No, it happens all the time. I like the Mindslaver lock on Turn 5, since it's basically a hard lock by that turn, but it's by no means an easy match-up. There's a lot of math that goes on in any given match relating to 12post, due to the way in which cards fall. It took me about 10 minutes just to make that Amulet of Vigor scenario due to the way in which the math works out.
What I'd really like to see is a Mindslaver deck that foregoes sweepers (or maybe uses All is Dust and O-Stone?) and just attempts to lock down the board itself with all its colorless mana. A sort of "mono-brown" control variant (which uses blue as a fall-back more than what I see as a crutch).
I might have missed the discussion after I got tired of the "ZOMG TARMOGOYF" whining, but what are the thoughts on Emrakul, the Aeons Torn? I didn't have a lot of time to talk to my modern players at FNM, but the few I did talk to seem very happy (or frustrated if they're not playing the deck) about having infinite turns on turn 4.
I still believe that WotC did a great job on the initial bannings, but they really did leave the doors open to a lot of other potentially degenerate combo decks.
Just so people are aware, the cloudpost deck DOES cast Emrakul on turn 4. My friend has been testing the deck to death, and it happens with reasonable frequency.
I don't know about 'infinite turns', but casting Emrakul on turn 4 usually seals it up anyway...
Also, this is not a rumor.
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Just so people are aware, the cloudpost deck DOES cast Emrakul on turn 4. My friend has been testing the deck to death, and it happens with reasonable frequency.
I don't know about 'infinite turns', but casting Emrakul on turn 4 usually seals it up anyway...
Also, this is not a rumor.
What do you mean by "this is not a rumor," that my post didn't belong in the thread?
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Yeah, I've been wondering what's up with that for a while now...
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"I am confident that if anyone actually
penetrates our facades, even the most
perceptive would still be fundamentally
unprepared for the truth of House Dimir."
Well, what happened is that we had a thread that was talking about Modern and a mod closed it because of and directed us to THIS THREAD.
Maybe if I had phrased it as ZOMG WHY DIDN'T THEY BAN EMRAKUL!!1!?1oneoneone!1!, it would have escaped mod attention like the Tarmogoyf topic did for over 20 freakin' pages.
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you're not being attacked by anyone it is ok I promise
Hey, you're misunderstanding. I'm not feeling attacked. Annoyed that once again one mod doesn't know what the other is doing? Yeah. Because there was no need to close the original thread and tell us to continue our discussions in this thread where yeah... it's sorta off topic. I'm being my usual sarcastic self.
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I hate this introduction of Modern, it's ruined my ability to buy efficient lands for my casual decks... I lost two auctions for playsets of shocklands for £30-£45 last night. That's just ridiculous. Thanks Wizards for forcing me to make proxies :(.
If (and true, it's a big if) WotC is smart, one of two things is happening:
1. Shocks will be reprinted in the return to Ravnica block
or (and more likely)
2. New lands will be printed. Hopefully like the M10-12 duals, but they'll count as individual land types. It won't be as good as a shock land on turn one, but after that it'll be a lot better.
With the way Modern prices are going through the roof (thanks ScalperCityGames.com), WotC is going to have to do some reprints of some sort if they want this format to take off.
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If (and true, it's a big if) WotC is smart, one of two things is happening:
1. Shocks will be reprinted in the return to Ravnica block
or (and more likely)
2. New lands will be printed. Hopefully like the M10-12 duals, but they'll count as individual land types. It won't be as good as a shock land on turn one, but after that it'll be a lot better.
With the way Modern prices are going through the roof (thanks ScalperCityGames.com), WotC is going to have to do some reprints of some sort if they want this format to take off.
Shocks can be printed in ANY block.
I don't know why people think they should only be in (the still far from confirmed) Rav 2.0 block.
Modern prices are shooting up because of demand, and also because CFB has a very aggressive buy list right now. SCG isn't the culprit this time.
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Just so people are aware, the cloudpost deck DOES cast Emrakul on turn 4. My friend has been testing the deck to death, and it happens with reasonable frequency.
I don't know about 'infinite turns', but casting Emrakul on turn 4 usually seals it up anyway...
Also, this is not a rumor.
Since there's Crystal Shard, you bounce Mr. Spaghetti and continue casting the noodles and taking extra turns...
Since there's Crystal Shard, you bounce Mr. Spaghetti and continue casting the noodles and taking extra turns...
The optimal lists wouldn't run something durdly like that.
Hardcasting Emrakul on turn 4 is all you need.
You don't need to run a card like Crystal Shard, it isn't needed to win at all.
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Shocks can be printed in ANY block.
I don't know why people think they should only be in (the still far from confirmed) Rav 2.0 block.
Yes, I know that Rav 2.0 is not confirmed. I'm not like the multitude of people that seem to populate this place that take a random person's word as fact. And yes, they can be reprinted at any time. However...
1. The return to Ravnica looks pretty likely by the pattern of sets. Logically they fit there if it's going to happen.
2. It's too late to fit the shocks into Innistrad, and with 10 lands they have to print them in a large set. I don't think there's recent precedent to show they would use 5 rare slots in each of 2 smaller sets. When Innistrad was developed, WotC had no way of knowing that the lands would be so in demand because they traditionally don't think that far ahead. They could do M13, but they seem to dislike enemy colors working together in the core set, so the block after Innistrad is the soonest and most logical set to do this.
Personally, I'm hoping for a new type of land that's better than the shocks. I'm trying to find the article the owner of the store I run FNM at talked about (yeah, I know, the "my local store owner says" thing, but I'm actually looking for the proof) where MaRo said that the designers don't like the idea of having to pay 3 life total when you fetch a shock land. Me personally, I love it. But if that's true, then turn one fetching a new Glacial Fortress that counts as an Island and Plains still has it coming into play tapped, but from turn two on it's pretty good.
>Claim they have to print all 10 shocklands in the Large Set.
>Looks at Ravnica.
>4 shocks in first set, 3 in the second, 3 in the third.
They could Easily spread them out over all three sets if they wanted to.
However, I don't think they will make it to Innistrad, but they would be INSANE to not put them in M13 and then reprint the Enemy Fetchlands in the Ravnica 2.0 Block. It would be like Printing money ffs!
Aaaand you could have said it without the sarcasm, but I'll still try and have an adult conversation with you.
Yep, they could spread it across a block. It'd help all 3 sets of the block to sell, but with their habit of short-printing the 2 smaller sets it'd drive up the prices of those lands. Furthermore, the game has changed once again since Ravnica, and I think that they have to print all 10 lands (either new or reprinted) together or you're going to hear cries of favoritism as certain lands are easier to get for modern and standard than others, creating a real or perceived unfair advantage.
As for the fetch lands, it's just personal opinion and vague recollection of something I might have read from WotC years ago, but putting fetches and anything other than basic lands for them to fetch together in Standard is something they don't want to do.
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Aaaand you could have said it without the sarcasm, but I'll still try and have an adult conversation with you.
Yep, they could spread it across a block. It'd help all 3 sets of the block to sell, but with their habit of short-printing the 2 smaller sets it'd drive up the prices of those lands. Furthermore, the game has changed once again since Ravnica, and I think that they have to print all 10 lands (either new or reprinted) together or you're going to hear cries of favoritism as certain lands are easier to get for modern and standard than others, creating a real or perceived unfair advantage.
As for the fetch lands, it's just personal opinion and vague recollection of something I might have read from WotC years ago, but putting fetches and anything other than basic lands for them to fetch together in Standard is something they don't want to do.
that's why this is the perfect time for shock reprints, even if it is just the allied pairs or something.
12post, which I was playing but found out it's insanely boring
zoo - don't like mindless aggro
affinity - same
combo (hive mind, cascade, etc) don't like these either, the only combo I like is depths
I don't forget if I forget something. Maybe aggro elves is tier1 too.
I was very happy because of this new cheap eternal format but it looks like I won't even be playing it since I don't like any of the best decks. I'll wait for my legacy deadguy ale to get some decent replacement for SFM and vindicate, because right now it can't compete against any of the modern decks.
zoo - don't like mindless aggro
affinity - same
the only combo I like is depths
I don't understand how you say Zoo and Affinity are mindless yet the only combo you like is getting a 20/20 indestructible that is by far the most mindless thing one can do. Hello I pay 2 black. Hello here is my 20/20.
I don't understand how you say Zoo and Affinity are mindless yet the only combo you like is getting a 20/20 indestructible that is by far the most mindless thing one can do. Hello I pay 2 black. Hello here is my 20/20.
Wizards has literally no obligation to reprint anything, people seem to forget this. Sure the format was created so they can reprint anything they want but that doesn't mean they have to. It really depends on how much they actually want to push the format, they clearly didn't want to support legacy since they didn't reprint a lot of the staples they are not on the reserve list (the duals are the only real staples on the reserve list). Not to mention it doesn't make sense financially for them to push players towards eternal formats since they make less money off of eternal players since they are less likely to buy product since they only get maybe a card a set thats playable.
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On Mono Black in Commander:
Quote from BlackJack68 »
But whomever your commander is, Cabal Coffers is really in charge.
I think the appropriate response from WotC is to take a wait and see approach with reprints. I don't think it's bad for an old format to have $50-$60 nonland staples. People invest in a format and as long as the pricing doesn't threaten the viability of the format(as has happened with Vintage and Legacy), they will continue to do that.
The shocklands seem to be a big request around here for reprinting, yet alot of people don't realize that cards like reflecting pool and filter lands are both viable alternatives to fix your mana in alot of decks. Even glimmervoid is fine in affinity strategies. 2 or 3 life if fetched for an untapped land DOES matter in this format. Zoo finds itself at 12-14 by turn 3 alot of the time from it's own cards. Add to this that you can play cards like Dismember and other phyrexian cards whereas a shock heavy deck won't be able to get away with it and you get a legitimate competitor to shocklands in filters and pools.
The shocklands seem to be a big request around here for reprinting, yet alot of people don't realize that cards like reflecting pool and filter lands are both viable alternatives to fix your mana in alot of decks. Even glimmervoid is fine in affinity strategies. 2 or 3 life if fetched for an untapped land DOES matter in this format. Zoo finds itself at 12-14 by turn 3 alot of the time from it's own cards. Add to this that you can play cards like Dismember and other phyrexian cards whereas a shock heavy deck won't be able to get away with it and you get a legitimate competitor to shocklands in filters and pools.
Honestly, I think the problem could be addressed one of two ways: 1) reprint of the shocklands or 2) print another set of duals with the basic land types and a different drawback. This would drive the price on them down ($15 tops).
The issue is not necessairly that there aren't "viable" (read: almost as good) alternatives out there. The issue that you have the flagship fundamental resource of a format as being the chase rares of the format. Its sheer idiocy. WotC has (thankfully) gotten away from it in standard and extended. No reason for them not to keep up the trend.
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What I'd really like to see is a Mindslaver deck that foregoes sweepers (or maybe uses All is Dust and O-Stone?) and just attempts to lock down the board itself with all its colorless mana. A sort of "mono-brown" control variant (which uses blue as a fall-back more than what I see as a crutch).
Just so people are aware, the cloudpost deck DOES cast Emrakul on turn 4. My friend has been testing the deck to death, and it happens with reasonable frequency.
I don't know about 'infinite turns', but casting Emrakul on turn 4 usually seals it up anyway...
Also, this is not a rumor.
Twitter
What do you mean by "this is not a rumor," that my post didn't belong in the thread?
"I am confident that if anyone actually
penetrates our facades, even the most
perceptive would still be fundamentally
unprepared for the truth of House Dimir."
Maybe if I had phrased it as ZOMG WHY DIDN'T THEY BAN EMRAKUL!!1!?1oneoneone!1!, it would have escaped mod attention like the Tarmogoyf topic did for over 20 freakin' pages.
you're not being attacked by anyone it is ok I promise
Hey, you're misunderstanding. I'm not feeling attacked. Annoyed that once again one mod doesn't know what the other is doing? Yeah. Because there was no need to close the original thread and tell us to continue our discussions in this thread where yeah... it's sorta off topic. I'm being my usual sarcastic self.
If (and true, it's a big if) WotC is smart, one of two things is happening:
1. Shocks will be reprinted in the return to Ravnica block
or (and more likely)
2. New lands will be printed. Hopefully like the M10-12 duals, but they'll count as individual land types. It won't be as good as a shock land on turn one, but after that it'll be a lot better.
With the way Modern prices are going through the roof (thanks ScalperCityGames.com), WotC is going to have to do some reprints of some sort if they want this format to take off.
Shocks can be printed in ANY block.
I don't know why people think they should only be in (the still far from confirmed) Rav 2.0 block.
Modern prices are shooting up because of demand, and also because CFB has a very aggressive buy list right now. SCG isn't the culprit this time.
Twitter
Since there's Crystal Shard, you bounce Mr. Spaghetti and continue casting the noodles and taking extra turns...
The optimal lists wouldn't run something durdly like that.
Hardcasting Emrakul on turn 4 is all you need.
You don't need to run a card like Crystal Shard, it isn't needed to win at all.
Twitter
Yes, I know that Rav 2.0 is not confirmed. I'm not like the multitude of people that seem to populate this place that take a random person's word as fact. And yes, they can be reprinted at any time. However...
1. The return to Ravnica looks pretty likely by the pattern of sets. Logically they fit there if it's going to happen.
2. It's too late to fit the shocks into Innistrad, and with 10 lands they have to print them in a large set. I don't think there's recent precedent to show they would use 5 rare slots in each of 2 smaller sets. When Innistrad was developed, WotC had no way of knowing that the lands would be so in demand because they traditionally don't think that far ahead. They could do M13, but they seem to dislike enemy colors working together in the core set, so the block after Innistrad is the soonest and most logical set to do this.
Personally, I'm hoping for a new type of land that's better than the shocks. I'm trying to find the article the owner of the store I run FNM at talked about (yeah, I know, the "my local store owner says" thing, but I'm actually looking for the proof) where MaRo said that the designers don't like the idea of having to pay 3 life total when you fetch a shock land. Me personally, I love it. But if that's true, then turn one fetching a new Glacial Fortress that counts as an Island and Plains still has it coming into play tapped, but from turn two on it's pretty good.
Aaaand you could have said it without the sarcasm, but I'll still try and have an adult conversation with you.
Yep, they could spread it across a block. It'd help all 3 sets of the block to sell, but with their habit of short-printing the 2 smaller sets it'd drive up the prices of those lands. Furthermore, the game has changed once again since Ravnica, and I think that they have to print all 10 lands (either new or reprinted) together or you're going to hear cries of favoritism as certain lands are easier to get for modern and standard than others, creating a real or perceived unfair advantage.
As for the fetch lands, it's just personal opinion and vague recollection of something I might have read from WotC years ago, but putting fetches and anything other than basic lands for them to fetch together in Standard is something they don't want to do.
that's why this is the perfect time for shock reprints, even if it is just the allied pairs or something.
12post, which I was playing but found out it's insanely boring
zoo - don't like mindless aggro
affinity - same
combo (hive mind, cascade, etc) don't like these either, the only combo I like is depths
I don't forget if I forget something. Maybe aggro elves is tier1 too.
I was very happy because of this new cheap eternal format but it looks like I won't even be playing it since I don't like any of the best decks. I'll wait for my legacy deadguy ale to get some decent replacement for SFM and vindicate, because right now it can't compete against any of the modern decks.
I don't understand how you say Zoo and Affinity are mindless yet the only combo you like is getting a 20/20 indestructible that is by far the most mindless thing one can do. Hello I pay 2 black. Hello here is my 20/20.
can you ever manage to not be hostile?
The shocklands seem to be a big request around here for reprinting, yet alot of people don't realize that cards like reflecting pool and filter lands are both viable alternatives to fix your mana in alot of decks. Even glimmervoid is fine in affinity strategies. 2 or 3 life if fetched for an untapped land DOES matter in this format. Zoo finds itself at 12-14 by turn 3 alot of the time from it's own cards. Add to this that you can play cards like Dismember and other phyrexian cards whereas a shock heavy deck won't be able to get away with it and you get a legitimate competitor to shocklands in filters and pools.
Honestly, I think the problem could be addressed one of two ways: 1) reprint of the shocklands or 2) print another set of duals with the basic land types and a different drawback. This would drive the price on them down ($15 tops).
The issue is not necessairly that there aren't "viable" (read: almost as good) alternatives out there. The issue that you have the flagship fundamental resource of a format as being the chase rares of the format. Its sheer idiocy. WotC has (thankfully) gotten away from it in standard and extended. No reason for them not to keep up the trend.