I know it sucks but if this is the effect you want (and having just recently tried it myself out I definitely recommend it), you needVendilion Clique. That card is irreplaceable because it does exactly what you want as well as actively disrupting them, AND being an evasive beater to help close out games, AND being super value town when you get to return it with Cruel Ultimatum.
I would love to have V clique but hes just too expensive for me to be running right now but once I'm able to get the set I need, I'm definitely including them in my list. Just won't buy them
I swapped out 2 serum visions and put in Peek in its place. I'm all for serum vision but sometimes I sit there thinking to myself I wish it were an instant and this seems to be doing the job. It does what it needs to do early, mid and late game; it gives me an inside look at their hand and a simple draw. I may revert back if I start to miss the scrying, but if it goes unnoticed I'll keep peek until something else fits the slot.
If you want that sort of an effect Gitaxian Probe is pretty much just better. It's not instant speed, but being able to cycle it for 2 life is well worth it.
eh see i thought about that but I like the instant speed better. I wasn't liking the sorcery speed for that play. I'd rather see the new draws and etc that's happening on their turn or even EoT I just drop to see if anything is available to counter my cruel. But the filter on probe isn't worth it for us with our shocklands and searchlands all adding up aswell.
Have we forgotten about peek? I actually think this can be quite useful "peeking" into your opponents hand turn before dropping a cruel or any other win-con you have + draw. Thoughts?
I love V Clique but hes too expensive for me to include in my list right now, unless I can get them via trading but I'm running Spellheart Chimera in its place. Have to test him out but he seems worthy
Blightning is probably not what you want, I would just go with Rakdos return or consult the necro sages at that point. Discard just makes that end of Cuel pointless, the damage does not clear the board (decent vs walkers I guess) or help you draw cards or stack with other burn. If you are light on 3 s tribute to hunger is very helpful in this heck with not much life gain! Also a couple more hard counters would be good, dissipate and counter flux realy are fine. Cut those serum visions for lands son, aint no control deck workin with 24!
You're right that blightning is probably not my choice but I can't see myself running any of those other cards as well. I did however find myself wanting a little more removal, I suppose, so I cut an izzet charm and added one more geth's verdict. It suited me better against pesky indestructibles and I wish i had another one added in the games tonight because I could have really used it. As far as hard counters I did feel I need some more oomphff but condescend + dreadship reef is phenom if there comes a time you need to use the stack. However to say that a control deck aint workin with 24 is a bit pessimistic. I have enough scry and draw to stabilize my mana base and believe it or not, every game I played today I was actually flooded with mana.
All the testing I have done has made me hopeful of this build except for tonight because one of my best friends has come down and brought his Jund and/or Bant Aura deck which is the one deck back in the day I could never seem to stop so I'm nervous to see how he does today but other than that I'm sure it's going to be a good night.
Edit: I have been doing some tinkering and online I like to switch in blightning over electrolyze. I feel the extra hand disruption plus damage that comes from blightning will serve me more than electrolyze. It would bring them down quicker when it hits along side a geth's or any burn really. I know it's sorcery speed but really it would be the only 3CMC card in my deck because right now electrolyze is the only one in so i don't think that speed would be an issue for me however I would like to run 2 blightning if doable? I guess I'll have to see how tonight goes to see if I would want it over electrolyze
It's been a while since i've really messed with my Cruel Ultimatums and since i've completed my set of Scalding Tarns I felt like revisiting the drawing board here.
Now I really put a sub emphasis on creatures. They had to have one of two things to be included. Value when cast, and or the natural ability to hit the yard. The reason was two fold, but primarily because Cruel Ultimatum works amazingly well when it can get an "extra spell" from the graveyard. Secondly, I also like getting extra value out of my Rise // Fall. Fall early, and top decking Rise later makes the card very flexible, but Rise really needs to reliably have a target in you're yard less you find those awkward moments when you might have to consider giving an opponent a creature from the yard back just to reuse half of it.
The Creatures Snapcaster Mage really goes without saying. His ability to recast a spell from the yard is just unbeatable. Mulldrifter is a love of mine from days past and i've been using him along side the Shadowborn Demon in my esper deck to great results. Speaking of the Demon... he's awesome. Sometimes he does his thing, then wait's patiently to die forcing opponents to hold off on an attack. Other times, he comes down removes something then demands to be removed lest he win the game on his own. Now Spellstutter Sprite is just something i'm testing out. 1/1 flying flash isn't the worst thing int he world at 2cmc, but it's penchant for saying no to thing's like:
And those are without getting into the possibility of having one of the field when you cast it. That said these can be replaced with most any other valuable creature, i'm just testing them out. Now Augur of Bolas used to be one of my go to dudes, but even with just 4 snapcasters and 4 of him, I felt like he missed too often for me to run him. Add in more dudes to the mix and I just don't think it's worth it.
The Lands
I really wish we could get allied fetches in modern already. Polluted Deta's oh how I miss thee. Until then i'm forced to run a slightly more painful mana base to get thing's done. I do have a few more basic's that normal primarily because an earlier version ran Solemn Simulacrum as an all around value dude, but really the only part of the lands I want to talk about is the last two spots. I decided to throw down the two "faerie" man-lands simply because they COULD help out a spellstutter sprite as a suprise for an unwary opponent, or at least complicate their decision making process when trying to figure out if I can counter something or not. The question is, do I run the cheaper, comes into play UNtapped Mutavault or the produces U but comes into play tapped Faerie Conclave. If the faeries were to be dropped as a whole or at least supporting the 4 main deck, I would probably just run Tectonic Edge as a solid way to answer a Celestial Colonnade.
Thoughts? Opinions? Should I scrap it and go back to the drawing board? Should I play Cruel Faeries? Should I finally go to sleep?
Don't do Faeries. It's not going to work out. At most your countering CMC 6, and that's if you have them all. Only 4CMC if you have just the SS in. Perhaps Mana Leak or Rune Snag if you like the stacking power. And your man lands should be Creeping Tar Pit or Lavaclaw Reaches atleast. These are just some of the things I'd do to it.
Is the sideboard too narrow or one-dimensional, which match-ups would be out of my favor despite post-sideboard?
You run a creature heavy package it seems. I would cut the thundermaw and move it to sb and either an augur or snap. Also I would trade the 2 think twice for 2 thoughtflare. Your curve looks to be high too. Also 4 electrolyze seems like too much in my book.
Edit: I see in your sb you have an extra damnation so move out consume the meek and put in the other damnation that way you have a better chance at seeing it come up and a better removal package. Damnation will get rid of things that consume the meek won't/can't.
I tend to play daily against R/G Tron, as I've mentioned before, as the deck holder is my girlfriends brother so with my experience against him, game 1 is typically in his favor but recently I've been doing a better job at slowing him down if not actually winning g1.
For g2 I absolutely side in sowing salt and slaughter games as a start. Something like -1 Snapcaster Mage -1 Electrolyze -2 Volcanic Fallout[/CARD] for +2 Sowing Salt and +2 Slaughter games. Me personally, I tend to see my sowing salt more often than my slaughter games so I bait out any shunts and hit him with the salt ASAP. Once you land a sowing salt the game is pretty much in your favor. You've slowed them down and rendered their mana ability useless. Slaughter Games I call out Karn before Wurmcoil. It seems to work out for me but sometimes there's a last wurmcoil I forget to take care of and it haunts me and just destroys the field. Should i call the Wurm first or stick with Karn?
G3 is a toss up really. It could go either way depending on how you play your cards since they expect a sowing salt now and slaughter games. I don't tend to board anything in g3, although I pretend I do (I ruffle through my SB and MB a bunch and make them over think) but now I'll put in a pithing needle as an added threat to deal with Karn and just have my games call out other nonsense like wurmcoil now.
From the games I've played and remember, we have a good shot at taking them down g2 and g3. Especially with sowing salt alone.
Other than that the only other deck I remember playing is hatebears and he sweeped me 2-0. I managed to land a cruel when he had a wilt-leaf liege in hand and it completely turned the game around for him and messed me up.
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Cruel Control: UUBBBRR
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I would love to have V clique but hes just too expensive for me to be running right now but once I'm able to get the set I need, I'm definitely including them in my list. Just won't buy them
I swapped out 2 serum visions and put in Peek in its place. I'm all for serum vision but sometimes I sit there thinking to myself I wish it were an instant and this seems to be doing the job. It does what it needs to do early, mid and late game; it gives me an inside look at their hand and a simple draw. I may revert back if I start to miss the scrying, but if it goes unnoticed I'll keep peek until something else fits the slot.
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eh see i thought about that but I like the instant speed better. I wasn't liking the sorcery speed for that play. I'd rather see the new draws and etc that's happening on their turn or even EoT I just drop to see if anything is available to counter my cruel. But the filter on probe isn't worth it for us with our shocklands and searchlands all adding up aswell.
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You're right that blightning is probably not my choice but I can't see myself running any of those other cards as well. I did however find myself wanting a little more removal, I suppose, so I cut an izzet charm and added one more geth's verdict. It suited me better against pesky indestructibles and I wish i had another one added in the games tonight because I could have really used it. As far as hard counters I did feel I need some more oomphff but condescend + dreadship reef is phenom if there comes a time you need to use the stack. However to say that a control deck aint workin with 24 is a bit pessimistic. I have enough scry and draw to stabilize my mana base and believe it or not, every game I played today I was actually flooded with mana.
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2 Island
1 Watery grave
4 Scalding Tarn
1 Mountain
3 Creeping Tar Pit
2 Drowned Catacombs
2 Sulfur Falls
2 Steam Vents
1 Lavaclaw Reaches
2 Reflecting Pool
1 Blood Crypt
1 Dreadship Reef
1 Dragonskull Summit
1 Cascade Bluff
Creatures: 5
3 Snapcaster Mage
2 Augur of Bolas
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
3 Cryptic Command
3 Mana Leak
3 Izzet Charm
2 Condescend
2 Geth's Verdict
2 Thoughtflare
2 Damnation
2 Serums Visions
2 Cruel Ultimatum
1 Remand
1 Terminate
1 Electrolyze
1 Pithing Needle
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Consuming Vapors
2 Sowing salt
2 Slaughter games
2 Flash Freeze
2 Doom Blade
2 Rakdos Charm
2 Shadow of Doubt
All the testing I have done has made me hopeful of this build except for tonight because one of my best friends has come down and brought his Jund and/or Bant Aura deck which is the one deck back in the day I could never seem to stop so I'm nervous to see how he does today but other than that I'm sure it's going to be a good night.
Edit: I have been doing some tinkering and online I like to switch in blightning over electrolyze. I feel the extra hand disruption plus damage that comes from blightning will serve me more than electrolyze. It would bring them down quicker when it hits along side a geth's or any burn really. I know it's sorcery speed but really it would be the only 3CMC card in my deck because right now electrolyze is the only one in so i don't think that speed would be an issue for me however I would like to run 2 blightning if doable? I guess I'll have to see how tonight goes to see if I would want it over electrolyze
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I do understand but when I click the card link it wasn't listed as being modern legal. That's what threw me off
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Give it a shot. Let us know how he works out for you..
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Don't do Faeries. It's not going to work out. At most your countering CMC 6, and that's if you have them all. Only 4CMC if you have just the SS in. Perhaps Mana Leak or Rune Snag if you like the stacking power. And your man lands should be Creeping Tar Pit or Lavaclaw Reaches atleast. These are just some of the things I'd do to it.
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You run a creature heavy package it seems. I would cut the thundermaw and move it to sb and either an augur or snap. Also I would trade the 2 think twice for 2 thoughtflare. Your curve looks to be high too. Also 4 electrolyze seems like too much in my book.
Edit: I see in your sb you have an extra damnation so move out consume the meek and put in the other damnation that way you have a better chance at seeing it come up and a better removal package. Damnation will get rid of things that consume the meek won't/can't.
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How? Isn't IoK touching CMC of 3-? How could he have taken your Cryp if it's 4..
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For g2 I absolutely side in sowing salt and slaughter games as a start. Something like -1 Snapcaster Mage -1 Electrolyze -2 Volcanic Fallout[/CARD] for +2 Sowing Salt and +2 Slaughter games. Me personally, I tend to see my sowing salt more often than my slaughter games so I bait out any shunts and hit him with the salt ASAP. Once you land a sowing salt the game is pretty much in your favor. You've slowed them down and rendered their mana ability useless. Slaughter Games I call out Karn before Wurmcoil. It seems to work out for me but sometimes there's a last wurmcoil I forget to take care of and it haunts me and just destroys the field. Should i call the Wurm first or stick with Karn?
G3 is a toss up really. It could go either way depending on how you play your cards since they expect a sowing salt now and slaughter games. I don't tend to board anything in g3, although I pretend I do (I ruffle through my SB and MB a bunch and make them over think) but now I'll put in a pithing needle as an added threat to deal with Karn and just have my games call out other nonsense like wurmcoil now.
From the games I've played and remember, we have a good shot at taking them down g2 and g3. Especially with sowing salt alone.
Other than that the only other deck I remember playing is hatebears and he sweeped me 2-0. I managed to land a cruel when he had a wilt-leaf liege in hand and it completely turned the game around for him and messed me up.
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