Otherwise, I don't really see you being able "get on your feet at any time" when you have somebody in the guard, or half guard, or the mount. It takes a little time to extricate yourself, and get up, especially if the guy on the ground is only trying to slow you down so his friend can hit you.
If the guy doesn't know anything about grappling, yes I'll be right on my feet minus a few seconds it might take to get out of it.
What starts out as 1 on 1 "fair fight", can turn into unarmed vs a guy with a knife, or a razor in the boot, once he figures out you're a much better fighter than him.
You think he'll have time to grab a knife out of his boot in the heat of the moment?
What you are suggesting is theory that doesn't work out well in reality.
Yes... but bulldoze through past one guy, or headbutt one guy in and break free, or make space with a pool cue and run, are certainly options. As long as you're standing, and just trying to maintain distance, you have the option to run in a 1 vs 2 or 3.
I'm not going to bother with this point. You try this in real life and if it works out for you, good. I just hope no one else takes your point seriously.
We're talking about what martial art is best for "street fighting".
Look at the second word there: "Fighting".
First understand that the word fighting is an adjective for the verb Fight that describes the act of fighting.
Now look at your points:
The best way of handling a street fight is to walk away.
The second best way of handling a street fight is to run away.
Neither of those two have anything to do with the adjective "fighting" because you are already in the act, you are fighting.
Running away will not always help you when you are in the act of fighting. Perhaps you are not far enough away, perhaps you're in a crowded area, maybe you even tried to run and the guy caught up to you.
The point is, we're not discussing fight prevention - because it doesn't have anything to do with the act of fighting.
I can't believe I actually have to spell this out, so that both you and highroller can get the difference.
The third best way to handle it is to hurt somebody enough to be able to run away.
There you go, that is one of the best ways to resolve the act of fighting. Hurt the guy enough to get away or hurt the guy enough so that the act of fighting ends.
The worst way to handle a street fight is to roll around in the guard for 5 minutes trying to get an ankle lock, on the floor of a dingy, sticky bar.
Unless that guy knows anything about grappling, I can guarantee you I'll get him in a sweep or submission (assuming he's even gets me in my guard) in less than 5 minutes.
The kinds of fights where two people roll around on the floor where nobody else intervenes, are basically the kind of fight that is basically a duel or MATCH. If nobody interferes, its because it's a contest between you and the other guy for seeing who is the tougher and more skilled *******... er I mean... determining who is the "better man".
You know... I don't really care anymore. You can assume whatever you want. I think at this point I'm going to bow out of this conversation because it honestly feels like I'm arguing with immature kids who have no idea what they are talking about.
If you want to assume that the Martial Art you take lets you take on multiple opponents, go for it. If you want to use improvised weapons, go for it.
When you end up getting beat up by multiple opponents or in jail for the next 10 years or so, for assault with a deadly weapon/manslaughter/murder in the second degree, don't blame me.
Yes, it's clear, that I, as a pediatric physician, who have not been in so much as a "street ARGUMENT" since grade school, let alone allowed something to escalate into a "street FIGHT"... am likely to end up in JAIL in the next 10 years.
Because I'm fighting...
And I'm an immature kid...
The comment about "improvised weapons" to pop somebody was in a situation where you really feel your life is in danger. Jail is probably not the first thing on your mind at that point.
Anything short of that... why would you be fighting at all?
Who gets sucker punched? Who gets in fights? Really, what civilized person finds himself fighting 1 on 1?
You know what happens if a doctor or a lawyer shows up at the hospital or court, sporting a black eye and bruises? Everybody is ****ing EMBARRASSED for him. It's either domestic violence, he's been the victim of a violent crime, or the guy has a substance abuse issue. Because no man with anything going for him is really likely to end up like that... and people are embarrassed for him because the likelihood of it being "violent crime" is virtually nil compared to the other two.
This is not to invalidate the subject of this thread. This is to CLARIFY that if you're "street fighting", you should ONLY be doing so to legitimately protect yourself from a criminal assault, and potentially defending your life. In which case, yeah, hitting somebody with a weapon to get away is on the menu.
If you find yourself grappling a stranger in a bar somewhere while your friends and his friends are standing by to make sure it's a "fair fight", then you two are just offering up free MMA for a bunch of drunks, and you really should ask yourself "WHAT AM I DOING HERE?"
So now that the OP has been banned and the more controversial people in this discussion have ragequit...
dcartist, I'm curious, what martial arts have you trained in? Kendo aside.
TKD for a couple years in high school... I sucked at it, and would never use anything I learned from it in real combat. I was always a pretty natural wrestler, and was probably competitive with people in my weight class in a middle of the road catholic high school (I had my brother for comparison who did wrestle on the team, and was very solid).
I took hap ki do also for a year, and I do think some of the things were helpful just in terms of the mechanics of arm bars, wrist locks and stuff like that, but I don't think as an actual combat technique for me...
This was all in the early 80s, so 25 years later, and in my 40s, I'm not going to beat anybody here in a fight.
I'm a huge FAN of MMA, I find the science of the sport of fighting to be fascinating... I watched since Royce Gracie and UFC I: I think it's really interesting to see the principles... the advantage of top, hip position determining control, guard, half guard, mount, triangle, wrist control... the differences in ability to take down based on discipline, variations of hip throws, lifts, low take down variations, i'd love to see how Alex Karelin would have done if he'd been in MMA in his prime...
I think as a person my age who's got perspective on seeing so many people fight in real life on the street (can't be Korean and not see that), seeing people who died or were maimed senselessly, and seeing how INCREDIBLY UNNECESSARY most fighting is (and having know dozens of "expert fighters", and noting that they tended to FIND their way into fights somehow), I have a viewpoint.
I could be wrong on all of it of course. I know that if I ever truly perceive myself to be in danger for my life, I will act as I need to defend myself, and that includes the best fast talkind and tapdancing that I know, giving away my wallet, being meek, giving off an aura of harmlessness and agreeability until opportunity presents itself, then act very decisively, to flee at high speed screaming like a little kid, or bashing a knee in with a 9 iron, as the situation calls for it... win or lose. But I will not "FIGHT" for any reason other than to protect the safety of self or loved ones.
(I will say that knowing anatomy, REALLY knowing anatomy, is a good idea)
Also, I never took Kendo. My friend was the guy who was very into Kendo. You would not believe how hard and quickly he could whip snap a broom handle down... crack your ****ing neck in a 1/10 of a second.
(I will say that knowing anatomy, REALLY knowing anatomy, is a good idea)
Oh this most emphatically. Nothing gives someone pause like a good hit to the eye. That mess HURTS.
Also, I never took Kendo. My friend was the guy who was very into Kendo. You would not believe how hard and quickly he could whip snap a broom handle down... crack your ****ing neck in a 1/10 of a second.
You know, that sounds kind of fun. I'll check this thing out. Always wanted to learn a sword art anyway.
What about you, Jay13x? You said ninjutsu, which I know nothing about. What else have you learned, and can you tell me more about ninjutsu?
If you're talking about a street fight TKD will do you no good. Most if not all street fiights end up with somebody tackling somebody and beating the snot out of somebody. If you want to do MMA TKD is also pretty bad I've wrestled for 13 years and that's a pretty good place to start if you want to do MMA. It focuses on all aspects except strikes which in reality aren't terribly hard to learn. Wrestling is also the oldest Martial Art and the first to use the belt system.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Playing: Modern: BWEldrazi and TaxesBW Legacy: WEldraziW
What about you, Jay13x? You said ninjutsu, which I know nothing about. What else have you learned, and can you tell me more about ninjutsu?
In response to this, I can say Ninjutsu is lots of fun and worth a try. Its not very good at protecting you against lots of different kicks as it only uses 1 type of punch and 1 type of kick. (at least I haven't learned much about defending against other martial arts yet, I haven't been going for very long)
So if you're gonna branch out in a martial art to learn how to defend against kicks, don't do ninjutsu. But for everything else, Ninjutsu is excellent.
Actually, now that I think about it there are several ways to strike with a hand, but there is only one punch. Also if you wanna learn how to defend against swinging punches, ninjutsu isn't good for that either. However, learn a little boxing or Karate or whatever teaches you to block swinging punches and you'll be fine.
What you learn about how the human body functions is very useful. Where to hit, how to hit, how to create an opportunity to deal lots of damage, etc. You learn locks and throws and its all about countering your opponent. There is very little in Ninjutsu which is about offence (But then again I'm still new so I might not have learnt it yet)
Basically, if you want to branch out and learn a little ninjutsu you've got to be prepared to do it for at least once a week for a year in order to make any of it effective in combat.
Its also great to use when your tired, as most of the moves are based around using your or your opponent's weight, rather than your muscle to move your opponent around. That means it doesn't take much energy to do. If you're tired, a lot of the times the moves will become MORE dangerous due to the fact you will naturally flop your weight and your opponent's weight around more.
Also be prepared to do a lot of sword work in Ninjutsu. The weapon you train with the most in Ninjutsu is the sword, not because its better than any other weapon, just cause its REALLY DIFFICULT to use properly (I mean people spent lifetimes learn how to master sword play, so it makes sense).
And also if you really wanna get the most out of ninjutsu, learn a little Japanese as well It helps in class occasionally.
to round off this discussion, i'd like to make a second post.
let's lay down the order of things:
- it is sensible to prepare yourself for the eventuality of having to defend yourself.
- with this in mind, it's important to note that almost any martial art will adequately prepare you for your average drunken tussle.
- no martial art encourages fighting as a primary solution. it is always better to walk away.
- this is because you can never know how a fight will pan out. you could lose just by slipping on a wet cobblestone, and then what good will your training do you?
- another word on knives.... don't attempt to fight if there are knives or similar weapons involved. the risk is simply too great and the consistency of being able to defend against them is low. when you are fighting against a weapon that can cripple your hands (i.e. your primary tools of defense and attack) with little or no effort, you are fighting a losing battle.
lastly - grappling martial arts are less ideal in the real world. they are lethal in a dojo against a single opponent (no question about it)... but in a brawl, where there may be broken glass on the floor, crowds, people helping your opponent and other hazards such as traffic.... it's not a sound tactic. maintaining correct distance is key.
in a sense this discussion can go on forever - no martial art is "the best"... it's all down to personal opinion. all i can give is some sound advice about being sensible.
and just to nail the point home once more - learning one martial art really well is infinitely better than many different arts incompletely.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Modern: G Tron, Vannifar, Jund, Druid/Vizier combo, Humans, Eldrazi Stompy (Serum Powder), Amulet, Grishoalbrand, Breach Titan, Turns, Eternal Command, As Foretold Living End, Elves, Cheerios, RUG Scapeshift
- another word on knives.... don't attempt to fight if there are knives or similar weapons involved. the risk is simply too great and the consistency of being able to defend against them is low. when you are fighting against a weapon that can cripple your hands (i.e. your primary tools of defense and attack) with little or no effort, you are fighting a losing battle.
OK. This is the part that I'm not getting:
Number one rule is supposed to be that if you can avoid fighting an unarmed person, do so. Walk away, back down, run away, talk fast, whatever you have to do.
So why do you need a special rule that says the exact same thing for a knife and gun situation?
The implication seems to be that the rule for a good fighter is really: "avoid fighting at all costs... unless you think you can win... as long as you don't have to give up any pride... and as long as he doesn't have a weapon."
But any situation could turn into a knife situation... Except when you're dealing wih clowns you know.
I don't think martial arts ends up making young men safer... I just don't. Because most young men operate by the rule "don't fight... Unless somebody pushes your buttons enough... And unless you think you can win." the corollary that goes with THAT rule is "don't fight people with knives, no matter how good a fighter you are."
Fighting excellence for many young men seems to be that now you get to pick and choose when you back down and when you fight. Bottom line is you fight more. Which isn't to say that learning an art makes you less safe. But it sure can if you have the wrong attitude (which is really really common).
Yet another thought that falls out of that is that martial arts that stress disarming knife and gun wielders encourages you to consider trying it.
I don't think martial arts ends up making young men safer... I just don't. Because most young men operate by the rule "don't fight... Unless somebody pushes your buttons enough... And unless you think you can win." the corollary that goes with THAT rule is "don't fight people with knives, no matter how good a fighter you are."
I feel that this attitude is the issue of the individual, not of martial arts. I know that here, Judo as a varsity sport is conducted with an attitude of respect. There are penalties for cheering too loudly, gloating before/after a match, etc. Yes, the goal when fighting is to win, but it is understood that picking fights is disgraceful. When taught properly martial arts does make young people safer because part of the lesson is that while the goal when fighting is to win, in almost every case there is s better option. The lesson is proper discretion.
Fighting excellence for many young men seems to be that now you get to pick and choose when you back down and when you fight. Bottom line is you fight more. Which isn't to say that learning an art makes you less safe. But it sure can if you have the wrong attitude (which is really really common).
Choices are very powerful things. I don't share your opinion that it leads to more fighting. I feel the more appropriate choice of words is that it leads to a better understanding of how to respond in certain situations, because the person has the training to act.
As an analogy, look at someone trained in medicine. It adds the ability to act in an emergency. Being trained means they have a greater chance of having a life or death choice in their hands than the average person because the training allows for the opportunity to act.
Yet another thought that falls out of that is that martial arts that stress disarming knife and gun wielders encourages you to consider trying it.
Again, that is an argument against the individual. In the general sense, all it allows for is more options. The proper use of the knowledge is at the discretion of the person who learns the technique. In the hands of law enforcement such a technique can and has saved lives before.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"What is mana but possibility, an idea not yet given form?" - Jhoira
Hey, I'm a guy who's interested in learning how to street fight
I think this is the biggest problem you have right there. You don't learn martial arts in order to get into fights, or you're going to find yourself in a jail cell really quickly. You were born a few hundred years to late to do the whole "nomad warrior travelling the land looking for duels" thing
Given that you basic reason for this is the problem, I'd say it doesn't really matter what art you study, the end result is is going to be the exact same, at best you end up a bloddy mess on a sidwalk after a gang of dudes jumps you after you messed with one of them, worse you're a GSW victim in the ER with doctors shooting andrenaline into your heart and pounding on your chest to keep you alive.
Realistically though, you'll probably end up in some fight in an alley or a bar, you beat up the other guy, and about 3 months later you're sitting in a courtroom watching this dude wearing a neckbrace and an arm cast telling the jury how much you pummled him, hearing his lawyer documnt all of your martial arts training for the record and making you out to be the next Bruce Lee to show you used excessive force, as the jury adds up the medical bills, lost wages, long term care, punitive damages, and then your legal fees on top of it and you end up owing mid 6 figure settlement that pretty much destroys your life. That's assuming you don't get sent up the river for assault and/or battery charges.
Or worse you accidentally choke the guy to long and he gets brain damage or god forbid dies, now you're looking at murder 1, or at least manslaughter, and your doing SERIOUS time in a FPMITA prison.
Maybe you should start thinking about where this "quest to become a street fighter" is going to lead to before you worry about learning how to kick and punch people to sovle you problems.
First off, no martial artist would be looking for a fight. Martial arts is not a fighting technique, it is a mindset.
Treat martial arts as if you were carrying a concealed handgun, don't do anything with it you wouldn't do without it.
Here's my advice to you. Go talk to your instructor/sensei about the mental aspects of martial arts. What I tell all of my students, just because you can fight, doesn't mean you need to. However, that aside, if you are looking for something to begin in, Zhongguo wushu is an excellent style to begin training in, because of your background in TKD, that will eventually lead to Zui Quan, which your grappling skills will be a great asset to.
If you like to fight, thats what fighting sports are for. Join a karate, Taekwondo or Mixed Martial Arts club and fight there. Then when you're in a street fight just use your techniques you've learned from sport and also kick your opponent in the genitals for good measure.
But your stupid if you want to get into fights without doing it within a sport based context. You're likely to get injured or killed or both if your really unlucky.
Fighting is and has always been about defending yourself, not about starting the attack.
If the guy doesn't know anything about grappling, yes I'll be right on my feet minus a few seconds it might take to get out of it.
You think he'll have time to grab a knife out of his boot in the heat of the moment?
What you are suggesting is theory that doesn't work out well in reality.
I'm not going to bother with this point. You try this in real life and if it works out for you, good. I just hope no one else takes your point seriously.
Look at the second word there: "Fighting".
First understand that the word fighting is an adjective for the verb Fight that describes the act of fighting.
Now look at your points:
Neither of those two have anything to do with the adjective "fighting" because you are already in the act, you are fighting.
Running away will not always help you when you are in the act of fighting. Perhaps you are not far enough away, perhaps you're in a crowded area, maybe you even tried to run and the guy caught up to you.
The point is, we're not discussing fight prevention - because it doesn't have anything to do with the act of fighting.
I can't believe I actually have to spell this out, so that both you and highroller can get the difference.
There you go, that is one of the best ways to resolve the act of fighting. Hurt the guy enough to get away or hurt the guy enough so that the act of fighting ends.
Unless that guy knows anything about grappling, I can guarantee you I'll get him in a sweep or submission (assuming he's even gets me in my guard) in less than 5 minutes.
You know... I don't really care anymore. You can assume whatever you want. I think at this point I'm going to bow out of this conversation because it honestly feels like I'm arguing with immature kids who have no idea what they are talking about.
If you want to assume that the Martial Art you take lets you take on multiple opponents, go for it. If you want to use improvised weapons, go for it.
When you end up getting beat up by multiple opponents or in jail for the next 10 years or so, for assault with a deadly weapon/manslaughter/murder in the second degree, don't blame me.
Because I'm fighting...
And I'm an immature kid...
The comment about "improvised weapons" to pop somebody was in a situation where you really feel your life is in danger. Jail is probably not the first thing on your mind at that point.
Anything short of that... why would you be fighting at all?
Who gets sucker punched? Who gets in fights? Really, what civilized person finds himself fighting 1 on 1?
You know what happens if a doctor or a lawyer shows up at the hospital or court, sporting a black eye and bruises? Everybody is ****ing EMBARRASSED for him. It's either domestic violence, he's been the victim of a violent crime, or the guy has a substance abuse issue. Because no man with anything going for him is really likely to end up like that... and people are embarrassed for him because the likelihood of it being "violent crime" is virtually nil compared to the other two.
This is not to invalidate the subject of this thread. This is to CLARIFY that if you're "street fighting", you should ONLY be doing so to legitimately protect yourself from a criminal assault, and potentially defending your life. In which case, yeah, hitting somebody with a weapon to get away is on the menu.
If you find yourself grappling a stranger in a bar somewhere while your friends and his friends are standing by to make sure it's a "fair fight", then you two are just offering up free MMA for a bunch of drunks, and you really should ask yourself "WHAT AM I DOING HERE?"
dcartist, I'm curious, what martial arts have you trained in? Kendo aside.
I took hap ki do also for a year, and I do think some of the things were helpful just in terms of the mechanics of arm bars, wrist locks and stuff like that, but I don't think as an actual combat technique for me...
This was all in the early 80s, so 25 years later, and in my 40s, I'm not going to beat anybody here in a fight.
I'm a huge FAN of MMA, I find the science of the sport of fighting to be fascinating... I watched since Royce Gracie and UFC I: I think it's really interesting to see the principles... the advantage of top, hip position determining control, guard, half guard, mount, triangle, wrist control... the differences in ability to take down based on discipline, variations of hip throws, lifts, low take down variations, i'd love to see how Alex Karelin would have done if he'd been in MMA in his prime...
I think as a person my age who's got perspective on seeing so many people fight in real life on the street (can't be Korean and not see that), seeing people who died or were maimed senselessly, and seeing how INCREDIBLY UNNECESSARY most fighting is (and having know dozens of "expert fighters", and noting that they tended to FIND their way into fights somehow), I have a viewpoint.
I could be wrong on all of it of course. I know that if I ever truly perceive myself to be in danger for my life, I will act as I need to defend myself, and that includes the best fast talkind and tapdancing that I know, giving away my wallet, being meek, giving off an aura of harmlessness and agreeability until opportunity presents itself, then act very decisively, to flee at high speed screaming like a little kid, or bashing a knee in with a 9 iron, as the situation calls for it... win or lose. But I will not "FIGHT" for any reason other than to protect the safety of self or loved ones.
(I will say that knowing anatomy, REALLY knowing anatomy, is a good idea)
Also, I never took Kendo. My friend was the guy who was very into Kendo. You would not believe how hard and quickly he could whip snap a broom handle down... crack your ****ing neck in a 1/10 of a second.
oh i didn't ragequit, i just decided to stop wasting my time arguing with people who have no idea what their talking about:D
Oh this most emphatically. Nothing gives someone pause like a good hit to the eye. That mess HURTS.
You know, that sounds kind of fun. I'll check this thing out. Always wanted to learn a sword art anyway.
What about you, Jay13x? You said ninjutsu, which I know nothing about. What else have you learned, and can you tell me more about ninjutsu?
And yet you're still posting here. THAT desperate to prove something to someone huh?
We should match.
It's been about 30 years since I took it so I might need to warm up first.
Crap, what can possibly counter this?!
Yes! I have found the solution!
Playing:
Modern:
BWEldrazi and TaxesBW
Legacy:
WEldraziW
In response to this, I can say Ninjutsu is lots of fun and worth a try. Its not very good at protecting you against lots of different kicks as it only uses 1 type of punch and 1 type of kick. (at least I haven't learned much about defending against other martial arts yet, I haven't been going for very long)
So if you're gonna branch out in a martial art to learn how to defend against kicks, don't do ninjutsu. But for everything else, Ninjutsu is excellent.
Actually, now that I think about it there are several ways to strike with a hand, but there is only one punch. Also if you wanna learn how to defend against swinging punches, ninjutsu isn't good for that either. However, learn a little boxing or Karate or whatever teaches you to block swinging punches and you'll be fine.
What you learn about how the human body functions is very useful. Where to hit, how to hit, how to create an opportunity to deal lots of damage, etc. You learn locks and throws and its all about countering your opponent. There is very little in Ninjutsu which is about offence (But then again I'm still new so I might not have learnt it yet)
Basically, if you want to branch out and learn a little ninjutsu you've got to be prepared to do it for at least once a week for a year in order to make any of it effective in combat.
Its also great to use when your tired, as most of the moves are based around using your or your opponent's weight, rather than your muscle to move your opponent around. That means it doesn't take much energy to do. If you're tired, a lot of the times the moves will become MORE dangerous due to the fact you will naturally flop your weight and your opponent's weight around more.
Also be prepared to do a lot of sword work in Ninjutsu. The weapon you train with the most in Ninjutsu is the sword, not because its better than any other weapon, just cause its REALLY DIFFICULT to use properly (I mean people spent lifetimes learn how to master sword play, so it makes sense).
And also if you really wanna get the most out of ninjutsu, learn a little Japanese as well It helps in class occasionally.
GOOD LUCK MAN!
Pretty much sums up why I like green so much
On the internet, everywhere is Soviet Russia[/QUOTE]
let's lay down the order of things:
- it is sensible to prepare yourself for the eventuality of having to defend yourself.
- with this in mind, it's important to note that almost any martial art will adequately prepare you for your average drunken tussle.
- no martial art encourages fighting as a primary solution. it is always better to walk away.
- this is because you can never know how a fight will pan out. you could lose just by slipping on a wet cobblestone, and then what good will your training do you?
- another word on knives.... don't attempt to fight if there are knives or similar weapons involved. the risk is simply too great and the consistency of being able to defend against them is low. when you are fighting against a weapon that can cripple your hands (i.e. your primary tools of defense and attack) with little or no effort, you are fighting a losing battle.
lastly - grappling martial arts are less ideal in the real world. they are lethal in a dojo against a single opponent (no question about it)... but in a brawl, where there may be broken glass on the floor, crowds, people helping your opponent and other hazards such as traffic.... it's not a sound tactic. maintaining correct distance is key.
in a sense this discussion can go on forever - no martial art is "the best"... it's all down to personal opinion. all i can give is some sound advice about being sensible.
and just to nail the point home once more - learning one martial art really well is infinitely better than many different arts incompletely.
Number one rule is supposed to be that if you can avoid fighting an unarmed person, do so. Walk away, back down, run away, talk fast, whatever you have to do.
So why do you need a special rule that says the exact same thing for a knife and gun situation?
The implication seems to be that the rule for a good fighter is really: "avoid fighting at all costs... unless you think you can win... as long as you don't have to give up any pride... and as long as he doesn't have a weapon."
But any situation could turn into a knife situation... Except when you're dealing wih clowns you know.
I don't think martial arts ends up making young men safer... I just don't. Because most young men operate by the rule "don't fight... Unless somebody pushes your buttons enough... And unless you think you can win." the corollary that goes with THAT rule is "don't fight people with knives, no matter how good a fighter you are."
Fighting excellence for many young men seems to be that now you get to pick and choose when you back down and when you fight. Bottom line is you fight more. Which isn't to say that learning an art makes you less safe. But it sure can if you have the wrong attitude (which is really really common).
Yet another thought that falls out of that is that martial arts that stress disarming knife and gun wielders encourages you to consider trying it.
I feel that this attitude is the issue of the individual, not of martial arts. I know that here, Judo as a varsity sport is conducted with an attitude of respect. There are penalties for cheering too loudly, gloating before/after a match, etc. Yes, the goal when fighting is to win, but it is understood that picking fights is disgraceful. When taught properly martial arts does make young people safer because part of the lesson is that while the goal when fighting is to win, in almost every case there is s better option. The lesson is proper discretion.
Choices are very powerful things. I don't share your opinion that it leads to more fighting. I feel the more appropriate choice of words is that it leads to a better understanding of how to respond in certain situations, because the person has the training to act.
As an analogy, look at someone trained in medicine. It adds the ability to act in an emergency. Being trained means they have a greater chance of having a life or death choice in their hands than the average person because the training allows for the opportunity to act.
Again, that is an argument against the individual. In the general sense, all it allows for is more options. The proper use of the knowledge is at the discretion of the person who learns the technique. In the hands of law enforcement such a technique can and has saved lives before.
My Recent Craft Projects:
Custom EDH Spell Book Deck Box
Custom EDH Deck Boxes
3D Magic Card Abacus 1 2 3 4
URURU Jhoira
BGWBG Teneb
BRGBR Karrthus
WUBRG Scion of the Ur-Dragon
BBBBB Balthor
RGWRG Uril
UBRUB Garza Zol
WUBWU Sharuum
UUUUU Arcanis
UBUBU Sivitri Scarzam
I think this is the biggest problem you have right there. You don't learn martial arts in order to get into fights, or you're going to find yourself in a jail cell really quickly. You were born a few hundred years to late to do the whole "nomad warrior travelling the land looking for duels" thing
Given that you basic reason for this is the problem, I'd say it doesn't really matter what art you study, the end result is is going to be the exact same, at best you end up a bloddy mess on a sidwalk after a gang of dudes jumps you after you messed with one of them, worse you're a GSW victim in the ER with doctors shooting andrenaline into your heart and pounding on your chest to keep you alive.
Realistically though, you'll probably end up in some fight in an alley or a bar, you beat up the other guy, and about 3 months later you're sitting in a courtroom watching this dude wearing a neckbrace and an arm cast telling the jury how much you pummled him, hearing his lawyer documnt all of your martial arts training for the record and making you out to be the next Bruce Lee to show you used excessive force, as the jury adds up the medical bills, lost wages, long term care, punitive damages, and then your legal fees on top of it and you end up owing mid 6 figure settlement that pretty much destroys your life. That's assuming you don't get sent up the river for assault and/or battery charges.
Or worse you accidentally choke the guy to long and he gets brain damage or god forbid dies, now you're looking at murder 1, or at least manslaughter, and your doing SERIOUS time in a FPMITA prison.
Maybe you should start thinking about where this "quest to become a street fighter" is going to lead to before you worry about learning how to kick and punch people to sovle you problems.
Treat martial arts as if you were carrying a concealed handgun, don't do anything with it you wouldn't do without it.
Here's my advice to you. Go talk to your instructor/sensei about the mental aspects of martial arts. What I tell all of my students, just because you can fight, doesn't mean you need to. However, that aside, if you are looking for something to begin in, Zhongguo wushu is an excellent style to begin training in, because of your background in TKD, that will eventually lead to Zui Quan, which your grappling skills will be a great asset to.
But your stupid if you want to get into fights without doing it within a sport based context. You're likely to get injured or killed or both if your really unlucky.
Fighting is and has always been about defending yourself, not about starting the attack.
Pretty much sums up why I like green so much
On the internet, everywhere is Soviet Russia[/QUOTE]