I'm guessing you're battling pretty heavily against Jund? That is a lot of life lost MD that you are packing. Have you tested at all? Your MD life loss in my main issue with your deck, but if you can secure enough games against Affinity and Jund in testing, then I would run with it.
As for your SB, I would dump the extra Pulse, 2 Infest, 1 Nihil Spellbomb, and Seal. Pulse won't really help you instant speed kill, which is what I personally favor and you have MD Pridemage. If not another kill spell, then for something more for combo? Maybe another Gaddock, or an Ethersworn? The Seal is way too slow and it's targetable before you set it off. I'm not sure what you need it against in Modern anyway, since I've been away, but if it's against Splinter Twin I would instead put Krosan Grip here.
Infest just isn't worth it, when you can play Engineered Explosives. No life loss from Dark Confidant, and it's not conditional upon P/T, which many creatures in this format are resistant to because of built in pumps.
With Bojuka Bog being tutorable with KotR, you can drop the extra copy of Nihil Spellbomb. I would replace it with another copy of Krosan if you're worried about Splinter Twin.
Truthfully, this deck can't work in the fast meta. The landbase alone will kill you for the aggro decks, which pretty much is(Jund acts like it and you have Zoo and Affinity). I would shorten the amount of shocks, and do the fetch and shock land toolbox I had going. I would also do 2 urborg, tomb of yawgmoth so that you can make use of the fetches after you have all of your colors on the board and you don't ping yourself to death.
Your removal package needs to step up it's game in speed. I would dump the Oblivion Ring unless you're expecting protection from black and/or green, in which I would have another PtE or GFtT. GFtT if you have decks that want to ramp. Needing to kill something at the EoT is great, while sorcery speeds stops you from dropping your bomb. Also, Tarmogoyf is needed in this deck. Absolutely needed, because he will draw out the removal spells, or put in a nice early clock before you drop KotR who is your real finisher.
Also, find room for early mana production. I know that Earlier in this thread that acceleration isn't crucial, but it is. This deck has a couple of game changing 3 drops and Elspeth turn 3 is another heavy threat. I would do Noble Hierarch at 4. The exalted doesn't make her useless later in the game. Let's face it anyway, if you aren't winning by then, you probably never were going to. Playing threats turn 2 makes this deck competitive, and there are no real threats with 2CMC other than Tarmogoyf.
I don't know what your meta looks like, so I can't suggest what to take out for my suggestions. If you could tell me, I will.
It isn't just Zoo, but Affinity and decks that keep the pressure on with solid beatstick swarms (knights). This deck really functions on destroying your opponents board and hand, then dropping your "rock" and beating face with it. Hand disruption and high amount of kill spells protect your rock. With all of those slots being taken up by spells and using your mana wisely by keeping your opponent off the board slows your creature landings, therefore any deck that focuses heavily in putting down creatures is going to be a problem.
I've found that out the hard way through gameplay( ) and lurking threads.
I think I'll proxy it and find out how I like Canopy. I think with my build, I may transfer Bob to my side. I really like the CA he gives me, but the pain he gives is just too much. Also, this deck has a problem with aggro. You will need to look into some kind of board wipe. I'm invested in Damnation. My list above is a little outdated. My sig keeps the most current.
After the bannings I dropped my Jund list and made a Junk list straight-away. I haven't played any games with it, so it is untested, but I like Liliana in the deck simply because all your cards are threats that are simply bigger than your opponents. Liliana lets you get to topdeck mode against your opponent which is where you have the advantage.
I know you said you haven't tested, but have you played with Horizon Canopy at all yet? I'm thinking about eliminating Oran-Rief and maybe another card(ghost quarter) for 2 of them.
I was thinking of adding Lily to keep opponents in top deck mode. Are Bobs enough to keep your side of the table off of top deck mode? Do you have a sideboard?
The deck never seems to be very consistent to me, and Sculler is just a poop card with PK fire and Bolt in the format, so I'm going to abandon that guy altogether. I think Thoughtseize or Duress may do it better. I believe I'm going to ditch Glittering Wish and put in 2 Doran and see how that goes. The synergy he has with Skinshifter is amazing. With that change, I'm going to have to adjust my SB a lot to accommodate the dropping of Wish.
I may keep the Bosk, but I might try the enemy check lands. I'm not going to bother with removing Bob. Arena would be the best, but it starts a full turn later and that's where I'd like to drop KotR or Finks.
I never got to battle Jund, but Eldrazi Green, a casual Essence of the Wild, and a Percy Legacy deck. Eldrazi Green stomped my face in. I beat everything else. It's a slow start up and I can definitely see a need for a board wipe, something better that Crime//Punishment.
So, a bit of play and I've noticed I'm really killing myself with so many fetches, shocks, and Bobs. The mana base is really greedy, and I think 1 of each shock will be optimal. I will definitely be eliminating Arena and Treetop Village and turning them into 2 more Ghost Quarter. I find that KotR is kill on sight and I never get to benefit from her ability, so maybe a bit of land destruction will help me more than not. Murmuring Bosk will be eliminated as well, and I think I will replace it with another Vastwood or a Golgar Rot Farm, which would be another way to pump KotR or mana ramp.
As for Bob, I'm not sure what I could use, but I really want some sort of 1 drop, but the CA from Bob is awesome, but he brings so much pain to the table. Any thoughts from anyone?
I think the main reason people aren't running Dismember is we're already losing so much life to Bob, at least that's been my testing. How has Profane Command been treating you? I've been unimpressed with it in my casual Wish build, and I prefer Primal Command. I'm similarly underwhelmed with Skinshifter, but he's probably the best budget replacement for Goyf. Might not be a bad idea to up your Doran count to make him better. Maybe swap one for one?
I wish I could say I've been playing the deck, but I haven't yet. What I mean by Skinshifter being underwhelming is that I've seen him played and I wasn't very happy with his performance, but maybe he'll be different here, who knows. I switched out Gaddock for Glissa. I play on kitchen tables mostly and Gaddock won't really be helping me much there. The only thing I don't like about Primal Command is that its CMC is 5, which is very painful with Bob.
How is this deck against Jund?
*Edit*
I have played with Profane before and I was somewhat disappointed with it's performance before. I played it in a casual MBI build and it was disappointing because life loss was irrelevant and the -X/-X was nearly impossible to kill off creatures with in the 24 lands I played. The points where it was strong was Fear and reanimation. With Profane, we're essentially running more creatures. The only problem being that they cost an additional BB, which might be back breaking in 24 lands. Only testing will put my mind at ease. What happened with you?
The Glittering Wish deck is probably what I will pick up. Question for you gents is why Tec Edge over Ghost Quarters? I will have to budget out Tarm, but is skin shifter a good replacement for him without Doran? Why are no lists running Dismember? as a singleton of course, or is the split second -4/-4 strictly better?
Also, thank you for the white force spike. Quite hilarious and I will like 4 as a collection card.
I'm one short in the MD. Any suggestions? This is going to be kitchen table played and decks I will need to beat is Eldrazi Green, Jund, red aggro, and U/B Control, maybe an occasional tournament, but those decks are what I want it geared toward beating.
Found it, but I'm not really happy with Skinshifter. Any other beaters?
I'm guessing you're battling pretty heavily against Jund? That is a lot of life lost MD that you are packing. Have you tested at all? Your MD life loss in my main issue with your deck, but if you can secure enough games against Affinity and Jund in testing, then I would run with it.
As for your SB, I would dump the extra Pulse, 2 Infest, 1 Nihil Spellbomb, and Seal. Pulse won't really help you instant speed kill, which is what I personally favor and you have MD Pridemage. If not another kill spell, then for something more for combo? Maybe another Gaddock, or an Ethersworn? The Seal is way too slow and it's targetable before you set it off. I'm not sure what you need it against in Modern anyway, since I've been away, but if it's against Splinter Twin I would instead put Krosan Grip here.
Infest just isn't worth it, when you can play Engineered Explosives. No life loss from Dark Confidant, and it's not conditional upon P/T, which many creatures in this format are resistant to because of built in pumps.
With Bojuka Bog being tutorable with KotR, you can drop the extra copy of Nihil Spellbomb. I would replace it with another copy of Krosan if you're worried about Splinter Twin.
My $.02.
@ Malacoda, any testing before the PTQ?
Your removal package needs to step up it's game in speed. I would dump the Oblivion Ring unless you're expecting protection from black and/or green, in which I would have another PtE or GFtT. GFtT if you have decks that want to ramp. Needing to kill something at the EoT is great, while sorcery speeds stops you from dropping your bomb. Also, Tarmogoyf is needed in this deck. Absolutely needed, because he will draw out the removal spells, or put in a nice early clock before you drop KotR who is your real finisher.
Also, find room for early mana production. I know that Earlier in this thread that acceleration isn't crucial, but it is. This deck has a couple of game changing 3 drops and Elspeth turn 3 is another heavy threat. I would do Noble Hierarch at 4. The exalted doesn't make her useless later in the game. Let's face it anyway, if you aren't winning by then, you probably never were going to. Playing threats turn 2 makes this deck competitive, and there are no real threats with 2CMC other than Tarmogoyf.
I don't know what your meta looks like, so I can't suggest what to take out for my suggestions. If you could tell me, I will.
I've found that out the hard way through gameplay(
I know you said you haven't tested, but have you played with Horizon Canopy at all yet? I'm thinking about eliminating Oran-Rief and maybe another card(ghost quarter) for 2 of them.
I was thinking of adding Lily to keep opponents in top deck mode. Are Bobs enough to keep your side of the table off of top deck mode? Do you have a sideboard?
4 Dark Confidant
4 Skinshifter
3 Tidehallow Sculler
4 Knight of the Reliquary
3 Kitchen Finks
Tech-18
3 Path to Exile
4 Inquisition of kozilek
2 Profane Command
4 Glittering Wish
3 go for the throat
2 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
4 Verdant Catacomb
4 Marsh Flats
1 Overgrown Tomb
1 Godless Shrine
1 temple garden
1 Oran-reif, the vastwood
1 Treetop Village
1 Murmuring Bosk
3 Swamp
3 Plains
3 Forest
1 Ghost Quarter
3 kataki, war's wage
1 Crime // Punishment
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Doran, the Siege Tower
1 Kitchen Finks
1 Knight of the Reliquary
1 Maelstrom Pulse
1 Loxodon Hierarch
1 Glissa, the traitor
1 Bojuka Bog
3 Spellskite
The deck never seems to be very consistent to me, and Sculler is just a poop card with PK fire and Bolt in the format, so I'm going to abandon that guy altogether. I think Thoughtseize or Duress may do it better. I believe I'm going to ditch Glittering Wish and put in 2 Doran and see how that goes. The synergy he has with Skinshifter is amazing. With that change, I'm going to have to adjust my SB a lot to accommodate the dropping of Wish.
3 Treefolk Harbringer
4 Dark Confidant
3 Skinshifter
4 Knight of the Reliquary
3 Kitchen Finks
2 Doran, the Siege Tower
Tech-17
4 Path to Exile
4 Inquisition of kozilek
2 Duress
2 Profane Command
1 go for the throat
2 Maelstrom Pulse
2 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
4 Verdant Catacomb
4 Marsh Flats
1 Overgrown Tomb
1 Godless Shrine
1 temple garden
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Oran-reif, the vastwood
1 Treetop Village
1 Murmuring Bosk
3 Swamp
3 Plains
2 Forest
1 Ghost Quarter
3 kataki, war's wage
3 Qasali Pridemage
3 day of judgment
3 Pithing Needle
3 Ethersworn Canonist
Any thoughts? Any body?
I never got to battle Jund, but Eldrazi Green, a casual Essence of the Wild, and a Percy Legacy deck. Eldrazi Green stomped my face in. I beat everything else. It's a slow start up and I can definitely see a need for a board wipe, something better that Crime//Punishment.
As for Bob, I'm not sure what I could use, but I really want some sort of 1 drop, but the CA from Bob is awesome, but he brings so much pain to the table. Any thoughts from anyone?
I wish I could say I've been playing the deck, but I haven't yet. What I mean by Skinshifter being underwhelming is that I've seen him played and I wasn't very happy with his performance, but maybe he'll be different here, who knows. I switched out Gaddock for Glissa. I play on kitchen tables mostly and Gaddock won't really be helping me much there. The only thing I don't like about Primal Command is that its CMC is 5, which is very painful with Bob.
How is this deck against Jund?
*Edit*
I have played with Profane before and I was somewhat disappointed with it's performance before. I played it in a casual MBI build and it was disappointing because life loss was irrelevant and the -X/-X was nearly impossible to kill off creatures with in the 24 lands I played. The points where it was strong was Fear and reanimation. With Profane, we're essentially running more creatures. The only problem being that they cost an additional BB, which might be back breaking in 24 lands. Only testing will put my mind at ease. What happened with you?
The Glittering Wish deck is probably what I will pick up. Question for you gents is why Tec Edge over Ghost Quarters? I will have to budget out Tarm, but is skin shifter a good replacement for him without Doran? Why are no lists running Dismember? as a singleton of course, or is the split second -4/-4 strictly better?
Also, thank you for the white force spike. Quite hilarious and I will like 4 as a collection card.
What I'm thinking of running.
4 Dark Confidant
4 Skinshifter
3 Tidehallow Sculler
3 Knight of the Reliquary
3 Kitchen Finks
1 Doran, the Siege Tower
Tech-18
3 Path to Exile
4 Inquisition of kozilek
2 Profane Command
4 Glittering Wish
1 Smother
2 go for the throat
2 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
4 Verdant Catacomb
4 Marsh Flats
2 Overgrown Tomb
2 Godless Shrine
2 temple garden
1 Arena
1 Oran-reif, the vastwood
1 Treetop Village
1 Murmuring Bosk
2 Swamp
2 Plains
1 Forest
1 Ghost Quarter
3 kataki, war's wage
1 Crime // Punishment
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Doran, the Siege Tower
1 Kitchen Finks
1 Knight of the Reliquary
1 Maelstrom Pulse
1 Loxodon Hierarch
1 Glissa, the traitor
1 Bojuka Bog
3 Spellskite
I'm one short in the MD. Any suggestions? This is going to be kitchen table played and decks I will need to beat is Eldrazi Green, Jund, red aggro, and U/B Control, maybe an occasional tournament, but those decks are what I want it geared toward beating.Found it, but I'm not really happy with Skinshifter. Any other beaters?