Would be great if they aligned this card so the top was similar to the actual card - having the CMC and title further down the card makes it more awkward to manage with the rest of your hand, or gives the opponent more information that it's there
I doubt they'd do this for Chromium, the Mutable, but it would be cool if, similar to morph creatures, they had a cool token representing his human form from his activated ability.
I doubt they'd do this for Chromium, the Mutable, but it would be cool if, similar to morph creatures, they had a cool token representing his human form from his activated ability.
Gideon cards have been turning into a creature ever since day one they have been made and introduce in MTG.
A separate card that serves a representation of his creature form is a must.
Gideon cards have been turning into a creature ever since day one they have been made and introduce in MTG.
A separate card that serves a representation of his creature form is a must.
Wait, am I missing something? Why are you all clamoring for an unnecessary token? The DFC tokens exist because you need to have cards with regular Magic backs in your deck. Why would you want a token that you only use for a fraction of a turn? It's not like the Gideons exile and return as a creature, they just turn into a creature. You don't get different tokens for each mode of Primal Clay. What is the point of a Gideon token?
Gideon cards have been turning into a creature ever since day one they have been made and introduce in MTG.
A separate card that serves a representation of his creature form is a must.
Wait, am I missing something? Why are you all clamoring for an unnecessary token? The DFC tokens exist because you need to have cards with regular Magic backs in your deck. Why would you want a token that you only use for a fraction of a turn? It's not like the Gideons exile and return as a creature, they just turn into a creature. You don't get different tokens for each mode of Primal Clay. What is the point of a Gideon token?
There is no practical reason. Ragavan and Geist of Saint Traft's angel are enough of a pain to use already. Not to mention, you'll have to remove and replace Gideon's loyalty counters (which may or may not be dice) every time you use the overlay. Heck, the only time I used the morph overlays was to differentiate them from manifested face-down cards.
Wait, am I missing something? Why are you all clamoring for an unnecessary token? The DFC tokens exist because you need to have cards with regular Magic backs in your deck. Why would you want a token that you only use for a fraction of a turn? It's not like the Gideons exile and return as a creature, they just turn into a creature. You don't get different tokens for each mode of Primal Clay. What is the point of a Gideon token?
Wow genius. Nice comparison and logic using their ability as a comparison instead of Bolas. I'm amaze every mode of Primal Clay? justify Gideon?
There's a huge differences between Primal Clay and Gideon that needs a representation of his creature form as card.
Gideon is a recurring card with a recurring ability that radically alters the function towards other spells and permanent.
And every Gideon release different version has an ability to Change/SHIFT from a different card type a PLANESWALKER to a CREATURE.
Another thing we are not talking about a single printed card like Primal Clay.
Both creature and planeswalker have huge different properties, usability and interaction with other permanent in game and battlefield, but your a true genius because of Primal Clay. Nice logic.
I'm trying to figure out how seriously to take you, and I'm pretty sure the answer is "not at all," but I guess I'll take the bait.
First, every single iteration of Gideon REMAINS A PLANESWALKER while it's a creature. The only change is his addition of creature typing, which does indeed make him interact differently with permanents, spells, etc. - for less than a turn. In designing effects like Gideon's, designers need to consider how trackable the board state is. The fact that Gideon can only become a creature at Sorcery speed, and usually only to allow it to attack immediately, the trackability of his transformation is pretty easy - "I plus one Gideon, Ally of Zendikar and attack you with him." The activation precedes an attack, and he doesn't even have Vigilance, so you see this sideways card being pushed at you. What purpose would a token serve? Does it make this 99.99% case usage any more clear?
My Clay example was just to show you that, even for more permanent transformation effects, they will usually not give tokens to indicate the changes. It isn't a direct parallel to Gideon, just as Gideon isn't a parallel for Bolas.
Back on topic, this token looks really cool, and I'm looking forward to using it on the field of Commander!
Yet a separate Gideon card representation that is more creature in visual improves the immersive experience in gameplay. So does the NicolBolas token do.
Yet a separate Gideon card representation that is more creature in visual improves the immersive experience in gameplay. So does the NicolBolas token do.
Except tokens don't exist to improve immersion, they're a necessity for certain cards to function. Creature tokens are a necessary memory aid used to accurately depict the board state in ways that even most makeshift tokens cannot. DFC checklist cards are necessary because Wizards doesn't want to force players to use sleeves. Emblems are necessary for much the same reason as tokens. Where is the necessity in a physical depiction what Gideon, or any non-creature that temporarily becomes a creature, does?
Yet a separate Gideon card representation that is more creature in visual improves the immersive experience in gameplay. So does the NicolBolas token do.
Actually it doesn't, because when I go to use vraska's contempt on an animated gideon, the token will create an unclear game state (am I exiling only the token? the planeswalker? does the damage go through if I exile the walker instead of the token?)
The bolas token is there only because bolas is a double-faced card (just like all the checklist cards when there are double faced cards in the set) so that players aren't required to have opaque sleeves to play with these cards. It probably shouldn't even be called a token. Notice at the bottom left the number is CH1/280. It's a checklist card, with only 1 possible option.
Yet your example with with Vraska's contempt on confusing the exile does will be the same cased with bolas token. I agree it shouldn't be called as a token even in the beginning I did address it as card representation of Gideon that is more creature in visual rather than a token.
I don't see how the interaction with removal is any more confusing than the one with already existing overlays for morph and manifest. The point stands though that any short-tem nonpermanent changes will not receive overlays. What's next? "+3/+3 until end of turn" overlay for Giant Growth? With Gideon you at least have the exact stats printed on the very card you are animating.
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Planar Chaos was not a mistake neither was it random. You might want to look at it again.
[thread=239793][Game] Level Up - Creature[/thread]
Actually it doesn't, because when I go to use vraska's contempt on an animated gideon, the token will create an unclear game state (am I exiling only the token? the planeswalker? does the damage go through if I exile the walker instead of the token?)
Actually it doesn't, because when I go to use vraska's contempt on a transformed bolas,the token will create an unclear game state (am I exiling only the token? the planeswalker? does the damage go through if I exile the walker instead of the token?)
were talking on creature visual representation not instant effects. Giant Growth?
Gideon, Ally of Zendikar has been brought up. It's an activated ability, but also lasts only until end of turn. Which is why it doesn't get a memory aid - just like Giant Growth.
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Planar Chaos was not a mistake neither was it random. You might want to look at it again.
[thread=239793][Game] Level Up - Creature[/thread]
Nah it's a very different situation because it is about a planeswalker turned to creature that radically change the attributes and interaction with spells and permanent. While GG is just an instant buff. It's false dichotomy of comparison not even near and logical.
Nah it's a very different situation because it is about a planeswalker turned to creature that radically change the attributes and interaction with spells and permanent. While GG is just an instant buff. It's false dichotomy of comparison not even near and logical.
Ah, so more like you want an overlay for Hydroform. Still an instant, but fits your criteria.
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Planar Chaos was not a mistake neither was it random. You might want to look at it again.
[thread=239793][Game] Level Up - Creature[/thread]
You need it for DFCs. And it's not really a token; in fact, it's arguably an anti-token, since with the exception of manifest, it never exists on the battlefield.
Pseudocards for temporary effects (and things like Riding the Dilu Horse which is supposed to be an aura but enchantments don't exist in Portal, making it weirder) is a good thing in electronic Magic, more as a "because we can" than anything else.
And of course, for noncreature permanents becoming creatures, we have a mnemonic aid already: The layout.
I should explain: I arrange my side of the battlefield like this:
Attacking/blocking creatures
Creatures not currently engaged in combat
Noncreature, nonland permanents
Lands
Even closer to me are my library, my graveyard, and two exile zones. One, next to the library and turned 90 degrees to the left, is for cards which are temporarily exiled. The other, next to the graveyard and turned 90 degrees to the right, is for permanently exiled cards not specifically tied to a card. Keep in mind that imprinted cards (and I use "imprint" to also mean things like O-Ring, Karn Liberated, and haunt, not just the imprint mechanic) stay next to the card they're imprinted on. Off to the side of that are a pack of tokens and dice, and a note pad, mostly for life totals, but also to take notes (such as the contents of a Thoughtseized hand).
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Card advantage is not the same thing as card draw. Something for 2B cannot be strictly worse than something for BBB or 3BB. If you're taking out Swords to Plowshares for Plummet, you're a fool. Stop doing these things!
Usually you'd call it a checklist card. But this time it doesn't really describe what we have here. Is there a better term than token or checklist card?
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I̟̥͍̠ͅn̩͉̣͍̬͚ͅ ̬̬͖t̯̹̞̺͖͓̯̤h̘͍̬e͙̯͈̖̼̮ ̭̬f̺̲̲̪i͙͉̟̩̰r̪̝͚͈̝̥͍̝̲s̼̻͇̘̳͔ͅt̲̺̳̗̜̪̙ ̳̺̥̻͚̗ͅm̜̜̟̰͈͓͎͇o̝̖̮̝͇m̯̻̞̼̫̗͓̤e̩̯̬̮̩n͎̱̪̲̹͖t͇̖s̰̮ͅ,̤̲͙̻̭̻̯̹̰ ̖t̫̙̺̯͖͚̯ͅh͙̯̦̳̗̰̟e͖̪͉̼̯ ̪͕g̞̣͔a̗̦t̬̬͓͙̫̖̭̻e̩̻̯ ̜̖̦̖̤̭͙̬t̞̹̥̪͎͉ͅo͕͚͍͇̲͇͓̺ ̭̬͙͈̣̻t͈͍͙͓̫̖͙̩h̪̬̖̙e̗͈ ̗̬̟̞̺̤͉̯ͅa̦̯͚̙̜̮f͉͙̲̣̞̼t̪̤̞̣͚e̲͉̳̥r͇̪̙͚͓l̥̞̞͎̹̯̹ͅi͓̬f̮̥̬̞͈ͅe͎ ̟̩̤̳̠̯̩̯o̮̘̲p̟͚̣̞͉͓e͍̩̣n͔̼͕͚̜e̬̱d̼̘͎̖̹͍̮̠,͖̺̭̱̮ ̣̲͖̬̪̭̥a̪͚n̟̲̝̤̤̞̗d̘̱̗͇̮͕̳͕͔ ͖̞͉͎t̹̙͎h̰̱͉̗e̪̞̱̝̹̩ͅ ̠̱̩̭̦p̯̙e͓o̳͚̰̯̺̱̰͔̘p̬͎̱̣̼̩͇l̗̟̖͚̠e̱͉͔̱̦̬̟̙ ̖͚̪͔̼̦w̺̖̤̱e͖̗̻̦͓̖̘̜r̭̥e͔̹̫̱͕̦̰͕ ̗͔̠p̠̗͍͍̱̳̠r̰͔͎̰o͉̥͓̰͚̥s̟͚̹̱͔̣t͉̙̳̖͖̪̮r̥̘̥͙̹a͉̟̫̟̳̠̟̭t͈̜̰͈͎e̞̣̭̲̬ ͚̗̯̟͙i͍͖̰̘̦͖͉ṇ̮̻̯̦̲̩͍ ̦̮͚̫̤t͉͖̫͕ͅͅh͙̮̻̘̣̮̼e͕̺ ͙l͕̠͎̰̥i̲͓͉̲g̫̳̟͈͇̖h̠̦̖t͓̯͎̗ ̳̪̘̟̙̩̦o̫̲f̙͔̰̙̠ ̹̪̗͇̯t͖̼̼͉͖̬h̹͇̩e͚̖̺̤͉̹͕̪ ͚͓̭̝̺G͎̗̯̩o̫̯̮̟̮̳̘d̜̲͙̠-̩̳̯̲̗̜P̹̘̥͉̝h͍͈̗̖̝ͅa͍̗̮̼̗r̜̖͇̙̺a̭̺͔̞̳͈o̪̣͓̯̬͙̯̰̗h̖̦͈̥̯͔.͇̣̙̝
EDH DECKS
Currently under construction
MAGECRAFT STORM
-Veyran, Voice of Duality-
Protection from Degeneracy
Do not pray for an easy life. Pray for the strength to endure a difficult one.
Yeah that would be so cool !!!
BGU Control
R Aggro
Standard - For Fun
BG Auras
UR Melek, Izzet ParagonUR, B Shirei, Shizo's CaretakerB, R Jaya Ballard, Task MageR,RW Tajic, Blade of the LegionRW, UB Lazav, Dimir MastermindUB, UB Circu, Dimir LobotomistUB, RWU Zedruu the GreatheartedRWU, GUBThe MimeoplasmGUB, UGExperiment Kraj UG, WDarien, King of KjeldorW, BMarrow-GnawerB, WBGKarador, Ghost ChieftainWBG, UTeferi, Temporal ArchmageU, GWUDerevi, Empyrial TacticianGWU, RDaretti, Scrap SavantR, UTalrand, Sky SummonerU, GEzuri, Renegade LeaderG, WUBRGReaper KingWUBRG, RGXenagos, God of RevelsRG, CKozilek, Butcher of TruthC, WUBRGGeneral TazriWUBRG, GTitania, Protector of ArgothG
Only one if you go by the statement "Use this card to represent a double-faced Nicol Bolas card in library or hand,"
...but it does go on to display Nicol Bolas, the ravager underneath that so I think it would be clear enough to not be confused with future double-faced Nicol Bolas cards Nicol, the half-A-whole dragon or Nicol Bolas, the fratricide.
A separate card that serves a representation of his creature form is a must.
Custom Set
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1hu9uNBSUt92PwGhvexYlwFvsh6_SJBlEEIUV3H9_XyU/edit?usp=sharing
Wait, am I missing something? Why are you all clamoring for an unnecessary token? The DFC tokens exist because you need to have cards with regular Magic backs in your deck. Why would you want a token that you only use for a fraction of a turn? It's not like the Gideons exile and return as a creature, they just turn into a creature. You don't get different tokens for each mode of Primal Clay. What is the point of a Gideon token?
There is no practical reason. Ragavan and Geist of Saint Traft's angel are enough of a pain to use already. Not to mention, you'll have to remove and replace Gideon's loyalty counters (which may or may not be dice) every time you use the overlay. Heck, the only time I used the morph overlays was to differentiate them from manifested face-down cards.
Wow genius. Nice comparison and logic using their ability as a comparison instead of Bolas. I'm amaze every mode of Primal Clay? justify Gideon?
There's a huge differences between Primal Clay and Gideon that needs a representation of his creature form as card.
Gideon is a recurring card with a recurring ability that radically alters the function towards other spells and permanent.
And every Gideon release different version has an ability to Change/SHIFT from a different card type a PLANESWALKER to a CREATURE.
Another thing we are not talking about a single printed card like Primal Clay.
Both creature and planeswalker have huge different properties, usability and interaction with other permanent in game and battlefield, but your a true genius because of Primal Clay. Nice logic.
First, every single iteration of Gideon REMAINS A PLANESWALKER while it's a creature. The only change is his addition of creature typing, which does indeed make him interact differently with permanents, spells, etc. - for less than a turn. In designing effects like Gideon's, designers need to consider how trackable the board state is. The fact that Gideon can only become a creature at Sorcery speed, and usually only to allow it to attack immediately, the trackability of his transformation is pretty easy - "I plus one Gideon, Ally of Zendikar and attack you with him." The activation precedes an attack, and he doesn't even have Vigilance, so you see this sideways card being pushed at you. What purpose would a token serve? Does it make this 99.99% case usage any more clear?
My Clay example was just to show you that, even for more permanent transformation effects, they will usually not give tokens to indicate the changes. It isn't a direct parallel to Gideon, just as Gideon isn't a parallel for Bolas.
Back on topic, this token looks really cool, and I'm looking forward to using it on the field of Commander!
Except tokens don't exist to improve immersion, they're a necessity for certain cards to function. Creature tokens are a necessary memory aid used to accurately depict the board state in ways that even most makeshift tokens cannot. DFC checklist cards are necessary because Wizards doesn't want to force players to use sleeves. Emblems are necessary for much the same reason as tokens. Where is the necessity in a physical depiction what Gideon, or any non-creature that temporarily becomes a creature, does?
The bolas token is there only because bolas is a double-faced card (just like all the checklist cards when there are double faced cards in the set) so that players aren't required to have opaque sleeves to play with these cards. It probably shouldn't even be called a token. Notice at the bottom left the number is CH1/280. It's a checklist card, with only 1 possible option.
Finally a good white villain quote: "So, do I ever re-evaluate my life choices? Never, because I know what I'm doing is a righteous cause."
Factions: Sleeping
Remnants: Valheim
Legendary Journey: Heroes & Planeswalkers
Saga: Shards of Rabiah
Legends: The Elder Dragons
Read up on Red Flags & NWO
let's apply the same logic on bolas card.
Gideon, Ally of Zendikar has been brought up. It's an activated ability, but also lasts only until end of turn. Which is why it doesn't get a memory aid - just like Giant Growth.
Finally a good white villain quote: "So, do I ever re-evaluate my life choices? Never, because I know what I'm doing is a righteous cause."
Factions: Sleeping
Remnants: Valheim
Legendary Journey: Heroes & Planeswalkers
Saga: Shards of Rabiah
Legends: The Elder Dragons
Read up on Red Flags & NWO
Ah, so more like you want an overlay for Hydroform. Still an instant, but fits your criteria.
Finally a good white villain quote: "So, do I ever re-evaluate my life choices? Never, because I know what I'm doing is a righteous cause."
Factions: Sleeping
Remnants: Valheim
Legendary Journey: Heroes & Planeswalkers
Saga: Shards of Rabiah
Legends: The Elder Dragons
Read up on Red Flags & NWO
Pseudocards for temporary effects (and things like Riding the Dilu Horse which is supposed to be an aura but enchantments don't exist in Portal, making it weirder) is a good thing in electronic Magic, more as a "because we can" than anything else.
And of course, for noncreature permanents becoming creatures, we have a mnemonic aid already: The layout.
I should explain: I arrange my side of the battlefield like this:
Attacking/blocking creatures
Creatures not currently engaged in combat
Noncreature, nonland permanents
Lands
Even closer to me are my library, my graveyard, and two exile zones. One, next to the library and turned 90 degrees to the left, is for cards which are temporarily exiled. The other, next to the graveyard and turned 90 degrees to the right, is for permanently exiled cards not specifically tied to a card. Keep in mind that imprinted cards (and I use "imprint" to also mean things like O-Ring, Karn Liberated, and haunt, not just the imprint mechanic) stay next to the card they're imprinted on. Off to the side of that are a pack of tokens and dice, and a note pad, mostly for life totals, but also to take notes (such as the contents of a Thoughtseized hand).
On phasing: