I'm a bit unclear on this interaction (Leyline of Abundance + Gyre Sage when the Sage has no +1/+1 counters on it), and it's largely due to a confusion I'm having with the meaning of the phrase "whenever you tap a creature for mana".
From rulings for the Leyline: An ability that triggers “whenever you tap a creature for mana” triggers only if you activate a mana ability of a creature including T in its cost.
From rulings for the Sage: Gyre Sage’s last ability is a mana ability. (Also, that ability does have T in the cost.)
Unless I'm mistaken, so long as no other effects and summoning sickness isn't a factor, nothing prevents you from tapping the sage to activate it's ability, so it could be tapped, the ability would go on the stack, and then the ability would see that there are zero counters as it resolves, and so would produce zero G on it's own. This is where I get tripped up, and can see two possibly scenarios depending on how that phrase works:
1) The phrase means something akin to "whenever you activate a creature's tapped mana ability"
The Sage taps for zero mana, but because it's mana ability was activated the Leyline creates a bonus G. This would mean that in a situation where there were two untapped Forests and a tappable Sage with zero counters on the field you could cast a spell costing up to GGG.
2) The phrase means something akin to "whenever a creature's tapped mana ability generates mana"
The Sage taps for zero mana, and since it generated no mana the Leyline also creates no mana, meaning in the same scenario (two untapped forests and a tappable Sage with zero counters) you could only cast a spell costing up to GG.
My gut tells me the correct interpretation is #2, but something about the phrasing and the rules leave me just enough doubt I'm not sure... Much thanks if you can help clarify this for me.
106.12a. An ability that triggers whenever a permanent "is tapped for mana" or is tapped for mana of a specified type triggers whenever such a mana ability resolves and produces mana or the specified type of mana.
As you can see, Leyline will only trigger if the Gyre Sage actually produces mana.
Also, to clarify a point above: the Sage's ability is a mana ability and, thus, does not use the stack. It resolves immediately after being activated.
Thank you! That's what I suspected, I just couldn't find the rule. Also thank you for catching my stack usage mistake - wasn't even thinking about that as I was typing...whoops!
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From rulings for the Leyline: An ability that triggers “whenever you tap a creature for mana” triggers only if you activate a mana ability of a creature including T in its cost.
From rulings for the Sage: Gyre Sage’s last ability is a mana ability. (Also, that ability does have T in the cost.)
Unless I'm mistaken, so long as no other effects and summoning sickness isn't a factor, nothing prevents you from tapping the sage to activate it's ability, so it could be tapped, the ability would go on the stack, and then the ability would see that there are zero counters as it resolves, and so would produce zero G on it's own. This is where I get tripped up, and can see two possibly scenarios depending on how that phrase works:
1) The phrase means something akin to "whenever you activate a creature's tapped mana ability"
The Sage taps for zero mana, but because it's mana ability was activated the Leyline creates a bonus G. This would mean that in a situation where there were two untapped Forests and a tappable Sage with zero counters on the field you could cast a spell costing up to GGG.
2) The phrase means something akin to "whenever a creature's tapped mana ability generates mana"
The Sage taps for zero mana, and since it generated no mana the Leyline also creates no mana, meaning in the same scenario (two untapped forests and a tappable Sage with zero counters) you could only cast a spell costing up to GG.
My gut tells me the correct interpretation is #2, but something about the phrasing and the rules leave me just enough doubt I'm not sure... Much thanks if you can help clarify this for me.
As you can see, Leyline will only trigger if the Gyre Sage actually produces mana.
Also, to clarify a point above: the Sage's ability is a mana ability and, thus, does not use the stack. It resolves immediately after being activated.