the other night a young woman not older then 25 came into my hotel looking for a room, when i found out that she did not have a credit card i about turned her away because the hotel owner wants every one to have a valid credit card because he is paranoid every one is going to trash the room. But i disobeyed the rules and game her a room anyways, because i saw under her half zipped up jacket that she had huge fist shaped bruses, this combined with the fact i could tell she had been in tears recently (he make up had run) made me question if she was a batterd woman or not. anyways to make a short story shorter, i was fired for this dispite the fact this action could have saved her life. makes me upset because i put in almost 3 years of my life at this job, then to get fired for something like this is upsetting to say the least. I told my bosses (who did not want to let me go, they were forced by the owner to fire me) that i did not think i did anything wrong. Did i? Has any one else ever been punshed for doing the right thing?
anyways ... off to look for a new job.
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To be fair, you did break the rules. The hotel owner has invested his money into the hotel and he's the one that loses if somebody without a credit card does trash the room. And, since they are the rules of the hotel, being fired for breaking them doens't seem like such a bad thing.
However, if it did look like she may have been in danger, it's probably good that you helped her and gave her a room or shelter. However, it probably would have been better to have you sit in the lobby while you get an ambulance or the police.
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"If the world should blow itself up, the last audible voice would be that of an expert saying it can't be done." - Sir Peter Ustinov
Did you explain to the paranoid owner that you believed she had been abused by someone and was trying to get away from her abuser? That seems like a very relevant argument.
If so, that's hard to believe someone would still be so heartless and cold to still fire you. What a terrible owner. I do agree with Epitaph that it probably would have been more prudent to notify authorities about her being abused.
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I would argue that you didn't do "the right thing". You had specific instructions about what to do, and you disobeyed them. You were told to not give people without valid credit cards rooms, and did so anyway. I'd say you did the wrong thing. Even if she was a battered woman, she could've gone to a different hotel. I doubt yours is the only hotel in town. It wasn't your fault she didn't have a credit card, you should have explained the policy, and directed her to another hotel. At least that's what I would've done.
We live in a country were ~50% of the populace believe public schooling is a socialist conspiracy and that being called Einstein is an insult. We could try and fix it, but unfortunately the other 50% don't believe in euthanasia.
Alerting the authorities would be the most right thing to do here, but I'm sorry that doing right here got you in trouble. Those are the rules, though, and that's what happens. In this case, though, if I were you, I'd take that knowing you did the right thing and be proud of yourself. You got fired, but you got fired for good reasons (not on the part of the policy, but on your action).
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My anecdotal evidence disagrees with yours! EXPLAIN THAT!
Really, who cares about rules, especially rules related to money, when someone's life is potentially in danger. I'm glad there are still people in the world that would rather lose their job than look the other way.
Still, you could have not lost your job by calling the authorities. On the other hand, she likely would have left had you done so. If she had wanted to go to the cops instead of your hotel, she likely would have.
the other night a young woman not older then 25 came into my hotel looking for a room, when i found out that she did not have a credit card i about turned her away because the hotel owner wants every one to have a valid credit card because he is paranoid every one is going to trash the room. But i disobeyed the rules and game her a room anyways, because i saw under her half zipped up jacket that she had huge fist shaped bruses, this combined with the fact i could tell she had been in tears recently (he make up had run) made me question if she was a batterd woman or not. anyways to make a short story shorter, i was fired for this dispite the fact this action could have saved her life.
You didn't do the right thing. You made some strange assumption that the woman was "in trouble," not taking into account the possibility that your rational faculties were exaggerating certain features of the woman.
You then made this other strange assumption that given a person "in trouble," it's somehow more important (or as you said, "the right thing to do") to intervene in favor of mending the "trouble," over two things:
1) respect of the wishes of a person (your employer) to impose a structure of his choosing on things of his possession as afforded him by right (that *his* hotel is maintained as he wishes); and
2) respect of the explicit requirement of your employer for you to accord with his wishes, as his employee, and in the relevant employment context (that *you* maintain his hotel as he wishes, as one of his contractual hotel-maintainment people)
.
Now those are two separate things. If you want to uphold your position - that to have denied the woman would have been reprehensible and to accept her was not - you will consider both of these.
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However, I have once been punished for doing the right thing - I used to be bullied, I would inform the relevant guardians in the area, and they, being incompetent schoolteachers, would indiscriminately impose penalties on all people remotely involved in the bullying incident - including, always, the person with crap beat out of him: me.
Doesn't really reveal anything to talk about, though.
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Rules are in place for a reason, and if you violate them, you can be punished. In this case, it was not the right thing to do to break the rules when contacting the authorities would have been just as good in dealing with the problem and he would not have been fired. She could have waited in the lobby, especially if it were crowded. Nobody would give her trouble in a crowded lobby. I'm sorry that you lost your job, but it wasn't completely unjustified.
And synchronicity, what if there was no police station in sight? What if she was fleeing from somebody and the first safe haven she saw was the hotel, even if she perferred the police? Should she have risked looking for the police? I know I wouldn't have.
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"If the world should blow itself up, the last audible voice would be that of an expert saying it can't be done." - Sir Peter Ustinov
Really, who cares about rules, especially rules related to money, when someone's life is potentially in danger. I'm glad there are still people in the world that would rather lose their job than look the other way.
Still, you could have not lost your job by calling the authorities. On the other hand, she likely would have left had you done so. If she had wanted to go to the cops instead of your hotel, she likely would have.
We don't know that her life was in danger. Maybe those bruises came from something innocent, I also agree with HH that they weren't as severe as Release said. We also have no evidence that her life was in danger. Also correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't there shelters for abused women? Also, nobody answered my point about other hotels. :(. Basically, Release had been given simple, reasonable instructions, and chose not to follow them, end of story. He was punished according to known guidelines that he knowingly violated. Release is in the wrong here, while his employer had every right to fire him.
We live in a country were ~50% of the populace believe public schooling is a socialist conspiracy and that being called Einstein is an insult. We could try and fix it, but unfortunately the other 50% don't believe in euthanasia.
I can understand where you are both coming from here. On the one hand, the woman's life might have been in jeopardy (it isn't entirely clear)
On the other hand, let's say the woman did trash the room and then take off. In this case, the owner (not you) would probably be left on the hook with a huge bill to work off and, in addition, you broke a promise.
Had I been the owner, I'd like to think I wouldn't have fired you. It would be unfortunate that you had broken your promise to me, but then it would also be clear that you are a person of depth and compassion, and that is a person that is generally beneficial for any organization to have around.
I don't know what it's like in your area, but around here there are shelters for women or others who are being abused. Are there any there and, if so, did you call them? They aren't that great to be at, I'm sure, but then the woman if she really was in danger would have been safe, your boss would not have taken a huge risk because of your decision and you wouldn't have broken a contract.
I wouldn't blame yourself too much for your actions though, you had to make a tough decision and you did just fine.
Also, did you try to talk to your boss about this before you agreed to put her up for the night? Maybe if you had reasoned with him, he wouldn't have been mad.. or would've had an idea as to what to do next.
Sucks that that happened, man. I think you did the right thing given the circumstances, but you aren't really responsible for this woman and it cost you your job, so maby next time you will ask permission and get help for this lady in the future.
Its good you were trying to help the lady, but I don't think you went about it correctly. Calling the police/calling a shelter and/or inquiring about her condition would be an option. Another would be to find someone who is your superior and query them about it. At the very least, you could fall back on plan A. (call the police) or your superior might decide to give her a room, and then the burden is no longer on your head.
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You disobeyed orders, and that not only nullifies any good you may have done, you exposed your employer to severe liability and thus earned your gross misconduct termination. If I saw that on an application from you, I would not hire you because you have an obvious issue with following directions.
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Ah, the differnce between doing what is right and what is in the rules. I do agree you did something right but you also broke the rules. You made a hasty decision, but I believe it was the right one. Better to get a new job where the people will honor good decisions than keep working at that place. And if anyone says they wouldn't hire this man because he broke a rule, you seriously need to get off your high chair, cause we've all broken rules before, and at least he did it for a moral reason.
I'm on the OP's side since that was indeed a nice gesture. However, I'm taking the opposite side because there's an equally reasonable answer to the problem. If you can't give business to the customer you can refer that person to someplace that WILL. Mostly because you have a responsibility to keep the place intact and running just as the owner does regardless if your boss is totally paranoid or not. That's his right as a business owner and he might suffer for business because of that or he might not but the fact remains that's his right.
Besides, I'm of the opinion that if they wanted to go to a shelter for people like that they probably would've, assuming they know about such places. If they don't that's another thing entirely. Either way it doesn't hurt to bring up such places if you truely think that.
No good deed goes unpunished. and now we got more anecdotal evidence. I wouldn't have given her a room, I woulda explained the policy then asked what was wrong and listened to see what I could do and refer her to a place she could go and call 'er a cab. After all you chose to break a rule, for every choice: a consequence.
As mentioned, we have no way of knowing if she was actually in danger. If it makes you feel better to think that you sacrificed your job to do a favor for a stranger, that's all up to you.
I've worked in hotels for 15+ years and have had to deal with somewhat similar situations. One time, we had a woman come in with her young daughter (4 or 5 years old) for an afternoon stay. Both were extremely scared. The woman asked that if anyone called we could say she wasn't there. We weren't really given a stroy, but from what the woman had told us, everyone assumed that the girl's father was trying to take the daughter from her and that they were both in danger. She left a few hours after checking in - about an hour later the father and the police came by. Apparently, he had legal custody of the girl and the woman had illegally taken her away. Suddenly everyone felt very bad. People originally thought they were doing the right thing by protecting this woman when we were actually helping her commit a crime.
As for your situation, I would have appologized to her for not being able to provide a room then asked if there were any other way i could have helped. Call someone, call authorities, help find a room at another hotel...
I've worked in hotels for 15+ years and have had to deal with somewhat similar situations. One time, we had a woman come in with her young daughter (4 or 5 years old) for an afternoon stay. Both were extremely scared. The woman asked that if anyone called we could say she wasn't there. We weren't really given a stroy, but from what the woman had told us, everyone assumed that the girl's father was trying to take the daughter from her and that they were both in danger. She left a few hours after checking in - about an hour later the father and the police came by. Apparently, he had legal custody of the girl and the woman had illegally taken her away. Suddenly everyone felt very bad. People originally thought they were doing the right thing by protecting this woman when we were actually helping her commit a crime.
Exactly my point. Imagine that a man had entered under exactly the same circumstances as the woman. Let's say that, somehow even, he appears as distressed as the woman (you can already tell where I'm going, can't you?).
Would you afford him this 'help'?
No.
Furthermore, I'll commit only half of myself to the belief that you *wouldn't* assume he was trying to pull something illicit.
You assumed that the woman wasn't being deceitful, that there's some innate sense in which she's likely to be in trouble if she looks it. This is almost reprehensibly sexist, but I guess I can't damn you for it as it is probably biologically favorable. But I can say you weren't appropriately applying your faculty of reason, a deficit you should try to mend.
And, I posit that the same thing was just as likely for the OP, and so, it is wrong what he did.
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Are you guys ****ing retarded? While it's possible that the bruises were caused by something else, I think you would at least give her the benefit of the doubt and assume that they had been caused by something malicious.
While I agree that he probably should have consulted his boss, I think that in the heat of the situation it's completely possible that, for whatever reason he didn't. If you've ever been in a situation like this I think you'll know what I mean.
And as for the fact that he shouldn't be fired, if anything I would be more likely to hire someone like this simply because that they'd be of better moral character, something more important than turning any sort of profit.
Forget them, release, you did the right thing, be happy with yourself.
no? maybe yes? i believe there is no true right or wrong. right and wrong is simply defined by the moral code of society which has no real stature. it has tended to change from era to era. for example, a person who was renowned for killing a black man may now be considered morally corrupt. however, he happened to be right during his era. therefore i believe that we should accept their definition of right and say that he was a good man. history becomes too confusing if we keep on judging what is right or wrong by modern terms.
no? maybe yes? i believethere is no true right or wrong. right and wrong is simply defined by the moral code of society which has no real stature. it has tended to change from era to era. for example, a person who was renowned for killing a blck man may now be considered morally corrupt. however, hje happened to be right during his era. therefore i believe that we should accept their definition of right and say that he was a good man. history becomes too confusing if we keep on judging what is right or wrong by modern terms.
And they also thought the Sun orbited the Earth. Are we being pretentious to suggest that the Earth goes around the Sun?
Are you guys ****ing retarded? While it's possible that the bruises were caused by something else, I think you would at least give her the benefit of the doubt and assume that they had been caused by something malicious.
I didn't see her or her bruises, so I can't say anything about where they MIGHT have come from.
While I agree that he probably should have consulted his boss, I think that in the heat of the situation it's completely possible that, for whatever reason he didn't. If you've ever been in a situation like this I think you'll know what I mean.
I have been in this type of position many times - and have been burned enough to know that things aren't always what they seem and still have to protect myself. Again, I didn't see this particular woman so it's very hard to say exactly what I would have done.
And as for the fact that he shouldn't be fired, if anything I would be more likely to hire someone like this simply because that they'd be of better moral character, something more important than turning any sort of profit.
Firing a person can be much more complicated than you think. For instance, if the hotel has a policy of firing people for breaking this particular rule, then they pretty much have to fire him for doing the same thing. Otherwise, they leave themselves open to lawsuits from former employees who were fired for doing what he did. Unfortunately, moral character doesn't matter in this type of situation.
It may sound like I'm being very cold towards this situation, but in reality the OP seems to have made a few assumptions about this woman. As far as I can tell, he was never told where the bruises came from nor was he given any reason to believe that her life was actually in danger. He seems to have assumed that if she left his hotel, something very bad was going to happen to her. Without having actually seen her or having any more information, it's hard to know if his assumptions were truly justified. I do feel bad that he was fired for trying to help someone.
I don't think you did anything wrong. Against the hotel rules sure, but who gives? Your own personal ethics, morals and standards should never be compromised, especially not for a job. If your ok with what you did you don't need to ask any of us here.
You were in the wrong here IMO. You have a job and you are working to do that job. You flatly disobeyed orders. If you worked at my job I would fire you too.
Besides why should you care about somebody you dont know like that. Its even worse to put your job on the line because of it.
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anyways ... off to look for a new job.
However, if it did look like she may have been in danger, it's probably good that you helped her and gave her a room or shelter. However, it probably would have been better to have you sit in the lobby while you get an ambulance or the police.
If so, that's hard to believe someone would still be so heartless and cold to still fire you. What a terrible owner. I do agree with Epitaph that it probably would have been more prudent to notify authorities about her being abused.
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I would argue that you didn't do "the right thing". You had specific instructions about what to do, and you disobeyed them. You were told to not give people without valid credit cards rooms, and did so anyway. I'd say you did the wrong thing. Even if she was a battered woman, she could've gone to a different hotel. I doubt yours is the only hotel in town. It wasn't your fault she didn't have a credit card, you should have explained the policy, and directed her to another hotel. At least that's what I would've done.
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someone's life >>> losing a couple bucks
Still, you could have not lost your job by calling the authorities. On the other hand, she likely would have left had you done so. If she had wanted to go to the cops instead of your hotel, she likely would have.
You didn't do the right thing. You made some strange assumption that the woman was "in trouble," not taking into account the possibility that your rational faculties were exaggerating certain features of the woman.
You then made this other strange assumption that given a person "in trouble," it's somehow more important (or as you said, "the right thing to do") to intervene in favor of mending the "trouble," over two things:
1) respect of the wishes of a person (your employer) to impose a structure of his choosing on things of his possession as afforded him by right (that *his* hotel is maintained as he wishes); and
2) respect of the explicit requirement of your employer for you to accord with his wishes, as his employee, and in the relevant employment context (that *you* maintain his hotel as he wishes, as one of his contractual hotel-maintainment people)
.
Now those are two separate things. If you want to uphold your position - that to have denied the woman would have been reprehensible and to accept her was not - you will consider both of these.
You can try yourself out on us, or you can take something right to your ex-employer. Choose both if you pay the Entwine cost.
Entwine - 'Resolve a debate'
However, I have once been punished for doing the right thing - I used to be bullied, I would inform the relevant guardians in the area, and they, being incompetent schoolteachers, would indiscriminately impose penalties on all people remotely involved in the bullying incident - including, always, the person with crap beat out of him: me.
Doesn't really reveal anything to talk about, though.
Awesome avatar provided by Krashbot @ [Epic Graphics].
And synchronicity, what if there was no police station in sight? What if she was fleeing from somebody and the first safe haven she saw was the hotel, even if she perferred the police? Should she have risked looking for the police? I know I wouldn't have.
We don't know that her life was in danger. Maybe those bruises came from something innocent, I also agree with HH that they weren't as severe as Release said. We also have no evidence that her life was in danger. Also correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't there shelters for abused women? Also, nobody answered my point about other hotels. :(. Basically, Release had been given simple, reasonable instructions, and chose not to follow them, end of story. He was punished according to known guidelines that he knowingly violated. Release is in the wrong here, while his employer had every right to fire him.
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On the other hand, let's say the woman did trash the room and then take off. In this case, the owner (not you) would probably be left on the hook with a huge bill to work off and, in addition, you broke a promise.
Had I been the owner, I'd like to think I wouldn't have fired you. It would be unfortunate that you had broken your promise to me, but then it would also be clear that you are a person of depth and compassion, and that is a person that is generally beneficial for any organization to have around.
I don't know what it's like in your area, but around here there are shelters for women or others who are being abused. Are there any there and, if so, did you call them? They aren't that great to be at, I'm sure, but then the woman if she really was in danger would have been safe, your boss would not have taken a huge risk because of your decision and you wouldn't have broken a contract.
I wouldn't blame yourself too much for your actions though, you had to make a tough decision and you did just fine.
Also, did you try to talk to your boss about this before you agreed to put her up for the night? Maybe if you had reasoned with him, he wouldn't have been mad.. or would've had an idea as to what to do next.
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Besides, I'm of the opinion that if they wanted to go to a shelter for people like that they probably would've, assuming they know about such places. If they don't that's another thing entirely. Either way it doesn't hurt to bring up such places if you truely think that.
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I've worked in hotels for 15+ years and have had to deal with somewhat similar situations. One time, we had a woman come in with her young daughter (4 or 5 years old) for an afternoon stay. Both were extremely scared. The woman asked that if anyone called we could say she wasn't there. We weren't really given a stroy, but from what the woman had told us, everyone assumed that the girl's father was trying to take the daughter from her and that they were both in danger. She left a few hours after checking in - about an hour later the father and the police came by. Apparently, he had legal custody of the girl and the woman had illegally taken her away. Suddenly everyone felt very bad. People originally thought they were doing the right thing by protecting this woman when we were actually helping her commit a crime.
As for your situation, I would have appologized to her for not being able to provide a room then asked if there were any other way i could have helped. Call someone, call authorities, help find a room at another hotel...
Exactly my point. Imagine that a man had entered under exactly the same circumstances as the woman. Let's say that, somehow even, he appears as distressed as the woman (you can already tell where I'm going, can't you?).
Would you afford him this 'help'?
No.
Furthermore, I'll commit only half of myself to the belief that you *wouldn't* assume he was trying to pull something illicit.
You assumed that the woman wasn't being deceitful, that there's some innate sense in which she's likely to be in trouble if she looks it. This is almost reprehensibly sexist, but I guess I can't damn you for it as it is probably biologically favorable. But I can say you weren't appropriately applying your faculty of reason, a deficit you should try to mend.
And, I posit that the same thing was just as likely for the OP, and so, it is wrong what he did.
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While I agree that he probably should have consulted his boss, I think that in the heat of the situation it's completely possible that, for whatever reason he didn't. If you've ever been in a situation like this I think you'll know what I mean.
And as for the fact that he shouldn't be fired, if anything I would be more likely to hire someone like this simply because that they'd be of better moral character, something more important than turning any sort of profit.
Forget them, release, you did the right thing, be happy with yourself.
And they also thought the Sun orbited the Earth. Are we being pretentious to suggest that the Earth goes around the Sun?
I didn't see her or her bruises, so I can't say anything about where they MIGHT have come from.
I have been in this type of position many times - and have been burned enough to know that things aren't always what they seem and still have to protect myself. Again, I didn't see this particular woman so it's very hard to say exactly what I would have done.
Firing a person can be much more complicated than you think. For instance, if the hotel has a policy of firing people for breaking this particular rule, then they pretty much have to fire him for doing the same thing. Otherwise, they leave themselves open to lawsuits from former employees who were fired for doing what he did. Unfortunately, moral character doesn't matter in this type of situation.
It may sound like I'm being very cold towards this situation, but in reality the OP seems to have made a few assumptions about this woman. As far as I can tell, he was never told where the bruises came from nor was he given any reason to believe that her life was actually in danger. He seems to have assumed that if she left his hotel, something very bad was going to happen to her. Without having actually seen her or having any more information, it's hard to know if his assumptions were truly justified. I do feel bad that he was fired for trying to help someone.
Besides why should you care about somebody you dont know like that. Its even worse to put your job on the line because of it.