What you overlooked in my post was the collateral damage it will do to hamid if his bro gets nailed for possession, and he's implicated.
It's actually not that bad. I don't, and never really intend to smoke, but I have no problem with those that do.
It doesn't adversely affect those who smoke it, outside minor temporary mental lapse, and the occasional run-ins with the police. The truth is that several legal drugs are much worse than marijuana; see also, cigarettes and alcohol. In fact, it seems the government is beginning to understand this, as California is considering legalizing it.
I'd say to just let your brother go about his business, unless it's seriously and adversely affecting anyone.
Does anyone know what the legal ramifications of this are?
Pretty sure it depends on what the drug test is for. IE Work, Court, etc. I think the only time it would be "illegal" is if the person was taking one on the order of a judge.
I guess you could say my brother is one of those people who smoke regularly and hasn't really effected their life considering hes been smoking since high school.
I like this. I go out to the park to play basketball with some friends on a daily basis, maybe i could him to come. It could get him exercise and maybe i'll get him going on a topic (since he'll explain for hours) and have fun. But i don't think hes going to go out and take any archery lessons though, but its a great idea!
I mean its a great way to break the ice. The ice being, we've never talked about weed to each other.
the way you describe your brother's use of weed (daily user, but engaged and finished college) proves to me that he has no interest in replacing it with something else. It sounds like he just wants to go home, relax and then...relax a little more. I myself am an occasional smoker (once or twice a month and only if someone offers it to me, because I don't want to spend money on it.) In any case, I have a couple of friends who smoke everyday and if you asked them to go play baseball they'd most assuredly say, "yeah! let's smoke a bowl and go play baseball!" My point is that weed isn't the same as an extracurricular activity. It takes about 5 minutes and then you're in a bit of a different state of mind and you do whatever. It's not at all inhibiting unless you've smoked a completely unnecessary amount. It isn't dangerous in the least bit even when driving. It doesn't turn an obviously clear-headed individual like your brother into a baffoon. The legal repercussions seem to be the only real issue with smoking marijuana. (as someone pointed out that you're brother is far too mature for it to be a gateway drug.) Even so, I've spoken with police officers about marijuana. there are actually quite a few cops out there who will pay zero attention to possession of marijuana if it's obviously for personal use only. Now if you're brother is riding around with a pound of weed and selling it to people he's going to get busted hard, but the penalty for a nickel or dime bag is minimal.
Now, I used to be completely opposed to marijuana, and it was only a short time ago that I tried it for the first time (not even a year ago.) I used to try to get my friends to stop doing it all the time with absolutely no success. People are going to do what they want to do until given concrete reason why they should not be doing it. Pretty much all of the time, that concrete reason has to be discovered on a personal level. Basically, he's going to keep smoking weed until he realizes completely on his own that it's hurting him or someone else. Right now it's not hurting him and it's not really hurting anyone else except that you and your family don't agree with it (which hardly hurts.)
The bad news for you is that he's probably never going to run into a reason to stop smoking weed because of the lack of negative consequences (half the world smokes weed, it's not often that people get caught and if he's been smoking everyday since high school his chances of getting caught seem pretty low.) Anyway, the same thing applies to you. You're not going to change your mind about your brother smoking weed unless you come to the conclusion yourself that it doesn't really matter, which probably won't happen unless you actually try it yourself. It's really just a matter of who realizes what first, and your brother is pretty much winning that race with his laundry list of positives and your very miniscule negative list that consists only of "there's a small chance that you might receive a minor infraction by the local law enforcement."
as for the religious repercussions, the bible also says that you'll go to hell for working on sunday or being gay, not to denounce the bible, that's not my intent. I merely suggest that today's society doesn't function in terms of obscure passages from the bible.
all in all, whether or not your brother continues to smoke weed is completely his own decision and will ultimately stay that way. Nothing will sway him but his own desire. You can't scare him out of it and you certainly can't sap him out of it. Meanwhile, I'd suggest that you not bash on things you've never done or experienced. I know from personal experience that that way of thinking gets you nowhere but frustrated.
This is generally true, people who don't see the harm in something they do in moderation, most likely won't be swayed if they believe they can control the outcomes. The desire to quit has to come from within. either he might suddenly realize that it's hurting his family, or he might suddenly lose everything he's worked for and must quit to avoid it.
This is generally true, people who don't see the harm in something they do in moderation, most likely won't be swayed if they believe they can control the outcomes. The desire to quit has to come from within. either he might suddenly realize that it's hurting his family, or he might suddenly lose everything he's worked for and must quit to avoid it.
I've come to realize that my brother is a much "cooler" and nicer person when hes had some to smoke. His medicine gives him a short temper so the weed kinda neutralizes him i guess.
All I know now, is that I am fine with him smoking as long as he doesn't do it front of me or any of my friends or co-workers. It doesn't seem to be effecting his life to much except i don't know where he's getting the money to buy all this weed from. Could be from his student loans...
All I know now, is that I am fine with him smoking as long as he doesn't do it front of me or any of my friends or co-workers. It doesn't seem to be effecting his life to much except i don't know where he's getting the money to buy all this weed from. Could be from his student loans...
That's probably the best approach to take right now. As long his smoking doesn't cause any problems for you, there's no real need to get confrontational with him about it (you disapproving of it and it causing problems for you are two very different things).
If he ever gets to a point where he's consistently neglecting responsibilities just so he can get high, then he's having a problem that he may not be able to control on his own - and you might want to approach him about that. But if he seems to have everything under control, there's no immediate concern for his welfare just because he smokes pot.
I really don't see a big deal with smoking weed. I don't smoke it, nor have I ever smoked it, but really, there are far-worse habits that someone can pick up. Like any habit, its only bad when out of moderation. That goes for any pleasurable activity, such as eating, sex, alcohol, smoking, and work.
But really, I could never buy the whole religious deal combined with being a pothead. I've met similar people before, and I just found it absurb. IMHO, you gotta pick one or another. Same thing with drinking and hardcore partying. Its like being a drunken fish and being a member of MADD at the same time. No one is going to extend any credibility towards your convictions.
this is awsomely funny. The dude is 26 still lives at home and is waking his younger brother up by smoking pot. This guy sounds like a huge loser to me. Especially when hes trying to defend himself by saying its not addicting. If thats the case why is his getting high at the crack of dawn. I mean this kid sounds like the stuff they tell you in school so you wont strt doing drugs.
Why dont your parents just kick him out. Hes an adult and hes not following your parents wish. They should tell him to hit the curb, its really that simple. And once he's on his own he can do wheatever he wants. But im sure that wont happen because Im sure this guy has complete controll over the houshold. Thats why hes been getting high in his parents house since high school and he still lives there at 26. Im sure his parents have 0 control over him, which I think is really sad.
And yes I did read most of the posts and yes I think no one drug is "better" or "worse" to do. If its either junk or pot its all the same to me. Ok with that said ...FLAME ON!
My God, you just pin-pointed my cousin's lie. He's a total loser. Also, I didn't quit the grass altogether. I just don't smoke as much as I used to. But I do remember having great times playing Magic stoned as hell.
Like any habit, its only bad when out of moderation.
Or when it's, you know, illegal.
All I know now, is that I am fine with him smoking as long as he doesn't do it front of me or any of my friends or co-workers.
So what exactly the thread initially about? I'm not trying to be rude, but I was always operating under the assumption that his smoking was currently harming himself or the family in some way.
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Our government has lost all credibility on the subjects of morality and legality when they are handing out bailouts to whoever they want. Alcohol is way more dangerous than weed, but they don't criminalize it because of how Prohibition turned out. Really, the whole War on Drugs is just a cozy government-business cooperative; a prison-industrial complex. Its there to make money, not keep order or police society's morals.
In short, don't worry about the Man tells you to do. Be prepared to do the time if you get caught and can't beat the charges in court, but just because something is illegal doesn't mean its bad.
While I whole heartedly agree with you on the majority of you post, this is part is incorrect I believe. The "War on Drugs" has been an economic drain since the 80's when it was first put into effect. It created inefficient government programs that drain tax payers money. It criminalizes something that multiple scientific studies have concluded pose no real threat to the way your body works and your judgment. This in turn send countless people to jail, which costs tax payer money to provide for their health, food, clothing, extra security guards, etc. This is all before you get into how much the government could make if they legalized and taxed it.
And all you nay-sayers and doom-tellers out there should take a look at this (here's looking at you Maverick827)
But I digress. If you want to reach your brother, the best way to go about it is to let your feelings known, but don't smother him with it. If he wants/needs to quit, it has to come of his accord. Interventions rarely if ever work. My father smoked cigarettes for roughly 30 years. I would constantly nag him to try and get him to quit, but all it did was create tension in our relationship. It was only when he decided that he wanted to quit that he was able to. It's been about 5 months now since he's had a cigarette.
You should be clear on the issue though, you can't beat around the subject or speak about it in a joking way. If your brother tries to make light of the issue, simply say "I don't see this is as humorously as you, and I am genuinely concerned about well being". Above all else, do not be rude or forceful in your tone.That is the quickest bridge burning you could cause between the two of you.
Our government has lost all credibility on the subjects of morality and legality when they are handing out bailouts to whoever they want.
And those who illegally buy and smoke marijuana have lost all credibility on the subjects of morality and legality when they took it upon themselves to decide which laws are "ok" and which laws they can blatantly break. See, I can do it, too!
And all you nay-sayers and doom-tellers out there should take a look at this (here's looking at you Maverick827)
I fail to see how that is a rebuke to anything I have said.
My point:
Even though you feel there is nothing bad or negative associated with marijuana, the fact remains it is still illegal, and there can be negative ramifications for buying/using it. This, alone, is reason enough for one to wish that their friends or family not partake in the substance.
Furthermore, I question the morality/validity/etc. of the notion: "well, it's a stupid law, so I can break it!" in association to what is almost always an entirely recreational activity and never an "undeniable human right."
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While I whole heartedly agree with you on the majority of you post, this is part is incorrect I believe. The "War on Drugs" has been an economic drain since the 80's when it was first put into effect. It created inefficient government programs that drain tax payers money. It criminalizes something that multiple scientific studies have concluded pose no real threat to the way your body works and your judgment. This in turn send countless people to jail, which costs tax payer money to provide for their health, food, clothing, extra security guards, etc. This is all before you get into how much the government could make if they legalized and taxed it.
Sorry my post was ambiguous. The War on Drugs IS there to make money: for the prison system and all of the contractors that go along with it (construction, food services, etc.) . Its there to give cozy government jobs to politicians' friends. Its not there to make money for the benefit of taxpayers, but it is there to make money for the benefit of a select few. Its just robbing from the taxpayers with no discernible benefit to anyone, except, as I said before, members of the prison-industrial complex.
And Maverick, its perfectly okay to break stupid laws.
Hell, Martin Luther King and Gandhi did it all the time. They got put in jail for it too. Its called "civil disobedience."
Really, as long as you're following the 10 commandments (or any permutation thereof that other religious groups have, it doesn't matter), you're in the green. Don't worry about other stupid crap that the government imposes on you. Just be prepared to do the time if you get caught.
nd Maverick, its perfectly okay to break stupid laws.
Hell, Martin Luther King and Gandhi did it all the time. They got put in jail for it too. Its called "civil disobedience."
Human equality != weed.
I'm sorry, but those two are on entirely different levels. Enough so that their comparison is entirely asinine.
However, I would like to explore the following:
as long as you're following the 10 commandments
What makes you believe in the 10 commandments more so than anti-marijuana laws?
Why are they more "valid" in your eyes (as far as laws go, because if you religiously believe in the 10 commands yet smoke weed, then contradictory argument is fail)?
How does one define what a "stupid law" is?
Is this definition flexible?
Is it even up to you, personally, to decide what this county's laws are? If so, do you feel simply breaking them is the proper course of action to rectifying the problem?
What is to stop someone from feeling "anti-muder" laws are "stupid?" Randomly and blatantly killing someone may be wrong, but surely a man's revenge on his daughter's rapist-gone-free is as logical as ignoring marijuana laws because it doesn't harm anyone in any way*, right?
*though it does, as evident by many links in this thread.
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I'm nerd enough to link my WoW Armory Though I'll put it in a small font.
For me, a law that bans something that harms nobody except the person doing it is a "stupid law." In my opinion, laws should be there to protect people from other people, not from themselves.
What is to stop someone from feeling "anti-muder" laws are "stupid?" Randomly and blatantly killing someone may be wrong, but surely a man's revenge on his daughter's rapist-gone-free is as logical as ignoring marijuana laws because it doesn't harm anyone in any way*, right?
Harming other people is different than doing something that harms nobody except potentially oneself.
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Harming other people is different than doing something that harms nobody except potentially oneself.
But hasn't this thread proven that it can harm someone else? Family members, friends, etc.?
Just because the OP has changed his mind, doesn't mean that someone in a similar situation yet with a more...destructive sibling/friend would be so peachy with some of the given responses.
While many discount the "gateway drug" theory, it is an undeniable truth that some people simply cannot and should not smoke weed. Some people do harm themselves and others because of the drug, and who exactly is it up to to decide whether or not it is dire enough to ban or legalize?
Is it you? And if so, again, is the proper course of action to blatantly break the law? What does that say about your character?
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@ Mav alcohol and most food now a days is really bad for u but is it against the law? As far as u keep saying its against the law people have the faculty of reason to decide what is good and bad for themselves. If i do something illegal cause I don't think the law is a good one then I'll deal with the consequences if caught. It's not as if no one knows what will happen if he got caught. As far as it can hurt someone else thing well it can but so can alot of legal stuff so I fail 2 see your point.
I fully support the prohibition of alcohol, but it's far too entrenched in society (as seen by previous action against it) for such a dream to happen. Right now we already have illegal marijuana, so it's at least worth fighting for (preserving the illegality, that is).
most food now a days is really bad for u but is it against the law?
Trans fats are banned in quite a few portions of the country. Even still, it's not a very apt comparison. For every minor way you could argue how trans fats affect more than just who is consuming them, I could argue two infinitely more legitimate ways marijuana/alcohol affects everyone but the consumer.
As far as u keep saying its against the law people have the faculty of reason to decide what is good and bad for themselves. If i do something illegal cause I don't think the law is a good one then I'll deal with the consequences if caught. It's not as if no one knows what will happen if he got caught.
This line of thinking - that is, the conscious and unrequited disregard for society's laws put into place to protect others - is borderline if not exactly what is called "antisocial personality disorder," or sociopathy.
As far as it can hurt someone else thing well it can but so can alot of legal stuff so I fail 2 see your point.
The legal applications of smoking marijuana are not within the domain of the discussion about their illegal consumption.
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I'm nerd enough to link my WoW Armory Though I'll put it in a small font.
Alcohol isn't bad for you unless you consume large quantities a lot.
Marijuana really has a few consequences worth thinking about:
slower thinking, however it should be noted this seems to *heal* itself within 6 months of quitting the green. Slightly reduced lung capacity, however someone whose smoked cigs for a year will see more reduced lung capacity than someone whose smoked weed for 15 (watch super high me...) so this really is a mute issue. It may also cause cancer, but this isn't proven and seriously: what DOESN'T contribute to cancer now a-days?
The other 2 things I think worth considering are:
1: it makes you lazy which may lead to increased weight and decreased fitness levels.
2: will affect your daily life, ie: you can't drive, can get fired, jail time, etc (unless you live in CA or another state where you can legally have mj as long as you have the required license)
I personally find it retarded that we waste taxpayer money pressing charges against and punishing people who deal or smoke mj. Let it be allowed, and tax the sale of the green and use all the extra money to combat real problems, like meth... If the federal gov't would follow CA's idea, they would have made over a billion extra $$$ just taxing the sale of mj in that one state.
This line of thinking - that is, the conscious and unrequited disregard for society's laws put into place to protect others - is borderline if not exactly what is called "antisocial personality disorder," or sociopathy.
The legal applications of smoking marijuana are not within the domain of the discussion about their illegal consumption.
Right, because blindly following what lawmakers tell you do is asignofmentalhealth.
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I fully support the prohibition of alcohol, but it's far too entrenched in society (as seen by previous action against it) for such a dream to happen. Right now we already have illegal marijuana, so it's at least worth fighting for (preserving the illegality, that is).
Trans fats are banned in quite a few portions of the country. Even still, it's not a very apt comparison. For every minor way you could argue how trans fats affect more than just who is consuming them, I could argue two infinitely more legitimate ways marijuana/alcohol affects everyone but the consumer. (The ways everyone but the consumer is hurt here only arise BECAUSE its illegal, still a point, but not in this specific argument)
This line of thinking - that is, the conscious and unrequited disregard for society's laws put into place to protect others - is borderline if not exactly what is called "antisocial personality disorder," or sociopathy.You're overreacting here on purpose
The legal applications of smoking marijuana are not within the domain of the discussion about their illegal consumption. no progress can be made towards legalizing it without making these assumptions. While thats not what this argument is about, its clearly brought about by its supporters goals...ie legalization. Also, I believe that this argument is somewhat indirectly related as it brings to light peoples feelings on the severity of the action.
I get the feeling you're looking for someone to say this. You are absolutely right in that the green is illegal, there is no way around this argument for those living under that law. But as far as sociopathy goes, a lot of people are gonna look at it on a completely different level. In the same way that there is first degree murder and second degree murder, there are different laws to break. Its not just the difference between a felony and a misdemeanor. A person will guage, this is what breaking the law does for me, this is what it will cost me if I get caught, the odds of me getting caught are, is it even just that I be punished for this? All of these calculations are made, and soooooo many people have come to the conclusion its worth it.
If you asked a constant drinker, I'm sure he'll tell you how bad alcohal can be, with a few good examples off the top of his head. Yet 99/100 pot smokers are gonna write off the benefits one by one. Don't you think that alone speaks for itself? Even the naysayers generally can call off multiple benefits when asked about weed and the downsides are MUCH LESS severe and much less common than any comparable illegal substance. I don't think I'm exaggerating when I say you're more likely to hurt yourself with 99.9% of the drugs that can be sold over the counter at your local pharmacy than with marijuana.
I'm not going with a technical standpoint, weed is illegal, but at the same time, is there any other substance thats got quite the same amount of backing pushing it towards legalization? Does that account for nothing?
I'm not going with a moral standpoint, weed can break people apart, but at the same time this is generally simply caused by a misunderstanding. Marijuana can be confused with a crutch, an addiction, or just a presence with a bad connotation, when it can be nothing more than a recreational activity or enhancer. Believe what you want about addictions, any physiological or pscyhological dependence boils down to the person. If weed set that off, the problems were already inherant in the person. Its not going to make a new person out of them.
I'm not going with a medical standpoing, list all the downsides you'd like, but any potsmoker has probably heard them, at least in passing, and the downsides still don't outweigh the benefits to that person.
The standpoint here is I feel that weed deserves its own podium. Its too unlike all that most people try to compare it to. To one person breaking the law to smoke weed is completely different than say doing heroin. But to another it may be deserving of 10 years in prison for such an atrocious act. The most directly link I can draw here is that weed can affect a person in much the same way. It can cause a perfectly functioning human being to....function fine. It can also cause them to become paranoid or lazy. If I had to compare it to anything, my opinion is its more like an allergy. If I was allergic to chocolate, say, my skin started to break out and became itchy in this case. I'd probably stop eating chocolate. Now lets say I really really like chocolate, now all of a sudden I'm doing the math... is Delicous > itching? And that's what It'll boil down to. If weed makes you paranoid or unable to function, its like an allergy, what are you gonna do about it. Odds are you should stop if you're getting a lot of negative feedback, but if you're not, then I'm sure you're weighing the +/- and came to a decision of your own. The math formula may be a little more erratic, say Getting High + Relaxing > Paranoia + Family Hates it + (illegal x odds of getting caught). And if the equation ever gets dangerous or tips the other way, then the person should by all means quit.
The "Weed equation" is different than alcohal or cocaine in that theres not really an "addiction multiplyer" except in extreme cases. These are extreme cases in the same way that a serial killer is an extreme individual. Don't judge the rule by exceptions. Marijuana is not addictive though a few individuals became addicted to it. The lottery is not winnable as far as I'm concerned but some people will win it...These are odds I'm willing to take...
finally to the OP:
you don't have to put up with it, you are in complete control, you can call on the parents to do something about it, his friends/teacher/boss, or even the police
When all is said and done, with a clean concious you can say that he was the one who burned all the bridges, after all what he did was illegal.
I noticed you didn't resort to that and good for you that you can talk with your brother openly, it really just boils down to how much it means to you, not him. There's nothing wrong with telling him how you feel, and while the decision to quit or continue his own, your feelings may just be enough to tip the scale one way or the other. Who knows, he may have actually been on the fence the whole time and didn't show it. And I can contest to that scale going both ways, I've known people who've smoked years at a time have a bad trip (believe it or not) or some big happening and they decided to quit instantly. More power to them, but I chalk it up to more proof that marijuana is very unlikely/rarely to lead to addiction. Its about as addicting as elmer's glue...but lets face it, you had much lower hopes for the kids that sniffed glue, but you dont put "glue user" on their permanent record, you just write "special" and send em on to the next grade.
However, I would like to explore the following:
What makes you believe in the 10 commandments more so than anti-marijuana laws?
Why are they more "valid" in your eyes (as far as laws go, because if you religiously believe in the 10 commands yet smoke weed, then contradictory argument is fail)?
How does one define what a "stupid law" is?
In my opinion, the best standard to judge the validity of a statute is to see if it bans either a natural crime or a vice. I will quote Lysander Spooner's definition and and method of distinguishing between the two as he is far more eloquent than I am:
"Vices are those acts by which a man harms himself or his property. Crimes are those acts by which one man harms the person or property of another.
Vices are simply the errors which a man makes in his search after his own happiness. Unlike crimes, they imply no malice toward others, and no interference with their persons or property.
In vices, the very essence of crime --- that is, the design to injure the person or property of another --- is wanting.
It is a maxim of the law that there can be no crime without a criminal intent; that is, without the intent to invade the person or property of another. But no one ever practises a vice with any such criminal intent. He practises his vice for his own happiness solely, and not from any malice toward others.
Unless this clear distinction between vices and crimes be made and recognized by the laws, there can be on earth no such thing as individual right, liberty, or property; no such things as the right of one man to the control of his own person and property, and the corresponding and coequal rights of another man to the control of his own person and property.
For a government to declare a vice to be a crime, and to punish it as such, is an attempt to falsify the very nature of things. It is as absurd as it would be to declare truth to be falsehood, or falsehood truth."
the counter-argument goes though...what happens when a vice begins to indirectly cause damage to another man? This is where the law steps in...to keep the guys with kinky vices in check. ALSO alcohol and the like distorts a person's ability to differentiate between vices and crimes, and influences the judgement into perhaps committing a crime, its here that the law steps in to stop a crime prematurely and I don't fault them for that
counter counter: From experience and asking around, I don't believe that marijuana inhibits your judgement to that degree, er-go, tis a vice d( '.' )b
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Don't sweat the petty things and don't pet the sweaty things.
Right, because blindly following what lawmakers tell you do is asignofmentalhealth.
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'nam is not condusive towards weed. Following the laws of the land are obviously not to the letter, anyone with any basic understanding of sociopolitical thought understands that.
The major difference between weed and 'nam, is that weed you can abstain from and engage in legal activities such as alcohol and sex. Which have medical benefits when restraint and precautions are taken. 'Nam you actually had to go if you were male and drafted. Frankly, a healthy skepticism of society is a major part of modern western thinking for a while now by academics to laymen.
However, weed is banned for good reasons. Yet, there are enough strong merits to legalize it. 'Nam was just an abomination of Wilsonianism.
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Ambition must be made to counteract ambition.
Individualities may form communities, but it is institutions alone that can create a nation.
Nothing succeeds like the appearance of success.
Here is my principle: Taxes shall be levied according to ability to pay. That is the only American principle.
My point was that lawmakers caused all of the terrible things that I linked to happen. I was trying to debate Mavrick's comment of "conscious and unrequited disregard for society's laws put into place to protect others - is borderline if not exactly what is called "antisocial personality disorder," or sociopathy" not compare Vietnam to smoking pot.
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It's actually not that bad. I don't, and never really intend to smoke, but I have no problem with those that do.
It doesn't adversely affect those who smoke it, outside minor temporary mental lapse, and the occasional run-ins with the police. The truth is that several legal drugs are much worse than marijuana; see also, cigarettes and alcohol. In fact, it seems the government is beginning to understand this, as California is considering legalizing it.
I'd say to just let your brother go about his business, unless it's seriously and adversely affecting anyone.
Pretty sure it depends on what the drug test is for. IE Work, Court, etc. I think the only time it would be "illegal" is if the person was taking one on the order of a judge.
the way you describe your brother's use of weed (daily user, but engaged and finished college) proves to me that he has no interest in replacing it with something else. It sounds like he just wants to go home, relax and then...relax a little more. I myself am an occasional smoker (once or twice a month and only if someone offers it to me, because I don't want to spend money on it.) In any case, I have a couple of friends who smoke everyday and if you asked them to go play baseball they'd most assuredly say, "yeah! let's smoke a bowl and go play baseball!" My point is that weed isn't the same as an extracurricular activity. It takes about 5 minutes and then you're in a bit of a different state of mind and you do whatever. It's not at all inhibiting unless you've smoked a completely unnecessary amount. It isn't dangerous in the least bit even when driving. It doesn't turn an obviously clear-headed individual like your brother into a baffoon. The legal repercussions seem to be the only real issue with smoking marijuana. (as someone pointed out that you're brother is far too mature for it to be a gateway drug.) Even so, I've spoken with police officers about marijuana. there are actually quite a few cops out there who will pay zero attention to possession of marijuana if it's obviously for personal use only. Now if you're brother is riding around with a pound of weed and selling it to people he's going to get busted hard, but the penalty for a nickel or dime bag is minimal.
Now, I used to be completely opposed to marijuana, and it was only a short time ago that I tried it for the first time (not even a year ago.) I used to try to get my friends to stop doing it all the time with absolutely no success. People are going to do what they want to do until given concrete reason why they should not be doing it. Pretty much all of the time, that concrete reason has to be discovered on a personal level. Basically, he's going to keep smoking weed until he realizes completely on his own that it's hurting him or someone else. Right now it's not hurting him and it's not really hurting anyone else except that you and your family don't agree with it (which hardly hurts.)
The bad news for you is that he's probably never going to run into a reason to stop smoking weed because of the lack of negative consequences (half the world smokes weed, it's not often that people get caught and if he's been smoking everyday since high school his chances of getting caught seem pretty low.) Anyway, the same thing applies to you. You're not going to change your mind about your brother smoking weed unless you come to the conclusion yourself that it doesn't really matter, which probably won't happen unless you actually try it yourself. It's really just a matter of who realizes what first, and your brother is pretty much winning that race with his laundry list of positives and your very miniscule negative list that consists only of "there's a small chance that you might receive a minor infraction by the local law enforcement."
as for the religious repercussions, the bible also says that you'll go to hell for working on sunday or being gay, not to denounce the bible, that's not my intent. I merely suggest that today's society doesn't function in terms of obscure passages from the bible.
all in all, whether or not your brother continues to smoke weed is completely his own decision and will ultimately stay that way. Nothing will sway him but his own desire. You can't scare him out of it and you certainly can't sap him out of it. Meanwhile, I'd suggest that you not bash on things you've never done or experienced. I know from personal experience that that way of thinking gets you nowhere but frustrated.
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I've come to realize that my brother is a much "cooler" and nicer person when hes had some to smoke. His medicine gives him a short temper so the weed kinda neutralizes him i guess.
All I know now, is that I am fine with him smoking as long as he doesn't do it front of me or any of my friends or co-workers. It doesn't seem to be effecting his life to much except i don't know where he's getting the money to buy all this weed from. Could be from his student loans...
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That's probably the best approach to take right now. As long his smoking doesn't cause any problems for you, there's no real need to get confrontational with him about it (you disapproving of it and it causing problems for you are two very different things).
If he ever gets to a point where he's consistently neglecting responsibilities just so he can get high, then he's having a problem that he may not be able to control on his own - and you might want to approach him about that. But if he seems to have everything under control, there's no immediate concern for his welfare just because he smokes pot.
But really, I could never buy the whole religious deal combined with being a pothead. I've met similar people before, and I just found it absurb. IMHO, you gotta pick one or another. Same thing with drinking and hardcore partying. Its like being a drunken fish and being a member of MADD at the same time. No one is going to extend any credibility towards your convictions.
My God, you just pin-pointed my cousin's lie. He's a total loser. Also, I didn't quit the grass altogether. I just don't smoke as much as I used to. But I do remember having great times playing Magic stoned as hell.
So what exactly the thread initially about? I'm not trying to be rude, but I was always operating under the assumption that his smoking was currently harming himself or the family in some way.
Though I'll put it in a small font.
Please stop hijacking my reply box.
Our government has lost all credibility on the subjects of morality and legality when they are handing out bailouts to whoever they want. Alcohol is way more dangerous than weed, but they don't criminalize it because of how Prohibition turned out. Really, the whole War on Drugs is just a cozy government-business cooperative; a prison-industrial complex. Its there to make money, not keep order or police society's morals.
In short, don't worry about the Man tells you to do. Be prepared to do the time if you get caught and can't beat the charges in court, but just because something is illegal doesn't mean its bad.
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While I whole heartedly agree with you on the majority of you post, this is part is incorrect I believe. The "War on Drugs" has been an economic drain since the 80's when it was first put into effect. It created inefficient government programs that drain tax payers money. It criminalizes something that multiple scientific studies have concluded pose no real threat to the way your body works and your judgment. This in turn send countless people to jail, which costs tax payer money to provide for their health, food, clothing, extra security guards, etc. This is all before you get into how much the government could make if they legalized and taxed it.
And all you nay-sayers and doom-tellers out there should take a look at this (here's looking at you Maverick827)
But I digress. If you want to reach your brother, the best way to go about it is to let your feelings known, but don't smother him with it. If he wants/needs to quit, it has to come of his accord. Interventions rarely if ever work. My father smoked cigarettes for roughly 30 years. I would constantly nag him to try and get him to quit, but all it did was create tension in our relationship. It was only when he decided that he wanted to quit that he was able to. It's been about 5 months now since he's had a cigarette.
You should be clear on the issue though, you can't beat around the subject or speak about it in a joking way. If your brother tries to make light of the issue, simply say "I don't see this is as humorously as you, and I am genuinely concerned about well being". Above all else, do not be rude or forceful in your tone.That is the quickest bridge burning you could cause between the two of you.
I fail to see how that is a rebuke to anything I have said.
My point:
Even though you feel there is nothing bad or negative associated with marijuana, the fact remains it is still illegal, and there can be negative ramifications for buying/using it. This, alone, is reason enough for one to wish that their friends or family not partake in the substance.
Furthermore, I question the morality/validity/etc. of the notion: "well, it's a stupid law, so I can break it!" in association to what is almost always an entirely recreational activity and never an "undeniable human right."
Though I'll put it in a small font.
Please stop hijacking my reply box.
Sorry my post was ambiguous. The War on Drugs IS there to make money: for the prison system and all of the contractors that go along with it (construction, food services, etc.) . Its there to give cozy government jobs to politicians' friends. Its not there to make money for the benefit of taxpayers, but it is there to make money for the benefit of a select few. Its just robbing from the taxpayers with no discernible benefit to anyone, except, as I said before, members of the prison-industrial complex.
And Maverick, its perfectly okay to break stupid laws.
Hell, Martin Luther King and Gandhi did it all the time. They got put in jail for it too. Its called "civil disobedience."
Really, as long as you're following the 10 commandments (or any permutation thereof that other religious groups have, it doesn't matter), you're in the green. Don't worry about other stupid crap that the government imposes on you. Just be prepared to do the time if you get caught.
I'm sorry, but those two are on entirely different levels. Enough so that their comparison is entirely asinine.
However, I would like to explore the following:
What makes you believe in the 10 commandments more so than anti-marijuana laws?
Why are they more "valid" in your eyes (as far as laws go, because if you religiously believe in the 10 commands yet smoke weed, then contradictory argument is fail)?
How does one define what a "stupid law" is?
Is this definition flexible?
Is it even up to you, personally, to decide what this county's laws are? If so, do you feel simply breaking them is the proper course of action to rectifying the problem?
What is to stop someone from feeling "anti-muder" laws are "stupid?" Randomly and blatantly killing someone may be wrong, but surely a man's revenge on his daughter's rapist-gone-free is as logical as ignoring marijuana laws because it doesn't harm anyone in any way*, right?
*though it does, as evident by many links in this thread.
Though I'll put it in a small font.
Please stop hijacking my reply box.
For me, a law that bans something that harms nobody except the person doing it is a "stupid law." In my opinion, laws should be there to protect people from other people, not from themselves.
Harming other people is different than doing something that harms nobody except potentially oneself.
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Just because the OP has changed his mind, doesn't mean that someone in a similar situation yet with a more...destructive sibling/friend would be so peachy with some of the given responses.
While many discount the "gateway drug" theory, it is an undeniable truth that some people simply cannot and should not smoke weed. Some people do harm themselves and others because of the drug, and who exactly is it up to to decide whether or not it is dire enough to ban or legalize?
Is it you? And if so, again, is the proper course of action to blatantly break the law? What does that say about your character?
Though I'll put it in a small font.
Please stop hijacking my reply box.
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Trans fats are banned in quite a few portions of the country. Even still, it's not a very apt comparison. For every minor way you could argue how trans fats affect more than just who is consuming them, I could argue two infinitely more legitimate ways marijuana/alcohol affects everyone but the consumer.
This line of thinking - that is, the conscious and unrequited disregard for society's laws put into place to protect others - is borderline if not exactly what is called "antisocial personality disorder," or sociopathy.
The legal applications of smoking marijuana are not within the domain of the discussion about their illegal consumption.
Though I'll put it in a small font.
Please stop hijacking my reply box.
Marijuana really has a few consequences worth thinking about:
slower thinking, however it should be noted this seems to *heal* itself within 6 months of quitting the green. Slightly reduced lung capacity, however someone whose smoked cigs for a year will see more reduced lung capacity than someone whose smoked weed for 15 (watch super high me...) so this really is a mute issue. It may also cause cancer, but this isn't proven and seriously: what DOESN'T contribute to cancer now a-days?
The other 2 things I think worth considering are:
1: it makes you lazy which may lead to increased weight and decreased fitness levels.
2: will affect your daily life, ie: you can't drive, can get fired, jail time, etc (unless you live in CA or another state where you can legally have mj as long as you have the required license)
I personally find it retarded that we waste taxpayer money pressing charges against and punishing people who deal or smoke mj. Let it be allowed, and tax the sale of the green and use all the extra money to combat real problems, like meth... If the federal gov't would follow CA's idea, they would have made over a billion extra $$$ just taxing the sale of mj in that one state.
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Right, because blindly following what lawmakers tell you do is a sign of mental health.
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I get the feeling you're looking for someone to say this. You are absolutely right in that the green is illegal, there is no way around this argument for those living under that law. But as far as sociopathy goes, a lot of people are gonna look at it on a completely different level. In the same way that there is first degree murder and second degree murder, there are different laws to break. Its not just the difference between a felony and a misdemeanor. A person will guage, this is what breaking the law does for me, this is what it will cost me if I get caught, the odds of me getting caught are, is it even just that I be punished for this? All of these calculations are made, and soooooo many people have come to the conclusion its worth it.
If you asked a constant drinker, I'm sure he'll tell you how bad alcohal can be, with a few good examples off the top of his head. Yet 99/100 pot smokers are gonna write off the benefits one by one. Don't you think that alone speaks for itself? Even the naysayers generally can call off multiple benefits when asked about weed and the downsides are MUCH LESS severe and much less common than any comparable illegal substance. I don't think I'm exaggerating when I say you're more likely to hurt yourself with 99.9% of the drugs that can be sold over the counter at your local pharmacy than with marijuana.
I'm not going with a technical standpoint, weed is illegal, but at the same time, is there any other substance thats got quite the same amount of backing pushing it towards legalization? Does that account for nothing?
I'm not going with a moral standpoint, weed can break people apart, but at the same time this is generally simply caused by a misunderstanding. Marijuana can be confused with a crutch, an addiction, or just a presence with a bad connotation, when it can be nothing more than a recreational activity or enhancer. Believe what you want about addictions, any physiological or pscyhological dependence boils down to the person. If weed set that off, the problems were already inherant in the person. Its not going to make a new person out of them.
I'm not going with a medical standpoing, list all the downsides you'd like, but any potsmoker has probably heard them, at least in passing, and the downsides still don't outweigh the benefits to that person.
The standpoint here is I feel that weed deserves its own podium. Its too unlike all that most people try to compare it to. To one person breaking the law to smoke weed is completely different than say doing heroin. But to another it may be deserving of 10 years in prison for such an atrocious act. The most directly link I can draw here is that weed can affect a person in much the same way. It can cause a perfectly functioning human being to....function fine. It can also cause them to become paranoid or lazy. If I had to compare it to anything, my opinion is its more like an allergy. If I was allergic to chocolate, say, my skin started to break out and became itchy in this case. I'd probably stop eating chocolate. Now lets say I really really like chocolate, now all of a sudden I'm doing the math... is Delicous > itching? And that's what It'll boil down to. If weed makes you paranoid or unable to function, its like an allergy, what are you gonna do about it. Odds are you should stop if you're getting a lot of negative feedback, but if you're not, then I'm sure you're weighing the +/- and came to a decision of your own. The math formula may be a little more erratic, say Getting High + Relaxing > Paranoia + Family Hates it + (illegal x odds of getting caught). And if the equation ever gets dangerous or tips the other way, then the person should by all means quit.
The "Weed equation" is different than alcohal or cocaine in that theres not really an "addiction multiplyer" except in extreme cases. These are extreme cases in the same way that a serial killer is an extreme individual. Don't judge the rule by exceptions. Marijuana is not addictive though a few individuals became addicted to it. The lottery is not winnable as far as I'm concerned but some people will win it...These are odds I'm willing to take...
finally to the OP:
you don't have to put up with it, you are in complete control, you can call on the parents to do something about it, his friends/teacher/boss, or even the police
When all is said and done, with a clean concious you can say that he was the one who burned all the bridges, after all what he did was illegal.
I noticed you didn't resort to that and good for you that you can talk with your brother openly, it really just boils down to how much it means to you, not him. There's nothing wrong with telling him how you feel, and while the decision to quit or continue his own, your feelings may just be enough to tip the scale one way or the other. Who knows, he may have actually been on the fence the whole time and didn't show it. And I can contest to that scale going both ways, I've known people who've smoked years at a time have a bad trip (believe it or not) or some big happening and they decided to quit instantly. More power to them, but I chalk it up to more proof that marijuana is very unlikely/rarely to lead to addiction. Its about as addicting as elmer's glue...but lets face it, you had much lower hopes for the kids that sniffed glue, but you dont put "glue user" on their permanent record, you just write "special" and send em on to the next grade.
In my opinion, the best standard to judge the validity of a statute is to see if it bans either a natural crime or a vice. I will quote Lysander Spooner's definition and and method of distinguishing between the two as he is far more eloquent than I am:
"Vices are those acts by which a man harms himself or his property.
Crimes are those acts by which one man harms the person or property of another.
Vices are simply the errors which a man makes in his search after his own happiness. Unlike crimes, they imply no malice toward others, and no interference with their persons or property.
In vices, the very essence of crime --- that is, the design to injure the person or property of another --- is wanting.
It is a maxim of the law that there can be no crime without a criminal intent; that is, without the intent to invade the person or property of another. But no one ever practises a vice with any such criminal intent. He practises his vice for his own happiness solely, and not from any malice toward others.
Unless this clear distinction between vices and crimes be made and recognized by the laws, there can be on earth no such thing as individual right, liberty, or property; no such things as the right of one man to the control of his own person and property, and the corresponding and coequal rights of another man to the control of his own person and property.
For a government to declare a vice to be a crime, and to punish it as such, is an attempt to falsify the very nature of things. It is as absurd as it would be to declare truth to be falsehood, or falsehood truth."
the counter-argument goes though...what happens when a vice begins to indirectly cause damage to another man? This is where the law steps in...to keep the guys with kinky vices in check. ALSO alcohol and the like distorts a person's ability to differentiate between vices and crimes, and influences the judgement into perhaps committing a crime, its here that the law steps in to stop a crime prematurely and I don't fault them for that
counter counter: From experience and asking around, I don't believe that marijuana inhibits your judgement to that degree, er-go, tis a vice d( '.' )b
'nam is not condusive towards weed. Following the laws of the land are obviously not to the letter, anyone with any basic understanding of sociopolitical thought understands that.
The major difference between weed and 'nam, is that weed you can abstain from and engage in legal activities such as alcohol and sex. Which have medical benefits when restraint and precautions are taken. 'Nam you actually had to go if you were male and drafted. Frankly, a healthy skepticism of society is a major part of modern western thinking for a while now by academics to laymen.
However, weed is banned for good reasons. Yet, there are enough strong merits to legalize it. 'Nam was just an abomination of Wilsonianism.
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