Also because the cat has her staff i wonder if the implication is the cat ate her anyway
Great catch, guess that Hyena didn't see her a partner after all.
It could also be that the dog brought her the staff i suppose, but since shes depicted as inside the cave and he's depicted as leaving the cave, i do wonder
Theres also cute things that get dumb big incidentally, like manaplasm.
Incubation druid, gyre sage, rishkar, they all seem perfect here too
Its the kind of hair that lumps you in a group, people will judge you for that hair and looks, like it or not.
I like that hairdo, while I do see it in a similar category as Exclusion Mage's, whose hairstyle just ruins the entire artwork for me. Yes, I'll gladly interact with people who wear their hair like that and yes, I'm happy for everyone who does like that kind of look. There's literally thousands of artworks in this game and a lot of them I really like. Still I can't always help but mention it when there's a new addition to the list of artwork that I like in this game.
Also, is it exclusively accepted to talk about the cards' gameplay here? I believe a great part of this game's appeal comes from its illustraions, too, and thus assumed it was okay to comment on that aspect also.
Big difference between something like talking about how the staff is in both arts, and saying shes goth **** fanservice
Huh? Okay, now I'm confused, very confused. Is the term 'fanservice' not a sort of euphemism for deliberately salacious depiction of characters..?
...I might have to change my username...
I know it's late but if it makes you feel any better I both got the joke and am well aware of what you intended by fan service. Although I agree with Xcric that this isn't particularly fan service-y.
Shame that someone out there feels the need to stereotype people based on their hair style and outfit choices. Those kinds of statements get you lumped in with a certain group. People will judge you for statements like those. Like it or not.
I wasn't aware that the term pandering has already received prejorative status. Apparently I did get the term fanservice more or less right, though, so that's a relief.
I am still unsure on whether or not it is generally accepted to comment on card's artwork and flavor instead of only gameplay here in the rumor mill. Could someone help me out there?
In regards to being lumped into groups, I hope that by making more elaborate statements than just saying 'Fugly!" or "Hawt!", I can express my sentiments regarding illustrations without being unnecessarily divisive.
I get that my humor is more hit than miss, and I'd rather fail here and there than just give up on it. I do want to know, though, if there's ever any hard feelings, so I can address that and reflect upon it for the future.
I still don't think I understand what the actual fan service is. Have these been hinted at before?
Huh? Okay, now I'm confused, very confused. Is the term 'fanservice' not a sort of euphemism for deliberately salacious depiction of characters..?
...I might have to change my username...
That definition is merely one example of fanservice. Fanservice, "to service the fans" is used to please the audience through originally intertextual work but now is more in reference to parodies, homages, and metahumor. It can take on the form of a visual, text, sound, symbol.
For example Savage Punch, Epic Confrontation, Outmuscle, and Really Epic Punch are fanservice. SP started an in-joke among the community. EC built on that, whether intetionally or not. REP is a parody of SP and EC. Om is an homage that continues the tradition built originally by SP.
Now to merge the first and second examples, take Norin the Wary. Prior to commander was he printed. Before his printing, he was a gag character on flavor texts for the cards Animate Wall (5th edition), Goblin Shrine (The Dark), Jade Statue (Alpha), Lightning Elemental (M12), and Sabretooth Tiger (5th edition). In the same set as he was printed, there was also Viscid Lemures. The tradition as him being a gag character was continued with Pyrophobia (Modern Horizons).
What you are thinking with Fanservice was primarily a thing popularized by Japan through the usage of anime and manga and live-action shows. While cute girls is one type of fanservice with a Japanese IP, another type is the transformation scene of a mech, while another type could be an entire episode that is just the two characters fighting, and even still you have shipping which is fanservice. Again, its still about pleasing the audience. The connotation of Fanservice has taken on a corrupted meaning however because of certain notable aspects.
Not all types of fanservice please the same person. Some may like Nikara, Lair Scavenger, others may not. For example in Ikoria, I find the return of the cycling mechanic, Shark Typhoon, Brallin, Skyshark Rider, Ukkima, Stalking Shadow, Kogla, the Titan Ape to be fanservice yet for differnet reasons. Ukkima is a reference to the Akhlut of Inuit myth. Kogla is a reference to the widely known King Kong movies and in popculture. Typhoon is a reference to Sharknado and remembered well in popculture. Brallin is representation of my Hawaiian culture. Cycling is my favorite keyword and the fact its returned again with great cycling cards and cycling support so far is a set that gets me back into magic.
In fact you can trace Fanservice as far back as Ancient Greece to works, jokes, plays, etc.
Thanks @Manasurfer for that very educational post!
Aloha! (I hope a non-Hawai'ian sayingthat is not considered disrepectful cultural appropriation...)
: )
@Xcric: Sorry, I overlooked your comment before. You know I didn't say, nor did I even mean to imply, that someone dressing like that is a ****. Yes, I addressed another aspect than the staff/story, that part is true.
I wasn't aware that the term pandering has already received prejorative status. Apparently I did get the term fanservice more or less right, though, so that's a relief.
I am still unsure on whether or not it is generally accepted to comment on card's artwork and flavor instead of only gameplay here in the rumor mill. Could someone help me out there?
In regards to being lumped into groups, I hope that by making more elaborate statements than just saying 'Fugly!" or "Hawt!", I can express my sentiments regarding illustrations without being unnecessarily divisive.
I get that my humor is more hit than miss, and I'd rather fail here and there than just give up on it. I do want to know, though, if there's ever any hard feelings, so I can address that and reflect upon it for the future.
Sorry if this is derailing the thread...
It’s not generally disallowed to comment on a cards art it’s just that comments on a characters appearance isn’t really a useful comment or a good way to start a conversation that has any positive outcome (as you saw by that one guys comment).
WotC promoted that kind of "style" since Battlebonds all for "representation" check mark stickers, and putting that kind of references in a fantasy game hurts the immersion by putting too much current time references into the game (its a trigger).
Isn’t that just boxing in what fantasy is allowed to be? Fantasy is a very broad genre by design.
I wasn't aware that the term pandering has already received prejorative status. Apparently I did get the term fanservice more or less right, though, so that's a relief.
I am still unsure on whether or not it is generally accepted to comment on card's artwork and flavor instead of only gameplay here in the rumor mill. Could someone help me out there?
In regards to being lumped into groups, I hope that by making more elaborate statements than just saying 'Fugly!" or "Hawt!", I can express my sentiments regarding illustrations without being unnecessarily divisive.
I get that my humor is more hit than miss, and I'd rather fail here and there than just give up on it. I do want to know, though, if there's ever any hard feelings, so I can address that and reflect upon it for the future.
Sorry if this is derailing the thread...
Yeah, it’s not really about how articulate you are when describing your predilections so much as reducing a woman’s value to how she looks. That’s generally a poor way of encouraging inclusivity in a public space.
Yeah, it’s not really about how articulate you are when describing your predilections so much as reducing a woman’s value to how she looks. That’s generally a poor way of encouraging inclusivity in a public space.
Painted art is quite literally about the looks.
Dont confuse an artwork with a real human being. Two very different topics.
If an artwork is explicitly aiming too boost itself with some sexual viewpoints, its totally fair to either like or dislike exactly that, anything else is just dishonest and pretentious.
And people better speak their mind instead of shutting themselves down just to claim they are "inclusive" (which just translates into a group of people that pretend to be nice and end up as backstabbing pretentious snitches).
In a public space you better be allowed to speak your mind, the moment you are not allowed to is when honesty dies.
I am honestly a bit lost when it comes to understanding why it's supposed to be problematic to tout gorgeous depictions of people.
I certainly don't expect people to tell me they'd welcome a character that's depicted looking like me. I wouldn't find that inclusive any more than I'd find that a waste of a great any artist's skills.
Also, commending artwork depicting looks that you like does not equal bein dismissive or unaccepting of actual people who don't look just like that. Where in Krokt's name does that kinda reasoning even come from? I like the looks of Captain Sisay, hence I'm appalled by even the idea of having to share the same planet with Melissa McCarthy? No, just no, that doesn't make any sense to me...
Maybe if you are over thirty and fan of zarana of gi joe this could pass as a fan service. Fan service should be based in somthing that already exist like what they are doing with godzilla
I don't understand some fanatics in here, they champion against bikini chain mail, but when a girl appears with garter stockings (cleary a sexual thing)they call it inclusion. I just call it pandering
Dont confuse an artwork with a real human being. Two very different topics.
Then talk about the art, not the woman.
Quote from TheOnlyOne652089 »
If an artwork is explicitly aiming too boost itself with some sexual viewpoints, its totally fair to either like or dislike exactly that, anything else is just dishonest and pretentious.
Except that this is a game (or a forum about a game) that has nothing to do with sex, so the way a woman is dressed and/or depicted is not an express invitation to wax prurient. If you want to talk about the actual art techniques used by that artist, that's another matter entirely. In the mean time, this space should be safe for people of all ages, genders, and sexual preferences to talk about Magic without having to worry if the very next poster is going to make them uncomfortable.
Quote from TheOnlyOne652089 »
And people better speak their mind instead of shutting themselves down just to claim they are "inclusive" (which just translates into a group of people that pretend to be nice and end up as backstabbing pretentious snitches).
In a public space you better be allowed to speak your mind, the moment you are not allowed to is when honesty dies.
Freedom of speech doesn't mean you're free from the social consequences of what you say. If your "honesty" is racist, sexist, homophobic, or otherwise bigoted or exclusionary, then we're all far better off with you keeping it to yourself.
I like the looks of Captain Sisay, hence I'm appalled by even the idea of having to share the same planet with Melissa McCarthy? No, just no, that doesn't make any sense to me...
Therein lies the problem, friend. I recommend you get in touch with HR for some sexual harassment training, lest you get blindsided by a complaint for complimenting a coworker on her looks. Yes, anyone else who hears that comment can file a complaint, even if it wasn't directed at them.
Again, its not a person, its an artwork of a women, thats literally what we do.
Except that this is a game (or a forum about a game) that has nothing to do with sex, so the way a woman is dressed and/or depicted is not an express invitation to wax prurient. If you want to talk about the actual art techniques used by that artist, that's another matter entirely. In the mean time, this space should be safe for people of all ages, genders, and sexual preferences to talk about Magic without having to worry if the very next poster is going to make them uncomfortable.
Theres nobody to white knight here. Nobody is harmed, nothing harmful is done at all.
Its very pretentious to claim that suddenly someone is the victim here ... nobody is.
Freedom of speech doesn't mean you're free from the social consequences of what you say. If your "honesty" is racist, sexist, homophobic, or otherwise bigoted or exclusionary, then we're all far better off with you keeping it to yourself.
You have a talent to take any form of discussion to a level of "racist, sexist, homophobic" ... is that your goal in the first place ?
The art is a women in garter stockings and that is sexual clothing (you are free to deny that, in which case you will never get it).
Thats the entire point of the fan-service ... make a female character with garter stockings, which makes it sexual, thats exactly what some people will enjoy about it, some others look at the purple hair and get some pleasure out of that, others will claim its just pretentious and pondering to that crowd (which it absolutely is).
People in this very thread get the art connection to Harley Quinn and her Hyena.
Is it that MUCH over the top ? Absolutely not, still remains a totally valid point to make if you discuss its art, pretending it doesnt exist is just pandering, its lying to yourself (which is grounded on a fear of making anybody uncomfortable in any made up way possible imaginable).
And to reinforce. Nobody is the victim here.
Who ever feels "uncomfortable" for whatever reason, can just feel uncomfortable and be done with it.
I am honestly a bit lost when it to understanding why it's supposed to be problematic to tout gorgeous depictions of people.
I certainly don't expect people to tell me they'd welcome a character that's depicted looking like me. I wouldn't find that inclusive any more than I'd find that a waste of a great any artist's skills.
Well, some people's identities aren't seen as equal by society. This includes a wide variety of intersections of things like race, gender, sex, ability, etc, and also includes expressions that are culturally nonconforming. That can be gender nonconformity ("butch" women, "feminine" men, etc), but also nonconformance when it comes to beauty standards or sexual expression. People are stigmatized for a lot of reasons, and for some representation is meaningful. Even when representation has limited meaning, seeing people saying disparaging things about fictitious characters because of traits that you identify with can negatively impact a person because it's a reflection and reminder of the stigma they live with all the time.
For example, the discourse when Oko's art was revealed sported a level of negative attitudes based solely on his more "feminine" appearance and shirtless pose. Imagine that you yourself were a man with a more feminine gender expression who liked seeing a major character that reflects a bit about who you are but the discourse around the art reminds you of how stigmatizing it can be to not be a masculine man in our world. So the characters are fake, but people are real, and the ways we talk about fictional characters can be revealing about our attitudes towards real people.
As far as commenting on gorgeous characters, it's fine I guess, but it still reveals something about the person who sees a piece of art and their first thought about the aesthetics is "that character is/is not sexually attractive to me".
Also, commending artwork depicting looks that you like does not equal bein dismissive or unaccepting of actual people who don't look just like that. Where in Krokt's name does that kinda reasoning even come from? I like the looks of Captain Sisay, hence I'm appalled by even the idea of having to share the same planet with Melissa McCarthy? No, just no, that doesn't make any sense to me...
Your first point is correct, saying you like one thing isn't inherently commenting on other things, but context is key here. You absolutely can comment on the aesthetics of a piece of art in a ways that does dismiss or disparage, which we have seen in this thread.
So, for one thing, I don't compliment people on their looks unless they specifically ask for my opinion.
If we're gonna talk about safe spaces, let's not forget that this game frequently displays people as well as aninals being brutalized or even killed, oftentimes even as part of a scene that is meant to be funny, which I believe might also be off-putting to people, as well as very sexualized men, to this day. And might I remind people that a certain Theros fan on this very sight keeps expressing their satisfaction with that last kind of art, which I absolutely commend them for.
To be perfectly honest, I'm surprised this game is still 13+ without the explicit demand that kids below 18 play it in the presence of their parents or whoever is legally responsible for them.
I'd love for you to shed some light on this comment for me, please.
Quote from TheOnlyOne652089 »
Nobody is harmed, nothing harmful is done at all.
Its very pretentious to claim that suddenly someone is the victim here ... nobody is.
...
And to reinforce. Nobody is the victim here.
Who ever feels "uncomfortable" for whatever reason, can just feel uncomfortable and be done with it.
Sorry, you don't get to decide that. Any of that. And you're only going to grow increasingly frustrated with a society that's moved beyond that tired, backwards sentiment.
Quote from TheOnlyOne652089 »
You have a talent to take any form of discussion to a level of "racist, sexist, homophobic" ... is that your goal in the first place ?
I'm sure that you're quite capable of looking at my post record and determining for yourself that I've only talked about Magic cards for weeks on end now. But if the question is "do you always have to call out bigoted or exclusionary behavior?" then yes, yes I do, and will continue to do so for the foreseeable future. Things will never improve if people choose to close their eyes and pretend like nothing's wrong, and everyone else around them abides it.
To be perfectly honest, I'm surprised this game is still 13+ without the explicit demand that kids below 18 play it in the presence of their parents or whoever is legally responsible for them.
So, for one thing, I don't compliment people on their looks unless they specifically ask for my opinion.
Why should that be any different here? You may be commenting on a piece of artwork, but there are women actively reading your posts.
Quote from Fan-of-"Fanservice" »
If we're gonna talk about safe spaces, let's not forget that this game frequently displays people as well as aninals being brutalized or even killed, oftentimes even as part of a scene that is meant to be funny, which I believe might also be off-putting to people, as well as very sexualized men, to this day.
I suppose there's a place for someone to interject here on the topic of animal cruelty; we all have our prerogatives. But we should try to avoid any kind of distillation that equates all of society's woes, lest we allow ourselves to retread the misguided path of the "all lives matter" mindset. Exposure to gratuitous violence and sexism are both problematic, certainly, but nowhere near equal in terms of their impact on society.
Quote from Fan-of-"Fanservice" »
And might I remind people that a certain Theros fan on this very sight keeps expressing their satisfaction with that last kind of art, which I absolutely commend them for.
To which he's very much entitled, to an extent. There are lines that shouldn't be crossed on any family friendly forum, no matter a person's individual predilections, but for the most part @Tiro is able to limit his slavering to all things Grecian and/or tentacled.
To be perfectly honest, I'm surprised this game is still 13+ without the explicit demand that kids below 18 play it in the presence of their parents or whoever is legally responsible for them.
To be perfectly honest, I'm surprised this game is still 13+ without the explicit demand that kids below 18 play it in the presence of their parents or whoever is legally responsible for them.
Yeah, when our daughter is faced with such imagery before she's 18, I definitely want myself or my wife to be there and talk with her about that.
No cards founds, but if I understand your point, you're worried about your daughter seeing violent/gory/horrifying imagery before she's 18? I can empathize with that, but MtG is part of a much larger media landscape that centres violence and sexuality whether explicitly or implicitly (reflecting a societal fascination on sex and violence) so I wish you luck trying to keep her from being exposed to either without you there to talk to her about it. I work with kids, they are exposed to things their parents would like to have input in years before their parents expect they'll be.
I'm not sure making MtG rated R (so to speak) for depicting sex and violence in ways no more gratuitously than movies and tv shows aimed at teens (for the most part, exceptions do exist though I still wouldn't consider them gratuitous enough for parental advisories) is going to make much of an impact.
It could also be that the dog brought her the staff i suppose, but since shes depicted as inside the cave and he's depicted as leaving the cave, i do wonder
Theres also cute things that get dumb big incidentally, like manaplasm.
Incubation druid, gyre sage, rishkar, they all seem perfect here too
Big difference between something like talking about how the staff is in both arts, and saying shes goth **** fanservice
I suppose thats an idea
I know it's late but if it makes you feel any better I both got the joke and am well aware of what you intended by fan service. Although I agree with Xcric that this isn't particularly fan service-y.
Shame that someone out there feels the need to stereotype people based on their hair style and outfit choices. Those kinds of statements get you lumped in with a certain group. People will judge you for statements like those. Like it or not.
It's just a less pejorative way of saying "pandering." So no, not euphemistic at all.
---
#BLM
#DefundThePolice
I wasn't aware that the term pandering has already received prejorative status. Apparently I did get the term fanservice more or less right, though, so that's a relief.
I am still unsure on whether or not it is generally accepted to comment on card's artwork and flavor instead of only gameplay here in the rumor mill. Could someone help me out there?
In regards to being lumped into groups, I hope that by making more elaborate statements than just saying 'Fugly!" or "Hawt!", I can express my sentiments regarding illustrations without being unnecessarily divisive.
I get that my humor is more hit than miss, and I'd rather fail here and there than just give up on it. I do want to know, though, if there's ever any hard feelings, so I can address that and reflect upon it for the future.
Sorry if this is derailing the thread...
For example Savage Punch, Epic Confrontation, Outmuscle, and Really Epic Punch are fanservice. SP started an in-joke among the community. EC built on that, whether intetionally or not. REP is a parody of SP and EC. Om is an homage that continues the tradition built originally by SP.
Another example of fanservice is the Commander line of products. Gerrard, Weatherlight Hero, Ezuri, Claw of Progress, Arixmethes, Slumbering Isle, K'rrik, Son of Yawgmoth, Yawgmoth, Thran Physician, Mairsil, the Pretender, Tawnos, Urza's Apprentice, Varchild, Betrayer of Kjeldor. Among others as many of them either got only one card or no card at all and were merely referenced throughout the years.
Now to merge the first and second examples, take Norin the Wary. Prior to commander was he printed. Before his printing, he was a gag character on flavor texts for the cards Animate Wall (5th edition), Goblin Shrine (The Dark), Jade Statue (Alpha), Lightning Elemental (M12), and Sabretooth Tiger (5th edition). In the same set as he was printed, there was also Viscid Lemures. The tradition as him being a gag character was continued with Pyrophobia (Modern Horizons).
What you are thinking with Fanservice was primarily a thing popularized by Japan through the usage of anime and manga and live-action shows. While cute girls is one type of fanservice with a Japanese IP, another type is the transformation scene of a mech, while another type could be an entire episode that is just the two characters fighting, and even still you have shipping which is fanservice. Again, its still about pleasing the audience. The connotation of Fanservice has taken on a corrupted meaning however because of certain notable aspects.
Not all types of fanservice please the same person. Some may like Nikara, Lair Scavenger, others may not. For example in Ikoria, I find the return of the cycling mechanic, Shark Typhoon, Brallin, Skyshark Rider, Ukkima, Stalking Shadow, Kogla, the Titan Ape to be fanservice yet for differnet reasons. Ukkima is a reference to the Akhlut of Inuit myth. Kogla is a reference to the widely known King Kong movies and in popculture. Typhoon is a reference to Sharknado and remembered well in popculture. Brallin is representation of my Hawaiian culture. Cycling is my favorite keyword and the fact its returned again with great cycling cards and cycling support so far is a set that gets me back into magic.
In fact you can trace Fanservice as far back as Ancient Greece to works, jokes, plays, etc.
Aloha! (I hope a non-Hawai'ian sayingthat is not considered disrepectful cultural appropriation...)
: )
@Xcric: Sorry, I overlooked your comment before. You know I didn't say, nor did I even mean to imply, that someone dressing like that is a ****. Yes, I addressed another aspect than the staff/story, that part is true.
It’s not generally disallowed to comment on a cards art it’s just that comments on a characters appearance isn’t really a useful comment or a good way to start a conversation that has any positive outcome (as you saw by that one guys comment).
Commander
U Tetsuko Umezawa, Fugitive
RG Zilortha, Strength Incarnate
WB Amalia Benavides Aguirre
Yeah, it’s not really about how articulate you are when describing your predilections so much as reducing a woman’s value to how she looks. That’s generally a poor way of encouraging inclusivity in a public space.
---
#BLM
#DefundThePolice
Painted art is quite literally about the looks.
Dont confuse an artwork with a real human being. Two very different topics.
If an artwork is explicitly aiming too boost itself with some sexual viewpoints, its totally fair to either like or dislike exactly that, anything else is just dishonest and pretentious.
And people better speak their mind instead of shutting themselves down just to claim they are "inclusive" (which just translates into a group of people that pretend to be nice and end up as backstabbing pretentious snitches).
In a public space you better be allowed to speak your mind, the moment you are not allowed to is when honesty dies.
WUBRG#BlackLotusMatterWUBRG
👮👮👮 #BlueLivesMatter 👮👮👮
Thanks for the mindful comments!
I am honestly a bit lost when it comes to understanding why it's supposed to be problematic to tout gorgeous depictions of people.
I certainly don't expect people to tell me they'd welcome a character that's depicted looking like me. I wouldn't find that inclusive any more than I'd find that a waste of a great any artist's skills.
Also, commending artwork depicting looks that you like does not equal bein dismissive or unaccepting of actual people who don't look just like that. Where in Krokt's name does that kinda reasoning even come from? I like the looks of Captain Sisay, hence I'm appalled by even the idea of having to share the same planet with Melissa McCarthy? No, just no, that doesn't make any sense to me...
Don't worry, its not, and its encouraged as its part of the Hawaiian language.
Aloha has three contextual uses: Hello, Goodbye, Love.
Mahalo means "Thank you"
Mahalo Nui means "Thank you very much".
Maybe if you are over thirty and fan of zarana of gi joe this could pass as a fan service. Fan service should be based in somthing that already exist like what they are doing with godzilla
I don't understand some fanatics in here, they champion against bikini chain mail, but when a girl appears with garter stockings (cleary a sexual thing)they call it inclusion. I just call it pandering
Then talk about the art, not the woman.
Except that this is a game (or a forum about a game) that has nothing to do with sex, so the way a woman is dressed and/or depicted is not an express invitation to wax prurient. If you want to talk about the actual art techniques used by that artist, that's another matter entirely. In the mean time, this space should be safe for people of all ages, genders, and sexual preferences to talk about Magic without having to worry if the very next poster is going to make them uncomfortable.
Freedom of speech doesn't mean you're free from the social consequences of what you say. If your "honesty" is racist, sexist, homophobic, or otherwise bigoted or exclusionary, then we're all far better off with you keeping it to yourself.
---
#BLM
#DefundThePolice
Therein lies the problem, friend. I recommend you get in touch with HR for some sexual harassment training, lest you get blindsided by a complaint for complimenting a coworker on her looks. Yes, anyone else who hears that comment can file a complaint, even if it wasn't directed at them.
---
#BLM
#DefundThePolice
Again, its not a person, its an artwork of a women, thats literally what we do.
Theres nobody to white knight here. Nobody is harmed, nothing harmful is done at all.
Its very pretentious to claim that suddenly someone is the victim here ... nobody is.
You have a talent to take any form of discussion to a level of "racist, sexist, homophobic" ... is that your goal in the first place ?
The art is a women in garter stockings and that is sexual clothing (you are free to deny that, in which case you will never get it).
Thats the entire point of the fan-service ... make a female character with garter stockings, which makes it sexual, thats exactly what some people will enjoy about it, some others look at the purple hair and get some pleasure out of that, others will claim its just pretentious and pondering to that crowd (which it absolutely is).
People in this very thread get the art connection to Harley Quinn and her Hyena.
Is it that MUCH over the top ? Absolutely not, still remains a totally valid point to make if you discuss its art, pretending it doesnt exist is just pandering, its lying to yourself (which is grounded on a fear of making anybody uncomfortable in any made up way possible imaginable).
And to reinforce. Nobody is the victim here.
Who ever feels "uncomfortable" for whatever reason, can just feel uncomfortable and be done with it.
WUBRG#BlackLotusMatterWUBRG
👮👮👮 #BlueLivesMatter 👮👮👮
Well, some people's identities aren't seen as equal by society. This includes a wide variety of intersections of things like race, gender, sex, ability, etc, and also includes expressions that are culturally nonconforming. That can be gender nonconformity ("butch" women, "feminine" men, etc), but also nonconformance when it comes to beauty standards or sexual expression. People are stigmatized for a lot of reasons, and for some representation is meaningful. Even when representation has limited meaning, seeing people saying disparaging things about fictitious characters because of traits that you identify with can negatively impact a person because it's a reflection and reminder of the stigma they live with all the time.
For example, the discourse when Oko's art was revealed sported a level of negative attitudes based solely on his more "feminine" appearance and shirtless pose. Imagine that you yourself were a man with a more feminine gender expression who liked seeing a major character that reflects a bit about who you are but the discourse around the art reminds you of how stigmatizing it can be to not be a masculine man in our world. So the characters are fake, but people are real, and the ways we talk about fictional characters can be revealing about our attitudes towards real people.
As far as commenting on gorgeous characters, it's fine I guess, but it still reveals something about the person who sees a piece of art and their first thought about the aesthetics is "that character is/is not sexually attractive to me".
Your first point is correct, saying you like one thing isn't inherently commenting on other things, but context is key here. You absolutely can comment on the aesthetics of a piece of art in a ways that does dismiss or disparage, which we have seen in this thread.
Archatmos
Excellion
Fracture: Israfiel (WBR), Wujal (URG), Valedon (GUB), Amduat (BGW), Paladris (RWU)
Collision (Set Two of the Fracture Block)
Quest for the Forsaken (Set Two of the Excellion Block)
Katingal: Plane of Chains
If we're gonna talk about safe spaces, let's not forget that this game frequently displays people as well as aninals being brutalized or even killed, oftentimes even as part of a scene that is meant to be funny, which I believe might also be off-putting to people, as well as very sexualized men, to this day. And might I remind people that a certain Theros fan on this very sight keeps expressing their satisfaction with that last kind of art, which I absolutely commend them for.
To be perfectly honest, I'm surprised this game is still 13+ without the explicit demand that kids below 18 play it in the presence of their parents or whoever is legally responsible for them.
Edit: Oh, and @Manasurfer: Mahalo Nui, then! : D
I'd love for you to shed some light on this comment for me, please.
Sorry, you don't get to decide that. Any of that. And you're only going to grow increasingly frustrated with a society that's moved beyond that tired, backwards sentiment.
I'm sure that you're quite capable of looking at my post record and determining for yourself that I've only talked about Magic cards for weeks on end now. But if the question is "do you always have to call out bigoted or exclusionary behavior?" then yes, yes I do, and will continue to do so for the foreseeable future. Things will never improve if people choose to close their eyes and pretend like nothing's wrong, and everyone else around them abides it.
---
#BLM
#DefundThePolice
..... really? Based on what?
Archatmos
Excellion
Fracture: Israfiel (WBR), Wujal (URG), Valedon (GUB), Amduat (BGW), Paladris (RWU)
Collision (Set Two of the Fracture Block)
Quest for the Forsaken (Set Two of the Excellion Block)
Katingal: Plane of Chains
Why should that be any different here? You may be commenting on a piece of artwork, but there are women actively reading your posts.
I suppose there's a place for someone to interject here on the topic of animal cruelty; we all have our prerogatives. But we should try to avoid any kind of distillation that equates all of society's woes, lest we allow ourselves to retread the misguided path of the "all lives matter" mindset. Exposure to gratuitous violence and sexism are both problematic, certainly, but nowhere near equal in terms of their impact on society.
To which he's very much entitled, to an extent. There are lines that shouldn't be crossed on any family friendly forum, no matter a person's individual predilections, but for the most part @Tiro is able to limit his slavering to all things Grecian and/or tentacled.
---
#BLM
#DefundThePolice
https://scryfall.com/search?q="Dismember" or "Disembowel" or "Giant's Skewer"&unique=cards&as=grid&order=name
Yeah, when our daughter is faced with such imagery before she's 18, I definitely want myself or my wife to be there and talk with her about that.
No cards founds, but if I understand your point, you're worried about your daughter seeing violent/gory/horrifying imagery before she's 18? I can empathize with that, but MtG is part of a much larger media landscape that centres violence and sexuality whether explicitly or implicitly (reflecting a societal fascination on sex and violence) so I wish you luck trying to keep her from being exposed to either without you there to talk to her about it. I work with kids, they are exposed to things their parents would like to have input in years before their parents expect they'll be.
I'm not sure making MtG rated R (so to speak) for depicting sex and violence in ways no more gratuitously than movies and tv shows aimed at teens (for the most part, exceptions do exist though I still wouldn't consider them gratuitous enough for parental advisories) is going to make much of an impact.
Archatmos
Excellion
Fracture: Israfiel (WBR), Wujal (URG), Valedon (GUB), Amduat (BGW), Paladris (RWU)
Collision (Set Two of the Fracture Block)
Quest for the Forsaken (Set Two of the Excellion Block)
Katingal: Plane of Chains