MTG Salvation

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An interesting theory. Do we know which came first, Avacyn or Helvault? I wonder if Nahiri could be Nahiri, the Moon Heron or something.

Nahiri was not on Innistrad previous to SOI, she can not be "Nahiri, the Moon Heron" with the implication that she was "OMFG, On Innistrad the Whole Time!". We where expressly told that Sorin did not know where Nahiri was. If she was on Innistrad the whole time, he would have known.

Actually, what Sorin told Ugin was that Nahiri was not on Zendikar and that he "might know" where she is and that she is not dead.

We've also been told that he does not know where she is exactly. If she had been on Innistrad, he would have known. After all, he was surprised that she didn't show up when the seal at the Eye of Ugin got broken. Knowing roughly where someone might be =/= as knowing where they are.

He was lying. He fully knows what's become of her, where she is and how she is. It's just that he didn't want to anger the dragon by telling him the truth of what happened. As for the eye warning, he was probably more upset about Ugin not showing up then Nahiri on the basis that he was responsible for her absence.

Definitely gonna need a source on this matter-of-fact statement. Also, I'm pretty sure that the instances of Sorin being worried about Nahiri not being at the eye and not responding was internal monologue.

Quote from MarkXero »

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Chandra and Ajani had friends who needed help. Lili doesn't do friends very well. (Just ask Jace.)

The only two plot threads Liliana is part of right now are her remaining demons, and the return of the Onakke. The former no longer has any connection to Innistrad, now that Griselbrand is dead, and the latter never did.

Expecting Liliana to show up in Shadows is like if you expected Sarkhan to show up in BfZ just because he was in the last Zendikar block.

I think I've already said this somewhere, but I am 99% certain Lili *is* going to be on Innistrad. Not (necessarily) for any ongoing plot reasons, but for a completely real-world reason: she is the only one of the Origins 5 not to feature in BFZ block. When they announced the new story-telling paradigm they said that the Origins 5 were going to be the ongoing focus of the storyline arc from now on. Lili's absence from BFZ / OGW means they will feel compelled for purely marketing / brand / familiarity reasons to have her appear in SoI block at some point - they can't leave one of their halo characters out of the spotlight for two blocks in a row, especially while they are first trying to establish them as the focus. Given that they established Innistrad as one of Lili's 'home' planes in Origins, it would be absurd now to go there and not have her appear. It would be like going to Regatha without Chandra or Vryn without Jace.

This is all highly subjective. They said that the Origins walkers would be the focus of the story, not that they would complete a cycle of some sort by having the missing one appear in the very next block after we just had the other 4 together. Have is an Origins walker, Jace is the reason we are even going to Innistrad right now in the first place and he will be on Innistrad. They've already filled their Origins quota for this block and it is not a requirement at all for another Origins walker to be shoehorned into the story. We can't make assertions on what the creative team thinks about "completion" or what they are "compelled" to do because we aren't creative and they have given no statements on this matter. So to state such things as fact is simply false. They most certainly can leave one character out for two more sets, there is absolutely nothing stopping them from doing so. In my opinion, it would be absurd for the story team to jam Liliana on a plane that, even as you have said, she has no reason to be on in the middle of a story she has nothing to do with. Your assertion about this being her home plane would hold a small amount of weight if, like the other Origins planeswalkers, she never previously returned here and settled her story and past on the plane. But she has. It was called the original Innistrad block.

As krishnath has already stated, on top of her having absolutely no story reasons to be on the plane, it is now overrun with her most hated species, angels, and they would all kill her on sight. Not to mention that nearly every other species on the plane would be at odds with her as well. Liliana is pragmatic. She has two very pressing matters which both have her life in a vice, the one thing she holds dear, so why would she just be hanging out on a plane full of things that want to kill her when with Liliana's motivation to have control of her own life and not die, it would only make sense for her to be almost literally anywhere else actually doing what she needs to do to kill her demons and be free of the Veil?

I'd also like to point out how ridiculous it is that people feel like the chances for Liliana showing up at all are SOI or bust. Um, we have another block starting this year as well. That isn't exactly a long way away and there is nothing stopping Liliana from being the star of that entire block as far as we know.

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I would love to see Ral Zarek on Innistrad. I know... highly unlikely. It would be cool to see such a powerful storm mage on a horror-based plane, though.

As for the Emrakul theories... It would be intriguing, but even after only two sets I think the story needs some much needed rest from the Eldrazi. That was the point of going to two-set blocks in the first place. The third set was always a stretch story-wise as well as mechanically.

I wouldn't be surprised if they tried Tibalt again considering the fans' desire for them to do so. It is a safe setting for the character to have another go. Thrusting him into another plane and it finally be a "Good" version would disconnect him from this plane a bit. The way creative has been working with character introduction, I don't think they would want his "triumphant return" to play out like that.

Extremely late to the party on this thread, but I wanted to bring it back around. It was starting to... wander.

I am of the opinion that Tibalt is going to be a villain in SOI, not the main threat, but a villain of the story never the less, using the chaos the main threat causes to spread additional mayhem and slaughter. He is a very sick puppy after all.

Actually, I want so badly for Tibalt to have amassed power while we've been away. So much so that he now has mastered demonic magic and has demons doing his dirty work for him as well as devils. I want him to be like a childish young-adult underground crime boss but with Innistrad's Gothic horror flavor. So much so that our planeswalker protagonists are begrudgingly forced to ask him for help dealing with the danger on the plane. Can you image how smug he would be and how much he would relish someone like Sorin coming to him for help?

Luckily, I heard that image was fake before I even saw it. Still, I actually want Bolas to be the threat on Innistrad now.

^^I prefer this, myself:

Gideon - Fred
Nissa - Daphne
Jace - Velma
Chandra - Shaggy

Quote from orlouge82 »

Quote from Silver_Spellthief »

Thanks for the punctuation correct, guys. That completely changes the meaning of the lines lol.

So, probably no evil angel Thalia(which would be totally weird anyway). However, the statement that the threat on Innistrad is multiversal makes me worried. Worried of the obvious implication that is Emrakul. I'm conflicted about it because on one hand, if this is the end of the Eldrazi arc, that means we won't have to deal with any more eldrazi probably ever again or at least not for another ten or so years. On the other hand, it means that the entire eldrazi struggle would be wrapped up in a little package that is far neater than it should be and it would also potentially mean turning Innistrad into another bout of "Eldrazi vs. Everyone else" just like what happened to Zendikar.

I kind of think it won't be Emrakul. It's more likely a brand new Multiverse-level threat to nearly coincide with the introduction of the brand new Gatewatch team, kind of like how new villains emerge right after the Justice League/Avengers initially form.

That'd be nice and kind of a breath of fresh air, honestly.

Thanks for the punctuation correct, guys. That completely changes the meaning of the lines lol.

So, probably no evil angel Thalia(which would be totally weird anyway). However, the statement that the threat on Innistrad is multiversal makes me worried. Worried of the obvious implication that is Emrakul. I'm conflicted about it because on one hand, if this is the end of the Eldrazi arc, that means we won't have to deal with any more eldrazi probably ever again or at least not for another ten or so years. On the other hand, it means that the entire eldrazi struggle would be wrapped up in a little package that is far neater than it should be and it would also potentially mean turning Innistrad into another bout of "Eldrazi vs. Everyone else" just like what happened to Zendikar.

http://www.bookdepository.com/The-Art-of-Magic-The-Gathering-James-Wyatt/9781421587806?ref=bd_ser_1

Um, I was browsing through tumblr and one of the MtG blogs I follow reblogged a screenshot of this page. There are important things to note here:

-Firstly, this description makes reference to "Thalia, Knight-Cathar Terror" and her "blood soaked wings". Are they reviving Thalia? And if so, are they somehow reviving her as an angel? And a murderous one at that?

-The description makes reference to the threat on Innistrad being a multiversal threat.

-The description says "Planeswalkers of the Vanguard". I'm not sure if this is some sort of error or not. Perhaps this is some other group of planeswalkers(doubtful) or perhaps this was a mistake in the description. If so, does this severely hamper this description's validity and credibility?

I think it would be a good idea to take a break from directly dealing with Eldrazi invasions for the story. Close to no one enjoyed the story for BFZ block and I think we're all kind of tentacled out. Let's wait maybe one or two blocks before diving back in with the last titan.

Quote from SnowBunny »

I'm actually excited for this. I loved innistrad for the awesome flavor. Going back will be awesomeness for sure

I enjoy the idea of going back to Innistrad too. It is an awesome plane. But my fears are two fold: 1. I'm afraid that the cards themselves and the play experience won't be that good. This fear is brought on by the state of BFZ which simply put, isn't a fun set imo. And 2. I'm afraid of the world's aesthetic this time around being populated by art that doesn't really nice song the world in either that it is far too clean or it looks far to CG. This was brought on by the current state of MtG art direction which, imo, is not nearly as compelling as Innistrad era art. Also, the new Geist of Saint Traft art is just icky.

The Werewolves weren't all turned into Wolfir. The cursemute only affected the Werewolves who were willing to accept it. I.E. The Werewolves who thought their lycanthropy was a curse and hated being Werewolves. We know for a fact, especially through card flavor texts, that there are plenty of Werewolves who actually liked being Werewolves. Those are the Werewolves we'll see in Shadows Over Innistrad. Cards like Kruin Outlaw, Ulvenwald Mystics and Mondronen Shaman illustrate many Werewolves who wouldn't have accepted the cursemute. Heck, Mondronen Shaman alludes to a whole pack of such Werewolves.

As far as we know, Liliana has no business on Innistrad. She killed her Demon master on that plane and left because she had bigger fish to fry than to fool around on her old stomping-plane. Her next order of business is either killing her third master, getting rid of the Chain Veil, or dealing with The Raven Man.

Writing her to suddenly find out "OH, my other demon master was on Innistrad THE WHOLE TIME and I never knew somehow." Would be extremely silly. As far as we know, the Chain Veil has no connection to Innistrad, though admittedly it could be possible that she could be looking for someone on the plane to loose her from it's hold on her just like she could somehow deal with The Raven Man there. Still, overall I think any chance of Liliana being involved in Shadows Over Innistrad being very unlikely because she really doesn't have anything to do there.