My YouTube Channel: The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
Goblin Recruiter is broken in my deck. Almost all of my creatures are goblins - and not just goblins, but goblins that create goblins when entering the battlefield. Unless I already have Goblin Recruiter in my hand, Goblin Matron 100% tutors for Goblin Recruiter. Having all your goblins on the top of your deck means that you're not drawing into lands to slow you down. I also top deck Goblin Ringleader when I look for all my goblins. That way with even a single cantrip, I draw into Goblin Ringleader which then lets me draw into 4 more goblins. I very rarely lose a game after resolving Goblin Recruiter.
My YouTube Channel: The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
Those are definitely some interesting ideas. I'm not adding the fast mana rocks because they are so expensive price wise, but I just had them in the list so I don't forget. My goal of making it more consistent was not to make it unbeatable. Obviously it still pretty much folds to a board wipe. I'm just trying to smooth draws and add some more answers so it's not helpless.
I was mainly hoping to get some advice on what cards you think I could cut to make room for the new ones. I listed some cards that sometime seem slow but other times are all stars so I'm really not sure.
You don't need to worry so much about fast mana rocks. I run a list that's a bit expensive but only because I already owned the cards. But the key shell for Zada and all support cards could be acquired for less than $50. Here's the link, if you're interested. You'd have to add the cost of Zada (in the sideboard) and subtract the cost of the mountains. Doing so gives a grand total of $49.98. And it's a deck that can easily win turn 4 or 5. Hope it helps!
My YouTube Channel: The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
What would you guys run between Fury Charm or Goblin Cratermaker? Charm is good because it can destroy or pump, while cratermaker is a body that also can destroy if needed. Upside of cratermaker is that it can also be tutored by goblin matron/recruiter or imperial recruiter and can even hit karn, ugin, or an eldrazi.
I'd say it's a meta call. Fury Charm works in any pod and Goblin Cratermaker seems to be more specific. At least with the charm, if there's no artifact that needs to be destroyed, it can pump your army.
My YouTube Channel: The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
Tectonic Reformation is a good backup plan if you're full of cards and mana but have run out of steam and don't have a cantrip or wincon in that hand. I run Cavalier of Flames but not Tectonic Reformation, though. I honestly haven't felt a need for it. You can test it, though; I don't feel like it would be a bad card. At worst it's "draw a card" for 2.
My YouTube Channel: The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
That is definitely true, but Aria doesn't require any extra mana to activate like spikeshot, and it persists between turns. You have to pump up spikeshot all at once and be able to activate it. Aria can end up doing a lot of incremental damage. Even if you're just casting a couple spells a turn, you'll be doming people for 6-7-8 pretty quick. It could even allow a win with no creatures because you could just pump your opponents if you got wiped. That's obviously a corner case but you never know. I think I might try it out but idk what to cut for it and you're right, I don't really want to replace spikeshot since he helps the creature count.
Have you done the math for it?
If you're in a 4-player game, you just handed out 30 life. You'd have to cast 4 spells to take away that 10 life from a player that you just gave them. So you cast 4 spells in order to deal a net damage of 0. Worst case scenario is that you haven't dealt any damage to anyone and let's assume everyone was at 40 life. So they were at 50 when Aria of Flame hit the board. Now, this deck is not storm. And copied spells don't trigger Aria of Flame. Let's say you start adding some verse counters to it. A wary opponent may decide to blow it up - something very easy to do in EDH. You just gifted your opponents 10 life with no downside to them.
Let's look at a best case scenario. Let's say you cast 10 spells in a single turn. That would make Aria of Flame hand out 55 damage to a single opponent, thus killing them since you gave them 10 life. 10 spells. To kill one opponent. Let's imagine those 10 spells were the following (in the following order):
This would produce 66 goblin tokens that would be 2/2 with haste. Giving a total of 132 damage. That practically takes out an entire table. And that's not counting the possibility of having Krenko, Mob Boss in play or casting more spells targeting Zada afterwards. Or even activating Goblin Goliath's ability. Doing that just to activate Aria of Flame to give 55 damage to a single player is just drastically inefficient when compared to what the deck can do with casting 10 spells anyways. It would take up a slot best suited for something else. If you cast 10 instant and/or sorcery spells in a multiplayer game in a single turn you should be winning anyways, not just taking out one player after having given everyone else 10 extra life.
My YouTube Channel: The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
What do you guys think of Aria of Flame? If you get it down early you could easily kill someone just by casting all your pumps on a turn with lots of big cantrips and not even attacking. You can use it to kill through stuff like Propaganda and then actually attack someone else.
With all the pump spells Spikeshot Elder gets pretty big and you can kill someone with its ability. Not only that, but with Goblin Goliath it gives double damage as well. Both are creatures which benefit Zada (more bodies to copy spells) and goblins as well, which makes them tutorable with Goblin Recruiter and also help Krenko, Mob Boss make more tokens.
My YouTube Channel: The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
Seasoned Pyromancer is not worth $27 in EDH. I'll wait until it rotates out of Standard, I guess.
I've got some bad news for you... Seasoned Pyromancer will probably only keep creeping up in price. It's not in Standard; it's from Modern Horizons. It's a Modern card. Thanks, Modern!
My YouTube Channel: The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
My YouTube Channel: The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
Core Set 2020 Cards: Scampering Scorcher - Another good token producer that hasn't been mentioned yet. Glint-Horn Buccaneer - For when you draw a bunch of cards and run out of mana. End your turn and kill everyone on the discard. Sort of like Psychosis Crawler in reverse.
I concur with your assessment. The great thing about Scampering Scorcher besides being 3 1/1's for 3R is that if you have other elementals in play thanks to Young Pyromancer or Tilonalli's Summoner, they're gonna get haste.
My YouTube Channel: The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
I'm uncertain on the "more polished" part. They have been recently refining the rules in some ways, but anytime they have to clarify how things work with a ruling on each relevant card, to me that says something's not inherently clear. I don't know what the impetus behind the splice revision was.
Yeah, I feel the same way. As long as we can keep abusing the jankiness of it with Zada, I'll be happy.
My YouTube Channel: The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
My YouTube Channel: The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
2. I don't think peteroupc is right. Even in comment #17 of your rules thread here he says that Overload's text-changing effect isn't copied (implying that copies won't be Overloaded I guess), but also links to a thread that says they are. I think he's just hung up on the text-changing part. Shiffrin even says in that third Twitter thread that Overload is copied.
The way I interpret this is that the resultant text-change is itself not directly copied, but the choice to splice and what was spliced are copied which has the result of performing the text-change on each copy separately. So we're still good, but keep those tweets on hand if you run the Splice package.
Okay, so I think that with the first tweet you linked to, spliced spells that are copied with Zada will copy the spell as is, including the text changed due to splice, right? Man, all this back and forth has me really confused and bummed out...
My YouTube Channel: The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
Apparently with Modern Horizons rule updates splice might not work like it used to with this deck. Meaning that if you splice Desperate Ritual on Unnatural Speed the splice effect won't be applied to the copies of Unnatural Speed. Hopefully I've misinterpreted this rule and Zada can still abuse the 'splice onto arcane' mechanic. Otherwise, the once glorious jank will only exist in the past...
I think you've misinterpreted. The only relevant thing I could find in the release notes was this, among the rulings on the cards in the set that have Splice:
If a spell is copied, choices made while casting it are copied, so the copy will have the same abilities spliced onto it as the original.
Combine this with the fact that you splice onto a cast spell as you cast it. When you're done casting it is when Zada's trigger will be put on the stack, so everything is already spliced when her ability finally copies the spell.
I had the same exact reasoning as you did: splice is done as it's cast and Zada triggers when it's cast, meaning the spell Zada copies has the splice effect. However, I asked this in the Rules Forum and was corrected; the copies no longer carry the spliced effect like it used to.
This annoys me greatly. WotC was already heavily criticized with the splice mechanic for being too narrow and parasitic. Then, with copy effects there's a way to make that trash into treasure with some spicy jank and then they go and make it even worse than what it originally was. What gives?!
My YouTube Channel: The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
Apparently with Modern Horizons rule updates splice might not work like it used to with this deck. Meaning that if you splice Desperate Ritual on Unnatural Speed the splice effect won't be applied to the copies of Unnatural Speed. Hopefully I've misinterpreted this rule and Zada can still abuse the 'splice onto arcane' mechanic. Otherwise, the once glorious jank will only exist in the past...
My YouTube Channel: The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
It's really amazing since it will generate a ton of mana.
BGU [Primer] Sidisi, Brood Tyrant BGU | BG [Primer] Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest BG | G [Primer] Polukranos, World Eater G
My YouTube Channel:
The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
BGU [Primer] Sidisi, Brood Tyrant BGU | BG [Primer] Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest BG | G [Primer] Polukranos, World Eater G
My YouTube Channel:
The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
You don't need to worry so much about fast mana rocks. I run a list that's a bit expensive but only because I already owned the cards. But the key shell for Zada and all support cards could be acquired for less than $50. Here's the link, if you're interested. You'd have to add the cost of Zada (in the sideboard) and subtract the cost of the mountains. Doing so gives a grand total of $49.98. And it's a deck that can easily win turn 4 or 5. Hope it helps!
BGU [Primer] Sidisi, Brood Tyrant BGU | BG [Primer] Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest BG | G [Primer] Polukranos, World Eater G
My YouTube Channel:
The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
I'd say it's a meta call. Fury Charm works in any pod and Goblin Cratermaker seems to be more specific. At least with the charm, if there's no artifact that needs to be destroyed, it can pump your army.
BGU [Primer] Sidisi, Brood Tyrant BGU | BG [Primer] Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest BG | G [Primer] Polukranos, World Eater G
My YouTube Channel:
The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
Tectonic Reformation is a good backup plan if you're full of cards and mana but have run out of steam and don't have a cantrip or wincon in that hand. I run Cavalier of Flames but not Tectonic Reformation, though. I honestly haven't felt a need for it. You can test it, though; I don't feel like it would be a bad card. At worst it's "draw a card" for 2.
BGU [Primer] Sidisi, Brood Tyrant BGU | BG [Primer] Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest BG | G [Primer] Polukranos, World Eater G
My YouTube Channel:
The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
Have you done the math for it?
If you're in a 4-player game, you just handed out 30 life. You'd have to cast 4 spells to take away that 10 life from a player that you just gave them. So you cast 4 spells in order to deal a net damage of 0. Worst case scenario is that you haven't dealt any damage to anyone and let's assume everyone was at 40 life. So they were at 50 when Aria of Flame hit the board. Now, this deck is not storm. And copied spells don't trigger Aria of Flame. Let's say you start adding some verse counters to it. A wary opponent may decide to blow it up - something very easy to do in EDH. You just gifted your opponents 10 life with no downside to them.
Let's look at a best case scenario. Let's say you cast 10 spells in a single turn. That would make Aria of Flame hand out 55 damage to a single opponent, thus killing them since you gave them 10 life. 10 spells. To kill one opponent. Let's imagine those 10 spells were the following (in the following order):
This would produce 66 goblin tokens that would be 2/2 with haste. Giving a total of 132 damage. That practically takes out an entire table. And that's not counting the possibility of having Krenko, Mob Boss in play or casting more spells targeting Zada afterwards. Or even activating Goblin Goliath's ability. Doing that just to activate Aria of Flame to give 55 damage to a single player is just drastically inefficient when compared to what the deck can do with casting 10 spells anyways. It would take up a slot best suited for something else. If you cast 10 instant and/or sorcery spells in a multiplayer game in a single turn you should be winning anyways, not just taking out one player after having given everyone else 10 extra life.
BGU [Primer] Sidisi, Brood Tyrant BGU | BG [Primer] Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest BG | G [Primer] Polukranos, World Eater G
My YouTube Channel:
The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
With all the pump spells Spikeshot Elder gets pretty big and you can kill someone with its ability. Not only that, but with Goblin Goliath it gives double damage as well. Both are creatures which benefit Zada (more bodies to copy spells) and goblins as well, which makes them tutorable with Goblin Recruiter and also help Krenko, Mob Boss make more tokens.
BGU [Primer] Sidisi, Brood Tyrant BGU | BG [Primer] Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest BG | G [Primer] Polukranos, World Eater G
My YouTube Channel:
The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
I've got some bad news for you... Seasoned Pyromancer will probably only keep creeping up in price. It's not in Standard; it's from Modern Horizons. It's a Modern card. Thanks, Modern!
BGU [Primer] Sidisi, Brood Tyrant BGU | BG [Primer] Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest BG | G [Primer] Polukranos, World Eater G
My YouTube Channel:
The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
I feel the same way about Teferi, Hero of Dominaria for my Atraxa, Praetors' Voice deck.
BGU [Primer] Sidisi, Brood Tyrant BGU | BG [Primer] Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest BG | G [Primer] Polukranos, World Eater G
My YouTube Channel:
The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
I concur with your assessment. The great thing about Scampering Scorcher besides being 3 1/1's for 3R is that if you have other elementals in play thanks to Young Pyromancer or Tilonalli's Summoner, they're gonna get haste.
BGU [Primer] Sidisi, Brood Tyrant BGU | BG [Primer] Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest BG | G [Primer] Polukranos, World Eater G
My YouTube Channel:
The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
Yeah, I feel the same way. As long as we can keep abusing the jankiness of it with Zada, I'll be happy.
BGU [Primer] Sidisi, Brood Tyrant BGU | BG [Primer] Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest BG | G [Primer] Polukranos, World Eater G
My YouTube Channel:
The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
BGU [Primer] Sidisi, Brood Tyrant BGU | BG [Primer] Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest BG | G [Primer] Polukranos, World Eater G
My YouTube Channel:
The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
Okay, so I think that with the first tweet you linked to, spliced spells that are copied with Zada will copy the spell as is, including the text changed due to splice, right? Man, all this back and forth has me really confused and bummed out...
BGU [Primer] Sidisi, Brood Tyrant BGU | BG [Primer] Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest BG | G [Primer] Polukranos, World Eater G
My YouTube Channel:
The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
I had the same exact reasoning as you did: splice is done as it's cast and Zada triggers when it's cast, meaning the spell Zada copies has the splice effect. However, I asked this in the Rules Forum and was corrected; the copies no longer carry the spliced effect like it used to.
This annoys me greatly. WotC was already heavily criticized with the splice mechanic for being too narrow and parasitic. Then, with copy effects there's a way to make that trash into treasure with some spicy jank and then they go and make it even worse than what it originally was. What gives?!
BGU [Primer] Sidisi, Brood Tyrant BGU | BG [Primer] Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest BG | G [Primer] Polukranos, World Eater G
My YouTube Channel:
The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!
BGU [Primer] Sidisi, Brood Tyrant BGU | BG [Primer] Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest BG | G [Primer] Polukranos, World Eater G
My YouTube Channel:
The Commander Tavern - a channel I just started where I'll post deck techs and gameplays. Please support by checking it out. Maybe you'll like its content and subscribe! Thanks!