MTG Salvation

Quote from philipneri

Why did Manuel Bucher name his 5 color control deck "Quick n Toast"?

"Quick n Toast" is the name of the restaurant where he built the deck or atleast the name of a deck that was built at a quick and toast somewhere in france

Quote from Rogon

Thanks for your list and your suggestion! I'll try 2 or 3 Creeping Tar Pit and 2 Lavaclaw Reaches. Lavaclaw is a nice mana-sink.

With respect to your deck, I did try Jace, Architect of Thought, but he usually just gives me one mini-fact or fiction and that's it. I also don't like to tap out. I think I would rather run Forbidden Alchemy instead.

Also, you run a lot less removal than I do. You have 8 dedicated removal (4 Bolts, 2 Geth's Verdict, 2 Electrolyze), while I run 13. In a creature heavy meta (Jund, in particular), I think that you need more. I really should fit in a second Damnation though.

you really should have 4 creeping tarpits in the deck just a few days ago i was able to beat jund with them resolving an unanswered bob and lili on turns 2 and 3 by beating them down with a tarpit followed with a few bolts

Jace is kinda trickier to play about 80% of the time i play him and +1 it protects him and can almost guarantee you untap with him with atleast 1 counter and once you untap with him using his -2 or just ticking him up to ult is fairly easy

you really should play 2 damnations its one of the best cards in the deck

also u use izzet charm as removal in most matchups and thats why the charms are so good they are decent removal but can also function as filtering in the mid to late game and as a counter spell early

the main reason i think tarpit is so good because it can vastly change your game plan by just racing ppl with unblockable attackers and burn because people often shock themselves a few times early or use a few fetches tarpit can be a 3-5 turn clock alone or with a few pieces of burn

Quote from Rogon

Thanks all! I put in 2 Slaughter Games in my side-board (-1 Vandalblast, -1 Psychic Spiral), and it definitely helped a lot. I also found that I need a little bit more than a single win condition, since you might be facing the same card yourself. I have tried Grave Titan, Inferno Titan, Nicol Bolas, Planeswalker and Consecrated Sphinx, but the one I am most happy with is Lone Revenant due to the hex-proof and the digging ability when it connects. (Since I am not running white, I can't run White Sun Zenith.) To make room for it in my main board I took out -2 Snapcaster Mage for +2 Lone Revenant. Additionally, I missed Mana Leak, so I took out -2 Remand for it, and I think I improved the deck somewhat.

My final thought is that I might try out Magmaquake. It's a sweeper for ground creatures and planes-walkers, and an instant so that you can tutor it with Teachings - in other words, great against the Superfriends type lists I've seen on MTGO. I'll let you know how that works out.

Oh, a final note. You can target your own spell with Remand! It might be old hat to you, but my Terminate got countered with Counterflux. I "countered" Counterflux by Remand-ing my Terminate, in order to cast Terminate a second time!

i just looked at your list again and you really need creeping tarpits in the deck you need 4 of them they are going to be the best way to close out games after a cruel ult

heres my list


Jace has been fantastic in alot of games and provides a decent draw engine along with a little protection from 1/Xs
also if u have any questions feel free to ask me

dont force your mana base to beat blood moon just know what decks its in and play around it with counter magic and discard

and anming stuff with slaughter games is very dependent not only on the matchup but the build and whats in thier hand so its kinda hard to give a comprehensive list

but heres a couple for the main 2 matchups it good in
Storm: most of the time you name grapeshot but if its game 3 and they lost to that in g1or2 then you may have to name empty the warrens instead but it depends on the list
twin: i like taking out deceiver exarch because killing perstermite is a joke but it kinda depends on thier hand and build again
other decks its highly dependent on what thier playing and the current board state

why play whipflare when you can play pyroclasm strictly better upgrade for this deck

ive moved back to grixis cruel from 5cc and wafo teachings ill post my list later but basically i took alot from the wafo teachings list i have 4 remands 4 electrolyze no artifacts and am playing with 3 jace aot who has been fantastic in many cases where ive drawn him and because ive cut all artifacts i had to cut thirst but because i added 8 cards that cantrip and jace you can still dig trough your deack real fast

so i have been working on my list again so ill put it back up





I moved to an all fetch shock style mana base because i hated lands that had to CitP tapped and also city of brass was always breaking my balls in the dmg sector the mana base is solid but prob could use some more work and also it really would like tarn instead of some of the other lands but i dont have them atm

also i cut one of the wishes from the deck because i just needed to make room for other cards like lingering souls which has been amazing for both stalling out against the aggressive match ups and putting some pressure down in control match ups

i also went down to one lantern because it was the worst top deck ever but some times you just need that type of effect

also on ppls wish boards STOP STOP STOP making 15 card wish boards you need to have non wish slots in your board because there are some match ups that your main will not be tuned to beat and you need answers

feel free to ask me anything about my list

read her ability it says "Spells and abilities your opponents control can't cause you to sacrifice permanents."

so anything that an opponent controls that would cause you to sac anything wont work

Edit: read PV's insight on Izzet charm and you'll see why its good http://www.channelfireball.com/articles/spoiler-spotlight-pv-on-the-charms/

I also am not sold on Deathrite Shaman the main reason being it turns on all of your opponents removal G1

Also i think lightning helix is still needed for the life gain in the more aggressive match ups



This is more like a list i would run i basically just altered Magicman657's list by cutting the cruel from the main one MB sweeper and the shamans for 3 helix and 2 esper charm also i altered the wish board to be more for my taste

also as for a replacement for Broodmate another choice is Sigarda, Host of Herons as she also dodges most removal even sac effects like Lilliana and annihilator from eldrazi

Supreme verdict is going to be an auto include in the wish board

abrupt decay should be a 2-3 of in the main with pulse staying in the side

counterflux would be good in the wish board but its not an auto include

some of the charms look good but there really isn't room for any of them

Vraska the Unseen will probably replace bolas in my wish board just because she only costs 5 mana and can take care of many of the things he can she basically only cant deal with lands

and chromatic lantern can replace relic if you want the ability to turn all your lands into reflecting pools but i already cut relic because tapping out early for it was always bad and late it wasnt needed

Well i finally decided to stop lurking and post my deck list



The mana base could use a bit of work but i was working on a bit of a budget when i put this together

a couple of things i realized when playing the deck was i never wanted to draw cruel before turn 8+ in the average game so i decided well just cut it from the main and only get it by wishing and so far it has worked out great

no more clunky 7 drops cluttering up your early draws and you can always wish for it later when you need it

also that esper charm is really needed as a 4 of in the main it just is so good if you are a head you can just make them discard on draw step to basically time walk them also it can get rid of problem enchantments like blood moon



The board may look strange so ill explain some of my stranger card choices:

I cut Broodmate Dragon because I never wanted to wish for it over cruel or nicol bolas

1 lightning helix because my mana base uses a few pain lands the extra removal and life gain is really good in some match ups
its also never really a bad card to side in just for more burn

1 Loxodon Hierarch i chose hierarch over finks because the 4/4 body is often more relevant than a 3/2 and a 2/1 and the extra mana almost never matters'

4 Leyline of Sanctity this card is insane
it can single-handedly win some match ups and turn some un-favorable match ups to at least even after board i would recommend all 5CC deck-lists have the 4 in the board

the 1 Grand Arbiter Augustin IV is currently my flex slot in the wish board

obviously this deck is going to go through some major changes once RtR comes out but until then this is what I'm going to run

Feel free to ask me any questions i would be glad to answer them

the problems w/ pillar is that one of the biggest draws to playing 5cc is that you play the best control cards in all colors and one of the biggest ones is Cryptic Command

And not being able to cast cryptic because you drew pilar instead of some other 4th land would be a huge problem

Also i don't think people should be playing with any more then 8-10 cards just for wish purposes in their sideboard

How Do you guys deal with R/G Tron

im having tons of trouble with it if they resolve karn i lose the game

BTW im playing the Wish version
with no mana leaks and just 4 cryptics as the only counters