty very rarely exists.
CP has been vague about the information, giving "I got the information from someone else, yes they're town, no I don't know who they are, yes its accurate" etc.
CP is also a role that can die and still play. As in, he can be killed before (to verify his information) or after (if he's wrong), which is why he came out with the information less than 20 posts into day 1.
I still don't understand how people are accepting this so easily.
What?! Look at the initial post; he is dead. Deceased. Kaputt. Indefinitely horizontal. In mafia games, you see, people are occasionally "killed off," and when that sad event occurs, he or she is no longer allowed to post, on account of rigor mortis and what-have-you.
'Welcome to Mafia Salvation', it said, 'Population: 3,660.' And someone, they never figured out who, had painted on the sign in red letters: '1,831 to lynch.'
Most of you guys have played with CP enough to realize that he pretty much has to be telling the truth here.
Actually, when I look at it, the breakdown mostly appears to be:
People in favor of lynching Xyre = People that have played lots of games with CP
People opposed to lynching Xyre = People that have not played alot of games with CP.
There are a couple of anomolies(such as Bateleur, but to be fair, the only plan that Bateleur ever really goes along with is his own, heh), but for the most part, it's pretty cut and dry.
It's a little weird that Xyre would go to the trouble of allowing himself to be lynched, and then let someone find out about it on Day 1...but eh.
On UD There is enough in his flavor post that I suspect he is a neutral who must certainly ally himself with the town to have a chance at fulfilling his WC
Nuff said on that
On Xyre lynch Lynching the mod day one feels like a no lynch to me at best
Bateleur Post 140 you insist we are not going to follow CP plan without discussing it
Post 145 it seems you are blessing the vig to take unilateral action while washing your hands of it in the same breath
Okay, how about 98.6% certain. Does that work better for you?
Must...not...joke...about...statistics....GAH!
@ CP
Here's my hesitation:
Quote from Xyre »
WORDS OF ADVICE
0. Read the rules. A lot of good people came in on their days off to write them, and you wouldn't want to make them angry. They're not the kind of people who get angry. They get even.
1. Because trusting nobody is the surest sign of scum, try trusting everybody. That way, you'll always be surprised.
2. The past is not always the best determinant of the future. Nor is the future the best determinant of the past.
3. This game will punish you severely for your bad habits and not paying attention. Your best ally is always your enemy.
4. All references to the mod being a nice guy in the rules above are lies. The mod is a liar. Of course, he could be lying right now - and how would you know?
This all seems like some sort of warning against exactly what's going on here. Of course, then Xyre throws a giant monkey wrench in it with #4.
I'd prefer if we played a normal game of mafia here and debate the merits of vigging or investigating him further tonight while pursuing actual player suspects today.
I have to agree with Ande here. I'd like to think I've played plenty with CP and I still think he's full of it right now. I can't fathom Xyre trying to nerf the town with a role that wants the mod dead, he has enough problems from the jester in TGA.
I realize the mod isn't a nice guy and he's a pathological liar, but he's the mod, meaning he's the only one who can get away with that.
I'm not voting for Xyre again unless we've got pretty much 100% proof that he needs to die to help the town.
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@Armlx: How is lynching Xyre different from lynching someone whom another person has role info saying they are scum? I may have worded what I said poorly, but what I meant was lynching Xyre with the info we have on him is effectively a cop coming out on Day 1, and saying, "I FOUND SCUM EVERYONE LYNCH THAT MOFO!!!" except without CP actually being a cop.
@Andel: A lyncher is in the same line of broken as a jester, because someone can do exactly what CP is doing ESPECIALLY when it's lyncher on the mod.
@DYH: Normal Mafia? After the past 4+ pages? That's like telling me to play a normal game of baseball with a spaghetti noodle and a bowling ball in place of a bat and ball.
Quote from Charm_master3125 »
I realize the mod isn't a nice guy and he's a pathological liar, but he's the mod, meaning he's the only one who can get away with that.
@CM: because Mafia isn't about lies...
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Most of you guys have played with CP enough to realize that he pretty much has to be telling the truth here.
Actually, when I look at it, the breakdown mostly appears to be:
People in favor of lynching Xyre = People that have played lots of games with CP
People opposed to lynching Xyre = People that have not played alot of games with CP.
There are a couple of anomolies(such as Bateleur, but to be fair, the only plan that Bateleur ever really goes along with is his own, heh), but for the most part, it's pretty cut and dry.
It's a little weird that Xyre would go to the trouble of allowing himself to be lynched, and then let someone find out about it on Day 1...but eh.
I have not played mafia with CP before, and so yes I'm reluctant to go along with a Xyre lynch that is based on his word and nothing else.
@Andel: A lyncher is in the same line of broken as a jester, because someone can do exactly what CP is doing ESPECIALLY when it's lyncher on the mod.
"A lyncher is broken because they'd be doing exactly what CP is doing"
Besides, a lyncher is way less broken than a jester:
A jester has to get themselves lynched. Easy, act scummy.
A lyncher has to get someone else lynched. Easy, claim a cop result? Not really, as can be seen here, (some) people are cautious about it. And the mod is the perfect target: he would not normally get lynched, and can't act scummy, which means the lyncher would have to actually work to get his goal accomplished.
Add that to the fact that a jester goes against good mafia play (lynching scummy players), while a lyncher still supports good play (scrutiny).
I doubt CP is actually a lyncher, but the doubt is there, and I don't see why being cautious is detrimental in any way.
I doubt CP is actually a lyncher, but the doubt is there, and I don't see why being cautious is detrimental in any way.
I am not saying it's detrimental. Hell, when I first voted for Xyre my mafia intuition was channel Admiral Akbar. However, since it is CP and not someone like say... me, I am more inclined to believe it.
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I am not saying it's detrimental. Hell, when I first voted for Xyre my mafia intuition was channel Admiral Akbar. However, since it is CP and not someone like say... me, I am more inclined to believe it.
What makes CP so special in this scenario? Why is it unlikely for him to be lying?
What?! Look at the initial post; he is dead. Deceased. Kaputt. Indefinitely horizontal. In mafia games, you see, people are occasionally "killed off," and when that sad event occurs, he or she is no longer allowed to post, on account of rigor mortis and what-have-you.
'Welcome to Mafia Salvation', it said, 'Population: 3,660.' And someone, they never figured out who, had painted on the sign in red letters: '1,831 to lynch.'
What?! Look at the initial post; he is dead. Deceased. Kaputt. Indefinitely horizontal. In mafia games, you see, people are occasionally "killed off," and when that sad event occurs, he or she is no longer allowed to post, on account of rigor mortis and what-have-you.
'Welcome to Mafia Salvation', it said, 'Population: 3,660.' And someone, they never figured out who, had painted on the sign in red letters: '1,831 to lynch.'
This is pretty much all the content on Xyre. DYH quoted them above and I looked back on them with interest...never even thinking of the possibility of the mod being scum before.
WORDS OF ADVICE
0. Read the rules. A lot of good people came in on their days off to write them, and you wouldn't want to make them angry. They're not the kind of people who get angry. They get even.
1. Because trusting nobody is the surest sign of scum, try trusting everybody. That way, you'll always be surprised.
2. The past is not always the best determinant of the future. Nor is the future the best determinant of the past.
3. This game will punish you severely for your bad habits and not paying attention. Your best ally is always your enemy.
4. All references to the mod being a nice guy in the rules above are lies. The mod is a liar. Of course, he could be lying right now - and how would you know?
Advice 0 is null to me. Just a mod warning.
Advice 1 is pretty much the only reason I'd have for going along with CP's plan.
Advice 2 shoots down Cyan's idea that CP is telling the truth about Xyre based on previous playstyles.
Advice 3 seems like some cryptic statement that is just thrown in there.
Advice 4 also looks like a warning that perhaps info given is only given due to the setup or an ability, not because its the truth.
This game popped up now for a reason. Its different from a normal game in many unforeseeable aspects. As such, we shouldn't be recklessly racking up votes on the mod just because they are counted for the same reason that we're not racking up FoSes on Bat. Its just brainless without something concrete to go on.
As such, we shouldn't be recklessly racking up votes on the mod just because they are counted for the same reason that we're not racking up FoSes on Bat. Its just brainless without something concrete to go on.
We aren't just doing it because they're counted. We're doing it because he's scum.
What?! Look at the initial post; he is dead. Deceased. Kaputt. Indefinitely horizontal. In mafia games, you see, people are occasionally "killed off," and when that sad event occurs, he or she is no longer allowed to post, on account of rigor mortis and what-have-you.
'Welcome to Mafia Salvation', it said, 'Population: 3,660.' And someone, they never figured out who, had painted on the sign in red letters: '1,831 to lynch.'
We aren't just doing it because they're counted. We're doing it because I say he's scum.
Fixed.
Nothing personal CP, but you haven't given us anything concrete. You're an unconfirmed player with information that was given to you from another unconfirmed player. That isn't what I'd call "concrete".
Nothing personal CP, but you haven't given us anything concrete. You're an unconfirmed player with information that was given to you from another unconfirmed player. That isn't what I'd call "concrete".
Hey, if I'm lying, you know where to go to deal with it. I may not be confirmed, but I'm offering enough of a guarantee that it shouldn't matter.
What?! Look at the initial post; he is dead. Deceased. Kaputt. Indefinitely horizontal. In mafia games, you see, people are occasionally "killed off," and when that sad event occurs, he or she is no longer allowed to post, on account of rigor mortis and what-have-you.
'Welcome to Mafia Salvation', it said, 'Population: 3,660.' And someone, they never figured out who, had painted on the sign in red letters: '1,831 to lynch.'
Cyan are looking pretty flippy-floppy right now. I confused (surprise!!!).
Aaaaanywho, CP, does your info suggest an investigation or inherent info role stuffage?
Mad Tapper and Zionite smell funny to me, but we should figure out this whole CP/Xyre thingiemabob first. Figure out what's out there before we go to what's not.
I'm going to take a nap, but when I awake, I expect nachos!
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As scum - 3/5
As town - 5/7
As neutral - none
(I really have been scum a lot)
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First, I'll Unvote to let Cyan have the first vote on Xyre.
Next, further reasoning behind my faith in CP. I have a fairly good idea about the source of his information, and we already know that CP comes back, in some form, after death. I don't see him being scum with his coming back role. I also see CP as a fairly intelligent player. For me, his intelligence + the low possibility that he is scum + what I think I know about his sources = enough for me to follow along.
That, along with the fact that post-xyrelynch will provide lots of insight on players, makes me give the plan a thumbs up.
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Games played:3, 1 ongoing Times Town: 1, with 1 win Times Scum: 1, with 1 loss
Sorry I couldn't post earlier, my internet was down until just recently.
Also, my posting style is going to be different from previous games simply because I'm spending less time on the computer than I once did... This post was compiled over a few hours of skimming when not distracted, lol.
Idk, maybe it's just me, but I never saw him backpedal, considering UD's using exactly the same wording as of his last post prior to 53 as he did in 22, soo...
One problem with this: by getting your ability out in the open, you're insuring that if we ever do catch a scum, all they have to do is vote for you to keep us from getting whatever ability it is.
If he's ever confirmed town, no one in their right mind would vote him until there's a damn good reason to.
...Also, wtf, the mod is a character capable of being lynched? That's... odd. o_O Does this happen very often on this site?
C_M and Xyre seem like the best bets at the moment. Xyre first of the two. Would rather see him vigged if possible. C_M and cp can be analyzed further based on the results. UD seems like the least likely scum atm.
Oh yeah, oopsies. Unvote. I'm not sure Cyan's on the up-and-up, but I'll be nice for now. If there are nachos involved. And there had BETTER be nachos involved.
MTGS stats (won/played)
As scum - 3/5
As town - 5/7
As neutral - none
(I really have been scum a lot)
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MTGS stats (won/played)
As scum - 3/5
As town - 5/7
As neutral - none
(I really have been scum a lot)
I'm now writing for Eye of the Vortex, come check out MTG articles and other geek culture
I also moderate the MTG forum, so register (it's free) and voice your thoughts.
What?! Look at the initial post; he is dead. Deceased. Kaputt. Indefinitely horizontal. In mafia games, you see, people are occasionally "killed off," and when that sad event occurs, he or she is no longer allowed to post, on account of rigor mortis and what-have-you.
'Welcome to Mafia Salvation', it said, 'Population: 3,660.' And someone, they never figured out who, had painted on the sign in red letters: '1,831 to lynch.'
MTGS stats (won/played)
As scum - 3/5
As town - 5/7
As neutral - none
(I really have been scum a lot)
I'm now writing for Eye of the Vortex, come check out MTG articles and other geek culture
I also moderate the MTG forum, so register (it's free) and voice your thoughts.
Vote Xyre. Thanks for being so placating there, y'all. We should try it again sometime. Like, with the next wagon. Etc.
@Andelijah: This is my rationale behind it all. What would you say that the chances of CP being scum are, really? I would say..ridiculously low. You're free to disagree, but, I'm not really seeing it. Alternatively, what would you say that the chances of CP incorrectly assessing information presented to him are? Once again, I would say that this is extremely low. CP is well known for being able to adequately/accurately assess a situation.
As such, I'm okay with lynching Xyre. Beyond that, there is also truth to the statement that something like this is alot better attempted on Day 1 than any other day.
And none of this is taking into account CP's statement that Xyre is some kind of scum. This should be the strongest point in his favor, honestly, and even then..it's one among many.
CP is a scum who is told that Xyre embodies a super-powered town that can only be killed by a lynch.
That's not the scenario I'm worried about at all. There are basically three possibilities here:
1) carrion pigeons is a townie who has received information that the Mod is scum from an unknown third party on night zero.
2) carrion pigeons wants to die for some reason. This doesn't have to be because he's a Jester (or a Lyncher or any other such role), it could be for all sorts of reasons.
3) carrion pigeons is a townie with the additional win requirement that the Mod must die (even though the Mod isn't really scum).
Note that in case 3 he must have "Town" alignment because he offered to die first.
Post 145 it seems you are blessing the vig to take unilateral action while washing your hands of it in the same breath
Yup. This is, incidentally, the correct way to handle vig interactions. Same as with Doc and Cop you can point out the advantages of them taking particular actions but should never remove their autonomy since it makes it easier for the scum to plan around known actions.
Admiral Akbar is probably best known for saying "It's a trap!" (original context being the fleet attack on the Death Star in Return of the Jedi). I suspect that's what he was referring to.
The point about this carrion pigeons thing generally is not that we know him to be bad, evil and wrong. The point is that the scenario he describes is at best incomplete and at worst not very plausible. And even supposing he believes he's telling the truth, actually lynching Xyre is a pretty bad way to deal with things, because it uses up a lynch.
(As an aside, I do support letting Cyan vote first on whomever we do lynch, I just don't think that should be Xyre.)
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I'm still not sure why everyone is supporting Cyan so much. Why are we trusting him that we want him leading the charge on Xyre? He hasn't given off any townie tells that I can see - in fact, he's the one who pushed the Big Red Button (tm) that Urban Druid tossed into the thread. And yet people are willing to take him at his word that we want to help him out?
Okay, how about 98.6% certain. Does that work better for you?
There are always remote possibilities; but I wouldn't be pushing this if I didn't think they were at all likely.
I really don't like the fact that you backtracked. For clarification: does that 1.4% reflect only the chance that the mod might be lying to you, and not another player?
And yet people are willing to take him at his word that we want to help him out?
It's more complicated than that.
Think about the ability he's implicitly claiming for a moment here. He has to be first on a lynch wagon and if he is then he gets some sort of bonus. In the hands of a townie that's pretty straightforward, it's a bonus for successfully scumhunting. Makes good sense. In the hands of a scum it's more subtle - it's a bonus for being persuasive.
So we have two cases...
Case 1: Cyan's a townie. In which case we want to let him vote first.
Case 2: Cyan's a scum. In which case we don't actually want to lynch his choice of target at all if we can help it, whether or not he votes first.
In the abstract this would be tricky to sort out, but in the specific case we have it's much easier. We know CP cannot be co-scum with Cyan because CP volunteered to die before his target (which is stupid if CP's alignment would come up as "Mafia"). So the last thing Cyan wants to be doing as scum here is strongly supporting CP's choice of lynch target - that would both fail to serve his goals and directly expose him to criticism for the lynch if it turns out to be bad.
Much more likely Cyan's just taking a leap of faith based on his understanding of CP as a player. This would be very like Cyan. In Hats Mafia he was ready to gamble the entire game on Azrael in a similar context.
On top of that is the potential gain for the town. If we can claim Cyan's "scumhunter" bonus every day by always backing out our votes and letting him vote first, that could be very powerful. I like this as a plan.
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No, not really. Night actions tend to be less reliable than lynches, but I'd be fine with Xyre getting vigged.
Planning for Xyre to get lynched isn't a great idea, though, unless the town acknowledges the need to lynch him if the vigging doesn't go through.
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If everyone else unvotes and lets me be the first vote on Xyre's wagon, I'll vote for Xyre.
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Unvote Xyre.
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Xyre, how about a vote count?
(12 to lynch)
Cyan - 2 (RobRoy, Urban Druid)
Sutherlands - 1 (Jobie)
UrbanDruid - 5 (Cyan, Sutherlands, GiftsTrix, StormBlind, Charm_Master3125)
Xyre - 2 (BigTime, jerubbaal)
Jobie - 1 (bateleur)
BigTime - 1 (andelijah)
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Just because you CAN do something doesn't always mean you should. You don't open a car door when you're going 60 miles an hour just because you can. All we have is the word of one player. One.
You won't be getting my vote on the mod unless there is more to this. If there is, it needs to be said now, or this whole thing needs to be put off until we have more information.
I'm not ending the day with 165 posts.
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CP is a scum who is told that Xyre embodies a super-powered town that can only be killed by a lynch.
Isn't this a type of role information that is OP for scum? I know that this is not the only situation we could have. Hell, CP could be a lyncher on the mod (if this is true, I am going to come to Xyre's house and castrate him).
Personally, I am willing to take role information on Day 1 and lynch Xyre, enabling us to get a two night start (one with kills and one without).
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Why can't we just play around that possibility?
You recognize the threat, and completely ignore it, blaming the mod for the role if it backfires.
Let's look at the circumstances:
CP claims to be 100% certain of something in a game where 100% certainty very rarely exists.
CP has been vague about the information, giving "I got the information from someone else, yes they're town, no I don't know who they are, yes its accurate" etc.
CP is also a role that can die and still play. As in, he can be killed before (to verify his information) or after (if he's wrong), which is why he came out with the information less than 20 posts into day 1.
I still don't understand how people are accepting this so easily.
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Okay, how about 98.6% certain. Does that work better for you?
There are always remote possibilities; but I wouldn't be pushing this if I didn't think they were at all likely.
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Why are you so certain your source is town aligned
Can you safely elaborate
Actually, when I look at it, the breakdown mostly appears to be:
People in favor of lynching Xyre = People that have played lots of games with CP
People opposed to lynching Xyre = People that have not played alot of games with CP.
There are a couple of anomolies(such as Bateleur, but to be fair, the only plan that Bateleur ever really goes along with is his own, heh), but for the most part, it's pretty cut and dry.
It's a little weird that Xyre would go to the trouble of allowing himself to be lynched, and then let someone find out about it on Day 1...but eh.
A vote for Clinton is a wasted vote
Unvote
On UD There is enough in his flavor post that I suspect he is a neutral who must certainly ally himself with the town to have a chance at fulfilling his WC
Nuff said on that
On Xyre lynch Lynching the mod day one feels like a no lynch to me at best
Bateleur Post 140 you insist we are not going to follow CP plan without discussing it
Post 145 it seems you are blessing the vig to take unilateral action while washing your hands of it in the same breath
These things do not blend well in my brain
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@ CP
Here's my hesitation:
This all seems like some sort of warning against exactly what's going on here. Of course, then Xyre throws a giant monkey wrench in it with #4.
I'd prefer if we played a normal game of mafia here and debate the merits of vigging or investigating him further tonight while pursuing actual player suspects today.
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I realize the mod isn't a nice guy and he's a pathological liar, but he's the mod, meaning he's the only one who can get away with that.
I'm not voting for Xyre again unless we've got pretty much 100% proof that he needs to die to help the town.
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@Andel: A lyncher is in the same line of broken as a jester, because someone can do exactly what CP is doing ESPECIALLY when it's lyncher on the mod.
@DYH: Normal Mafia? After the past 4+ pages? That's like telling me to play a normal game of baseball with a spaghetti noodle and a bowling ball in place of a bat and ball.
@CM: because Mafia isn't about lies...
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I have not played mafia with CP before, and so yes I'm reluctant to go along with a Xyre lynch that is based on his word and nothing else.
Record: 3-2
Simpsons Mafia (Newbie) - Vanilla Mafia - Win
The Fiasco Corporation - Town Reporter - Loss
Doomsday Mafia - Mafia Roleblocker - Win
Battle Royale Mafia - Serial Daykiller - Loss
Danger City Mafia - Vanilla Town - Win
Besides, a lyncher is way less broken than a jester:
A jester has to get themselves lynched. Easy, act scummy.
A lyncher has to get someone else lynched. Easy, claim a cop result? Not really, as can be seen here, (some) people are cautious about it. And the mod is the perfect target: he would not normally get lynched, and can't act scummy, which means the lyncher would have to actually work to get his goal accomplished.
Add that to the fact that a jester goes against good mafia play (lynching scummy players), while a lyncher still supports good play (scrutiny).
I doubt CP is actually a lyncher, but the doubt is there, and I don't see why being cautious is detrimental in any way.
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I am not saying it's detrimental. Hell, when I first voted for Xyre my mafia intuition was channel Admiral Akbar. However, since it is CP and not someone like say... me, I am more inclined to believe it.
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That means I'm curious why Cyan and Jobie seem inclined to believe you because you're you, not because of anything particular you've done.
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Advice 0 is null to me. Just a mod warning.
Advice 1 is pretty much the only reason I'd have for going along with CP's plan.
Advice 2 shoots down Cyan's idea that CP is telling the truth about Xyre based on previous playstyles.
Advice 3 seems like some cryptic statement that is just thrown in there.
Advice 4 also looks like a warning that perhaps info given is only given due to the setup or an ability, not because its the truth.
This game popped up now for a reason. Its different from a normal game in many unforeseeable aspects. As such, we shouldn't be recklessly racking up votes on the mod just because they are counted for the same reason that we're not racking up FoSes on Bat. Its just brainless without something concrete to go on.
We aren't just doing it because they're counted. We're doing it because he's scum.
That seems pretty concrete to me.
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Fixed.
Nothing personal CP, but you haven't given us anything concrete. You're an unconfirmed player with information that was given to you from another unconfirmed player. That isn't what I'd call "concrete".
Record: 3-2
Simpsons Mafia (Newbie) - Vanilla Mafia - Win
The Fiasco Corporation - Town Reporter - Loss
Doomsday Mafia - Mafia Roleblocker - Win
Battle Royale Mafia - Serial Daykiller - Loss
Danger City Mafia - Vanilla Town - Win
Hey, if I'm lying, you know where to go to deal with it. I may not be confirmed, but I'm offering enough of a guarantee that it shouldn't matter.
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Aaaaanywho, CP, does your info suggest an investigation or inherent info role stuffage?
Mad Tapper and Zionite smell funny to me, but we should figure out this whole CP/Xyre thingiemabob first. Figure out what's out there before we go to what's not.
I'm going to take a nap, but when I awake, I expect nachos!
NACHOS!!!!
Whose cheese is that?
......
NACHOS!!!!!
O SNAP!
................
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
MTGS stats (won/played)
As scum - 3/5
As town - 5/7
As neutral - none
(I really have been scum a lot)
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Next, further reasoning behind my faith in CP. I have a fairly good idea about the source of his information, and we already know that CP comes back, in some form, after death. I don't see him being scum with his coming back role. I also see CP as a fairly intelligent player. For me, his intelligence + the low possibility that he is scum + what I think I know about his sources = enough for me to follow along.
That, along with the fact that post-xyrelynch will provide lots of insight on players, makes me give the plan a thumbs up.
Also, my posting style is going to be different from previous games simply because I'm spending less time on the computer than I once did... This post was compiled over a few hours of skimming when not distracted, lol.
Idk, maybe it's just me, but I never saw him backpedal, considering UD's using exactly the same wording as of his last post prior to 53 as he did in 22, soo...
If he's ever confirmed town, no one in their right mind would vote him until there's a damn good reason to.
...Also, wtf, the mod is a character capable of being lynched? That's... odd. o_O Does this happen very often on this site?
C_M and Xyre seem like the best bets at the moment. Xyre first of the two. Would rather see him vigged if possible. C_M and cp can be analyzed further based on the results. UD seems like the least likely scum atm.
MTGS stats (won/played)
As scum - 3/5
As town - 5/7
As neutral - none
(I really have been scum a lot)
I'm now writing for Eye of the Vortex, come check out MTG articles and other geek culture
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There is hope for the world yet.
MTGS stats (won/played)
As scum - 3/5
As town - 5/7
As neutral - none
(I really have been scum a lot)
I'm now writing for Eye of the Vortex, come check out MTG articles and other geek culture
I also moderate the MTG forum, so register (it's free) and voice your thoughts.
This is the third time.
* carrion pigeons sighs.
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This is the jumpiest nap I've taken in.....
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MTGS stats (won/played)
As scum - 3/5
As town - 5/7
As neutral - none
(I really have been scum a lot)
I'm now writing for Eye of the Vortex, come check out MTG articles and other geek culture
I also moderate the MTG forum, so register (it's free) and voice your thoughts.
@Andelijah: This is my rationale behind it all. What would you say that the chances of CP being scum are, really? I would say..ridiculously low. You're free to disagree, but, I'm not really seeing it. Alternatively, what would you say that the chances of CP incorrectly assessing information presented to him are? Once again, I would say that this is extremely low. CP is well known for being able to adequately/accurately assess a situation.
As such, I'm okay with lynching Xyre. Beyond that, there is also truth to the statement that something like this is alot better attempted on Day 1 than any other day.
And none of this is taking into account CP's statement that Xyre is some kind of scum. This should be the strongest point in his favor, honestly, and even then..it's one among many.
That's not the scenario I'm worried about at all. There are basically three possibilities here:
1) carrion pigeons is a townie who has received information that the Mod is scum from an unknown third party on night zero.
2) carrion pigeons wants to die for some reason. This doesn't have to be because he's a Jester (or a Lyncher or any other such role), it could be for all sorts of reasons.
3) carrion pigeons is a townie with the additional win requirement that the Mod must die (even though the Mod isn't really scum).
Note that in case 3 he must have "Town" alignment because he offered to die first.
Yup. This is, incidentally, the correct way to handle vig interactions. Same as with Doc and Cop you can point out the advantages of them taking particular actions but should never remove their autonomy since it makes it easier for the scum to plan around known actions.
Admiral Akbar is probably best known for saying "It's a trap!" (original context being the fleet attack on the Death Star in Return of the Jedi). I suspect that's what he was referring to.
The point about this carrion pigeons thing generally is not that we know him to be bad, evil and wrong. The point is that the scenario he describes is at best incomplete and at worst not very plausible. And even supposing he believes he's telling the truth, actually lynching Xyre is a pretty bad way to deal with things, because it uses up a lynch.
(As an aside, I do support letting Cyan vote first on whomever we do lynch, I just don't think that should be Xyre.)
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I really don't like the fact that you backtracked. For clarification: does that 1.4% reflect only the chance that the mod might be lying to you, and not another player?
It's more complicated than that.
Think about the ability he's implicitly claiming for a moment here. He has to be first on a lynch wagon and if he is then he gets some sort of bonus. In the hands of a townie that's pretty straightforward, it's a bonus for successfully scumhunting. Makes good sense. In the hands of a scum it's more subtle - it's a bonus for being persuasive.
So we have two cases...
Case 1: Cyan's a townie. In which case we want to let him vote first.
Case 2: Cyan's a scum. In which case we don't actually want to lynch his choice of target at all if we can help it, whether or not he votes first.
In the abstract this would be tricky to sort out, but in the specific case we have it's much easier. We know CP cannot be co-scum with Cyan because CP volunteered to die before his target (which is stupid if CP's alignment would come up as "Mafia"). So the last thing Cyan wants to be doing as scum here is strongly supporting CP's choice of lynch target - that would both fail to serve his goals and directly expose him to criticism for the lynch if it turns out to be bad.
Much more likely Cyan's just taking a leap of faith based on his understanding of CP as a player. This would be very like Cyan. In Hats Mafia he was ready to gamble the entire game on Azrael in a similar context.
On top of that is the potential gain for the town. If we can claim Cyan's "scumhunter" bonus every day by always backing out our votes and letting him vote first, that could be very powerful. I like this as a plan.
(I'm on on this site much anymore. If you want to get in touch it's probably best to email me: dom@heffalumps.org)
Forum Awards: Best Writer 2005, Best Limited Strategist 2005-2012
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MTGSalvation Articles: 1-20, plus guest appearance on MTGCast #86!
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