I feel there's 2 potential decks here that can be based off the Chief Engineer/Grand Architect dream. There's the "Big Blue" deck, which we've been obviously exploring; and then the Genesis Chamber/[insert value combo] deck, which isn't getting much vocal thought. I personally would love to see both avenues explored even if just to test the theory. I'm just wondering how a Chief Engineer/Grand Architect engine deck that's running Genesis Chamber or Disciple/Time Sieve compares to Norin the Wary type decks. What's the end game? What are the pieces to the puzzle outside the 2-card engine?
I think you don't get this concept until you try it out playing some games.
I'm not sure that line was necessary, or considerate. It ain't my first time around the brewer's block.
If you wanna try to tune a new brew to beat Twin, Affinity, and Scapeshift then go for it. I don't think it wins against those decks. Maybe I'm just lucky because no one at my LGS plays Twin, Storm, or Scapeshift so I don't have to worry about a 3 turn clock starting on Turn 0.
Have you got a decklist drawn out? I'd be interested to compare it to the other lists I've seen conjured up.:)
- Similarly counterspells and Thirst are wrong as well. You don't stay mana open, you dump your creatures on the board to produce as much fast mana as possible. Since you still want to have a chance of winning against combo decks (Twin, Scapeshift and the likes), your disruption must come from creatures as well. That's why four Spellskites are nearly mandatory to be competitive. If you are willing to do serious work on the paper version of this deck, prepare to shell a lot of bucks for them 'Skites. They are artifacts, they get played for free off a turn 1 blue dork plus turn 2 Chief Engineer, your manabase is almost entirely monoblue. You don't get anything better. He can also attack for damage when pumped by Architect(s)
You seem quite sure on this. Where would you make room for a full playset of Spellskites? If your opening hand has 3 Skites and you draw your fourth how do you win? What if you're on turn 5 have 2 cards left in hand, would you rather draw a Spellskite or a thirst for knowledge? The card is good, don't get me wrong, but you're talking in absolutes ("have to play" "these are wrong") which is not healthy for brewing ideas of a completely new deck. Test it out in proxy, like I'm going to Maybe there's room for 2x Spellskites to help curveball the opponent, but I'm not sure a full playset is correct in the main deck.
On another note, could you further elaborate the importance of Platinum Angel? A 6/6 lifelinker in the form of Wurmcoil Engine (which is still a threat when dead) is pretty backbreaking for most decks. U-Tron decks need the Angel because they are long game decks, this isn't really a Mini U-Tron deck.
What are peoples thoughts on the complete lack of removal in this deck? Zoo at least have Bolts & Helixes, Merfolk has Vapor Snag, this deck has such a large engine requirement I don't see main deck space for removal. Repeal? Pongify? That new mass-Turn-To-Frog card in M15? Are these relegated to sideboard options?
I've updated my list at home to include the Judge's Familiar instead of Vedalken Certarch. Still wish there was a better 1 drop creature for slots 5-7.
Back during Scars-Innistrad standard a friend of mine had a Grand Architect "mill" deck which ran the proverbial T3 Grand Architect into Wurmcoil Engine plus Trepanation Blade + SoB&M for extra hurt (Invisible Stalker is still broken btw).
I think keeping it rather conservative is the way to go. I really want to go T2 Chief Engineer into Myr Superion but it's just not good enough for Modern... but this might be:
Vedalken Certarch is on-theme, but maybe something as lowly as Kraken Hatchling is all the deck needs to slow down the boardstate. I like the Light & Shadow here as it recurs Grand Architect or Chief Engineer for the long game and weenie beat down is always an option. Don't need the full 8x Fetches for just Sage of Epityr, but might go to 8x if I want to splash White or Black for sideboard tech. It's possible Phyrexian Metamorph deserves a slot or two, but I think more fat and more card draw (Thirst) comes before that.
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Thoughts?
I'm not sure that line was necessary, or considerate. It ain't my first time around the brewer's block.
If you wanna try to tune a new brew to beat Twin, Affinity, and Scapeshift then go for it. I don't think it wins against those decks. Maybe I'm just lucky because no one at my LGS plays Twin, Storm, or Scapeshift so I don't have to worry about a 3 turn clock starting on Turn 0.
Have you got a decklist drawn out? I'd be interested to compare it to the other lists I've seen conjured up.:)
You seem quite sure on this. Where would you make room for a full playset of Spellskites? If your opening hand has 3 Skites and you draw your fourth how do you win? What if you're on turn 5 have 2 cards left in hand, would you rather draw a Spellskite or a thirst for knowledge? The card is good, don't get me wrong, but you're talking in absolutes ("have to play" "these are wrong") which is not healthy for brewing ideas of a completely new deck. Test it out in proxy, like I'm going to
On another note, could you further elaborate the importance of Platinum Angel? A 6/6 lifelinker in the form of Wurmcoil Engine (which is still a threat when dead) is pretty backbreaking for most decks. U-Tron decks need the Angel because they are long game decks, this isn't really a Mini U-Tron deck.
What are peoples thoughts on the complete lack of removal in this deck? Zoo at least have Bolts & Helixes, Merfolk has Vapor Snag, this deck has such a large engine requirement I don't see main deck space for removal. Repeal? Pongify? That new mass-Turn-To-Frog card in M15? Are these relegated to sideboard options?
I've updated my list at home to include the Judge's Familiar instead of Vedalken Certarch. Still wish there was a better 1 drop creature for slots 5-7.
I think keeping it rather conservative is the way to go. I really want to go T2 Chief Engineer into Myr Superion but it's just not good enough for Modern... but this might be:
2 Academy Ruins
15 Island
3 Misty Rainforest
3 Scalding Tarn
Creatures
4 Chief Engineer
4 Etherium Sculptor
4 Grand Architect
3 Myr Battlesphere
4 Sage of Epityr
3 Treasure Mage
3 Vedalken Certarch
3 Wurmcoil Engine
1 Mindslaver
4 Serum Visions
1 Sword of Light and Shadow
3 Thirst for Knowledge
Vedalken Certarch is on-theme, but maybe something as lowly as Kraken Hatchling is all the deck needs to slow down the boardstate. I like the Light & Shadow here as it recurs Grand Architect or Chief Engineer for the long game and weenie beat down is always an option. Don't need the full 8x Fetches for just Sage of Epityr, but might go to 8x if I want to splash White or Black for sideboard tech. It's possible Phyrexian Metamorph deserves a slot or two, but I think more fat and more card draw (Thirst) comes before that.