There are a lot of players who use this line as an excuse not to acquire the best cards. Not saying you are, and I am all for creativity in deckbuilding, but there are very few decks that don't want a Top.
And if you run so few shuffle effects, why is Sylvan Library any good in the first place?
Because it can 1) let you draw 2 extra cards for 8 life, 2) let you get two free "instead of drawing a card effects" per turn.
Notably, Green has a four mana enchantment whos name excapes me right now that lets you say "instead of drawing I'm going to put the next land or non-land card in my deck into my hand" Work wonders with library.
Some of us want a good product that we can actually play with. I have all the cards I need so with these I am looking for a well designed and well balanced set of decks. The financial value isn't the only value of these.
I'm somewhat indifferent on the financial value as well. I'm going to buy one of each and my wife and I are going to canabalize the crap out of them because we always end up doing that. Assuming the *new* cards are worth playing.
Because really, thats what I want -- the new cards. I could care less how strong they are for legacy, but I'm REALLY hoping that each of the decks includes *new* cards that scale up with the number of players.
If you run blue/black for example you need the U/B fetch, right? What if your opponent plays turn 1 blood moon and you need a basic island and you have the B/W fetch? You lose? And this is just an example of many.
if they run a turn 1 blood moon it doesn't matter what color fetch you have... your fetch is a mountain.
This is debatable. What you define as an EDH staple may be different from what I define and EDH staple as. Staples are competitive based requirements for decks. Jace is a constructed staple, not a casual staple. The Average staple card for EDH is 10 dollars, cards like Sol Ring, Solemn *although not 10 bucks just really hard to find sometimes*, fetch lands, shock lands, cryptic command, demonic tutor, vampiric tutor, enlightened tutor, gamble, wasteland, gilded lotus, primeval titan, both Akroma's, akroma's memorial, sorin, tezzeret, liliana, these are all staples, these are all expensive to an extent and can easily be valued close to or significantly over 10 dollars. I cannot see them printing 5-10 ten dollar cards in these sets.
What I do not define as an EDH staple are karoo lands or signets, or your niche card that really only fits your deck, or just a card you think is good. Those are not staples. Staples are renowned cards that you will play with if you want to play EDH competitively. And the list just gets higher as you get more competitive such as cards like Xiahou Dun, Mana Crypt, Mana Drain, Force of Will, Gaea's Cradle, etc etc. Again, those are staple card pieces. Those are not being reprinted in this set.
I can't even see them printing Gilded Lotus for this set.
I plan on buying these for the legends and new cards which are worth 30 bucks to me. I whole heartedly can believe I will be pretty much chucking 95% of it out the window.
right, but why not?
All the other summer of multiplayer sets and duel decks (most recent failure being the exception)have had at least one deck with multiple casual staples (following your definition of staple), why would this one be the exception?
Akroma : reprinted in divine vs demonic
Demonic tutor: reprinted in divine vs demonic
Duplicant: reprinted in arch enemy
swords: reprinted in EvsT
etc.
etc.
With the exception of the recent duel deck, all of their products like this have included one or two casual staples.
I just don't get why in the world you think they are suddenly going to reverse that and put only garbage in this set...
I have a source who says that none of the edh commander precons contain any adh staples and thats its basically jank of whatever color the deckis with little synergy existing.
If you don't mind my asking: what sort of source is this? Its not that I don't believe you... well actually it is pretty much that, but still. You don't need to name names, or where they work or anything -- but how was your source able to see the decklists already?
And how would these decks being filled with jank coincide at all with the past two summer of multi player sets where at least a portion of the decks included major multi player staples? Nobody is realisitcally expecting every deck to be PACKED full of EDH staples, but expecting 5 to 10 in each deck is entirely reasonable.
Well, judging from the new cards we have seen, they are pushing the 'fun/big effects' angle.
These aren't going to cater to cutthroat edh players.
While I agree, one of the requirements of the "fun big effects" deal is being able to pay for those same fun big effects.
Some form of aggresive mana acceleration is going to be present in each of the decks. Whether its limited to preexisting stuff or not is a good question.
I'd like to see something like 2[tap]:add one colorless mana to your mana pool for each opponent, you cannot generate more than 3 mana this way.
Not broken at all in single player (darn near useless really), but really scales up depending on the number of players in the game. A card like that would be great for the pushing big hilarious effects theme, while at the same time wouldn't see any play outside of casual multiplayer.
I had a blast at the Planechase one. Archenemy had some big event going on that weekend so we had to do two groups of three. I got two promos becuase of the low turnout. I think Commander will be pretty full. Very much looking forward to it.
yea, I thikn archenemy is a huge dud as far as their multiplayer designs. It seems almost liek an attempt at raid decks from WoW TCG, but has no flavor or cohesiveness to the set.
planechase is fun on ocasion, we play it with edh about once every other month or so.
I understand that some people hate foils, (even some EDH players) so I suppose it's good to have a foil and non-foil version.
I wonder what they will do for the launch party promo, an oversized foil of another existing legend? Alt art normal foils of the new guys? Another new legend?
I also expect them to support the set throughout the year like they did with Planechase and Archenemy. So I guess my question extends to that as well.
Have they had launch parties for these products in the past? I wasn't aware of it if they had... seems like this woudl be fun.
My guess for the text of the URG general, XXku of Two Reflections:
XXku of Two Reflections :2mana::symu::symr::symg:
Legendary Creature - Human Wizard
Whenever you cast an instant or sorcery, copy that spell. You may choose a new targets for the copy.
Whenever a nontoken creature enters the battlefield under your control, put a token that's copy of it.
3/3
I wouldn't be surprised.
that woudl be disgustingly powerful, and enable some very nice infinite combos. It would also prohibit you from playing legendary creatures...
I would never rule anything out until it's spoiled, but top would just drag the game times into the ground. 4 people waiting for the guy to top multiple times every turn set would get obnoxious!
I don't know about you, but its never actually slowed down a casual game I've played in, unless the person doing it was just trying to be a dick... and that person can slow down the game with any non-sorcery speed effect.
Just out of curiosity, how much is the box of all of these likely to cost? Would one even be able to get that? it wouldnt be <100 would it?....would it?
I really am still blown away that anyone could still think there would be anything like Top and Shocklands in this.
I'm confused. Shocklands, sure very unlikely. But top? Why *wouldn't* a staple utility uncommon make its way into at least one of the boxes? Sure they aren't trying to fix the legacy availability issue with these, but that doesn't mean they WON'T include cards that are staples just because they are hard to get.
Did anyone notice that the U/R legend wasn't on the front of any of the decks? I'm just curious where they put it if there are only 10 new legends...
Unless they changed that guy to the "guru of two reflections" because the BUG deck seems to have the new G/U legend.
I dunno I'm just like where did it go?
The U/R legend is just "one of the new cards" within one of the decks. He can't be one of the new generals because all the decks are wedges (three colors). Since its not a general it doesn't make sense for it to be showcased on the front of the pacakging.
It says each deck has fifteen new cards, and we know that there are about 50 new cards total, right? It said that somewhere (maybe in the announcement). We can then make some estimations about how much overlap of new cards there is between decks...
there is:
51 cards total.
2 new generals for each deck that cannot possibly be shared (10 cards)
leaving 41 cards.
Each enemy colored pair (5) each also has a new legendary creature. Its probably safe to assume these also will not be shared between the decks (and will likely be "rare")
that leaves 36 cards. The prevailing speculation from before (and it makes sense) is that at least one of these will be a universal fixer land and/or colorless mana accel and will be shared across all 5 decks. That puts us down to 35 cards left.
35/5 = 7 of that, my guess is that there will be 2 overlapping cards on each "side" of the wedge, so 2 of your cards overlap with one deck and 2 overlap with another. that would give each deck 6 unique cards and 5 overlapping cards.
That seems to be the most reasonable breakdown to me. (Edit: I double counted cards -- each deck would actually have 13 new cards in it rather than 11 with sharing 2 cards to each side) where would the other 2 cards be...
Because it can 1) let you draw 2 extra cards for 8 life, 2) let you get two free "instead of drawing a card effects" per turn.
Notably, Green has a four mana enchantment whos name excapes me right now that lets you say "instead of drawing I'm going to put the next land or non-land card in my deck into my hand" Work wonders with library.
somewhat regularly against the deck designed to do it (theres 8 blood moons in the deck) almost never from any other deck.
I'm somewhat indifferent on the financial value as well. I'm going to buy one of each and my wife and I are going to canabalize the crap out of them because we always end up doing that. Assuming the *new* cards are worth playing.
Because really, thats what I want -- the new cards. I could care less how strong they are for legacy, but I'm REALLY hoping that each of the decks includes *new* cards that scale up with the number of players.
if they run a turn 1 blood moon it doesn't matter what color fetch you have... your fetch is a mountain.
right, but why not?
All the other summer of multiplayer sets and duel decks (most recent failure being the exception)have had at least one deck with multiple casual staples (following your definition of staple), why would this one be the exception?
Akroma : reprinted in divine vs demonic
Demonic tutor: reprinted in divine vs demonic
Duplicant: reprinted in arch enemy
swords: reprinted in EvsT
etc.
etc.
With the exception of the recent duel deck, all of their products like this have included one or two casual staples.
I just don't get why in the world you think they are suddenly going to reverse that and put only garbage in this set...
If you don't mind my asking: what sort of source is this? Its not that I don't believe you... well actually it is pretty much that, but still. You don't need to name names, or where they work or anything -- but how was your source able to see the decklists already?
And how would these decks being filled with jank coincide at all with the past two summer of multi player sets where at least a portion of the decks included major multi player staples? Nobody is realisitcally expecting every deck to be PACKED full of EDH staples, but expecting 5 to 10 in each deck is entirely reasonable.
While I agree, one of the requirements of the "fun big effects" deal is being able to pay for those same fun big effects.
Some form of aggresive mana acceleration is going to be present in each of the decks. Whether its limited to preexisting stuff or not is a good question.
I'd like to see something like 2[tap]:add one colorless mana to your mana pool for each opponent, you cannot generate more than 3 mana this way.
Not broken at all in single player (darn near useless really), but really scales up depending on the number of players in the game. A card like that would be great for the pushing big hilarious effects theme, while at the same time wouldn't see any play outside of casual multiplayer.
yea, I thikn archenemy is a huge dud as far as their multiplayer designs. It seems almost liek an attempt at raid decks from WoW TCG, but has no flavor or cohesiveness to the set.
planechase is fun on ocasion, we play it with edh about once every other month or so.
Have they had launch parties for these products in the past? I wasn't aware of it if they had... seems like this woudl be fun.
I swear, it seems like nobody actaully reads the whole announcement. How many times have you had to address this point?
that woudl be disgustingly powerful, and enable some very nice infinite combos. It would also prohibit you from playing legendary creatures...
I don't know about you, but its never actually slowed down a casual game I've played in, unless the person doing it was just trying to be a dick... and that person can slow down the game with any non-sorcery speed effect.
$30.00 each X 5 = what....
I'm confused. Shocklands, sure very unlikely. But top? Why *wouldn't* a staple utility uncommon make its way into at least one of the boxes? Sure they aren't trying to fix the legacy availability issue with these, but that doesn't mean they WON'T include cards that are staples just because they are hard to get.
The U/R legend is just "one of the new cards" within one of the decks. He can't be one of the new generals because all the decks are wedges (three colors). Since its not a general it doesn't make sense for it to be showcased on the front of the pacakging.
there is:
51 cards total.
2 new generals for each deck that cannot possibly be shared (10 cards)
leaving 41 cards.
Each enemy colored pair (5) each also has a new legendary creature. Its probably safe to assume these also will not be shared between the decks (and will likely be "rare")
that leaves 36 cards. The prevailing speculation from before (and it makes sense) is that at least one of these will be a universal fixer land and/or colorless mana accel and will be shared across all 5 decks. That puts us down to 35 cards left.
35/5 = 7 of that, my guess is that there will be 2 overlapping cards on each "side" of the wedge, so 2 of your cards overlap with one deck and 2 overlap with another. that would give each deck 6 unique cards and 5 overlapping cards.
That seems to be the most reasonable breakdown to me. (Edit: I double counted cards -- each deck would actually have 13 new cards in it rather than 11 with sharing 2 cards to each side) where would the other 2 cards be...