The full set is out here. However, with how many cards have been revealed, we only have a few left (including some reprints), unlike the usual 50-card dump in the end.
Well thank goodness tormenting voice is in standard still, at least that way if I draw any cards from ZKR I can pitch them to pay for it and draw cards from the rest of standard.
what i was really surprised with, and I guess I shouldnt have been, is how amazing the full art basic lands are.
These lands... make me want to actually draft this pile set more.
Go figure.
I get that it's not a high powered standard set - and that's fine, considering all the complaining that we've had about balance recently - but there's a lot in here for other formats. I'd rate it at least 7/10 for my interests.
Anyone care to discuss all the implications for EDH?
I get that it's not a high powered standard set - and that's fine, considering all the complaining that we've had about balance recently - but there's a lot in here for other formats. I'd rate it at least 7/10 for my interests.
Anyone care to discuss all the implications for EDH?
I, for one, am glad it's not another over-tuned, ill-tested trainwreck. There are numerous cards here I'm already brewing with, and I find a number of them perfectly serviceable in Standard, especially with the Azusa, Lost but Seeking/Radha, Heart of Keld deck I've been running, already. The MDFCs are fire with Azusa. Play em face down early to ramp up, then cast whatever you want.
What I’m surprised at is no manlands besides Crawling Barrens
The MDFC that where part creature, part land played ended up taking up that room.
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“There are no weak Jews. I am descended from those who wrestle angels and kill giants. We were chosen by God. You were chosen by a pathetic little man who can't seem to grow a full mustache"
"You can tell how dumb someone is by how they use Mary Sue"
no manlands, no fetches, no quests, no level up, no allies, no traps, no feeling of adventure. this is hardly zendikar. i don't want to hear some bull***** like this was known, or we got this instead. those were the things that really captured the feeling of zendikar, and they're gone. replaced with mediocrity and gimmicks.
party is a mechanic that desperately wants more mana fixing and was designed as if there were fetches in the set initially. its underwhelming in its payoff, and requires too much to set up/maintain without disruption.
kicker is underwhelming with very few cards actually being worth running yet the set was designed as if there was an abundance of good kicker cards so you end up with all these messy creatures that rely on something else that might not even be worth playing.
there isn't really anything all that interesting, new, or exploratory at common or uncommon, even rare is a little lackluster. most of the cards just relying too much on the weak mechanics of the set or rehashing something we've already seen.
landfall got some decent cards, but feels really underwhelming in what its doing too. most of those cards are just rehashes of what we've already done with landfall. nothing really new.
there are some reprints that would've worked out great here, and helped manage their pricing a little, but they too were ignored because of course they were. better to jam them into another product that's just as mediocre so we have a means to push it.
almost all the obvious value is again tied to mythic - be that monetary value or gameplay value. there's a few alright rares, but don't forget that given the way things are set up to push more packs all of those rares are going to decline in value as product is opened as people gamble on getting mythics, or just to get box topper expedition lands since thats the only way, or to get pulls from "the list"
but hey you can get like, an expedition land if you buy a whole box, or sometimes a card from "the list" if you buy set boosters, which has a strong chance of just being a dud anyway as a huge portion of the list is crapola, thats great right? buy more product! consume! don't think about the scheme we've orchestrated to suck you dry. crack more packs!
i just don't see any reason here to buy sealed product at all. buy the singles you want, there's only a few decent ones, and otherwise **** this entire product line. save some space in your bulk boxes.
no manlands, no fetches, no quests, no level up, no allies, no traps, no feeling of adventure. this is hardly zendikar. i don't want to hear some bull***** like this was known, or we got this instead. those were the things that really captured the feeling of zendikar, and they're gone. replaced with mediocrity and gimmicks.
party is a mechanic that desperately wants more mana fixing and was designed as if there were fetches in the set initially. its underwhelming in its payoff, and requires too much to set up/maintain without disruption.
kicker is underwhelming with very few cards actually being worth running yet the set was designed as if there was an abundance of good kicker cards so you end up with all these messy creatures that rely on something else that might not even be worth playing.
there isn't really anything all that interesting, new, or exploratory at common or uncommon, even rare is a little lackluster. most of the cards just relying too much on the weak mechanics of the set or rehashing something we've already seen.
landfall got some decent cards, but feels really underwhelming in what its doing too. most of those cards are just rehashes of what we've already done with landfall. nothing really new.
there are some reprints that would've worked out great here, and helped manage their pricing a little, but they too were ignored because of course they were. better to jam them into another product that's just as mediocre so we have a means to push it.
almost all the obvious value is again tied to mythic - be that monetary value or gameplay value. there's a few alright rares, but don't forget that given the way things are set up to push more packs all of those rares are going to decline in value as product is opened as people gamble on getting mythics, or just to get box topper expedition lands since thats the only way, or to get pulls from "the list"
but hey you can get like, an expedition land if you buy a whole box, or sometimes a card from "the list" if you buy set boosters, which has a strong chance of just being a dud anyway as a huge portion of the list is crapola, thats great right? buy more product! consume! don't think about the scheme we've orchestrated to suck you dry. crack more packs!
i just don't see any reason here to buy sealed product at all. buy the singles you want, there's only a few decent ones, and otherwise **** this entire product line. save some space in your bulk boxes.
Yeah man ! I feel the same.
Zendikar 1 is still its best version !
If your expectation was that they were just going to reprint original Zendikar, almost verbatim, then you set yourself up for disappointment. This set is... fine. Not amazing, but there are enough interesting cards to capture my attention.
Party wasn't executed well, but mechanically and flavorfully it's better than ally. Expect it to get even mo' better after D&D: The Gathering drops later next year.
Fetches are OP, time for us all to get over them. If you really want to hold Wizards to a higher standard, we should stop asking them to promote basic resources as chase cards instead of what they actually are: crutches and limitations for a card game in 2020.
Again, quest, level up, and traps were all distinctively tied to Zendikar 1.0. Should Magic grow as a brand, or just do the same old things every time we revisit a plane?
Would you like me to list all of the cards that have me excited?
There are only 3 inscription cards.
Red & white one missin. Why ?
Red and white have six kicker cards between them, mostly removal. They got Felidar Retreat and Valakut Exploration instead, which most people on here see as a good thing.
There are quite a few cards I want, but overall, there is room for improvement on power level and mechanical focus. The borders on those expeditions don't even look like MTG cards.
1st Zendikar block - ROE released. Focus on Eldrazi/Allies. Players: We prefer Landfall and adventure world.
BFZ - Focus on Eldrazi/Allies. Players: Where are Traps/Expeditions/Lands/Landfall? We prefer Landfall and adventure world.
ZNR - Focus on Party. Players: Where are Traps/Expeditions/Lands/Landfall? We prefer Landfall and adventure world.
Next return to Zendikar: Focus on more creature/tribal. Players: Where are Traps/Expeditions/Lands/Landfall? We prefer Landfall and adventure world.
The art, theme and general approach this time were good though. Far better. I'd trade Party for Quests, Traps and Expedition enchantments but the set's tone is at least in the right place, with a healed world with traces of former Eldrazi.
I actually think the RW landfall aggro is fine and there are probably enough pieces to build a Naya or RG landfall stompy, but sadly between the decision to lower overall power level and the pinnacle of power that we just saw in 6 of the last sets, even with 3 of them rotating out, there are more exciting options in those color pairs. As far as fetches hi, we have Fabled Passage which is the best fetch analog we should have in Standard and that's fine. Between Asuza, the new Crucible on legs and Lithoforming we have some very interesting options for landdall, and depending on how the next year plays out then 2021 September standard may want that deck. But until then it's probably overshadowed. Rogues /mill may actually be getting a real shot in the arm though so that's something?
Anyone care to discuss all the implications for EDH?
Potential commanders I may brew:
Tazri - I don't love the party mechanic as executed, but I once tried a janky 5 color Allies deck and I think a more refined party deck that uses better creatures from other sets may be possible, though I'm in no rush to do that
Akiri - I think she's great, I've wanted to build a RW equipment deck and she is the inspiration I needed
Cards I may add to decks I already have: Angelheart Protector - I have a blink-focused deck that this may work in, though slots are pretty tight and the ability may not be relevant often enough in terms of indestructability in response to removal. Felidar Retreat - I have a GW Cats deck, this slots in fairly well and either fills out the board or boosts the army Luminarch Aspirant - I don't know if it fits in my Atraxa deck, but I do have other decks that may want a steady flow of free counters Nighthawk Scavenger - immediately in my vampire tribal deck, ditto the Nullpriest and Scion of the Storm Skyclave Shadowcat - easily slots into a variety of decks, but mostly aristrocrats and +1/+1 counter decks
Moraug - slots right into my Saskia legends/attacking matters deck, extra attacks are great for that deck Rockslide Sorcerer - another great effect for my NivMizz spellslinger deck, Kaza also slots in easily (60% or so of the creatures in the deck are Wizards) Valakut Exploration - fits in my Intet deck, though it may be too expensive to justify purchasing since it's largely redundant Ancient Greenwarden and Ashaya - could be in consideration for my land creatures deck Roiling Regrowth - good card for almost any deck with green, it's probably the card I'll get in larger numbers
Nahiri - if I build around Akiri, I can see Nahiri being in the list Zagras - another great addition to my Edgar deck, will frequently be quite inexpensive Forsaken Monument - goes right in my Baraldrazi counters/Eldrazi deck Lithoform Engine - I really like it, and want to use it, just not sure where yet because I probably won't be able to buy more than one Relic Amulet and Vial - Amulet may go with NivMizz (it's already heavy on burn, so the Amulet is redundant), Vial will definitely go in Teysa (it's everything the deck wants more of) Skyclave Relic - I anticipate it being a pricy card, I'll likely only get enough to go in the decks that both need the mana ramp as well as the extra artifacts
That's honestly about it. I'm really unimpressed with the overall quality of cards. There are ideas here that I like, but the execution was some combination of too costly/too many hoops/too underpowered and ultimately that dulls my excitement for the set. Even the other legends are pretty meh for me, they're alright but are more likely to slot into the 99 elsewhere than being things I build around.
The MDFCs are nonstarters for me, I just hate playing with them and never will. Landfall isn't really my bag, but I think folks who like it got some great new tools.
I think Commander players should be relatively happy, particularly casual players, the set isn't a total loss. I'm fairly happy that most of what I'm likely to pick up as singles are commons and uncommons, or they're by and large rares and mythics that are unlikely to be popular enough to drive prices up. It's a good set for my budget.
The landfall cards are strong, even stronger than the ones in original Zendikar
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How i feel about competitive players and casual players in EDH: The competitive are german tourists, the casual are italian tourists, both in a italian beach. The italians asking themselves "why are the germans here?" make a legitimate question, the answer is because the beach is beautiful, no matter the country you came from. The italians wanting to ban the germans are dumb, because if the germans pay for their stay and follow the rules like everyone else, they have the right to be in the beach. Hovewer, if the germans started to ask themselves "why are the italians here?"... they would be dumb as hell.
There are only 3 inscription cards.
Red & white one missin. Why ?
Red and white have six kicker cards between them, mostly removal. They got Felidar Retreat and Valakut Exploration instead, which most people on here see as a good thing.
As someone who loves my Hallar, the Firefletcher deck I'm very sad there's no red one, I was kind of waiting for it to get spoiled. Still there are plenty of good kicker cards for that deck in this set, it just feels like an unfinished cycle.
In what universe? If you build a deck like that, and ever draw that hand, I will personally come to wherever you live, perform complicated acts of awestruck ********, then disembowel myself to escape the world that allowed something like this to occur and validate you.
I really don’t understand why they removed the Ally mechanic to make room for the Party mechanic when that would have obviously been more appropriate for the D&D set.
They bent over backward to turn Zendikar into a plane of D&D adventures and basically took out all of the stuff we liked about Zendikar except for Landfall. Zendikar was about unlocking a mystery, not going on fun adventures with your bro to find treasure.
Seems like they have the same problem revisiting Zendikar as they did with Ravnica.
First Ravnica block was the best, partially because of all the innovative card designs, but also because it had an organic creative feel to it. There were lots of individual features like the nephilim that weren't popular in and of themselves but added character to the setting. These were stripped out during the revisits and replaced with more of the features that marketed well, resulting in a blander, more generic plane. By the third visit I dread ever going back.
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These lands... make me want to actually draft this pile set more.
Go figure.
Anyone care to discuss all the implications for EDH?
---
#BLM
#DefundThePolice
I, for one, am glad it's not another over-tuned, ill-tested trainwreck. There are numerous cards here I'm already brewing with, and I find a number of them perfectly serviceable in Standard, especially with the Azusa, Lost but Seeking/Radha, Heart of Keld deck I've been running, already. The MDFCs are fire with Azusa. Play em face down early to ramp up, then cast whatever you want.
The MDFC that where part creature, part land played ended up taking up that room.
"You can tell how dumb someone is by how they use Mary Sue"
no manlands, no fetches, no quests, no level up, no allies, no traps, no feeling of adventure. this is hardly zendikar. i don't want to hear some bull***** like this was known, or we got this instead. those were the things that really captured the feeling of zendikar, and they're gone. replaced with mediocrity and gimmicks.
party is a mechanic that desperately wants more mana fixing and was designed as if there were fetches in the set initially. its underwhelming in its payoff, and requires too much to set up/maintain without disruption.
kicker is underwhelming with very few cards actually being worth running yet the set was designed as if there was an abundance of good kicker cards so you end up with all these messy creatures that rely on something else that might not even be worth playing.
there isn't really anything all that interesting, new, or exploratory at common or uncommon, even rare is a little lackluster. most of the cards just relying too much on the weak mechanics of the set or rehashing something we've already seen.
landfall got some decent cards, but feels really underwhelming in what its doing too. most of those cards are just rehashes of what we've already done with landfall. nothing really new.
there are some reprints that would've worked out great here, and helped manage their pricing a little, but they too were ignored because of course they were. better to jam them into another product that's just as mediocre so we have a means to push it.
almost all the obvious value is again tied to mythic - be that monetary value or gameplay value. there's a few alright rares, but don't forget that given the way things are set up to push more packs all of those rares are going to decline in value as product is opened as people gamble on getting mythics, or just to get box topper expedition lands since thats the only way, or to get pulls from "the list"
but hey you can get like, an expedition land if you buy a whole box, or sometimes a card from "the list" if you buy set boosters, which has a strong chance of just being a dud anyway as a huge portion of the list is crapola, thats great right? buy more product! consume! don't think about the scheme we've orchestrated to suck you dry. crack more packs!
i just don't see any reason here to buy sealed product at all. buy the singles you want, there's only a few decent ones, and otherwise **** this entire product line. save some space in your bulk boxes.
Yeah man ! I feel the same.
Zendikar 1 is still its best version !
Red & white one missin. Why ?
If your expectation was that they were just going to reprint original Zendikar, almost verbatim, then you set yourself up for disappointment. This set is... fine. Not amazing, but there are enough interesting cards to capture my attention.
Party wasn't executed well, but mechanically and flavorfully it's better than ally. Expect it to get even mo' better after D&D: The Gathering drops later next year.
Fetches are OP, time for us all to get over them. If you really want to hold Wizards to a higher standard, we should stop asking them to promote basic resources as chase cards instead of what they actually are: crutches and limitations for a card game in 2020.
Again, quest, level up, and traps were all distinctively tied to Zendikar 1.0. Should Magic grow as a brand, or just do the same old things every time we revisit a plane?
Would you like me to list all of the cards that have me excited?
---
#BLM
#DefundThePolice
1st Zendikar block - ROE released. Focus on Eldrazi/Allies. Players: We prefer Landfall and adventure world.
BFZ - Focus on Eldrazi/Allies. Players: Where are Traps/Expeditions/Lands/Landfall? We prefer Landfall and adventure world.
ZNR - Focus on Party. Players: Where are Traps/Expeditions/Lands/Landfall? We prefer Landfall and adventure world.
Next return to Zendikar: Focus on more creature/tribal. Players: Where are Traps/Expeditions/Lands/Landfall? We prefer Landfall and adventure world.
The art, theme and general approach this time were good though. Far better. I'd trade Party for Quests, Traps and Expedition enchantments but the set's tone is at least in the right place, with a healed world with traces of former Eldrazi.
|| UW Jace, Vyn's Prodigy UW || UG Kenessos, Priest of Thassa (feat. Arixmethes) UG ||
Cards I still want to see created:
|| Olantin, Lost City || Pavios and Thanasis || Choryu ||
Potential commanders I may brew:
Tazri - I don't love the party mechanic as executed, but I once tried a janky 5 color Allies deck and I think a more refined party deck that uses better creatures from other sets may be possible, though I'm in no rush to do that
Akiri - I think she's great, I've wanted to build a RW equipment deck and she is the inspiration I needed
Cards I may add to decks I already have:
Angelheart Protector - I have a blink-focused deck that this may work in, though slots are pretty tight and the ability may not be relevant often enough in terms of indestructability in response to removal.
Felidar Retreat - I have a GW Cats deck, this slots in fairly well and either fills out the board or boosts the army
Luminarch Aspirant - I don't know if it fits in my Atraxa deck, but I do have other decks that may want a steady flow of free counters
Nighthawk Scavenger - immediately in my vampire tribal deck, ditto the Nullpriest and Scion of the Storm
Skyclave Shadowcat - easily slots into a variety of decks, but mostly aristrocrats and +1/+1 counter decks
Moraug - slots right into my Saskia legends/attacking matters deck, extra attacks are great for that deck
Rockslide Sorcerer - another great effect for my NivMizz spellslinger deck, Kaza also slots in easily (60% or so of the creatures in the deck are Wizards)
Valakut Exploration - fits in my Intet deck, though it may be too expensive to justify purchasing since it's largely redundant
Ancient Greenwarden and Ashaya - could be in consideration for my land creatures deck
Roiling Regrowth - good card for almost any deck with green, it's probably the card I'll get in larger numbers
Nahiri - if I build around Akiri, I can see Nahiri being in the list
Zagras - another great addition to my Edgar deck, will frequently be quite inexpensive
Forsaken Monument - goes right in my Baraldrazi counters/Eldrazi deck
Lithoform Engine - I really like it, and want to use it, just not sure where yet because I probably won't be able to buy more than one
Relic Amulet and Vial - Amulet may go with NivMizz (it's already heavy on burn, so the Amulet is redundant), Vial will definitely go in Teysa (it's everything the deck wants more of)
Skyclave Relic - I anticipate it being a pricy card, I'll likely only get enough to go in the decks that both need the mana ramp as well as the extra artifacts
That's honestly about it. I'm really unimpressed with the overall quality of cards. There are ideas here that I like, but the execution was some combination of too costly/too many hoops/too underpowered and ultimately that dulls my excitement for the set. Even the other legends are pretty meh for me, they're alright but are more likely to slot into the 99 elsewhere than being things I build around.
I absolutely adore the concept they have for party, but I can't say they executed it well. Archpriest of Iona, Emeria Captain, Journey to Oblivion, Squad Commander, Nimble Trapfinder, Skyclave Plunder, Coveted Prize, Deadly Alliance, Malakir Blood-Priest, Thwart the Grave, Linvala, Spoils of Adventure, and Base Camp could have potential if party decks manage to get off the ground. Not all of them are stellar, but they all feel like they'd be pretty good with full party. The rest of the party cards largely seem bad, especially given the investment needed.
The MDFCs are nonstarters for me, I just hate playing with them and never will. Landfall isn't really my bag, but I think folks who like it got some great new tools.
I think Commander players should be relatively happy, particularly casual players, the set isn't a total loss. I'm fairly happy that most of what I'm likely to pick up as singles are commons and uncommons, or they're by and large rares and mythics that are unlikely to be popular enough to drive prices up. It's a good set for my budget.
Archatmos
Excellion
Fracture: Israfiel (WBR), Wujal (URG), Valedon (GUB), Amduat (BGW), Paladris (RWU)
Collision (Set Two of the Fracture Block)
Quest for the Forsaken (Set Two of the Excellion Block)
Katingal: Plane of Chains
a set only having five cards I want is a blessing in disguise in these destitute times!
The landfall cards are strong, even stronger than the ones in original Zendikar
As someone who loves my Hallar, the Firefletcher deck I'm very sad there's no red one, I was kind of waiting for it to get spoiled. Still there are plenty of good kicker cards for that deck in this set, it just feels like an unfinished cycle.
They bent over backward to turn Zendikar into a plane of D&D adventures and basically took out all of the stuff we liked about Zendikar except for Landfall. Zendikar was about unlocking a mystery, not going on fun adventures with your bro to find treasure.
First Ravnica block was the best, partially because of all the innovative card designs, but also because it had an organic creative feel to it. There were lots of individual features like the nephilim that weren't popular in and of themselves but added character to the setting. These were stripped out during the revisits and replaced with more of the features that marketed well, resulting in a blander, more generic plane. By the third visit I dread ever going back.