Mordred should almost never claim Percy to start. Morg can claim Percy because it makes the real Percy hesitant to counterclaim because it might actually be Merlin. Mordred can counterclaim the actual Percy, though. That's sort of how it's supposed to be anyway.
That said. GG folks. I do think Terry was a bit too obvious but I sort of lost track of why I thought he was scum and didn't have time to reread to remember.
Also he bussed the ***** out of D_V which kind of threw me.
Uhm. Mind I don't think I ever would have caught, to be honest. Cantrip I knew from spectating Overwatch, but it made me really paranoid of shadow again so. lol!me.
@DV: Hmm, ok...I retract some of my vitriol. That was actually nice thinking, and it seemed to work.
My strategy as Morgana was....practically non-existent to start with because I foolishly was in the mindset of playing Mafia. :/ I do not feel like I did a very good job this game. Other than being on at the right moment to opportunistically hammer.
@DV: Hmm, ok...I retract some of my vitriol. That was actually nice thinking, and it seemed to work.
My strategy as Morgana was....practically non-existent to start with because I foolishly was in the mindset of playing Mafia. :/ I do not feel like I did a very good job this game. Other than being on at the right moment to opportunistically hammer.
I'm not 100% certain it is right but there are only 2 on the town side that know I'm lying and I appear town to one of them. Its a strange thing to do as the only town scum.
So I was thinking how I would play Oberon....is the correct decision, if you are sent on a quest, to always vote Yes unless it would lose the game?
Hmm, maybe Merlin is Proph. But I'm still thinking Brin. Again, though, I guess Proph is more likely behaviorally, what with the whole replace request? Eh, I thought I saw something that made me think Proph wasn't...bah, my notetaking this game was bad.
This was my gut feeling. He was the only one to propose a passing quest. A couple things threw me on his reads though. I don't think Proph would have replaced out as Merlin.
So I was thinking how I would play Oberon....is the correct decision, if you are sent on a quest, to always vote Yes unless it would lose the game?
Hmm, maybe Merlin is Proph. But I'm still thinking Brin. Again, though, I guess Proph is more likely behaviorally, what with the whole replace request? Eh, I thought I saw something that made me think Proph wasn't...bah, my notetaking this game was bad.
yeah I think it is the way to play. because you have to have faith that your team knows more than you do, and you might screw up the plans. If we'd seen 2 fails on Q2 or Q1 for that matter, it would have been terrible.
meanwhile, if it HAD been say, Silver, that "two on Q3" would have been unstoppable.
Also, yeah failing Q3 was not done lightly. At the end I realized that it would be impossible to tell between Rhand/Me/Proph, and I thought I could push either one as scummy.
I thought D_V was Merlin when he claimed Percy, but. After we failed Q2 I was pretty sure it was Osi for the rest of the game until I realized he couldn't be town unless Brinatoo was.
Game is hard to solve, but that's good. Fun(tm).
I was kicking myself a bit because if Osi was Merlin and I had held onto that read we might have had a chance, but. He wasn't anyway, just had better reads than me.
This was my gut feeling. He was the only one to propose a passing quest. A couple things threw me on his reads though. I don't think Proph would have replaced out as Merlin.
(Ah, **** it. Iso and official confirmation be damned.)
You think I would've replaced out as a town investigative?
I'll give you few hints:
- I made 0 posts in this game
- I almost got prodded to hell until I replaced out
- I gave less than zero ****s about anything in this game
- [insert here whatever else belongs to my scum meta]
Guess twice what my/Brins role was.
I was Oberon
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Also modgaming Bur setups is kind of treading down a dark path
I thought D_V was Merlin when he claimed Percy, but. After we failed Q2 I was pretty sure it was Osi for the rest of the game until I realized he couldn't be town unless Brinatoo was.
Game is hard to solve, but that's good. Fun(tm).
I was kicking myself a bit because if Osi was Merlin and I had held onto that read we might have had a chance, but. He wasn't anyway, just had better reads than me.
Minus Shadow (which was admittedly at least somewhat sheeping your scumread).
Silver, you scared me the whole game, but I think I hid in a blindspot there. It's okay, I'll never be scum again
Mmhmm.
*Puts Mindreaver in his meta notes next to Tom and shadow.*
This is awesome.
Also, I almost said something about not adding Terry and just adding me, but oh well.
That was the original plan. I was like 97% certain Rhand was Merlin. When I floated out that possible Q4 I didn't expect to actually propose it. Rhand's support was what pushed it over for me.
That's super hilarious, actually, that he proposed a quest that would have passed and it got shot down.
Well, it would be if I wasn't the one who took an axe to it anyway.
I thought Cantrip or Silver was Merlin and Shadow was scum for most of the game.
Not sure what you're talking about. I am Merlin.
@Silver: Can I ask what about Overwatch clued you in on me?
@Osie: No kidding, your behavior turnaround from D1 to the rest of the game was night and day. You did a spectacular job of becoming a solid townie.
Eh, Proph spent a lot of time early on townreading me. Like, in detail. Same with Mindreaver. Eh, I don't have time to re-search for whatever I saw. Like I said, terrible notes this game.
I agree that not being able to vote yourself was a big change but pretty interesting. Not voting on proposals simultaneously and not being able to vote against your own proposal don't seem to have really offered new.
Speaking of which, I'm feeling pretty awesome with three games = three wins since I returned (even if this one wasn't significantly due to me). Gotta keep this streak going!
@Silver: Can I ask what about Overwatch clued you in on me?
You can ask, but. It wasn't anything specific, just that between the vote analysis I had and the fact I knew you could be town without, you know, being town I was pretty sure it was you.
Unfortunately I let that slip into my shadow read, too, even though that's not what lost us the game. If I had reevaluated shadow I would have pushed for Q3+shadow hard.
Really it was that unfortunate dichotomy between AG/Osi that convinced me Osi was scum that screwed my reads up at the end. I was really starting to think it was Oberon on Q3 so I never even thought about Oberon!Brinatoo.
Okay, serious post game cred grab right here:
Avalon
Town
Shadowlancerx
Vaimes
Silver
Osie?
AG
Rhand
Proph
Scum
Mindreaver
DV
Brin
Cantrip
JoeTerry
I can't believe I blew this
100% accurate and I fumbled everything
Eh, it's hard for me to see that as a failure on your part. You played a good game, and I think you would have had a ridiculous time convincing everyone of Mind, at minimum. Take some assurance from the knowledge that your instincts and reads were right, and use that to reinforce your future town play/confidence.
Okay, serious post game cred grab right here:
Avalon
Town
Shadowlancerx
Vaimes
Silver
Osie?
AG
Rhand
Proph
Scum
Mindreaver
DV
Brin
Cantrip
JoeTerry
I can't believe I blew this
100% accurate and I fumbled everything
Eh, it's hard for me to see that as a failure on your part. You played a good game, and I think you would have had a ridiculous time convincing everyone of Mind, at minimum. Take some assurance from the knowledge that your instincts and reads were right, and use that to reinforce your future town play/confidence.
I don't think I failed because I couldn't convince everyone, I failed because I tinfoiled away from the exact team I sent to iso for cred; again.
There were like 3 different times I went to post something to look townie and solved the game for town and hit delete. I'm pretty much the best player I know.
Yeah, I had AG and Shadow as very likely scum near end game, and Cantrip and Mindreaver as very likely town. That was a pretty big screw-up. Rhand kept creeping onto my scum radar.
I agree with Shadow. If Proph was Merlin, that's really annoying. It seems Proph wasn't near Mind's scope.
So the team we know, is D_V/Cantrip/Me/Terry. D_V being Mordred. I definitely didn't want him on Q1. and his Percy claim I was originally pissed at, but it took Vaimes right out of play (I'm really sad about that BTW, I think there were lines of play for you, but you're right that it was going to be tricky).
I'm so glad my gut was right about you being scum early on. You basically outlined my line of play. I barned the hell out of where I saw you developing your game.
I saw my proposal working out in three likely ways: being widely accepted and pushed, being widely rejected and denied, and being rejected while coupling me with my +1.
I weighed the pros/cons of each and saw the latter 2 being more likely given everyones view of me. Now since I had no idea on my team, I narrowed down my choice to Cantrip/Osie which I had a high suspicion one of them was deepscum but wasn't particularly sure which was which. If Osie was town/scum, my idea was that there would be enough force by my partners who were townread to push an agenda against it or for it (I was right )
My guess before gameover for who Merlin was was Osie or AG because there was a few instances from each where it felt like a "all-knowing" player.
I was very confused about why anyone thought that Terry was town.
Some of his wording late in the game sounded genuine. With you, D_V, Brinatoo and one of Proph/Rhand/Mindreaver as scum there would have to be 1 town in Terry/Cantrip and Cantrip was scummier.
Oh ya, Silver you arguing that shadow was scum is why I became so certain shadow was town. Your claim that shadow was playing the same way he was as scum made me realize that was just wrong and shadow was very different from how he'd played in Bare Bones.
Yeah, my shadow paranoia was... Well, it hasn't gone away yet.
And I still think it looks the same.
Didn't help that D_V was on the quest with him and I couldn't tell if he was scum or not either.
I'll probably just never be able to read shadow and have to deal with him the way I deal with tom, that is, you stay in the PoE forever because I can't trust you to be town when you sound town.
If we get too many of these I'll have to figure something else out.
Yeah, my shadow paranoia was... Well, it hasn't gone away yet.
And I still think it looks the same.
Didn't help that D_V was on the quest with him and I couldn't tell if he was scum or not either.
I'll probably just never be able to read shadow and have to deal with him the way I deal with tom, that is, you stay in the PoE forever because I can't trust you to be town when you sound town.
If we get too many of these I'll have to figure something else out.
I kinda like that, and it also kinda makes me sad
Though the fact that both Tom and I prefer playing scum might be an indicator here.
Yeah, my shadow paranoia was... Well, it hasn't gone away yet.
And I still think it looks the same.
Didn't help that D_V was on the quest with him and I couldn't tell if he was scum or not either.
I'll probably just never be able to read shadow and have to deal with him the way I deal with tom, that is, you stay in the PoE forever because I can't trust you to be town when you sound town.
If we get too many of these I'll have to figure something else out.
Shadow was conciliatory in Bare Bares and was trying to placate people. He was much more aggressive in this game.
Yeah, my shadow paranoia was... Well, it hasn't gone away yet.
And I still think it looks the same.
Didn't help that D_V was on the quest with him and I couldn't tell if he was scum or not either.
I'll probably just never be able to read shadow and have to deal with him the way I deal with tom, that is, you stay in the PoE forever because I can't trust you to be town when you sound town.
If we get too many of these I'll have to figure something else out.
Shadow was conciliatory in Bare Bares and was trying to placate people. He was much more aggressive in this game.
But my tone was the same, and silver got burned by my tone
That said. GG folks. I do think Terry was a bit too obvious but I sort of lost track of why I thought he was scum and didn't have time to reread to remember.
Also he bussed the ***** out of D_V which kind of threw me.
Uhm. Mind I don't think I ever would have caught, to be honest. Cantrip I knew from spectating Overwatch, but it made me really paranoid of shadow again so. lol!me.
My strategy as Morgana was....practically non-existent to start with because I foolishly was in the mindset of playing Mafia. :/ I do not feel like I did a very good job this game. Other than being on at the right moment to opportunistically hammer.
Wow.
You were the only one voting against all the quests that failed, though?
That was like. The entire reason I didn't post that vote analysis lol.
I'm not 100% certain it is right but there are only 2 on the town side that know I'm lying and I appear town to one of them. Its a strange thing to do as the only town scum.
Hmm, maybe Merlin is Proph. But I'm still thinking Brin. Again, though, I guess Proph is more likely behaviorally, what with the whole replace request? Eh, I thought I saw something that made me think Proph wasn't...bah, my notetaking this game was bad.
Also, I almost said something about not adding Terry and just adding me, but oh well.
meanwhile, if it HAD been say, Silver, that "two on Q3" would have been unstoppable.
Also, yeah failing Q3 was not done lightly. At the end I realized that it would be impossible to tell between Rhand/Me/Proph, and I thought I could push either one as scummy.
Game is hard to solve, but that's good. Fun(tm).
I was kicking myself a bit because if Osi was Merlin and I had held onto that read we might have had a chance, but. He wasn't anyway, just had better reads than me.
(Ah, **** it. Iso and official confirmation be damned.)
You think I would've replaced out as a town investigative?
I'll give you few hints:
- I made 0 posts in this game
- I almost got prodded to hell until I replaced out
- I gave less than zero ****s about anything in this game
- [insert here whatever else belongs to my scum meta]
Guess twice what my/Brins role was.
Minus Shadow (which was admittedly at least somewhat sheeping your scumread).
That was the original plan. I was like 97% certain Rhand was Merlin. When I floated out that possible Q4 I didn't expect to actually propose it. Rhand's support was what pushed it over for me.
Well, it would be if I wasn't the one who took an axe to it anyway.
@Silver: Can I ask what about Overwatch clued you in on me?
@Osie: No kidding, your behavior turnaround from D1 to the rest of the game was night and day. You did a spectacular job of becoming a solid townie.
Eh, Proph spent a lot of time early on townreading me. Like, in detail. Same with Mindreaver. Eh, I don't have time to re-search for whatever I saw. Like I said, terrible notes this game.
My money's still on Brin.
*shakes head*
So... it has to be Proph or Rhand, basically.
And it's obviously not Rhand or he wouldn't have voted for the quest, I hope.
100% accurate and I fumbled everything
Yeah, unfortunately I got slammed down in a 2-against-1 fight with AG and Shadow...
Speaking of which, I'm feeling pretty awesome with three games = three wins since I returned (even if this one wasn't significantly due to me). Gotta keep this streak going!
Unfortunately I let that slip into my shadow read, too, even though that's not what lost us the game. If I had reevaluated shadow I would have pushed for Q3+shadow hard.
Really it was that unfortunate dichotomy between AG/Osi that convinced me Osi was scum that screwed my reads up at the end. I was really starting to think it was Oberon on Q3 so I never even thought about Oberon!Brinatoo.
I agree with Shadow. If Proph was Merlin, that's really annoying. It seems Proph wasn't near Mind's scope.
I saw my proposal working out in three likely ways: being widely accepted and pushed, being widely rejected and denied, and being rejected while coupling me with my +1.
I weighed the pros/cons of each and saw the latter 2 being more likely given everyones view of me. Now since I had no idea on my team, I narrowed down my choice to Cantrip/Osie which I had a high suspicion one of them was deepscum but wasn't particularly sure which was which. If Osie was town/scum, my idea was that there would be enough force by my partners who were townread to push an agenda against it or for it (I was right )
My guess before gameover for who Merlin was was Osie or AG because there was a few instances from each where it felt like a "all-knowing" player.
Nope, I just got pocketed again and took an axe to the team that would have won us the game instead of holding on to my mid game reads.
Some of his wording late in the game sounded genuine. With you, D_V, Brinatoo and one of Proph/Rhand/Mindreaver as scum there would have to be 1 town in Terry/Cantrip and Cantrip was scummier.
And I still think it looks the same.
Didn't help that D_V was on the quest with him and I couldn't tell if he was scum or not either.
I'll probably just never be able to read shadow and have to deal with him the way I deal with tom, that is, you stay in the PoE forever because I can't trust you to be town when you sound town.
If we get too many of these I'll have to figure something else out.
Though the fact that both Tom and I prefer playing scum might be an indicator here.
Shadow was conciliatory in Bare Bares and was trying to placate people. He was much more aggressive in this game.
But now he'll know so I can't trust him anyway.