In my experimenting with Triggers that say 'Whenever you Discard' a card with Cycling.
Cycling requires Discard and other Discard costs will also trigger 'Whenever you Discard' has anyone tried to abuse this in a deck and do you believe its worth trying to make it slightly competitive? The cards im thinking about working around are Glint-Horn Buccaneer,Hekma Sentinels,Teferi's Tutelage,Ghostly Pilfere,Subira,Tulzidi Caravanner,Drannith Stinger,Teferi Master of Time,The Royal Scions with spells and lands with Cycling.
Cycle everything away, and win in a combo of mana rituals, bringing all the cycling creatures back, for more cycling.
Can even win by simply casting the creatures in a big turn.
----
In other formats cycling and discarding your own stuff is more niche and currently not very competitive.
In modern the closest might be a Hollow One BR discard deck, that is much more about discarding a lot of stuff and abusing the mechanics to be fast:
The most expensive parts are the lands, which can be somewhat removed for much cheaper alternatives (at least for starters).
----
These decks can win for sure.
The slower cycling decks of the old days are not competitive at all anymore, but people even build some fun "cycling" Commander decks that at least work to some degree.
Old cards that are wheel effects (discard your hand draw 7 new cards) help to fuel a lot of these decks, as that is just powerful.
The best use of cycling cards I've seen in Arena is the Treasure Flare deck. Its just cycling lands. Treasure Hunt and Zenith Flare. It reliably kills turn 4 uninterrupted turn 5 or six through disruption.
Cycle everything away, and win in a combo of mana rituals, bringing all the cycling creatures back, for more cycling.
Can even win by simply casting the creatures in a big turn.
----
In other formats cycling and discarding your own stuff is more niche and currently not very competitive.
In modern the closest might be a Hollow One BR discard deck, that is much more about discarding a lot of stuff and abusing the mechanics to be fast:
The most expensive parts are the lands, which can be somewhat removed for much cheaper alternatives (at least for starters).
----
These decks can win for sure.
The slower cycling decks of the old days are not competitive at all anymore, but people even build some fun "cycling" Commander decks that at least work to some degree.
Old cards that are wheel effects (discard your hand draw 7 new cards) help to fuel a lot of these decks, as that is just powerful.
Your list and that list both interest me and I am putting the deck together (in paper) as we speak. Thanks in advance. Not sure why its calling those my deck, sorry.
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Playing since 1994: Currently MAGS (HomeBrew),Standard & Pauper (Pioneer and Modern are degenerate trash formats)
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Your list and that list both interest me and I am putting the deck together (in paper) as we speak. Thanks in advance. Not sure why its calling those my deck, sorry.
I played a bunch with the deck and looked what cards tend to get stuck in hand and what work as intended.
I started with 4 of everything and reduced what i did not want 2+ of in hand.
The deck is incredible consistent anyway, due to all the cycling you easily see halve your deck before an opponent could kill you.
All the point removal the opponent has against creatures is basically worthless, if at all, they kill the Stinger asap (which you dont have to play before you absolutely have to, or against decks with not much removal you want it out asap).
The deck absolutely wants as many creatures as possible, and rituals that are creatures work even better, as they double dip into the Song and get returned with Reaping (Tinderwall even blocks some random 2 power creature from time to time, which there are plenty around), it gets better against decks with Daze and the like, as you can use it to pay for the counterspells.
For cycling creatures the colorless cycling is best, as you can always pay for it. Black cyclers work if you opt to play a mono black manabase, in which the non-black rituals dont work well.
Some random enemies will have flyers for you to kill (like a flipped Delver), so the Deadshot can do extra work against some decks.
Lotus Petal is a fairly bad ritual for the deck, its neither a creature and doesnt draw cards, most of the time you have plenty of mana if a Song resolves thats easily 7+ mana right away, if you can reap and get all these cyclers back you are good to go.
Land Grant is always a land, it fixes mana for green and removes land later on, while providing storm too.
The only time its really bad, is if you draw multiple lands with early cyclers, but if your opponent isnt killing you quickly, you can just slow down and play the lands.
Chromatic Star is a easy play to wash your mana in the colors you need and draw a card to find your Songs and Reaps.
Sphere is just a 5th one, having multiple of them isnt really hurting, as you can always cycle them for a new card if needed.
It often happens that you draw your entire deck, then you need just 2+ red mana to play the Stingers and burn them out.
The sideboard all depends on what hate your opponent is bringing and how you can counter them.
They bring artifacts to remove the grave, or spells that prevent damage, the single Flaring Pain wins against that for your combo turn (otherwise you go for a combo turn and just die as you cant burn them for the turn, yes you can often just play the creatures from your hand and that can win too, but not if they can swing for the win before you can).
You can pack many different cards in the sideboard depending on what opponents you might face, as this deck cycles so much, you have a good chance to see the sideboard cards basically guaranteed.
Deck is fun, just not for the opponent (as they often cant do anything against the combo with their maindeck at all, so its a race who wins first).
Cycling requires Discard and other Discard costs will also trigger 'Whenever you Discard' has anyone tried to abuse this in a deck and do you believe its worth trying to make it slightly competitive? The cards im thinking about working around are Glint-Horn Buccaneer,Hekma Sentinels,Teferi's Tutelage,Ghostly Pilfere,Subira,Tulzidi Caravanner,Drannith Stinger,Teferi Master of Time,The Royal Scions with spells and lands with Cycling.
Former Rules Advisor
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3 Tinder Wall
4 Deadshot Minotaur
4 Drannith Healer
4 Drannith Stinger
4 Imposing Vantasaur
4 Monstrous Carabid
4 Street Wraith
4 Cabal Ritual
4 Manamorphose
4 Reaping the Graves
4 Songs of the Damned
4 Land Grant
1 Chromatic Sphere
4 Chromatic Star
1 Swamp
3 Forest
2 Barren Moor
Sideboard:
4 Geothermal Crevice
4 Red Elemental Blast
1 Tinder Wall
4 Dissenter's Deliverance
1 Flaring Pain
----
Cycle everything away, and win in a combo of mana rituals, bringing all the cycling creatures back, for more cycling.
Can even win by simply casting the creatures in a big turn.
----
In other formats cycling and discarding your own stuff is more niche and currently not very competitive.
In modern the closest might be a Hollow One BR discard deck, that is much more about discarding a lot of stuff and abusing the mechanics to be fast:
4 Flameblade Adept
4 Flamewake Phoenix
4 Hollow One
4 Lightning Skelemental
4 Street Wraith
4 Bloodghast
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Unearth
4 Burning Inquiry
4 Goblin Lore
2 Swamp
3 Mountain
3 Arid Mesa
3 Blood Crypt
4 Bloodstained Mire
4 Blackcleave Cliffs
The most expensive parts are the lands, which can be somewhat removed for much cheaper alternatives (at least for starters).
----
These decks can win for sure.
The slower cycling decks of the old days are not competitive at all anymore, but people even build some fun "cycling" Commander decks that at least work to some degree.
Old cards that are wheel effects (discard your hand draw 7 new cards) help to fuel a lot of these decks, as that is just powerful.
1 Brallin, Skyshark Rider
1 Cloud of Faeries
1 Curator of Mysteries
1 Drannith Stinger
1 Ephara, God of the Polis
1 Eternal Dragon
1 Herald of the Forgotten
1 Nimble Obstructionist
1 Niv-Mizzet, the Firemind
1 Psychosis Crawler
1 Rielle, the Everwise
1 Rooting Moloch
1 Shabraz, the Skyshark
1 Spellpyre Phoenix
1 Sun Titan
1 Surly Badgersaur
1 The Locust God
1 Valiant Rescuer
1 Vizier of Tumbling Sands
1 Yidaro, Wandering Monster
1 Complicate
1 Countervailing Winds
1 Fierce Guardianship
1 Forsake the Worldly
1 Hieroglyphic Illumination
1 Miscalculation
1 Neutralize
1 Radiant's Judgment
1 Starstorm
1 Swords to Plowshares
1 Zenith Flare
1 Boon of the Wish-Giver
1 Decree of Annihilation
1 Decree of Justice
1 Dismantling Wave
1 Idyllic Tutor
1 Migratory Route
1 Slice and Dice
1 Abandoned Sarcophagus
1 Alhammarret's Archive
1 Arcane Signet
1 Azorius Signet
1 Boros Signet
1 Commander's Sphere
1 Fluctuator
1 Izzet Signet
1 Raugrin Crystal
1 Sol Ring
1 Talisman of Creativity
1 Astral Drift
1 Astral Slide
1 Cast Out
1 Crystalline Resonance
1 Decree of Silence
1 Drake Haven
1 Lightning Rift
1 New Perspectives
1 Ominous Seas
1 Reconnaissance Mission
1 Shark Typhoon
1 Tectonic Reformation
1 Teferi's Ageless Insight
1 Ash Barrens
1 Azorius Chancery
1 Command Tower
1 Desert of the Fervent
1 Desert of the Mindful
1 Desert of the True
1 Drifting Meadow
1 Exotic Orchard
1 Forgotten Cave
1 Hallowed Fountain
1 Irrigated Farmland
1 Izzet Boilerworks
1 Lonely Sandbar
1 Myriad Landscape
1 Mystic Monastery
1 Prairie Stream
1 Raugrin Triome
1 Reliquary Tower
1 Remote Isle
1 Sacred Foundry
1 Secluded Steppe
1 Shivan Reef
1 Skycloud Expanse
1 Smoldering Crater
1 Steam Vents
1 Thriving Isle
3 Plains
4 Island
2 Mountain
For more inspiration for Commander decks check out:
https://edhrec.com/commanders/gavi-nest-warden
It has a very nice feature to see the average cards people put in decks of that theme.
WUBRG#BlackLotusMatterWUBRG
๐ฎ๐ฎ๐ฎ #BlueLivesMatter ๐ฎ๐ฎ๐ฎ
I may be a little late on this one but I was wondering your justifications for some of the changes in your Pauper deck from say this list from CFB
https://www.channelfireball.com/all-strategy/articles/pauper-storm-is-back/
Your list and that list both interest me and I am putting the deck together (in paper) as we speak. Thanks in advance. Not sure why its calling those my deck, sorry.
STOP using "dude/bro" as a pejorative or insult. Grow up.
Margaret Thatcher: โThe problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.โ
Benjamin Franklin: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
Martin Luther King Jr.: "I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character."
I played a bunch with the deck and looked what cards tend to get stuck in hand and what work as intended.
I started with 4 of everything and reduced what i did not want 2+ of in hand.
The deck is incredible consistent anyway, due to all the cycling you easily see halve your deck before an opponent could kill you.
All the point removal the opponent has against creatures is basically worthless, if at all, they kill the Stinger asap (which you dont have to play before you absolutely have to, or against decks with not much removal you want it out asap).
The deck absolutely wants as many creatures as possible, and rituals that are creatures work even better, as they double dip into the Song and get returned with Reaping (Tinderwall even blocks some random 2 power creature from time to time, which there are plenty around), it gets better against decks with Daze and the like, as you can use it to pay for the counterspells.
For cycling creatures the colorless cycling is best, as you can always pay for it. Black cyclers work if you opt to play a mono black manabase, in which the non-black rituals dont work well.
Some random enemies will have flyers for you to kill (like a flipped Delver), so the Deadshot can do extra work against some decks.
Lotus Petal is a fairly bad ritual for the deck, its neither a creature and doesnt draw cards, most of the time you have plenty of mana if a Song resolves thats easily 7+ mana right away, if you can reap and get all these cyclers back you are good to go.
Land Grant is always a land, it fixes mana for green and removes land later on, while providing storm too.
The only time its really bad, is if you draw multiple lands with early cyclers, but if your opponent isnt killing you quickly, you can just slow down and play the lands.
Chromatic Star is a easy play to wash your mana in the colors you need and draw a card to find your Songs and Reaps.
Sphere is just a 5th one, having multiple of them isnt really hurting, as you can always cycle them for a new card if needed.
It often happens that you draw your entire deck, then you need just 2+ red mana to play the Stingers and burn them out.
The sideboard all depends on what hate your opponent is bringing and how you can counter them.
They bring artifacts to remove the grave, or spells that prevent damage, the single Flaring Pain wins against that for your combo turn (otherwise you go for a combo turn and just die as you cant burn them for the turn, yes you can often just play the creatures from your hand and that can win too, but not if they can swing for the win before you can).
You can pack many different cards in the sideboard depending on what opponents you might face, as this deck cycles so much, you have a good chance to see the sideboard cards basically guaranteed.
Deck is fun, just not for the opponent (as they often cant do anything against the combo with their maindeck at all, so its a race who wins first).
WUBRG#BlackLotusMatterWUBRG
๐ฎ๐ฎ๐ฎ #BlueLivesMatter ๐ฎ๐ฎ๐ฎ