And not super fond of zomg still hedging after I asked him to take a stance one way or the other.
... but scarbo might be on to something with the zomg/Proph interaction.
@zomg: Do you have any scumspects right now? If you're leaning towards not no-lynching, and don't want to lynch Proph, is there anyone you would be willing to lynch right now?
An added note- I DO think the game is balanced around unlocking these latent abilities, but that doesnt mean that the game is balanced around us unlocking them all
I certainly hope we can all unlock them all.
As much as I also think it would be awesome to unlock them all, I don't see that happening. I think it's just as likely that lynching will unlock abilities and no one is saying anything because that gets a little bit too specific about how your ability unlocks.
I think if we spend enough time hung up on how to play the game, we forget to actually work towards hunting scum. I think we can and should still pursue the course of action that ends in town victory, and count on our triggered abilities as they come up.
I'm in full favor of lynching, because that's how we actually beat the scum (barring some incredibly lucky vigilante) and I think no lynch is not going to help us. It's even possibly that the scum have a passive that triggers on no lynch too.
See that's the thing about these latent abilities. I'm of the opinion that we should be playing the game normally, and not paying them this level of attention. I don't want to weigh no-lynch (or some other action, NOT in our benefit) against the potential that a couple people get cool abilities. If they naturally emerge, that's great.
I mean, we don't really have any idea if they are even linked to the trigger. For instance, the no-lynch trigger might reward a double vote, to prevent further gridlock (or save a LyLo situation). I agree with zomg, the game is likely balanced around certain scenarios happening, and then balancing them out. But it's possible that it's not at all linked. A no-lynch might give us a doctor or a cop. I think this is less likely. I also think it was probably balanced around what would naturally happen in a game. So "gaming" the system with a day one no-lynch might not be as powerful as a day 7 no-lynch (if that ends up being the best play for us), even if you unlock the same ability.
Until we know more, I'd rather not continue to speculate. I also don't think we should be making choices, just to unlock powers.
See that's the thing about these latent abilities. I'm of the opinion that we should be playing the game normally, and not paying them this level of attention. I don't want to weigh no-lynch (or some other action, NOT in our benefit) against the potential that a couple people get cool abilities. If they naturally emerge, that's great.
I mean, we don't really have any idea if they are even linked to the trigger. For instance, the no-lynch trigger might reward a double vote, to prevent further gridlock (or save a LyLo situation). I agree with zomg, the game is likely balanced around certain scenarios happening, and then balancing them out. But it's possible that it's not at all linked. A no-lynch might give us a doctor or a cop. I think this is less likely. I also think it was probably balanced around what would naturally happen in a game. So "gaming" the system with a day one no-lynch might not be as powerful as a day 7 no-lynch (if that ends up being the best play for us), even if you unlock the same ability.
Until we know more, I'd rather not continue to speculate. I also don't think we should be making choices, just to unlock powers.
@Silver - If it's making your nervous Unvote.
This is where I'm at too. If we incidentally unlock triggers over the course of the game, great. I don't want to go out of our way to unlock people's abilities at the detriment to the town gameplan.
@Vaimes:
Tone. But also,
I liked his #155 about Proph's claim and agree lynching scum is the plan, not lynching claimed neutrals that are unlikely to be lying. His #192 gels with my plan as well (lynch scum, don't no lynch or something just on the chance we get cool stuff), though he read zomg's post differently than I did.
I think we have similar views on the game state and that seems unlikely if he's scum.
Mindreaver: Sorry, I was actually talking about posts in past games you've played with him.
Why exactly did you back off of Silver when you did? You said missing opportunities is NAI for you, but handling your vote the way you did is ???.
I can dig up some past games. Maybe tomorrow if work is slow.
As far as my vote, I'd forgotten I'd voted Silver until he mentioned it. He didn't say "stop voting me brah" but he wanted me to actually vote scum. In all honesty, I'd vote zomg, but was more interested to see who else would join that wagon, especially curious to see if it'd get to 5 votes. So I just unvoted. It's not really like it mattered either way.
But now I'ma gonna try something else. Vote Gentleman Johnny.
gj is town for bringing something back from his old playstyle because it seemed like a good idea.
proph is telling the truth.
just had a massive scum qt with ghosting. i think hes town here.
I'm bias but am okay with everyone claiming how they unlock their latent ability.
As far as town is concerned, I'm not sure if this is the best route. I think it opens up doors for scum to potentially narrow down who to kill more easily. For example, if they know I might unlock a latent soon, and think I might be the doctor, they're more likely to kill me knowing my latent is an easy unlock, then another player they think could also be doctor if their latent is significantly harder to unlock. Maybe none of this is what scum will think and I'm totally wrong, that's also a possibility.
EBWODP: My apologies D_V, I see you're asking for a "sorta claim". I'm still in favour of that.
Of course, I think this is a much safer route for town, but I don't think that it is really beneficial? It'll just mean that town has to make assumptions, and scum doesn't because they already know who are town and who are scum, so can just use that to their advantage. I could see scum trying to say "Oh well their ability activates with a no lynch, that further indicates they're scum!" or something like that. I can't think of a situation where town can really use the information to their advantage.
EBWODP: My apologies D_V, I see you're asking for a "sorta claim". I'm still in favour of that.
Of course, I think this is a much safer route for town, but I don't think that it is really beneficial? It'll just mean that town has to make assumptions, and scum doesn't because they already know who are town and who are scum, so can just use that to their advantage. I could see scum trying to say "Oh well their ability activates with a no lynch, that further indicates they're scum!" or something like that. I can't think of a situation where town can really use the information to their advantage.
I agree. I'm not sure this soft claim benefits town. It's not information that can be used to determine alignment.
For instance, my trigger is shady as hell. Honestly, if I was to share it, I'd lynch me. Yeah, I could hide behind a safe "generic" soft claim, and say "Oh, it's vote based" (it's not) or some other nonsense. But I do not see how we use this information to A) Find Scum or B) Clear town. It seems the only benefit is to scum, to let them know exactly who has/has not been able to unlock powers yet (and by extension, make more efficient kills).
Town points for Ghosting, and scum points for D_V.
I also have to come to realize that if people get upgraded PRs from no lynching in an all PR game and STILL don't want to no-lynch, there is nothing else I can say in favor for it.
CFC did no favors for the slot. tom replacing in is a giant pain in the ass as I find tom to be harder to read, if not more entertaning. Still lean scum on the slot and would be fine, but tom is making feel a teeny bit better. I might be fine with Mindreaver at this stage.
While I am not sold on Ghosting for scum, I am not impressed with him either. It will take some serious scum hunting from him later on to make me ok with the slot.
Cythare I assume is faking, as the last three times I played with a posting restriction, they were fake as *****. Apparently, Annorax's was real, but what are the odds Cythare got another one. Can also clearly move his vote, so not sure why ZOMG is his primary target, but maybe I need to look back.
Vaimes I am not impressed with either.
DV/Proph are the only two people in my no-lynch pile and one of them is a claimed neutral =/. I need to get more town reads, people should be posting more to make me feel better about them, as "town because I am reading four other people as scum" is not a great place to be.
Oh, right. Soren should be in my not today pile as well. I liked how he explained his post and kept it logical, while CFC's response came off as trying to look logical.
Besides "worst post in the game", what do you disagree with exactly?
I don't necessarily agree or disagree with anything you said in that post. What made it bad was:
1) You eluded you have a shady trigger, mentioned it likely causes you to get lynched, and then didn't mention it. I don't know why either alignment would mention that, but the illogical ones for town would have still claimed the trigger. I am going to guess you are either an apprentice or a role that activates when a town PR dies. Might be the reverse of XDS game where instead of getting weaker when the enemy dies, you get stronger.
2) Ghosting is incredibly passive in that answer and seems like he is trying to convince himself the softclaim thing is bad, rather than stating the idea is bad. We already know about a third of the game's condition anyway and the scum don't actually care I would imagine. It doesn't effect their nk choices, as they still are hunting for either expirence or investigative/protective abilities.
3) If DV is scum, he is playing a remarkably good early game. The scum points for DV doesn't make sense unless you can explain why he comes at that plan from a scum perspective. Remember, he isn't asking for PRs, and some of us might not actually be PRs UNTIL the condition is met.
4) Your tone already had me leaning scum. I might ISO you later when I am feeling less lazy but you are in my realm for potential people to push. And we are only 223/224 posts in. There will be plenty of time to find a worse post, and more people need to post.
Like seriously, here is my five minute impression of the game at this stage, just by looking at the player list and not rereading. Ignoring tom's slot for obvious reasons:
Vaimes: Not a great opening, halk of his posts have been just about tom.
Silver: Posting decently. Slight lean town read
Kosa: In this game?
Hunt: In this game? (I know one post he made was going to catch up, I am just emphasizing this as a point)
GJ: Obvious town
Mindreaver: Lean scum, see above.
Ghosting: Solid bleh, because he is posting awkwardly. Can't decide if TSTBS or if DV is right and he is just plain old scum
Shadow: In this game?
Cythare: Lols posting restriction
Scarbo: I admit I haven't been paying attention to him, seems null.
zomgarcwind: Null. I know Cythare keeps voting him, not sure why.
Jack: I know his name because people are voting him
lil4leaf: One post I recall, but it was a decent one. Lean town
Proph: Lols neutral
DV: Stronger town read
Soren: Lean town read
I want more people to become known to me. The people I haven't been paying attention to might change, but I find having a small pocket of people to work through helps me understand.
1) You eluded you have a shady trigger, mentioned it likely causes you to get lynched, and then didn't mention it. I don't know why either alignment would mention that, but the illogical ones for town would have still claimed the trigger. I am going to guess you are either an apprentice or a role that activates when a town PR dies. Might be the reverse of XDS game where instead of getting weaker when the enemy dies, you get stronger.
I don't want to claim it at this time, but I wanted to emphasize that I KNOW that we can't PoE scum down based on what the triggers are (which I think is part of D_V's plan).
2) Ghosting is incredibly passive in that answer and seems like he is trying to convince himself the softclaim thing is bad, rather than stating the idea is bad. We already know about a third of the game's condition anyway and the scum don't actually care I would imagine. It doesn't effect their nk choices, as they still are hunting for either expirence or investigative/protective abilities.
Well, I didn't pick up on Ghosting's tone. I'll reread that I guess. But why come after me then? I'm not trying to convince myself :). It does affect their NK choices, and really obviously it does. If Player1 says "I get an ability when we no lynch" and then we no-lynch, they have MORE INFORMATION to make that choice. And yeah, maybe they don't give two *****s about Player1 and whatever random ability he happens to get. But without the softclaims, we would be in a better situation, because that information is hidden until the player decides to reveal. Somebody trying to cause scum WIFOM, like you did in your first few posts; should understand that the threat of vanillas becoming more powerful without notice is good for town. And yes, maybe that means they hunt for experience or PRs or are trying to manipulate relationships. But that's mafia.
3) If DV is scum, he is playing a remarkably good early game. The scum points for DV doesn't make sense unless you can explain why he comes at that plan from a scum perspective. Remember, he isn't asking for PRs, and some of us might not actually be PRs UNTIL the condition is met.
I explained exactly why I didn't like what D_V was doing. He's asking for us to put triggers into the thread. That helps scum more than town. Therefore, I don't like what he's doing. Therefore, scum points for him and town points for Ghosting, who was against it (but as you said might have been hedging). "Remarkably good" is a strange characterization for a game, as you note, with less than 300 posts. Nobody is pinging me as obv!anything. And certainly nothing is remarkable.
4) Your tone already had me leaning scum. I might ISO you later when I am feeling less lazy but you are in my realm for potential people to push. And we are only 223/224 posts in. There will be plenty of time to find a worse post, and more people need to post.
Meh. I think you've seen me play a few games, but this is our first game together. I can't imagine you can read my tone with any accuracy. But you're right, it's early.
1) You eluded you have a shady trigger, mentioned it likely causes you to get lynched, and then didn't mention it. I don't know why either alignment would mention that, but the illogical ones for town would have still claimed the trigger. I am going to guess you are either an apprentice or a role that activates when a town PR dies. Might be the reverse of XDS game where instead of getting weaker when the enemy dies, you get stronger.
I don't want to claim it at this time, but I wanted to emphasize that I KNOW that we can't PoE scum down based on what the triggers are (which I think is part of D_V's plan).
2) Ghosting is incredibly passive in that answer and seems like he is trying to convince himself the softclaim thing is bad, rather than stating the idea is bad. We already know about a third of the game's condition anyway and the scum don't actually care I would imagine. It doesn't effect their nk choices, as they still are hunting for either expirence or investigative/protective abilities.
Well, I didn't pick up on Ghosting's tone. I'll reread that I guess. But why come after me then? I'm not trying to convince myself :). It does affect their NK choices, and really obviously it does. If Player1 says "I get an ability when we no lynch" and then we no-lynch, they have MORE INFORMATION to make that choice. And yeah, maybe they don't give two *****s about Player1 and whatever random ability he happens to get. But without the softclaims, we would be in a better situation, because that information is hidden until the player decides to reveal. Somebody trying to cause scum WIFOM, like you did in your first few posts; should understand that the threat of vanillas becoming more powerful without notice is good for town. And yes, maybe that means they hunt for experience or PRs or are trying to manipulate relationships. But that's mafia.
3) If DV is scum, he is playing a remarkably good early game. The scum points for DV doesn't make sense unless you can explain why he comes at that plan from a scum perspective. Remember, he isn't asking for PRs, and some of us might not actually be PRs UNTIL the condition is met.
I explained exactly why I didn't like what D_V was doing. He's asking for us to put triggers into the thread. That helps scum more than town. Therefore, I don't like what he's doing. Therefore, scum points for him and town points for Ghosting, who was against it (but as you said might have been hedging). "Remarkably good" is a strange characterization for a game, as you note, with less than 300 posts. Nobody is pinging me as obv!anything. And certainly nothing is remarkable.
4) Your tone already had me leaning scum. I might ISO you later when I am feeling less lazy but you are in my realm for potential people to push. And we are only 223/224 posts in. There will be plenty of time to find a worse post, and more people need to post.
Meh. I think you've seen me play a few games, but this is our first game together. I can't imagine you can read my tone with any accuracy. But you're right, it's early.
1). For you to know that, you would have to know that the mafia's. If you admit DV has a plan that is trying to narrow down PoE by trigger claim, why do you think that is scum? Maybe he's wrong, but it still sounds town reasoning.
2). " I'm not sure if this is the best route. I think it opens up doors for scum to potentially narrow down who to kill more easily"
Are you telling me you couldn't tell he sounded like he was asking a question more than just posting an opinion? Maybe I am biased as someone who works with high school students, but students that respond like that are guessing, trying to read your face if that is correct.
3). Triggers don't actually matter for the scum, unless they know which role gets activated. Nothing changes from the typical kill tier 0 roles first, expirenced players second, suspected high tier PRs third. Some scum mix two and three up.
4). I don't care about meta, and my tone comment had nothing to do with your previous games. Meta is horrible if you are self aware, and your comment about our first game makes it clear you are aware of how you post as town v scum.
And I checked back. I said it was my least favorite post, not the worst post of the game. The former means I am getting stronger scum vibes. The later can easily be a town post. Not that it matters horribly, but just for clarification.
1) You eluded you have a shady trigger, mentioned it likely causes you to get lynched, and then didn't mention it. I don't know why either alignment would mention that, but the illogical ones for town would have still claimed the trigger. I am going to guess you are either an apprentice or a role that activates when a town PR dies. Might be the reverse of XDS game where instead of getting weaker when the enemy dies, you get stronger.
I don't want to claim it at this time, but I wanted to emphasize that I KNOW that we can't PoE scum down based on what the triggers are (which I think is part of D_V's plan).
2) Ghosting is incredibly passive in that answer and seems like he is trying to convince himself the softclaim thing is bad, rather than stating the idea is bad. We already know about a third of the game's condition anyway and the scum don't actually care I would imagine. It doesn't effect their nk choices, as they still are hunting for either expirence or investigative/protective abilities.
Well, I didn't pick up on Ghosting's tone. I'll reread that I guess. But why come after me then? I'm not trying to convince myself :). It does affect their NK choices, and really obviously it does. If Player1 says "I get an ability when we no lynch" and then we no-lynch, they have MORE INFORMATION to make that choice. And yeah, maybe they don't give two *****s about Player1 and whatever random ability he happens to get. But without the softclaims, we would be in a better situation, because that information is hidden until the player decides to reveal. Somebody trying to cause scum WIFOM, like you did in your first few posts; should understand that the threat of vanillas becoming more powerful without notice is good for town. And yes, maybe that means they hunt for experience or PRs or are trying to manipulate relationships. But that's mafia.
3) If DV is scum, he is playing a remarkably good early game. The scum points for DV doesn't make sense unless you can explain why he comes at that plan from a scum perspective. Remember, he isn't asking for PRs, and some of us might not actually be PRs UNTIL the condition is met.
I explained exactly why I didn't like what D_V was doing. He's asking for us to put triggers into the thread. That helps scum more than town. Therefore, I don't like what he's doing. Therefore, scum points for him and town points for Ghosting, who was against it (but as you said might have been hedging). "Remarkably good" is a strange characterization for a game, as you note, with less than 300 posts. Nobody is pinging me as obv!anything. And certainly nothing is remarkable.
4) Your tone already had me leaning scum. I might ISO you later when I am feeling less lazy but you are in my realm for potential people to push. And we are only 223/224 posts in. There will be plenty of time to find a worse post, and more people need to post.
Meh. I think you've seen me play a few games, but this is our first game together. I can't imagine you can read my tone with any accuracy. But you're right, it's early.
1). For you to know that, you would have to know that the mafia's. If you admit DV has a plan that is trying to narrow down PoE by trigger claim, why do you think that is scum? Maybe he's wrong, but it still sounds town reasoning.
Well, trying to PoE down, is town thinking. But Disclosing too much information into the thread to do it, or in this case asking for it, can be a scum mindset as well. What if I asked everyone with a role right now to list the first letter of that role. That way we can PoE down who could be a doctor and who is a godfather. Seems scummy right? We're trying to PoE down, by revealing triggers, and I believe it helps the mafia to know what those triggers are. And no, I know my alignment, and I know my trigger. The only trigger that seems scummier was your example that I'd become more powerful as town PRs died. Literally, that's all I can think of. So, from my perspective, Scummy trigger Condition != scum. Therefore the PoE plan is giving out information, and can't be used to actually determine alignment. And therefore, at least from my perspective, I wouldn't need to "know" anyone else's trigger condition to make this judgment that listing them out is bad. Maybe you think I'm scum, and I'm lying. But I don't see a motivation for me to. To keep town role information out of the thread? To preempt being "found out" later? Neither of those makes sense to me.
2). " I'm not sure if this is the best route. I think it opens up doors for scum to potentially narrow down who to kill more easily"
Are you telling me you couldn't tell he sounded like he was asking a question more than just posting an opinion? Maybe I am biased as someone who works with high school students, but students that respond like that are guessing, trying to read your face if that is correct.
Honestly, I think that's just Ghosting's style. I'll admit it's not as forceful as I'd like. And he made two posts together with a clear evolution of thought. I'm not sure that's somebody trying to convince himself, and just something throwing out ideas as they come to him.
3). Triggers don't actually matter for the scum, unless they know which role gets activated. Nothing changes from the typical kill tier 0 roles first, expirenced players second, suspected high tier PRs third. Some scum mix two and three up.
So you admit that suspected high tier PRs might be a target. Have you considered that a no-lynch trigger might grant a vig shot? That maybe scum would want that person dead, before they could use it? That by your own estimation, scum COULD use that info to suspect a power role and remove it, once triggered? I think this is making my case for me. We shouldn't give out any more info on what triggers a particular ability. That way the warning scum has when an ability is unlocked, is a bullet to the face, not a checklist they can look at and analyze.
4). I don't care about meta, and my tone comment had nothing to do with your previous games. Meta is horrible if you are self aware, and your comment about our first game makes it clear you are aware of how you post as town v scum.
I've never been scum, so I wouldn't know how I post as scum. That includes this game, BTW
And I checked back. I said it was my least favorite post, not the worst post of the game. The former means I am getting stronger scum vibes. The later can easily be a town post. Not that it matters horribly, but just for clarification.
Fair enough, I tend to be a tad dramatic, so when you called my post "the worst thing that a human could write on the internet", I might have taken some artistic license.
Like seriously, here is my five minute impression of the game at this stage, just by looking at the player list and not rereading. Ignoring tom's slot for obvious reasons:
Vaimes: Not a great opening, halk of his posts have been just about tom.
Silver: Posting decently. Slight lean town read
Kosa: In this game?
Hunt: In this game? (I know one post he made was going to catch up, I am just emphasizing this as a point)
GJ: Obvious town
Mindreaver: Lean scum, see above.
Ghosting: Solid bleh, because he is posting awkwardly. Can't decide if TSTBS or if DV is right and he is just plain old scum
Shadow: In this game?
Cythare: Lols posting restriction
Scarbo: I admit I haven't been paying attention to him, seems null.
zomgarcwind: Null. I know Cythare keeps voting him, not sure why.
Jack: I know his name because people are voting him
lil4leaf: One post I recall, but it was a decent one. Lean town
Proph: Lols neutral
DV: Stronger town read
Soren: Lean town read
I want more people to become known to me. The people I haven't been paying attention to might change, but I find having a small pocket of people to work through helps me understand.
@cythare: Why ZOMG?
Unvote
Vote: Gentleman Johnny
probably not going to move my vote rest of the day
I still want to keep the pressure on Hunt. His opening post did nothing to sate my anger and if you want resist my awesome plans to no lynch
You're focusing on this more than I'd expect. I'll admit it's been a while since I've played along with you, but I don't recall you usually pushing this hard. Also, didn't you literally just say that there's nothing more you can say regarding a No-Lynch? Also, your "anger" feels fabricated - presumably you were voting him because he hadn't shown up yet, and then stayed "angry" because he didn't immediately make content? I understand not wanting to let another player fly under the radar, but this reaction seems disproportionate.
CFC did no favors for the slot. tom replacing in is a giant pain in the ass as I find tom to be harder to read, if not more entertaning. Still lean scum on the slot and would be fine, but tom is making feel a teeny bit better. I might be fine with Mindreaver at this stage.
You unvote Huntzilla, then mention CFC/Tom in passing, then say you "might be fine" with the person you literally just voted.
While I am not sold on Ghosting for scum, I am not impressed with him either. It will take some serious scum hunting from him later on to make me ok with the slot.
Waffly language. Also, I feel like you're missing something very important about what he said or are trying specifically to be obtuse about it.
Cythare I assume is faking, as the last three times I played with a posting restriction, they were fake as *****. Apparently, Annorax's was real, but what are the odds Cythare got another one. Can also clearly move his vote, so not sure why ZOMG is his primary target, but maybe I need to look back.
About as good as anyone else getting it? Also, not being able to move my vote isn't the issue. About zomgarcwind specifically, I feel that I've been pretty clear.
1. He's acting very self-conscious.
2. He talked about no-lynching in the vein of "the game is designed for it".
3. He talked about the options for today being to either lynch a neutral or no lynch (he had mentioned initially that we have other options but then focuses on those two).
4. Related to that, he's focused on discussing those two options at the detriment of actually looking for scum.
DV/Proph are the only two people in my no-lynch pile and one of them is a claimed neutral =/. I need to get more town reads, people should be posting more to make me feel better about them, as "town because I am reading four other people as scum" is not a great place to be.
Why is DV in your "no lynch" pile? Also, why should we be catering to you?
1) You eluded you have a shady trigger, mentioned it likely causes you to get lynched, and then didn't mention it. I don't know why either alignment would mention that, but the illogical ones for town would have still claimed the trigger. I am going to guess you are either an apprentice or a role that activates when a town PR dies. Might be the reverse of XDS game where instead of getting weaker when the enemy dies, you get stronger.
I don't want to claim it at this time, but I wanted to emphasize that I KNOW that we can't PoE scum down based on what the triggers are (which I think is part of D_V's plan).
2) Ghosting is incredibly passive in that answer and seems like he is trying to convince himself the softclaim thing is bad, rather than stating the idea is bad. We already know about a third of the game's condition anyway and the scum don't actually care I would imagine. It doesn't effect their nk choices, as they still are hunting for either expirence or investigative/protective abilities.
Well, I didn't pick up on Ghosting's tone. I'll reread that I guess. But why come after me then? I'm not trying to convince myself :). It does affect their NK choices, and really obviously it does. If Player1 says "I get an ability when we no lynch" and then we no-lynch, they have MORE INFORMATION to make that choice. And yeah, maybe they don't give two *****s about Player1 and whatever random ability he happens to get. But without the softclaims, we would be in a better situation, because that information is hidden until the player decides to reveal. Somebody trying to cause scum WIFOM, like you did in your first few posts; should understand that the threat of vanillas becoming more powerful without notice is good for town. And yes, maybe that means they hunt for experience or PRs or are trying to manipulate relationships. But that's mafia.
3) If DV is scum, he is playing a remarkably good early game. The scum points for DV doesn't make sense unless you can explain why he comes at that plan from a scum perspective. Remember, he isn't asking for PRs, and some of us might not actually be PRs UNTIL the condition is met.
I explained exactly why I didn't like what D_V was doing. He's asking for us to put triggers into the thread. That helps scum more than town. Therefore, I don't like what he's doing. Therefore, scum points for him and town points for Ghosting, who was against it (but as you said might have been hedging). "Remarkably good" is a strange characterization for a game, as you note, with less than 300 posts. Nobody is pinging me as obv!anything. And certainly nothing is remarkable.
4) Your tone already had me leaning scum. I might ISO you later when I am feeling less lazy but you are in my realm for potential people to push. And we are only 223/224 posts in. There will be plenty of time to find a worse post, and more people need to post.
Meh. I think you've seen me play a few games, but this is our first game together. I can't imagine you can read my tone with any accuracy. But you're right, it's early.
1). For you to know that, you would have to know that the mafia's. If you admit DV has a plan that is trying to narrow down PoE by trigger claim, why do you think that is scum? Maybe he's wrong, but it still sounds town reasoning.
Well, trying to PoE down, is town thinking. But Disclosing too much information into the thread to do it, or in this case asking for it, can be a scum mindset as well. What if I asked everyone with a role right now to list the first letter of that role. That way we can PoE down who could be a doctor and who is a godfather. Seems scummy right? We're trying to PoE down, by revealing triggers, and I believe it helps the mafia to know what those triggers are. And no, I know my alignment, and I know my trigger. The only trigger that seems scummier was your example that I'd become more powerful as town PRs died. Literally, that's all I can think of. So, from my perspective, Scummy trigger Condition != scum. Therefore the PoE plan is giving out information, and can't be used to actually determine alignment. And therefore, at least from my perspective, I wouldn't need to "know" anyone else's trigger condition to make this judgment that listing them out is bad. Maybe you think I'm scum, and I'm lying. But I don't see a motivation for me to. To keep town role information out of the thread? To preempt being "found out" later? Neither of those makes sense to me.
2). " I'm not sure if this is the best route. I think it opens up doors for scum to potentially narrow down who to kill more easily"
Are you telling me you couldn't tell he sounded like he was asking a question more than just posting an opinion? Maybe I am biased as someone who works with high school students, but students that respond like that are guessing, trying to read your face if that is correct.
Honestly, I think that's just Ghosting's style. I'll admit it's not as forceful as I'd like. And he made two posts together with a clear evolution of thought. I'm not sure that's somebody trying to convince himself, and just something throwing out ideas as they come to him.
3). Triggers don't actually matter for the scum, unless they know which role gets activated. Nothing changes from the typical kill tier 0 roles first, expirenced players second, suspected high tier PRs third. Some scum mix two and three up.
So you admit that suspected high tier PRs might be a target. Have you considered that a no-lynch trigger might grant a vig shot? That maybe scum would want that person dead, before they could use it? That by your own estimation, scum COULD use that info to suspect a power role and remove it, once triggered? I think this is making my case for me. We shouldn't give out any more info on what triggers a particular ability. That way the warning scum has when an ability is unlocked, is a bullet to the face, not a checklist they can look at and analyze.
4). I don't care about meta, and my tone comment had nothing to do with your previous games. Meta is horrible if you are self aware, and your comment about our first game makes it clear you are aware of how you post as town v scum.
I've never been scum, so I wouldn't know how I post as scum. That includes this game, BTW
And I checked back. I said it was my least favorite post, not the worst post of the game. The former means I am getting stronger scum vibes. The later can easily be a town post. Not that it matters horribly, but just for clarification.
Fair enough, I tend to be a tad dramatic, so when you called my post "the worst thing that a human could write on the internet", I might have taken some artistic license.
1) Fair enough. In my experience though, scum are usually not the ones to pull semi-claims/mass claims. Those are typically town plays, despite being often see as fishing. I agree with you on the fact that I do not think that triggers narrow the game down. I still don't know why you bring up your trigger as scum sounding.
2) Not meta relevant as he can do it as either alignment, but Ghosting can be more aggressive/forceful/whatever word you want to use. It may not make him scum, but it sure as hell doesn't make him town.
3) I believe at least two people claimed they get abilities on a no-lynch. Mafia can't deal with them all. Also, how do you know the person wouldn't get the shot immediately and then use it before they die?
4) I hope you understand I can't actually take this point seriously.
Like seriously, here is my five minute impression of the game at this stage, just by looking at the player list and not rereading. Ignoring tom's slot for obvious reasons:
Vaimes: Not a great opening, halk of his posts have been just about tom.
Silver: Posting decently. Slight lean town read
Kosa: In this game?
Hunt: In this game? (I know one post he made was going to catch up, I am just emphasizing this as a point)
GJ: Obvious town
Mindreaver: Lean scum, see above.
Ghosting: Solid bleh, because he is posting awkwardly. Can't decide if TSTBS or if DV is right and he is just plain old scum
Shadow: In this game?
Cythare: Lols posting restriction
Scarbo: I admit I haven't been paying attention to him, seems null.
zomgarcwind: Null. I know Cythare keeps voting him, not sure why.
Jack: I know his name because people are voting him
lil4leaf: One post I recall, but it was a decent one. Lean town
Proph: Lols neutral
DV: Stronger town read
Soren: Lean town read
I want more people to become known to me. The people I haven't been paying attention to might change, but I find having a small pocket of people to work through helps me understand.
@cythare: Why ZOMG?
Unvote
Vote: Gentleman Johnny
probably not going to move my vote rest of the day
all aboard
Post 233. Bold move cotten, let's see if it pays off.
As a side note, I don't like when Seppel naked votes, but people tolerate it. I won't take it from you. Back that vote up, boy.
Mindreaver and GJ, you guys played together in GoldenEye, 'member?
@GJ: you're assuming that all of the players with no-lynch unlocks are town. I think that's a shaky assumption. Also, what about Mindreaver's tone seems scummy? It seems like his town!tone to me.
I feel like you're skipping past a lot of stuff and what you don't skip past is pretty basic.
I mean, it's clear I am focusing on a particular set of players as scum. Have to start somewhere after all.
You're focusing on this more than I'd expect. I'll admit it's been a while since I've played along with you, but I don't recall you usually pushing this hard. Also, didn't you literally just say that there's nothing more you can say regarding a No-Lynch? Also, your "anger" feels fabricated - presumably you were voting him because he hadn't shown up yet, and then stayed "angry" because he didn't immediately make content? I understand not wanting to let another player fly under the radar, but this reaction seems disproportionate.
New style, admitted it pre-game, doing it now. I intend to be much more aggressive than normal, and here I am. As far as Hunt goes, I just picked a 0 poster at random and decided to apply pressure until either A). That person posts more and I feel better or B). They don't make me feel better/are scum.
You unvote Huntzilla, then mention CFC/Tom in passing, then say you "might be fine" with the person you literally just voted.
Point blank, CFC would have been my next path had she not replaced out. I wasn't intending to stay on Hunt unless he posted horribly and scummy.
Waffly language. Also, I feel like you're missing something very important about what he said or are trying specifically to be obtuse about it.
My progression on Ghosting is pretty well established. If I had to go one side of the fence over the other, I would go town. But I have not been a huge fan of his last few posts.
1. He's acting very self-conscious.
2. He talked about no-lynching in the vein of "the game is designed for it".
3. He talked about the options for today being to either lynch a neutral or no lynch (he had mentioned initially that we have other options but then focuses on those two).
4. Related to that, he's focused on discussing those two options at the detriment of actually looking for scum.
The voting every post was seeming strange to me. But, wasn't he one of the claims that got his latent ability through no-lynching?
Tell me more.
Keep reading
Why is DV in your "no lynch" pile? Also, why should we be catering to you?
1). Because I am town.
2). Because it is my suggestion.
3). Because I am 1 of 6 players who are posting above the mod line (being atog + bur)
Quote from Jack »
This read list seems strange and comes off as selective reading since not sure how you don't know why people are voting Zomgarcwind and I'm only known for been voted. This read list could easily of been formed from just the first two pages of the game. Not saying you are not up to date but it just appears strange to me. I will agree though some people lack a presense in the game so far.
It was my list off simple memory. There are players I haven't been actively responding to that I have a read on.
Maybe i'm been dumb here and missed a reply to this but been annoying me for a while this. But what is the reverse of turning everyone vanilla, making sure everyone gets latent ability? Because that sounds like a strange role.
The people I haven't been paying attention to might change
like what does that even mean except "hey I'm scum"
It means I am not hardcore analyzing every single poster and their interactions, I am focusing on a few. Every single player in this game is doing it to a some extend. I don't see 16 replies to every point I make.
Mindreaver and GJ, you guys played together in GoldenEye, 'member?
@GJ: you're assuming that all of the players with no-lynch unlocks are town. I think that's a shaky assumption. Also, what about Mindreaver's tone seems scummy? It seems like his town!tone to me.
His posts come off incredibly self-conscious, especially the post about his trigger being scum sounding. Responded to no-lynch with a youtube link with a serious question, his calling DV's vote on me good, but being unclear of the motive. Those kind of things.
I feel like you're skipping past a lot of stuff and what you don't skip past is pretty basic.
I mean, it's clear I am focusing on a particular set of players as scum. Have to start somewhere after all.
Yes, but the reasons you're pulling out for focusing on them, as reflected in your "five minute impression" seem extremely flimsy. It looks to me like you're reaching to establish a set of players as scum rather than actually looking for scum. There's a difference and it's important.
You're focusing on this more than I'd expect. I'll admit it's been a while since I've played along with you, but I don't recall you usually pushing this hard. Also, didn't you literally just say that there's nothing more you can say regarding a No-Lynch? Also, your "anger" feels fabricated - presumably you were voting him because he hadn't shown up yet, and then stayed "angry" because he didn't immediately make content? I understand not wanting to let another player fly under the radar, but this reaction seems disproportionate.
New style, admitted it pre-game, doing it now. I intend to be much more aggressive than normal, and here I am. As far as Hunt goes, I just picked a 0 poster at random and decided to apply pressure until either A). That person posts more and I feel better or B). They don't make me feel better/are scum.
Your interpretation of aggressive seems to actually mean blowing things out of proportion and calling them scummy though. Also, wordy nitpick about this making it seem like you're going to stop applying pressure whether or not they make you feel better, but I know that's not what you mean.
Waffly language. Also, I feel like you're missing something very important about what he said or are trying specifically to be obtuse about it.
My progression on Ghosting is pretty well established. If I had to go one side of the fence over the other, I would go town. But I have not been a huge fan of his last few posts.
Ok, you did miss it, but you get to it towards the bottom of this post.
1. He's acting very self-conscious.
2. He talked about no-lynching in the vein of "the game is designed for it".
3. He talked about the options for today being to either lynch a neutral or no lynch (he had mentioned initially that we have other options but then focuses on those two).
4. Related to that, he's focused on discussing those two options at the detriment of actually looking for scum.
The voting every post was seeming strange to me. But, wasn't he one of the claims that got his latent ability through no-lynching?
Didn't you already address my voting when you said that you felt my "posting restriction was fake as *****"? And yes, he did say that his latent ability is unlocked this way. He's still talking about it to the detriment of actually doing town legwork, which is scummy.
Why is DV in your "no lynch" pile? Also, why should we be catering to you?
1). Because I am town.
2). Because it is my suggestion.
3). Because I am 1 of 6 players who are posting above the mod line (being atog + bur)
That answered...half of my questions...kind of. You skip past the DV part, and you know that I can't take you at your word for #1, #2 is contingent on #1, and #3 is bs, especially being only a few days in and given the surprising frequency of vote counts.
This read list seems strange and comes off as selective reading since not sure how you don't know why people are voting Zomgarcwind and I'm only known for been voted. This read list could easily of been formed from just the first two pages of the game. Not saying you are not up to date but it just appears strange to me. I will agree though some people lack a presense in the game so far.
It was my list off simple memory. There are players I haven't been actively responding to that I have a read on.
Then share these. Your "list" you provided looks, frankly, fake.
Maybe i'm been dumb here and missed a reply to this but been annoying me for a while this. But what is the reverse of turning everyone vanilla, making sure everyone gets latent ability? Because that sounds like a strange role.
Wait, did Ghosting ever claim neutral?
This is what I was getting at before about being obtuse/missing something about Ghosting. Also part of why I thought you were skimming.
Mindreaver and GJ, you guys played together in GoldenEye, 'member?
@GJ: you're assuming that all of the players with no-lynch unlocks are town. I think that's a shaky assumption. Also, what about Mindreaver's tone seems scummy? It seems like his town!tone to me.
His posts come off incredibly self-conscious, especially the post about his trigger being scum sounding. Responded to no-lynch with a youtube link with a serious question, his calling DV's vote on me good, but being unclear of the motive. Those kind of things.
There's a difference between being self-aware and self-conscious. Knowing that your trigger looks scummy is being self-aware, not self-conscious. Also, you only seem to care about naked votes on yourself.
And not super fond of zomg still hedging after I asked him to take a stance one way or the other.
... but scarbo might be on to something with the zomg/Proph interaction.
@zomg: Do you have any scumspects right now? If you're leaning towards not no-lynching, and don't want to lynch Proph, is there anyone you would be willing to lynch right now?
Mafia Stats 2016-2017:
Town: 1-0 | Scum: 2-0 | Neutral: 1-1
As much as I also think it would be awesome to unlock them all, I don't see that happening. I think it's just as likely that lynching will unlock abilities and no one is saying anything because that gets a little bit too specific about how your ability unlocks.
I think if we spend enough time hung up on how to play the game, we forget to actually work towards hunting scum. I think we can and should still pursue the course of action that ends in town victory, and count on our triggered abilities as they come up.
I'm in full favor of lynching, because that's how we actually beat the scum (barring some incredibly lucky vigilante) and I think no lynch is not going to help us. It's even possibly that the scum have a passive that triggers on no lynch too.
I mean, we don't really have any idea if they are even linked to the trigger. For instance, the no-lynch trigger might reward a double vote, to prevent further gridlock (or save a LyLo situation). I agree with zomg, the game is likely balanced around certain scenarios happening, and then balancing them out. But it's possible that it's not at all linked. A no-lynch might give us a doctor or a cop. I think this is less likely. I also think it was probably balanced around what would naturally happen in a game. So "gaming" the system with a day one no-lynch might not be as powerful as a day 7 no-lynch (if that ends up being the best play for us), even if you unlock the same ability.
Until we know more, I'd rather not continue to speculate. I also don't think we should be making choices, just to unlock powers.
@Silver - If it's making your nervous Unvote.
Vote zomgarcwind
I don't really like this line of questioning.
This is where I'm at too. If we incidentally unlock triggers over the course of the game, great. I don't want to go out of our way to unlock people's abilities at the detriment to the town gameplan.
Draft my cube! (630 cards)
Ghosting (2) - Lil4leafclover, D_V
zomgarcwind (2) - Jackrito, Cythare
Prophylaxis (1) - SorenBlade
Silvercrys3467 (1) - Kosakosa
Mindreaver (1) - Vaimes
Cythare (1) - Chandra's Fiery Cat
Huntzilla (1) - Gentleman Johnny
Not Voting (8) - Huntzilla, Ghosting, Prophylaxis, shadowlancerx, Silvercrys3467, Scarbo, Mindreaver, zomgarcwind
With 17 alive, it's 9 to lynch.
Deadline is Friday, October 7th, at 11:59 PM EST.
ive been reading along. you all seem scummy.
I'm so glad you replaced in, this game just got even better.
Mafia Stats 2016-2017:
Town: 1-0 | Scum: 2-0 | Neutral: 1-1
Vote: tomsloger
Vote zomgarcwind
This is an exciting change of events!
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---
akshalyurhfalisuhfaliwufywoi
hi tom
---
Mindreaver: Sorry, I was actually talking about posts in past games you've played with him.
Why exactly did you back off of Silver when you did? You said missing opportunities is NAI for you, but handling your vote the way you did is ???.
---
Okay, now that he's posted a bit more, please substantiate.
---
I'm getting weird feelings about [redacted] which I can't really explain right now, but I'm using this post to remind me to bring it up later.
Tone. But also,
I liked his #155 about Proph's claim and agree lynching scum is the plan, not lynching claimed neutrals that are unlikely to be lying. His #192 gels with my plan as well (lynch scum, don't no lynch or something just on the chance we get cool stuff), though he read zomg's post differently than I did.
I think we have similar views on the game state and that seems unlikely if he's scum.
As far as my vote, I'd forgotten I'd voted Silver until he mentioned it. He didn't say "stop voting me brah" but he wanted me to actually vote scum. In all honesty, I'd vote zomg, but was more interested to see who else would join that wagon, especially curious to see if it'd get to 5 votes. So I just unvoted. It's not really like it mattered either way.
But now I'ma gonna try something else. Vote Gentleman Johnny.
proph is telling the truth.
just had a massive scum qt with ghosting. i think hes town here.
vote jackrito
poke.
(I'll respond to the people who are talking to me when I'm not drinking o/)
Vote zomgarcwind
Yes!
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Vote zomgarcwind
That wasn't the smiley I wanted.
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I'm going to quote myself to resubmit this because I got one answer for this.
Towny points for him!
Also yay tom!
As far as town is concerned, I'm not sure if this is the best route. I think it opens up doors for scum to potentially narrow down who to kill more easily. For example, if they know I might unlock a latent soon, and think I might be the doctor, they're more likely to kill me knowing my latent is an easy unlock, then another player they think could also be doctor if their latent is significantly harder to unlock. Maybe none of this is what scum will think and I'm totally wrong, that's also a possibility.
Mafia Stats 2016-2017:
Town: 1-0 | Scum: 2-0 | Neutral: 1-1
Of course, I think this is a much safer route for town, but I don't think that it is really beneficial? It'll just mean that town has to make assumptions, and scum doesn't because they already know who are town and who are scum, so can just use that to their advantage. I could see scum trying to say "Oh well their ability activates with a no lynch, that further indicates they're scum!" or something like that. I can't think of a situation where town can really use the information to their advantage.
Mafia Stats 2016-2017:
Town: 1-0 | Scum: 2-0 | Neutral: 1-1
For instance, my trigger is shady as hell. Honestly, if I was to share it, I'd lynch me. Yeah, I could hide behind a safe "generic" soft claim, and say "Oh, it's vote based" (it's not) or some other nonsense. But I do not see how we use this information to A) Find Scum or B) Clear town. It seems the only benefit is to scum, to let them know exactly who has/has not been able to unlock powers yet (and by extension, make more efficient kills).
Town points for Ghosting, and scum points for D_V.
Least favorite post of the game so far above.
I also have to come to realize that if people get upgraded PRs from no lynching in an all PR game and STILL don't want to no-lynch, there is nothing else I can say in favor for it.
The GJ way path to no lynching:
CFC did no favors for the slot. tom replacing in is a giant pain in the ass as I find tom to be harder to read, if not more entertaning. Still lean scum on the slot and would be fine, but tom is making feel a teeny bit better. I might be fine with Mindreaver at this stage.
While I am not sold on Ghosting for scum, I am not impressed with him either. It will take some serious scum hunting from him later on to make me ok with the slot.
Cythare I assume is faking, as the last three times I played with a posting restriction, they were fake as *****. Apparently, Annorax's was real, but what are the odds Cythare got another one. Can also clearly move his vote, so not sure why ZOMG is his primary target, but maybe I need to look back.
Vaimes I am not impressed with either.
DV/Proph are the only two people in my no-lynch pile and one of them is a claimed neutral =/. I need to get more town reads, people should be posting more to make me feel better about them, as "town because I am reading four other people as scum" is not a great place to be.
The GJ way path to no lynching:
Besides "worst post in the game", what do you disagree with exactly?
The GJ way path to no lynching:
I don't necessarily agree or disagree with anything you said in that post. What made it bad was:
1) You eluded you have a shady trigger, mentioned it likely causes you to get lynched, and then didn't mention it. I don't know why either alignment would mention that, but the illogical ones for town would have still claimed the trigger. I am going to guess you are either an apprentice or a role that activates when a town PR dies. Might be the reverse of XDS game where instead of getting weaker when the enemy dies, you get stronger.
2) Ghosting is incredibly passive in that answer and seems like he is trying to convince himself the softclaim thing is bad, rather than stating the idea is bad. We already know about a third of the game's condition anyway and the scum don't actually care I would imagine. It doesn't effect their nk choices, as they still are hunting for either expirence or investigative/protective abilities.
3) If DV is scum, he is playing a remarkably good early game. The scum points for DV doesn't make sense unless you can explain why he comes at that plan from a scum perspective. Remember, he isn't asking for PRs, and some of us might not actually be PRs UNTIL the condition is met.
4) Your tone already had me leaning scum. I might ISO you later when I am feeling less lazy but you are in my realm for potential people to push. And we are only 223/224 posts in. There will be plenty of time to find a worse post, and more people need to post.
The GJ way path to no lynching:
Vaimes: Not a great opening, halk of his posts have been just about tom.
Silver: Posting decently. Slight lean town read
Kosa: In this game?
Hunt: In this game? (I know one post he made was going to catch up, I am just emphasizing this as a point)
GJ: Obvious town
Mindreaver: Lean scum, see above.
Ghosting: Solid bleh, because he is posting awkwardly. Can't decide if TSTBS or if DV is right and he is just plain old scum
Shadow: In this game?
Cythare: Lols posting restriction
Scarbo: I admit I haven't been paying attention to him, seems null.
zomgarcwind: Null. I know Cythare keeps voting him, not sure why.
Jack: I know his name because people are voting him
lil4leaf: One post I recall, but it was a decent one. Lean town
Proph: Lols neutral
DV: Stronger town read
Soren: Lean town read
I want more people to become known to me. The people I haven't been paying attention to might change, but I find having a small pocket of people to work through helps me understand.
@cythare: Why ZOMG?
The GJ way path to no lynching:
I don't want to claim it at this time, but I wanted to emphasize that I KNOW that we can't PoE scum down based on what the triggers are (which I think is part of D_V's plan).
Well, I didn't pick up on Ghosting's tone. I'll reread that I guess. But why come after me then? I'm not trying to convince myself :). It does affect their NK choices, and really obviously it does. If Player1 says "I get an ability when we no lynch" and then we no-lynch, they have MORE INFORMATION to make that choice. And yeah, maybe they don't give two *****s about Player1 and whatever random ability he happens to get. But without the softclaims, we would be in a better situation, because that information is hidden until the player decides to reveal. Somebody trying to cause scum WIFOM, like you did in your first few posts; should understand that the threat of vanillas becoming more powerful without notice is good for town. And yes, maybe that means they hunt for experience or PRs or are trying to manipulate relationships. But that's mafia.
I explained exactly why I didn't like what D_V was doing. He's asking for us to put triggers into the thread. That helps scum more than town. Therefore, I don't like what he's doing. Therefore, scum points for him and town points for Ghosting, who was against it (but as you said might have been hedging). "Remarkably good" is a strange characterization for a game, as you note, with less than 300 posts. Nobody is pinging me as obv!anything. And certainly nothing is remarkable.
Meh. I think you've seen me play a few games, but this is our first game together. I can't imagine you can read my tone with any accuracy. But you're right, it's early.
1). For you to know that, you would have to know that the mafia's. If you admit DV has a plan that is trying to narrow down PoE by trigger claim, why do you think that is scum? Maybe he's wrong, but it still sounds town reasoning.
2). " I'm not sure if this is the best route. I think it opens up doors for scum to potentially narrow down who to kill more easily"
Are you telling me you couldn't tell he sounded like he was asking a question more than just posting an opinion? Maybe I am biased as someone who works with high school students, but students that respond like that are guessing, trying to read your face if that is correct.
3). Triggers don't actually matter for the scum, unless they know which role gets activated. Nothing changes from the typical kill tier 0 roles first, expirenced players second, suspected high tier PRs third. Some scum mix two and three up.
4). I don't care about meta, and my tone comment had nothing to do with your previous games. Meta is horrible if you are self aware, and your comment about our first game makes it clear you are aware of how you post as town v scum.
And I checked back. I said it was my least favorite post, not the worst post of the game. The former means I am getting stronger scum vibes. The later can easily be a town post. Not that it matters horribly, but just for clarification.
The GJ way path to no lynching:
Honestly, I think that's just Ghosting's style. I'll admit it's not as forceful as I'd like. And he made two posts together with a clear evolution of thought. I'm not sure that's somebody trying to convince himself, and just something throwing out ideas as they come to him.
So you admit that suspected high tier PRs might be a target. Have you considered that a no-lynch trigger might grant a vig shot? That maybe scum would want that person dead, before they could use it? That by your own estimation, scum COULD use that info to suspect a power role and remove it, once triggered? I think this is making my case for me. We shouldn't give out any more info on what triggers a particular ability. That way the warning scum has when an ability is unlocked, is a bullet to the face, not a checklist they can look at and analyze.
I've never been scum, so I wouldn't know how I post as scum. That includes this game, BTW
Fair enough, I tend to be a tad dramatic, so when you called my post "the worst thing that a human could write on the internet", I might have taken some artistic license.
Unvote
Vote: Gentleman Johnny
probably not going to move my vote rest of the day
all aboard
Vote Gentleman Johnny
I feel like you're skipping past a lot of stuff and what you don't skip past is pretty basic.
You're focusing on this more than I'd expect. I'll admit it's been a while since I've played along with you, but I don't recall you usually pushing this hard. Also, didn't you literally just say that there's nothing more you can say regarding a No-Lynch? Also, your "anger" feels fabricated - presumably you were voting him because he hadn't shown up yet, and then stayed "angry" because he didn't immediately make content? I understand not wanting to let another player fly under the radar, but this reaction seems disproportionate.
You unvote Huntzilla, then mention CFC/Tom in passing, then say you "might be fine" with the person you literally just voted.
Waffly language. Also, I feel like you're missing something very important about what he said or are trying specifically to be obtuse about it.
About as good as anyone else getting it? Also, not being able to move my vote isn't the issue. About zomgarcwind specifically, I feel that I've been pretty clear.
1. He's acting very self-conscious.
2. He talked about no-lynching in the vein of "the game is designed for it".
3. He talked about the options for today being to either lynch a neutral or no lynch (he had mentioned initially that we have other options but then focuses on those two).
4. Related to that, he's focused on discussing those two options at the detriment of actually looking for scum.
Tell me more.
Why is DV in your "no lynch" pile? Also, why should we be catering to you?
Draft my cube! (630 cards)
1) Fair enough. In my experience though, scum are usually not the ones to pull semi-claims/mass claims. Those are typically town plays, despite being often see as fishing. I agree with you on the fact that I do not think that triggers narrow the game down. I still don't know why you bring up your trigger as scum sounding.
2) Not meta relevant as he can do it as either alignment, but Ghosting can be more aggressive/forceful/whatever word you want to use. It may not make him scum, but it sure as hell doesn't make him town.
3) I believe at least two people claimed they get abilities on a no-lynch. Mafia can't deal with them all. Also, how do you know the person wouldn't get the shot immediately and then use it before they die?
4) I hope you understand I can't actually take this point seriously.
5) Nothing wrong with being artistic.
Post 233. Bold move cotten, let's see if it pays off.
As a side note, I don't like when Seppel naked votes, but people tolerate it. I won't take it from you. Back that vote up, boy.
The GJ way path to no lynching:
@GJ: you're assuming that all of the players with no-lynch unlocks are town. I think that's a shaky assumption. Also, what about Mindreaver's tone seems scummy? It seems like his town!tone to me.
Oh that's easy.
like what does that even mean except "hey I'm scum"
I mean, it's clear I am focusing on a particular set of players as scum. Have to start somewhere after all.
New style, admitted it pre-game, doing it now. I intend to be much more aggressive than normal, and here I am. As far as Hunt goes, I just picked a 0 poster at random and decided to apply pressure until either A). That person posts more and I feel better or B). They don't make me feel better/are scum.
Point blank, CFC would have been my next path had she not replaced out. I wasn't intending to stay on Hunt unless he posted horribly and scummy.
My progression on Ghosting is pretty well established. If I had to go one side of the fence over the other, I would go town. But I have not been a huge fan of his last few posts.
The voting every post was seeming strange to me. But, wasn't he one of the claims that got his latent ability through no-lynching?
Keep reading
1). Because I am town.
2). Because it is my suggestion.
3). Because I am 1 of 6 players who are posting above the mod line (being atog + bur)
It was my list off simple memory. There are players I haven't been actively responding to that I have a read on.
Wait, did Ghosting ever claim neutral?
The GJ way path to no lynching:
It means I am not hardcore analyzing every single poster and their interactions, I am focusing on a few. Every single player in this game is doing it to a some extend. I don't see 16 replies to every point I make.
Also, give me a little more credit than that.
The GJ way path to no lynching:
His posts come off incredibly self-conscious, especially the post about his trigger being scum sounding. Responded to no-lynch with a youtube link with a serious question, his calling DV's vote on me good, but being unclear of the motive. Those kind of things.
The GJ way path to no lynching:
Vote Gentleman Johnny
Yes, but the reasons you're pulling out for focusing on them, as reflected in your "five minute impression" seem extremely flimsy. It looks to me like you're reaching to establish a set of players as scum rather than actually looking for scum. There's a difference and it's important.
Your interpretation of aggressive seems to actually mean blowing things out of proportion and calling them scummy though. Also, wordy nitpick about this making it seem like you're going to stop applying pressure whether or not they make you feel better, but I know that's not what you mean.
Ok, tell me more about what specifically you disliked about CFC that led to this conclusion.
Ok, you did miss it, but you get to it towards the bottom of this post.
Didn't you already address my voting when you said that you felt my "posting restriction was fake as *****"? And yes, he did say that his latent ability is unlocked this way. He's still talking about it to the detriment of actually doing town legwork, which is scummy.
This was about Vaimes, and your reasoning provided for this seems artificial and doesn't actually tell me anything more.
That answered...half of my questions...kind of. You skip past the DV part, and you know that I can't take you at your word for #1, #2 is contingent on #1, and #3 is bs, especially being only a few days in and given the surprising frequency of vote counts.
Then share these. Your "list" you provided looks, frankly, fake.
This is what I was getting at before about being obtuse/missing something about Ghosting. Also part of why I thought you were skimming.
Draft my cube! (630 cards)
Vote Gentleman Johnny
There's a difference between being self-aware and self-conscious. Knowing that your trigger looks scummy is being self-aware, not self-conscious. Also, you only seem to care about naked votes on yourself.
Draft my cube! (630 cards)
Gentleman Johnny (3) - Mindreaver, Scarbo, Cythare
Ghosting (2) - Lil4leafclover, D_V
Mindreaver (2) - Vaimes, Gentleman Johnny
zomgarcwind (1) - Jackrito
Prophylaxis (1) - SorenBlade
Silvercrys3467 (1) - Kosakosa
Jackrito (1) - tomsloger
Not Voting (6) - Huntzilla, Ghosting, Prophylaxis, shadowlancerx, Silvercrys3467, zomgarcwind
With 17 alive, it's 9 to lynch.
Deadline is Friday, October 7th, at 11:59 PM EST.