Karn, Scion of Urza
4
Legendary Planeswalker — Karn
5
+1 Reveal the top two cards of your library. An opponent chooses one of them. Put that card into your hand and exile the other with a silver counter on it.
-1 Put a card you own with a silver counter on it from exile into your hand.
-2 Create a 0/0 colorless Construct artifact creature token with "This creature gets +1/+1 for each artifact you control.
Draws cards a creates bodies that grow, no ultimate but a good ammount of loyalty. Interesting to have a colourless walker.
Solid card on its own, which gets better if you support the artifact.dec. I don't know if this is necessarily better than Coercive Portal, since it can be attacked to death and your opponent controls the quality of your card draw (until you start {-1}-ing him). But it's still a colorless Planeswalker with high starting Loyalty that generates card advantage and can create bodies. I think it will be good enough for most cubes.
Think he will test better than he looks, and he looks solid.
Big fan.
4cmc
Can protect himself by generating a body and still staying at a healthy 3 loyalty first turn.
Generates card advantage while ticking UP to 6 loyalty first turn.
Supports Artifacts.dec even more.
I like it. It slots into anything, but rewards you for playing in a particular direction. I also like that it's not insanely splashy. It's a sober card that rewards skillful play on behalf of both players. I'd like to get this card, but I'll forgo it if it's expensive.
I’m a bit more skeptical of this one. Giving your opponent control over your draw is a lot worse than it looks, especially if they’re applying pressure and you need to draw an out. You really want to be able to take advantage of the artifact clause for this to be more than a janky Coercive Portal.
You give them control, but you also can -1 and get whatever you didn't get before hand. It might not be great in a deck without (m)any other artifacts, but for a number of cubes that's not a real hurdle in my experience and being able to make threats that typically get better as the game progresses is really nice.
Seems excellent in the artifact.dec, not sure If I'd play it without a fair # of artifacts though.
What I like about Karn similar to coercive portal is it's easy to power him out very fast with cards like mana vault/mana crypt etc.
Sometimes other planeswalkers take an extra turn to come out because you don't have the WW for elspeth or whatever.
He also scales well into the late game (in an artifact.dec) making legitimate threats.
Auto-include for my cube, but actually not sure how good he'll be in a low artifact count large unpowered cube.
He's not always better when you want a portal, there are a lot of real scenarios where your karn draws a card and gains you X life, which is definitely worse than Coercive Portal. IMO Karn is overall better, but there are certainly a number of boards where Portal draws you more cards due to not being able to attack it.
In the scenarios where you want a Coercive Portal, Karn just seems like a better Coercive Portal. If that is the kind of effect you're in the market for, you can just alternate between the +1 and -1 ability. If you do, the end result is a Coercive Portal with the upside of being one card faster and the drawback of being killed by attacks.
Add in the fact that you can make scaling dudes, and I think Karn is the complete package. If your first token is always a 1/1, Karn gets worse, but a lot of decks that want an effect like this run a few artifacts. Obviously Karn gets nutty when he's making 5/5s or whatever, but I don't really think he needs more than one artifact out for the -2 to be solid.
Except you always get the worst card first and he can be attacked to death. Outside of the artifact deck he's just a meh coercive portal, a card I'm already not running. He doesn't even threaten ticking up to an ult. This seems like a pass to me
This looks like a great card for the artifact.dec. Outside of it, though, I think this Karn would be underwhelming. It has potential, but I'm concerned it'll be too narrow.
I think Karn is much better than Cohersive Portal. Although you're getting the worse of the two cards, from the second turn onwards you don't just have to draw another card but you have the choice of what card you would like to draw. You get the final choice of what you're drawing, not your opponent. In fact, choosing a card off the top of your library or an exiled card is much stronger then just drawing a card. If you have any board presence, feel free to leave an exiled card in exile while you dig through your library more.
Coming down for 4 generic mana and replacing himself while leaving 6 loyalty behind are very strong stats. Allowing you card selection going forward or a body in a pinch is fantastic. I think Karn is a great cube card and is just busted in artifact decks.
I get the coercive portal reference but I am surprised that is the only way this guy is being looked at. Portal can't generate an army of dudes. And yes you only get 2 2/2 if you only go the token route but he is so much more than that. I think after a couple of +1 the - will look amazing. And simple dropping this on turn 2 or 3 off a man rock and making a couple 3/3 before drawing cards seems so good. And in powered with moxes going on is really exciting to me.
Yeah, if you’re powering Karn out with artifact mana on turn 2 or 3, he seems real sick. Granted, most planeswalkers will be, but it’s hard to get double colored mana for something like JTMS or Chandra. This is something you can realistically drop on turn 2 off of something like Ancient Tomb into a mana rock and win with ease.
I think Karn is probably a better overall card than Portal, but Portal certainly has merits that don't apply to Karn. For example, I don't play Portal at the moment, but I'm leaning towards testing Karn. But I'm just not convinced that it's flat better than Portal is.
Ran 3 cubes and Karn saw a lot of play today. Was very impressed.
In an artifact focused deck, in a powered cube with high artifact density, current opinion (subject to change with more testing) is that Karn Scion of Urza is one of the most powerful planeswalkers ever printed (Not JTMS/Dack fayden tier, but I'm guessing he belongs in the category below that).
Summary what makes him powerful:
1) His casting cost is so easy to achieve, it's easy to power him out fast and consistent in fast mana cubes.
2) In an artifact deck, he can make large threats (4/4 - 6/6) in the mid game for little investment. (while still threatening to draw cards after).
3) His loyalty is so high, that it is very difficult to kill him with combat damage before he gets off 2 activations, yet he's powerful enough that you cannot ignore him.
...What HAPPENED to Karn?? I know he's a pacifist but that doesn't mean he should be asking his opponent's for advice on spells to cast...
I'm initially a little underwhelmed for cube applications. Drawing cards every turn off a 4 drop is sick, don't get me wrong. When I consider that he can plus to draw, plus to draw, plus to draw, and then -1 once to draw 3 cards, I'm more excited. He's not an underpowered planeswalker, I just have a bad taste in my mouth from his last ability having nothing to do with the rest of the card and only being decent in an artifact shell. But IN those shells... make a 4/4, make a 5/5, draw a card, make a 6/6?
But ANY drafter getting to play this? Now THAT's very exciting. That's my favorite part about Wurmcoil and OG Karn, everyone wants a piece!
EDIT: just reread. You can't draw multiple cards with the -1. Sad face.
Ran 3 cubes and Karn saw a lot of play today. Was very impressed.
In an artifact focused deck, in a powered cube with high artifact density, current opinion (subject to change with more testing) is that Karn Scion of Urza is one of the most powerful planeswalkers ever printed (Not JTMS/Dack fayden tier, but I'm guessing he belongs in the category below that).
Summary what makes him powerful:
1) His casting cost is so easy to achieve, it's easy to power him out fast and consistent in fast mana cubes.
2) In an artifact deck, he can make large threats (4/4 - 6/6) in the mid game for little investment. (while still threatening to draw cards after).
3) His loyalty is so high, that it is very difficult to kill him with combat damage before he gets off 2 activations, yet he's powerful enough that you cannot ignore him.
I'm really curious how he performs in a Not-really artifact focused average midrange or control deck. In theory I think he's a fine card there too.
Yeah me too.. For example in a deck with a couple mana rocks and that's it. I think he'll be playable, but noticeably worse. The option to make huge creature that scales, is just so much more powerful than making a 2/2 body that downticks his loyalty -2.
Honestly, just going to 6 loyalty and drawing a card each turn is quite powerful. (high loyalty is a form of self protection)
4
Legendary Planeswalker — Karn
5
+1 Reveal the top two cards of your library. An opponent chooses one of them. Put that card into your hand and exile the other with a silver counter on it.
-1 Put a card you own with a silver counter on it from exile into your hand.
-2 Create a 0/0 colorless Construct artifact creature token with "This creature gets +1/+1 for each artifact you control.
Draws cards a creates bodies that grow, no ultimate but a good ammount of loyalty. Interesting to have a colourless walker.
Also, please use proper tags when creating SCD threads. I fixed this one.
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Definitely IN my artifact cube.
Big fan.
4cmc
Can protect himself by generating a body and still staying at a healthy 3 loyalty first turn.
Generates card advantage while ticking UP to 6 loyalty first turn.
Supports Artifacts.dec even more.
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What I like about Karn similar to coercive portal is it's easy to power him out very fast with cards like mana vault/mana crypt etc.
Sometimes other planeswalkers take an extra turn to come out because you don't have the WW for elspeth or whatever.
He also scales well into the late game (in an artifact.dec) making legitimate threats.
Auto-include for my cube, but actually not sure how good he'll be in a low artifact count large unpowered cube.
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Except you always get the worst card first and he can be attacked to death. Outside of the artifact deck he's just a meh coercive portal, a card I'm already not running. He doesn't even threaten ticking up to an ult. This seems like a pass to me
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Coming down for 4 generic mana and replacing himself while leaving 6 loyalty behind are very strong stats. Allowing you card selection going forward or a body in a pinch is fantastic. I think Karn is a great cube card and is just busted in artifact decks.
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I don't think this is true.
I think Karn is probably a better overall card than Portal, but Portal certainly has merits that don't apply to Karn. For example, I don't play Portal at the moment, but I'm leaning towards testing Karn. But I'm just not convinced that it's flat better than Portal is.
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In an artifact focused deck, in a powered cube with high artifact density, current opinion (subject to change with more testing) is that Karn Scion of Urza is one of the most powerful planeswalkers ever printed (Not JTMS/Dack fayden tier, but I'm guessing he belongs in the category below that).
Summary what makes him powerful:
1) His casting cost is so easy to achieve, it's easy to power him out fast and consistent in fast mana cubes.
2) In an artifact deck, he can make large threats (4/4 - 6/6) in the mid game for little investment. (while still threatening to draw cards after).
3) His loyalty is so high, that it is very difficult to kill him with combat damage before he gets off 2 activations, yet he's powerful enough that you cannot ignore him.
Last Updated 02/07/24
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I'm initially a little underwhelmed for cube applications. Drawing cards every turn off a 4 drop is sick, don't get me wrong. When I consider that he can plus to draw, plus to draw, plus to draw, and then -1 once to draw 3 cards, I'm more excited. He's not an underpowered planeswalker, I just have a bad taste in my mouth from his last ability having nothing to do with the rest of the card and only being decent in an artifact shell. But IN those shells... make a 4/4, make a 5/5, draw a card, make a 6/6?
But ANY drafter getting to play this? Now THAT's very exciting. That's my favorite part about Wurmcoil and OG Karn, everyone wants a piece!
EDIT: just reread. You can't draw multiple cards with the -1. Sad face.
This is still the best place for high-power-level cube chat & debate.
Here's to many more years at MTGS *clink*
Yeah me too.. For example in a deck with a couple mana rocks and that's it. I think he'll be playable, but noticeably worse. The option to make huge creature that scales, is just so much more powerful than making a 2/2 body that downticks his loyalty -2.
Honestly, just going to 6 loyalty and drawing a card each turn is quite powerful. (high loyalty is a form of self protection)
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