Trance N (Whenever this creature would untap, you may put N +1/+1 counters on it instead.)
502.3 suggests this doesn't work, not during the untap step at least, which is not what I want.
502.3. No player receives priority during the untap step, so no spells can be cast or resolve and no
abilities can be activated or resolve. Any ability that triggers during this step will be held until the
next time a player would receive priority, which is usually during the upkeep step.
1) Is that right?
2) If so, how could I change the ability to work around that?
3) Would changing 502.3 so that this works be insane?
1-2) "Whenever" and "instead" are mutually exclusive on abilities. "Whenever" suggests a triggered ability, whereas "instead" indicates a replacement effect. Given that you're talking about priority issues, I'm assuming you want this to be a triggered ability, not a replacement effect. If that's the case, then the proper wording would be something like the following, depending on your exact functionality:
a. Trance N (Whenever this creature becomes untapped, put N +1/+1 counters on it.)
b. Trance N (You may choose not to untap this creature if it would untap. When you do, put N +1/+1 counters on it.)
c. Trance N (You may choose not to untap this creature during your untap step. When you do, put N +1/+1 counters on it.)
3) Currently, all abilities that trigger during the untap step and during the upkeep step are put onto the stack at the same time, which means that abilities that triggered during the untap step and abilities that triggered during the upkeep step can be intermingled with each other. If the intention is to have the counters be put on before any abilities that care about the upkeep resolve, you have two primary options:
a. Make it so that during the upkeep step, all abilities that triggered during the untap step must be put onto the stack last, after abilities that triggered during the upkeep step. This would make it so that the abilities that triggered during the untap step resolve first. Between (a) and (b), I think this implementation is cleaner.
b. Modify the rules of timing and priority such that abilities can be put onto the stack during the untap step. However, players would not get priority in between abilities being put on and leaving the stack, so effectively the abilities would resolve immediately. One of the problems with this approach is that if any abilities trigger upon counters being put on will be put on top of the stack and will also resolve immediately. Between (a) and (b), I think this is the worse implementation to use.
Of course, modifying these rules would slightly change interactions with some already-existing mechanics (such as inspired).
---
On the other hand, if the intention is for this to be a replacement effect, you can just change "Whenever" to "If" in the reminder text and you'll be golden.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
How to use card tags (please use them for everybody's sanity)
[c]Lightning Bolt[/c] -> Lightning Bolt
[c=Lightning Bolt]Apple Pie[/c] -> Apple Pie
Vowels-Only Format Minimum deck size: 60 Maximum number of identical cards: 4 Ban list: Cards whose English names begin with a consonant, Unglued and Unhinged cards, cards involving ante, Ancestral Recall
502.3 suggests this doesn't work, not during the untap step at least, which is not what I want.
1) Is that right?
2) If so, how could I change the ability to work around that?
3) Would changing 502.3 so that this works be insane?
RUNIN: Norse mythology set (awaiting further playtesting)
FATE of ALARA: Multicolour factions (currently on hiatus)
Contibutor to the Pyrulea community set
I'm here to tell you that all your set mechanics are bad
#Defundthepolice
a. Trance N (Whenever this creature becomes untapped, put N +1/+1 counters on it.)
b. Trance N (You may choose not to untap this creature if it would untap. When you do, put N +1/+1 counters on it.)
c. Trance N (You may choose not to untap this creature during your untap step. When you do, put N +1/+1 counters on it.)
3) Currently, all abilities that trigger during the untap step and during the upkeep step are put onto the stack at the same time, which means that abilities that triggered during the untap step and abilities that triggered during the upkeep step can be intermingled with each other. If the intention is to have the counters be put on before any abilities that care about the upkeep resolve, you have two primary options:
a. Make it so that during the upkeep step, all abilities that triggered during the untap step must be put onto the stack last, after abilities that triggered during the upkeep step. This would make it so that the abilities that triggered during the untap step resolve first. Between (a) and (b), I think this implementation is cleaner.
b. Modify the rules of timing and priority such that abilities can be put onto the stack during the untap step. However, players would not get priority in between abilities being put on and leaving the stack, so effectively the abilities would resolve immediately. One of the problems with this approach is that if any abilities trigger upon counters being put on will be put on top of the stack and will also resolve immediately. Between (a) and (b), I think this is the worse implementation to use.
Of course, modifying these rules would slightly change interactions with some already-existing mechanics (such as inspired).
---
On the other hand, if the intention is for this to be a replacement effect, you can just change "Whenever" to "If" in the reminder text and you'll be golden.
[c]Lightning Bolt[/c] -> Lightning Bolt
[c=Lightning Bolt]Apple Pie[/c] -> Apple Pie
Vowels-Only Format
Minimum deck size: 60
Maximum number of identical cards: 4
Ban list: Cards whose English names begin with a consonant, Unglued and Unhinged cards, cards involving ante, Ancestral Recall
Well, the intention is for you to be able to put +1/+1 counters on creatures instead of untapping them, but this is probably the right way.
Thanks.
RUNIN: Norse mythology set (awaiting further playtesting)
FATE of ALARA: Multicolour factions (currently on hiatus)
Contibutor to the Pyrulea community set
I'm here to tell you that all your set mechanics are bad
#Defundthepolice