What? I'm not trolling! I'm just drowning in doubt that I'm the only one even suggesting that Lorwyn is a miniature world.
I posted something in the thread with the land art, too. The Mountain and Swamp art are part of one canvas - when you see the whole canvas, the Mountain is just a bunch of rocks next to a puddle that's supposed to be a Swamp.
And look again at the art here with the giant. See how they've cleverly worked it to deny you a way to get perspective? You can't see the feet of the elves in front, nor the two archers. The "giant" is no help, but you can look at the Elf going to leap the tree. He's only as tall as the diameter of the trunk.
Now, we can get a sense of the height of the tree because we can see the roots and the top branches. From your experience with trees, you can imagine how wide the trunk is, and that's not very much. The Elves are rather short. Okay, not quite as short as my first mistake, but dangit, they're short!
Even ignoring the general senselessness of the theory, notice the second elf on left is casting a shadow that stops just short of the grass. From the angle and width it does not appear to me the elf is a million miles away from giant grass.
It might be a reprint. Frozen Solid was in Scourge, and was reprinted for Coldsnap. I know I read somewhere that the Scourge printing was allegedly the reprint in accordance with the 'mysterious lost Ice Age set' thing, but still. It's possible.
Please read the thread; back in post #20, I already explained that "Grand Melee" has nothing to do with Lorwyn. Read this article by Brian David-Marshall and you'll see that the Grand Melee is an event being held at Gen Con.
And also, on http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=events/magic/07gencon, the image appears right under the section about the Grand Melee event and is captioned as "Every Melee battler gets his or her very own playmat." So speculating about whether the card Grand Melee is in Lorwyn on the basis of this picture does not really make sense.
- Jon Finkel Facts: (follow the link at left to see more Facts, or add more Facts!)
- Chuck Norris counted to infinity twice—because he was trying to count how much damage Jon Finkel deals in an average game.
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If Horizon Canopy / Edge of Autumn are any indication of humanoid / tree size relationships in Lorwyn, the plane probably just has really, really big trees.
If Horizon Canopy / Edge of Autumn are any indication of humanoid / tree size relationships in Lorwyn, the plane probably just has really, really big trees.
that, OR lorwyn has been proven to have normal sized nature stuff and edge and canopy are from another part of magic's infamous "maybe" future:rolleyes:
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The internet is like drugs, it can be alot of fun, but most people on it say really stupid stuff
What? I'm not trolling! I'm just drowning in doubt that I'm the only one even suggesting that Lorwyn is a miniature world.
I posted something in the thread with the land art, too. The Mountain and Swamp art are part of one canvas - when you see the whole canvas, the Mountain is just a bunch of rocks next to a puddle that's supposed to be a Swamp.
And look again at the art here with the giant. See how they've cleverly worked it to deny you a way to get perspective? You can't see the feet of the elves in front, nor the two archers. The "giant" is no help, but you can look at the Elf going to leap the tree. He's only as tall as the diameter of the trunk.
Now, we can get a sense of the height of the tree because we can see the roots and the top branches. From your experience with trees, you can imagine how wide the trunk is, and that's not very much. The Elves are rather short. Okay, not quite as short as my first mistake, but dangit, they're short!
Here's a hint: If you've been suggesting a theory for months, and people on the Rumor Mill still havent picked up on it, you're wrong.
Seriously. No one thinks this is a minature world at this point but you. Three months ago? Lots of people did. No one does now. It doesnt fit with any of the art we've gotten.
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Cyme we inne frið, fram the grip of deaþ to lif inne ðis smylte land.
I'm not sure if there are different races of elves in Lorwyn, but as far as these ones go, they definitely match with the female on the book cover. Small, curved horns, and strange two-toed/hooved feet.
Here's a hint: If you've been suggesting a theory for months, and people on the Rumor Mill still havent picked up on it, you're wrong.
Seriously. No one thinks this is a minature world at this point but you. Three months ago? Lots of people did. No one does now. It doesnt fit with any of the art we've gotten.
I've been suggesting it for... I think four days. I've only mentioned it in two places, including here.
What was going on three months ago? What did we have back then?
... and where is this "art we've gotten" that derails this conjecture?
And why is it that everything I said was received in the harshest fashion? It's sort of hard to ignore being accused of trolling.
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Where are the Gencon Playmates!? I come in this thread for some good pics and all it is... is some elves and a Giant... oh wait... oh Playmats.... nevermind.
What? I'm not trolling! I'm just drowning in doubt that I'm the only one even suggesting that Lorwyn is a miniature world. See how they've cleverly worked it to deny you a way to get perspective? Okay, not quite as short as my first mistake, but dangit, they're short!
Okay, if you're not trolling, thank you. It just seems incredibly outlandish and outlandish posts in the face of reason make me think people are being trolly or misleading. Assuming you're not trying to get the thread off course, good.
I still don't see what you're talking about, however. Here's the art, slightly zoomed, and flipped horizontally to provide a different "angle".
I don't know much about art perspective, so using the term has little meaning coming from me. But I'll just point out the giant's foot, next to which is a tree trunk and an elf. The giant's foot is just wider than the tree trunk, and the elf's arm is about exactly as wide as the tree trunk. Logic then tells us that the giant's foot is just wider than the length of an elf's arm.
The art below shows that an elf's arm is about half the length of its entire body:
If a giant's foot is just bigger than an elf's arm, and an elf's body is twice as big as an elf's arm, then:
An Elf is about the same size as a Giant's foot.
And that's exactly how we'd expect it to be, because Giants are much bigger than Elves, and always have been.
As for "the world is huge and the being on it are tiny", that doesn't seem to be the case if an elf's arm as long as the width of a tree trunk.
But hey, take whatever you want from the picture. If it's a world of miniature creatures for you, go for it. That might actually be a cool setting for Magic.
I'm not sure if there are different races of elves in Lorwyn, but as far as these ones go, they definitely match with the female on the book cover. Small, curved horns, and strange two-toed/hooved feet.
I noticed that too. I think I remmeber something being mentioned on different races of elves, or different classes anyways. These almost look satyr-like. Color me excited. Also, I'm much more excited about this block than Onslaught block in terms of a tribal-ish playing style. I thought that Onslaught block (I think that's what it was... was it legions?) had ugly art, lame creature types, and a general clumsiness about it. Ravnica, Time Spiral, and even 10th have all been rock solid, on all fronts. It's a beautiful time to be playing magic. Kudos to Wizards!
*whew* Thank you for your patient response, R_e. It's amazing how an image can become so different under a simple manipulation*. I am forced to see it as you describe.
At this point, to continue to believe in the miniature world would be to bow to my human dispositions and commit a (common) fallacy of belief perseverance.
You can read about it here (off-topic; please, respond by PM only):
If someone experiences something that gives him a belief (call it belief A), and has even a few events that seem to "confirm" belief A for him, a curious psychological phenomenon occurs. That is, even if this person comes to *know* that his original reason to believe A is flawed, or even if serious doubt is cast on all of his individual reasons, the belief may still persist. Under the additional condition that there is no direct contradiction of a substantial number of his reasons, the belief in A will persist to a degree that, from the outside, most agree is irrational - because it doesn't fit with the person's belief in the reasons.
Basically, a person can simultaneously have one belief, while substantially disbelieving every reason to have that belief - and be fully aware that he has lost his reasons for believing the first thing. This is one of those nonlinearity problems that ties up psychology oh-so-much.
Obvious exploitations of this phenomenon are all forms of smear campaigning. Giving someone a bad impression of something is really frickin' easy, if you talk first.
However, the land art still makes me suspicious.
*My sister is an art student. We have both noticed that an image of a person can look perfectly normal when drawn, but look absolutely ridiculous when flipped (on a computer). I have posited that, if the image doesn't look right when flipped, when the object depicted is something we know should survive symmetry, there must in fact be something wrong with the original. Some illusion created by the mind is disguising it.
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Awesome avatar provided by Krashbot @ [Epic Graphics].
Sakura, thanks for posting this art (the link in the first post wasn't working for some reason). I'd been wondering what the playmat was going to look like. Not quite as good as the Stuffy or Akroma playmats, but better than the terrible States playmats (and I know for a fact this is one of the good mousepad-style playmats, not the paper-thin type).
Still, with the tournament only being $15 (if I saw correctly), its not a bad deal just for the playmat.
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Hmm, maybe that felled tree is actually the reason why the elves attack the giant. Anyone else who gets that impression?
Similar to the old llanowar elves perhaps.
That's an awful lot of broken twigs... that giant's in for one hell of a world of hurt then
I am really enjoying this new direction theyre going with the art and I hope the set provides some originality to match that of the artwork. There is not a lot new to say about the artwork but the look of that giant adds to my belief that part of the overlap between timespiral and lorwyn will be the blurring of color lines but in the case of lorwyn it will be creature types that get changed around like white getting more giants.
Also I will smack the next person that makes some pointless comment about how thin the elves are or how they all look like supermodels or how they dont eat or anything of that sort. I think most of us already agree that women are being held to an unfair beauty standard and there is really no point in making an issue of it every single time a piece of art is revealed that has a woman with either large breasts or a thin physique. This is just a card game and they are not saying this is how women should look in reality its just how they look in this block. I still have yet to hear of one guy waving a magic card in his girlfriend/fiancee/wife's face saying "why cant you look more like her"
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From MaRo
Every rarity gets good cards. That means that some mythic rares will be tournament quality as will some commons, some uncommons and some rares. My promise wasn't that mythic rares wouldn't get good cards but that we wouldn't limit the good cards to only being mythic rare.
Bear this in mind the next time a powerful mythic rare is spoiled
Thanks to chaostheory90 for finding this quiz for me
Also I will smack the next person that makes some pointless comment about how thin the elves are or how they all look like supermodels or how they dont eat or anything of that sort. I think most of us already agree that women are being held to an unfair beauty standard and there is really no point in making an issue of it every single time a piece of art is revealed that has a woman with either large breasts or a thin physique. This is just a card game and they are not saying this is how women should look in reality its just how they look in this block. I still have yet to hear of one guy waving a magic card in his girlfriend/fiancee/wife's face saying "why cant you look more like her"
You do realize that the Lorwyn Elves are supposedto be hellbent on being beautiful, right?
so after watching the gran melee and seeing alot of people giving up. (after no turn for 1 hour+) i'm glad i didn't join since it ended up going 12 hours. Now here is the question. I'm still looking for a playmat. if anyone has one they want to sell or know where to get one let me know. I love the artwork on it.
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Even ignoring the general senselessness of the theory, notice the second elf on left is casting a shadow that stops just short of the grass. From the angle and width it does not appear to me the elf is a million miles away from giant grass.
It's a bolas I think.
Please read the thread; back in post #20, I already explained that "Grand Melee" has nothing to do with Lorwyn. Read this article by Brian David-Marshall and you'll see that the Grand Melee is an event being held at Gen Con.
And also, on http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=events/magic/07gencon, the image appears right under the section about the Grand Melee event and is captioned as "Every Melee battler gets his or her very own playmat." So speculating about whether the card Grand Melee is in Lorwyn on the basis of this picture does not really make sense.
- Jon Finkel believes in maintaining a healthy, balanced diet. He gets all his fiber from eating Magic cards for breakfast, and all his protein from eating Magic players for lunch.
that, OR lorwyn has been proven to have normal sized nature stuff and edge and canopy are from another part of magic's infamous "maybe" future:rolleyes:
The internet is like drugs, it can be alot of fun, but most people on it say really stupid stuff
Here's a hint: If you've been suggesting a theory for months, and people on the Rumor Mill still havent picked up on it, you're wrong.
Seriously. No one thinks this is a minature world at this point but you. Three months ago? Lots of people did. No one does now. It doesnt fit with any of the art we've gotten.
I'm not sure if there are different races of elves in Lorwyn, but as far as these ones go, they definitely match with the female on the book cover. Small, curved horns, and strange two-toed/hooved feet.
Nath looks quite unlike these elves.
I've been suggesting it for... I think four days. I've only mentioned it in two places, including here.
What was going on three months ago? What did we have back then?
... and where is this "art we've gotten" that derails this conjecture?
And why is it that everything I said was received in the harshest fashion? It's sort of hard to ignore being accused of trolling.
Awesome avatar provided by Krashbot @ [Epic Graphics].
Okay, if you're not trolling, thank you. It just seems incredibly outlandish and outlandish posts in the face of reason make me think people are being trolly or misleading. Assuming you're not trying to get the thread off course, good.
I still don't see what you're talking about, however. Here's the art, slightly zoomed, and flipped horizontally to provide a different "angle".
I don't know much about art perspective, so using the term has little meaning coming from me. But I'll just point out the giant's foot, next to which is a tree trunk and an elf. The giant's foot is just wider than the tree trunk, and the elf's arm is about exactly as wide as the tree trunk. Logic then tells us that the giant's foot is just wider than the length of an elf's arm.
The art below shows that an elf's arm is about half the length of its entire body:
If a giant's foot is just bigger than an elf's arm, and an elf's body is twice as big as an elf's arm, then:
An Elf is about the same size as a Giant's foot.
And that's exactly how we'd expect it to be, because Giants are much bigger than Elves, and always have been.
As for "the world is huge and the being on it are tiny", that doesn't seem to be the case if an elf's arm as long as the width of a tree trunk.
But hey, take whatever you want from the picture. If it's a world of miniature creatures for you, go for it. That might actually be a cool setting for Magic.
.
Hey R_e, when did we get that art
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A truly great petition
I noticed that too. I think I remmeber something being mentioned on different races of elves, or different classes anyways. These almost look satyr-like. Color me excited. Also, I'm much more excited about this block than Onslaught block in terms of a tribal-ish playing style. I thought that Onslaught block (I think that's what it was... was it legions?) had ugly art, lame creature types, and a general clumsiness about it. Ravnica, Time Spiral, and even 10th have all been rock solid, on all fronts. It's a beautiful time to be playing magic. Kudos to Wizards!
Heehee, 100 posts!
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At this point, to continue to believe in the miniature world would be to bow to my human dispositions and commit a (common) fallacy of belief perseverance.
You can read about it here (off-topic; please, respond by PM only):
Basically, a person can simultaneously have one belief, while substantially disbelieving every reason to have that belief - and be fully aware that he has lost his reasons for believing the first thing. This is one of those nonlinearity problems that ties up psychology oh-so-much.
Obvious exploitations of this phenomenon are all forms of smear campaigning. Giving someone a bad impression of something is really frickin' easy, if you talk first.
However, the land art still makes me suspicious.
*My sister is an art student. We have both noticed that an image of a person can look perfectly normal when drawn, but look absolutely ridiculous when flipped (on a computer). I have posited that, if the image doesn't look right when flipped, when the object depicted is something we know should survive symmetry, there must in fact be something wrong with the original. Some illusion created by the mind is disguising it.
Awesome avatar provided by Krashbot @ [Epic Graphics].
Still, with the tournament only being $15 (if I saw correctly), its not a bad deal just for the playmat.
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That's an awful lot of broken twigs... that giant's in for one hell of a world of hurt then
Also I will smack the next person that makes some pointless comment about how thin the elves are or how they all look like supermodels or how they dont eat or anything of that sort. I think most of us already agree that women are being held to an unfair beauty standard and there is really no point in making an issue of it every single time a piece of art is revealed that has a woman with either large breasts or a thin physique. This is just a card game and they are not saying this is how women should look in reality its just how they look in this block. I still have yet to hear of one guy waving a magic card in his girlfriend/fiancee/wife's face saying "why cant you look more like her"
Bear this in mind the next time a powerful mythic rare is spoiled
Thanks to chaostheory90 for finding this quiz for me
You do realize that the Lorwyn Elves are supposed to be hellbent on being beautiful, right?
I think that giant is much bigger then a 4/4. There's seven elves trying to take him down and he's running over everyone.
I'd put him at least a 6/5 - 6/6 with some ability to prevent small amounts of damage like a "Callous Giant" effect.