All I know is I will probably open one, or God-forbid two, of these at the pre-release and proceed to shed a few tears while they guy next to me opens a bomb mythic and rares.
Honestly seems like a pretty good aggro card... It just keeps attacking and attacking and attacking and OH GOD IT WONT DIE NO MATTER HOW MANY LINGERING SOULS I PLAY
I don't like this card, at all. I've wracked my brain for reasons to play it, and I just can't come up with any. This should be an uncommon too, if not for the fact that the ability was so unique I guess. Maybe if you're playing U/B Self-mill with Lab Maniac, you run him as an awesome blocker. But otherwise, eww.
I find this card reasonably curious. The ability is good without being great, because it's limited it the effects it fights but is great at fighting the one it does. A 2/1 that is effectively indestructible while in combat is a solid beater (it's even superior to that, since indestructible creatures still die to creatures with Infect, this doesn't), and the investment is small enough that if it does trade with a removal spell you probably got something close to parity on it. It makes an excellent blocker against any non-trampler.
Perhaps the biggest issue is it's color, since most of the other great Spirits are White and Blue, but Lingering Souls is tribally relevant and on color for it (well, the Flashback is). I wouldn't call it unplayable, but there just might not be the deck for it.
Uh, play it in a flashback build with Runic Repetition, or with that cast-from-exile Misthollow Griffin?
I kid, gentlemen, I kid. (Nonetheless, I'd love to be able to use it like that.)
Yeah, I don't get it either. People seemed excited about this card and I just wondered why. It seems rather bad. At least casting something from exile could be cool?
People are looking at it as an aggressive black 2-drop, because you can attack with it for little penalty. When you're going on the offensive against any deck except control, Dolmen Gate helps keep on the offensive, rather than getting blunted by enemy 2/2s.
Yeah, I don't get it either. People seemed excited about this card and I just wondered why. It seems rather bad. At least casting something from exile could be cool?
Whenthere are eventually more cards that can cast from exile this card will be awsome. Magic has an almost 20 year history --> if it even lasts close to another 10 years, tell me you can't see a mechanic using exile as a resource/new design space. "Exiled matters" for the WIN!!
People are looking at it as an aggressive black 2-drop, because you can attack with it for little penalty. When you're going on the offensive against any deck except control, Dolmen Gate helps keep on the offensive, rather than getting blunted by enemy 2/2s.
See, this guy gets it. While likely not as powerful as something like Gravecrawler, it's pretty awesome in a metagame full of small cheap creatures, since it can not be easily attacked into the turn it lands, and can attack indescriminately into any number of creatures. Really, how much damage do you expect this thing to take? If it ever managed to lose you the game by milling you to death, it probably nearly won you the game by being an amazing blocker.
hmm, it doesn't have any other abilities, making it pretty much the same as playing a Highborn Ghoul in zombies that can be blocked, so that sucks. As for blocking, yeah ok thats nice, but why should you care about blocking with an aggro deck anyway, you only care about killing the opponent as fast as possible.
That sounds single-minded but really if you build your deck with defense in mind you take away from the explosive quality.
The point being there are better 2 drops.
hmm, it doesn't have any other abilities, making it pretty much the same as playing a Highborn Ghoul in zombies that can be blocked, so that sucks. As for blocking, yeah ok thats nice, but why should you care about blocking with an aggro deck anyway, you only care about killing the opponent as fast as possible.
That sounds single-minded but really if you build your deck with defense in mind you take away from the explosive quality.
The point being there are better 2 drops.
You kind of missed my point, but nevermind. Just remember compared to Highborn Ghoul, it's not a Zombie it's a Spirit, and it costs a whole colored mana less, which makes it much easier to splash, especially in an enemy color deck (BW Spirits, maybe?)
This guy is a lot better than people are thinking. Sure, he can be killed, but then they are wasting a removal on a two drop instead of your bigger threats. Hes a nice follow up to your 1 drop zombies, or vexing devil. He can block something when he has summoning sickness, without worry of him dying. I think he is better than highborn ghoul for sure.
I def see this guy in a B/R aggro deck.
Who cares if you exile cards from your library. This is black, the only life, and the only card that matters is the last one!
Also, which two drops in black are better than this? (Not considering Zombies, where creature type is almost more relevant than actual stats)
More interesting question would be what deck except zombies would want an aggressive black 2-drop ?
Some kind of BWG aggro with township maybe to double up on strangleroot geists? Or esper spirits using him as a defensive creature before captain comes online?
Though I can see him in zombies SB against aggro if you have the slots.
Yeah, I don't get it either. People seemed excited about this card and I just wondered why. It seems rather bad. At least casting something from exile could be cool?
Yup. That's why I said what I said.... and that's already been explicitly posted on page 1 on this thread... (posting for post count much?)
Anyway, in Zombies Highborn Ghoul is probably better (if that card is even playable in Zombies). You basically just want to rack up damage more than you want to win the attrition battle against Lingering Souls, etc. And obviously tribal synergies with Ghoul not Surgeon (Gravecrawler, lord), plus he doesn't work with Cavern of Souls naming Zombie.
As a pure blocker you'd rather just Doom Blade a guy. For example, every Titan (except maybe Sun Titan without targets) owns the Surgeon. (This is especially important now because of Cavern of Souls hitting standard.) Every flying/unblockable creature owns the Surgeon. Any reasonably sized creature will continue to live through combat basically making this a rather janky version of Wall of Denial. But to be fair it is decent against smaller non-evasive guys... then again so is Black Sun's Zenith.
As an attacker it's not terrible but it doesn't guarantee any damage and is too fragile to be considered much better than a 2 mana 2/1.
In another time this card would have been considered very, very good. Now it's fringe playable... fringe playable with some high powered cards in standard. The drawback (exiling library) isn't irrelevant either, especially if you have some 'search' targets in your deck.
It should have been when he is dealt damage that cards are removed and put INTO your graveyard.. not exiled.. and a zombie... in merry christmas dream land.
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But it's still a 2/1 for 2 that doesn't die in combat..
still gets Burned and Slipped.
All I know is I will probably open one, or God-forbid two, of these at the pre-release and proceed to shed a few tears while they guy next to me opens a bomb mythic and rares.
Older Magic as a Board Game: Panglacial Wurm , Mill
Perhaps the biggest issue is it's color, since most of the other great Spirits are White and Blue, but Lingering Souls is tribally relevant and on color for it (well, the Flashback is). I wouldn't call it unplayable, but there just might not be the deck for it.
I kid, gentlemen, I kid. (Nonetheless, I'd love to be able to use it like that.)
Karador EDH
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Misthollow Griffin
Since the entire point of swords in the first place is so they cannot block and it connects. Not doing anything a gravecralwer couldn't do.
See, this guy gets it. While likely not as powerful as something like Gravecrawler, it's pretty awesome in a metagame full of small cheap creatures, since it can not be easily attacked into the turn it lands, and can attack indescriminately into any number of creatures. Really, how much damage do you expect this thing to take? If it ever managed to lose you the game by milling you to death, it probably nearly won you the game by being an amazing blocker.
That sounds single-minded but really if you build your deck with defense in mind you take away from the explosive quality.
The point being there are better 2 drops.
You kind of missed my point, but nevermind. Just remember compared to Highborn Ghoul, it's not a Zombie it's a Spirit, and it costs a whole colored mana less, which makes it much easier to splash, especially in an enemy color deck (BW Spirits, maybe?)
I def see this guy in a B/R aggro deck.
Who cares if you exile cards from your library. This is black, the only life, and the only card that matters is the last one!
More interesting question would be what deck except zombies would want an aggressive black 2-drop ?
Some kind of BWG aggro with township maybe to double up on strangleroot geists? Or esper spirits using him as a defensive creature before captain comes online?
Though I can see him in zombies SB against aggro if you have the slots.
Yup. That's why I said what I said.... and that's already been explicitly posted on page 1 on this thread... (posting for post count much?)
Anyway, in Zombies Highborn Ghoul is probably better (if that card is even playable in Zombies). You basically just want to rack up damage more than you want to win the attrition battle against Lingering Souls, etc. And obviously tribal synergies with Ghoul not Surgeon (Gravecrawler, lord), plus he doesn't work with Cavern of Souls naming Zombie.
As a pure blocker you'd rather just Doom Blade a guy. For example, every Titan (except maybe Sun Titan without targets) owns the Surgeon. (This is especially important now because of Cavern of Souls hitting standard.) Every flying/unblockable creature owns the Surgeon. Any reasonably sized creature will continue to live through combat basically making this a rather janky version of Wall of Denial. But to be fair it is decent against smaller non-evasive guys... then again so is Black Sun's Zenith.
As an attacker it's not terrible but it doesn't guarantee any damage and is too fragile to be considered much better than a 2 mana 2/1.
In another time this card would have been considered very, very good. Now it's fringe playable... fringe playable with some high powered cards in standard. The drawback (exiling library) isn't irrelevant either, especially if you have some 'search' targets in your deck.