I see him dropping to around $15-20, but then regaining value this summer. He's good, and does a LOT more work than people are giving him credit. Kind of reminds me when Tamiyo was spoiled. People felt she was a bit overcosted for what she did, and eventually saw plenty of play (though not as much now as last year).
I see him dropping to around $15-20, but then regaining value this summer. He's good, and does a LOT more work than people are giving him credit. Kind of reminds me when Tamiyo was spoiled. People felt she was a bit overcosted for what she did, and eventually saw plenty of play (though not as much now as last year).
Thanks for your post, you put my ideas on paper in a very simple way.
I see him dropping to around $15-20, but then regaining value this summer. He's good, and does a LOT more work than people are giving him credit. Kind of reminds me when Tamiyo was spoiled. People felt she was a bit overcosted for what she did, and eventually saw plenty of play (though not as much now as last year).
What in folks estimation are the differences between Ral and Gideon power~price-wise? Gideon was going for as high as $35 preorder, and now, a few months later, is down as low as $7. With u/r/x losing a lot of ground in the competitive realm, I'm interested to see if Ral follows the same sort of hype->decline cycle as Gid.
I see him dropping to around $15-20, but then regaining value this summer. He's good, and does a LOT more work than people are giving him credit. Kind of reminds me when Tamiyo was spoiled. People felt she was a bit overcosted for what she did, and eventually saw plenty of play (though not as much now as last year).
Ral Zarek has some awkward abilities and I find a large gap between him and Tamiyo.
Ral's +1 has more applications in combat. Note that it does cause the permanents to untap next turn and as such it only works well giving a creature vigilance and tapping down a potential blocker (good with reckoner actually). Tamiyo's +1 locks down a permanent until their next next turn provided she decides to not tap that same permanent again.
Ral's -2 is not too bad, but I don't see any cards in standards with toughness less or equal to 3 that is particularly back breaking except reckoner but slinging it at reckoner is usually not the best idea.
Color wise, the UR is a turn off. Tamiyo and Jace AOT being mono blue means it can be played in esper control, UW control/tempo and American control. UR colors essentially places Ral solely in American control decks
All I can say is, everyone better pick up their "Advent of the Wurm" cards now while they are cheap. Easily an $8 card or higher. The instant speed makes all the difference, and the fact that it interacts with snapcaster is pretty nuts as well.
To the person who said we need a grim monolith or mana vault type effect in standard to make ral zarek work, see: gilded lotus. It's even 6 mana of two different colors if you need it to be two different colors. I wouldn't be a bit surprised to see gilded lotus combined with ral zarek and sphinx's revelation in standard or something ridiculous like that, not sure if it will be good enough to be tier 1 or not though.
Beck//Call is much better than people think. Wirewood hivemaster + beck//call in legacy? Yes please. Cloudstone curio to literally draw my entire deck with birchlore rangers and nettle sentinel + a dude? The possibilities are endless with this card, and 3 dollars a pop is a bargain for it in all likelihood. If the card is as good as I suspect, years down the line it will be double digits with ease.
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Beck//Call is much better than people think. Wirewood hivemaster + beck//call in legacy? Yes please. Cloudstone curio to literally draw my entire deck with birchlore rangers and nettle sentinel + a dude? The possibilities are endless with this card, and 3 dollars a pop is a bargain for it in all likelihood. If the card is as good as I suspect, years down the line it will be double digits with ease.
Its redundant glimpse in legacy, whether it'll be a breakout or not I feel depends on modern.
None of these strike me as overly powerful. The cards are mostly great but niche - which is exciting to me because so far the set seems well designed. Hopefully the rest of the set is similarly useful.
Its redundant glimpse in legacy, whether it'll be a breakout or not I feel depends on modern.
I dunno about that, Glimpse reads "when you cast a creature spell" , Beck reads "When a creature enters the battlefield"
Two similar, yet VERY different effects, I could see Midnight Guard + Presence of Gond with Beck in Modern for a turn 3 kill. Essentially, make a bunch of tokens, draw your library, give them haste, and kill opponent...
With mana dorks, a could see RWUG Token//Draw with Mass Hysteria deck pop up just with Beck/Call in the format.
Also, I could see that token generation thing work in LEgacy with Beck, because it doesn't work with Glimpse at all. Mainly because, Legacy you have better combo protection in the form of Force of Will, Daze, etc.
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what do you all think of Renounce the guilds value??? I say a 2-5 depending on the rest of Dragon's maze and the meta. but I'm horrible at guesstimating on stuff like this. great hate card on Geist although there's Deputy of Acquittals to protect Geist.
Renounce the guilds is a niche removal spell at best I think. Card doesn't seem that powerful. It adds another dimension to oblivion ring versus detention sphere, as sphere gets sacrificed generally upon resolution of renounce the guilds in control decks. And it answers garruk, the veil-cursed although that's just a neat interaction and not necessarily a good one.
Legacy elves wanted more glimpse of nature last I heard. Beck fits the bill perfectly, as well as being quite strong with green sun's zenith and natural order, something that glimpse is not good with. Also, drawing two per elf with hivemaster in play and just one beck active? It's like you resolved two glimpse of nature but you didn't need two glimpses, rather just one card which is pretty huge in legacy combo.
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-Ral is maybe $10 value for opening release, and his price is just hype inflation or stores trying to cash in. If he was three cmc; I would have noticed cause RU is hard to run on its own.
-Advent of the Wurm looks really cool for Sanpcaster mage, and its instant speed! I got mine just cause i Like the idea of the card. $5 at best for me for pre-order.
-Renounce the Guilds just interests me cause its seems neat and unexspeted. Dreadbore price at best.
Remember folks, Speculation of price or pre-ordering is decent plan if it's Low mana cost, easily splashed, staple worthy, Jund or Bant good, and you feel the itch to play it.
I dunno about that, Glimpse reads "when you cast a creature spell" , Beck reads "When a creature enters the battlefield"
Two similar, yet VERY different effects, I could see Midnight Guard + Presence of Gond with Beck in Modern for a turn 3 kill. Essentially, make a bunch of tokens, draw your library, give them haste, and kill opponent...
With mana dorks, a could see RWUG Token//Draw with Mass Hysteria deck pop up just with Beck/Call in the format.
Also, I could see that token generation thing work in LEgacy with Beck, because it doesn't work with Glimpse at all. Mainly because, Legacy you have better combo protection in the form of Force of Will, Daze, etc.
Beck has some unique "better than glimpse" interactions
- Forbidden Orchard (draws 1)
- Dryad Arbor (draws 1 off fetchland)
- Any multiple creature creating effects
In standard for instance, you can use the spell that (when this creature dies create 1/1 tokens for each power), and kill that creature to draw his power in cards, you can't do that with glimpse.
Whenever a creature enters is much better than whenever you cast a creature spell.
the 1 cmc vs 2 cmc is still a difference though and I'd expect beck to be the lower powered one.
I'd still not expect beck to raise in value much. There's still a lot of value to be found for beck in modern, whether in affinity, elves or some other archetype that has creatures and wants cards.
Beck has some unique "better than glimpse" interactions
- Forbidden Orchard (draws 1)
- Dryad Arbor (draws 1 off fetchland)
- Any multiple creature creating effects
In standard for instance, you can use the spell that (when this creature dies create 1/1 tokens for each power), and kill that creature to draw his power in cards, you can't do that with glimpse. Same with effects like inkmoth nexus.
Whenever a creature enters is much better than whenever you cast a creature spell.
the 1 cmc vs 2 cmc is still a difference though and I'd expect beck to be the lower powered one.
I'd still not expect beck to raise in value much. There's still a lot of value to be found for beck in modern, whether in affinity, elves or some other archetype that has creatures and wants cards.
How do you mean effects like inkmoth? A land turning into a creature isn't a creature entering the battlefield you know. Beck has zero interation with manlands(Dryad Arbor being the exception since it's always a creature).
What do you guys think the ceiling on the wurm is? I wish I stayed up last night to preorder them when they were $3, but I was able to get them for $5.
What do you guys think the ceiling on the wurm is? I wish I stayed up last night to preorder them when they were $3, but I was able to get them for $5.
They were never $3. eBay started them at $5, SCG and CF at $4. I think the realistic ceiling is $15ish. It's likely going to be $10~$15, jumping when it sees play in the PT.
It's a playable card for sure but it's still just a dumb beef card with mana cost of 1GGW, no way it'll end up being worth $10 or more.
Instant Speed, interactible with Snapcaster, in the right colors for Bant, Oh yeah, this has Sphinx's Revelation syndrome written all over it...
It'll be cheap out of the gate, then continually rise until it's played on the pro-tour, I know for a fact i'm going to be preordering multiples of this at $5 each, along with as many becks/calls as i can get for $4...
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It's an instant speed 5/5 trampler for 4. Wtf do you people want seriously? It has applications in populate/ above the curve beats decks, or in Bant control/ flash. I seriously think anyone mad at this card for any reason other than losing an attacker to instant speed wurm, should go home and make their own awesome card game and leave the rest of us alone.
How do you guys feel about Laviana? Everyone keeps raving about UWX control post innistrad rotation. Do we think this should see play? Is it worth pre ordering? Any other big ones from the set thus far?
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I haven't seen the Boros Reckoner of the set yet. However Boros reckoner was never a pre-view card but was revealed with the last 100 cards at the end.
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Thanks for your post, you put my ideas on paper in a very simple way.
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What in folks estimation are the differences between Ral and Gideon power~price-wise? Gideon was going for as high as $35 preorder, and now, a few months later, is down as low as $7. With u/r/x losing a lot of ground in the competitive realm, I'm interested to see if Ral follows the same sort of hype->decline cycle as Gid.
"Personally I love high-riak, low-reqars gambles. Life's best with a decent amount of riak. And f*** reqars."
Ral Zarek has some awkward abilities and I find a large gap between him and Tamiyo.
Ral's +1 has more applications in combat. Note that it does cause the permanents to untap next turn and as such it only works well giving a creature vigilance and tapping down a potential blocker (good with reckoner actually). Tamiyo's +1 locks down a permanent until their next next turn provided she decides to not tap that same permanent again.
Ral's -2 is not too bad, but I don't see any cards in standards with toughness less or equal to 3 that is particularly back breaking except reckoner but slinging it at reckoner is usually not the best idea.
Color wise, the UR is a turn off. Tamiyo and Jace AOT being mono blue means it can be played in esper control, UW control/tempo and American control. UR colors essentially places Ral solely in American control decks
Beck//Call is much better than people think. Wirewood hivemaster + beck//call in legacy? Yes please. Cloudstone curio to literally draw my entire deck with birchlore rangers and nettle sentinel + a dude? The possibilities are endless with this card, and 3 dollars a pop is a bargain for it in all likelihood. If the card is as good as I suspect, years down the line it will be double digits with ease.
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Its redundant glimpse in legacy, whether it'll be a breakout or not I feel depends on modern.
I dunno about that, Glimpse reads "when you cast a creature spell" , Beck reads "When a creature enters the battlefield"
Two similar, yet VERY different effects, I could see Midnight Guard + Presence of Gond with Beck in Modern for a turn 3 kill. Essentially, make a bunch of tokens, draw your library, give them haste, and kill opponent...
With mana dorks, a could see RWUG Token//Draw with Mass Hysteria deck pop up just with Beck/Call in the format.
Also, I could see that token generation thing work in LEgacy with Beck, because it doesn't work with Glimpse at all. Mainly because, Legacy you have better combo protection in the form of Force of Will, Daze, etc.
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Legacy elves wanted more glimpse of nature last I heard. Beck fits the bill perfectly, as well as being quite strong with green sun's zenith and natural order, something that glimpse is not good with. Also, drawing two per elf with hivemaster in play and just one beck active? It's like you resolved two glimpse of nature but you didn't need two glimpses, rather just one card which is pretty huge in legacy combo.
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-Advent of the Wurm looks really cool for Sanpcaster mage, and its instant speed! I got mine just cause i Like the idea of the card. $5 at best for me for pre-order.
-Renounce the Guilds just interests me cause its seems neat and unexspeted. Dreadbore price at best.
Remember folks, Speculation of price or pre-ordering is decent plan if it's Low mana cost, easily splashed, staple worthy, Jund or Bant good, and you feel the itch to play it.
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Beck has some unique "better than glimpse" interactions
- Forbidden Orchard (draws 1)
- Dryad Arbor (draws 1 off fetchland)
- Any multiple creature creating effects
In standard for instance, you can use the spell that (when this creature dies create 1/1 tokens for each power), and kill that creature to draw his power in cards, you can't do that with glimpse.
Whenever a creature enters is much better than whenever you cast a creature spell.
the 1 cmc vs 2 cmc is still a difference though and I'd expect beck to be the lower powered one.
I'd still not expect beck to raise in value much. There's still a lot of value to be found for beck in modern, whether in affinity, elves or some other archetype that has creatures and wants cards.
(edit fixed)
How do you mean effects like inkmoth? A land turning into a creature isn't a creature entering the battlefield you know. Beck has zero interation with manlands(Dryad Arbor being the exception since it's always a creature).
They were never $3. eBay started them at $5, SCG and CF at $4. I think the realistic ceiling is $15ish. It's likely going to be $10~$15, jumping when it sees play in the PT.
Instant Speed, interactible with Snapcaster, in the right colors for Bant, Oh yeah, this has Sphinx's Revelation syndrome written all over it...
It'll be cheap out of the gate, then continually rise until it's played on the pro-tour, I know for a fact i'm going to be preordering multiples of this at $5 each, along with as many becks/calls as i can get for $4...
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Loxodon Smiter seems to be a good comparison - both have their own strengths and Smiter is much easier to cast.
The spilt cards would like to have a word with you.
This set is looking a lot like 'Commander the set' at this moment, but still plenty of cards to spoil.
I hope this set's underpowered overcosted cards will drop booster boxes, because it has a ton of EDH stuff I will want already.
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