Oh hey, I just realized I forgot to say this as well. Congrats on the victory - you certainly worked for it.
Should I have false claimed neutral something in response to TMT? I thought of doing it, but if I was pegged as scum, it would do nothing to help my cause at all.
Should I have false claimed neutral something in response to TMT? I thought of doing it, but if I was pegged as scum, it would do nothing to help my cause at all.
I would never encourage lying if you're town. If you had claimed neutral, I probably would have thought you were lying (which you would have been).
Dagger's right. The town let you down. Don't kick yourself.
One thing you might have done is comb the thread and present a case on TMT. It was up to us to evaluate both you and TMT to try and determine who was lying, and digging up the dirt yourself wouldn't have hurt. As long as you keep a civil tone you shouldn't run afoul of the OMGUS tell. It will get thrown at you, but it's better for the town to have the evidence presented and lynch you in spite of it than to leave it buried. Again, I wouldn't kick yourself over it.
Remember, when nothing's going to help your cause you have nothing left to lose.
(This was what...your second game? I tried to lynch the town tracker my second game, and I iirc I had him at L-1 before JSex put an end to it. You did a lot better than me!)
Actually, this is not exactly true. Fudging of truth is a valuable weapon against the scums because they usually expect townies to speak nothing but the truth. There are certain circumstances when lying would serve the town's cause better.
I would never encourage lying if you're town. If you had claimed neutral, I probably would have thought you were lying (which you would have been).
Dagger's right. The town let you down. Don't kick yourself.
One thing you might have done is comb the thread and present a case on TMT. It was up to us to evaluate both you and TMT to try and determine who was lying, and digging up the dirt yourself wouldn't have hurt. As long as you keep a civil tone you shouldn't run afoul of the OMGUS tell. It will get thrown at you, but it's better for the town to have the evidence presented and lynch you in spite of it than to leave it buried. Again, I wouldn't kick yourself over it.
Remember, when nothing's going to help your cause you have nothing left to lose.
(This was what...your second game? I tried to lynch the town tracker my second game, and I iirc I had him at L-1 before JSex put an end to it. You did a lot better than me!)
Yeah... the main problem - from my point of view, at least - was that we didn't really have any positive tells from you to counteract TMT claiming that he hadn't been able to target you. Whenever you tried to defend yourself, you were basically just saying "I'm Jimmy Carter! Of course I'm town!", which isn't very helpful when we already think you're lying. More from you on TMT - or, hell, on Xyre, or JSexton before he was lynched - would have given us more insight into how you were approaching the game.
Hmm... in my second game I falsely (unbeknownst to me) counterclaimed the townie bomb, forcing the mod to step in and clarify some things before I lynched him, which would have killed both of us. I was just lucky the mod decided his PMs were unclear enough that we were both acting in good faith.
Actually, this is not exactly true. Fudging of truth is a valuable weapon against the scums because they usually expect townies to speak nothing but the truth. There are certain circumstances when lying would serve the town's cause better.
Corner cases, mostly. The thing is, it's better to raise folks up right. Lying is more often a bad trait in a townie than a good one, and it can take time to develop a sense of when it's okay to lie as town. I'd rather encourage good behaviors or ones that lend themselves to mastering the basics before giving the advanced manual to newer players.
Using Some One's question as the example he would be better served personally to build up his expertise at finding and presenting cases than lying. He could have done either one to try and fight his lynch, but he (and the town, and future towns) benefit more from presenting arguments than lying.
I would never encourage lying if you're town. If you had claimed neutral, I probably would have thought you were lying (which you would have been).
Dagger's right. The town let you down. Don't kick yourself.
One thing you might have done is comb the thread and present a case on TMT. It was up to us to evaluate both you and TMT to try and determine who was lying, and digging up the dirt yourself wouldn't have hurt. As long as you keep a civil tone you shouldn't run afoul of the OMGUS tell. It will get thrown at you, but it's better for the town to have the evidence presented and lynch you in spite of it than to leave it buried. Again, I wouldn't kick yourself over it.
This. There's nothing OMGUS about attacking someone whom you KNOW is lying, because they are saying something you know to be untrue. OMGUS only applies when a player presents a case on you, and you retaliate by calling them scum for simply putting together a case.
And, let's face it, the town was pretty lax in the end game, me included.
First, I feel that there were too many points in this game, too many roles, where we were working against the mod. It feels like there were a number of roles in here that were designed to be booby-traps - roles where you set them up, walked away, and then watched as the town blew themselves up on them.
Let's put it this way, this game was designed to be moderately stupid proof. Hitlist mafia basically prevented people from claiming role names, with 2 mafia's, claiming was basically kept to an absolute minimum, and i gave the town as little grenades to blow themselves up on as possible. I had designed this game to be very light on role interactions, and to run more of analysis and player interactions then off role interactions. I also wanted to shoot people in the face for attempting to metagame. And by god did that happen.
Now, I approve of some of the things you did. I have no problem with my role returning my added minutes on death - that's something that the players can come up with as a possibility, should we think about it for a minute - and I have no issues with the town not having a doctor. Those are both reasonable.
Glad you think so. Honestly, in my simulations, there were QUITE a few points where both mafia's would... NOT want to fire, so i felt a full protective role would cause the game to drag on too long (And 9 days isnt exactly a short game). And your role essentially destroyed one factions ability to win aslong as it was alive and active. Honestly, look at the end game, you were worth 7 (Tho there were 12 dead townies, soyou coulda added another minute) minutes. That's a whole different kind of power role.
However:
SoP - Al Gore, the uber-Godfather - anybody who shows incorrectly on death - whether miller or godfather - can be a huge swing. I think that swing is amplified by the small scum group sizes. Especially in a 3-man scum group, the town needs to know when one of them is dead. Ideally, you shouldn't have had to explicitly tell us that the HL mafia were all dead - although the fact that you did might have kept me from being lynched instead of JSexton! It also made me rather annoyed at you when you modkilled the "townie" and then immediately went to night - heh.
I honestly KNEW that people would have an issue with his role. Some of my reviewers did, and his role *WAS* a bastard mod role. It was there to compensate for the fact that the hitlist mafia was pretty underpowered really. A time cop is nice, but it would take a while for the mafia to figure out how it worked, and im not entirely sure if they did at all. They just killed people who would add time to screw over the doomsday mafia, and it worked. This could give them some movement room, and the BEST thing that could be done with this role was some kind of masonry claim, but the fact there were already masons, and the distinctively low power setup of this game, would have made that quite suspicious, especially as the game went on. And thing is, no one KNEW what the setup here was. 5/17 isnt unbalanced, especially with double mafia kills. *shrug* I felt it would be a bit annoying for some players in retrospect, but that in practice, its overall results would PROBABLY be the exact same as a godfather. I also gave hints here and there about his role, such as the fact that his role name is "Vice President" and no one even batted an eye at it o_0. I felt there were things being dropped, but that players were oblivious. I.E. When xyre got the time clock. I told him 2/2, and he thought the game was wrapped up. He failed to realize, he used an ability, Jsex confirmed using an ability, and TMT confirmed blockign Jsexton. And yet he only realized "If only 2 abilities were using TMT must be scum!".
Xyre/sneakyh - Lee Scott Jr, item distributor - I disagree with him being able to give items to himself. Not a huge thing, but I think that it adds to the role if he can't Voltron himself up. Maybe max 1 to himself.
Thingis, if you look at his abilities, they are mostly pretty minor to put it mildly. The extra vote is SORTA useful, but mostly in the end game to help the town out.
The Ability count was pretty minor, and mostly designed to give the user info about how the game stands. So that when players get rb'd or someone claims vanilla, it'll be clear that its quite a likely possibility.
The kill protection, in light of no REAL protection roles, was USEFUL, but it was almost like a one shot doc protection. Pretty minor all in all.
Lastly, the cell phone. This ability was honestly just thrown on at the LAST moment in the hopes that the reciever, if mafia, would be dumb and try to send some stupid message.
Essentially, the way his abilities break down are as such:
Ability counter = different form of watcher. Inferior to a watcher since its not directed, and it doesnt count roleblocked abilities.
Flak Jacket = one shot doc, but a variant of it. Stronger then a normal doc protect in most ways, but if you give it to a mafia, more likely to hurt the town the a one shot doc protect.
Extra Vote = DEFINITELY useful, but moreso as the game drags since its mostly a hammer tool.
Cellphone = Crappy one shot cop almost. Designed to catch a liar.
That was the reason it was decided that it could be used on self. It's abilities are REALLY generally minor and not actually WORTH alot. And only 2 of them are truly worth having on himself. The rest are meh, or making the ability worse.
goatrevolt - Barack Obama, motivator - I'm guessing that this is why the nights kept overrunning their scheduled times. That's a problem, since there were several times that I would check back after the scheduled end time for the night and find that it was still going, which was frustrating. Maybe a requirement for him to submit his motivate within the first half of night, or something? It's a hard ability to run smoothly. I think I also disagree with the extra caveats in his ability, where it says that abilities that work 50% of the time or every other day still work - that's giving too much information away. goatrevolt might have been able to save CharmMaster on day 1 if he'd just come out and said that his role confirms the existence of a coin-flip ability.
Admittedly, yes. This was my first time working with a motivator role however, and with the activity problems this game was having for a LARGE portion of it... i dont think the over long nights could have been helped without totally hindering the town. (who were the majority of the slow pokes). But i agree, next time i will give this role only to a dedicated player known for being active.
Dagger - Rumsfeld, Kidnapper/Vig - why didn't he show as a Kidnapper/Vig in the morning scene? I also don't like the post that you made talking about how Dagger became Faceless Butcher as a result of dying - it makes it sound like you decided that after it happened in the game. Those are the kind of details that you should have worked out before the game begins.
Honestly, it WASNT something I had thought of. Since it was day usable, i had mostly figured it would be used during the day, due to the type of ability it is. Also, there was quite a few roles whose names were never heard of before. I.E. Guide, Kidnapper, TimeBank, TimeCop, Census townie (Awesome and stupid typo on my part.), Kill Changer.
They were designed to not give much information as to actual role abilities. Something ive noticed recently in games is that as power roles get taken out, some players stop trying because they see it as a lost cause. But when you're losing roles whose abiltiies you dont KNOW, its not as bad a mental breakdown.
Plus, when xyre claimed vig, if dagger came up Kidnapper/vig, things would have looked quite odd dont you agree?
Cyan - Putin, paranoid cop - horribly unfair to the town. The flavour does hint a bit that he's paranoid, but not enough to raise warning flags. And unlike a normal game, where a cop might sit on a guilty result in order to build connections to other players, the doomsday clock in this game almost guaranteed a Day 2 claim, followed shortly thereafter by the Day 2 mislynch. I don't think a paranoid cop belonged in this game at all.
This i admit was PROBABLY my favourite flavour role in the game. And that was another thing, this game type is actually balanced towards a late game. Even killing all the town's highest number roles in the first 3 days doesnt do much to guarantee a loss aslong as the time bank is alive.
This game was balanced and only 1 in like, 30-40 simulations had anything earlier then a day 4 end. Players just had a bad assumption that the game could and would end really early without their own private contribution.
Plus, Abbey was my co-setup writer, he helped me figure out quite a few things during the planning phase, and i put this in as a nod to 1001 nights. Honestly, the way things went down was about the WORST possible way it could have gone down actually. And i KNOW cyan's angry about it.
JSexton - Gorbachev, gravedigger - another booby-trapped role. As far as I can tell, the only roles he interacts with are mine and Pale Mage's, and in both of those cases he is hurting other townies. I just don't see the point in having this role in the game. You mention that he's there to inhibit the game, but I think that giving him that role was unfair. If there was some point to his action - if he could get an extra vote for every other body dug up or something - then I could accept the role. As-is, he's just a land mine.
Yes, he is. In general, the town is moderately likely to lose 2.5 players every day night period. a 3-1 ratio for townie to mafia deaths. That's a minute on the clock EVERY time. The gravedigger was designed to atleast give the pretense that the doomsday mafia could win it.
@TMT: Thank you gratuitously for not giving up. This game, had about as close a win rate comparison as possible.
If anything, the hitlist mafia had the hardest win condition in the game considering the tools available to them. Look at this game, Xyre, who was one of the hitlist targets, survived til the end of the game, while 2 others, Jimmy carter + Dalai Lama, lived to the end of the as well essentially.
I know the hitlist win con was HARD, but it wasnt impossible, they had about a 20-25% win rate in my sims. They punished the town for letting almost any info slip, and with good/lucky play, could pull out a retardedly early win.
The issue was that for the game to be balanced, and the doomsday mafia to have a good chance to win, i couldnt find any way to make the game work without the time bank, and he was too strong, so i had to nerf him a bit.
Masons - you have them noted in the description that they are not modfirmed, but by saying in the role PM that they are allies, there's no way that they're going to think the other person may be scum. Just an editing thing.
That's something that surprised me. It never came up in game. In almost every game i saw masons exist, the question came up, "Are you mod confirmed?". That NEVER came up, and it surprised the hell outta me. Heh.
On that topic, which I'm not sure to direct at your reviewers or you: there were a number of cases where the information in your posts and PMs either had problems (spelling of character names, grammar) or didn't properly convey the information you wanted (masons). I also had to go back to the signup thread to find the information that the HL mafia had 11 targets to kill to win the game. Things like grammar and spelling aren't as important to catch, since it's preferable that you be consistent throughout the game instead of having a perfect first post and then start making mistakes; still, having the player names correct would have been nice. This is an area that I'm somewhat picky about, though, having good copyediting skills myself, and I'm willing to concede that grammar and spelling are far below good design and flavour in making a good game. Still, there were several times in the game where you were sloppy - whatever happened the night JSexton was almost motivated, posting the wrong name in JSexton's death scene, and the time you PM'd me with "have you picked a target yet?" at night stick out to my mind.
That was my bad. This is the first time ive ever hosted a game of this scale, and as stated, its fallen over some of the most annoying time period it could have. Return to school, 3-4 holidays, me finding out my fiance is pregnant.
Admittedly, i didnt devote as much time as i should have towards spell checking and such during the actual game. And the stuff before was me just being sloppy. Even tho NO ONE caught most of the typos.
For the record, i had 3 people look over this setup.
Abbey, axelrod, and LJustus.
Heh.
Having said all of that bad stuff, though - I did have fun with this game. The core concept of the game was great, with the two scum groups with different win conditions. The flavour worked rather well, and I liked that our townies and scum weren't (largely) obvious based on character names. I'll be interested to see how your next game plays out.
I have to admit, my favourite part of this game was the player reactions to some of their roles. "Im WHO?! And im TOWNIE!?!."
I.E. Mike Millitello, the mafia doc. CC didnt even know WHO they were and had to google him. And at first glance, he's a pharmacist for pfizer, a theoretical good guy, yet in the end, he works for a company with extremely questionable ethics who have blinded, and maimed millions.
But at first glance.... he's a perfect townie doc.
And im quite happy that no one seems to have issues with the double mafia thing. Mostly just individual roles. I kept hearing from people that a double mafia game is nearly impossible to balance properly. And although i had to do some shortcuts to make it happen, i feel it did the balancing pretty damned well.
Edit: didn't make this clear, but I am looking for feedback. Some of what's here is likely going to be personal taste on my part, but there is other stuff that I think most people will agree with. I'm interested in hearing back from SB about this, and also from others.
I guess, my primary defense for some of this, the parts i feel i should defend is this.
So far, my hosting experience is this, and 2 mini's. I don't have much experience at all. Yet i feel i put together a unique, and balanced game. There may have been some roadbombs along the way, but the game itself went well, i didnt get any death threats yet, and even tho the game faced some pretty large replacement / activity issues, it SEEMS most players enjoyed themselves.
All in All. I am really happy with this games run through, and end results.
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[19:59] greymon90210: Hey StormBlind how tall are you? "I'm six money *****, don't forget it"
"The Critics always said that we'd only have a black president when pigs flu"...
Some one, claiming neutral would have been a really poor idea. Sometimes, lying as town is the right way to play, but in almost every situation it's not. The only situation I can think of where it is better to claim scum than town is an endgame with 2 townies, 1 scum, 1 serial killer, and that's an odd special case.
Your best bet was to attempt to present a case on TMT. Quite often, if scum are claiming a role they legitimately do not have (jailkeeper, for example) or have not used to benefit the town there are going to be inconsistencies. If TMT had blocked an obvious pro-town role, he cannot claim that. Instead he has to claim to have blocked a different player that night, and this can create inconsistencies in his story (maybe it doesn't make sense based on his play for him to block that player, or that player didn't receive flavor and others did, etc.). In this case, the inconsistency was that some people got flavor and not others. Furthermore, TMT's information implicated you as scum. Since you knew you were town and you knew you didn't do anything that night it becomes clear that TMT was the last scum. I would have been pushing hard the idea that TMT is lying and scum the entire time. Even suggesting something like "Lynch me, then lynch TMT" would have been enough to get people to believe you as town, or even if that didn't work, they would be inclined to lynch you then lynch TMT, which would have worked out for us.
I thought the concept of the game was excellent. Two competing scum groups with win conditions differing from simply "kill everyone" is pretty neat. I had a couple of issues with the execution, though, and I think Rob Roy covered those fairly well. All in all, it was fun for the short time I was in it.
Also, grats to TMT. I had you pegged as town early on in the game, and only grew more skeptical later on. It wasn't until the counterclaim on Some One that I figured you were scum, but you did an excellent job of sneaking your way out of that one. Well played.
Admittedly, yes. This was my first time working with a motivator role however, and with the activity problems this game was having for a LARGE portion of it... i dont think the over long nights could have been helped without totally hindering the town. (who were the majority of the slow pokes). But i agree, next time i will give this role only to a dedicated player known for being active.
I felt bad about this. I replaced into a role where I had to actively have a grasp of who is pro-town and who isn't, because motivating scum can lead to bad things happening, which means I couldn't simply use my role at night without a careful read through of the entire game. After reading through the game, I had issues picking out pro-town players. I motivated Dagger my first night, which was an obvious choice, but after that I had no real clue. I ended up motivating Pale Mage the second night because he seemed pro-town, and because I felt he was playing differently than berserk, where I thought he was probably scum. Rob Roy the 3rd night was iffy, because I could have seen Rob Roy as scum. I actually thought AK was town and had a legitimately pro-town role after he soft claimed (until he actually claimed it), but wasn't about to motivate him just in case.
I think you should have given me an earlier deadline. I'm pretty sure I got in all my actions during the deadline, but I didn't even really think about what that meant for extending the deadline as you motivate the other player and they act again. I was more in the mindset of "I need to make a decision by this time". Apologies.
The roles I had the most issue with are Jsexton and SP. Silent Prophet's role (or any role that makes you believe a dead player is of a different alignment than they actually are) is something that I don't want to see in games. So much of scum hunting is connecting players to dead scum and analysing connections between players. Not having accurate information in that regard is really going to screw over the town. It ended up working out ok in this game (mainly because Memna/SP didn't create any connections), but I think it had the potential to be extremely problematic and game breaking.
I felt there were things being dropped, but that players were oblivious. I.E. When xyre got the time clock. I told him 2/2, and he thought the game was wrapped up. He failed to realize, he used an ability, Jsex confirmed using an ability, and TMT confirmed blockign Jsexton. And yet he only realized "If only 2 abilities were using TMT must be scum!".
Honestly, the way things went down was about the WORST possible way it could have gone down actually. And i KNOW cyan's angry about it.
I'll admit that there was no reason to think that he was going to take the cop with him. But the clock went down with the day 1 lynch, and down again after night 1, and given those circumstances the paranoid cop was always going to claim day 2. And if he targeted a townie, then we were mislynching. I think paranoid cops are, in general, a bastard mod role; and in this case, with the extra incentive to claim, that was even more the case.
The issue was that for the game to be balanced, and the doomsday mafia to have a good chance to win, i couldnt find any way to make the game work without the time bank, and he was too strong, so i had to nerf him a bit.
If my role was too powerful, I think he should have been adjusted himself. 1 minute per 3 townies, or something. I strongly disagree with putting a townie role in the game for the express purpose of screwing with another townie, and not have them know about it.
That's something that surprised me. It never came up in game. In almost every game i saw masons exist, the question came up, "Are you mod confirmed?". That NEVER came up, and it surprised the hell outta me. Heh.
We didn't find out about the masons until one was already dead. No point in asking the question then.
And im quite happy that no one seems to have issues with the double mafia thing. Mostly just individual roles. I kept hearing from people that a double mafia game is nearly impossible to balance properly. And although i had to do some shortcuts to make it happen, i feel it did the balancing pretty damned well.
Well, I'm pretty sure the guy who won it for his team deserved it, so that's a good thing. A little post hoc, ergo propter hoc there, but hey.
So far, my hosting experience is this, and 2 mini's. I don't have much experience at all. Yet i feel i put together a unique, and balanced game. There may have been some roadbombs along the way, but the game itself went well, i didnt get any death threats yet, and even tho the game faced some pretty large replacement / activity issues, it SEEMS most players enjoyed themselves.
All in All. I am really happy with this games run through, and end results.
Overall, it was a good game, and one that I enjoyed. I argue because I care.
I DO Agree that some of my roles, or some interactions probably could have been better planned, and i fully do plan to take player input here into consideration in the future.
Sorry if it seems otherwise, i do appreciate the feedback, and its not falling on deaf ears.
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[19:59] greymon90210: Hey StormBlind how tall are you? "I'm six money *****, don't forget it"
"The Critics always said that we'd only have a black president when pigs flu"...
I wasn't that mad about being a paranoid cop. I was(I don't really care at this point, I died like 2 months ago) angry because you/AG's logic behind it all was 'derfderf it's Putin, everyone should realize this is an auto-paranoid cop'. And that is a huge logical fallacy. It's mafia, nothing is ever given for certain. The way that the role read to me, I was the cop because I had alot of power and a huge network of spies. Sounds pretty reasonable.
It's not realistic to expect people to take real life flavor and extrapolate, without any in-game knowledge, that there might be something abberant to their role. If you're trying to force a flavor argument, then half of the roles in this game were misaligned anyway.
I was a little bit suspicious when I received my N1 result, considering that my men tortured the result out of the guy...but the description was not remotely clear enough to give a solid seed of doubt. And given the nature of the game/setup, I couldn't just sit around and wait for connections to build, multiple results, etc.
And lastly, N2 when I died, I investigated RobRoy, and got an Innocent result back from you before I died. I realize it's immaterial because I died anyway, but I don't see how a paranoid cop ever gets an innocent result.
I think that abberant cop roles have to be approached with extreme care, exactly because of situations like these. If someone is naive/insane/paranoid, this should be made somewhat obvious. Hoping that they pick up on A)flavor or B)a minor hint isn't good enough, especially in a 'timeline' style of game.
And I don't see the reason for a sheer bastardly role like Al Gore when you already have other bastard mod roles. I felt like you couldn't figure out how to give the mafia an appropriate power level(s), so, you just went out of your way to screw the town on their role/roles instead.
I thought that you did an alright job for your first specialty type of game, just that some areas could be improved upon.
One thing that pissed me off was when SB said that HL mafia were all gone. What's the point of having a death GF if you report that we are all dead? I wanted the town to be confused by Al Gore, not to have a gift-The knowledge that Wuffles, had to have been HL.
We live in a country were ~50% of the populace believe public schooling is a socialist conspiracy and that being called Einstein is an insult. We could try and fix it, but unfortunately the other 50% don't believe in euthanasia.
The problem is that I am on vacation now and the internet I am using has been far too slow to do anything other than click the last page of a thread. I didn't really have the time to dig up and present a case, but realistically, I don't think it would have mattered extensively because people were unwilling to discuss things over to very much of an extent at all. Jsex and myself swung waaaay too quickly, and as I said at the time, why did the town let TMT lead us to a mislynch not once but twice? That was entirely beyond me...
The problem is that I am on vacation now and the internet I am using has been far too slow to do anything other than click the last page of a thread. I didn't really have the time to dig up and present a case, but realistically, I don't think it would have mattered extensively because people were unwilling to discuss things over to very much of an extent at all. Jsex and myself swung waaaay too quickly, and as I said at the time, why did the town let TMT lead us to a mislynch not once but twice? That was entirely beyond me...
JSex's lynch was mostly due to the bastardly role he was given. His role was a direct detriment to the town, and the HL were confirmed dead. His lynch was inevitable.
Your lynch was in part due to people not willing to believe I'd lie so blatantly, and in part due to people getting too comfortable with the clock. They were willing to take my word for it and axe you, confident that they would have the next day to take care of me if I was lying. Also, if I may say so, you had a tendency to blow up when you were under pressure, and it made people a less inclined to listen to you. To them it looked like you were flailing.
Actually, I remember thinking that JSexton was part of one of the Mafia the first time I glanced through the setup, because his ability stuck in my head. Heh.
I feel the complete slowdown around day 3/4 didn't really help matters for the town, though. I know that's when most of us dropped off the spectator forum. -_o
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Esper Simperer; Even the court homonculi need someone to look down on.
Jund Fangirl; Few things can describe the bliss of the fangirl's cries fading to silence (broken by occasional munching sounds).
Grixis Emo; 'Why should I go out there? They're all uncaring zombies! *sniff* No one understands me...' Bant Wageslave; Behind every successful knight is a corporate drudge doing his taxwork.
Naya Overenthusiast; Because there is such a thing as too much enthusiasm.
God dammit, menma and I were totally dedicated to a 2-person mason claim that game, then menma and subsequently silent prophet (who you should both recommend to the probation list, SB - at least, I know that SP has been a deadposter with little to no excuse in multiple games before this) deadposted, and got themselves modkilled for inactivity.
I had the claim completely planned out with menma.
"I am Theodore John Kaczynski, The Unabomber, Townie "Unavig". As the
infamous Unabomber, I conducted mail bombings all over america, in
protest of the way technology is moving forward too quickly. Then, for
many years, I simply disappeared off the grid completely.
I have a one-shot dayvig and a one-shot nightvig. I was the one that
vigged Andelijah last night. The reasons I have for targeting him are,
indeed, quite interesting.
During Night 2, I was sent an anonymous letter from another player,
through MODGOD, saying that the sender knew who I was, what I had
done, and that he approved of and respected the skills by which I was
able to avoid the clumsy retailation of society, in my efforts to do
whatever is necessary in service to my country. The sender apparently
wished to make use of both my not inconsiderable talents (subterfuge
and explosives). He suggested the name of a target to me last night, I
agreed, figuring, "what the hell, it's the vice president of the
united states" and what do you know, Scumdelijah is dead today.
I do not know who Al Gore is (the message was signed "Al Gore",
though, so I know it's him) but I believe him to be 100% on the side
of the town. There is of course a slim chance that he is a member of
the other mafia, looking to thin the numbers of the opposition,
however I don't seriously believe this to be the case.
Without quoting the PM in question, the messages tone implies that the
letter-sending was a setup-based interaction, and that Al Gore
(whoever he is) did not know who exactly I was when the letter was
sent. However, Al, whoever you are, feel free to instruct me on who to
use my daykill on. I'm yours to command, after the last one. =D"
What do you think, menma? This takes great advantage of your uber-
godfather abilities, gives me a great way to pseudo-confirm you, and
doesn't make us look scummy by revealing any additional player names.
Then, we get menma killed ASAP, and he comes up town, completely confirming me.
I have to say, though, can't help but feel completely screwed by the way Stormblind arbitrarily decided what happened to me - 2 months or more after the setup was finalized. These kinks should have been seen in advance, I mean, it was quite a simple possibility to notice...also, it really pissed me off the way that SB described my nightkill of andelijah - I mean, I'm the freaking UNABOMBER for chrissake, why would I break his kneecaps first (to which SB replied along the lines of "artistic licence lollllzzzz" )
I really liked the mechanics in this game, though, and would happily repeat the experience. Kinks aside, I enjoyed this game thoroughly, though I shouldn't have let myself be baited so blatantly by dagger, heh.
If SB really replied that way, I'm going to LOLOLOLOLOLOL.
And I didn't even get to gloat about killing you and saying "See, told ya all Wuffles was scum" in front of the whole town.
We both died the same night, if it's any consolation.
Meh, if it's any consolation, if it looked like I was going to be lynched, I would have taken you out anyways. So there was no way you were making it out alive of this one, barring the events that did occur.
Meh, if it's any consolation, if it looked like I was going to be lynched, I would have taken you out anyways. So there was no way you were making it out alive of this one, barring the events that did occur.
I already had my death planned way in advance.
You know what I told SB the moment I got my role PM? "I'll try to force the scums to NK me Night 3". Since my ability was two-shot, I planned to use 1 shot through Night 1 and the other through Night 2, maximizing participation from my targets and investigation results. I was planning to give my investigation results on Day 3, and trying to draw a NK in my direction at the same time for the dual purposes of validating my investigation results to the town and generating confirmed players. At the same time, I was hoping that if I managed to draw a NK on Night 3, both the doc and cop, if they exist, would have an extra night to wreak havoc.
Circumstances didn't actually turn out the way I predicted. For one, the Cop was dead due to the Paranoid Cop. However, it turned out for the best anyway, since I managed to claim my investigation results under the pretext of me being a cop-confirmed townie and wanting to share my results before being NKed by the scums. I managed to give off the impression that I was still a power role to the scums, when in actual fact I was essentially vanilla. I was actually worrying at the end there on how to explain to the town that no, I cannot give them any more investigations or kills.
In the end, I had the endgame I desired where I was NKed Night 3. The icing on the cake then was when SB told me someone motivated me, and I instantly grabbed at the opportunity to investigate/kill you. Then I found out that I was NKed. And you were removed from the game. Ah well.
Oh hey, I just realized I forgot to say this as well. Congrats on the victory - you certainly worked for it.
Should I have false claimed neutral something in response to TMT? I thought of doing it, but if I was pegged as scum, it would do nothing to help my cause at all.
We'll make you an offer you can't refuse.
Hosting: Vista Mafia
Hosted: Intrigue Mafia (Mini), Seance #43 (Basic), Conflux Mafia (Normal), Goo Mafia (FTQ), Experiment #26 (Basic)
Ongoing/Completed - 0/41
Town/Mafia/SK/Survivor - 30/6/4/1
NKed/Lynched/Survived - 15/11/15
I would never encourage lying if you're town. If you had claimed neutral, I probably would have thought you were lying (which you would have been).
Dagger's right. The town let you down. Don't kick yourself.
One thing you might have done is comb the thread and present a case on TMT. It was up to us to evaluate both you and TMT to try and determine who was lying, and digging up the dirt yourself wouldn't have hurt. As long as you keep a civil tone you shouldn't run afoul of the OMGUS tell. It will get thrown at you, but it's better for the town to have the evidence presented and lynch you in spite of it than to leave it buried. Again, I wouldn't kick yourself over it.
Remember, when nothing's going to help your cause you have nothing left to lose.
(This was what...your second game? I tried to lynch the town tracker my second game, and I iirc I had him at L-1 before JSex put an end to it. You did a lot better than me!)
Actually, this is not exactly true. Fudging of truth is a valuable weapon against the scums because they usually expect townies to speak nothing but the truth. There are certain circumstances when lying would serve the town's cause better.
We'll make you an offer you can't refuse.
Hosting: Vista Mafia
Hosted: Intrigue Mafia (Mini), Seance #43 (Basic), Conflux Mafia (Normal), Goo Mafia (FTQ), Experiment #26 (Basic)
Ongoing/Completed - 0/41
Town/Mafia/SK/Survivor - 30/6/4/1
NKed/Lynched/Survived - 15/11/15
Yeah... the main problem - from my point of view, at least - was that we didn't really have any positive tells from you to counteract TMT claiming that he hadn't been able to target you. Whenever you tried to defend yourself, you were basically just saying "I'm Jimmy Carter! Of course I'm town!", which isn't very helpful when we already think you're lying. More from you on TMT - or, hell, on Xyre, or JSexton before he was lynched - would have given us more insight into how you were approaching the game.
Hmm... in my second game I falsely (unbeknownst to me) counterclaimed the townie bomb, forcing the mod to step in and clarify some things before I lynched him, which would have killed both of us. I was just lucky the mod decided his PMs were unclear enough that we were both acting in good faith.
Corner cases, mostly. The thing is, it's better to raise folks up right. Lying is more often a bad trait in a townie than a good one, and it can take time to develop a sense of when it's okay to lie as town. I'd rather encourage good behaviors or ones that lend themselves to mastering the basics before giving the advanced manual to newer players.
Using Some One's question as the example he would be better served personally to build up his expertise at finding and presenting cases than lying. He could have done either one to try and fight his lynch, but he (and the town, and future towns) benefit more from presenting arguments than lying.
This. There's nothing OMGUS about attacking someone whom you KNOW is lying, because they are saying something you know to be untrue. OMGUS only applies when a player presents a case on you, and you retaliate by calling them scum for simply putting together a case.
And, let's face it, the town was pretty lax in the end game, me included.
Glad you think so. Honestly, in my simulations, there were QUITE a few points where both mafia's would... NOT want to fire, so i felt a full protective role would cause the game to drag on too long (And 9 days isnt exactly a short game). And your role essentially destroyed one factions ability to win aslong as it was alive and active. Honestly, look at the end game, you were worth 7 (Tho there were 12 dead townies, soyou coulda added another minute) minutes. That's a whole different kind of power role.
I honestly KNEW that people would have an issue with his role. Some of my reviewers did, and his role *WAS* a bastard mod role. It was there to compensate for the fact that the hitlist mafia was pretty underpowered really. A time cop is nice, but it would take a while for the mafia to figure out how it worked, and im not entirely sure if they did at all. They just killed people who would add time to screw over the doomsday mafia, and it worked. This could give them some movement room, and the BEST thing that could be done with this role was some kind of masonry claim, but the fact there were already masons, and the distinctively low power setup of this game, would have made that quite suspicious, especially as the game went on. And thing is, no one KNEW what the setup here was. 5/17 isnt unbalanced, especially with double mafia kills. *shrug* I felt it would be a bit annoying for some players in retrospect, but that in practice, its overall results would PROBABLY be the exact same as a godfather. I also gave hints here and there about his role, such as the fact that his role name is "Vice President" and no one even batted an eye at it o_0. I felt there were things being dropped, but that players were oblivious. I.E. When xyre got the time clock. I told him 2/2, and he thought the game was wrapped up. He failed to realize, he used an ability, Jsex confirmed using an ability, and TMT confirmed blockign Jsexton. And yet he only realized "If only 2 abilities were using TMT must be scum!".
Thingis, if you look at his abilities, they are mostly pretty minor to put it mildly. The extra vote is SORTA useful, but mostly in the end game to help the town out.
The Ability count was pretty minor, and mostly designed to give the user info about how the game stands. So that when players get rb'd or someone claims vanilla, it'll be clear that its quite a likely possibility.
The kill protection, in light of no REAL protection roles, was USEFUL, but it was almost like a one shot doc protection. Pretty minor all in all.
Lastly, the cell phone. This ability was honestly just thrown on at the LAST moment in the hopes that the reciever, if mafia, would be dumb and try to send some stupid message.
Essentially, the way his abilities break down are as such:
Ability counter = different form of watcher. Inferior to a watcher since its not directed, and it doesnt count roleblocked abilities.
Flak Jacket = one shot doc, but a variant of it. Stronger then a normal doc protect in most ways, but if you give it to a mafia, more likely to hurt the town the a one shot doc protect.
Extra Vote = DEFINITELY useful, but moreso as the game drags since its mostly a hammer tool.
Cellphone = Crappy one shot cop almost. Designed to catch a liar.
That was the reason it was decided that it could be used on self. It's abilities are REALLY generally minor and not actually WORTH alot. And only 2 of them are truly worth having on himself. The rest are meh, or making the ability worse.
Admittedly, yes. This was my first time working with a motivator role however, and with the activity problems this game was having for a LARGE portion of it... i dont think the over long nights could have been helped without totally hindering the town. (who were the majority of the slow pokes). But i agree, next time i will give this role only to a dedicated player known for being active.
Honestly, it WASNT something I had thought of. Since it was day usable, i had mostly figured it would be used during the day, due to the type of ability it is. Also, there was quite a few roles whose names were never heard of before. I.E. Guide, Kidnapper, TimeBank, TimeCop, Census townie (Awesome and stupid typo on my part.), Kill Changer.
They were designed to not give much information as to actual role abilities. Something ive noticed recently in games is that as power roles get taken out, some players stop trying because they see it as a lost cause. But when you're losing roles whose abiltiies you dont KNOW, its not as bad a mental breakdown.
Plus, when xyre claimed vig, if dagger came up Kidnapper/vig, things would have looked quite odd dont you agree?
This i admit was PROBABLY my favourite flavour role in the game. And that was another thing, this game type is actually balanced towards a late game. Even killing all the town's highest number roles in the first 3 days doesnt do much to guarantee a loss aslong as the time bank is alive.
This game was balanced and only 1 in like, 30-40 simulations had anything earlier then a day 4 end. Players just had a bad assumption that the game could and would end really early without their own private contribution.
Plus, Abbey was my co-setup writer, he helped me figure out quite a few things during the planning phase, and i put this in as a nod to 1001 nights. Honestly, the way things went down was about the WORST possible way it could have gone down actually. And i KNOW cyan's angry about it.
Yes, he is. In general, the town is moderately likely to lose 2.5 players every day night period. a 3-1 ratio for townie to mafia deaths. That's a minute on the clock EVERY time. The gravedigger was designed to atleast give the pretense that the doomsday mafia could win it.
@TMT: Thank you gratuitously for not giving up. This game, had about as close a win rate comparison as possible.
If anything, the hitlist mafia had the hardest win condition in the game considering the tools available to them. Look at this game, Xyre, who was one of the hitlist targets, survived til the end of the game, while 2 others, Jimmy carter + Dalai Lama, lived to the end of the as well essentially.
I know the hitlist win con was HARD, but it wasnt impossible, they had about a 20-25% win rate in my sims. They punished the town for letting almost any info slip, and with good/lucky play, could pull out a retardedly early win.
The issue was that for the game to be balanced, and the doomsday mafia to have a good chance to win, i couldnt find any way to make the game work without the time bank, and he was too strong, so i had to nerf him a bit.
That's something that surprised me. It never came up in game. In almost every game i saw masons exist, the question came up, "Are you mod confirmed?". That NEVER came up, and it surprised the hell outta me. Heh.
That was my bad. This is the first time ive ever hosted a game of this scale, and as stated, its fallen over some of the most annoying time period it could have. Return to school, 3-4 holidays, me finding out my fiance is pregnant.
Admittedly, i didnt devote as much time as i should have towards spell checking and such during the actual game. And the stuff before was me just being sloppy. Even tho NO ONE caught most of the typos.
For the record, i had 3 people look over this setup.
Abbey, axelrod, and LJustus.
Heh.
I have to admit, my favourite part of this game was the player reactions to some of their roles. "Im WHO?! And im TOWNIE!?!."
I.E. Mike Millitello, the mafia doc. CC didnt even know WHO they were and had to google him. And at first glance, he's a pharmacist for pfizer, a theoretical good guy, yet in the end, he works for a company with extremely questionable ethics who have blinded, and maimed millions.
But at first glance.... he's a perfect townie doc.
And im quite happy that no one seems to have issues with the double mafia thing. Mostly just individual roles. I kept hearing from people that a double mafia game is nearly impossible to balance properly. And although i had to do some shortcuts to make it happen, i feel it did the balancing pretty damned well.
I guess, my primary defense for some of this, the parts i feel i should defend is this.
So far, my hosting experience is this, and 2 mini's. I don't have much experience at all. Yet i feel i put together a unique, and balanced game. There may have been some roadbombs along the way, but the game itself went well, i didnt get any death threats yet, and even tho the game faced some pretty large replacement / activity issues, it SEEMS most players enjoyed themselves.
All in All. I am really happy with this games run through, and end results. Let's put it this way, this game was designed to be moderately stupid proof. Hitlist mafia basically prevented people from claiming role names, with 2 mafia's, claiming was basically kept to an absolute minimum, and i gave the town as little grenades to blow themselves up on as possible. I had designed this game to be very light on role interactions, and to run more of analysis and player interactions then off role interactions. I also wanted to shoot people in the face for attempting to metagame. And by god did that happen.
Your best bet was to attempt to present a case on TMT. Quite often, if scum are claiming a role they legitimately do not have (jailkeeper, for example) or have not used to benefit the town there are going to be inconsistencies. If TMT had blocked an obvious pro-town role, he cannot claim that. Instead he has to claim to have blocked a different player that night, and this can create inconsistencies in his story (maybe it doesn't make sense based on his play for him to block that player, or that player didn't receive flavor and others did, etc.). In this case, the inconsistency was that some people got flavor and not others. Furthermore, TMT's information implicated you as scum. Since you knew you were town and you knew you didn't do anything that night it becomes clear that TMT was the last scum. I would have been pushing hard the idea that TMT is lying and scum the entire time. Even suggesting something like "Lynch me, then lynch TMT" would have been enough to get people to believe you as town, or even if that didn't work, they would be inclined to lynch you then lynch TMT, which would have worked out for us.
I thought the concept of the game was excellent. Two competing scum groups with win conditions differing from simply "kill everyone" is pretty neat. I had a couple of issues with the execution, though, and I think Rob Roy covered those fairly well. All in all, it was fun for the short time I was in it.
Also, grats to TMT. I had you pegged as town early on in the game, and only grew more skeptical later on. It wasn't until the counterclaim on Some One that I figured you were scum, but you did an excellent job of sneaking your way out of that one. Well played.
I have been skimming since day6, and concentated on the endgame; excellent play TMT, I really had no clue who was the last scum
I felt bad about this. I replaced into a role where I had to actively have a grasp of who is pro-town and who isn't, because motivating scum can lead to bad things happening, which means I couldn't simply use my role at night without a careful read through of the entire game. After reading through the game, I had issues picking out pro-town players. I motivated Dagger my first night, which was an obvious choice, but after that I had no real clue. I ended up motivating Pale Mage the second night because he seemed pro-town, and because I felt he was playing differently than berserk, where I thought he was probably scum. Rob Roy the 3rd night was iffy, because I could have seen Rob Roy as scum. I actually thought AK was town and had a legitimately pro-town role after he soft claimed (until he actually claimed it), but wasn't about to motivate him just in case.
I think you should have given me an earlier deadline. I'm pretty sure I got in all my actions during the deadline, but I didn't even really think about what that meant for extending the deadline as you motivate the other player and they act again. I was more in the mindset of "I need to make a decision by this time". Apologies.
The roles I had the most issue with are Jsexton and SP. Silent Prophet's role (or any role that makes you believe a dead player is of a different alignment than they actually are) is something that I don't want to see in games. So much of scum hunting is connecting players to dead scum and analysing connections between players. Not having accurate information in that regard is really going to screw over the town. It ended up working out ok in this game (mainly because Memna/SP didn't create any connections), but I think it had the potential to be extremely problematic and game breaking.
Not exactly:
Using that information, if TMT had blocked JSexton, we'd have had a number of 2.
Yeah, it wasn't a major thing. I just like forcing the player to have to make decisions on who he can trust.
Probably not a good thing to say - after all, you don't want people metagaming you.
I'll admit that there was no reason to think that he was going to take the cop with him. But the clock went down with the day 1 lynch, and down again after night 1, and given those circumstances the paranoid cop was always going to claim day 2. And if he targeted a townie, then we were mislynching. I think paranoid cops are, in general, a bastard mod role; and in this case, with the extra incentive to claim, that was even more the case.
If my role was too powerful, I think he should have been adjusted himself. 1 minute per 3 townies, or something. I strongly disagree with putting a townie role in the game for the express purpose of screwing with another townie, and not have them know about it.
We didn't find out about the masons until one was already dead. No point in asking the question then.
Congratulations!
Well, I'm pretty sure the guy who won it for his team deserved it, so that's a good thing. A little post hoc, ergo propter hoc there, but hey.
Overall, it was a good game, and one that I enjoyed. I argue because I care.
Thanks again!
Sorry if it seems otherwise, i do appreciate the feedback, and its not falling on deaf ears.
It's not realistic to expect people to take real life flavor and extrapolate, without any in-game knowledge, that there might be something abberant to their role. If you're trying to force a flavor argument, then half of the roles in this game were misaligned anyway.
I was a little bit suspicious when I received my N1 result, considering that my men tortured the result out of the guy...but the description was not remotely clear enough to give a solid seed of doubt. And given the nature of the game/setup, I couldn't just sit around and wait for connections to build, multiple results, etc.
And lastly, N2 when I died, I investigated RobRoy, and got an Innocent result back from you before I died. I realize it's immaterial because I died anyway, but I don't see how a paranoid cop ever gets an innocent result.
I think that abberant cop roles have to be approached with extreme care, exactly because of situations like these. If someone is naive/insane/paranoid, this should be made somewhat obvious. Hoping that they pick up on A)flavor or B)a minor hint isn't good enough, especially in a 'timeline' style of game.
And I don't see the reason for a sheer bastardly role like Al Gore when you already have other bastard mod roles. I felt like you couldn't figure out how to give the mafia an appropriate power level(s), so, you just went out of your way to screw the town on their role/roles instead.
I thought that you did an alright job for your first specialty type of game, just that some areas could be improved upon.
My other banners not in use
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JSex's lynch was mostly due to the bastardly role he was given. His role was a direct detriment to the town, and the HL were confirmed dead. His lynch was inevitable.
Your lynch was in part due to people not willing to believe I'd lie so blatantly, and in part due to people getting too comfortable with the clock. They were willing to take my word for it and axe you, confident that they would have the next day to take care of me if I was lying. Also, if I may say so, you had a tendency to blow up when you were under pressure, and it made people a less inclined to listen to you. To them it looked like you were flailing.
Record: 3-2
Simpsons Mafia (Newbie) - Vanilla Mafia - Win
The Fiasco Corporation - Town Reporter - Loss
Doomsday Mafia - Mafia Roleblocker - Win
Battle Royale Mafia - Serial Daykiller - Loss
Danger City Mafia - Vanilla Town - Win
I feel the complete slowdown around day 3/4 didn't really help matters for the town, though. I know that's when most of us dropped off the spectator forum. -_o
Jund Fangirl; Few things can describe the bliss of the fangirl's cries fading to silence (broken by occasional munching sounds).
Grixis Emo; 'Why should I go out there? They're all uncaring zombies! *sniff* No one understands me...'
Bant Wageslave; Behind every successful knight is a corporate drudge doing his taxwork.
Naya Overenthusiast; Because there is such a thing as too much enthusiasm.
I'm just glad I didn't join, because filtering out all those references to "DD mafia" would have been a pain.
God dammit, menma and I were totally dedicated to a 2-person mason claim that game, then menma and subsequently silent prophet (who you should both recommend to the probation list, SB - at least, I know that SP has been a deadposter with little to no excuse in multiple games before this) deadposted, and got themselves modkilled for inactivity.
I had the claim completely planned out with menma.
"I am Theodore John Kaczynski, The Unabomber, Townie "Unavig". As the
infamous Unabomber, I conducted mail bombings all over america, in
protest of the way technology is moving forward too quickly. Then, for
many years, I simply disappeared off the grid completely.
I have a one-shot dayvig and a one-shot nightvig. I was the one that
vigged Andelijah last night. The reasons I have for targeting him are,
indeed, quite interesting.
During Night 2, I was sent an anonymous letter from another player,
through MODGOD, saying that the sender knew who I was, what I had
done, and that he approved of and respected the skills by which I was
able to avoid the clumsy retailation of society, in my efforts to do
whatever is necessary in service to my country. The sender apparently
wished to make use of both my not inconsiderable talents (subterfuge
and explosives). He suggested the name of a target to me last night, I
agreed, figuring, "what the hell, it's the vice president of the
united states" and what do you know, Scumdelijah is dead today.
I do not know who Al Gore is (the message was signed "Al Gore",
though, so I know it's him) but I believe him to be 100% on the side
of the town. There is of course a slim chance that he is a member of
the other mafia, looking to thin the numbers of the opposition,
however I don't seriously believe this to be the case.
Without quoting the PM in question, the messages tone implies that the
letter-sending was a setup-based interaction, and that Al Gore
(whoever he is) did not know who exactly I was when the letter was
sent. However, Al, whoever you are, feel free to instruct me on who to
use my daykill on. I'm yours to command, after the last one. =D"
What do you think, menma? This takes great advantage of your uber-
godfather abilities, gives me a great way to pseudo-confirm you, and
doesn't make us look scummy by revealing any additional player names.
I have to say, though, can't help but feel completely screwed by the way Stormblind arbitrarily decided what happened to me - 2 months or more after the setup was finalized. These kinks should have been seen in advance, I mean, it was quite a simple possibility to notice...also, it really pissed me off the way that SB described my nightkill of andelijah - I mean, I'm the freaking UNABOMBER for chrissake, why would I break his kneecaps first (to which SB replied along the lines of "artistic licence lollllzzzz" )
I really liked the mechanics in this game, though, and would happily repeat the experience. Kinks aside, I enjoyed this game thoroughly, though I shouldn't have let myself be baited so blatantly by dagger, heh.
If SB really replied that way, I'm going to LOLOLOLOLOLOL.
And I didn't even get to gloat about killing you and saying "See, told ya all Wuffles was scum" in front of the whole town.
We both died the same night, if it's any consolation.
We'll make you an offer you can't refuse.
Hosting: Vista Mafia
Hosted: Intrigue Mafia (Mini), Seance #43 (Basic), Conflux Mafia (Normal), Goo Mafia (FTQ), Experiment #26 (Basic)
Ongoing/Completed - 0/41
Town/Mafia/SK/Survivor - 30/6/4/1
NKed/Lynched/Survived - 15/11/15
I already had my death planned way in advance.
You know what I told SB the moment I got my role PM? "I'll try to force the scums to NK me Night 3". Since my ability was two-shot, I planned to use 1 shot through Night 1 and the other through Night 2, maximizing participation from my targets and investigation results. I was planning to give my investigation results on Day 3, and trying to draw a NK in my direction at the same time for the dual purposes of validating my investigation results to the town and generating confirmed players. At the same time, I was hoping that if I managed to draw a NK on Night 3, both the doc and cop, if they exist, would have an extra night to wreak havoc.
Circumstances didn't actually turn out the way I predicted. For one, the Cop was dead due to the Paranoid Cop. However, it turned out for the best anyway, since I managed to claim my investigation results under the pretext of me being a cop-confirmed townie and wanting to share my results before being NKed by the scums. I managed to give off the impression that I was still a power role to the scums, when in actual fact I was essentially vanilla. I was actually worrying at the end there on how to explain to the town that no, I cannot give them any more investigations or kills.
In the end, I had the endgame I desired where I was NKed Night 3. The icing on the cake then was when SB told me someone motivated me, and I instantly grabbed at the opportunity to investigate/kill you. Then I found out that I was NKed. And you were removed from the game. Ah well.
We'll make you an offer you can't refuse.
Hosting: Vista Mafia
Hosted: Intrigue Mafia (Mini), Seance #43 (Basic), Conflux Mafia (Normal), Goo Mafia (FTQ), Experiment #26 (Basic)
Ongoing/Completed - 0/41
Town/Mafia/SK/Survivor - 30/6/4/1
NKed/Lynched/Survived - 15/11/15