I mostly like the design. It does a great job of resembling the classic layout while looking modern and very clean. Just the planeswalker icon looks a bit tacked on, in terms of placement as well as color... removing it and centering the text would greatly improve the overall look imo.
Anyway, I just look at this solely as an option for digital play, changing the back of printed cards is just not gonna happen.
The design would make a great business card back but doesn't have a fantasy aesthetic to it aside from the word "magic." Sincerely hope this stays as a sleeve and is not adopted as a new card back.
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Avatar by Disappointing Signet Inc
EDH Decks UWB Oloro, Ageless Ascetic's spring of life RUG Animar, Soul of the Elements and friends... lots of them WBG Karador king of two worlds (value and attrition) WRKalemne's Angels BRUG Yidris's Wild Party UWBR Breya's Terrifying Tinker Toys UBRThe Pretender
I don't trust executives not to force this change thinking they can make people stop playing with older cards in such a way.
Which makes me glad I'm selling out of Modern and Legacy and buying board games instead.
As a card sleeve or online variant I can dig it. As a new cardback, I think that is what would make me stop playing magic. DFCs is one thing even though I'm still not a fan, but separate cardbacks would kill it for me.
Im in the overreacting Ill never buy a card again if they change the actual paper backs.
Like many have said, Card Sleeves themselves give the player basically an infinite number of cardbacks anyway so there would be no justification for the change in paper. (Funny my favorite card sleeves are the actual Magic card back sleeves hehehehe, because they are sleeved but still look just like the cards).
For digital, Arena, MTGO or whatever I just dont care or have no opinion because I dont play them and probably never will because I need to physically hold in my hands my collection, decks and investment.
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Been a member here for over a dozen years. Playing since '95 just got lost in the twitch shuffle.
I don't like it. Magic is ultimately a fantasy game, even on Mirrodin there was feel of traditional magic. Changing the game logo is bad enough, card back like this is seriously making it too modern.
Though this is also a 25 year old game, what people deemed best at the time is different from current. While this new card back might attract more players (I'm no expert), old players like me would be irritated. As long as the game itself remain unchanged I guess...
Well, nowadays card back isn't an issue, DFC kinda proves that. People play with sleeves anyway. The only problem is making sure it's opaque.
However, I dislike changes just because of trying to revitalize logos and so on. There is no need for that, specially if that is the proposal.
If they need to change it because of counterfeit measure or maybe even insert microchips, that'd be a reason. Maybe not a good reason, but at least a reason for it. Just changing it just to have a freshier looking logo is just frivolous.
... So how many of us here don't use card sleeves? I know changing the card back has harmed games before, but that was when no one was sleeving cards normally.
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1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
It's for card sleeves and online only. They are not changing the card backs, it's way to late for that now.
This. It's just not going to happen. Relax people.
After seeing the negative responses to the design in how it relates specifically to this game and it’s genre, do you really think it’s a good idea for it to represent magic online?
Honestly, let’s say they do only use this for Arena. It still doesn’t say anything about what makes this game unique which isn’t so great for something that is trying to establish itself.
In other words, where DOES this look fit? Nowhere. It belongs nowhere near this game.
I hope they change the physical cardback into that horrible mess.
Not because I like it, but because it would destroy WOTC.
The game would live on without them and probably healthier if purchased by a decent company like FFG.
Because Fantasy Flight's card games are so great compared to MtG?
I hope they change the physical cardback into that horrible mess.
Not because I like it, but because it would destroy WOTC.
The game would live on without them and probably healthier if purchased by a decent company like FFG.
Because Fantasy Flight's card games are so great compared to MtG?
Yes actually. They've pushed the LCG model as far as it can go and consistently produce good games. Magic does not fit the LCG model but if FFG took over and continued with the TCG model we might at least have better cardstock quality and distribution.
... So how many of us here don't use card sleeves? I know changing the card back has harmed games before, but that was when no one was sleeving cards normally.
I don't think that should be a justification, ever.
OK, let's assume that WotC does decide to change the card back (besides DFC). We know they're not, just go with the flow here.
What is the larger message they're sending to players if they do ? It's certainly not, "oh, you guys play with sleeves anyways so what's the harm?" The larger message is WotC lost faith in their core paper product and feel the need to "reset" the game. It is basically WotC telling us they've abandoned the paper game.
And a game reset of that scale would basically excise the entire existing card pool. Something no sleeving would ever smooth over. There won't be a need for a reserved list because WotC won't be printing the P9 and family again anyways. Not if they want to control the meta like they've been doing.
Like I mentioned before, I can tolerate sleeves. I won't tolerate changing the paper card back.
But I digress. Reading my post it seems like it's pretty far off topic.
If WotC ever announces a change to the paper card backs, we can bring fire and brimstone onto their offices. Until then, I'll try to take this art at face value and refer back to my previous post.
I personally like the design. I wouldn't say it would "never" happen in physical form, but all the changes with card front formatting and design makes it distinct possibility even if remote. Changing card backs, like others have said, have a more game altering effect because of the library and your hand.
It would be a weird reset of the MtG game if they did. The new backs would likely be a start of a new tournament format, and the old backs being legacy.
... So how many of us here don't use card sleeves? I know changing the card back has harmed games before, but that was when no one was sleeving cards normally.
I don't think that should be a justification, ever.
OK, let's assume that WotC does decide to change the card back (besides DFC). We know they're not, just go with the flow here.
What is the larger message they're sending to players if they do ? It's certainly not, "oh, you guys play with sleeves anyways so what's the harm?" The larger message is WotC lost faith in their core paper product and feel the need to "reset" the game. It is basically WotC telling us they've abandoned the paper game.
And a game reset of that scale would basically excise the entire existing card pool. Something no sleeving would ever smooth over. There won't be a need for a reserved list because WotC won't be printing the P9 and family again anyways. Not if they want to control the meta like they've been doing.
Like I mentioned before, I can tolerate sleeves. I won't tolerate changing the paper card back.
But I digress. Reading my post it seems like it's pretty far off topic.
If WotC ever announces a change to the paper card backs, we can bring fire and brimstone onto their offices. Until then, I'll try to take this art at face value and refer back to my previous post.
Changing the card back doesn't send any message. What sends messages is the msrp of sets, the lack of paying for better quality control on the cards, and having a complete disconnect with the player base. If they did a grand reversal of this behavior; drop the price of reprint sets, promotional codes, good use of the DCI system to provide player rewards, etc, and followed this shift with a change to the card back, it would over all be a good thing.
As for the change in the digital product to the card back I'm not sure I am totally with them on doing it. I'd rather have something like this happen in both paper and online with the proper requisite shift to bring player confidence up. Otherwise it feels like change for the sake of change, rather than change with a purpose in mind.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
People are overreacting. They didn't even say something like "this is what the new card back could look like if we were to introduce one", just that this is a re-imagined card back to be used for sleeves.
As far as it goes, I don't hate the design. I could see myself using these sleeves although I usually prefer matte black or dark blue sleeves.
It's pretty normal for them to release 'alternate' card back sleeves every few years. What makes this design more/less likely to be considered as an actual card back change?
Its a pretty spiffy looking card back, but it would look better if someone accidentally scribbled on it with a ballpoint pen before it got used as a template
... So how many of us here don't use card sleeves? I know changing the card back has harmed games before, but that was when no one was sleeving cards normally.
I don't think that should be a justification, ever.
OK, let's assume that WotC does decide to change the card back (besides DFC). We know they're not, just go with the flow here.
What is the larger message they're sending to players if they do ? It's certainly not, "oh, you guys play with sleeves anyways so what's the harm?" The larger message is WotC lost faith in their core paper product and feel the need to "reset" the game. It is basically WotC telling us they've abandoned the paper game.
And a game reset of that scale would basically excise the entire existing card pool. Something no sleeving would ever smooth over. There won't be a need for a reserved list because WotC won't be printing the P9 and family again anyways. Not if they want to control the meta like they've been doing.
Like I mentioned before, I can tolerate sleeves. I won't tolerate changing the paper card back.
But I digress. Reading my post it seems like it's pretty far off topic.
If WotC ever announces a change to the paper card backs, we can bring fire and brimstone onto their offices. Until then, I'll try to take this art at face value and refer back to my previous post.
Changing the card back doesn't send any message. What sends messages is the msrp of sets, the lack of paying for better quality control on the cards, and having a complete disconnect with the player base. If they did a grand reversal of this behavior; drop the price of reprint sets, promotional codes, good use of the DCI system to provide player rewards, etc, and followed this shift with a change to the card back, it would over all be a good thing.
I think we're just going to have to disagree on this aspect.
I think what neither your or I know for sure is just how many people would give a double middle finger to WotC if they did do a pretty drastic change. I know that I would do so. I have absolutely no qualms walking away from the game and never looking back if they did such a change. All the other changes in the past 25 years would pale in comparison.
As for the change in the digital product to the card back I'm not sure I am totally with them on doing it. I'd rather have something like this happen in both paper and online with the proper requisite shift to bring player confidence up. Otherwise it feels like change for the sake of change, rather than change with a purpose in mind.
The online component is an easy change to implement and an easy one to avoid. You and I both know this. Dynamic card backs would not diminish the play value of existing online cards.
This is not necessary at all and doing it will just upset people and hurt the game.
It does not contribute anything to the game that has any reasonable gain at all.
Nobody with their senses would go that route.
... But sadly, we are talking about WotC here, so if there is something outright stupid to do, we can be pretty much guaranteed they will pull that switch no matter how stupid it is. That fact really frightens me, just a matter of time till they go full on self-destruct ...
---
Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.
Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.
Anyway, I just look at this solely as an option for digital play, changing the back of printed cards is just not gonna happen.
W(W/U)U Ephara - Flash & Taxes W(W/U)U || B(B/G)G Meren - Circle of Life B(B/G)G
RGW Marath - Ever shifting Wilds RGW || (U/R)C(W/B) Breya - Artificial Dominion (U/R)C(W/B)
UBR Becket Brass - take what you can, give nothing back UBR
EDH Decks
UWB Oloro, Ageless Ascetic's spring of life
RUG Animar, Soul of the Elements and friends... lots of them
WBG Karador king of two worlds (value and attrition)
WRKalemne's Angels
BRUG Yidris's Wild Party
UWBR Breya's Terrifying Tinker Toys
UBR The Pretender
Which makes me glad I'm selling out of Modern and Legacy and buying board games instead.
Like many have said, Card Sleeves themselves give the player basically an infinite number of cardbacks anyway so there would be no justification for the change in paper. (Funny my favorite card sleeves are the actual Magic card back sleeves hehehehe, because they are sleeved but still look just like the cards).
For digital, Arena, MTGO or whatever I just dont care or have no opinion because I dont play them and probably never will because I need to physically hold in my hands my collection, decks and investment.
Though this is also a 25 year old game, what people deemed best at the time is different from current. While this new card back might attract more players (I'm no expert), old players like me would be irritated. As long as the game itself remain unchanged I guess...
Shu Yun, the Silent Tempest WUR Voltron Control
Temmet, Vizier of Naktamun WU Unblockable Mirror Trickery
Ra's al Ghul (Sidar Kondo) and Face-Down Ninjas
Brudiclad, Token Engineer
Vaevictis (VV2) the Dire Lantern
Rona, Disciple of Gix
Tiana the Auror
Hallar
Ulrich the Politician
Zur the Rebel
Scorpion, Locust, Scarab, Egyptian Gods
O-Kagachi, Mathas, Mairsil
"Non-Tribal" Tribal Generals, Eggs
However, I dislike changes just because of trying to revitalize logos and so on. There is no need for that, specially if that is the proposal.
If they need to change it because of counterfeit measure or maybe even insert microchips, that'd be a reason. Maybe not a good reason, but at least a reason for it. Just changing it just to have a freshier looking logo is just frivolous.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Stay reasonable, be mindful of your expectations and don't feed the trolls.
Doomsdayin'
After seeing the negative responses to the design in how it relates specifically to this game and it’s genre, do you really think it’s a good idea for it to represent magic online?
Honestly, let’s say they do only use this for Arena. It still doesn’t say anything about what makes this game unique which isn’t so great for something that is trying to establish itself.
In other words, where DOES this look fit? Nowhere. It belongs nowhere near this game.
Because Fantasy Flight's card games are so great compared to MtG?
I loathe creatures! Praise Prison and Land Destruction!
My Peasant Cube (looking for feedback)
I don't think that should be a justification, ever.
OK, let's assume that WotC does decide to change the card back (besides DFC). We know they're not, just go with the flow here.
What is the larger message they're sending to players if they do ? It's certainly not, "oh, you guys play with sleeves anyways so what's the harm?" The larger message is WotC lost faith in their core paper product and feel the need to "reset" the game. It is basically WotC telling us they've abandoned the paper game.
And a game reset of that scale would basically excise the entire existing card pool. Something no sleeving would ever smooth over. There won't be a need for a reserved list because WotC won't be printing the P9 and family again anyways. Not if they want to control the meta like they've been doing.
Like I mentioned before, I can tolerate sleeves. I won't tolerate changing the paper card back.
But I digress. Reading my post it seems like it's pretty far off topic.
If WotC ever announces a change to the paper card backs, we can bring fire and brimstone onto their offices. Until then, I'll try to take this art at face value and refer back to my previous post.
It would be a weird reset of the MtG game if they did. The new backs would likely be a start of a new tournament format, and the old backs being legacy.
Changing the card back doesn't send any message. What sends messages is the msrp of sets, the lack of paying for better quality control on the cards, and having a complete disconnect with the player base. If they did a grand reversal of this behavior; drop the price of reprint sets, promotional codes, good use of the DCI system to provide player rewards, etc, and followed this shift with a change to the card back, it would over all be a good thing.
As for the change in the digital product to the card back I'm not sure I am totally with them on doing it. I'd rather have something like this happen in both paper and online with the proper requisite shift to bring player confidence up. Otherwise it feels like change for the sake of change, rather than change with a purpose in mind.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
As far as it goes, I don't hate the design. I could see myself using these sleeves although I usually prefer matte black or dark blue sleeves.
I think we're just going to have to disagree on this aspect.
I think what neither your or I know for sure is just how many people would give a double middle finger to WotC if they did do a pretty drastic change. I know that I would do so. I have absolutely no qualms walking away from the game and never looking back if they did such a change. All the other changes in the past 25 years would pale in comparison.
The online component is an easy change to implement and an easy one to avoid. You and I both know this. Dynamic card backs would not diminish the play value of existing online cards.
This is not necessary at all and doing it will just upset people and hurt the game.
It does not contribute anything to the game that has any reasonable gain at all.
Nobody with their senses would go that route.
... But sadly, we are talking about WotC here, so if there is something outright stupid to do, we can be pretty much guaranteed they will pull that switch no matter how stupid it is. That fact really frightens me, just a matter of time till they go full on self-destruct ...
WUBRG#BlackLotusMatterWUBRG
👮👮👮 #BlueLivesMatter 👮👮👮
I don't care either way, but I'm curious if card back is part of that promise.
Older Magic as a Board Game: Panglacial Wurm , Mill