This thread is for the discussion of -spooky-'s latest article, Squandered Resources: Bringing Back the Dead and Making New Friends. Due to technical issues the thread that is normally created when an article is published didn't occur, so I have created this thread to allow you to talk about it. As always, please keep your comments on topic.
I'm not sure how this would work in Legacy (haven't played it), but Curse of Exhaustion could shut down Storm decks without biting you in the back like Rule of Law.
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Haven't played anything but EDH and casual for over a year
I'm not sure how this would work in Legacy (haven't played it), but Curse of Exhaustion could shut down Storm decks without biting you in the back like Rule of Law.
The 4 mana would not be too difficult to achieve with Enchantress, so that's actually a pretty good choice. I didn;t know the card existed. Thanks!
Awesome ideas! Haha I've actually been working on a red control build that runs 8 red counter spells.
You mention that the build you've posted is more suited to creature heavy metas, any recommendations for combo heavy metas? Everyone at my local shop either plays combo or RUG delver :/
Awesome ideas! Haha I've actually been working on a red control build that runs 8 red counter spells.
You mention that the build you've posted is more suited to creature heavy metas, any recommendations for combo heavy metas? Everyone at my local shop either plays combo or RUG delver :/
Ummm. My recommendation for a combo heavy meta is not playing mono red control. At least, not this version of it. A Wildfire deck with 4 Chalice and 4 3sphere would be better. At least, as far as mono red controlish decks go.
I really like the Helm and Rest in Peace combo in Enchantress! It is a lot less clunkier than some decks running Emrakul as the win-con. If I were to take the deck to a tournament tomorrow, the only thing I would change is to add some Enlightened Tutors and trim something for them.
Helm/Rest in Peace has been out for a while now, but I think this is the best shell to put it in, aside from the more expensive esper builds. Yes, tutors will be awesome.
As an aside, Don't you think 4 buried alive is overkill? In a deck with 4 Entomb, 4 Imp and 2 therapies? were there any instances in playtesting when it has come up a dead draw? It has done so quite a lot for me..
I'm really loving the thought put into the red deck. I especially like the use of snow covered mountains + scrying sheets, and skred to hit for big numbers. It's interesting to see a different take on red, a colour that typically wants to win fast at any cost.
As an aside, Don't you think 4 buried alive is overkill? In a deck with 4 Entomb, 4 Imp and 2 therapies? were there any instances in playtesting when it has come up a dead draw? It has done so quite a lot for me..
I don't think so, no. Like I said in the article the deck has no card sorting of any kind. You want to maximize your chances of getting creatures into the graveyard. It will almost never be a dead card in my opinion, simply because as the board state changes so too will your need for specific fatties.
Its awesome that you showed all of the common reanimator targets, but in truth playing 4x grislbrand is just better.
also, there is a really awesome UG enchantress build that uses Words of wind to lock the other guy out of permanents, It might even be cheaper than the version you listed!
I don't think grisel is better in mono black. when you have blue hes great because he can protect himself by drawing into counter magic. In mono black the best you can hope for is fast mana and new reanimation targets. Not sure if that warrents a full play set of him.
The words of wind list might be cheaper, not sure. I like being able to just kill straight up with helm and RIP though.
I don't think grisel is better in mono black. when you have blue hes great because he can protect himself by drawing into counter magic. In mono black the best you can hope for is fast mana and new reanimation targets. Not sure if that warrents a full play set of him.
The words of wind list might be cheaper, not sure. I like being able to just kill straight up with helm and RIP though.
Except this deck also plays fast mana, and double draw 7 has a very real chance of getting another fatty into play.
gris kills in three swings, most other targets kill in 4 while he gains life and is thus impossible to race.
The only other options reanimator needs is 1xiona for combo and control, 1xelesh to gank swarm strats that grislbrand isnt good against, inkwell gets a slot because he dodges remvoal and karakas and then you get 2 more slots after 4x grilsbrand for a nice 9 reanimator targets.
play the deck as is, every time you reanimate something, ask yourself this: is this creature *really* better than grislbrand right now? most of the time, the answer will be no
1. I dislike koth of the hammer in the monored control deck. Its +1 is only useful for attacking, its -2 does nothing really because all the spells are cheap, and its -5 is good but you have to wait 2 turns to get it.
3. Take out the buried alive in the monoblack reanimator deck and add in gitaxian probe. This will make your deck faster and just as consistent. (If you find there are not enough ways to get creatures in your graveyard, add in the extra cabal therapys.)
4. I agree with what other people are saying about the 4 griselbrand.
1. I dislike koth of the hammer in the monored control deck. Its +1 is only useful for attacking, its -2 does nothing really because all the spells are cheap, and its -5 is good but you have to wait 2 turns to get it.
3. Take out the buried alive in the monoblack reanimator deck and add in gitaxian probe. This will make your deck faster and just as consistent. (If you find there are not enough ways to get creatures in your graveyard, add in the extra cabal therapys.)
4. I agree with what other people are saying about the 4 griselbrand.
Otherwise, great decks!
1- I actually really like Koth. His mana ability is great and his other 2 are awesome finishers in what is otherwise a very slow deck. Sometimes you just need to win fast, and he lets us do that. Also, dont forget that his man land ability untaps the mountain, allowing you to use it for mana again.
2- I agree completely.
3- Buried Alive is weird. Sometimes I really like it, and sometimes I hate it. I absolutely cannot agree that a 1 card cantrip is just as effective as an actual discard outlet in providing discard, but I can agree that buried alive is iffy sometimes. Maybe a 2-2 split could work? I don't know, would require testing.
4- As far as griselbrand goes, I have already stated my opinion. By no means does that automatically make me right, and if multiple people are telling me I am wrong, maybe I need to rethink my stance. This, much like anything else, would require testing. I feel my logic is strong, but if so many people disagree then maybe I need to look into it more.
1- I actually really like Koth. His mana ability is great and his other 2 are awesome finishers in what is otherwise a very slow deck. Sometimes you just need to win fast, and he lets us do that. Also, dont forget that his man land ability untaps the mountain, allowing you to use it for mana again.
When will you ever need mana on turn 4?
3- Buried Alive is weird. Sometimes I really like it, and sometimes I hate it. I absolutely cannot agree that a 1 card cantrip is just as effective as an actual discard outlet in providing discard, but I can agree that buried alive is iffy sometimes. Maybe a 2-2 split could work? I don't know, would require testing..
I think you should put in 2 gitaxian probe and the 2 extra cabal therapy, since the latter is more versatile than buried alive. If you find you don't have enough reanimation targets, you can add in another reanimation target in place of a therapy. Buried alive is just really slow.
I think you should put in 2 gitaxian probe and the 2 extra cabal therapy, since the latter is more versatile than buried alive. If you find you don't have enough reanimation targets, you can add in another reanimation target in place of a therapy. Buried alive is just really slow.
1-
Who knows. Its nice to have the option. being able to cast multiple spells in numbers that you otherwise could not can be the difference between a win and a loss.
2-
Buried Alive does not serve the role of a reanimation target per se though. It's a form of discard outlet that lets you find specific fatties. You don't want to replace a discard outlet with a cantrip or a spell that can be considered a sub-par discard outlet. It also allows you the comfort of not needing a fatty in your hand. :/
1-
Who knows. Its nice to have the option. being able to cast multiple spells in numbers that you otherwise could not can be the difference between a win and a loss.
2-
Buried Alive does not serve the role of a reanimation target per se though. It's a form of discard outlet that lets you find specific fatties. You don't want to replace a discard outlet with a cantrip or a spell that can be considered a sub-par discard outlet. It also allows you the comfort of not needing a fatty in your hand. :/
I really think 4-5 mana is enough for MRC. You have no 4-mana cards other than planeswalkers, and no 3-mana cards, and by turn 5 or so you'll start running out of cards in your hand. The only time I can see it being useful is with punishing fire, but even then you want to be trying to win the game, not kill your opponent's creatures.
About buried alive: I know, it's just really slow and I wanted to try to help you achieve the right balance without it. Maybe you can keep 1, but 4 3-mana cards is really too much when you want to try to win on turn 1. Also, therapy doubles as protection, so it isn't really that bad. (If you can achieve the right balance, there's almost no harm in putting gitaxian probe in because it basically lets you have a 56 card deck)
My Pauper Cube ♤ The Pauper Cube Thread Common Knowledge — 1 2
The 4 mana would not be too difficult to achieve with Enchantress, so that's actually a pretty good choice. I didn;t know the card existed. Thanks!
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You mention that the build you've posted is more suited to creature heavy metas, any recommendations for combo heavy metas? Everyone at my local shop either plays combo or RUG delver :/
Ummm. My recommendation for a combo heavy meta is not playing mono red control. At least, not this version of it. A Wildfire deck with 4 Chalice and 4 3sphere would be better. At least, as far as mono red controlish decks go.
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As an aside, Don't you think 4 buried alive is overkill? In a deck with 4 Entomb, 4 Imp and 2 therapies? were there any instances in playtesting when it has come up a dead draw? It has done so quite a lot for me..
I'm really loving the thought put into the red deck. I especially like the use of snow covered mountains + scrying sheets, and skred to hit for big numbers. It's interesting to see a different take on red, a colour that typically wants to win fast at any cost.
I don't think so, no. Like I said in the article the deck has no card sorting of any kind. You want to maximize your chances of getting creatures into the graveyard. It will almost never be a dead card in my opinion, simply because as the board state changes so too will your need for specific fatties.
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also, there is a really awesome UG enchantress build that uses Words of wind to lock the other guy out of permanents, It might even be cheaper than the version you listed!
The words of wind list might be cheaper, not sure. I like being able to just kill straight up with helm and RIP though.
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Except this deck also plays fast mana, and double draw 7 has a very real chance of getting another fatty into play.
gris kills in three swings, most other targets kill in 4 while he gains life and is thus impossible to race.
The only other options reanimator needs is 1xiona for combo and control, 1xelesh to gank swarm strats that grislbrand isnt good against, inkwell gets a slot because he dodges remvoal and karakas and then you get 2 more slots after 4x grilsbrand for a nice 9 reanimator targets.
play the deck as is, every time you reanimate something, ask yourself this: is this creature *really* better than grislbrand right now? most of the time, the answer will be no
2. chandra, pyromaster is much better than chandra, the firebrand in MRC.
3. Take out the buried alive in the monoblack reanimator deck and add in gitaxian probe. This will make your deck faster and just as consistent. (If you find there are not enough ways to get creatures in your graveyard, add in the extra cabal therapys.)
4. I agree with what other people are saying about the 4 griselbrand.
Otherwise, great decks!
Modern Patagia Viper Combo
pfiremc13 on the source
Inkfathom Biomage on Undisclosed Magic Software
I should stop making so many different names for myself.
1- I actually really like Koth. His mana ability is great and his other 2 are awesome finishers in what is otherwise a very slow deck. Sometimes you just need to win fast, and he lets us do that. Also, dont forget that his man land ability untaps the mountain, allowing you to use it for mana again.
2- I agree completely.
3- Buried Alive is weird. Sometimes I really like it, and sometimes I hate it. I absolutely cannot agree that a 1 card cantrip is just as effective as an actual discard outlet in providing discard, but I can agree that buried alive is iffy sometimes. Maybe a 2-2 split could work? I don't know, would require testing.
4- As far as griselbrand goes, I have already stated my opinion. By no means does that automatically make me right, and if multiple people are telling me I am wrong, maybe I need to rethink my stance. This, much like anything else, would require testing. I feel my logic is strong, but if so many people disagree then maybe I need to look into it more.
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When will you ever need mana on turn 4?
I think you should put in 2 gitaxian probe and the 2 extra cabal therapy, since the latter is more versatile than buried alive. If you find you don't have enough reanimation targets, you can add in another reanimation target in place of a therapy. Buried alive is just really slow.
Modern Patagia Viper Combo
pfiremc13 on the source
Inkfathom Biomage on Undisclosed Magic Software
I should stop making so many different names for myself.
1-
Who knows. Its nice to have the option. being able to cast multiple spells in numbers that you otherwise could not can be the difference between a win and a loss.
2-
Buried Alive does not serve the role of a reanimation target per se though. It's a form of discard outlet that lets you find specific fatties. You don't want to replace a discard outlet with a cantrip or a spell that can be considered a sub-par discard outlet. It also allows you the comfort of not needing a fatty in your hand. :/
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Getting Started in Legacy and Legacy Budget Primer 5!
Special thanks to Bornnover for the banner used in those articles.
I really think 4-5 mana is enough for MRC. You have no 4-mana cards other than planeswalkers, and no 3-mana cards, and by turn 5 or so you'll start running out of cards in your hand. The only time I can see it being useful is with punishing fire, but even then you want to be trying to win the game, not kill your opponent's creatures.
About buried alive: I know, it's just really slow and I wanted to try to help you achieve the right balance without it. Maybe you can keep 1, but 4 3-mana cards is really too much when you want to try to win on turn 1. Also, therapy doubles as protection, so it isn't really that bad. (If you can achieve the right balance, there's almost no harm in putting gitaxian probe in because it basically lets you have a 56 card deck)
Modern Patagia Viper Combo
pfiremc13 on the source
Inkfathom Biomage on Undisclosed Magic Software
I should stop making so many different names for myself.