1.I don't want to watch 20 pages of people flailing trying to deal with KoD. It can be entertaining but there are much more constructive ways I can get my entertainment.
2.I like messing with KoD.
Also it's too early to be able to figure out his alignment. KoD always gets into fights with people so that's a null tell. Get him on the defensive and I might be able to tell you.
Oh, some of you guys thought I seriously wanted to no lynch. It can be the correct play, but we can usually do better.
Unvote
@TappingStones:
I'm just an inauthentic sort of guy. Sorry.
@KingOfDominaria:
Lemme me give you what it looked like from my perspective.
1) Sir Chris naked town clears Shockwave.
2) You say "I don't like No Lynching or randomly town clearing" and FoS him.
3) He says "King might be scum because he assumed I was randomly clearing and cast suspicion at me instead of asking why I town cleared Shockwave
4) You say you didn't want to be suspected of fishing. This is an odd claim (from my POV) because townies aren't supposed to care about appearing to fish.
In fact, a major part of town's job is fishing for motivation. It's only a scum tell when you're trying to out a power role or something, and not even always then.
5) Chris seems to take the same view of this and wonders if you thought he was soft claiming day cop or something.
Then you two argue about the word random or something and you settle on voting him for not asking you why you suspected him. It seems like OMGUS, especially considering he expressed suspicion of you first for that reason and now you're turning it around on him.
Alright I'm going help you guys out with KoD a bit because this is sad to watch and most of you have never played with him before.
KoD Rule#1-KoD always thinks he's right, no exception.
KoD Rule#2-KoD does not apply the logic he applies to other people to himself, get used to that.
KoD Rule#3-KoD believes mafia should be played in a very specific way and if you go outside the lines he's going to go after you.
KoD Rule#4-KoD will only believe he is even more correct the longer you argue with him.
KoD Rule#5-KoD is stubborn and will almost never change his mind about anything.
KoD Rule#6-KoD will generally disregard all conclusions he does not come up himself. If you want him to see your point of view you just kind of hope he gets there himself.
KoD Rule#7-KoD rarely feels the need to explain his actions.
As far as anything else goes the only people worthy of clearance are corpses.
Good to know.
Hey, can you link me to a game that KoD has played?
Rescue? Ha! I'm just trying to save you guys a headache I wish someone had saved me. If you don't appreciate it I have no problems watching you guys try to figure out KoD for yourselves. To the contrary it could be quite entertaining to watch once you get the hang of it.
Speaking of which, same question. Any opinions on events thus far?
Well, it's an interesting mindset. It's being "helpful" but not with anything that will actually help us solve the game. Which I can't say I'm a fan of. Let me break it down for you, and if you disagree with any of the following, let me know.
1) I haven't played with KoD
2) I haven't played with you either, but you're going to help me figure him out
3) Nobody should be cleared but corpses
Now, should I trust you, and your "rules" for figuring out KoD? Probably not.
Was it even help though? Let's pretend I have you as confirmed town. I then know the following:
1) He's clearly abrasive. Whatever, we have lots of those, we'll sort him out.
2) You have a desire to help us figure out his meta, BUT, none of those rules have anything to do with whether he is scum or town
I'm not warning you about TS's playstyle (just an example, I actually like playing with TS). And if I had a desire to even post something like that, I'd certainly say things like "when TS is town, you see arguments like this all the time" or "I don't think he would act like this way as scum". But you don't have any alignment indicative rules, which is a red flag to me, that you don't really want us to figure him out, just ignore his post style.
Secondly, I'm not meta-clearing anyone. I'm definitely not meta-clearing somebody on the say-so of somebody else. I don't care if Sir Chis thinks D_V is the swellest guy in the whole wide world, or if JD decides to call everyone in the thread a moron. Show me behavior.
So, why did you feel the need to write up something like that post? Why not instead tell me what you think about his behavior to date? Do you think he's more likely to be town or scum based on his interactions thus far? I'm leaning town.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
Well, now that silver is backing off the no lynch thing, here is my post concerning that.
So many of you know GJ votes no lynch in the beginning of games, often. Nobody ever remembers *why* he does that. Town responses are easy to read, they are usually "What? that's stupid". Scum on the other hand, are caught off guard and try to appear town by debating the logic or the statistics or what have you, because it's an abnormal position that clearly favors their goals. It's also a safe topic, that allows content generation without actually committing to anything.
It's actually a pretty smart move with this many new faces, that might be caught off guard.
It's not as effective to regulars here, because people are used to it. DoTA's response is an example of that, completely null (although I could make WIFOM arguments about him knowing the right things not to say. You scum DoTA? Don't lie to me). TS's response is also reading town to me, because he's at least trying to figure out Silver's thought process, even though he disagrees with the play.
KoD's response is what I'd expect of a town player not used to seeing that early no lynch vote. Because silver made a ridiculous stance as the first post of the game with 19 people in it.
Oh, some of you guys thought I seriously wanted to no lynch.
Why do you care what we think, and why did you feel you needed to defend your stance? This is so self-conscious, especially since yours was the first post in the game, and the "No Lynch lololololololo" culture at MTGS.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang) 2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer 2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator) 2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia 2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational 2015 - Best Town Player 2015 - Best Mafia Player 2015 - Best Overall Player
Why does GJ not being here make it a good idea for you to suggest a no lynch? Why do you think this is in SC's scum spectrum, even though you admit to having little experience with scum!SC?
See Mindreaver's post for the "no lynch" bit, and as for my experience with Sir Chris I'm paranoid about getting snowed by an extremely capable player.
Why do you care what we think, and why did you feel you needed to defend your stance? This is so self-conscious, especially since yours was the first post in the game, and the "No Lynch lololololololo" culture at MTGS.
To be honest, I was just surprised that TappingStones of all people took my No Lynch vote seriously. I thought about leaving my vote there to see if anyone else would bite, but figured I already got as good as I would get.
Why does GJ not being here make it a good idea for you to suggest a no lynch? Why do you think this is in SC's scum spectrum, even though you admit to having little experience with scum!SC?
See Mindreaver's post for the "no lynch" bit, and as for my experience with Sir Chris I'm paranoid about getting snowed by an extremely capable player.
Why do you care what we think, and why did you feel you needed to defend your stance? This is so self-conscious, especially since yours was the first post in the game, and the "No Lynch lololololololo" culture at MTGS.
To be honest, I was just surprised that TappingStones of all people took my No Lynch vote seriously. I thought about leaving my vote there to see if anyone else would bite, but figured I already got as good as I would get.
I didn't say I took it seriously. I can't just assume you are joking as I've seen multiple people push for this on day one's here, not just GJ. Hence why I made my thoughts on it known "as if it's serious", if it's just RSV then we don't lose anything by me posting my thoughts on the prospect of it being a genuine idea.
In regards to SC. I don't think it's wise to be more paranoid of a strong player than anyone else. This can easily lead you into seeing ghosts. Based on your fear of not wanting a player to slip one over on us, you might start reading scum tells that are actually null.
In many respects, you have to recognize your own skill level and play against a high-level player straight up. Because you have to look at the big picture, more often than not, a player will be town-aligned. Do you want to (potentially) witchhunt your strongest town players just because they are good? You need to balance your theoretical payoffs. If I was worried about SC I would be thinking about things like: How can I beat a scum!SC? In what situations would someone of my skill level be most likely to catch him? Can I tilt him with a fiery post? Does he have certain tells after a teammate flips? Know your potential outs. But also use the strong players to kill the scum.
I don't like the idea that "good" players get more of a pass then everyone else and it feels like a cover for you taking the bait.
You didn't read what I wrote very closely. I said to "play them straight up". That means you don't throw extra shade at them just because they are good. Are you saying we should throw extra scum reads on good players? Because that makes no logical sense.
So far I like that SC guy. And that Necarg is an amusing bloke.
I'll politely disagree with clearing shock. I'll also disagree with KoD's assessment that he would be called out for fishing for asking why. Granted our meta is a lot more heavy handed when it comes to fishing, but even there asking why wouldn't likely have lead to a fishing accusation. He is being overly aggressive even for him. But I wouldn't attribute that to an alignment just yet.
Not knowing the players and the meta here, I'm not going to fault the players I do know for being out of character, at least early in the game, since we will all need a bit of a "feeling out" period.
In many respects, you have to recognize your own skill level and play against a high-level player straight up. Because you have to look at the big picture, more often than not, a player will be town-aligned. Do you want to (potentially) witchhunt your strongest town players just because they are good? You need to balance your theoretical payoffs. If I was worried about SC I would be thinking about things like: How can I beat a scum!SC? In what situations would someone of my skill level be most likely to catch him? Can I tilt him with a fiery post? Does he have certain tells after a teammate flips? Know your potential outs. But also use the strong players to kill the scum.
Right, but I'm not witch-hunting him. All I said was I think he's probably capable of this play as scum and I don't want to get snowed. I'm not, like, consigning him to the depths of the scum list and pushing a lynch on him or anything. I'm just more paranoid of him than some others seem to be, and it could well be that it's because I don't have as much experience with him as they do. But that doesn't mean I'm just going to go along with their meta clear of him or whatever.
For what it's worth, he's neck-and-neck with Mindreaver for "strongest town read" at the moment. I'm just not willing to clear people on page 2.
Your post came across as you being afraid of going against a "good" player because if we lynch them and are wrong then oh no we lost a good player.
Too bad. Everyone has the same chance of rolling scum and no one deserves special treatment. If a player acts scummy then you lynch them, no exceptions.
Awesomesauce – Reading my posts in Alan Shore's voice is the best way to read them. I agree that KoD has an unusual mindset for a member of town but I am unsure if it is a scum one.
Wasabi Pea- I kind of like you too. Mostly because I like to eat Wasabi Peas, nothing to do with the game.
From KoD:
@Sauce: Perception of my posts? You mean post that wasn't made, right? Because that is the only one I expressed any concern over when faced with the count question from Chris. Speaking of which, you're being awfully unfair charging me to ask when the person could have just stated why in the first place (I can say this because Chris showed no actual, super important reason that must be hidden when he stated his reason why later in conversation).
In short, you're being opportunistic with hitting me with that when Chris is at fault for not being upfront.
This is an interesting post because KoD doesn't seem to really get why him not making a post due to concern of perception is damning to some. Also I don't have a number in my head but I think charges of 'unfairness' tend to lean scum from my experience. Especially this one which can be re-read as “why should I be interested in why other players do things when they can just explain it themselves?” I mean there's no game solving going on in your head when you say this. Now granted this could simply be because you're not much of a game solver and doesn't have to mean you're scum.
Hmm... instinct says town though. There really isn't a lot of guile going on here. Your tone, while not one I expect from a skilled player, matches the process which led to your vote. You're even doing the classic town thing of piling on over and over via reinforcement. You look bad, but there's not much here that makes me wary of you even if you're tripping some things which scum like to do. You are also a classic player archetype for a mislynch with the way you post, and those I do tend to be wary about especially what with you getting so much early attention that exceeds my desire. It's actually pretty common for when I spar a bit early on and not REALLY attack someone for that person to be voted on a bit, and from experience if I think it is too much that person tends to be town. I have my doubts how helpful you are going to be as the day progresses given what you've done so far, but I'll do my best to keep you alive for now, KoD.
@ Killjoy:
[/quote]Lolololololololol for reasons. (specifically at the "critically thinking" portion of that)
But could you explain the theory behind that?
[/quote]
To keep it brief (on lunch and I ate a lot of it thinking about KoD above, oops) scum have to fake thoughts, town has thoughts. Keep people talking enough and if you're clever you can spot the difference. Scum who aren't talented at engaging will often just keep it light and not even bother to try, and hope to god people just think they are flakey because when they try to really go into detail they stick out. It's not 100% because sadly critical thought is lacking in many people's town games as well, but scum who are able to accurately present critical thinking on a consistent basis are very rare and are all universally scary monsters to catch.
I like Silver asking for a comparison between my logic and KoD's from KoD, shows he is paying attention. I appreciate that. I also appreciated that he waited.
Oh speaking of scum.
##VOTE: Fable07
I may not be able to get around to explaining this in this post (not sure, on a time restraint and don't know how long this will take) but rest assured I am going to eat you at some point and then KoD is going to see what Chris actually suspecting someone looks like.
I will say Fable's 'oh look causing trouble' and KoD going 'I'm playing the game' is a response I really, REALLY like from KoD. Because I immediately red flagged Fable's post when I read it in the car on my way to work as being unhelpful and attempting to stir bias against KoD. KoD has some problems with some words, but he is indeed just playing the game.
@ TS – Okay so I am so confused about this gunshy thing now. The fact that I instantly do what I clearly wanted to do makes it pretty obvious I am not gun shy. I think at this point you just like to make sure you have a paragraph on me in your opening salvo of every game to just see how I am going to react because otherwise I don't even understand how this occurred to you to think about. Or you're finally scum and just missed the mark on your usual interesting points. I can't give you a pass for not knowing I like to be cheeky either! Clear cheek going on there, TS. As for not liking my self-awareness, you should be really used to that by now too. I'll let this thread go for now because LUNCH but yeah weird.
If Wasabi is scum he is not aligned with either Silver or Shock btw, as he mixed them up in post # 43.
@ Mindreaver
That is... pretty funny and fair I guess. Although I never said it was town genius, merely natural town-ness.
Fable then gives his 7 KoD rules with the intent to be both “helpful” and completely bury a player. Like, that's probably one of the rudest posts I've ever read about another player in the context of an opening page. Player nullification is pretty awful and Fable basically just said “I don't want you to waste time, yeah!' while really what this does is make people who may be borderline on KoD feel more comfortable ousting him later because hey, he's not that useful. If Fable is scum whoever gave him crap for this post is for sure town. I just scrolled, it was Mindreaver. I like this Mindreaver person, let us hope he is town and that we may feast together in glory forevermore.
Hello Cythare. *Pets
Also Fable calling me naïve is a bit silly considering how experienced I am. Yeah I don't like this guy at all let's butcher him and call it a day.
I am glad Fable agrees with me that there are NO EXCEPTIONS to lynching scummy players, it will make their death easier.
Oh and btw, in regards to TS he has been wary of going after strong players since he tried to anchor me for like 2 days in Predator while I was kind of sort of solo'ing the scum team.
See you tonight folks.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang) 2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer 2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator) 2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia 2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational 2015 - Best Town Player 2015 - Best Mafia Player 2015 - Best Overall Player
Your post came across as you being afraid of going against a "good" player because if we lynch them and are wrong then oh no we lost a good player.
Too bad. Everyone has the same chance of rolling scum and no one deserves special treatment. If a player acts scummy then you lynch them, no exceptions.
I'm not sure how you got that idea. I clearly stated that you shouldn't give someone extra scum reads because they are considered good players. The key word there is "extra" and as I already said you should play them "straight up". So yeah, I don't think it comes across at all as "being afraid of going against a good player". I was replying to someone who I thought was being overly paranoid.
Read through what I wrote again, pretty confident you can see where I'm coming from. Essentially, "DON'T be afraid of strong players, which is the exact opposite of what you accused me of doing.
@ TS – Okay so I am so confused about this gunshy thing now. The fact that I instantly do what I clearly wanted to do makes it pretty obvious I am not gun shy. I think at this point you just like to make sure you have a paragraph on me in your opening salvo of every game to just see how I am going to react because otherwise I don't even understand how this occurred to you to think about. Or you're finally scum and just missed the mark on your usual interesting points. I can't give you a pass for not knowing I like to be cheeky either! Clear cheek going on there, TS. As for not liking my self-awareness, you should be really used to that by now too. I'll let this thread go for now because LUNCH but yeah weird.
The sentence feels self-conscious to me. Let's check it out again.
So let's begin my never welcome and often mystifying to people townclearing with Shockwave07.
You were aware enough of what people "might" think about this town-clearance. By saying it's never welcome and mystifying. That sort of "heralding" might just be you being cheeky as you said but why not help us out and say why you feel the way you do about him? Feels like "You guys can't throw shade this way because I'm preempting you". Just something I noticed.
* Cythare purrs as Chris pets her, then scampers out of the room. A few minutes later, she comes back with a blue ball of yarn in her mouth, drops it, and rolls it towards TappingStones. She then hisses at Fable07 and bats at his feet. *
Well this has already turned into a fun little welcoming party, I try to help and get attacked for it. It's fine though I don't mind having to tear through a few people before being able to scumhunt.
Well this has already turned into a fun little welcoming party, I try to help and get attacked for it. It's fine though I don't mind having to tear through a few people before being able to scumhunt.
Misrepping me didn't seem very helpful. And voting me without even having interaction with me didn't do you any favors.
I didn't misrep you at worst you could say I misinterpreted you but I still don't think I did and it still seems to me you want to give players you feel are skilled extra slack. You saw what SC was doing and automatically assumed you needed to next level it in some way essentially you were outsmarting yourself. Also I don't need to have an interaction with someone to see scum behavior.
I didn't misrep you at worst you could say I misinterpreted you but I still don't think I did and it still seems to me you want to give players you feel are skilled extra slack. You saw what SC was doing and automatically assumed you needed to next level it in some way essentially you were outsmarting yourself. Also I don't need to have an interaction with someone to see scum behavior.
There is nothing in my post that suggests in any way, shape, or form that skilled players should get extra slack as referenced twice now by you.
"Automatically assumed" that's pretty loaded stuff there! I don't automatically assume anything, in fact I go over my reads very carefully. I also didn't assume I needed to next level anything. In my last post, I clearly stated what part caught my eye and why. Nothing automatic there.
So you are voting me based on misinterpreting (not reading) what I wrote and then saying I automatically assumed something when I clearly did no such thing.
VOTE:FABLE07
I fail to see what your list of rules were in aid of. You can warn someone, like "Hey guys, I've played with this dude before and he gets like this, here's a link to a similar game so you can see what I mean." Instead, you character assassinate him while he's trying to fight through some argument.
I'm not sure where your mind is at but you don't seem to be scum-hunting. You are looking for a place to put your vote.
I did read what you wrote I'm saying that at worst I mistook your meaning but you insist on saying I didn't read it. Also you said you read what SC wrote and got paranoid because you didn't want to witch hunt a strong player. I don't know how else I'm suppose to take that other then you outsmarting yourself.
I did read what you wrote I'm saying that at worst I mistook your meaning but you insist on saying I didn't read it. Also you said you read what SC wrote and got paranoid because you didn't want to witch hunt a strong player. I don't know how else I'm suppose to take that other then you outsmarting yourself.
That's not OMGUS.
I gave you a chance to look critically at the error you made and you don't seem to want to. You also didn't respond to the point about you making that damning list of rules. Why with such detail and at that moment?
Like there is nothing paranoid about me mentioning something I found peculiar in Sc's post. I felt it might be "gunshy" he says it wasn't and that he was being cheeky. Knowing how he plays it does make sense in that context.
Your posts are not like that. They have no semblance of scum hunting. You are looking to put your vote somewhere.
What the KoD rules? Just like I don't the history between you and SC you don't know the history between me and KoD. I see him doing what he always does being his usually abrasive self and wanted to spare you guys from it, nothing more. Obviously that was a mistake and I won't be doing anything like that again.
Also you all have the advantage of having played each other and knowing each other's behavior, that is information I do not have and I have to make the best calls I can being that I'm starting at level one. I'm just calling things the way I see them.
@Fable:
This is just TS being himself. He's pretty aggressive and calls misreps, etc. to generate reactions. I guess KoD is sort of the same way, from what you were saying? Should be interesting to have them both in a game.
@Fable:
This is just TS being himself. He's pretty aggressive and calls misreps, etc. to generate reactions. I guess KoD is sort of the same way, from what you were saying? Should be interesting to have them both in a game.
Where was I being aggressive? Heck, I'm being pretty nice to be honest. He said something that was incorrect. I asked him to review the post. I restated the parts that show his rep to have been inaccurate and he still doesn't want to back off of it. What am I to think? He just got finished complaining that KOD thinks he's always right and butts heads. I would say Fable is calling the kettle black.
As for your theory, feel free to lay it on me. I may disagree with it though.
The theory you're trying to use is Lynch All Liars, the idea that, since townies have no reason to lie, we should lynch anyone who does lie. However, this theory often doesn't work because then, no one can push a gambit, which is often useful and/or integral, and it ignores the psychology and basic principal of compulsory lying, which is not alignment indicative.
Alright I'm going help you guys out with KoD a bit because this is sad to watch and most of you have never played with him before.
KoD Rule#1-KoD always thinks he's right, no exception.
KoD Rule#2-KoD does not apply the logic he applies to other people to himself, get used to that.
KoD Rule#3-KoD believes mafia should be played in a very specific way and if you go outside the lines he's going to go after you.
KoD Rule#4-KoD will only believe he is even more correct the longer you argue with him.
KoD Rule#5-KoD is stubborn and will almost never change his mind about anything.
KoD Rule#6-KoD will generally disregard all conclusions he does not come up himself. If you want him to see your point of view you just kind of hope he gets there himself.
KoD Rule#7-KoD rarely feels the need to explain his actions.
As far as anything else goes the only people worthy of clearance are corpses.
I really don't like this post. It just seems like a ton of hate and trying to tunnel someone, and then gets really salty about it later.
1.Opinions on the barely anything that's happened so far? Well lets see...
2.Necarg is apparently going to spend this game talking about his dick. That should be fun.
1. Normally I'd agree with you, but we actually have some good content page 1, so I have no idea what your talking about.
2. It sure as hell will be.
Well this has already turned into a fun little welcoming party, I try to help and get attacked for it. It's fine though I don't mind having to tear through a few people before being able to scumhunt.
This is so much OMGUS and the first part is directly a threat. He also acts extremely salty and irratible. He seems to be giving off a rather large reaction for having, what, 2 votes on him? Vote: Fable07
Misrepping me didn't seem very helpful. And voting me without even having interaction with me didn't do you any favors.
There TS goes with The Boy Who Called Misrep(TM). Par for the course.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
My thoughts are with the friends and family of the Orlando Shooting victims and with the rest of the LGBTQA+ community.
Check out my Newborder Peasant Cube here! http://www.cubetutor.com/draft/37467
Necarg, please don't acknowledge this in any way whatsoever.
True Name Mafia (Win),Clan Contest IX Mafia (Win), Bravely Default Mafia (Loss), BOTAS (loss), BfV (Loss), Ace Attourney (loss)
Rules Advisor before they were eradicated
Given that half your points on TS seem to apply to silver instead, fable, he might have a point that you aren't paying close enough attention. At least that's where the witch hunting comments seem to lead to me, as TS was talking about hypothetical witch hunting and silver was the one that said he wasn't witch hunting him in the specific. I think both sides of that are being a bit poorly misrepresented as silver was never indicating additional shade be thrown to better players, rather not cutting them extra slack. Kind of opposite sides of the same coin. It seems to me that those involved in this are only looking at one side. Somebody says don't give them a pass. The other side looks at that as throw extra shade on them and vice versa. In reality though playing them straight up means no passes and no extra shade and saying one isn't indicative of the other.
Oh no I have no doubt that me and KoD are more alike than either of us would ever dare admit. We're both likely to get into fights every game we play but I like to think I'm more aggressive in a fun and carefree way while KoD is more serious and vitriolic.
Of course I'm in no position to say my perspective is the correct one since I don't have the ability to be the one looking in from the outside to that situation.
Please don't take my threats as me being salty that's just how I like to have fun. I'm not one to take mafia that seriously and I like teasing people.
Misrepping me didn't seem very helpful. And voting me without even having interaction with me didn't do you any favors.
Can be sort of harsh. Actually, in a lot of ways you're the pot calling the kettle now.
FWIW, I don't see anything particularly indicative of Fable's alignment one way or the other yet. Being stubborn isn't alignment indicative over all and the mindset makes me lean slightly town. I don't think Fable was chainsawing for King, though the thought crossed my mind.
Well this has already turned into a fun little welcoming party, I try to help and get attacked for it. It's fine though I don't mind having to tear through a few people before being able to scumhunt.
It's been said, but this post is worrysome. Honestly, who threatens a cat? Serial Murderers.
I'll say this about the environment here, not one of the people that is engaging you, is incapable of admitting they were wrong and changing their mind.
But you know the only thing that is going to change minds? If you scumhunted, instead of "tearing through" people. Maybe just a poor choice of words here, but if I was you I'd be less worried about TS/SC making you look scummy and more about catching scum.
Since you don't know me, I'm not bothered by how you choose to describe me. You'll get w/e feelings develop for me as the game progresses.
And how is a fishing accusation "unusual"? You're the one who felt the best response wasn't to say why you cleared who you did. Instead it was to cast suspicion back on me for FoSing you. In your recent post you completely undermined yourself by saying you have no trouble saying why you cleared the person. Back on the fishing, your post even alludes to not being "transparent" by which I assume you mean not being completely honest about everything in case they have vital info that they gathered. That just backs up my reasoning about potentially being accused for fishing had I decided to ask why as opposed to just accusing you for what you obviously did (clear someone randomly).
Isn't that what town is supposed to do? Get as much info out onto the open field as possible?
I know exactly what random is. It's what you did with "clearing" Shock (that's who you said right?). Since you claimed it to be your opinion, you are more or less communicating to me that you randomly cleared him. Simple as that.
Also, I don't know you. So I don't have high expectations for this relationship between you and I. Now, back to the matter at hand.
How do you not know since I already explained the train of thought behind it? I accuse you of randomly clearing someone and FoS you for it. You respond by throwing suspicion back at me citing I could have asked why you did that. I respond by calling it like I see it: If I ask why, you accuse me of fishing. After all, in order to get at why you cleared said person, you'd have to explain yourself (and that's assuming you're not lying anyway). That's a classic way to get called out for fishing for information. I'm honestly surprised you're not seeing it after I explained it.
Aside from my surprise at you not getting it, the hypothetical talk doesn't matter since you clearly cleared Shock randomly -- oh wait, no. You gave a reason for why you cleared him, correct? That just cycles back around to how you reacted. Rather than react to a person you don't know with what you said, you just threw suspicion back at the player. That's scummy on your part. You've just earned a vote.
Vote: Sir Chris
This is just the best vote ever. I don't like your logic, but it really isn't logic. Clearly you are scum even though it doesn't matter what you actually said, because the logic is bad. I'm in love.
Oh, some of you guys thought I seriously wanted to no lynch. It can be the correct play, but we can usually do better.
Unvote
@TappingStones:
I'm just an inauthentic sort of guy. Sorry.
@KingOfDominaria:
Lemme me give you what it looked like from my perspective.
1) Sir Chris naked town clears Shockwave.
2) You say "I don't like No Lynching or randomly town clearing" and FoS him.
3) He says "King might be scum because he assumed I was randomly clearing and cast suspicion at me instead of asking why I town cleared Shockwave
4) You say you didn't want to be suspected of fishing. This is an odd claim (from my POV) because townies aren't supposed to care about appearing to fish.
In fact, a major part of town's job is fishing for motivation. It's only a scum tell when you're trying to out a power role or something, and not even always then.
5) Chris seems to take the same view of this and wonders if you thought he was soft claiming day cop or something.
Then you two argue about the word random or something and you settle on voting him for not asking you why you suspected him. It seems like OMGUS, especially considering he expressed suspicion of you first for that reason and now you're turning it around on him.
Vote: KingOfDominara
Oh look. The clear of SC into the buddying of SC into the must attack his attacker play. Yeah.... I want you dead.
I also think I see where you're coming from with the clear of Chris. However, I do not agree with your assessment here.
I read that as D_V just being playful. You think it was more then that? Or do you just want D_V for a buddy?
I read it as serious, and did not agree Chris was clear based on that.
It wasn't but it is now.
Also that Fable wagon is something else, but you guys have fun going down that rabbit hole. And I swear to god I'm policy lynching the first of the two PR players to drop the act.
Well this has already turned into a fun little welcoming party, I try to help and get attacked for it. It's fine though I don't mind having to tear through a few people before being able to scumhunt.
It's been said, but this post is worrysome. Honestly, who threatens a cat? Serial Murderers.
I'll say this about the environment here, not one of the people that is engaging you, is incapable of admitting they were wrong and changing their mind.
But you know the only thing that is going to change minds? If you scumhunted, instead of "tearing through" people. Maybe just a poor choice of words here, but if I was you I'd be less worried about TS/SC making you look scummy and more about catching scum.
Why are you coaching here?
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Smile your day could be worse, so I did smile and it was worse.
D_V, answer the question. Regardless of Silver a why question is a fair point. Don't deflect.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang) 2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer 2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator) 2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia 2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational 2015 - Best Town Player 2015 - Best Mafia Player 2015 - Best Overall Player
No offense D_V but it seems like you're dodging SC's question. He asked you why you thought it was buddying and then just made a general true statement.
That hardly seems like grounds for accusing SC of trying to pit you and TS against each other.
... Oh jesus there are 2 SCs. You can't do that, Fable.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang) 2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer 2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator) 2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia 2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational 2015 - Best Town Player 2015 - Best Mafia Player 2015 - Best Overall Player
1.I don't want to watch 20 pages of people flailing trying to deal with KoD. It can be entertaining but there are much more constructive ways I can get my entertainment.
2.I like messing with KoD.
Also it's too early to be able to figure out his alignment. KoD always gets into fights with people so that's a null tell. Get him on the defensive and I might be able to tell you.
Unvote
@TappingStones:
I'm just an inauthentic sort of guy. Sorry.
@KingOfDominaria:
Lemme me give you what it looked like from my perspective.
1) Sir Chris naked town clears Shockwave.
2) You say "I don't like No Lynching or randomly town clearing" and FoS him.
3) He says "King might be scum because he assumed I was randomly clearing and cast suspicion at me instead of asking why I town cleared Shockwave
4) You say you didn't want to be suspected of fishing. This is an odd claim (from my POV) because townies aren't supposed to care about appearing to fish.
In fact, a major part of town's job is fishing for motivation. It's only a scum tell when you're trying to out a power role or something, and not even always then.
5) Chris seems to take the same view of this and wonders if you thought he was soft claiming day cop or something.
Then you two argue about the word random or something and you settle on voting him for not asking you why you suspected him. It seems like OMGUS, especially considering he expressed suspicion of you first for that reason and now you're turning it around on him.
Vote: KingOfDominara
Draft my cube! (630 cards)
That's a post restriction.
Good to know.
Hey, can you link me to a game that KoD has played?
Hello there.
Any opinions on events so far?
Speaking of which, same question. Any opinions on events thus far?
Where was this in Twinborn?
Hey guys, I think I've Spot-ted something.
So many of you know GJ votes no lynch in the beginning of games, often. Nobody ever remembers *why* he does that. Town responses are easy to read, they are usually "What? that's stupid". Scum on the other hand, are caught off guard and try to appear town by debating the logic or the statistics or what have you, because it's an abnormal position that clearly favors their goals. It's also a safe topic, that allows content generation without actually committing to anything.
It's actually a pretty smart move with this many new faces, that might be caught off guard.
It's not as effective to regulars here, because people are used to it. DoTA's response is an example of that, completely null (although I could make WIFOM arguments about him knowing the right things not to say. You scum DoTA? Don't lie to me). TS's response is also reading town to me, because he's at least trying to figure out Silver's thought process, even though he disagrees with the play.
KoD's response is what I'd expect of a town player not used to seeing that early no lynch vote. Because silver made a ridiculous stance as the first post of the game with 19 people in it.
I'm a little concerned about this though:
Why do you care what we think, and why did you feel you needed to defend your stance? This is so self-conscious, especially since yours was the first post in the game, and the "No Lynch lololololololo" culture at MTGS.
I read that as D_V just being playful. You think it was more then that? Or do you just want D_V for a buddy?
I'm gonna take that as a compliment, I think...
Going to lunch soon, expect thoughts then.
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang)
2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer
2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator)
2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia
2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational
2015 - Best Town Player
2015 - Best Mafia Player
2015 - Best Overall Player
@Killjoy
Opinions on the barely anything that's happened so far? Well lets see...
-The No Lynch vote was an obvious ruse that nobody should have fell for.
-Shockwave feels the need to tell everyone their questions are stupid. Don't know if it's role related or he's trying to play some sort of game.
-Sir Chris clearing shockwave is naive. Nobody should be cleared when the game just started and nobody has died.
-KoD is being KoD. Don't know if he's town or mafia yet.
-Getting the slightest of town reads off of Chris.
-Necarg is apparently going to spend this game talking about his dick. That should be fun.
-Killjoy and TappingStones are already going in with large multi-quote posts. Either going to be the most helpful town or scum that's trying too hard.
-I find Mindreaver amusing.
To be honest, I was just surprised that TappingStones of all people took my No Lynch vote seriously. I thought about leaving my vote there to see if anyone else would bite, but figured I already got as good as I would get.
I didn't say I took it seriously. I can't just assume you are joking as I've seen multiple people push for this on day one's here, not just GJ. Hence why I made my thoughts on it known "as if it's serious", if it's just RSV then we don't lose anything by me posting my thoughts on the prospect of it being a genuine idea.
In regards to SC. I don't think it's wise to be more paranoid of a strong player than anyone else. This can easily lead you into seeing ghosts. Based on your fear of not wanting a player to slip one over on us, you might start reading scum tells that are actually null.
In many respects, you have to recognize your own skill level and play against a high-level player straight up. Because you have to look at the big picture, more often than not, a player will be town-aligned. Do you want to (potentially) witchhunt your strongest town players just because they are good? You need to balance your theoretical payoffs. If I was worried about SC I would be thinking about things like: How can I beat a scum!SC? In what situations would someone of my skill level be most likely to catch him? Can I tilt him with a fiery post? Does he have certain tells after a teammate flips? Know your potential outs. But also use the strong players to kill the scum.
I don't like the idea that "good" players get more of a pass then everyone else and it feels like a cover for you taking the bait.
Isn't FoS'ing without voting a major scumtell? If you aren't Guardman, that is.
Then again, I'm rusty as heck on this.
You didn't read what I wrote very closely. I said to "play them straight up". That means you don't throw extra shade at them just because they are good. Are you saying we should throw extra scum reads on good players? Because that makes no logical sense.
So far I like that SC guy. And that Necarg is an amusing bloke.
I'll politely disagree with clearing shock. I'll also disagree with KoD's assessment that he would be called out for fishing for asking why. Granted our meta is a lot more heavy handed when it comes to fishing, but even there asking why wouldn't likely have lead to a fishing accusation. He is being overly aggressive even for him. But I wouldn't attribute that to an alignment just yet.
Not knowing the players and the meta here, I'm not going to fault the players I do know for being out of character, at least early in the game, since we will all need a bit of a "feeling out" period.
For what it's worth, he's neck-and-neck with Mindreaver for "strongest town read" at the moment. I'm just not willing to clear people on page 2.
Too bad. Everyone has the same chance of rolling scum and no one deserves special treatment. If a player acts scummy then you lynch them, no exceptions.
Awesomesauce – Reading my posts in Alan Shore's voice is the best way to read them. I agree that KoD has an unusual mindset for a member of town but I am unsure if it is a scum one.
Wasabi Pea- I kind of like you too. Mostly because I like to eat Wasabi Peas, nothing to do with the game.
From KoD:
This is an interesting post because KoD doesn't seem to really get why him not making a post due to concern of perception is damning to some. Also I don't have a number in my head but I think charges of 'unfairness' tend to lean scum from my experience. Especially this one which can be re-read as “why should I be interested in why other players do things when they can just explain it themselves?” I mean there's no game solving going on in your head when you say this. Now granted this could simply be because you're not much of a game solver and doesn't have to mean you're scum.
Hmm... instinct says town though. There really isn't a lot of guile going on here. Your tone, while not one I expect from a skilled player, matches the process which led to your vote. You're even doing the classic town thing of piling on over and over via reinforcement. You look bad, but there's not much here that makes me wary of you even if you're tripping some things which scum like to do. You are also a classic player archetype for a mislynch with the way you post, and those I do tend to be wary about especially what with you getting so much early attention that exceeds my desire. It's actually pretty common for when I spar a bit early on and not REALLY attack someone for that person to be voted on a bit, and from experience if I think it is too much that person tends to be town. I have my doubts how helpful you are going to be as the day progresses given what you've done so far, but I'll do my best to keep you alive for now, KoD.
@ Killjoy:
[/quote]Lolololololololol for reasons. (specifically at the "critically thinking" portion of that)
But could you explain the theory behind that?
[/quote]
To keep it brief (on lunch and I ate a lot of it thinking about KoD above, oops) scum have to fake thoughts, town has thoughts. Keep people talking enough and if you're clever you can spot the difference. Scum who aren't talented at engaging will often just keep it light and not even bother to try, and hope to god people just think they are flakey because when they try to really go into detail they stick out. It's not 100% because sadly critical thought is lacking in many people's town games as well, but scum who are able to accurately present critical thinking on a consistent basis are very rare and are all universally scary monsters to catch.
I like Silver asking for a comparison between my logic and KoD's from KoD, shows he is paying attention. I appreciate that. I also appreciated that he waited.
Oh speaking of scum.
##VOTE: Fable07
I may not be able to get around to explaining this in this post (not sure, on a time restraint and don't know how long this will take) but rest assured I am going to eat you at some point and then KoD is going to see what Chris actually suspecting someone looks like.
I will say Fable's 'oh look causing trouble' and KoD going 'I'm playing the game' is a response I really, REALLY like from KoD. Because I immediately red flagged Fable's post when I read it in the car on my way to work as being unhelpful and attempting to stir bias against KoD. KoD has some problems with some words, but he is indeed just playing the game.
@ TS – Okay so I am so confused about this gunshy thing now. The fact that I instantly do what I clearly wanted to do makes it pretty obvious I am not gun shy. I think at this point you just like to make sure you have a paragraph on me in your opening salvo of every game to just see how I am going to react because otherwise I don't even understand how this occurred to you to think about. Or you're finally scum and just missed the mark on your usual interesting points. I can't give you a pass for not knowing I like to be cheeky either! Clear cheek going on there, TS. As for not liking my self-awareness, you should be really used to that by now too. I'll let this thread go for now because LUNCH but yeah weird.
If Wasabi is scum he is not aligned with either Silver or Shock btw, as he mixed them up in post # 43.
@ Mindreaver
That is... pretty funny and fair I guess. Although I never said it was town genius, merely natural town-ness.
Fable then gives his 7 KoD rules with the intent to be both “helpful” and completely bury a player. Like, that's probably one of the rudest posts I've ever read about another player in the context of an opening page. Player nullification is pretty awful and Fable basically just said “I don't want you to waste time, yeah!' while really what this does is make people who may be borderline on KoD feel more comfortable ousting him later because hey, he's not that useful. If Fable is scum whoever gave him crap for this post is for sure town. I just scrolled, it was Mindreaver. I like this Mindreaver person, let us hope he is town and that we may feast together in glory forevermore.
Hello Cythare. *Pets
Also Fable calling me naïve is a bit silly considering how experienced I am. Yeah I don't like this guy at all let's butcher him and call it a day.
I am glad Fable agrees with me that there are NO EXCEPTIONS to lynching scummy players, it will make their death easier.
Oh and btw, in regards to TS he has been wary of going after strong players since he tried to anchor me for like 2 days in Predator while I was kind of sort of solo'ing the scum team.
See you tonight folks.
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang)
2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer
2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator)
2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia
2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational
2015 - Best Town Player
2015 - Best Mafia Player
2015 - Best Overall Player
I'm not sure how you got that idea. I clearly stated that you shouldn't give someone extra scum reads because they are considered good players. The key word there is "extra" and as I already said you should play them "straight up". So yeah, I don't think it comes across at all as "being afraid of going against a good player". I was replying to someone who I thought was being overly paranoid.
Read through what I wrote again, pretty confident you can see where I'm coming from. Essentially, "DON'T be afraid of strong players, which is the exact opposite of what you accused me of doing.
We're going to have a lot of fun together I can already tell.
The sentence feels self-conscious to me. Let's check it out again.
You were aware enough of what people "might" think about this town-clearance. By saying it's never welcome and mystifying. That sort of "heralding" might just be you being cheeky as you said but why not help us out and say why you feel the way you do about him? Feels like "You guys can't throw shade this way because I'm preempting you". Just something I noticed.
Vote Fable07
Draft my cube! (630 cards)
Am I going to have to skin a cat?
Well this has already turned into a fun little welcoming party, I try to help and get attacked for it. It's fine though I don't mind having to tear through a few people before being able to scumhunt.
Misrepping me didn't seem very helpful. And voting me without even having interaction with me didn't do you any favors.
I didn't misrep you at worst you could say I misinterpreted you but I still don't think I did and it still seems to me you want to give players you feel are skilled extra slack. You saw what SC was doing and automatically assumed you needed to next level it in some way essentially you were outsmarting yourself. Also I don't need to have an interaction with someone to see scum behavior.
There is nothing in my post that suggests in any way, shape, or form that skilled players should get extra slack as referenced twice now by you.
"Automatically assumed" that's pretty loaded stuff there! I don't automatically assume anything, in fact I go over my reads very carefully. I also didn't assume I needed to next level anything. In my last post, I clearly stated what part caught my eye and why. Nothing automatic there.
So you are voting me based on misinterpreting (not reading) what I wrote and then saying I automatically assumed something when I clearly did no such thing.
VOTE:FABLE07
I fail to see what your list of rules were in aid of. You can warn someone, like "Hey guys, I've played with this dude before and he gets like this, here's a link to a similar game so you can see what I mean." Instead, you character assassinate him while he's trying to fight through some argument.
I'm not sure where your mind is at but you don't seem to be scum-hunting. You are looking for a place to put your vote.
I did read what you wrote I'm saying that at worst I mistook your meaning but you insist on saying I didn't read it. Also you said you read what SC wrote and got paranoid because you didn't want to witch hunt a strong player. I don't know how else I'm suppose to take that other then you outsmarting yourself.
That's not OMGUS.
I gave you a chance to look critically at the error you made and you don't seem to want to. You also didn't respond to the point about you making that damning list of rules. Why with such detail and at that moment?
Like there is nothing paranoid about me mentioning something I found peculiar in Sc's post. I felt it might be "gunshy" he says it wasn't and that he was being cheeky. Knowing how he plays it does make sense in that context.
Your posts are not like that. They have no semblance of scum hunting. You are looking to put your vote somewhere.
What the KoD rules? Just like I don't the history between you and SC you don't know the history between me and KoD. I see him doing what he always does being his usually abrasive self and wanted to spare you guys from it, nothing more. Obviously that was a mistake and I won't be doing anything like that again.
Also you all have the advantage of having played each other and knowing each other's behavior, that is information I do not have and I have to make the best calls I can being that I'm starting at level one. I'm just calling things the way I see them.
This is just TS being himself. He's pretty aggressive and calls misreps, etc. to generate reactions. I guess KoD is sort of the same way, from what you were saying? Should be interesting to have them both in a game.
Where was I being aggressive? Heck, I'm being pretty nice to be honest. He said something that was incorrect. I asked him to review the post. I restated the parts that show his rep to have been inaccurate and he still doesn't want to back off of it. What am I to think? He just got finished complaining that KOD thinks he's always right and butts heads. I would say Fable is calling the kettle black.
What do you think?
The theory you're trying to use is Lynch All Liars, the idea that, since townies have no reason to lie, we should lynch anyone who does lie. However, this theory often doesn't work because then, no one can push a gambit, which is often useful and/or integral, and it ignores the psychology and basic principal of compulsory lying, which is not alignment indicative.
What is this bullcrap TS? This isn't like you, you aren't hard scumreading everyone twice yet!
I really don't like this post. It just seems like a ton of hate and trying to tunnel someone, and then gets really salty about it later.
Hiya!
That's a nice post restriction you got there. Wanna see mine? *nudge nudge wink wink* (I'm talking about my dick again, if that wasn't obvious)
1. Normally I'd agree with you, but we actually have some good content page 1, so I have no idea what your talking about.
2. It sure as hell will be.
Hiya!
This is so much OMGUS and the first part is directly a threat. He also acts extremely salty and irratible. He seems to be giving off a rather large reaction for having, what, 2 votes on him?
Vote: Fable07
There TS goes with The Boy Who Called Misrep(TM). Par for the course.
Check out my Newborder Peasant Cube here! http://www.cubetutor.com/draft/37467
True Name Mafia (Win),Clan Contest IX Mafia (Win), Bravely Default Mafia (Loss), BOTAS (loss), BfV (Loss), Ace Attourney (loss)
Rules Advisor before they were eradicated
Of course I'm in no position to say my perspective is the correct one since I don't have the ability to be the one looking in from the outside to that situation.
Please don't take my threats as me being salty that's just how I like to have fun. I'm not one to take mafia that seriously and I like teasing people.
Stuff like this: Can be sort of harsh. Actually, in a lot of ways you're the pot calling the kettle now.
FWIW, I don't see anything particularly indicative of Fable's alignment one way or the other yet. Being stubborn isn't alignment indicative over all and the mindset makes me lean slightly town. I don't think Fable was chainsawing for King, though the thought crossed my mind.
It's been said, but this post is worrysome. Honestly, who threatens a cat? Serial Murderers.
I'll say this about the environment here, not one of the people that is engaging you, is incapable of admitting they were wrong and changing their mind.
But you know the only thing that is going to change minds? If you scumhunted, instead of "tearing through" people. Maybe just a poor choice of words here, but if I was you I'd be less worried about TS/SC making you look scummy and more about catching scum.
This wasn't serious but after you said that it is now.
Vote Silver
Isn't that what town is supposed to do? Get as much info out onto the open field as possible?
This is just the best vote ever. I don't like your logic, but it really isn't logic. Clearly you are scum even though it doesn't matter what you actually said, because the logic is bad. I'm in love.
Oh look. The clear of SC into the buddying of SC into the must attack his attacker play. Yeah.... I want you dead.
It wasn't but it is now.
Also that Fable wagon is something else, but you guys have fun going down that rabbit hole. And I swear to god I'm policy lynching the first of the two PR players to drop the act.
I think perhaps we got off to the wrong start and I really don't want anyone here to think I'm malicious in any sort of capacity.
Also I fully intend to scumhunt I just ask that you give me time to prove myself is all.
Draft my cube! (630 cards)
Also It appears I'm always going to scum read you.
Why are you coaching here?
*Mumbles That's a stupid question, and proceeds to rub the cat's belly*
That's a great defense. Maybe we are both right.
Nice job trying to get me to go after TS or him to go after me instead of actually saying anything.
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang)
2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer
2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator)
2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia
2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational
2015 - Best Town Player
2015 - Best Mafia Player
2015 - Best Overall Player
That hardly seems like grounds for accusing SC of trying to pit you and TS against each other.
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang)
2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer
2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator)
2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia
2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational
2015 - Best Town Player
2015 - Best Mafia Player
2015 - Best Overall Player
Sorry! TS was doing it earlier so I thought it was understood that SC was silver and if someone was referring to you they would just write out Chris.