MTG Salvation

Hello all! This is the official thread for any general CCC&G Pro Tour discussion, as well as the place to find all the latest updates and official standings.

How the Circuit works:

The Point of All This
We want to make CCC+G as fun as possible for everybody. Because of this it is important that we get regular feedback about how the circuit is running. This is the thread to do so, so if you have any comments, suggestions, or queries, please post them here rather than individual contest threads.

Thanks,
—The Pro Tour Committee

This post now contains a link to the Google Doc with comprehensive Pro Point scores.

Pro Tour Points Full Leaderboard

Updated as of 12/09/2012

Just for S&G, what would a person need to do to be a part of the 'committee'?

Speaking of which also, I will be PMing you in regards to something in which bothers me about a particular aspect of this. Maybe we can facilitate this.

Quote from PsiJet

Just for S&G, what would a person need to do to be a part of the 'committee'?

Speaking of which also, I will be PMing you in regards to something in which bothers me about a particular aspect of this. Maybe we can facilitate this.

The committee was chosen beforehand.

I suggest sending communication to me, also. I'd be happy to discuss any aspect of the system, especially before we really get into it full force.

Quote from Prophylaxis

I have a question - seeing that this was enacted pretty close to the January DCC, will I still get my trophy?

January trophies will still be awarded, though TBH I actually forgot you won. Putting in the request now...

All of the January games will receive trophies, since that was before we enacted the policy. Due to the DCC lapsing this month I was considering not awarding trophies for February at all, but if there's significant opposition to that idea I could be swayed. For now though, January is the end of traditional trophies here in CCC.

So what kind of time frame will MQ's occur on?

I can make announcement posts in here, apparently.

The Monthly Qualifier games are starting up again!

CCL Signups are here!

The MCC is currently looking for judges and organizers! Remember, there are pro point rewards for judging and organizing, so you can still work your way to POY this way!

The DCC will be restarting in March after a month-long hiatus.

Signups for March's CFG, "Blockbusters," are here!


March is the first month where all of our Monthly Qualifiers are running full-steam, so I'm very excited to really usher in the new Pro Tour Circuit.

Have fun, everybody!



Other bookkeeping announcements: The MCC will no longer receive sticky threads for the individual rounds. The discussion threads for the DCC, CCL, and MCC will stay stuck though. This thread also exists for general MQ discussion, of course.
The MCC Hall of Fame has also been moved into the Card of the Month subforum.

With victory in MCC February, Tesco(black)lotus is the next qualifier for the Pro Tour!

I'm wondering if anyone has any opinions on how qualifying contests that are longer than a month should be handled. Contests such as the Mechanic Creator's Contest, Magic Wars, or Design Idol might take significantly more than a month. Do we want to allow these contests to contribute points and invites to the Invitational? I see a couple of options:
1. Only the MCC, DCC, CCL, and monthly Flamingo games qualify people.
2. Long-format games qualify more people, at a rate of roughly one per month of length. So if we run Magic Wars for two months, the top 2 finishers could qualify. Should everyone else receive double points?
3. Long-format games qualify one winner, points the same as any monthly contest.

Should there be a limit on the number of long-format games run per season? This depends somewhat on how long they actually are, we could support say three two month games, run one at a time, or maybe allow a couple to go on simultaneously, but stagger the entry periods somewhat to allow people to pick them up, starting mid-month for example to avoid overlapping with the beginning and end of the monthly games.

Quote from Gerrard"s Mom

I'm wondering if anyone has any opinions on how qualifying contests that are longer than a month should be handled. Contests such as the Mechanic Creator's Contest, Magic Wars, or Design Idol might take significantly more than a month. Do we want to allow these contests to contribute points and invites to the Invitational? I see a couple of options:
1. Only the MCC, DCC, CCL, and monthly Flamingo games qualify people.
2. Long-format games qualify more people, at a rate of roughly one per month of length. So if we run Magic Wars for two months, the top 2 finishers could qualify. Should everyone else receive double points?
3. Long-format games qualify one winner, points the same as any monthly contest.

Should there be a limit on the number of long-format games run per season? This depends somewhat on how long they actually are, we could support say three two month games, run one at a time, or maybe allow a couple to go on simultaneously, but stagger the entry periods somewhat to allow people to pick them up, starting mid-month for example to avoid overlapping with the beginning and end of the monthly games.

My vote is for Option 1, but possibly awarding pro points for the longer-form games without offering guaranteed qualifiers. But also possibly not. I don't want there to be so many point-awarding or spot-awarding games that the only players who make it are those with the most free time. I don't mean that condescendingly or negatively — I just think the current system does a good job of giving people equal shot, and of offering enough variety.

Check out post #2 for the up to date leaderboard guys.

Quote from Gerrard"s Mom

I'm wondering if anyone has any opinions on how qualifying contests that are longer than a month should be handled. Contests such as the Mechanic Creator's Contest, Magic Wars, or Design Idol might take significantly more than a month. Do we want to allow these contests to contribute points and invites to the Invitational? I see a couple of options:
1. Only the MCC, DCC, CCL, and monthly Flamingo games qualify people.
2. Long-format games qualify more people, at a rate of roughly one per month of length. So if we run Magic Wars for two months, the top 2 finishers could qualify. Should everyone else receive double points?
3. Long-format games qualify one winner, points the same as any monthly contest.

Should there be a limit on the number of long-format games run per season? This depends somewhat on how long they actually are, we could support say three two month games, run one at a time, or maybe allow a couple to go on simultaneously, but stagger the entry periods somewhat to allow people to pick them up, starting mid-month for example to avoid overlapping with the beginning and end of the monthly games.

Quote from Socrates

My vote is for Option 1, but possibly awarding pro points for the longer-form games without offering guaranteed qualifiers. But also possibly not. I don't want there to be so many point-awarding or spot-awarding games that the only players who make it are those with the most free time. I don't mean that condescendingly or negatively — I just think the current system does a good job of giving people equal shot, and of offering enough variety.

Well...

4 MQ games x 6 month season = 24 spots, which equal exactly enough spots to qualify. Obviously there will be some redundancy with winners, but IF there isn't, where would fit in 6 more spots if we ran three 2 month contests? My opinion is that these contests should only effect the pro points (which really only matter for the Card Maker of the Year trophy). The pro points should be doubled since the contests are much longer, which will normally lead to the same outcome anyways of awarding a place in the Pro Tour if there are overlaps with winners.

EDIT:

Quote from CCC&G Pro Tour

Check out post #2 for the up to date leaderboard guys.

This doesn't seem to account for the judging points. Has that been decided yet? Also, I think it would be beneficial for the organizers and player base to see which contests have been incorporated into the scores ie.

Player of the Year standings here! (Updates = Strikethrough: MCC February, CCL February, DCC February, CF February):
Prophylaxis 24
Rithaniel 18
MirrorEntity 18
yewlas 14
etc...

I've been away so I'm not sure exactly what the current standings reflect. MirrorEntity will need to speak to that.

I will say that I like keeping a list of which results are in, not just the last received results.

-Leaderboard has been updated.
- Judge points have been added.
- Updated to ATTWN I. Socrates has earned an invite to the Pro Tour!
- Google Doc added to post #3 for full details.

Hooray!

Coming up in April:

The MCC is still looking for judges! This month, ced395 and MirrorEntity will be taking the lead — Help them out by judging! Don't forget, by judging you are guaranteed pro points that count toward your qualification totals! Signups start April 1st!

The CCL is still taking signups! Limited time offer! Things close up on March 31st! MDenham's got it this time.

This month, CFG will be taking a break from brand-new games to revive an old favorite — Transmogrify That Card! Gerrard's Mom will be taking us on a trip down nostalgia lane during April. Signups are open now!

And, of course, the DCC keeps truckin' along every day. Don't forget, if you miss one day, you can still enter! Enter as many or as few times as you like!

March organizers: Don't forget to PM your results to the CCC&G Pro Tour account. It saves work on our end and makes the record keeping go that much more smoothly.

I'm excited for April! Things have been going well so far this year and we're going to try to keep up the momentum for you. That said, don't hesitate to post and comments, questions, or suggestions right here in this thread. I promise everything will be looked at.

Thanks, and have a great month of custom card creation!

—:meg:

Leaderboard updated (fixed KK's double listing finally! :p)

Gerrard's Mom has earned a qualification! Congrats.

***The contents of this post are coming from a bystander who spent quite a bit of time thinking about this. Even though I don't really have any time to play these contests anymore, I still put some thought into this during this time. These thoughts came over the course of a few months, which is why this is only getting posted now and not when the announcement first happened.

Quote from CCC&G Pro Tour

The Point of All This
We want to make CCC+G as fun as possible for everybody. Because of this it is important that we get regular feedback about how the circuit is running. This is the thread to do so, so if you have any comments, suggestions, or queries, please post them here rather than individual contest threads.

Thanks,
—The Pro Tour Committee

I'm wondering if I'm alone in my opinion here.

I know that the announcement for this change in how this place was run came back in January, but I didn't have enough points to back up the claim I had at the time.

Am I alone in stating that I don't like the prize support here that much?
(Looking at the original thread this was in, it was 34 in support of this to 4 against, but I don't think there were any posts actually made that stated an opinion against it.)

I know that having 37 trophies a year may be a bit excessive, but cutting it down to 4 seems like a bit much.

So two of these are tied in to year-round things (Player of the Year, Card Maker of the Year), which kinda makes sense.

The other two, however:
To even get a chance of winning one of these, you must win an MQ (or have a really high score among non-winners, we'll get to that part later on). Most of these MQs (MCC, DCC, CCL) are things that made you win a trophy under the old system. Now, if you win one of these contests, you have a chance to win a trophy, and based on what I'm reading, it looks like the Pro Tour would be another contest that might work in a similar way to the MCC or CCL.

The part about high scorers among non-winners pretty much means you should play (almost) every MQ there is, and get a good score on as many as possible in order to get a chance to get these wildcard spots. It seems logical that a person who does this well should be allowed to qualify, so I'm fine with this.

However, the actual thing about having to win the Pro Tour to get a trophy though, is where I kinda think it's a bit too hard compared to the previous system. First you have to qualify in one of the ways that was mentioned, then you need to win a specific contest (the Pro Tour itself) to get a trophy. If you don't win, the next chance you get is six months later. where you must (pretty much) repeat the same process again (unless you were second place in the previous PT, in which case you may skip the first part of the process).

Now I guess this is coming from someone who liked the old system and is used to it; maybe if it was like this from the start, this post wouldn't exist.
But am I the only one thinking there are too few trophies now?


The contents of the spoiler below are the changes I would make assuming I was in charge (in case anyone is open to suggestions). While I don't expect you to change the system immediately because one random bystander said so, I still have an opinion to share.

Anyways, so this is a long post from me. I'm not going to outright reject the idea of a CCC&G Pro Tour, but my points stand.

~Aurora

Quote from Aurora Illumina

But am I the only one thinking there are too few trophies now?

To be honest, I'd prefer to have other forums cut down on the number of awarded trophies as well. Somewhere around 15-20 trophies a year between the entire site would make more sense.

When are going to update points with the March DCC points? Or it already happened?

Quote from Solesticio

When are going to update points with the March DCC points? Or it already happened?

Was just getting to that

luminum can destroyed the competition in DCC March and has an invite to the Pro Tour!

Balefire edged out on top in the March MCC and also earns an invite!

Scores updated with these contests.

Regarding the trophies:

I'm very reluctant to change anything before we at the very least see how this system works.

I have nothing to say regarding the perceived value of trophies or whatnot, but I'm open to entertaining this conversation in December after we see how it goes.

—:meg:

I prefer it this way. You actually have to achieve something to get one, which makes them all the more special.

Please remember that at the end of the day trophies are just vaguely cup-shaped blobs of yellow pixels. I don't think it's a battle worth fighting.

This just occurred to me, but presuming the Pro Tour is a month long event, for those unable to partucipate, or who have to leave midway for whatever reason, do invites carry over to the next Pro Tour?